/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2012-04-17 / end
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- # Session Start: Tue Apr 17 00:00:00 2012
- # Session Ident: #accessibility
- # [00:17] * Joins: brambles (brambles@4CBAB088.F3076E90.1822ACA6.IP)
- # [00:24] <@firebot> hub@mozilla.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615491 on bug 712924.
- # [00:24] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712924 nor, P2, mozilla14, hub, NEW, [Mac] li elements inside an ul element are announced as "list box"
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- # [00:40] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 745981 filed by eitan@monotonous.org.
- # [00:40] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745981 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Switching to a tab without a set virtual cursor raises an error
- # [00:41] <satdav> hey guys can we get https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/accessibility that on the topic if possible
- # [00:41] <satdav> as its the general accessibility list
- # [00:41] * hub changes topic to '"build the web for everyone" | release schedule: http://mzl.la/LNc0W | accessibility list https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/accessibility'
- # [00:41] <@hub> like that?
- # [00:41] <satdav> thanks hub
- # [00:42] <satdav> sign up for it if you are not
- # [00:42] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615501 on bug 745981.
- # [00:42] <@hub> satdav: I'm already on it
- # [00:42] <satdav> cool
- # [00:42] <satdav> hub, will pm you the now regarding it
- # [00:44] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 745982 filed by eitan@monotonous.org.
- # [00:44] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745982 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Move BORDER_PADDING to VisualPresenter
- # [00:45] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615503 on bug 745982.
- # [00:47] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 745986 filed by eitan@monotonous.org.
- # [00:47] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745986 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Display page loading states
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- # [02:01] <@surkov> hi, hub
- # [02:04] <@hub> hey
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- # [02:31] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 615556 on bug 743680.
- # [02:31] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=743680 nor, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, don't export nsARIAMap.h
- # [02:40] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615458 on bug 739191.
- # [02:40] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739191 nor, --, ---, xph9753, ASSI, get rid nsAccUtils::GetDocAccessibleFor(const nsIPresShell* aPresShell)
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- # [03:44] <@firebot> maxli@maxli.ca requested feedback from surkov.alexander@ gmail.com for attachment 615584 on bug 739882.
- # [03:44] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739882 nor, --, ---, maxli, NEW, decomtaminate getting row and column count on accessible tables
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- # [05:14] <@surkov> eeejay: around?
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- # [07:38] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 739191 from --- to mozilla14.
- # [07:38] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739191 nor, --, mozilla14, xph9753, ASSI, get rid nsAccUtils::GetDocAccessibleFor(const nsIPresShell* aPresShell)
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- # [08:14] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted feedback for attachment 615584 on bug 739882.
- # [08:14] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739882 nor, --, ---, maxli, NEW, decomtaminate getting row and column count on accessible tables
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- # [08:44] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615491 on bug 712924.
- # [08:44] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712924 nor, P2, mozilla14, hub, NEW, [Mac] li elements inside an ul element are announced as "list box"
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- # [09:04] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 739498 from mozilla14 to ---.
- # [09:04] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739498 nor, --, ---, eitan, RESO FIXED, Add Javascript layer for mobile accessibility
- # [09:04] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 739498 from --- to mozilla14.
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- # [09:08] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615501 on bug 745981.
- # [09:08] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745981 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Switching to a tab without a set virtual cursor raises an error
- # [09:15] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615503 on bug 745982.
- # [09:16] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745982 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Move BORDER_PADDING to VisualPresenter
- # [09:29] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com requested review from marco.zehe@googlema il.com for attachment 615626 on bug 733848.
- # [09:29] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 733848 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
- # [09:29] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=733848 nor, --, ---, surkov.alexander, ASSI, Intermittent failures in a11y/accessible/name/test_markup.html | Can't get accessible for [object HT
- # [09:57] <Mark_Capella> surkov: Good Morning
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- # [10:06] <@surkov> hello, Mark_Capella
- # [10:06] <Mark_Capella> surkov: have you been busy? You havent been talking much?
- # [10:07] <@surkov> when? :)
- # [10:07] <Mark_Capella> last few days ... maybe I just missed you
- # [10:07] <@surkov> perhaps timezones
- # [10:07] <Mark_Capella> yah ...
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- # [10:08] <Mark_Capella> surkov: did you see i reposted the GetName Densify patch? I had forgotten to HG Qrefresh thats why you didnt see my last changes
- # [10:08] <@surkov> yeah, I'm looking at it
- # [10:08] <Mark_Capella> :) O! Cool!
- # [10:17] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615318 on bug 740747.
- # [10:17] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740747 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, dexpcom nsAccessible::GetName
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- # [10:38] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746084 filed by surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
- # [10:38] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746084 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, provide extended logging for a11y module
- # [10:51] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com granted review for attachment 615626 on bug 733848.
- # [10:51] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=733848 nor, --, ---, surkov.alexander, ASSI, Intermittent failures in a11y/accessible/name/test_markup.html | Can't get accessible for [object HT
- # [10:58] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 733848 from --- to mozilla14.
- # [11:00] <@surkov> MarcoZ: can you steal review from tbsaunde in bug 743680?
- # [11:00] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=743680 nor, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, don't export nsARIAMap.h
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- # [12:01] <@firebot> bugs@pettay.fi granted review for attachment 615556 on bug 743680.
- # [12:01] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=743680 nor, --, mozilla14, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, don't export nsARIAMap.h
- # [12:22] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 615642 on bug 740747.
- # [12:22] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740747 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, dexpcom nsAccessible::GetName
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- # [13:41] <@firebot> maxli@maxli.ca requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 615664 on bug 739882.
