/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2012-06-11 / end
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- # Session Start: Mon Jun 11 00:00:00 2012
- # Session Ident: #accessibility
- # [00:27] * Joins: ehsan (ehsan@BEDFFF26.EE049E25.8B035CD7.IP)
- # [01:05] <capella> dang ... builds are busted (bug 763212) ... m-c backing out changes etc ... time to let it go till the dust settles
- # [01:05] <firewolfbot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=763212 blo, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Build fails with "/bin/sh: line 0: fg: no job control" - related to "%pythonpath" ?
- # [01:37] <firewolfbot> ryanvm@gmail.com changed the Status on bug 761188 from ASSIGNED to RESOLVED.
- # [01:38] <firewolfbot> ryanvm@gmail.com set the Resolution field on bug 761188 to FIXED.
- # [01:38] <firewolfbot> ryanvm@gmail.com denied in-testsuite on bug 761188.
- # [01:38] <firewolfbot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=761188 nor, --, mozilla16, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, reuse layout code for accessible boundaries calculation
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- # [02:41] <capella> build bug fixed ... what was I hacking last?
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- # [08:17] <@MarcoZ> Morning all!
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- # [10:59] <@MarcoZ> Won a JS battle! \-O-/
- # [11:10] <capella> dang ... thats twice today i was implicated on an inbound issue that wasnt mine :P
- # [11:16] <@MarcoZ> capella: Ouch, not nice!
- # [11:17] <capella> yah i know - heart attack-city
- # [11:17] <capella> but both times it was prior patch in inbound .... right before mine
- # [11:18] <capella> marcoz: whats the JS battle you won?
- # [11:21] <@MarcoZ> capella: Referencing objects properly.
- # [11:22] <@MarcoZ> capella: Esp if an object contains stuff that looks more like an array, but mst be an object due to the data complexity.
- # [11:22] <capella> man vs. machine !!!
- # [11:22] <capella> oh - hmmmm ... sounds interesting
- # [11:55] <@MarcoZ> capella: Looks like the faulty one was just backed out, and it was not you! :)
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- # [11:56] <capella> yah was weird .... cause i saw all the orange and had already decided not me ... then ed chimed in and freaked me out
- # [11:57] <capella> ryanvm tried to get me earlier in the evening ... dodged him too :P
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- # [13:27] <@MarcoZ> capella: How good is your JS? :) Perhaps you can help me with a problem?
- # [13:28] <capella> umm .... merely fair ... but i can try
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- # [13:59] <@MarcoZ> capella: I'm working on a patch for bug 762851, and for some reason, it fails, although the smaller test case I created works fine. The patch is here: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1660468
- # [14:21] <capella> marcoz: thats a lot for me ... I'd start sprinkling alert("")'s around to hack my way through ...
- # [14:21] <capella> but thats me
- # [14:24] <@MarcoZ> capella: I believe the thing falls over somewhere during a very early stage, since not even the functionality that was there before is working with this patch applied. Hmmmm...
- # [14:24] <@MarcoZ> OK, will have to dig further.
- # [14:24] <capella> when JS goes out entirely like that, I look for syntax errors
- # [14:25] <@MarcoZ> Me, too, but jslint doesn't show me any.
- # [14:26] <capella> gotta be something simple ... code looks nice, fwiw
- # [14:27] <@MarcoZ> Thanks!
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- # [14:27] <@MarcoZ> I'll wait until davidb is around and pester him.
- # [14:28] <capella> yah ... he's a regular 9 to 4 type of guy :D
- # [14:28] <capella> has a life outside of moco i guess
- # [14:30] <@MarcoZ> Yeah he has a family.
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- # [14:39] <tbsaunde> surkov: hi, hve a minute to tell me what you think about how platform objects should be septup with uia, or should I mail you?
- # [14:40] <@surkov> tbsaunde: hi, perhaps some of wrap classes will override QueryService
- # [14:40] <@surkov> but usually they get all things by requesting pattern interface which is not required to be accessible object
- # [14:41] <tbsaunde> surkov: sure, but willl ia2 / msaa eventually share a platform object with uia, or should they stay seperate?
- # [14:41] <@surkov> in that means I thought to keep uia separately
- # [14:42] <tbsaunde> surkov: ok
- # [14:42] <@surkov> basically rawelmprovider and IAccessible can be on the same object
- # [14:42] <tbsaunde> surkov: what about each uia pattern impl? will they each have there own tearoff then?
- # [14:42] <@surkov> but nothing requires that
- # [14:43] <@surkov> we could but I'm not sure at this point
- # [14:43] <tbsaunde> ok
- # [14:43] <tbsaunde> surkov: finally, any reason you don't want to cache the uia provider in the wrap?
