/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2013-03-25 / end
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- # Session Start: Mon Mar 25 00:00:00 2013
- # Session Ident: #accessibility
- # [00:11] <@firebot> matspal@gmail.com granted review for attachment 728765 on bug 809871.
- # [00:11] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=809871 nor, --, ---, nobody, ASSI, XUL tree accessible creation may flush layout
- # [00:19] <@firebot> matspal@gmail.com granted review for attachment 728766 on bug 809871.
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- # [01:28] <@firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com requested review from surkov.alexander@gm ail.com for attachment 728800 on bug 809871.
- # [01:28] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=809871 nor, --, ---, nobody, ASSI, XUL tree accessible creation may flush layout
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- # [04:57] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com cancelled needinfo?(surkov.alexander@ gmail.com) on bug 847233.
- # [04:57] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=847233 nor, --, ---, mounir, ASSI, Fix a11y with <input type='file'> changes
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- # [05:48] <@firebot> jamie@nvaccess.org cancelled needinfo?(jamie@nvaccess.or g) on bug 847233.
- # [05:48] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=847233 nor, --, ---, mounir, ASSI, Fix a11y with <input type='file'> changes
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- # [08:20] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com granted review for attachment 728800 on bug 809871.
- # [08:20] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=809871 nor, --, ---, nobody, ASSI, XUL tree accessible creation may flush layout
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- # [14:13] <@davidb> heyo
- # [14:13] <@marcoz> Hi davidb!
- # [14:21] <@davidb> hi hi
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- # [14:46] <@marcoz> Oh fun, installation of a self-built Fennec on Gingerbread seems to be borked.
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- # [15:01] <@davidb> marcoz: 1:1?
- # [15:01] <@marcoz> davidb: Yes, Sir!
- # [15:01] <@marcoz> Firing up Skype.
- # [15:02] * @davidb hunts room
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- # [15:49] <@davidb> hmmm
- # [15:50] <@davidb> trying to run tests locally on mac i get this:
- # [15:50] <@davidb> ImportError: No module named mozcrash
- # [15:50] <@davidb> hub: do you get that? ^
- # [15:50] <@davidb> maybe i need to do some mozcrash mozconfigery
- # [15:51] <@hub> davidb: I have never had that
- # [15:51] <@hub> at least not last week
- # [15:54] <@tbsaunde> davidb: try updating? a bunch of people have had that issue
- # [15:54] <@marcoz> davidb: I've had that, too.
- # [15:54] <@davidb> i updated 1 hour ago
- # [15:54] <@davidb> will try again
- # [15:55] <@marcoz> davidb: I've had it since last Wednesday.
- # [15:55] <@marcoz> or Thursday.
- # [15:55] * @tbsaunde shrugs
- # [15:55] * @davidb files
- # [15:55] <@hub> let me check
- # [15:56] * @davidb holds off
- # [15:56] <@tbsaunde> davidb: you realize this is what #developers is for right?
- # [15:56] <@davidb> tbsaunde: yeah
- # [15:59] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
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- # [16:19] <@firebot> New Core - Disability Access APIs bug 854416 filed by marco.zehe@googlemail.com.
- # [16:19] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=854416 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Navigating from awesome bar to content via the D-Pad in Gingerbread is broken (again)
- # [16:28] <@tbsaunde> vd: hey
- # [16:28] <vd> tbsaunde: hey?
- # [16:28] <@tbsaunde> vd: so, I'm looking at your new patch
- # [16:29] <vd> this time I remembered to use 8 lines of context :)
- # [16:29] <@tbsaunde> vd: actually nvm, might just be easier to comment in bug
- # [16:30] <vd> sure
- # [16:37] <@marcoz> davidb: eeejay: I really wish we had the statistics to tell us what percentage of users using accessible Firefox are still on Gingerbread.
- # [16:41] <@davidb> i don't even know if we have this bug 819516
- # [16:41] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=819516 is not accessible
- # [16:41] <@davidb> but i seem to recall checking it somehow… probably a dream
- # [16:42] <@davidb> tbsaunde: 1:1?
- # [16:43] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
- # [16:49] <@firebot> trev.saunders@gmail.com cancelled review?(trev.saunders@gmail .com) for attachment 728261 on bug 733712.