- # [13:41] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739882 nor, --, ---, maxli, NEW, decomtaminate getting row and column count on accessible tables
- # [13:44] <@MarcoZ> Hi all!
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- # [14:31] <Mark_Capella> waves @ marcoz
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- # [14:40] <Mark_Capella> surkov: got your ears on?
- # [14:40] <@surkov> sure
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- # [14:40] <Mark_Capella> can i ask you to do a quick read of Bug 739568 - nsXULTreeGridRowAccesible should cache
- # [14:40] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739568 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, nsXULTreeGridRowAccesible should cache its kids as nsXULTreeGridCellAccessibles not generic accessib
- # [14:41] <@surkov> ok
- # [14:46] <Mark_Capella> yah, not sure my c++ is up to that yet
- # [14:48] <Mark_Capella> well, let me read that a few more times ... do some research
- # [14:51] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com changed the Status on bug 745740 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
- # [14:51] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745740 nor, --, ---, markcapella, ASSI, De-ns-ify nsApplicationAccessible
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- # [15:00] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Hi! Do you have an idea why the a11y Mochitests do currently not work on the Mac?
- # [15:01] <@surkov> MarcoZ: do you mean tbox machines (no idea)?
- # [15:03] <fxa90id> hi
- # [15:04] <fxa90id> surkov, I have a question
- # [15:05] <@surkov> fxa90id: hi, sure
- # [15:05] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Yes. Because I think that's the only thing keeping us from turning on a11y for OS X builds on tbox machines right now.
- # [15:05] <@firebot> markcapella@twcny.rr.com changed the Status on bug 678429 from ASSIGNED to NEW.
- # [15:05] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=678429 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, implement weak reference for accessible objects
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- # [15:05] <@surkov> MarcoZ: do they pass nowadays ?
- # [15:06] <@MarcoZ> surkov: I'm just building and will find out afterwards.
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- # [15:08] <@surkov> ok
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- # [15:13] <@MarcoZ> surkov: I believe the tests would theoretically pass, but they were not even starting last time we tried.
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- # [15:24] <@MarcoZ> Heyo davidb!
- # [15:24] <@davidb> hi - gotta install updates
- # [15:24] * @davidb does that
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- # [15:33] <@davidb> heyo
- # [15:34] <@tbsaunde> hi
- # [15:34] <@MarcoZ> Hi tbsaunde!
- # [15:34] <@tbsaunde> hi MarcoZ
- # [15:34] * @tbsaunde seems to be terrible at not getting distracted as usual
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- # [15:38] <@firebot> michaljev@o2.pl requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615689 on bug 727722.
- # [15:38] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=727722 nor, --, ---, michaljev, NEW, Create an accessible for HTML table row by frame
- # [15:40] * Quits: jhk (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP) (Ping timeout)
- # [15:43] <@MarcoZ> surkov: So the tests *appear* to be running.
- # [15:44] <@surkov> good to hear
- # [15:44] <@surkov> MarcoZ: do we have a bug?
- # [15:44] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Taking a stab at seeing where the tests currently are on Mac.
- # [15:44] <@surkov> iirc there was something
- # [15:44] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Yes we do, but I don't remember off-hand.
- # [15:44] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Hub filed it.
- # [15:45] <@davidb> what are we talking about?
- # [15:45] <@surkov> running mochitest on os x
- # [15:45] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Getting the Mochitests running and passing on OS X again.
- # [15:45] <@surkov> on tbox machines
- # [15:46] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Because if that's out of the way, I'd like to have a11y enabled on the accessibility branch ASAP, and at the beginning of next cycle on central, if possible.
- # [15:46] <@davidb> sounds excellent
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- # [15:46] <@davidb> hub and I were discussing this
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- # [15:48] <@MarcoZ> surkov: davidb: So it got stuck on the docload test.
- # [15:48] <@tbsaunde> its not clear to me why we need to hve tests passing before we change the defaults in configure
- # [15:48] <@MarcoZ> It opened the document, but didn't close it again.
- # [15:49] <@davidb> we should ask hub
- # [15:49] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: Because if we make the changes in configure and the a11y tests don't pass, Mac will be perma-orange.
- # [15:49] <@davidb> (hi aaronlev)
- # [15:49] <@davidb> heyo Mark_Capella
- # [15:49] <@tbsaunde> we can't start ding test jobs on opt osx until they pass, but enabling building a11y doesn't require that we start running those jobs
- # [15:49] <Mark_Capella> heyo!
- # [15:50] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: AFAIK, this goes hand in hand right now.
- # [15:50] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: no it won't until we tell releng to turn on running tests in mochitest-o
- # [15:50] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: I don't think that is correct
- # [15:51] <@tbsaunde> running tests requires building a11y of course, but scheduling jobs isn't automatic if a11y is built
- # [15:51] <@tbsaunde> but its easy enough to find out
- # [15:52] <@surkov> MarcoZ: you can file patches to disable certain tests under mac
- # [15:52] <@surkov> to get them running
- # [15:52] <@surkov> and file bugs to investigate the issue
- # [15:52] <aaronlev> MarcoZ: Herzlichen Glückwunsch, ein Tag zu spät
- # [15:53] <@MarcoZ> surkov: I just restarted the test run because it kept hanging. And what I see is that this thing is running very very slowly. On Windows, it takes at most 2 minutes for he tests to finish, on the Mac, I was over 10 minutes, and was only at the events/context menu testing thing.
- # [15:53] <@firebot> michaljev@o2.pl cancelled review?(surkov.alexander@gm ail.com) for attachment 615689 on bug 727722.
- # [15:53] <@firebot> michaljev@o2.pl requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615694 on bug 727722.
