/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2012-03-30 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Fri Mar 30 00:00:00 2012
  2. # Session Ident: #accessibility
  3. # [00:03] <@firebot> hub@mozilla.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 610696 on bug 718627.
  4. # [00:03] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=718627 nor, P1, ---, hub, ASSI, [Mac] Navigating by character, or interacting with, the text in the awesome bar does not speak the c
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  9. # [00:23] <@firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com cancelled review?(trev.saunders@gmail .com) for attachment 610698 on bug 734566.
  10. # [00:23] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=734566 nor, --, ---, michaljev, NEW, optimize layout of TextAttrsMgr
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  16. # [02:20] <@firebot> maxli@maxli.ca cancelled review?(trev.saunders@gmail .com) for attachment 610510 on bug 725432.
  17. # [02:20] <@firebot> maxli@maxli.ca requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 610764 on bug 725432.
  18. # [02:20] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=725432 nor, --, ---, maxli, NEW, HTML buttons with aria-pressed not exposing IA2 TOGGLE_BUTTON role
  19. # [02:23] * tbsaunde|afk is now known as tbsaunde
  20. # [02:46] <@firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com granted review for attachment 610764 on bug 725432.
  21. # [02:46] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=725432 nor, --, ---, maxli, NEW, HTML buttons with aria-pressed not exposing IA2 TOGGLE_BUTTON role
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  31. # [04:22] <@tbsaunde> surkov: you were looking for me this morning?
  32. # [04:23] <@surkov> tbsaunde: that was yesterday :) for me
  33. # [04:24] <@surkov> i wanted talk something about dexpcoming but don't recall details, when i recall i ping you again :)
  34. # [04:25] <@tbsaunde> surkov: ok, true
  35. # [04:25] <@tbsaunde> surkov: I got http://paste.debian.net/161418/ thoughts ?
  36. # [04:34] <@tbsaunde> surkov: ?
  37. # [04:36] <@surkov> tbsaunde: sounds good, how big tasks can be?
  38. # [04:38] <@tbsaunde> surkov: not sure, about to ask them
  39. # [04:38] <@surkov> ok, great, please ask if they are looking into c++ code or testing framework
  40. # [04:39] <@tbsaunde> yeah, asking that too
  41. # [04:40] * @tbsaunde wonders why he was the one asked ...
  42. # [04:41] <@surkov> regardless you do a good mentoring, there are different ways how people find information :)
  43. # [04:42] <@tbsaunde> surkov: thanks, true
  44. # [04:43] <@tbsaunde> surkov: I'm probably about to go sleep for a while unless you want to ask something
  45. # [04:43] <@surkov> sure, nothing for now
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  50. # [04:57] <jhk> surkov: ping
  51. # [04:57] <@surkov> jhk: pong
  52. # [04:58] <jhk> which screen reader we use for windows ? NVDA ?
  53. # [05:01] <jhk> surkov: and how a11y apis interfaces with it? mssa for example
  54. # [05:02] <@surkov> jhk: we use NVDA and other screen readers as well
  55. # [05:03] <@surkov> jhk: when windows screen reader call GetAccessibleFromWindow or something like that win32 API function then Firefox window receives WM_GETOBJECT event
  56. # [05:03] <@surkov> Firefox answer it and returns document accessible object
  57. # [05:03] <@surkov> then screen reader query IAccessible interface that's how MSAA works
  58. # [05:05] <jhk> ok
  59. # [05:20] <jhk> surkov: and where IAccessible interface is implemented?
  60. # [05:24] <jhk> it seems IA2 extends IAccessible.
  61. # [05:26] <@surkov> jhk: see accessible/src/msaa forlder, nsAccessibleWrap files
  62. # [05:29] <jhk> got it..thanks!
  63. # [05:37] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740696 filed by hub@mozilla.com.
  64. # [05:37] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740696 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [Mac] we have children that are expired.
  65. # [05:48] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 610696 on bug 718627.
  66. # [05:48] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=718627 nor, P1, ---, hub, ASSI, [Mac] Navigating by character, or interacting with, the text in the awesome bar does not speak the c
  67. # [05:49] <@surkov> yw!
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  71. # [06:34] <@firebot> michaljev@o2.pl changed the Status on bug 734566 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
  72. # [06:34] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=734566 nor, --, ---, michaljev, ASSI, optimize layout of TextAttrsMgr
  73. # [06:46] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740702 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
  74. # [06:46] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740702 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, nsHyperTextAccessible::GetDOMPointByFrameOffset should take nsAccessible*
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  76. # [06:56] <Mark_Capella> surkov: for bug739524 ... you want me to remove mochitest tree view changed event tests, but keep firing the event in nsTreeBodyFrame,
  77. # [06:56] <Mark_Capella> and dont listen for them in nsRootAccessible ?
