/irc-logs / mozilla / #developers / 2012-01-11 / end

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# Session Start: Wed Jan 11 00:00:01 2012
# Session Ident: #developers
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# [00:05] <Waldo> jlebar: have you looked at webkit's linked-list classes at all?
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# [00:05] <jlebar> Waldo, no. :)
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# [00:05] <Waldo> jlebar: they have three of them, CircularLinkedList, SinglyLinkedList, and SentinelLinkedList
# [00:05] <Waldo> jlebar: I'll dig up a URL
# [00:06] <jlebar> Waldo, thanks.
# [00:06] <Waldo> http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Source/JavaScriptCore/wtf/ is WTF
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# [00:07] <Waldo> http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Source/JavaScriptCore/wtf/SinglyLinkedList.h and http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Source/JavaScriptCore/wtf/SentinelLinkedList.h and http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Source/JavaScriptCore/wtf/DoublyLinkedList.h
# [00:07] <Waldo> jlebar: ^
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# [00:07] <Waldo> jlebar: I'm pretty sure if they end up with that many, we're going to end up with more than just one
# [00:07] <Waldo> jlebar: given this, I'm guessing squatting LinkedList now is not a viable long-term strategy
# [00:08] <jlebar> Waldo, what do you mean "squatting"?
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# [00:08] <Waldo> jlebar: taking the name, then someone wanting another LinkedList class with somewhat different semantics
# [00:08] <jlebar> oh.
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# [00:09] <Waldo> jlebar: and given there are three different concepts that could all fairly be called "linked list" (at least), seems better to have unambiguous names
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# [00:09] * Waldo was going through making more detailed comments, but really, more fundamental things should be resolved first
# [00:09] <jlebar> Waldo, I'm not attached to the name, although I feel like, when we add a second one, we can just change the name.
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# [00:10] <Waldo> past the name, I'm also wondering if these are the definite semantics we want, or if we want semantics something more like the WTF ones, or even something totally different
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# [00:11] <gps> what's the preferred way to extract the individual query string parameters from a string from JS? i.e. do we have a query string -> object helper function?
# [00:11] <jlebar> Waldo, I need to eat dinner now, but I can ping you after. Or we can discuss in the bug.
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# [00:11] <Waldo> jlebar: after sounds good
# [00:11] <jlebar> cool.
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# [00:22] <joe> protip: don't do make -j -l 8
# [00:22] * joe just got control of his computer back
# [00:22] <blizzard> :D
# [00:22] <hub> joe: what does that do?
# [00:22] * hub suffers with just make -j2 on this machine
# [00:23] <joe> "fork as much as you want until you reach a load of 8"
# [00:23] <hub> ouch
# [00:23] <hub> yeah
# [00:23] <joe> normally I do -l 4
# [00:23] <hub> I would do that, but not with 4GB of RAM on a Mac
# [00:23] <joe> i have 8
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# [00:24] <hub> on order...
# [00:24] <joe> i wish there was an iotop on mac
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# [00:24] <hub> I wish I could just do that on Linux
# [00:24] <joe> i'd like to know what's writing to my spinning disk
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# [00:24] <gps> use dtrace for that
# [00:25] <gps> http://www.brendangregg.com/DTrace/dtrace_oneliners.txt
# [00:25] <gps> although I think a bunch of those don't work on OS X out of the box
# [00:25] <rhelmer> joe: iotop as in the dtrace script? I have it on my mbp?
# [00:26] <gps> see also Intruments.app on OS X
# [00:27] <sfink> hub: if you're suffering from make on Linux, you might want to use cgroups to wall it off
# [00:27] <gregglind> Instruments >> dtrace (on osx)
# [00:27] <gps> well, Instruments.app is just a GUI for dtrace, no?
# [00:27] <gps> albeit a very very pretty one
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# [00:28] <gps> 3> dtrace
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# [00:28] <hub> sfink: nah. on Mac I'm suffering. no problem with Linux, except that my current tasks can't be done on it
# [00:28] <hub> sfink: and it is mostly due to lack of RAM
# [00:28] <sfink> hub: Oh. Try painting your computer white.
# [00:29] <hub> sfink: which one?
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# [00:29] <sfink> The Linux one, of course. Then you can do anything a Mac can do.
