/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2012-11-13 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Tue Nov 13 00:00:01 2012
  2. # Session Ident: #accessibility
  3. # [00:12] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
  4. # [00:47] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org changed the Assignee on bug 810364 from nobody@mozilla.org to eitan@monotonous.org.
  5. # [00:47] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810364 nor, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Record starting touch coordinate in gesture detection
  6. # [00:47] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org changed the Assignee on bug 810359 from nobody@mozilla.org to eitan@monotonous.org.
  7. # [00:47] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810359 nor, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Introduce haptic presenter
  8. # [00:48] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org changed the Assignee on bug 810372 from nobody@mozilla.org to eitan@monotonous.org.
  9. # [00:48] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810372 nor, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Don't mutter app URLs
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  13. # [01:42] <@firebot> bugzilla@mversen.de changed the Component on bug 808538 from Untriaged to Disability Access.
  14. # [01:42] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=808538 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Why Firefox shows "server busy" prompt ?
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  25. # [02:34] <@surkov> tbsaunde: hi
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  27. # [02:45] <@tbsaunde> surkov: evening
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  35. # [05:50] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com cancelled review?(surkov.alexander@gm ail.com) for attachment 680722 on bug 801356.
  36. # [05:50] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com cancelled feedback?(trev.saunders@gma il.com) for attachment 680722 on bug 801356.
  37. # [05:50] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=801356 nor, --, ---, joey.blacksmith, NEW, LeafAccessible needs to override Append/InsertChild
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  44. # [07:38] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com requested needinfo from the wind on bug 810260.
  45. # [07:38] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810260 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, xul:deck hidden pages shouldn't be offscreen
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  63. # [10:58] <@firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com cancelled needinfo? on bug 810260.
  64. # [10:58] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810260 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, xul:deck hidden pages shouldn't be offscreen
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  80. # [14:06] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 811269 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
  81. # [14:06] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=811269 nor, --, ---, marco.zehe, NEW, [AccessFu] Improve utterances for lists and list items
  82. # [14:08] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com changed the Status on bug 811269 from NEW to ASSIGNED.
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  95. # [15:32] <@davidb> heyo
  96. # [15:33] <@davidb> marcoz: i thought we used the title when all else failed (on images)
  97. # [15:33] <@davidb> hi surkov, hub
  98. # [15:33] <@surkov> hi, davidb
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  100. # [15:38] <@hub> heyo
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  105. # [16:00] <@marcoz> davidb: Hi! Yes, on images inserted via an img tag. :) But if it's a CSS generated background image which only gets inserted via the class reference, there's no chance we can even know an image is there.
  106. # [16:00] <@davidb> aw crap
  107. # [16:01] <@hub> yep. shame
  108. # [16:01] <@marcoz> Yes, these people use CSS to insert background images as stylings for empty anchorss/links. JavaScript does the rest, the backgrund image serves as the user-visible click target.
  109. # [16:01] <@davidb> yeah
  110. # [16:01] <@davidb> i remember dojo wanted to do that
  111. # [16:08] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Resolution on bug 556622 from --- to WORKSFORME.
  112. # [16:08] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 556622 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  113. # [16:08] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=556622 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO WORKSFORME, Intermittent test_bug265203.html | Test timed out (followed by "Error: Unable to restore focus, expe
  114. # [16:24] <@marcoz> davidb: surkov: The question is: Can we reliably detect that the text within an anchor is empty? And could we fall back to using the title as the accessible name instead in that case? Right now, the title always gets converted to the accDescription, so is only spoken on request, and not included in the virtual buffer. Or maybe it's NVDA playing tricks on me again since they see the child nodes and don't notice that they're empty. It'
  115. # [16:24] <@davidb> marcoz: i wonder if nvda should fallback to the description
  116. # [16:25] <@surkov> marcoz: if anchor has empty text then @title should be used as name I think
  117. # [16:26] <@marcoz> surkov: I agree. And we *may* do it, I haven't checked with the sites I tried outside NVDA. But NVDA may still traverse into the child text nodes and try to get something and not fall back to the accName. Will ask Jamie later.
  118. # [16:27] <@davidb> surkov: what about using title as last resort generally?
  119. # [16:27] <@davidb> are there problem cases?
  120. # [16:28] <@surkov> davidb: we do this and it should be ok
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  123. # [16:30] <@marcoz> davidb: There is probably an NVDA part to this problem. Sometimes, Mick and Jamie don't use the name if they suspect there might be children inside that provide more useful info.
  124. # [16:31] <@davidb> i see
  125. # [16:33] <@surkov> marcoz: perhaps the problem can be related with explicit-name attribute which we introduced recently. Having it I suspect NVDA should behave correct (I'm not sure if they released new version working with it)
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  127. # [16:36] <satdav> marcoz, me and a couple of others had a meeting with john from ux and hes going to fix the issue with the mozilla sites
  128. # [16:39] <@marcoz> surkov: I don't think they introduced that in 2012.3. But yes, this may be helpful in the future!
  129. # [16:39] <@marcoz> Oh fun, browsing app.net's global stream causes a hang in Firefox for Android. The phone becomes totally unresponsive, may even reboot, and takes a few minutes to come back.