- # [16:49] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=733712 cri, --, ---, vd, ASSI, Don't call atk_object_set_name
- # [16:50] * vd looking
- # [16:50] <@tbsaunde> davidb: sure
- # [16:51] <@tbsaunde> vd: be away for a bit, but feel free to question and thanks :)
- # [16:51] <@davidb> tbsaunde: ok heading to regular spot
- # [16:51] <vd> tbsaunde: ok
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- # [17:15] <@hub> davidb: mochitest-a11y ran fine
- # [17:15] <@davidb> interesting
- # [17:15] <@hub> with this AM checkout
- # [17:15] <@davidb> oh yeah the suite
- # [17:16] <@davidb> AM?
- # [17:16] <@hub> morning
- # [17:17] <@hub> or is it different test you tried to run?
- # [17:17] <@eeejay> morn
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- # [17:37] <vd> tbsaunde: ping
- # [17:38] <@marcoz> eeejay: Morning! :)
- # [17:39] <@eeejay> marcoz, morn morn
- # [17:42] <@marcoz> eeejay: So, what's the story with the alternative patch in bug 852955? Why did you decide to go a different path than to disable the dynamic toolbar?
- # [17:42] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=852955 maj, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Trying to activate items at top of pages brings up awesome bar or menu instead
- # [17:42] <@eeejay> marcoz, they are meant to be used together
- # [17:43] <@marcoz> eeejay: Oh! Aha!
- # [17:43] <@marcoz> So even with the disabled dynamic toolbar, the offsets would still be wrong?
- # [17:47] <@firebot> joe@drew.ca changed the Resolution on bug 853340 from --- to FIXED.
- # [17:47] <@firebot> joe@drew.ca changed the Status on bug 853340 from REOPENED to RESOLVED.
- # [17:47] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=853340 nor, --, mozilla22, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, getTextAtOffset for word boundaries: beginning of a new life
- # [17:55] <@tbsaunde> vd: hi
- # [17:59] <vd> tbsaunde:
- # [17:59] <vd> > so, that creates an object that only lives for the statement which is going
- # [17:59] <vd> > to mean accessing atkObj->name after this statement is a use after free.
- # [17:59] <vd> you mean "name" instead of "atkObj->name", right?
- # [18:00] <vd> the code is: const gchar* name = NS_ConvertUTF16toUTF8(aNewNameUTF16).get();
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- # [18:05] <vd> tbsaunde: anyway, what is more important is are you sure that we do not need the call: "(klass->set_name)(aAtkObj, name);" ?
- # [18:05] <@tbsaunde> vd: yeah, I guess I just meant name
- # [18:06] <@tbsaunde> vd: and if you you do it the way I suggest with setting atkObj->name I'm sure since we don't override that vfunc which I'll grab the default impl of
- # [18:07] <vd> ok, will submit an adjusted patch shortly
- # [18:07] <@tbsaunde> static void
- # [18:07] <@tbsaunde> atk_object_real_set_name (AtkObject *object,
- # [18:07] <@tbsaunde> const gchar *name)
- # [18:07] <@tbsaunde> {
- # [18:07] <@tbsaunde> g_free (object->name);
- # [18:07] <@tbsaunde> object->name = g_strdup (name);
- # [18:08] <@tbsaunde> }
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- # [18:09] <vd> ah, I see what you mean - do the free/strdup/notify calls only
- # [18:09] <vd> originally I wanted to preserve the body of atk_object_set_name() as much as possible
- # [18:11] <@tbsaunde> vd: meh, doesn't seem terribly important
- # [18:11] <vd> btw g_free() handles a NULL pointer, but I will check that anyway and will not call g_free(NULL)
- # [18:12] <@tbsaunde> vd: I think you can just use free / strdup here without the g_
- # [18:12] <vd> hmm, the g_free() body was more involved than just calling free(3), let me look at it again...
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- # [18:13] <@tbsaunde> if your the only one allocating / deallocating
- # [18:13] <vd> am I?
- # [18:13] <vd> :)
- # [18:13] <@marcoz> davidb: Do you want to rspond to this? https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1996
- # [18:13] <@firebot> Bug 1996 enh, P4, ---, nobody, REOP, Support LONGDESC for IMG
- # [18:14] <@marcoz> And to the tweet by Laura Carlson?
- # [18:14] <@davidb> marcoz: not really
- # [18:14] <@davidb> i'm not against it though
- # [18:14] <@tbsaunde> vd: I believe so
- # [18:14] <@davidb> marcoz: i should look for the tweet i guess
- # [18:15] <vd> ok, good
- # [18:15] <@davidb> marcoz: ah she cc'ed you :)
- # [18:15] <@tbsaunde> vd: I'm also fairly confident we hook glib allocation stuff to go through jemalloc so it wouldn't matter anyway
- # [18:16] <vd> ok
- # [18:16] * @tbsaunde votes for letting longdesc die of apathy
- # [18:17] <@davidb> one way to kill the issue is to add support
- # [18:17] <@tbsaunde> vd: sorry this stuff is tricky, the way atk wants to work and the way our internal api want to work don't quiet match up :/
- # [18:18] <@tbsaunde> davidb: I thought we do support longdesc?