# [00:29] <hub> sfink: not really.
# [00:29] <hub> sfink: *hint* I'm fixing Accessibility on MacOS
# [00:30] <gps> Linux has nothing on dtrace
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# [00:30] <gps> their filesystems are also years behind ZFS
# [00:30] <sfink> hub: You're too distracted by reality. Superficial impressions are what count.
# [00:30] <gps> I miss Sun/Solaris
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# [00:34] <@dbaron> ok, since I was hitting a lot of fatal JS asserts (one every few days), I updated my tree
# [00:34] <@dbaron> and now I can't even restore my session without getting a fatal JS assert
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# [00:35] <@dbaron> I wonder if things will just start working again if I comment out the assertion in JSAtom::asPropertyName
# [00:36] <Jesse> dbaron: which assert(s)?
# [00:36] <@dbaron> Jesse, there's only one
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# [00:37] <@dbaron> Jesse, Assertion failure: !isIndex(&dummy), at /home/dbaron/builds/ssd/mozilla-central/mozilla/js/src/vm/String.h:856
# [00:38] <mccr8> dbaron: sound like 715682?
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# [00:38] <@dbaron> mccr8, same assert, so may well be
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# [00:39] <@dbaron> mccr8, except I have the fix for it
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# [00:40] <roc> the temptation to make a snide comment about fatal asserts is nearly overwhelming
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# [00:50] <jlebar> Waldo, I'm checking out webkit so I can grep to see how they use these different linked list classes. But it's going very slowly. Do you know if they have a mxr-equivalent I can search?
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# [00:55] <rhelmer> jlebar: code search seems to still be up though it's going to be taken down soon http://www.google.com/codesearch#OAMlx_jo-ck/src/
# [00:55] <jlebar> rhelmer, cool; thanks!
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# [00:59] <Waldo> jlebar: yeah, I think codesearch is it; because their layout tests are mostly pixel-based, you get a gazillion new images with every checkout :-(
# [01:00] <Waldo> and now I'm off to dinner :-)
# [01:00] <jdm> ehsan: with regards to bug 697981, I'm putting feelers out to deLta30, drexler and jhk
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# [01:00] <ehsan> jdm: thanks :)
# [01:00] <jlebar> Waldo|dinner, We can catch up tomorrrow, if I'm not around when you're back.
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# [01:00] <Waldo|dinner> jlebar: sure
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# [01:18] <jimb> Anybody want to help this guy, trying to get his binary plugin signed properly? http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8790819/firefox-ignores-signature-on-successfully-signed-xpi-how-to-diagnose
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# [01:21] <Matti> jimb: it looks like his certificate is not valid/not accepted in FF for software signing
# [01:23] <@dbaron> ok, commenting out the assert seems to work
# [01:23] <@dbaron> (pokes Waldo|dinner)
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# [01:42] <gps> Unfocused: at what point will AddonManager.getInstallForURL stop adding new optional positional arguments and switch to taking args via an JS object? are you holding out for named arguments in JS?
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# [01:43] <gps> (I just feel dirty adding a 9th argument to that function)
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# [01:45] <gps> speaking of named arguments, isn't that approved for JS? do we have it in SpiderMonkey yet?
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# [01:47] <jimb> Matti: Want to offer that as an answer on stackexchange?
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# [01:50] <Mook_as> huh, he even comments that signing only works if he manually adjusts the CA's trust bits...
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# [01:51] <jimb> Do we have a devmo link that explains what kind of certificate he should be using?
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# [01:52] <Mossop> A problem is not necessarily that his cert is the wrong kind, just that it comes from a CA that we don't trust for object signing, there are bugs open for some of the CAs for this
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# [01:53] <jimb> Mossop: Are there some certs we trust for other purposes, but not for object signing?
# [01:53] <jimb> s/certs/CA's/
# [01:53] <Mossop> Yes, most CAs are only trusted for webserver signing
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# [01:54] <Mossop> IIRC there are three twust bits, webserver, mail and code (object)
# [01:54] * Mossop snickers at "twust"
# [01:54] <jimb> Mossop: I twust you, cwootie
# [01:55] <jimb> Do we have a public list of CAs trusted for object signing? That is, what's the process a well-informed developer follows to get a cert that actually works?