  130. # [16:39] <@marcoz> satdav: Cool thanks.
  131. # [16:46] <@davidb> hub: you doing the b2g/gaia call today?
  132. # [16:48] <@marcoz> Hub: I agree with you that Flash should just die. Problem with Mozilla: There's always some nerd around who will do stuff like this just because (s)he can. :)
  133. # [16:50] <satdav> most sites are getting rid of flash now
  134. # [16:53] <@hub> davidb: I can do it
  135. # [16:53] <@hub> yeah
  136. # [16:53] <@davidb> hub: just curious of your plans… (thinking about lunch)
  137. # [16:53] <@hub> marcoz: and we can't implement flash freely. too many patent restricted techs, from mp3, to the various flv codec and h264
  138. # [16:54] <@hub> marcoz: etc.
  139. # [16:54] <@hub> marcoz: it does not help the free web
  140. # [16:54] <@hub> marcoz: or accessibility
  141. # [16:56] <@davidb> are you guys talking about shumway>
  142. # [16:56] <@davidb> ?
  143. # [16:56] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 811307 filed by dbolter@mozilla.com.
  144. # [16:56] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=811307 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Add mochitest for enabling
  145. # [16:57] <@hub> davidb: yeah.
  146. # [16:57] <@hub> davidb: I said, "for the record" on twitter that I thought it was a waste of time
  147. # [16:57] <@hub> and resources
  148. # [16:57] <@davidb> it might be a stepping stone
  149. # [16:57] <@davidb> a necessary evil
  150. # [16:58] <@hub> we'd better focus on make tools to make content, including some that would allow to import to generate html5
  151. # [16:58] <@hub> but not playback
  152. # [16:58] <@hub> davidb: an impossible evil
  153. # [16:58] <@hub> davidb: we don't even support the video and audio codec in Firefox
  154. # [17:00] <@marcoz> davidb: So, where's the patch? :D
  155. # [17:00] <@davidb> marcoz: check again
  156. # [17:00] <@davidb> i decided to post what i have before i lose it again
  157. # [17:00] * @davidb shakes fist at mercurial
  158. # [17:01] <@firebot> dbolter@mozilla.com changed the Assignee on bug 811307 from nobody@mozilla.org to dbolter@mozilla.com.
  159. # [17:01] <@firebot> dbolter@mozilla.com requested review from eitan@monotonous.or g for attachment 681040 on bug 811307.
  160. # [17:01] <@firebot> dbolter@mozilla.com requested feedback from marco.zehe@google mail.com for attachment 681040 on bug 811307.
  161. # [17:02] <@hub> davidb: fist pump
  162. # [17:02] <@davidb> heh
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  164. # [17:13] * @davidb PM's bsmedberg about flash hangs
  165. # [17:13] * @davidb shakes his fist at flash
  166. # [17:17] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Resolution on bug 691005 from --- to WORKSFORME.
  167. # [17:17] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 691005 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  168. # [17:17] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691005 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO WORKSFORME, Intermittent test_docload.xul | Doubled event { event type: reorder, target: getContainer, arg: unde
  169. # [17:22] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com granted feedback for attachment 681040 on bug 811307.
  170. # [17:22] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=811307 nor, --, ---, dbolter, NEW, [AccessFu] Add mochitest for enabling
  171. # [17:26] <@hub> davidb: what do you have in mind for lunch?
  172. # [17:26] <@davidb> hub: i was thinking of that indian buffet
  173. # [17:27] <@davidb> just typing that almost made my stomach eat itself
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  175. # [17:27] <@hub> davidb: never been there
  176. # [17:28] <@davidb> it is where the grind house used to be
  177. # [17:28] <satdav> hub, you not in a different office from davidb
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  179. # [17:29] <satdav> has anyone tried server 2008 yet
  180. # [17:29] <@hub> davidb: grindhouse is gone?
  181. # [17:30] <@davidb> hub: yep
  182. # [17:31] <@davidb> I think that place was doomed by poor/inconsistent service.
  183. # [17:33] <satdav> hub, you in toronto now
  184. # [17:38] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  185. # [17:39] <satdav> going the now but will be back soon
  186. # [17:40] <@marcoz> eeejay: Hi! You around yet? I just managed to crash my whole phone by browsing http://alpha.app.net (yes I have an account there) on my Galaxy Nexus. The whole phone rebooted. On the NEXUS 7, everything went smoothly.
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  202. # [18:28] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Resolution on bug 807911 from --- to FIXED.
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  205. # [18:28] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 807911 from ASSIGNED to RESOLVED.
  206. # [18:29] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Target Milestone on bug 807911 from --- to mozilla19.
  207. # [18:29] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=807911 nor, --, mozilla19, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, whittle mutation events processing
  208. # [18:29] * Joins: satdav (satdav@moz-E4AC2781.range109-154.btcentralplus.com)
  209. # [18:32] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Resolution on bug 810372 from --- to FIXED.
  210. # [18:32] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 810372 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  211. # [18:32] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Target Milestone on bug 810372 from --- to mozilla19.
