/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2011-12-13 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Tue Dec 13 00:00:00 2011
  2. # Session Ident: #accessibility
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  6. # [00:53] <@eeejay> the text interface is really buggy
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  10. # [01:28] <@tbsaunde|afk> eeejay: volunteering to fix it ;)
  11. # [01:28] <@eeejay> tbsaunde|afk, doing my best!
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  17. # [02:18] * @eeejay waves "hello" at mdcurran
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  22. # [03:37] <@tbsaunde|afk> eeejay: so, what isthestatus of the traversal stuff?
  23. # [03:37] * tbsaunde|afk is now known as tbsaunde
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  32. # [06:47] <firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 710125 filed by m_kato@ga2.so-net.ne.jp.
  33. # [06:47] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
  34. # [07:22] <firebot> m_kato@ga2.so-net.ne.jp requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 581187 on bug 710125.
  35. # [07:22] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
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  40. # [09:04] <firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com requested review from roc@ocallahan.org for attachment 581187 on bug 710125.
  41. # [09:04] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
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  43. # [09:22] <jhk_> tbsaunde : ping
  44. # [09:25] <@tbsaunde> jhk_: yo
  45. # [09:27] <jhk_> I think I will have to go through all the files one bye and compile it. there are lots of issues coming up while modifying role like.
  46. # [09:28] <@tbsaunde> jhk_: yeah, :(
  47. # [09:29] <@tbsaunde> its kind of tidious but I'm not aware of anything better
  48. # [09:31] <jhk_> tbsaunde : I will look at that side by side . right now Bug 539694 . can we keep same constructor definition in the private
  49. # [09:31] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=539694 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, accessible objects should have private copy constructor
  50. # [09:31] <@tbsaunde> jhk_: I'm not sure I understand
  51. # [09:43] <firebot> roc@ocallahan.org granted review for attachment 581187 on bug 710125.
  52. # [09:43] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
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  57. # [10:42] <firebot> jigneshhk1992@gmail.com requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 581202 on bug 539694.
  58. # [10:42] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=539694 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, accessible objects should have private copy constructor
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  60. # [10:47] <firebot> jigneshhk1992@gmail.com cancelled review?(trev.saunders@gmail .com) for attachment 581202 on bug 539694.
  61. # [10:47] <firebot> jigneshhk1992@gmail.com requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 581205 on bug 539694.
  62. # [11:03] <firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com granted review for attachment 581205 on bug 539694.
  63. # [11:04] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=539694 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, accessible objects should have private copy constructor
  64. # [11:06] <@tbsaunde> jhk_: how is fixing the role stuff?
  65. # [11:08] <jhk_> tbsaunde: doing it . lots of files.:)
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  67. # [11:34] <firebot> jigneshhk1992@gmail.com requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 581211 on bug 539694.
  68. # [11:35] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=539694 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, accessible objects should have private copy constructor
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  70. # [11:46] <@tbsaunde> jhk_: since its the same patch no need for review
  71. # [11:47] <jhk_> ok
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  73. # [11:54] <firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com cancelled review?(trev.saunders@gmail .com) for attachment 581211 on bug 539694.
  74. # [11:54] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=539694 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, accessible objects should have private copy constructor
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  77. # [12:39] <firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gmail.com for attachment 580908 on bug 591363.
  78. # [12:39] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=591363 nor, --, ---, bolterbugz, NEW, (in)visible state is not always correct?
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  84. # [14:58] <firebot> New Firefox - Keyboard Navigation bug 710195 filed by bj@herbison.com.
  85. # [14:58] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710195 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Control-T and control-N do not work after clicking "Try again" from connection timeout
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  89. # [15:34] <firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 707852 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  90. # [15:34] <firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk set the Resolution field on bug 707852 to FIXED.
  91. # [15:34] <firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Target Milestone on bug 707852 from --- to mozilla11.
  92. # [15:34] <firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk denied in-testsuite on bug 707852.
