/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2013-03-28 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Thu Mar 28 00:00:00 2013
  2. # Session Ident: #accessibility
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  16. # [01:34] <@tbsaunde> surkov: hey
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  18. # [01:36] <@surkov> tbsaunde: hello
  19. # [01:36] <@tbsaunde> surkov: wouldn't it be nice to have a js function to dump an accessible tree
  20. # [01:36] <@tbsaunde> ?
  21. # [01:37] <@surkov> tbsaunde: I think yes but I'd guess we had something?
  22. # [01:37] <@tbsaunde> not that I'm aware of?
  23. # [01:37] <@surkov> or I probably confuse with DOMi capabilites
  24. # [01:38] <@surkov> I need to check
  25. # [01:40] <@tbsaunde> surkov: also how much do you care about adding a test for bug 852150? it seems like it might be tricky because of what needs to not be accessible?
  26. # [01:40] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=852150 maj, --, ---, trev.saunders, NEW, "ASSERTION: No accessible parent?!" with table
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  28. # [01:44] <@surkov> tbsaunde: who claims there's no accessible parent?
  29. # [01:45] <@surkov> tbsaunde: I thought we can check that row or cell moved under hidden element whether it's still in the accessibility cache
  30. # [01:47] <@tbsaunde> surkov: yeah, we can probably test some stuff, I guess just testing the full tree isn't easy
  31. # [01:48] <@surkov> tbsaunde: no, it seems the primary problem here is we keep the accessible in cache longer than we need and if we tested that then it'd be good
  32. # [01:48] <@tbsaunde> surkov: ok, that shouldn't be too bad I think
  33. # [01:49] <@surkov> yep
  34. # [02:02] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
  35. # [02:09] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so, I'd think http://paste.debian.net/245299/ should work as a test, but it seems to pass with our old code
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  37. # [02:10] <@surkov> tbsaunde: did you check result DOM? I'd suggest to use display:table-row instead (it doesn't affect on DOM)
  38. # [02:11] <@surkov> tbsaunde: do you get an assertion with old code?
  39. # [02:17] <@tbsaunde> surkov: I don't think so otherwise I'd get a test failure for not annotating it
  40. # [02:17] <@tbsaunde> surkov: check which part of result DOM?
  41. # [02:17] <@surkov> tbsaunde: initial DOM
  42. # [02:17] <@surkov> when you use table and tr tags then DOM is correct
  43. # [02:18] <@surkov> that's why I said to try display styles instead
  44. # [02:18] <@surkov> (they don't affect on DOM)
  45. # [02:18] <@tbsaunde> surkov: why is it correct? tr isn't child of table
  46. # [02:18] <@surkov> then ok
  47. # [02:19] <@surkov> so you have an assertion but the accessible is not in the cache?
  48. # [02:19] <@tbsaunde> surkov: I don't think tr needs to be there at all though
  49. # [02:19] <@tbsaunde> surkov: I guess, but not really sure
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  51. # [02:34] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so, looks like in the fuzz test case the table's accessible is still in the cache
  52. # [02:34] <@surkov> tbsaunde: yeah it should be
  53. # [02:34] <@tbsaunde> (when the setTimeout is firing so a second later)
  54. # [02:34] <@tbsaunde> surkov: any idea why it isn't in my test?
  55. # [02:35] * @surkov shrugs
  56. # [02:40] <@tbsaunde> surkov: then what do you want to do?
  57. # [02:40] <@surkov> tbsaunde: add a fuzzy test as is?
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  59. # [02:41] <@tbsaunde> surkov: not sure what you mean add the test roughly as I showed you and how it catches the bug sometimes or something?
  60. # [02:42] <@surkov> tbsaunde: you said that the accessible is still in the cache when you run original test?
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  62. # [02:44] <@tbsaunde> surkov: yes
  63. # [02:45] <@surkov> tbsaunde: can you put that into mochitest?