  212. # [18:32] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810372 nor, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Don't mutter app URLs
  213. # [18:32] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Resolution on bug 810359 from --- to FIXED.
  214. # [18:32] * Quits: @surkov (surkov@D08E2EFF.E35E3D12.E17943EE.IP) (Quit: surkov)
  215. # [18:32] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 810359 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  216. # [18:33] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Target Milestone on bug 810359 from --- to mozilla19.
  217. # [18:33] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810359 nor, --, mozilla19, eitan, RESO FIXED, [AccessFu] Introduce haptic presenter
  218. # [18:33] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Resolution on bug 810364 from --- to FIXED.
  219. # [18:33] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Status on bug 810364 from NEW to RESOLVED.
  220. # [18:33] <@firebot> bmo@edmorley.co.uk changed the Target Milestone on bug 810364 from --- to mozilla19.
  221. # [18:33] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=810364 nor, --, mozilla19, eitan, RESO FIXED, [AccessFu] Record starting touch coordinate in gesture detection
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  232. # [19:47] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org cancelled review?(eitan@monotonous.or g) for attachment 681006 on bug 811269.
  233. # [19:47] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=811269 nor, --, ---, marco.zehe, ASSI, [AccessFu] Improve utterances for lists and list items
  234. # [19:57] * habber-away is now known as habber
  235. # [20:01] <@firebot> dbolter@mozilla.com cancelled review?(eitan@monotonous.or g) for attachment 681040 on bug 811307.
  236. # [20:01] <@firebot> dbolter@mozilla.com requested review from eitan@monotonous.or g for attachment 681130 on bug 811307.
  237. # [20:01] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=811307 nor, --, ---, dbolter, NEW, [AccessFu] Add mochitest for enabling
  238. # [20:04] <@firebot> eitan@monotonous.org granted review for attachment 681130 on bug 811307.
  239. # [20:09] <@eeejay> \o/
  240. # [20:09] <@davidb> heh
  241. # [20:09] <@eeejay> the tyranny of the mochitest begins
  242. # [20:09] <@davidb> may the test coverage begin!
  243. # [20:09] <@davidb> snap!
  244. # [20:09] <@eeejay> i have the power to break tbpl with simple accessfu checkins
  245. # [20:10] <@hub> you have the power to fix them too :-D
  246. # [20:10] <@eeejay> davidb, oops, did you try it on a try server?
  247. # [20:10] <@davidb> eeejay: no :(
  248. # [20:10] * @eeejay doesn't understand how mochitests work on non ff desktop products
  249. # [20:11] <@davidb> eeejay: i tried it on debug only
  250. # [20:11] <@davidb> i hit known oranges
  251. # [20:11] * @eeejay hopes it doesn't break tests in android and b2g
  252. # [20:11] <@davidb> eeejay: any idea how it could?
  253. # [20:12] <@eeejay> davidb, i don't have enough knowledge of how mochitests work in those products
  254. # [20:12] <@davidb> i did do a try
  255. # [20:12] <@davidb> trying to find it now
  256. # [20:12] <@eeejay> davidb, you cant get the top level from e10s
  257. # [20:12] <@hub> who is the mochitest "owner"
  258. # [20:12] <@davidb> hub: for all mochitests?
  259. # [20:12] <@eeejay> davidb, so if the mochitest in b2g is in a content process, it would break
  260. # [20:13] <@davidb> hmmm
  261. # [20:13] <@hub> davidb: for the system
  262. # [20:14] <@davidb> eeejay: i don't think b2g runs mochitest-o
  263. # [20:14] <@davidb> see https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=5cf2290cbad3
  264. # [20:14] <@davidb> hub: not sure… most roads lead to ted
  265. # [20:14] <@hub> b2g runs marionette
  266. # [20:15] <@eeejay> no mochitests at all? phew
  267. # [20:15] <@hub> and some mochitest
  268. # [20:15] <@hub> 2 and 3
  269. # [20:16] <@eeejay> well, i would like to see it run successfully in b2g
  270. # [20:16] <@davidb> yeah
  271. # [20:16] * @eeejay hardly does desktop builds anymore
  272. # [20:17] <@davidb> we may need to sniff in the test
  273. # [20:20] <@davidb> eeejay: i can do that probably thursday
  274. # [20:20] <@davidb> if not todayish
  275. # [20:20] <@davidb> not sure if tricky
  276. # [20:21] <@eeejay> davidb, no worries. you didn't break inbound?
  277. # [20:21] <@davidb> eeejay: hasn't run through yet
  278. # [20:21] <@eeejay> davidb, cool
  279. # [20:24] <@davidb> hahah
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  293. # [21:30] <@davidb> eeejay: i think i need to turn accessfu off at the end of the test...
  294. # [21:31] <@davidb> that might explain the frequency of the orange fails
  295. # [21:31] <@davidb> which is interesting in itself
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  298. # [21:44] <@eeejay> davidb, oops
  299. # [21:44] <@davidb> yeah
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  319. # Session Close: Wed Nov 14 00:00:00 2012

The end :)