  93. # [15:34] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=707852 nor, --, mozilla11, hub, RESO FIXED, [mac] remove the Objective-C wrapper
  94. # [15:34] <firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk granted checkin for attachment 580494 on bug 707852.
  95. # [15:47] <@tbsaunde> davidb: want to review bug 710125? (seems your marco, but he's not around) might be better than me
  96. # [15:47] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
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  102. # [16:31] <Stevef> davidb: you around?
  103. # [16:37] <@davidb> Stevef: hi!
  104. # [16:38] <@davidb> Stevef: trying to catch up. Lots of chaos in spec world.
  105. # [16:38] <Stevef> davidb: would like to get your input on this at some point http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Dec/0077.html
  106. # [16:39] <Stevef> davidb: as in feedback to the list
  107. # [16:42] <Stevef> davidb: hixie appears to be suggesting that if title is mapped in a manner inconsistent with what he has specified the browsers need to change "If browsers map it in a manner inconsistent with its meaning, that
  108. # [16:42] <Stevef> should be fixed."
  109. # [16:42] <@davidb> Stevef: what is "its meaning" supposed to be?
  110. # [16:43] <@davidb> we're not going to regress a11y on a whim.
  111. # [16:43] <Stevef> davidb: its pretty wishy washy
  112. # [16:43] <@davidb> perfect
  113. # [16:44] <Stevef> please read the bug to get the issue https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=14740
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  115. # [16:49] <Stevef> davidb: if you could email the list stating what mozilla intends to do whatever that may be , it would be useful
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  117. # [16:49] <@davidb> Stevef: this is how I plan to respond "I don't imagine we (Mozilla) will stop using the title attribute value as a last resort in attempting to provide an accessible name, that would regress accessibility."
  118. # [16:49] <@davidb> ok?
  119. # [16:51] <@davidb> sending...
  120. # [16:51] <Stevef> davidb: 'last resort' sounds kinda desperate, but ok
  121. # [16:52] <@davidb> too late :)
  122. # [16:53] <Stevef> davidb: thanks
  123. # [16:53] <@davidb> np
  124. # [16:53] <@davidb> Stevef: what's going on with Rich, canvas, and HTML chairs?
  125. # [16:53] <Stevef> davidb: did you read richs email?
  126. # [16:53] <@davidb> I did.
  127. # [16:54] <@davidb> But the current status of things is unclear.
  128. # [16:54] <Stevef> in what way?
  129. # [16:54] <@davidb> Is there an alternate proposal?
  130. # [16:55] <Stevef> to provide the accessibility stuff that richs speccing did?
  131. # [16:55] <Stevef> no
  132. # [16:55] <Stevef> its back to rpoving to hixie that use cases exist
  133. # [16:56] <@davidb> Stevef: what if we just implement it and not worry about specs?
  134. # [16:56] <@davidb> this spec stuff is sapping us
  135. # [16:57] <Stevef> if you just implement what was specced and proposed by rich and charles pricthard etc
  136. # [16:58] <Stevef> ?
  137. # [16:58] <@davidb> yes, in theory.
  138. # [16:58] <@davidb> we'll land stuff in steps anyways.
  139. # [16:59] <Stevef> sam has requested this "Can we get a simple statement from Mozilla? All it needs to state is that they intend to implement whatever the 2D Canvas API might contain for a focus ring API in the W3C spec? We are not looking for a commitment as to timeframes. We are simply looking for a statement of intent at this point."
  140. # [16:59] <Stevef> is that somthing you can provide in theory?
  141. # [17:00] <@davidb> Stevef: I've pinged Jonas on that request, so that we can be on the same page.
  142. # [17:00] <Stevef> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Dec/0087.html
  143. # [17:00] <@davidb> Hopefully we'll have something to say soonish.
  144. # [17:00] <@davidb> yeah I read it
  145. # [17:00] <Stevef> no worries
  146. # [17:01] <Stevef> all i know is rich is pretty pissed at the whole thing
  147. # [17:01] <Stevef> and sick of being jerked around
  148. # [17:01] <@davidb> yeah, not a great way to start his holiday
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  156. # [17:15] <Stevef> davidb: follow up question sent your way...