- # [15:53] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=727722 nor, --, ---, michaljev, NEW, Create an accessible for HTML table row by frame
- # [15:53] <@surkov> interesting
- # [15:53] <@MarcoZ> aaronlev: Thank you!
- # [15:53] <@MarcoZ> aaronlev: And BTW, two days, it was on the 15th. ;)
- # [15:54] <aaronlev> heh
- # [15:56] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Yeah, I'll leave it running in the background for a while and see how far it comes.
- # [15:57] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615694 on bug 727722.
- # [15:57] <@tbsaunde> so, is there a reason we don't just push the change to configure to accessibility and see what happens?
- # [16:08] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: First, I need to find out where that change is made nowadays. They revamped all the mozconfigs, yet again.
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- # [16:13] <@MarcoZ> OK, this one terminated right in the middle of actions/test_general.html, probably due to a crash.
- # [16:13] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: you change the default in configure.in
- # [16:13] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: hub put a patch on a bug
- # [16:14] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: Due to all those changes that happened to the build system recently, that patch is probably no longer valid/needs rebasing.
- # [16:15] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: mybe, but its a one line edit, so shouldn't take more than 5 seconds to do
- # [16:15] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: Do you remember the bug number?
- # [16:16] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Does it bother anyone if the accessibility branch went orange permanently for a while? Or can we basically mess with it all we want?
- # [16:16] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: not off hand
- # [16:17] <@davidb> we can do whatever we like with it
- # [16:19] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: I didn't look for the bug, but I just "wrote" the patch again http://paste.debian.net/163528/
- # [16:19] <@tbsaunde> its actually more than a line since I can remove some stuff, but still
- # [16:20] <@firebot> mak77@bonardo.net changed the Status on bug 729154 from ASSIGNED to RESOLVED.
- # [16:20] <@firebot> mak77@bonardo.net set the Resolution field on bug 729154 to FIXED.
- # [16:20] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=729154 nor, --, mozilla14, dbolter, RESO FIXED, Telemetry for a11y instantiation by unknown cause.
- # [16:20] <@firebot> mak77@bonardo.net changed the Status on bug 741699 from ASSIGNED to RESOLVED.
- # [16:20] <@firebot> mak77@bonardo.net set the Resolution field on bug 741699 to FIXED.
- # [16:20] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=741699 nor, --, mozilla14, maxli, RESO FIXED, telemetry for uiautomation.dll
- # [16:22] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: Thanks!
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- # [16:23] <@tbsaunde> MarcoZ: np
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- # [16:56] <@MarcoZ> surkov: davidb: OK, it times out in events/test_browserui.xul, after it first times out in the docload thing and I have to close the window manually for it to complete. I feel it has something to do with document loading not being told to a11y APIs on OS X.
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- # [16:57] <@surkov> MarcoZ: there's no known orange for that?
- # [16:57] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Have not seen any in either of those files.
- # [16:57] <@surkov> ok
- # [16:57] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Moreover, the doclad ne is reprducible at least n my machine. Three times in a rw.
- # [16:58] <@MarcoZ> surkov: dclad ne.
- # [16:58] <@surkov> ok
- # [16:58] <@surkov> so makes sense to disable them on mac
- # [16:58] <@MarcoZ> surkov: doc load one.
- # [16:59] <@firebot> mak77@bonardo.net changed the Status on bug 739191 from ASSIGNED to RESOLVED.
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- # [16:59] <@firebot> mak77@bonardo.net set the Resolution field on bug 739191 to FIXED.
- # [16:59] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739191 nor, --, mozilla14, xph9753, RESO FIXED, get rid nsAccUtils::GetDocAccessibleFor(const nsIPresShell* aPresShell)
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- # [17:25] <@MarcoZ> surkov: OK, it actually hangs at the contextmenu test and times out with a terminal ending when it waits for the context menu to appear to do the "escape key" test. This is when it finally dies. But it has another timeout in the events/test_autocomplete.xul test and one in the test_focus_browserui.xul files.
- # [17:26] <@surkov> there's a bunch of them :)
- # [17:26] <@MarcoZ> surkov: In addition, there are some test failures in the bounds/test_zoom.html file, where the height of a paragraph and the relevant y coordinate are not reported correctly. One is the rounded, the other is the unrounded value (decimal digits). I'll file bugs and post the relevant portions of the log files.
- # [17:27] <@surkov> yes, please
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- # [17:34] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746160 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [17:34] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746160 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [Meta] Various new Mac a11y Mochitest failures
- # [17:40] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746164 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [17:40] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746164 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Failure for the shortcut keys in actions/test_keys.html b/accessible/tests/mochitest/actions/test_ke
- # [17:44] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615727 on bug 746164.
- # [17:44] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com changed the Status on bug 746164 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
- # [17:47] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746168 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [17:47] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746168 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Wrong font referenced in attributes/test_text.html for the cursive test
- # [17:47] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615727 on bug 746164.
- # [17:48] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 615729 on bug 746168.
- # [17:48] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com changed the Status on bug 746168 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
- # [17:53] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 615729 on bug 746168.
- # [17:53] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746176 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [17:53] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746176 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Various height and y coordinate failures in bounds/test_zoom.html
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- # [17:57] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746177 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [17:57] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746177 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Test timeout in events/test_autocomplete.xul when testing the Yahoo! search field.
- # [18:00] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746178 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [18:00] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746178 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, test timeout in events/test_focus_browserui.xul
- # [18:01] <@firebot> joe@drew.ca changed the Component on bug 745514 from General to Disability Access APIs.
- # [18:01] <@firebot> joe@drew.ca changed the Product on bug 745514 from Firefox to Core.
- # [18:01] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745514 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, viewing large png image in firefox crashes Xserver
- # [18:02] <@firebot> joe@drew.ca changed the Component on bug 745514 from Disability Access APIs to Widget: Gtk.