  78. # [06:56] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
  79. # [06:56] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: yes
  80. # [06:56] <Mark_Capella> gotcha
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  85. # [07:11] <@hub> damn, I wanted to finish commenting on this review
  86. # [07:11] <@hub> bugzilla maintenance
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  97. # [08:41] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com set status-firefox13 to fixed on bug 706784.
  98. # [08:41] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com set status-firefox12 to fixed on bug 706784.
  99. # [08:41] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=706784 cri, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, Firefox 8.0.1 Crash Report [@ nsLinkableAccessible::GetValue(nsAString_internal&) ] (mainly correlat
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  107. # [09:07] <@MarcoZ> surkov: bug 706784 landed on both aurora and beta.
  108. # [09:07] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=706784 cri, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, Firefox 8.0.1 Crash Report [@ nsLinkableAccessible::GetValue(nsAString_internal&) ] (mainly correlat
  109. # [09:08] <@surkov> MarcoZ: ok, cool
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  111. # [09:41] <@firebot> scoobidiver@netcourrier.com set status-firefox13 to verified on bug 735666.
  112. # [09:41] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=735666 cri, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, crash [@ nsIDocument::GetContainer() ]
  113. # [09:45] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  114. # [09:49] <@tbsaunde|afk> surkov: by get rid of testing for treeview changed I assume you mean testing for the dom event not events we fire?
  115. # [09:49] <@surkov> yes DOM events
  116. # [09:53] <@tbsaunde|afk> surkov: ok :)
  117. # [09:53] * tbsaunde|afk is now known as tbsaunde
  118. # [09:57] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740725 filed by markcapella@twcny.rr.com.
  119. # [09:57] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740725 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Add down-casting to nsXULTreeAccessible
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  122. # [10:19] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: if you feel like you want to mentoring the bug 740725 then you're welcome :)
  123. # [10:19] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740725 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Add down-casting to nsXULTreeAccessible
  124. # [10:20] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: of feel free to take it if you want
  125. # [10:20] <Mark_Capella> surkov: I'd be more likely to take it ... not sure I follow it close enough yet to mentor someone else
  126. # [10:20] <Mark_Capella> has it on my list though
  127. # [10:20] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: ok, great
  128. # [10:21] <Mark_Capella> <--- working on nsAccessibilityService ... trying to tie up the pointers
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  130. # [10:29] <Mark_Capella> surkov: was bug652635 close enough / done or can you show me a test example that fails ...
  131. # [10:29] <Mark_Capella> "multiple indexs" seems to be the problem
  132. # [10:30] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=652635 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, Fallback missing @longdesc to aria-describedby pointing to <a href>
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  141. # [10:57] <@MarcoZ> surkov: See latest question7comments in bug 706784 please. Seems I was missing some change when I pushed the attached patch to aurora and beta.
  142. # [10:57] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=706784 cri, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, Firefox 8.0.1 Crash Report [@ nsLinkableAccessible::GetValue(nsAString_internal&) ] (mainly correlat
  143. # [10:58] <@surkov> MarcoZ: yes you uploaded the patch from bug which was different from landed one
  144. # [11:00] <@surkov> I don't think it's big deal though
  145. # [11:01] <@tbsaunde> yeah, funnny looking, but nsnull is just 0 so should be fine
  146. # [11:03] <@tbsaunde> surkov: did you want to leve changing the nsIDOMNode argument to GetDOMPointByFrameOffset() to nsIContent to another bug?
  147. # [11:03] <@tbsaunde> also that function is eressive in its use of nsCOMPtr :(
  148. # [11:06] <@surkov> tbsaunde: yeah, it has dependences
  149. # [11:07] <@tbsaunde> ok
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  151. # [11:28] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so, is the way that we don't call UpdateTreeInternal() for every added accesible that sometimes we attach one accessible as a child of another and then dd the root of that tree to the documents tree or is it a different way?
  152. # [11:29] <@surkov> tbsaunde: sorry what is the problem of UpdateTreeInternal for every added child?
  153. # [11:31] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com requested feedback from surkov.alexander@ gmail.com for attachment 610839 on bug 739524.