  157. # [17:17] <Stevef> hhillen: hi HANSome you follwoing me?
  158. # [17:18] <Stevef> again
  159. # [17:18] <hhillen> Stevef: Just making sure you behave
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  162. # [17:44] <Stevef> davidb: response sent your way...
  163. # [17:45] <@davidb> got it - it is a good response
  164. # [17:45] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  165. # [17:50] <@davidb> Stevef: do you want a reply?
  166. # [17:51] <@davidb> I don't have a substantive reply.
  167. # [17:53] <Stevef> just say uncle :-)
  168. # [17:54] <@davidb> hahaha
  169. # [17:55] <@davidb> Stevef: well, in the case of Firefox, aria-label will just fill in a11y API. no changes needed on the part of AT.
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  172. # [17:56] <Stevef> yes true once browsers catch up it twill be good
  173. # [17:57] <@davidb> Stevef: are you joining the call in 9 minutes?
  174. # [17:57] <@davidb> oh!
  175. # [17:58] <@davidb> in 3 hrs 9 minutes
  176. # [17:58] <Stevef> call? no I am joining the call in 3 hrs and 9 mins
  177. # [17:58] <@davidb> Stevef: that's what i said :)
  178. # [17:59] <Stevef> yeah catch you then have to go and pick my kids up
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  184. # [18:21] <@eeejay> morning, peeps
  185. # [18:23] <@davidb> yo
  186. # [18:28] * @eeejay is hunting text iface bugs
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  194. # [19:47] <@tbsaunde> eeejay: so, what's happening with bug 698823? should I being doing something?
  195. # [19:48] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=698823 nor, --, mozilla10, eitan, NEW, Introduce virtual cursor/soft focus functionality to a11y API
  196. # [19:48] <@eeejay> tbsaunde, nope. the API is pretty much down
  197. # [19:48] <@tbsaunde> eeejay: ack
  198. # [19:49] <@eeejay> tbsaunde, i am stuck with implementation issues because of the text iface,
  199. # [19:49] <@eeejay> tbsaunde, there will be plenty of reviewing soon
  200. # [19:49] <@tbsaunde> eeejay: ok
  201. # [19:49] <@eeejay> can't make any promises about when. it might be worth not implementing the text traversal in the first patch set
  202. # [19:49] <@tbsaunde> eeejay: what does issues in the text interfaces effect implenting that stuff?
  203. # [19:50] <@eeejay> tbsaunde, there is text navigation functionality in the API that i am implementing
  204. # [19:50] <@tbsaunde> eeejay: ok
  205. # [19:50] <@tbsaunde> I guess the patches will make it clearer
  206. # [19:51] <@tbsaunde> but it seems like that patch set could just use the api supposing it were correct
  207. # [19:51] <@tbsaunde> ofcourse it wouldn't end up working correctly till we fix the text interfaces, but...
  208. # [19:52] <@eeejay> tbsaunde, yeah. i would say it is worth putting in no-op functions instead of putting in something explicitly broken.
  209. # [19:52] <@tbsaunde> eeejay: I wouldn't call them broken if there correct but an api they use is buggy
  210. # [19:53] <@davidb> agree
  211. # [19:53] <@tbsaunde> useless perhaps, and perhaps because of that its not worth writing yet
  212. # [19:54] <@eeejay> yeah
  213. # [19:58] <@tbsaunde> hub: thoughts on my last comment on bug 705404 (warning was written when at < 100% and I'm still at < 100%)
  214. # [19:58] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=705404 nor, --, ---, hub, NEW, build separate accessible tree on mac
  215. # [19:59] <@hub> tbsaunde: I just commented before you asked
  216. # [20:00] <@hub> tbsaunde: and this imply I'm gonna update the patch
  217. # [20:00] <@tbsaunde> hub: ok, cool
  218. # [20:00] <@davidb> guys, anything you want to say in the dev meeting?