- # [14:44] <@surkov> no real reason, just I went with pure tearoff
- # [14:44] <tbsaunde> surkov: ok, just seems it might be nice to not have more refs to accessibles :)
- # [14:45] <tbsaunde> on the other hand it mkaes accessibles bigger
- # [14:45] * tbsaunde isn't sure how big an AccessibleWrap is on win32
- # [14:46] <@surkov> tbsaunde: we always can put tear offs into hierarchy
- # [14:46] <@surkov> it should be easy like we do for ia2
- # [14:47] <tbsaunde> surkov: not sure what you mean
- # [14:48] <tbsaunde> surkov: unless you mean make it not be a tearoff
- # [14:49] <@surkov> tbsaunde: if do tear off approach then we can convert it easily to keep-in-one-object appraoch
- # [14:49] <tbsaunde> ok, yeah
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- # [15:29] <@MarcoZ> Hi davidb!
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- # [15:31] <@davidb> hi hi hi!
- # [15:34] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Set up to build Fennec with a certain patch and see if you can get something out why it won't work?
- # [15:34] <@MarcoZ> davidb: It's patch for bug 762851.
- # [15:34] <@davidb> yep i can reboot into linux - but not for about 20 mins
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- # [15:35] <@MarcoZ> Great! :)
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- # [15:51] * @davidb has ubuntu booted
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- # [15:56] * @davidb builds fennec trunk
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- # [16:00] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Great!
- # [16:01] * @MarcoZ didn't find anything in logcat for some reason.
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- # [16:51] <@davidb> dang it - gotta rebuild
- # [16:53] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Ouch, what's wrong?
- # [16:54] <@davidb> my bad
- # [16:54] <@davidb> i forgot to switch my mozconfig on this box
- # [16:54] <@MarcoZ> Oh :)
- # [16:57] <@davidb> or rather… i forget to export MOZCONFIG= blah blah
- # [17:03] <@davidb> tbsaunde: hard to believe you are going to be here in less than 1 month
- # [17:05] <@MarcoZ> And surkov one month after!
- # [17:05] <@davidb> indeed
- # [17:07] <tbsaunde> davidb: heh
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- # [17:13] <@MarcoZ> davidb: I have a blog post at the back of my head which I am really hesitant to write, primarily because it might piss of a lot of people. It has to do with the inefficiency of keyboard usage and most accessibility architectures, esp on Windows, and why I think these are the reasons for the web still losing out against native apps on many counts for non-mouse users.
- # [17:14] <@davidb> you haven't been very timid in the past :)
- # [17:15] <@davidb> do you point fingers?
- # [17:15] <@davidb> sigh… build fail
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- # [17:16] <@MarcoZ> No, but this one really might bring a lot of people on the fences when I state that, for blind and many other keyboard ussers, the web is still an inferior platform compared to native apps. :)
- # [17:16] <@MarcoZ> For example, if I tweet from my phone or my native Twitter client on the Mac, I'm three to four keystrokes more efficient than if I use some web app as accessible as EasyChirp.
- # [17:16] <@davidb> "the truth hurts"
- # [17:17] <@davidb> i like truth
- # [17:17] <@davidb> if we need to shine a light on it, then lets do that
- # [17:18] <@MarcoZ> I'll write up something when my patch is in review and I have some more calm, and will send it to you for feedback if you'd like.
- # [17:19] <@davidb> sure
- # [17:19] <@davidb> i'm always happy to review blogs
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- # [17:36] <@davidb> hub: are you ready for the onslaught in 30 mins?
- # [17:36] <@davidb> the lions are coming
- # [17:42] <tbsaunde> davidb: ?
- # [17:55] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Lions? Interesting 1:1 pracitces! :)
- # [18:00] <@hub> davidb: what?
- # [18:01] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
- # [18:05] <@davidb> Euro 2012 :)
- # [18:06] <@hub> davidb: they play hockey?
- # [18:06] <@davidb> silly
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- # [18:08] * tbsaunde still doesn't know what davidb is talking about other than it being related to sports
- # [18:09] <@hub> tbsaunde: there is some Euro FIFA tournament going on
- # [18:09] <@hub> tbsaunde: the Stanley Cup isn't even done yet
- # [18:10] <@davidb> the game played with the foot and a ball… that we call soccer
- # [18:10] <tbsaunde> ah
- # [18:10] <@hub> because your football is played a lot with the hands
- # [18:10] <@davidb> :)
- # [18:12] <@MarcoZ> LOL
- # [18:12] <@hub> 9 AM isn't that the time for the Apple WWDC keynote?
- # [18:12] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Did the build finish, or did you give up after the failure?
- # [18:12] <@MarcoZ> hub: 10 AM.
- # [18:12] <@davidb> i tried a few things and gave up for now
- # [18:12] <@davidb> sorry
- # [18:12] * @MarcoZ will wear his Apple fan-boy hat in an hour from now and watch live tickers.
- # [18:13] <@davidb> i figured eeejay would be up soon
- # [18:13] <@hub> MarcoZ: thanks.
- # [18:13] <@hub> MarcoZ: proof that I no longer care
- # [18:13] <@davidb> wwdc… *yawn*
- # [18:13] <@hub> after drinking the kool-aid for 2 years
- # [18:13] <@hub> davidb: like GoogleIO
- # [18:13] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Yeah, will be curious to see if eeejay finds what's wrong with the patch.