  154. # [11:31] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
  155. # [11:32] <@tbsaunde> surkov: 1 trying to figure out if it is called for every accessible and more generally understanding the problem in bug 682811
  156. # [11:32] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=682811 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, menupopup_start/menupopup_end/alert events should be fired for accessibles inside the shown/hide sub
  157. # [11:34] <@surkov> tbsaunde: it's called for every inserted accessible (that corresponds to inserted content)
  158. # [11:36] <@tbsaunde> surkov: ok, so then why why is show / hide only fired for root of subtee? (other than coalescence?
  159. # [11:38] <@surkov> tbsaunde: nah, it's called on every inserted accessible that corresponds to inserted content :) that doesn't mean it's called on children of inserted accessible :)
  160. # [11:39] <@tbsaunde> surkov: oh, so if you insert a tree of content objects then its only called on the root of the cooresponding tree of accessibles?
  161. # [11:45] <@surkov> tbsaunde: correct
  162. # [11:45] <@surkov> tbsaunde: and then CacheChildrenInSubtree in UpdateTreeInternal updates the tree
  163. # [11:46] <@tbsaunde> surkov: yeah, I remember that part now]
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  166. # [11:53] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted feedback for attachment 610839 on bug 739524.
  167. # [11:53] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
  168. # [11:53] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: do you still need your email in whiteboard status (bug 739524)?
  169. # [11:54] <Mark_Capella> nah - i saw that too ok to remove
  170. # [11:54] <Mark_Capella> surkov: you said you can do a second part (use nsITreeView* instead of nsRefPtr<nsITreeView>) as followup
  171. # [11:55] <Mark_Capella> you mean nsCOMPtr<nsITreeView> ??
  172. # [11:55] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: yes, those mTreeView members
  173. # [11:55] <@surkov> sorry for confusing :)
  174. # [11:56] <Mark_Capella> Is ok ... and you mean across the board right? nsxultreeaccessible.*, nsxultreegridaccessible.*, etc ??
  175. # [11:56] <Mark_Capella> (found in 8 files)
  176. # [11:57] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: absolutely
  177. # [11:58] <Mark_Capella> surkov: ok - it its that easy Ill put it in with this bug ... no need for a followup
  178. # [11:58] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: up to you
  179. # [11:59] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: don't forget to fix cycle collecting
  180. # [11:59] <Mark_Capella> oh ... well ... maybe a followup after all :) "cycle collecting"
  181. # [12:00] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740747 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
  182. # [12:00] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740747 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, dexpcom nsAccessible::GetName
  183. # [12:01] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: up to you :) it's not hard, just remove cycle collection marcros related to mTreeView
  184. # [12:05] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so, for dexpcoming Name how do you plan to deal with fact return value is used for more than success / failure in a way it isn't for description (NS_OK_NO_TOOLTIP etc)
  185. # [12:06] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740750 filed by markcapella@twcny.rr.com.
  186. # [12:06] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740750 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Use nsITreeView* instead of nsRefPtr<nsITreeView> as followup to bug#739524
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  188. # [12:13] <@surkov> tbsaunde: enum?
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  191. # [12:17] <@tbsaunde> surkov: yeah, could work, should probably describe idea in bug some
  192. # [12:17] <@surkov> ok
  193. # [12:19] <@tbsaunde> askalski: hi, were you looking for me yesterday at some point? I don't remember...
  194. # [12:19] <@askalski> tbsaunde, I don't recall. anyway, nice to see you :)
  195. # [12:26] <@askalski> btw, hi everyone!
  196. # [12:30] <@surkov> hi
  197. # [12:37] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740758 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
  198. # [12:37] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740758 is not accessible
  199. # [12:46] <Mark_Capella> surkov: has Bug 726071 - get rid nsAccUtils::GetPositionAndSizeForXULSelectControlItem gotten distributed yet?
  200. # [12:46] <Mark_Capella> I mean ... has everyone who has done an HG PULL -u received the changes?
  201. # [12:46] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=726071 nor, --, mozilla14, markcapella, RESO FIXED, get rid nsAccUtils::GetPositionAndSizeForXULSelectControlItem
  202. # [12:51] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: I update the tree every day
  203. # [12:51] <@surkov> mostly
  204. # [12:51] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: why do you ask?
  205. # [12:52] <Mark_Capella> <infinity> cant get the changed version of nsrolemap.h to make his changes re: roles::comments
  206. # [12:53] <Mark_Capella> mxr shows it properly ... hg pull -u doesnt get it
  207. # [12:54] <Mark_Capella> 2nd line from end s/b // ROLE_CHECK_RICH_OPTION item
  208. # [12:55] <Mark_Capella> in the mac/nsrolemap.h
  209. # [12:58] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740764 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
  210. # [12:58] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740764 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, merge GetAttributes and GetAttributesInternal
  211. # [12:59] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: perhaps he has some local changes in the tree
  212. # [12:59] <@surkov> that prevents a tree from update
  213. # [13:00] <Mark_Capella> i checked with <avih> in #introduction .... he doesnt have it either??