- # [18:18] <@davidb> i think longdesc wastes about 1000 hours a year of various person hours.
- # [18:18] <@davidb> here's the paste:
- # [18:18] <@davidb> User agents should make the link available to all users through the regular user interface.
- # [18:18] <@davidb> User agents should expose the link to relevant APIs, especially accessibility-oriented APIs.
- # [18:18] <@davidb> User agents should enable users to discover when images in a page contain a long description.
- # [18:18] <@tbsaunde> I'd believe it happily I haven't wasted a full hour yet this year :)
- # [18:18] <@davidb> tbsaunde: good.
- # [18:18] <vd> tbsaunde: np, as long as you help me with the big picture
- # [18:19] <@davidb> marcoz: i'd ask hsivonen
- # [18:19] <@tbsaunde> davidb: ah
- # [18:21] <vd> tbsaunde: so no braces if there is a single statement after "if (...)" ?
- # [18:21] <@tbsaunde> vd: yes
- # [18:21] <@tbsaunde> vd: I think the high level looks good
- # [18:22] <vd> tbsaunde: ok, there is one more place which you did not mention in the review, changing that one too
- # [18:22] <@tbsaunde> vd: are you testing patches at all other than building?
- # [18:22] <vd> No!
- # [18:22] <@tbsaunde> vd: ok, I can do some of that for you since its not exactly simple
- # [18:23] <vd> I was just going to ask how do I do that :)
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- # [18:31] <@tbsaunde> vd: so, what I'd probably do is first grab the scrip at people.mozilla.org/~tsaunders/atspimon.py.txt then run it as a python script with the argument Firefox then start firefox
- # [18:31] <@tbsaunde> the script will dump all the accessible events from firefox
- # [18:32] <@tbsaunde> but you might well be missing dependancies so testing for you is not a problem
- # [18:33] <@davidb> marcoz: what is your opinion?
- # [18:34] <vd> tbsaunde: will try that one, recompiling right now...
- # [18:35] <@tbsaunde> vd: cool :)
- # [18:39] <@marcoz> davidb: I have none. I hardly used it when I was using JAWS and IE, and I hardly encountered it in the wild, either. I could see it being useful for more complex images, but I don't think many authors will actually go to the trouble to implement this.
- # [18:39] <@marcoz> davidb: In short: Indifferent.
- # [18:39] <@davidb> marcoz: the thing is… it is a resource suck
- # [18:40] <@davidb> somehow it needs to die or live
- # [18:40] <@davidb> tbsaunde: elisha replied.
- # [18:41] <@tbsaunde> davidb: I see, guess I need to learn how video works now :/
- # [18:42] <@davidb> or tell her to call your cell or something
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- # [18:54] <vd> tbsaunde: I am able to run the script, but strangely, firefox is not listed in the output of "python atspimon.py.txt -a", although I have it running
- # [19:01] <@firebot> vd@FreeBSD.org requested review from trev.saunders@gmail .com for attachment 729066 on bug 733712.
- # [19:01] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=733712 cri, --, ---, vd, ASSI, Don't call atk_object_set_name
- # [19:02] <@tbsaunde> vd: is anything shown?
- # [19:02] <vd> yes, lots of apps
- # [19:02] <vd> btw I submitted the new patch (as the firebot already told us)
- # [19:03] <@tbsaunde> vd: that's interesting what is the list
- # [19:05] <vd> tbsaunde: http://www.pastebin.mozilla.org/2245329
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- # [19:06] <yzen> eeejay: ping
- # [19:07] <eeejay> yzen, yo
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- # [19:07] <@tbsaunde> vd: are you starting firefox before or after the script?
- # [19:08] <vd> before
- # [19:08] <yzen> eeejay: :) I was chatting with davidb earlier about my bug, I really want to write some tests for the utterance generation for the whole accessible context (that i m moving from presentation) but presenters context object is not visible since it's not exported. do you have any suggestions as to how to go about it? should it be exported? or should I be testing something similar to the presenters context ?