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- # [18:05] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 746183 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [18:05] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746183 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Unexpected termination of complete test run in events/test_focus_contextmenu.xul
- # [18:08] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Done for now.
- # [18:08] <@surkov> MarcoZ: ok, cool
- # [18:08] <@surkov> nice work
- # [18:08] <@MarcoZ> surkov: and I'd like to hand the last three to you since I have no means to debug those.
- # [18:09] <@surkov> ok
- # [18:09] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Thanks!
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- # [18:14] <Bryen> Whoo hoo! I'm in da channel!
- # [18:18] <@hub> Bryen: yes you are. for all your firefox a11y woes :-)
- # [18:19] <Bryen> hehe thanks hub :-)
- # [18:19] <Bryen> so let me repeat the question I asked hub a while ago and see if anyone can give some insight before I know how to file the bug properly...
- # [18:20] <Bryen> I use FF by changing background to black and font to white. The problem is when I do that, many sites do not display images.
- # [18:20] <Bryen> I have a sample here at http://bryen.com/susestudio/ which shows buttons only visible when I revert to allow site to display its own colors
- # [18:21] <Bryen> As a low-vision user extremely sensitive to white glare, this makes many sites unusable.
- # [18:22] <Bryen> and I'm hesitant to blame davidb for all my woes
- # [18:22] <Bryen> (thought that was a good way to grab his attention hehe)
- # [18:24] <@hub> Bryen: if blaming davidb does not work, you can blame Canada :-)
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- # [18:25] <Bryen> do I have to learn the Canadian national anthem first before I do that?
- # [18:25] <@hub> Bryen: no
- # [18:25] <Bryen> whew
- # [18:26] <@hub> we are nice people
- # [18:27] <Bryen> Sure, we just forget Canada exists, down here in the US :-)
- # [18:27] <@hub> and apologize in advance for the treatment you might endure at our borders. they just try to emulate the south :-)
- # [18:28] <Bryen> well we have a legitimate concern that you guys might force our bacon to become Canadian bacon
- # [18:32] <Bryen> hub, As near as I can tell, without having html expertise, images that don't appear are actually some form of html image rather than a .png image or something like that.
- # [18:32] <Bryen> Although I've encountered standard graphic images that won't show up either out there.
- # [18:32] <@hub> Bryen: but not being able to see the source HTML makes it hard to diagnose
- # [18:33] <Bryen> ok let me find an page that doesn't require a log in hang on...
- # [18:36] <Bryen> hub, http://www.opensuse.org/en/ is an example. Do you want screenshots to accompany this?
- # [18:36] <@hub> it is done in ccs
- # [18:36] <@hub> css
- # [18:37] <Bryen> so is it a bad implementation of CSS or FF?
- # [18:38] <@hub> not saying that
- # [18:38] <@hub> how do you change the colors?
- # [18:38] <Bryen> Preferences > Content > Colors
- # [18:39] <Bryen> within that pop-up window, there's an option to allow pages to choose their own colors. I have to check this box several times a day. And then squint like hell :-)
- # [18:41] <@hub> ew
- # [18:41] * Quits: nhirata (nhirata.bu@moz-C03D0C61.vlan426.asr1.sfo1.gblx.net) (Quit: nhirata)
- # [18:41] <Bryen> ew on so many levels :-)
- # [18:42] <@hub> shouldn't you OS invert colors for you?
- # [18:42] <@hub> </troll>
- # [18:43] <@hub> but yeah if I swap the colors it fails to display images
- # [18:43] <@hub> I'm sure this is a bug in the CSS
- # [18:43] <Bryen> hub, Well I do have high-contrast inversion on my desktop but that doesn't apply within an application like FF
- # [18:44] <@hub> bummer. I wonder if it is a bug here or deliberate
- # [18:44] <Bryen> problem is, now as you point out its a CSS thing, what am I supposed to do? File a bug to every website around the world that has this problem? (lots have it)
- # [18:44] <@hub> davidb or surkov should know more
- # [18:44] <Bryen> ok
- # [18:44] <@hub> file a bug to us then
- # [18:45] * Bryen prepares for his first ever Mozilla bug filing...
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- # [18:51] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 746164 from --- to mozilla14.
- # [18:51] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746164 nor, --, mozilla14, marco.zehe, ASSI, Failure for the shortcut keys in actions/test_keys.html b/accessible/tests/mochitest/actions/test_ke
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- # [18:53] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 746168 from --- to mozilla14.
- # [18:53] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746168 nor, --, mozilla14, marco.zehe, ASSI, Wrong font referenced in attributes/test_text.html for the cursive test
- # [18:56] * Quits: richardschwerdtfeger (richardsch@moz-773B11CB.telbonet.an) (Quit: richardschwerdtfeger)
- # [18:57] <@MarcoZ> OK, more to come tomorrow. I'll disable the ones that are currently causing timeouts etc. locally and then continue to find ones that fail that I can fix. :) And I'll be happy to do reviews for surkov and others for those tests. :)
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- # [18:57] <@MarcoZ> See you all tomorrow!
- # [18:58] <@MarcoZ> Hub: Before I leave: I filed bug 746160 and dependent ones for current test failures I see in our mochitests. Two I've fixed, the others I've asked Surkov to takea look since I have no idea what might be going on, and I can't debug this with a screen reader.
- # [18:58] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746160 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [Meta] Various new Mac a11y Mochitest failures
- # [18:58] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org changed the Target Milestone on bug 745982 from --- to mozilla14.
- # [18:58] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745982 nor, --, mozilla14, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Move BORDER_PADDING to VisualPresenter
- # [18:58] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org changed the Target Milestone on bug 745981 from --- to mozilla14.