  214. # [13:00] <Mark_Capella> enerything looks ok for you though?
  215. # [13:08] <Mark_Capella> yah
  216. # [13:11] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: I don't have those code in my tree
  217. # [13:13] <Mark_Capella> surkov: you mean the patch didnt get to you yet?
  218. # [13:13] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: no, it's in my tree
  219. # [13:13] * Joins: arky (arky@2BA41E9A.BCED5211.B9D97DBA.IP)
  220. # [13:14] <Mark_Capella> oh ... its good for you ... ok thats good to know ... not sure why <infinity> cant see it in his repo/tree.
  221. # [13:14] <Mark_Capella> and <avih> said now he >thinks< hes done a recent pull -u
  222. # [13:15] <Mark_Capella> so Ill check with <infinity> he must have a beginner problem
  223. # [13:17] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740766 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
  224. # [13:18] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740766 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, dexpcom nsAccessible::GroupPosition
  225. # [13:18] <@surkov> yep
  226. # [13:18] <@surkov> thanks!
  227. # [13:19] <Mark_Capella> surkov: forgot to ask ... no tests fail for test_tree.xul ... why / what do you want changed?
  228. # [13:20] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: they shouldn't fail because you fire TreeViewChanged event but we don't care about this event any more, right?
  229. # [13:20] <@surkov> so let's remove it from our testing
  230. # [13:20] <@surkov> I'm pretty sure it should be covered by some content tests
  231. # [13:21] <Mark_Capella> doesn't the test fire and listen for the event ...? hmmm ... lemme think
  232. # [13:35] <@firebot> maxli@maxli.ca requested review from hub@mozilla.com for attachment 610849 on bug 739193.
  233. # [13:35] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739193 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, nsTextEquivUtils::AppendTextEquivFromContent shouldn't use GetAccService()->GetAccessible
  234. # [13:47] * Joins: fer (fer@moz-D01BD20F.easynet.es)
  235. # [13:48] <fer> hi guys
  236. # [13:49] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com requested feedback from surkov.alexander@ gmail.com for attachment 610851 on bug 739524.
  237. # [13:50] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
  238. # [13:51] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com requested review from roc@ocallahan.org for attachment 610851 on bug 739524.
  239. # [13:51] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted feedback for attachment 610851 on bug 739524.
  240. # [13:51] <@surkov> hi, fer
  241. # [13:51] <@surkov> how is it going?
  242. # [13:53] <fer> surkov, good good, and you?
  243. # [13:54] <@surkov> fer, well, no bad, pretty swamped by things :)
  244. # [13:54] <@surkov> as usual
  245. # [13:56] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com cancelled review?(roc@ocallahan.org) for attachment 610851 on bug 739524.
  246. # [13:56] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com requested feedback from surkov.alexander@ gmail.com for attachment 610853 on bug 739524.
  247. # [13:57] <Mark_Capella> ooops review / feedback
  248. # [14:07] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com requested review from roc@ocallahan.org for attachment 610853 on bug 739524.
  249. # [14:07] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted feedback for attachment 610853 on bug 739524.
  250. # [14:07] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
  251. # [14:08] <@tbsaunde> surkov: should ug 739193 just get rid of getting the pres shell all together?
  252. # [14:09] <Mark_Capella> surkov: ok re:trivial changes
  253. # [14:09] * Quits: fer (fer@moz-D01BD20F.easynet.es) (Ping timeout)
  254. # [14:09] <@surkov> thx
  255. # [14:11] <@surkov> tbsaunde: not sure I follow
  256. # [14:14] <@tbsaunde> surkov: after the patch we get the presShell, and do nothing with it other than return if its null
  257. # [14:14] <@tbsaunde> which is sort of silly
  258. # [14:19] <@surkov> tbsaunde: yeah, we don't need, please comment into bug
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  262. # [14:45] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com changed the Status on bug 740725 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
  263. # [14:45] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740725 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, Add down-casting to nsXULTreeAccessible
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  273. # [15:21] * ChanServ sets mode: +qo davidb davidb
  274. # [15:26] * Joins: fxa90id (fxa90id@moz-4FFDB6B1.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
  275. # [15:27] <@davidb> hi!
  276. # [15:27] <fxa90id> hi!
  277. # [15:33] <@MarcoZ> Hi davidb!