- # [18:13] <@MarcoZ> Heh
- # [18:14] <@hub> today with have Gary visiting in Vancouver
- # [18:15] <@davidb> hub: nice
- # [18:15] <@davidb> hub: regarding hands… nobody can claim a worse handball against than England
- # [18:15] <@davidb> and "the hand of god"
- # [18:16] <@hub> davidb: careful. they head butt too.
- # [18:17] <@davidb> only rooney
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- # [18:18] <eeejay> MarcoZ, hi. forgot to sign into irc
- # [18:18] <eeejay> already looking at your patch
- # [18:21] <eeejay> MarcoZ, you don't import XPCOMUtils
- # [18:21] <eeejay> adb logcat is your friend
- # [18:23] <@davidb> yeah i was gonna adb logcat except form build fail
- # [18:23] <@davidb> form/for my
- # [18:24] <eeejay> i did it via a desktop build
- # [18:24] <eeejay> davidb, btw, the accessfu tester extension works on mac
- # [18:25] <@davidb> that is exciting
- # [18:25] <eeejay> davidb, just need to do it in nightly, i don't know if you were doing that earlier
- # [18:28] <eeejay> MarcoZ, your patch works nicely!
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- # [18:32] <@davidb> eeejay: i was trying to build trunk
- # [18:32] <eeejay> davidb, hum
- # [18:32] <@davidb> fennec
- # [18:35] <@davidb> man… france is looking good
- # [18:41] <@davidb> dodeedooo
- # [18:42] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: SHIT! :) Thanks for spotting that! I had that line in there once, then removed it for a reason that escapes me now.
- # [18:42] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: Feel free to r+ and land with that change, then!
- # [18:45] <eeejay> MarcoZ, I have another round of feedback
- # [18:46] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: Cool! So just also define the cu const and do the import after the EXPORTED_SYMBOLS line, right?
- # [18:46] <eeejay> MarcoZ, yep
- # [18:46] <eeejay> MarcoZ, but i have a bunch of other nits and questions
- # [18:48] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: OK! Put them in the bug I'd say, I'll deal with them.
- # [18:50] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: I'm glad you like the patch in principle and that it's working! :)
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- # [20:43] <@davidb> MarcoZ: re android i think my mozconfig was out of date
- # [20:47] <@hub> a11y is being talked about in the WWDC keynote
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- # [20:51] <@davidb> hub: ya?
- # [21:00] * clown_mtg is now known as clown
- # [21:04] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Hub: One of the first success stories of the WWDC keynote, shown in a video, was a blind guy navigating around a forest using the Ariadne GPS iPhone software. Later, it was talked about children with autism and how iOS 6 will help them more, etc.
- # [21:04] <@MarcoZ> Accessibility was indeed quite present in this WWDC keynote!
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- # [21:09] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: Thanks for the feedback! Given the choice, I think I'll move the keyMap back into the virtualCursorController and rename the QuickNavigation object to TraversalRules, and shorten the inner objects to say something like |simple|, |anchor| etc. What do you think?
- # [21:10] <eeejay> MarcoZ, perfect. Move TraversalRules back into the VirtualCursorController module as well
- # [21:10] <eeejay> MarcoZ, but as an independant object
- # [21:11] <@MarcoZ> eeejay: OK, so no extra file, then. What about gestures, should they be handled in VirtualCursorController as well? If yes, then that's no problem. If you want to have an extra module for gestures, this might get more complicated, unless you'd want to import the whole VirtualCursorController jsm.
- # [21:12] <@MarcoZ> Just thinking into the future.
- # [21:12] <eeejay> MarcoZ, good point.
- # [21:13] <eeejay> MarcoZ, gestures would utilize VirtualCursorController for sure
- # [21:13] <@MarcoZ> Anyway, this is so much good feedback that I'll be dealing with it tomorrow, it's past 9 PM here.
- # [21:13] <eeejay> MarcoZ, will they be a seperate object or extend it, we will see
- # [21:14] <eeejay> MarcoZ, thanks for your patience, this is going to be a killer feature\
- # [21:14] <eeejay> puts us in the big league :)
- # [21:14] <@MarcoZ> OK, I'll put all into the VirtualCursorController for now, and put the rules as a separate object that doesn't get exported as symbol for now.
- # [21:14] <@MarcoZ> I'm excited as hell about this, too!
- # [21:14] <eeejay> MarcoZ, right. we might export it in the future
- # [21:14] <@MarcoZ> OK guys, see you tomorrow, then!
- # [21:15] <eeejay> MarcoZ, night!
- # [21:15] * Quits: @MarcoZ (Daily@moz-352FEF2E.dip.t-dialin.net) (Quit: Excited, and good night!)
- # [21:29] * @davidb shakes his fist at 3:30pm
- # [21:29] <@davidb> 3:20 even
- # [21:29] * @davidb is just generally mad at time
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- # Session Close: Tue Jun 12 00:00:01 2012
The end :)