  64. # [02:46] <@tbsaunde> surkov: that's what my test was trying to do, but apparently not closely enough
  65. # [02:54] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so, I guess the best guess is that somehow table accessible is eventually removed at which point hide fires and accessible is removed from cache so test passes
  66. # [02:54] <@surkov> did you try to add second mutation that was in original test
  67. # [02:59] <@tbsaunde> surkov: no, but it doesn't seem like that should be important for this test
  68. # [02:59] <@tbsaunde> I'm trying not using hide event / event queue
  69. # [03:13] <@tbsaunde> surkov: so the thing is if you just remove the table and then check if its in the cache that works with the old code as a test, but clearly doesn't with the fuzz test case
  70. # [03:13] <@surkov> I guess that second removal is a key point
  71. # [03:15] <@tbsaunde> surkov: but it can't be
  72. # [03:16] <@tbsaunde> because at the time when it would happen the table accessible nolonger is cached in the test
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  84. # [05:17] <brankc> I'm trying to implement tests for https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=849624 - Is attributes/test_xml-roles.html the right place to start?
  85. # [05:17] <@firebot> Bug 849624 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, modify HTML5 header and footer accessibility API mapping
  86. # [05:25] <brankc> Main thing I'm wondering is what header and footer should be mapped to for testing purposes if not banner/contentinfo.
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  112. # [10:07] <@marcoz> surkov: Hi! Great blog post about the changes in Firefox 21! :)
  113. # [10:07] <@surkov> marcoz: thank you!
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  115. # [10:09] <@marcoz> surkov: I was wondering if you would also want to blog about those getTextxxx changes you were working on, word offsets and such. And if there's anything AT vendors and users alike should watch out for when using Nightly, or from end of next week, also Aurora, since that will become 22 then.
  116. # [10:09] <@surkov> marcoz: ok, I will
  117. # [10:10] <@marcoz> surkov: Cool!
  118. # [10:37] <Steve> surkov: me likes it too, keep it up!
  119. # [10:37] <@surkov> thank you, Steve!
  120. # [10:38] <Steve> surkov: does <label> work with any aria widget role?
  121. # [10:38] <Steve> or just combobox
  122. # [10:38] <@surkov> Steve: yes, it should
  123. # [10:38] <Steve> ok thanks
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  138. # [14:41] <icaaq> Hey! I was thinking, do you guys know of any website that collect good accessible real world sites? I'm thinking like the aha moments I can have sometimes when looking at a site. if you, for example are a screenreader user and you feel just like WOW, they have really thought a11y here…
  139. # [14:44] <@davidb> heyo
  140. # [14:44] <@tbsaunde> hey
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  142. # [14:45] <@davidb> icaaq: I'm among the least qualified to answer that since I don't dogwood enough
  143. # [14:45] <@davidb> dogfood even
  144. # [14:45] * @davidb thanks spell correct
  145. # [14:45] <@davidb> not aware of a site
  146. # [14:48] <icaaq> davidb: ok, maybe a a11yawards site would be in order. like http://www.cssawards.net/nominees/ but for a11y
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  148. # [14:49] <@davidb> icaaq: i like that idea
  149. # [14:50] <@davidb> !seen clown
  150. # [14:50] <@firebot> clown was last seen 2 days, 23 hours, 49 minutes and 25 seconds ago, changing nick to clown_mtg.
  151. # [14:51] <@davidb> surkov: in your blog should it be "Flash the screen *2* times"?
  152. # [14:51] <@surkov> davidb: right :)
  153. # [14:51] <@surkov> thanks
  154. # [14:51] <@davidb> np
  155. # [14:52] <@surkov> fixed
  156. # [14:54] <@davidb> haha "Go ask your dad"
  157. # [14:54] <@tbsaunde> davidb: ?
  158. # [14:54] <@davidb> tbsaunde: it is in surkov's blog
  159. # [14:54] <@tbsaunde> surkov: did you mean to do something with the r? in the test ath bug?
  160. # [14:54] <@tbsaunde> ah
  161. # [14:55] <@davidb> aria-invalid="grammar" totally flew under my radar
  162. # [14:55] <@surkov> tbsaunde: what about r?
  163. # [14:56] <@tbsaunde> surkov: wasn't sure if you intended to look at that patch or something
  164. # [14:56] <@surkov> tbsaunde: assertion patch?
  165. # [14:57] <@tbsaunde> surkov: no, the test path stuff
  166. # [14:57] <@surkov> tbsaunde: which bug (I don't follow you, probably it's too late here :) )
  167. # [14:59] <@surkov> tbsaunde: ah your about mochitest bug? I asked a question there
  168. # [14:59] <@tbsaunde> surkov: bug 854868
  169. # [14:59] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=854868 nor, --, ---, mbrubeck, ASSI, no way to provide a test path for mochitest-a11y
  170. # [15:01] <@surkov> gotta go
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  178. # [15:10] <@davidb> hi clown_mtg are we meeting at 1?