  278. # [15:37] * Joins: muralisr92 (chatzilla@moz-6292B23E.dynip.nus.edu.sg)
  279. # [15:43] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: do you have a blog?
  280. # [15:43] <@davidb> jhk: and you?
  281. # [15:43] <Mark_Capella> davidb: im afraid not
  282. # [15:43] <@davidb> np
  283. # [15:43] <Mark_Capella> davidb: but i take direct inquiries :)
  284. # [15:44] <@davidb> hehe
  285. # [15:44] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: just thinking about options if bug 652635 lands
  286. # [15:44] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=652635 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, Fallback missing @longdesc to aria-describedby pointing to <a href>
  287. # [15:45] <Mark_Capella> options? you like in case of total and utter destruction?
  288. # [15:45] <@davidb> nah, in terms of telling people about it :)
  289. # [15:45] <Mark_Capella> Oh! thats a good think ... how does Mozilla.org handle communications like that?
  290. # [15:46] <Mark_Capella> thing
  291. # [15:46] <jhk> davidb: yes a little http://goo.gl/vkWUy
  292. # [15:46] <Mark_Capella> plus arent changes vetted ... q/a group before going out?
  293. # [15:47] <@davidb> jhk: nice. you are overdue for another post (like me) :)
  294. # [15:47] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: we vet a11y changes
  295. # [15:47] <jhk> right :)
  296. # [15:48] <@MarcoZ> That reminds me that I should blog again, too, but somehow recent changes were a lot under the hood and not user-facing.
  297. # [15:49] <@MarcoZ> ...and that's just to say that I didn't find a topic that might interest most my readers. :)
  298. # [15:49] <Mark_Capella> davidb: i mean we dont just drop stuff in peoples lap ... someone from mozilla end users must be involved? q/a? help desk?
  299. # [15:50] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: we have release channels
  300. # [15:50] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: so we get nightly user feedback, aurora, then beta, finally release
  301. # [15:51] <@davidb> MarcoZ: is our in-house QA guru and has some tendrils in various communities
  302. # [15:51] <Mark_Capella> davidb: cool ... so you were thinking blog for extra exposure
  303. # [15:51] <@davidb> along those lines, but not specific to one bug really
  304. # [15:51] <@davidb> surkov will likely blog about this one, or we can post to some key mailing lists
  305. # [15:52] <@davidb> or it will hit the twitters :)
  306. # [15:52] <Mark_Capella> davidb: yah .... thats good ... im not really tied in yet ... if i tell someone no one notices ;)
  307. # [15:52] <@davidb> But in general, I find it really cool you guys are helping move web accessibility forward and blogging about that could also be cool.
  308. # [15:52] <@davidb> heh
  309. # [15:52] <@davidb> gotta start somewhere
  310. # [15:54] <@surkov> yep, twitter is especially nice because you don't need to have lot of ties to be retweeted much
  311. # [15:54] <@surkov> so if you blog then just ping davidb or MarcoZ
  312. # [15:54] <@davidb> surkov: i retweeted your contributor blog
  313. # [15:55] <Mark_Capella> davidb: i guess I should review the groups status stuff ... priorities list at some point
  314. # [15:55] <Mark_Capella> (I know its there I havent hooked in yet)
  315. # [15:55] <@davidb> surkov: curious why you didn't point to: https://wiki.mozilla.org/Accessibility/Contribute ?
  316. # [15:55] <@surkov> davidb: yeah, i saw it, thank you!
  317. # [15:55] <@davidb> go team!
  318. # [15:56] <@surkov> davidb: I think I missed it, I saw bunch of a11y contributors pages but all of them were rather for us than for contributors
  319. # [15:56] <@davidb> yeah there are some confusingly close URLs
  320. # [15:57] <@davidb> see also https://wiki.mozilla.org/Contribute/Accessibility
  321. # [15:58] * Quits: fxa90id (fxa90id@moz-4FFDB6B1.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) (Ping timeout)
  322. # [15:58] <@davidb> I think I should take my name off that latter one
  323. # [15:58] <@davidb> Ken can own it
  324. # [16:00] * Quits: muralisr92 (chatzilla@moz-6292B23E.dynip.nus.edu.sg) (Client exited)
  325. # [16:02] * @davidb emails Ken
  326. # [16:04] <@davidb> tbsaunde: your patch on bug 733510 looks nearly ready
  327. # [16:04] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=733510 nor, --, ---, trev.saunders, NEW, Transition boolean a11y telemetry to 'flag' telemetry as appropriate
  328. # [16:05] <@tbsaunde> davidb: I guess, but I don't have time to fiddle with naming for a couple days
  329. # [16:06] <@tbsaunde> feel free to do it if you like
  330. # [16:06] <@davidb> thanks but forecast is not good for spare cycles
  331. # [16:07] <@davidb> but maybe
  332. # [16:09] * Joins: aaronlev (aaronlev@moz-CDA191A6.c3-0.arl-ubr1.sbo-arl.ma.cable.rcn.com)
  333. # [16:34] <@tbsaunde> heh
  334. # [16:51] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Thanks for filing the keyboard nav/focus indication bug against mozilla.org !