- # [18:58] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745981 nor, --, mozilla14, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Switching to a tab without a set virtual cursor raises an error
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- # [19:06] * tbsaunde|afk is now known as tbsaunde
- # [19:06] <clown> Bryen, hub: possilble explanation for your problem — the images on the page are background images. When you force the background to black and override the page styles, then you are effectively erasing the images.
- # [19:07] * Quits: jhk (jiggy@8E6C34C1.A3F9767A.1C37C358.IP) (Connection reset by peer)
- # [19:08] <Bryen> clown, That's the interpretation I had in my mind as well.
- # [19:08] <Bryen> question is, how do we solve that? How doe we get FF to say "Ok he meant the overall background, not every image background."
- # [19:09] <clown> Bryen: right. if that's the case, then technically it's not a browser bug, but authoring bug.
- # [19:09] <Bryen> clown, and that sounds like I have to poke all the websites in the world that have this issue
- # [19:09] <Bryen> assuming I know an image is erased, that is. :-)
- # [19:09] <clown> well, I suppose you could have setting that means, "the background should be black generally, but not where there are background images."
- # [19:10] <Bryen> clown, I'm about to click to file the bug on mozilla. Can you make these comments there?
- # [19:10] <clown> sure can, Bryen'
- # [19:10] <Bryen> as I know a number of people who use these settings, and I am certain this annoys more than just me, the issue has to be rather serious
- # [19:11] <@firebot> New Firefox - Disability Access bug 746205 filed by a11yrocks@bryen.com.
- # [19:11] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746205 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, CSS issues render color selection in FF useless
- # [19:11] <Bryen> whoo hoo! I love it when bots do that!
- # [19:19] <@hub> clown: yes they are background images. I checked.
- # [19:21] <Bryen> Do background images get a unique distinction from "standard" backgrounds?
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- # [19:25] <@hub> Bryen: they are part of the CSS. how I see it is that you override the background property but setting custom colors
- # [19:25] <@hub> this include the images
- # [19:25] * @davidb is occupied but URL drops http://dojotoolkit.org/community/a11yHighContrastMode
- # [19:25] <@davidb> "With high contrast mode turned on, all background colors are mapped to the high contrast background color and all foreground colors are mapped to the high contrast scheme foreground color. This includes all colors specified via CSS stylesheets, directly via the style attribute or inherited. In addition, all background images specified via CSS are turned off."
- # [19:25] <clown> yes, davidb, this is releated to high contrast mode, but not quite the same.
- # [19:25] <@davidb> so there might be some bogus detection in js out there
- # [19:26] <@davidb> clown: ok
- # [19:26] * @davidb scurries off
- # [19:27] <@hub> ok, gotta run to the office. see you in a bit
- # [19:28] * Quits: @hub (hub@moz-E2FCA694.figuiere.net) (Ping timeout)
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- # [19:31] * clown didn't mean to scare davidb away.
- # [19:35] <Bryen> clown, ahh... davidb can be a scaredy-cat sometimes :-)
- # [19:36] <Bryen> but since he helped me impress my gf by getting her a Mozilla shirt, I can't complain about him :-)
- # [19:37] <clown> he got her one too??? and here I thought I was special… *sigh*
- # [19:39] <Bryen> no no no...
- # [19:39] <Bryen> he gave it to me to give to her. I didn't want her falling for him
- # [19:41] <clown> :-)
- # [19:48] * Joins: hub (hub@21B7B9F2.B87E9213.6E712CE2.IP)
- # [19:48] * ChanServ sets mode: +o hub
- # [19:52] * ehsan is now known as ehsan|extremely-busy
- # [20:19] * Quits: Mark_Capella (chatzilla@moz-DD0C7E4F.twcny.res.rr.com) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 13.0a2/20120405042010])
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- # [20:27] <Mark_Capella> tbsaunde: got your ears on?
- # [20:27] <Mark_Capella> davidb: or you?
- # [20:28] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: yep
- # [20:29] <Mark_Capella> im looking at this memory reporter bug tbsaunde pointed me to ... what does it mean you must have "accessibility enabled"
- # [20:29] <@davidb> Mark_Capella: probably 'instantiated"
- # [20:29] <@davidb> since our whole engine is lazily instantiated
- # [20:29] <@davidb> fires up when an API call happens
- # [20:30] <Mark_Capella> external access via a toolit or screen reader or such?
- # [20:30] <Mark_Capella> DOMinspector would do it?
- # [20:33] <Mark_Capella> yah that seems to do it
- # [20:33] <@davidb> yes. yes.
- # [20:33] <Mark_Capella> my little about:memory addon blew out the about:memory page
- # [20:33] <Mark_Capella> :)
- # [20:34] <@davidb> haha!
- # [20:34] <Mark_Capella> hey its better than being ignored!
- # [20:34] <@davidb> progress
- # [20:34] <Mark_Capella> successfully failed "P
- # [20:38] <Mark_Capella> coffee break ... mull it over
- # [20:45] <Mic|web> Hi! Does anyone know how to view the "label" property of a richlistitem with DOMi? I created one as textual representation of the item and want to check the result.
- # [20:45] <Mic|web> Too bad I can't figure out how to do that with DOMi :(
- # [20:57] * Quits: Mic|web (Mibbit@moz-5D79243.bibliothek.uni-wuerzburg.de) (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
- # [21:10] * Quits: fxa90id (fxa90id@moz-55B4421D.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) (Connection reset by peer)
- # [21:50] <@firebot> hub@mozilla.com requested approval-mozilla-central from the wind for attachment 615491 on bug 712924.
