/irc-logs / mozilla / #accessibility / 2014-04-24 / end
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- # Session Start: Thu Apr 24 00:00:01 2014
- # Session Ident: #accessibility
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- # [07:54] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com set status-firefox29 to wontfix on bug 638465.
- # [07:54] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com set status-firefox30 to affected on bug 638465.
- # [07:54] <@firebot> marco.zehe@googlemail.com set status-firefox31 to verified on bug 638465.
- # [07:55] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=638465 nor, --, mozilla31, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, We're not picking up the insertion into the newly created window of testcase for bug 637644
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- # [09:49] <@MarcoZ> Good morning!
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- # [12:48] <@MarcoZ> Back.
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- # [13:16] <@firebot> cbook@mozilla.com changed the Resolution on bug 1000500 from --- to FIXED.
- # [13:16] <@firebot> cbook@mozilla.com changed the Status on bug 1000500 from NEW to RESOLVED.
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- # [13:16] <@firebot> cbook@mozilla.com changed the Target Milestone on bug 1000500 from --- to mozilla31.
- # [13:16] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1000500 nor, --, mozilla31, yzenevich, RESO FIXED, [AccessFu] When traversing to the link, prevent stepping into it.
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- # [13:49] <@MarcoZ> Good morning all! :-)
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- # [15:36] * @MarcoZ must re-do his work Windows machine and does it via BootCamp instead of a VM this time. Somehow working in Windows productivelyis anoylingly slow in a VM in the long run.
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- # [16:00] <@davidb> heyo!
- # [16:01] <@MarcoZ> Heyo davidb!
- # [16:01] <@davidb> MarcoZ, surkov, it will be interesting to see how we can best work with the W3C together as we go.
- # [16:02] <@MarcoZ> jwei: Hi! Just saw your comment in bug 1000465 about the zoom tests failing. I saw those recently, too, but ignored them because they were not in the field I was working in. Seems to have to do with High DPI screens.
- # [16:02] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1000465 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, fix bunch of warning in hypertext accessible class
- # [16:02] <@MarcoZ> davidb: Indeed!
- # [16:03] <@davidb> also, sometimes we won't agree, we'll have to decide whether to argue in public or try to keep the noise down and have a united voice.
- # [16:03] <jwei> MarcoZ: Yeah, there's a few tests that permanently fail on high DPI screens. The ones I'm mentioning were added with the type warning fixes, though.
- # [16:03] <@surkov> davidb, MarcoZ let’s schedule a chat, I will be in the office tomorrow
- # [16:03] <@davidb> surkov, great, how about 10am our time?
- # [16:03] <@surkov> davidb: sure, I arrive early
- # [16:03] <@davidb> MarcoZ?
- # [16:04] * clown is now known as clown_mtg
- # [16:05] <@MarcoZ> davidb: surkov: I'll be there!
- # [16:05] <@davidb> cool, I'll zimbra it up
- # [16:09] <tbsaunde> davidb: I can i take "not" for $500? ;)
- # [16:10] <@davidb> tbsaunde, heheh yes for this meeting.
- # [16:11] <tbsaunde> davidb: I meant for howt to work with the w3c
- # [16:11] <@davidb> oh
- # [16:11] <@davidb> well 'work with' can be quite a spectrum
- # [16:11] <@davidb> optimizing it is hard
- # [16:14] <tbsaunde> davidb: I was half joking
- # [16:14] <@MarcoZ> jwei: Question is if we have any idea how to fix these zoom-related bugs? But I realize you're nearing the end of your internship, so I won't bother you with this unless you want to voluntarily. :-)
- # [16:15] <@davidb> tbsaunde, right a joke with some truth
- # [16:15] <@davidb> MarcoZ: give him enough work that he can't go back to school
- # [16:16] <jwei> davidb MarcoZ: Not that I particularly want to go back to school. :P
- # [16:16] <@davidb> jwei, i'm with you.
- # [16:17] * @davidb has put his PhD off indefinitely
- # [16:19] <tbsaunde> MarcoZ: I though surkov had a patch?
- # [16:19] <@MarcoZ> Same here, i can totally understand how jwei feels! I made that same choice 15 years ago. :-)
- # [16:19] <@MarcoZ> But that was not meant as general encouragement, of course! :-)
- # [16:19] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: Well, I've not seen one, that's why I'm asking.
- # [16:21] <@MarcoZ> tbsaunde: surkov: All I know is that, when i see these zoom-related test failures in local builds, I ignore them because they don't relate to the code I work on.
- # [16:21] <@yzen> MarcoZ hey
- # [16:26] <@surkov> MarcoZ: they are because of retina
- # [16:31] * @davidb hunts tylenol
- # [16:33] <@MarcoZ> surkov: I realize that. But there must be a way to fix them, no?
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- # [16:33] <@MarcoZ> Hi yzen!
- # [16:33] <@yzen> MarcoZ , i watned to ask about the entry role
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- # [16:33] <@surkov> MarcoZ: sure
- # [16:33] <@yzen> still thinking what the best semantics is for the statusbar and its components
- # [16:34] <@surkov> MarcoZ: wanna take it? :)
- # [16:35] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Nope. :-)
- # [16:35] <@surkov> sad :)
- # [16:35] <@MarcoZ> surkov: This visual stuff is the last thing *I* should be working on.