  335. # [16:51] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Unfortunately, these are things that never get caught by me, naturally.
  336. # [16:52] * @MarcoZ pings Stephen Donner on this bug.
  337. # [16:52] <@davidb> MarcoZ: sure
  338. # [16:52] <@davidb> MarcoZ: can you work with QA to make sure there is sighted keyboard testing included in the QA plan?
  339. # [16:53] <@davidb> because OMFG
  340. # [16:53] <@davidb> this is a11y 101
  341. # [16:53] * Joins: muralisr92 (chatzilla@695E91DD.C558A9D6.F1C91561.IP)
  342. # [16:58] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Just did, and you're CC'd.
  343. # [16:58] <@davidb> read it - thanks
  344. # [17:06] * Joins: nhirata (nhirata.bu@moz-585D5EFC.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
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  349. # [17:16] <@davidb> MarcoZ: if the answer is anything but yes, please ping me.
  350. # [17:16] <@davidb> this has to be part of QA
  351. # [17:17] <@davidb> the populations we know about are: 1. sighted non mouse ptr users (including mobility impairments) and 2. mag users.
  352. # [17:17] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  353. # [17:17] <@davidb> i suspect there are non-a11y cases too
  354. # [17:17] <@davidb> and this isn't hard stuff.
  355. # [17:18] * Joins: arky (arky@2BA41E9A.BCED5211.B9D97DBA.IP)
  356. # [17:19] <@davidb> MarcoZ: this reminds me, it has been a while since we did an a11y brown bag.
  357. # [17:19] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: about DOMi: http://asurkov.blogspot.com/2012/02/dom-inspector-as-accessibility-tool.html
  358. # [17:19] <@davidb> we could do a brown bag or something more targeted… like crash a webdev work week.
  359. # [17:20] <aaronlev> Time for a 3rd coffee
  360. # [17:20] <@davidb> surkov: is Mark_Capella asking for js work? :)
  361. # [17:21] <@surkov> davidb: no just giving a link about DOMi
  362. # [17:21] <@surkov> in case if he wants to look at that tool
  363. # [17:21] <@surkov> it's good for debugging
  364. # [17:22] <@davidb> indeed!
  365. # [17:22] <@tbsaunde> surkov: is there more stuff we want to add to domi? or have you done all the things you want?
  366. # [17:23] <Mark_Capella> surkov: thankx btw ... i was looking at this too http://accessibility.linuxfoundation.org/a11yweb/util/accprobe/
  367. # [17:23] <@surkov> tbsaunde: even no half of the way is passed :)
  368. # [17:23] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: that's a good tool but crashy lately
  369. # [17:23] <@surkov> it's still requires a lot of work, I just don't need anything urgently to continue hacking on it
  370. # [17:23] * Quits: Mark_Capella (chatzilla@moz-DD0C7E4F.twcny.res.rr.com) (Client exited)
  371. # [17:24] <@surkov> my queue contains some unfinished pathes, some of them are going to be nice features
  372. # [17:24] <@surkov> :)
  373. # [17:25] <@firebot> New Core - Keyboard: Navigation bug 740813 filed by neil@httl.net.
  374. # [17:25] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740813 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Tabbing to a design mode frame focuses its document element
  375. # [17:25] * Joins: NeilAway (neil@moz-32AA0D01.in-addr.btopenworld.com)
  376. # [17:25] <NeilAway> if I have a <textbox accesskey="d"> do you use that information at all?
  377. # [17:25] * @davidb waves to NeilAway
  378. # [17:25] * NeilAway waves back
  379. # [17:25] <@davidb> good q
  380. # [17:26] <@davidb> I don't know
  381. # [17:26] <@davidb> i don't know our access key code at all actually… surkov? ^
  382. # [17:27] <NeilAway> someone wants to change our code to focus the textbox in script instead, and I was wondering whether it would reduce accessibility
  383. # [17:27] <@surkov> NeilAway: yes
  384. # [17:27] <@surkov> NeilAway: could you cc me and MarcoZ to the bug please?