- # [21:50] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712924 nor, P2, mozilla14, hub, NEW, [Mac] li elements inside an ul element are announced as "list box"
- # [21:52] * Quits: drexler (chatzilla@moz-6F22CAC7.e7jvsoe-gw.cust.sover.net) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.0.17/2009122204])
- # [22:03] <@hub> Bryen: expecting something from ubuntu to go upstream.... I think that's a dream
- # [22:07] * Quits: nhirata (nhirata.bu@moz-C03D0C61.vlan426.asr1.sfo1.gblx.net) (Quit: nhirata)
- # [22:08] <satdav> hub, wonder if you know ken_s what time normally is he on
- # [22:08] * Parts: satdav (satdav@moz-1ECB932B.cable.virginmedia.com) (Leaving)
- # [22:08] * Joins: nhirata (nhirata.bu@moz-C03D0C61.vlan426.asr1.sfo1.gblx.net)
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- # [22:09] <@hub> satdav: I don't even know him
- # [22:11] <Mark_Capella> !seen ken_s
- # [22:11] <@firebot> ken_s was last seen 3 weeks, 5 days, 2 hours, 18 minutes and 21 seconds ago, saying 'thanks' in #mozillians.
- # [22:11] * Bryen thinks clown is a pretty cool dude
- # [22:13] <@hub> Bryen: we have fantastic community members :-)
- # [22:13] * clown ah shucks
- # [22:13] <@davidb> firebot: clown?
- # [22:13] <@firebot> davidb: I have heard that clown is a GNOME Shell Magnifier developer, and WAI-ARIA gadfly.
- # [22:13] <Bryen> hub, and then I had to come along and stink up the place? :-)
- # [22:13] <@davidb> firebot: Bryen?
- # [22:13] <@firebot> davidb: Sorry, I've no idea what 'Bryen' might be.
- # [22:14] <@davidb> psh!
- # [22:14] <clown> now there's a straight line...
- # [22:14] <Bryen> LOL
- # [22:14] <@davidb> firebot: Bryen is a clown fanboi
- # [22:14] <@firebot> davidb: ok
- # [22:14] <@davidb> firebot: Bryen?
- # [22:14] <@firebot> davidb: Bryen is a clown fanboi
- # [22:14] <Bryen> I thought I was Firebot's worst nightmare?
- # [22:14] <@davidb> me work here is done
- # [22:14] <@davidb> firebot: hub?
- # [22:14] <@firebot> davidb: hub is a Mozilla platform hacker and his bugmail resolves on ":hub"
- # [22:14] <clown> firebot: Bryen is Firebot's worst nightmare.
- # [22:14] <@firebot> clown: But Bryen is 'a clown fanboi'...
- # [22:15] <clown> don't be so stubborn.
- # [22:15] <@davidb> clown: you have to so firebot: no, ...
- # [22:15] <@davidb> so/say
- # [22:15] <@davidb> kaiser so/say
- # [22:15] <Bryen> LOL
- # [22:15] <clown> huh?
- # [22:15] <clown> firebot: the usual suspects?
- # [22:15] <@davidb> firebot: no, Bryen is fireboat's worst nightmare
- # [22:15] <@davidb> sigh
- # [22:15] <@firebot> davidb: ok
- # [22:15] <@firebot> clown: Sorry, I've no idea what 'the usual suspects' might be.
- # [22:16] <@davidb> firebot: no, Bryen is firebot's worst nightmare
- # [22:16] <@firebot> davidb: ok
- # [22:16] <Bryen> firebot, davidb
- # [22:16] <@firebot> Bryen: Was it not... er, someone, who said: davidb is a frood who knows where his towel is AND exposes gecko to everyone (bolterbugz@gmail.com)
- # [22:16] <clown> it's one of davidb's favourite movies, firebot
- # [22:16] <@davidb> firebot: no, davidb is a vogon and his bug mail resolves on ":davidb"
- # [22:16] <@firebot> davidb: ok
- # [22:17] <@hub> davidb: as long as you don't read poetry, we are good
- # [22:17] <@hub> :-)
- # [22:17] <@davidb> :)
- # [22:17] <@hub> I'll grab my towel
- # [22:17] * clown will leave room before davidb starts reciting
- # [22:17] * @davidb needs a perfect tea
- # [22:17] <Bryen> guys, while we're all joking around, I assume you are all still on the gnome-a11y mailing list? If so, did you see my a11y @ OLF thread this week?
- # [22:17] <@davidb> hmm
- # [22:17] <@hub> I saw the thread, yeah
- # [22:18] <Bryen> Would Mozilla be interested in this?
- # [22:18] <clown> yup, seen it Bryen, but haven't had time to read it yet.
- # [22:18] <@hub> not using the infinite improbably drive to go there
- # [22:18] <@hub> Bryen: I'm very much too far
- # [22:18] <clown> hub, use bistro math.
- # [22:19] <Bryen> hub, well someday we could organize a similar thing on the west coast. I don't want to create something where everyone has to fly all over either.
- # [22:19] <Bryen> Next year's LFNW for example
- # [22:20] <@davidb> Bryen: what is the subject line of the email?
- # [22:20] <@hub> Bryen: if it was in Seattle it would be too far. Also I'm not gonna stay in Vancouver much longer anyway.
- # [22:20] <Bryen> davidb, a11y @ olf
- # [22:20] <@hub> Bryen: even Point Roberts is too far
- # [22:20] <Bryen> hub, What?? I kinda will miss your vancouver tweet rants :-)
- # [22:20] * @davidb doesn't have it
- # [22:20] <Bryen> where the heck is Point Roberts?