  219. # [20:01] <@hub> "Hi"
  220. # [20:06] * nhirata is now known as nhirata|mtg
  221. # [20:06] <@tbsaunde> davidb: so your not taking me up on my offer to let you review bug 710125?
  222. # [20:06] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
  223. # [20:07] * Quits: hhillen (hhillen@moz-2A42E9B3.upc-d.chello.nl) (Quit: hhillen)
  224. # [20:07] <@davidb> hub: :)
  225. # [20:07] <@davidb> tbsaunde: i hadn't noticed it yet
  226. # [20:08] * @davidb is in the meeting
  227. # [20:09] <@tbsaunde> davidb: yeah, figured you saw my ping early this morning
  228. # [20:09] <@davidb> tbsaunde: aha, yeah Marco and Alex are not around this week
  229. # [20:09] <@davidb> tbsaunde: you can twiddle the bits if you want my attention
  230. # [20:11] <@tbsaunde> silly davidb never says yes I want or no I don't ;-)
  231. # [20:11] <@davidb> heh
  232. # [20:11] <@davidb> tbsaunde: sorry - juggling here.
  233. # [20:11] <@tbsaunde> its cool I figured you wouldn't respond because meeting
  234. # [20:12] <@eeejay> oops, the meeting
  235. # [20:13] <@davidb> tbsaunde: loading windows libraries, probably someone from Rob Strong's team should take a look
  236. # [20:13] <@davidb> "Desktop Integration" team
  237. # [20:14] <@hub> I think roc already gave the go ahead
  238. # [20:14] <@hub> oh different rob
  239. # [20:15] <@tbsaunde> davidb: seems we load the lib always anyway so Idono
  240. # [20:16] <@tbsaunde> davidb: I'm not sure what that group does, but probably not the first group I'd ask
  241. # [20:16] <@davidb> ok i'll look at the bug soon
  242. # [20:27] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
  243. # [20:28] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  244. # [20:32] <firebot> hub@mozilla.com cancelled review?(trev.saunders@gmail .com) for attachment 581044 on bug 705404.
  245. # [20:32] <firebot> hub@mozilla.com requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 581342 on bug 705404.
  246. # [20:32] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=705404 nor, --, ---, hub, NEW, build separate accessible tree on mac
  247. # [20:36] <@davidb> ok!
  248. # [20:36] <@davidb> i have 30 minutes
  249. # [20:36] <@davidb> (then w3c html5 call)
  250. # [20:40] <@davidb> lies.
  251. # [20:40] <@davidb> tbsaunde: that patch looks dangerous?
  252. # [20:40] * @davidb jumps into a phone call
  253. # [20:44] <@tbsaunde> davidb: not really sure
  254. # [20:45] <@tbsaunde> davidb: I sort of think not, but I'm not really the best to judge
  255. # [20:49] <firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com granted review for attachment 581342 on bug 705404.
  256. # [20:49] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=705404 nor, --, ---, hub, NEW, build separate accessible tree on mac
  257. # [20:50] * @tbsaunde considers if he wants to watch the tree
  258. # [20:51] <@davidb> tbsaunde: inbound
  259. # [20:51] <khuey> is closed
  260. # [20:51] <@davidb> khuey: booo
  261. # [20:51] <@davidb> true
  262. # [20:52] <@tbsaunde> hub: I you feel like staring I don't particularly object to being around
  263. # [20:52] <@tbsaunde> *if and
  264. # [20:54] <@hub> tbsaunde: I can stay around
  265. # [20:54] <@davidb> tbsaunde: I worry bug 710125 patch might break our dummy window usage
  266. # [20:54] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710125 nor, --, ---, m_kato, NEW, Reduce LoadLibray/GetProcAddress for user32.dll and oleacc.dll on a11y
  267. # [20:54] <@tbsaunde> davidb: hmm, maybe didn't think about that
  268. # [20:55] <@tbsaunde> I don't immediately see why, but didn't really consider that
  269. # [20:55] <@tbsaunde> hub: and deal with tbpl.mozilla.org?