  179. # [15:11] <clown_mtg> davidb, yes. same time. same batty channel.
  180. # [15:11] <@davidb> heh
  181. # [15:11] <@davidb> alright
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  189. # [15:31] <@marcoz> davidb: tbsaunde: hub: Hi! :)
  190. # [15:31] <@davidb> hi hi hi
  191. # [15:48] * @marcoz hopes eeejay doesn't get overwhelmed by my last comment in bug 852955. ;)
  192. # [15:48] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=852955 maj, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Trying to activate items at top of pages brings up awesome bar or menu instead
  193. # [15:50] * Joins: rednaks (rednaks@F463A367.7B2CFADA.55FFA9B4.IP)
  194. # [16:04] <@marcoz> should it be really a one-line fix to fix bug 785144? The build I'm currently making will show.
  195. # [16:04] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=785144 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [AccessFu] Braille doesn't update when navigating through content
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  201. # [16:37] <@marcoz> Nope, it is not.
  202. # [16:38] <@davidb> bummer
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  205. # [17:12] <@marcoz> eeejay: Hi! You around already?
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  212. # [18:11] * @davidb suspects tbsaunde will like ES6
  213. # [18:11] <@davidb> relative to pre ES6
  214. # [18:12] <@tbsaunde> davidb: ?
  215. # [18:12] <@davidb> lexical scoping with the new arrow syntac
  216. # [18:13] <@davidb> syntax
  217. # [18:15] * @marcoz had his first glimpse of SCala today, while looking at the Spiel sourcecode. Looks like a mixture of Visual Basic and JavaScript. Not very appealing. ;)
  218. # [18:15] <@davidb> i've never looked
  219. # [18:16] <@tbsaunde> davidb: I have no idea what your talking about
  220. # [18:16] <@davidb> tbsaunde: new javascript
  221. # [18:17] <@davidb> allows saner scoping use
  222. # [18:17] <@davidb> like C
  223. # [18:17] <@davidb> you don't have to imagine all the possible dynamic binding cases
  224. # [18:20] <@tbsaunde> davidb: and does it have any static checking? ;-)
  225. # [18:22] <@davidb> actually that could happen now i suppose
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  228. # [18:30] <lizzard> hello davidb, tsaunde!
  229. # [18:30] <@davidb> heyo
  230. # [18:31] <@tbsaunde> lizzard: hi
  231. # [18:33] * ChanServ sets mode: +o marcoz
  232. # [18:33] <@marcoz> Hi lizzard! :)
  233. # [18:34] <lizzard> hi there marcoz!
  234. # [18:34] <lizzard> one more day in toronto...
  235. # [18:34] <lizzard> mdas from my team has been taking me to amazing restaurants
  236. # [18:34] <@marcoz> lizzard: And how did you like it? Did the backdoor entrance solution work out for you?
  237. # [18:35] <lizzard> marcoz: everyone is lovely, and toronto is not as full of snow as I had feared, and the back door was perfectly fine
  238. # [18:35] <@marcoz> Oh yes, Toronto has a good number of really fancy restaurants! Can't wait to come back! :)
  239. # [18:39] <@marcoz> eeejay: davidb: Gonna have dinner now, but look back here afterwards in case I'm needed for anything regarding bug 852955.
  240. # [18:40] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=852955 maj, --, ---, eitan, NEW, [AccessFu] Trying to activate items at top of pages brings up awesome bar or menu instead
  241. # [18:40] <@davidb> cheers
  242. # [18:43] <rednaks> Hello, I'm working on a good bug in accessibility module and i'm wondering if there any test I can run to see if my patch did not break any thing
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  246. # [18:45] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: make mochitest-a11y
  247. # [18:46] <rednaks> ok thanks tbsaunde :)
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  250. # [18:53] <eeejay> marcoz, yo
  251. # [18:54] <eeejay> sorry for the late start
  252. # [18:54] <eeejay> marcoz, trying to reproduce those issues with no success
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  256. # [19:08] <@marcoz> eeejay: Would a video call help?
  257. # [19:09] <eeejay> marcoz, sure. let me put in earphones. could you show me on a nexus 7?