- # [16:36] <@surkov> it’s rather failing test than visual stuff
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- # [16:38] <@yzen> MarcoZ ^
- # [16:40] <@MarcoZ> surkov: But the tests that are failing have to do with a very visual feature. :-)
- # [16:40] <@MarcoZ> yzen: So what's the question?
- # [16:41] <@surkov> MarcoZ: it’s true but probably less important than it’s a failure :)
- # [16:41] <@yzen> MarcoZ so you suggested group for the status bar itself which makes sense, what'd be the best role for the actual statusbar icon/element ?
- # [16:42] * clown_mtg is now known as clown
- # [16:43] <@MarcoZ> yzen: That depends on the items. In iOS, all those items are just separate touchable text items that have labels such as "3 of 5 bars" "Telekom.de network" "3 of 3 WiFi-bars", "16:45" "Bluetooth on" "Location services on" "Battery 75 percent".
- # [16:44] <@MarcoZ> And if a new notification appears, it is put over the top of these and becomes the touchable item. It also gets spoken automatically and interrupts other speech, much like an assertive live region, so one can react to it immediately.
- # [16:44] <@yzen> MarcoZ interesting so no particular role announced
- # [16:44] <@MarcoZ> the other items are not spoken when they update.
- # [16:44] <@yzen> makes sense\
- # [16:46] <@MarcoZ> yzen: When such a notification appears that gets spoken, touching, then double-tapping it will automatically bring up the application which sent the notification.
- # [16:47] <@yzen> right
- # [16:47] <@MarcoZ> This works similarly in Android, although the standard Nexus launcher mashes the notifications all together in one big chunk rather than separate items. But there are other status bar widgets on Android that do a better job at separating things.
- # [16:48] <@yzen> thanks MarcoZ
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- # [16:50] <@MarcoZ> surkov: My problem is also that these screen calculations confuse me, probably because I have a hard time visualizing what is happening, or transfering numbers into happenings in screen cords. So I'd appreciate it if someone better suited for these kinds of calculations and such could take this.
- # [16:51] <@surkov> MarcoZ: that’s easy, you just need to multiply numbers at 2
- # [16:52] <@MarcoZ> surkov: Well from the stuff we had to deal with in Android, it sure looked more complicated to me than that.
- # [16:53] <@surkov> ok, I don’t know about android failures
- # [16:53] <@surkov> I just saw tehm on os x
- # [16:53] <@MarcoZ> There are none AFAIK.
- # [16:54] <@MarcoZ> I saw them on OS X and Windows. But not all of them, and not always. And that alone gave me a headache.
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- # [17:33] <@yzen> MarcoZ in terms of elements such as status bar entries, would a note role be appropriate? i am looking for a role that would have the announcement and traversal rules that would satisfy both text icons and image icons..
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- # [17:48] <jwei> surkov: ping
- # [17:48] <@surkov> jwei: pong
- # [17:49] <jwei> surkov: In https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=916419#c26, point number 3 suggests that mfenced elements have the open/close operators and separators exposed in the tree.
- # [17:49] <@firebot> Bug 916419 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Expose MathML as a hierarchical accessible tree
- # [17:49] <jwei> surkov: Is it the TreeWalker that determines what is put into the accessible tree or not?
- # [17:50] * Parts: jlin (jlin@moz-615916EF.x.rootbsd.net)
- # [17:50] <@surkov> jwei: not really, TreeWalker determines the order of DOM tree traversal
- # [17:50] <@surkov> jwei: AccessibilityService decides what is accessible
- # [17:53] <@surkov> jwei: not sure about mfenced, but it looks like we don’t really need to have an accessible for it, if we had text leaf accessibles for braces then it mgiht be enough. on the another hand having mfenced as accessible would let AT to find braced statement more easily
- # [17:53] <@surkov> jwei: what is your current approach?
- # [17:54] <jwei> surkov: Currently, mfenced is an accessible, but its children is only the content. An example is (x, y) where mfenced contains two children, mi x and mi y. There's no information for (, ',', and ).
- # [17:54] <@surkov> jwei: did you check the accessible tree actually? TreeWalker might find something from frame tree
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- # [17:55] <jwei> surkov: There's nothing there in the finished accessible tree (DOM inspector) on both current Firefox as well as with the MathML patches applied, but I'll take a look at when we build the tree.
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- # [17:56] <@surkov> jwei: ok, I see, I think it can be dealt separately
- # [17:57] <jwei> surkov: I took a look at the nsMathMLmfencedFrame, and it looks like the operators are rendered separately from the content, so it's possible that it's because they're not explicitly in the MathML namespace (content->IsMathML returns false).
- # [17:58] <@surkov> jwei: perhaps it can be changed to nsIAnonymousTreeCreator approach
- # [18:01] <@davidb> jwei, tbsaunde, i'm hankering for food
- # [18:01] <@davidb> maybe pamier kebab?