  270. # [20:55] <@hub> it depends of what dealing involve
  271. # [20:55] <@hub> I can push it to a TryServer
  272. # [20:56] <@tbsaunde> when random test failures happen you blaim them on a bug that caused them
  273. # [20:56] <@tbsaunde> hub: if it builds on mac that's enough
  274. # [20:56] <@tbsaunde> and you ran tests locally I'd believe its good
  275. # [20:57] <@hub> yeah it shouldn't impact anything else
  276. # [20:57] <@hub> since inbound is closed, I'll push to try just to make sure
  277. # [20:59] <@tbsaunde> hub: ok, I probably wouldn't bother, but I might just be far to brave :p
  278. # [21:00] <@tbsaunde> also, in that case I'm going to head out soon and deal with it tonight or something (hopefully the windows stuff will be sorted out then and m-i open)
  279. # [21:00] * nhirata|mtg is now known as nhirata
  280. # [21:03] <@tbsaunde> hub: staring usually isn't particularly difficult, when random test failures happen you look at the log and and the list of bugs it suggests and figure out which one is to blaim
  281. # [21:03] <@tbsaunde> if it doesn't have any suggestions but pretty clearly wasn't you you ask #developers or just ask philer directly :)
  282. # [21:06] * Quits: jhk_ (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP) (Connection reset by peer)
  283. # [21:06] * Joins: jhk_ (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP)
  284. # [21:19] <@tbsaunde> ok, I'm about to head out for a the afternoon / evening unless someone's going to want something
  285. # [21:21] <@tbsaunde> davidb: eeejay hub ^
  286. # [21:21] <@davidb> tbsaunde: have a nice one.
  287. # [21:21] <@eeejay> tbsaunde, have fun!
  288. # [21:23] <@tbsaunde> thx
  289. # [21:52] * Joins: clown (clown@67828CC7.C1A51174.9D42CF23.IP)
  290. # [22:24] <@davidb> clown: what fills your days these days?
  291. # [22:24] <clown> davidb: a bunch of little gnomes.
  292. # [22:24] <@davidb> illusionists
  293. # [22:27] <clown> you?
  294. # [22:28] <@davidb> clown: today, 6 meetings. but they felt worthwhile.
  295. # [22:28] <@davidb> sadly.
  296. # [22:28] <@davidb> now i'm trying to find something i did, a tool, but not finding it
  297. # [22:28] <@davidb> aha!
  298. # [22:29] <@davidb> crap
  299. # [22:34] <clown> you did something?
  300. # [22:35] <@davidb> naw s'ok i found it
  301. # [22:36] * Quits: @davidb (davidb@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP) (Quit: davidb)
  302. # [22:44] * Quits: nhirata (nhirata.bu@moz-BBE3ABD.mv.mozilla.com) (Connection reset by peer)
  303. # [22:44] * Joins: nhirata (nhirata.bu@moz-BBE3ABD.mv.mozilla.com)
  304. # [22:49] * Quits: a-865 (fmcz@moz-A5D13CA.cable.mindspring.com) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [SeaMonkey 2.6/20111130195502])
  305. # [22:53] * Joins: a-865 (fmcz@moz-A5D13CA.cable.mindspring.com)
  306. # [23:08] * Quits: jhk_ (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP) (Connection reset by peer)
  307. # [23:11] * Parts: clown (clown@67828CC7.C1A51174.9D42CF23.IP)
  308. # [23:48] * Quits: Flyingmana (Mana@moz-A07BC3F4.adsl.alicedsl.de) (Quit: Verlassend)
  309. # [23:54] <firebot> asa@mozilla.org granted approval-mozilla-aurora for attachment 577543 on bug 706026.
  310. # [23:54] <firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=706026 cri, --, mozilla11, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, Crash in nsXULTextFieldAccessible::FrameSelection
  311. # [23:57] * Joins: jhk_ (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP)
  312. # Session Close: Wed Dec 14 00:00:00 2011

The end :)