  258. # [19:10] * eeejay is ready on skype
  259. # [19:10] <@marcoz> eeejay: I am reproducing this on a Galaxy Nexus.
  260. # [19:11] <eeejay> marcoz, ok
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  266. # [19:16] <eeejay> marcoz, i noticed a debug braille display at the bottom of your phone. it might be related?
  267. # [19:18] <@marcoz> eeejay: Nope, it also happens without that.
  268. # [19:19] <@marcoz> I only activated it a bit earlier this evening to see if I could get BrailleBack to work. But it also happens without BrailleBac enabled.
  269. # [19:19] <eeejay> marcoz, ok
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  271. # [19:32] <@marcoz> eeejay: Found one. Look for the Flash Video Downloader, then swipe to "View all versions". Double-Tapping that activates the Home button on my Nexus 7.
  272. # [19:33] <@marcoz> Flash Video Downloader is an add-on.
  273. # [19:34] <eeejay> marcoz, wfm
  274. # [19:34] <eeejay> weird
  275. # [19:35] <eeejay> marcoz, i'm going to upload my rebased version of chris's patch. maybe they differ?
  276. # [19:36] * Joins: yzen (Adium@AA2C085E.10C8AEF8.9A8C35B4.IP)
  277. # [19:38] <@marcoz> eeejay: Dunno.
  278. # [19:38] <@marcoz> eeejay: Do you wanna see my Nexus 7?
  279. # [19:38] <eeejay> marcoz, don't know if that will help
  280. # [19:38] <eeejay> marcoz, sure, why noy
  281. # [19:43] <eeejay> marcoz, http://people.mozilla.com/~eisaacson/fennec-22.0a1.en-US.android-arm.apk
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  283. # [19:47] <@marcoz> eeejay: Yup, reproduced with your binary, too. This time, it opened the "Recent apps".
  284. # [19:47] <eeejay> marcoz, weird!
  285. # [19:48] <@marcoz> eeejay: Are you holding it in portrait like I do, or in landscape?
  286. # [19:48] <eeejay> marcoz, portrait
  287. # [19:48] <eeejay> marcoz, dump question: you are sure you used "fennec eitan"
  288. # [19:48] <@marcoz> Positive.
  289. # [19:49] <@marcoz> It even announced that as it was focusing on that last opened app. :)
  290. # [19:49] <@marcoz> eeejay:
  291. # [19:49] <eeejay> hm
  292. # [19:50] <eeejay> marcoz, i don't know when you want to head out
  293. # [19:50] <eeejay> marcoz, but adb logcat is the next step
  294. # [19:50] <eeejay> we might not solve this
  295. # [19:51] <@marcoz> eeejay: With your current build or would you put in debug stuff and send me a new one?
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  297. # [19:52] <@marcoz> eeejay: I'm sticking around for now.
  298. # [19:53] <eeejay> marcoz, i would need to reproduce this and play with it with different debug output. but maybe logcat would show some glaring error now
  299. # [19:53] <@marcoz> eeejay: OK, let me logcat and reproduce and send you the file.
  300. # [19:53] <eeejay> k
  301. # [19:53] <yzen> eeejay: hi, i was hoping you might take a look at the patches i have for 753984 and if they require more work, at your convenience of course :)
  302. # [19:54] <eeejay> yzen, yeah. i'm in fire extinguishing mode right now. but its on my list :)
  303. # [19:54] <yzen> eeejay: cool :)
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  305. # [19:58] <@marcoz> eeejay: You've got mail.
  306. # [20:01] <eeejay> marcoz, i'm assuming latest version of talkback
  307. # [20:02] <@marcoz> eeejay: You assume correctly.
  308. # [20:04] * eeejay reinstalls apk
  309. # [20:05] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
  310. # [20:07] <eeejay> marcoz, from your adb log. it looks like every time you double clicked the throbber started. so you activated a link
  311. # [20:08] <eeejay> marcoz, change Logger.logLevel to 0 in Utils.jsm
  312. # [20:11] <eeejay> marcoz, and.. tweak up the log level all the way in talkback
  313. # [20:16] <@marcoz> eeejay: Building with the utils.jsm change now. Will tune up the TalkBack level now.
  314. # [20:23] <@marcoz> eeejay: And you've got mail.