- # [18:01] <jwei> davidb: Sure.
- # [18:01] <@davidb> we'd have to roll now
- # [18:02] * @davidb stands
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- # [19:45] * tbsaunde just got a palindrome bug number 1001001
- # [19:47] <@davidb> heh
- # [19:48] <@yzen> i had one too the other day 997799
- # [19:48] <@davidb> amazingnizama
- # [19:58] <@firebot> surkov.alexander@gmail.com changed the Assignee on bug 1000465 from nobody@mozilla.org to surkov.alexander@gmail.com.
- # [19:58] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1000465 nor, --, ---, surkov.alexander, NEW, fix bunch of warning in hypertext accessible class
- # [19:58] <@davidb> that review? (me) sometimes fools me :)
- # [19:59] <jwei> davidb: Hmm. Is there a way to alias it?
- # [19:59] <@davidb> s'ok, not sure.
- # [19:59] <jwei> davidb: Apart from changing the e-mail address, anyway.
- # [19:59] * @davidb shrugs
- # [20:00] <tbsaunde> davidb: ?
- # [20:01] <@davidb> tbsaunde, when jwei is requested for review it shortens his email address to "me" and displays that as the requestee
- # [20:01] <@davidb> no biggie
- # [20:03] <jwei> davidb: …it also appears I lost all permissions after changing the e-mail.
- # [20:04] <@davidb> jwei: ha! i can add those
- # [20:04] <@davidb> jwei, address?
- # [20:05] <jwei> davidb: me@jonathanwei.ca
- # [20:05] <@davidb> errr
- # [20:05] <@davidb> you didn't change the email
- # [20:05] * @davidb is confused
- # [20:06] <@davidb> anyways, i see you and will add back
- # [20:06] <jwei> davidb: After switching my Bugzilla account from jwei@mozilla.com to me@jonathanwei.ca, I now have no permission bits.
- # [20:06] <@davidb> ahhh
- # [20:06] <@davidb> jwei, before i do this then... do you have a jwei@jonathanwei.ca?
- # [20:07] <jwei> davidb: I can go activate it.
- # [20:07] <jwei> davidb: And use that for Bugzilla to reduce confusion.
- # [20:07] <@davidb> ok cool and i'll get you your permissions when i'm back online at 3:30
- # [20:07] <@davidb> 3:45
- # [20:07] <@davidb> ttfn
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- # [20:53] <@davidb> jwei, done.
- # [20:53] <jwei> davidb: Cool, thanks.
- # [20:53] <@davidb> np thanks for the change
- # [20:56] <@firebot> jmathies@mozilla.com changed the Assignee on bug 722178 from jmathies@mozilla.com to nobody@mozilla.org.
- # [20:56] <@firebot> jmathies@mozilla.com changed the Status on bug 722178 from UNCONFIRMED to NEW.
- # [20:56] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=722178 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Microsoft Magnifier tool does not focus (follow) text editing cursor properly when the cursor is not
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- # [21:40] <icaaq> Hi, what would you say about adding a webaccess or weba11y keyword in bugzilla.
- # [21:40] <@davidb> icaaq, we have "access"
- # [21:41] <@davidb> and sec508
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- # [21:41] <icaaq> davidb yes, i know. but that is more of what you guys are doing :)
- # [21:42] <icaaq> ohh, sec508 i didn't know about that
- # [21:49] <icaaq> davidb i still think a weba11y keyword would be handy. now there are different ways of describing a bug eg. [a11y] in the summary
- # [21:50] <icaaq> or access keyword that will send out lots of mail to people that maybe not are interested in webdev a11y
- # [21:54] <@davidb> icaaq, i'd use access until you hear grumping
- # [21:54] <@davidb> that said, i have nothing against adding weba11y
- # [21:54] <@davidb> or similar
- # [21:54] <icaaq> davidb ok
- # [21:56] <@davidb> icaaq... if we add a few related keywords like this... maybe we should have a common prefix...
- # [21:57] <@davidb> access, access-web, access-infra, access-foo
- # [21:57] <@davidb> seems to be the way things go
- # [21:57] <icaaq> davidb +1
- # [21:58] <icaaq> access-web would be good I think
- # [21:58] <@davidb> ok so if down the road you see the need, file the bug request and ping me
- # [21:58] <icaaq> will do :)
- # [21:58] <@davidb> icaaq, thanks for all that you do.
- # [21:59] * @davidb -->meeting
- # [21:59] <icaaq> davidb :)
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- # [22:15] <@firebot> ryanvm@gmail.com set status-firefox30 to fixed on bug 638465.
- # [22:15] <@firebot> Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=638465 nor, --, mozilla31, surkov.alexander, RESO FIXED, We're not picking up the insertion into the newly created window of testcase for bug 637644
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- # [23:34] <tbsaunde> jwei: you heading out soon? I have no clue how far this palce is
- # [23:34] <jwei> tbsaunde: I don't even know where we're going, haha.
- # [23:34] <jwei> tbsaunde: I'll grab you when we're leaving.
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- # Session Close: Fri Apr 25 00:00:00 2014
The end :)