- # [19:10] <@davidb> eeejay i told him to ask you :)
- # [19:10] <eeejay> yzen, hm. i'm not sure. part of the refactor we talked about earlier might mean having the utterance generator accept PresenterCOntext
- # [19:10] <eeejay> so maybe
- # [19:10] <yzen> eeejay: ya that's exactly what im doing
- # [19:11] <yzen> something called UtteranceGenerator.genForContext
- # [19:11] <eeejay> yzen, nothing is set in stone. so you could go ahead and change things, and i could be another set of eyes to see if it is sane
- # [19:11] <yzen> eeejay: sounds good
- # [19:13] <@tbsaunde> vd: try after, order is dependant
- # [19:13] <@tbsaunde> vd: because firefox only enables accessibility if its enabled in your gnome session, which requires that script running or something else setting the default from off to on
- # [19:14] <vd> tbsaunde: but the script quits immediatelly !?
- # [19:14] * @tbsaunde checks something
- # [19:14] <vd> ah, you mean to run it with a 'firefox' arg
- # [19:14] <vd> then it hangs, let me try that...
- # [19:14] <@tbsaunde> vd: yeah
- # [19:16] <vd> "Registering Event Listener..."
- # [19:17] <vd> nothing happens
- # [19:18] <@tbsaunde> vd: oh, interesting
- # [19:18] <vd> the script does not detect that FF is started while it waits for it
- # [19:18] <@tbsaunde> vd: yeah, what happens if you restart it?
- # [19:18] <@tbsaunde> or do you have orca installed?
- # [19:18] <vd> the script or FF?
- # [19:18] <@tbsaunde> the script
- # [19:18] <vd> I tried restarting each one a few times :)
- # [19:19] <vd> gnome-orca - Scriptable screen reader
- # [19:19] <vd> this one?
- # [19:19] <@tbsaunde> vd: yes
- # [19:19] <vd> yes, that one is installed
- # [19:20] <@tbsaunde> vd: what happens if you run it?
- # [19:21] <Bryen> tbsaunde, Hey there. Is there a document or page online that gives a complete overview of a11y and Firefox?
- # [19:21] <vd> tbsaunde: it starts with a robot voice and a small window with 4 buttons on it
- # [19:22] <vd> tbsaunde: I have to go off now, bbl
- # [19:23] <@tbsaunde> vd: ok, try restaring firefox after it starts whenever you have time :)
- # [19:23] <@tbsaunde> Bryen: I'm not really clear what your looking for
- # [19:24] <Bryen> tbsaunde, basically, I want to know a-z about accessibility in Firefox and what you guys are working on hehe
- # [19:24] <Bryen> just so I can pretend to know it all.
- # [19:25] * habber is now known as habber-away
- # [19:25] <@tbsaunde> Bryen: I don't believe there is any such thing but that's still a pretty vague request ;-)
- # [19:25] <@davidb> Bryen: we have an out of date vpat somewhere
- # [19:25] <@davidb> 6 week trains have made that hard to keep on top of
- # [19:26] <@davidb> http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/vpat-3.html
- # [19:26] <Bryen> heh ok
- # [19:26] <@davidb> sort of dry
- # [19:26] <Bryen> I'm going to be a DeafBlind equipment trainer soon so I wanted to be able to know where to reference stuff. I'll start with that
- # [19:27] <@davidb> wow yeah
- # [19:27] <@davidb> ok
- # [19:27] <Bryen> NDBEDP program
- # [19:28] <@davidb> Bryen: ken saunders hosts http://www.accessfirefox.org/
- # [19:28] <@tbsaunde> we have exactly 1 test that forces that accessibles are removed left to right not right to left :/
- # [19:28] <@davidb> but it is mostly vis stuff
- # [19:28] <@davidb> tbsaunde: why do we test that?
- # [19:28] <@davidb> because that is the order of removal?
- # [19:28] <@davidb> and we want to preserve it?
- # [19:28] <@davidb> or is this a bidi thing?
- # [19:29] <@tbsaunde> davidb: what we actually test is that if you have <span><span id=foo><span>11</span><span>22</span></span>33</span> we say the text removal was 1122 not 2211
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- # [19:30] <@tbsaunde> now I suppsoe its possible to remove the other way and preserve that, but it seems ... hard
- # [19:30] <@tbsaunde> its not going to kill anything just make me rewrite some stuff
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- # [19:32] <@davidb> hmm yeah i think for LTR languages we probably want left to right
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- # [19:34] <@tbsaunde> yeah, and I'd guess we're all sorts of busted for rtl stuff :/
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- # [22:07] <@davidb> ark time
- # [22:07] <@davidb> afk time even
- # [22:07] <@davidb> ciao
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- # Session Close: Tue Mar 26 00:00:00 2013
The end :)