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  316. # [20:29] <eeejay> marcoz, hm
  317. # [20:29] <eeejay> marcoz, we don't capture that doubletap anymore
  318. # [20:31] <@marcoz> eeejay: Ugh, how can that be? Focus definitely does not change for TalkBack, at least it doesn't speak anything.
  319. # [20:32] <@marcoz> eeejay: Do we still capture the swipe onto that View All Versions link?
  320. # [20:32] <eeejay> marcoz, i am seeing very little gesture logging
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  322. # [20:32] <eeejay> which is weird
  323. # [20:33] <sadegh> Hi to all
  324. # [20:33] <@marcoz> eeejay: Indeed! I definitely hear the speech output corresponding with what I expect to hear from that page.
  325. # [20:33] <@tbsaunde> sadegh: hi
  326. # [20:36] <eeejay> marcoz, it is as if you are using the system ebt instead of ours
  327. # [20:37] <@marcoz> eeejay: Phew….Let me try and see if our quick nav gestures work.
  328. # [20:40] <sadegh> Hi to all
  329. # [20:41] <@marcoz> eeejay: Yep, I can navigate to the View All Versions link with three finger swipes and double-tap, and it will open the Recent Apps thingie.
  330. # [20:42] <@davidb> sadegh: hi
  331. # [20:42] <sadegh> davidb: hi
  332. # [20:42] <eeejay> marcoz, i am puzzled as why i don't see almost any gesture logging
  333. # [20:43] <eeejay> marcoz, ah. in the log you sent me you were only single finger swiping
  334. # [20:44] <@marcoz> eeejay: Yep.
  335. # [20:44] <eeejay> marcoz, ok. i wonder if you could give me screenshots
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  337. # [20:44] * eeejay looks how to do that
  338. # [20:45] <@marcoz> eeejay: Except for one instance where I put the finger down in the lower third of the screen and then started swiping.
  339. # [20:46] <@marcoz> eeejay: I believe the easiest way would be if I called you again and then performed steps really slowly so you could watch it all the way.
  340. # [20:47] <eeejay> marcoz, ok. but the resolution and focus it makes it hard to tell for sure, and it is a one pixel light colored border i am looking for
  341. # [20:48] <@marcoz> eeejay: Let's try it first, it's the fastest way I think. :)
  342. # [20:48] <eeejay> marcoz, ok
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  359. # [22:09] <rednaks> tbsaunde, I was looking for a way to get an Accessible from nsIFrame and I found this https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=542039, a bug that you worked on
  360. # [22:09] <@firebot> Bug 542039 nor, --, mozilla19, trev.saunders, RESO FIXED, nsIFrame should return accessible type
  361. # [22:09] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: ok, what are you trying to do?
  362. # [22:10] <rednaks> I'm on bug 850987
  363. # [22:10] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=850987 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, RenderedToContentOffset/ContentToRenderedOffset should return an offset unchanged for HTMLTextFieldA
  364. # [22:10] <rednaks> and I have to check if the accessible is and HTMLTextField or not
  365. # [22:11] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: looking
  366. # [22:11] <rednaks> but I don't know the utility of IsTextField if we can get the AccType from an nsIFrame
  367. # [22:12] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: you need to know if this is aa HTMLTextfieldAccessible, not the accessible for the passed in frame
  368. # [22:14] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: the accessible for the frame that's passed in will be a child of this and won't be a HTMLTextfieldAccessible
  369. # [22:15] <rednaks> emm I see
  370. # [22:15] <rednaks> how can I do it, I can't use IsTextField()
  371. # [22:15] <rednaks> inside the static function
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  374. # [22:17] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: an interesting question, I didn't see they were static
  375. # [22:18] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: you could just make them not static
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  377. # [22:20] <rednaks> ContentToRenderedOffset and RenderedToContentOffset are both static
  378. # [22:20] <rednaks> I'm allowed to do that ?
  379. # [22:21] <rednaks> there must be a good reason if they are static isn't it ?
  380. # [22:21] <@tbsaunde> rednaks: I'd assume they just didn't need a this before
  381. # [22:22] <@tbsaunde> I might be missing something but I think its fine
  382. # [22:24] <rednaks> okey
  383. # [22:24] <rednaks> thanks
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  393. # Session Close: Fri Mar 29 00:00:01 2013

The end :)