  385. # [17:28] <@surkov> btw, that yes was about first question
  386. # [17:28] <NeilAway> surkov: so, if the screen reader sees accesskey="d" it will say "hey, you can use Alt+D to get back to this field"?
  387. # [17:28] <@MarcoZ> Yes, the access key is exposed to accessibility APIs so screen readers can announce it without looking at the DOM.
  388. # [17:28] <@surkov> yes
  389. # [17:29] <NeilAway> whereas if we change to Firefox's way of using <key key="d" modifiers="alt" oncommand="textbox.focus(); /* and now the point of the change */ textbox.select();"/> then you won't announce that
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  395. # [17:50] <@surkov> NeilAway: do you talk about bug 372371?
  396. # [17:50] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=372371 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, use xul:command/xul:key to expose keyBinding
  397. # [17:51] * Joins: Mark_Capella (chatzilla@moz-DD0C7E4F.twcny.res.rr.com)
  398. # [17:51] <@surkov> sad thing is <textbox accesskey="d"> case is not covered by a11y mochitests
  399. # [17:54] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: accprobe should do a trick :)
  400. # [17:54] <Mark_Capella> surkov: im playing with the tools ... pretty neat :)
  401. # [17:55] <@surkov> but we need to ping tbsaunde to see if he has nice ideas about bug 652635
  402. # [17:55] <@surkov> ok cool
  403. # [17:55] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=652635 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, Fallback missing @longdesc to aria-describedby pointing to <a href>
  404. # [17:56] * @MarcoZ is off for the evening, been at it since before 8 this morning.
  405. # [17:56] <@MarcoZ> See you all on Monday!
  406. # [17:56] <Mark_Capella> surkov: you want to ask tbsaunde about 652635? Or the followup bug...
  407. # [17:57] <@surkov> about original bug
  408. # [17:57] <@surkov> your previous patch was good except it calculated longdesc element twice
  409. # [17:57] <Mark_Capella> oh - ok hmmm ... he should be awake
  410. # [17:57] * Joins: ehsan (ehsan@C83DD54.BA5D982D.ED954971.IP)
  411. # [17:57] <@surkov> the last one is wrong
  412. # [17:57] <Mark_Capella> last test?
  413. # [17:57] <@surkov> tbsaunde sleeps at strange time :)
  414. # [17:57] <@surkov> last patch
  415. # [17:58] <Mark_Capella> oh .. drats
  416. # [17:59] * Quits: @MarcoZ (Daily@moz-D11E3999.dip.t-dialin.net) (Quit: Weekend!)
  417. # [17:59] <Mark_Capella> this one calculates it once but introduces a bug is what youre saying?
  418. # [17:59] <@tbsaunde> surkov: I'm around but should be thinking about graph theory
  419. # [17:59] <@surkov> ok
  420. # [17:59] <@surkov> :)
  421. # [17:59] <@surkov> Mark_Capella: correct
  422. # [18:00] <Mark_Capella> k ill wait for more info when tbsaunde frees up
  423. # [18:00] <Mark_Capella> <--- needs to go shopping anyhow :)
  424. # [18:03] <NeilAway> surkov: well, Ratty attached the wrong patch, oops
  425. # [18:03] <@tbsaunde> surkov: couldn't we just have ActionCount() check both tht the index is the right number and that there is a longdesc?
  426. # [18:04] <@surkov> NeilAway: ok, then things aren't so scary :)
  427. # [18:05] <NeilAway> surkov: well, I just can't show you the right patch ;-)
  428. # [18:06] <@surkov> tbsaunde: ActionCount relies on getting long desc element too, we don't want to get it twice
  429. # [18:06] <NeilAway> surkov: Firefox changed it at a time when they didn't care about reviews or attaching patches to bugzilla
  430. # [18:06] <NeilAway> surkov: but here's the diff in bonsai: http://bonsai.mozilla.org/cvsview2.cgi?diff_mode=context&whitespace_mode=show&subdir=mozilla/browser/base/content&command=DIFF_FRAMESET&file=browser.xul&rev1=1.223&rev2=1.224&root=/cvsroot
  431. # [18:06] * ctalbert|afk is now known as ctalbert
  432. # [18:06] <@surkov> oh, I see
  433. # [18:08] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
  434. # [18:08] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  435. # [18:09] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so, what I think I mean is sepeerate loic of the two methods os IsValidIndex() doesn't check that there is actually a longdesc just that the index would be correct if there is one, and LongDesc() tries to get the longdesc but takes no index
  436. # [18:09] * Quits: arky (arky@2BA41E9A.BCED5211.B9D97DBA.IP) (Ping timeout)
  437. # [18:10] <@surkov> tbsaunde: sounds ok
  438. # [18:11] <@surkov> just IsValidIndex is not very correct name
  439. # [18:11] <@tbsaunde> surkov: well, depends what you mean valid
  440. # [18:11] <@surkov> yeah, but the meaning it's used now isn't not correct :)
  441. # [18:12] <@tbsaunde> EDOUBLENEGATIOn
  442. # [18:12] * Joins: jhk (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP)
  443. # [18:13] <@tbsaunde> we could rename it
  444. # [18:14] <NeilAway> surkov: seamonkey proposed patch version: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=610903&action=diff#a/suite/browser/navigator.xul_sec1
  445. # [18:14] <@firebot> hub@mozilla.com denied review for attachment 610849 on bug 739193.