- # [22:20] <@davidb> i think i'm only on dev-a11y-gnome
- # [22:21] <Bryen> davidb, that's a problem then :-) let me get you the web link... hang on
- # [22:21] <@davidb> ty
- # [22:21] <@hub> Bryen: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-accessibility-list/2012-April/msg00011.html
- # [22:21] <@davidb> firebot: accessibility?
- # [22:21] <@firebot> davidb: I seem to recall that accessibility is not optional.
- # [22:21] <@hub> davidb: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-accessibility-list/2012-April/msg00011.html
- # [22:21] <@hub> Bryen: and FWIW, by September I hope to be settled in Montreal
- # [22:22] <@hub> still too far
- # [22:22] <@davidb> yeah not sure this event is doable for me
- # [22:22] <@hub> Bryen: *hint* if CBP represent the Americans, then your country is hostile to visitors.
- # [22:23] <Bryen> hub, CBP?
- # [22:23] <@hub> Customer and Border Patrol
- # [22:23] <@hub> Customs
- # [22:23] <@hub> gah
- # [22:23] <@hub> can't type
- # [22:23] <@hub> http://cbp.gov/
- # [22:23] <@hub> s/Patrol/Protection
- # [22:23] <Bryen> oh
- # [22:24] <@hub> Bryen: here in Canada we fingerprint and mughsot people only when arrested
- # [22:24] <Bryen> all of sudden lately I'm hearing canadians complaining about difficulty entering US. When did we start worrying about Canadians?
- # [22:24] <@hub> Bryen: I have a EU passport, still
- # [22:24] <@hub> Canadians are just the exception
- # [22:24] <@hub> but even for them it is a PITA
- # [22:24] <@hub> (and I don't know how long it will last)
- # [22:24] <Bryen> hub, But you've already entered the US so still an issue?
- # [22:25] <@hub> Bryen: each and everytime
- # [22:25] <@hub> Bryen: and even
- # [22:25] * Bryen admits he has no idea what its like to enter US as a non-citizen.
- # [22:25] <@hub> Bryen: yeah because Europe doesn't reciprocate
- # [22:25] <Bryen> All I know is that TSA is an asshole to DB folks when we come home
- # [22:25] <clown> hub, body scan when going thru airport security (when flying into the US)?
- # [22:26] <@hub> clown: no I always avoid that one way or the other
- # [22:26] <@hub> clown: and that
- # [22:26] <clown> how (for future reference)?
- # [22:26] <@hub> and that's not CBP
- # [22:26] <Bryen> Actually less than 5% of those scanners are in use, and I've never been scanned. TSA would be disappointed to see what I really look like anyway
- # [22:26] <@hub> clown: 1. luck 2. OPT OUT
- # [22:26] <clown> ah, frisking instead (?)
- # [22:26] <@hub> clown: TSA is cheaper than getting a hooker
- # [22:26] <@hub> :-)
- # [22:26] <clown> ewww...
- # [22:26] <@hub> clown: yeah but this only happened at YVR
- # [22:27] <@hub> so it is not like TSA
- # [22:27] <clown> which one is YVR?
- # [22:27] <@hub> Vancouver
- # [22:27] <@hub> Canadeh
- # [22:27] <clown> oh, right (shoulda figured that out).
- # [22:27] <@hub> if it start with a Y it is Canada
- # [22:27] <@davidb> i've always opted out
- # [22:27] <Bryen> as in "Oh Y Canada? Y Canadaaaaa!"?
- # [22:27] <clown> that i know, but should have figure out "VR" meant VancoveR
- # [22:28] <clown> "VancouveR"
- # [22:28] <@hub> also I have to apologize for Canadaa CBSA, they want to copy CBP in rudeness
- # [22:28] <clown> hub likes to talk in initials..
- # [22:28] <@hub> clown: YUL is Montreal, YYZ is Toronto. Logic?
- # [22:28] <@hub> clown: YOW is OttaWa
- # [22:28] <clown> cowabunga!
- # [22:29] <clown> and YTZ is Toronto island.
- # [22:29] <@hub> something like that
- # [22:29] <Bryen> Once I landed in US from EU to change planes and TSA refused to help guide me around, even when they could see my white cane. Just kept pointing and barking directions
- # [22:29] <clown> perhaps they were guide dogs?
- # [22:29] <Bryen> And when I told them I can't hear either, they said "well we can't help you"... and I struggled for like 45 minutes to finally find the line to enter US
- # [22:29] <@hub> Bryen: TSA are not here to service you
- # [22:29] <Bryen> and missed my frickin transfer flight.
- # [22:30] <Bryen> hub, Actually they are supposed to assist people with disabilities. And they do at all airports except during the immigaration checkin gates.
- # [22:30] <@hub> Bryen: I know they are supposed to
- # [22:30] <@hub> Bryen: but it is TSA they hire the most honest and competent people
- # [22:31] <@hub> [SARCASM] <- sarcasm billboard
- # [22:31] <Bryen> hub, What I should have done is "accidentally" wander into a restricted zone, set off alarms, shut down the airport and then publicly point to the fact that they refused to help this poor DeafBlind guy find his way around. :-)
- # [22:31] <@hub> Bryen: yeah would have been funny
- # [22:32] <@davidb> hub: next time heed this http://prutser.wordpress.com/2009/04/01/what-to-do-when-you-meet-a-sighted-person/
- # [22:32] <Bryen> err... this conversation here isn't being logged, is it? :-)
- # [22:32] <@davidb> errr not hub
- # [22:32] <@davidb> Bryen: ^
- # [22:32] <@davidb> it is being logged actually
- # [22:32] <Bryen> yikes :-)
- # [22:32] <@davidb> anyways Bryen http://prutser.wordpress.com/2009/04/01/what-to-do-when-you-meet-a-sighted-person/
- # [22:32] * Bryen reads
- # [22:32] <clown> firebot: SARCASM?