  446. # [18:14] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739193 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, nsTextEquivUtils::AppendTextEquivFromContent shouldn't use GetAccService()->GetAccessible
  447. # [18:14] <NeilAway> surkov: so technically we lose some accessibility by doing that?
  448. # [18:16] <@surkov> NeilAway: yes until bug 372371 is fixed
  449. # [18:16] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=372371 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, use xul:command/xul:key to expose keyBinding
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  452. # [18:38] <Mark_Capella> <--- back later
  453. # [18:40] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740851 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
  454. # [18:40] <@firebot> Bug 740851 was not found.
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  469. # [20:13] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com changed the Status on bug 740375 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
  470. # [20:13] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740375 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, get rid nsIAccessible innerHTML method
  471. # [20:19] <@tbsaunde> Mark_Capella so, for bug 739524 why don't you pss mTreeView to TreeViewChanged()?
  472. # [20:19] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
  473. # [20:19] <@tbsaunde> I think the patch is good as is, but that'd make it better I think :)
  474. # [20:19] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740892 filed by hub@mozilla.com.
  475. # [20:19] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740892 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Add a method that returns selection including selection for caret.
  476. # [20:21] <Mark_Capella> tbsaunde: copied the code in nsAccessibilityService.cpp worked back from there ... its consistant
  477. # [20:23] <@tbsaunde> Mark_Capella: copied what?
  478. # [20:24] <Mark_Capella> nsAccessibilityService::UpdateListBullet .... function right below it ... almost the same
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  481. # [20:30] <@tbsaunde> Mark_Capella: consistancy is nice, but getting the view ourselves is probably not entirely cheap and kind of silly
  482. # [20:32] <Mark_Capella> tbsaunde: ... ok ... I followed surkovs suggestions, but can tweak it even further ... can you post the details to the bug? I'll make the changes :)
  483. # [20:32] <@tbsaunde> Mark_Capella: sure
  484. # [20:33] <Mark_Capella> Thx :Dn I'll turn it right around .... get it right back to you
  485. # [20:33] <Mark_Capella> after a build and a test of course
  486. # [20:35] <@tbsaunde> no hurry, I'm sort of in and out tthe next few days
  487. # [20:35] <Mark_Capella> okay ... i work on weekends also
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  492. # [21:00] <Mark_Capella> firebot: uuid
  493. # [21:00] <@firebot> 46d422d1-c92f-4536-bdef-f77bc8350ec7 (/msg firebot cid for CID form)
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  513. # [22:02] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 725432 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  514. # [22:02] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk set the Resolution field on bug 725432 to FIXED.
  515. # [22:03] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Target Milestone on bug 725432 from --- to mozilla14.
  516. # [22:03] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=725432 nor, --, mozilla14, maxli, RESO FIXED, HTML buttons with aria-pressed not exposing IA2 TOGGLE_BUTTON role
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  524. # [22:21] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com requested feedback from trev.saunders@gma il.com for attachment 610983 on bug 740375.
  525. # [22:21] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740375 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, get rid nsIAccessible innerHTML method
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  532. # [23:00] <@firebot> roc@ocallahan.org granted review for attachment 610853 on bug 739524.
  533. # [23:00] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739524 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, replace TreeViewChanged DOM event on direct call from XUL tree
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  535. # [23:01] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 740958 filed by scoobidiver@netcourrier.com.
  536. # [23:01] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740958 cri, --, ---, nobody, NEW, crash in nsAccessible::GetBounds
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  547. # [23:41] <@firebot> hub@mozilla.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 611039 on bug 718627.
  548. # [23:41] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=718627 nor, P1, ---, hub, ASSI, [Mac] Navigating by character, or interacting with, the text in the awesome bar does not speak the c
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  554. # Session Close: Sat Mar 31 00:00:00 2012

The end :)