- # [22:32] <@firebot> clown: Oh, I know this one! SARCASM is derision, mockery, ridicule
- # [22:33] <Bryen> LOL great article
- # [22:33] <Bryen> davidb, Yesterday, I was at Walgreen's and asked at the checkout counter for a lighter. He asked (while clearly seeing my white cane) What color do you prefer?
- # [22:34] <Bryen> firebot, firebot?
- # [22:34] <@firebot> Bryen: hmm... I think firebot is at least 1.1x as good as sumobot
- # [22:34] <clown> firebot: sumobot?
- # [22:34] <@firebot> clown: Sumobot is the bot for sumo, obviously!
- # [22:34] <@davidb> Bryen: I won't tell you what happened when I went to buy caulk.
- # [22:34] <clown> riiight..
- # [22:35] * Bryen wonders if davidb uses caulk for good or evil
- # [22:35] * clown wonders if davidb uses caulk to patch FF
- # [22:35] <@davidb> it is far more dirty. nevermind.
- # [22:35] <@davidb> over beers maybe.
- # [22:36] <Bryen> over beers yes, with my hearing aid also shut off so I don't hear this gastardly story
- # [22:36] <@hub> davidb: I read that a while ago
- # [22:36] <@davidb> yeah i think i tweeted it
- # [22:37] * Quits: aaronlev (aaronlev@moz-654DF715.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) (Quit: aaronlev)
- # [22:37] <@hub> Bryen: at CSUN I was walking Marco's dog. This was hilarious.
- # [22:37] <@hub> Bryen: I still had my sunglasses on
- # [22:37] <@davidb> lol
- # [22:37] * Joins: bram (bram@F6439486.99C6B0B8.3C8B9613.IP)
- # [22:38] <@hub> and to make things even funnier I had my camera on the side
- # [22:39] <Bryen> hub, and half the people didn't see you :-)
- # [22:39] <@hub> (it was not deliberate, I was just helping Marco)
- # [22:40] <@hub> Bryen: outside of the hotel
- # [22:40] <@hub> dog needed to do business
- # [22:40] * clown wants to see the vidoe.
- # [22:40] <Bryen> CSUN can be a dangerous place. I once got run over by a motorized wheel chair, and occasionally at CSUN, you hear a poor dog yelping from getting run over as well.
- # [22:40] <@hub> clown: I wish there was one
- # [22:40] <Bryen> They need traffic cops in those aisles in the exhibit hall.
- # [22:40] <@davidb> i need to relocate about 8 kms
- # [22:40] <@davidb> ciao
- # [22:40] * Quits: @davidb (davidb@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP) (Quit: davidb)
- # [22:41] <Bryen> hub, Last week I went into a restaurant, sat down, and waiter came over and profusely apologized for not having a braille menu
- # [22:42] <Bryen> So I asked him if he wanted me to read the menu out loud to him... He seemed unable to respond :-)
- # [22:43] <satdav> hey guys bram is doing the website for sumo he is making sure everyone can make it stand out better
- # [22:46] <@hub> Bryen: with Eitan we were walking back to the hotel with Jennisson, through the entertainment district in Toronto. I can tell you it was epic with cane
- # [22:47] * Bryen thinks sumo wrestlers don't need help standing out
- # [22:47] <@hub> Bryen: "I'm sure he can see", etc.
- # [22:47] <@hub> satdav, bram: awesome. let us know if you need anything
- # [22:48] <Bryen> hub, you will be amazed, especially young people, who totally act unaware of your presence. I've had people run and in front of me and send my cane flying around.
- # [22:48] <bram> satdav hub: sure thing! and let me know how SUMO can be helped in terms of readability (it is my main focus)
- # [22:48] <bram> satdav: and thanks for the introduction :)
- # [22:48] <Bryen> once my mother borrowed a wheelchair at a store because she had knee problems and was sruprised to see how many young people ignored the fact that there was a wheelchair there and kept cutitng her off
- # [22:49] <@hub> Bryen: I have seen it
- # [22:49] <Bryen> attitude is the biggest barrier to accessibility, not technology
- # [22:50] <satdav> hub, I am doing the qa website the now puting some bugs in about how to make it easier to read a bit more
- # [22:50] <Bryen> When the Americans with Disabilities Act was passed, a business owner complained to me about the costs of redoing his business to be accessible, including making wider doors.
- # [22:51] <Bryen> I told him, wheelchairs have been around as far back as the 1400's. Why is it our fault your architects didn't make the doors wider in the first place?
- # [22:51] <@hub> Bryen: I have had cyclist on the sidewalk telling me the curb cut was design to them to do so....
- # [22:52] <@hub> s/to them/for them/
- # [22:52] <Bryen> :-)
- # [22:52] <satdav> hub filling out a bug the now for the plugin page
- # [22:53] <@tbsaunde> Mark_Capella: do you still want something from me?
- # [22:53] <@hub> our temporary office here isn't accessible
- # [22:54] <@hub> there are stairs and no ramp / elevator
- # [22:54] <Bryen> old building?
- # [22:54] <@hub> yeah
- # [22:55] <Bryen> Even under ADA, there are loopholes that allow certain buildings to get away with no elevators.
- # [22:55] <Bryen> But I love the ruling recently by a US District Court that indeed "Vicarious Liability" does exist for companies.
- # [22:56] <@hub> fortunately the "new" office has one
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- # [23:42] <@hub> tbsaunde: the approval is because they closed the tree for Fennec Native (Android version) as to not break before the uplift.
- # [23:43] <@tbsaunde> hub: I know what its for
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- # Session Close: Wed Apr 18 00:00:01 2012
The end :)