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# [01:55] <gps> Mossop: oh it's twue! it's twue!
# [01:56] <Mossop> jimb: So few people do this that we don't have good lists or even readable docs for this stuff
# [01:56] <jimb> gps: wov --- TWUE wov ---
# [01:56] <jimb> Mossop: Okay. So there's no devmo page I can point him at...
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# [01:57] <Mossop> Nope
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# [01:58] <Mook_as> jimb: https://spreadsheets.google.com/a/activestate.com/pub?key=ttwCVzDVuWzZYaDosdU6e3w&single=true&gid=0&output=html ?
# [01:58] <Mook_as> (via http://www.mozilla.org/projects/security/certs/included/ / https://wiki.mozilla.org/CA:Schedule#Queue_for_Public_Discussion )
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# [02:07] <jimb> Mook_as: That's perfect! Thanks!
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# [02:11] <Mook_as> jimb: and make sure he picks up Netscape signing certs, not Authenticode ones...
# [02:11] <jimb> Mook_as: What's the detail/reason there?
# [02:11] <Mook_as> jimb: Authenticode = MS code signing = doesn't actually work for Mozilla signing
# [02:12] <Mook_as> (it's a different bit, or something along those lines, basically)
# [02:12] <jimb> How can one tell what kind of code signing a given cert is capable of?
# [02:12] <jimb> Is it something you request when you buy it?
# [02:13] <Mook_as> it should be, yeah... otherwise they're selling you stuff that will never work? :p
# [02:13] <jimb> What is the structural difference in the cert?
# [02:13] <jimb> Never mind, that's not the right question...
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# [02:14] <jimb> Mook_as: So, authorities who apply to be able to sign code for Mozilla know about our special code-signing requirements, and produce (if requested) certs that have the appropriate internal structure for signtool to work with?
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# [02:15] <Mook_as> jimb: right.
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# [02:17] <jimb> Mook_as: Thanks again!
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# [02:21] <philor> mmm, PGO bustage
# [02:21] <edmorley> Bug 702158 i believe
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# [02:21] <edmorley> (retriggered some PGO earlier)
# [02:22] <edmorley> about to backout, unless you have any other ideas?
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# [02:23] <philor> error: line too long to read as a single line and keep it all in your head
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# [02:26] <philor> edmorley: nope, seems reasonable enough
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# [02:28] <Unfocused> gps: you're welcome to switch to a more sane method, if you can do it without breaking compatibility :)
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# [02:29] <gps> along that vein - I'm having trouble tracing the entire flow down to the post-install ping
# [02:29] <gps> actually, I can't find the code for the post-install ping at all
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# [02:31] <Unfocused> gps: https://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/mozapps/extensions/XPIProvider.jsm#6157
# [02:31] <gps> oh, it's at the bottom of the file I'm only halfway through scanning ;)
# [02:31] <Unfocused> its more of a "during install" ping
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# [02:34] <gps> wait - so cacheAddons() has a side-effect of being used as metrics on the server?
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# [02:38] <Unfocused> yep
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# [02:39] <gps> so, you want to add a new query string parameter that gets sent during cacheAddons() for add-ons installed during sync. then we tell the AMO people about it and they can use it for metrics?
# [02:39] <gps> or do you want to not send the metadata ping at all?
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# [02:41] <Unfocused> yea, new parameter
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# [02:42] <Unfocused> can't not do that metadata ping - it results in data the addons manager uses (including compatibility overrides, needed for compatible-by-default)
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# [02:45] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/b386494d97eb - Ed Morley - Bug 698425 - Fix lack of whitespace breaking conditional in toolkit-makefiles.sh; rs=build
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# [02:47] <tbsaunde> the windows m4 leak on m-c is bug 694772 right?
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# [02:50] <gps> Unfocused: so, how do you want to do this? you want a src=X query string parameter on the AddonRepository getAddonsByIDs API?
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# [02:52] <edmorley> tbsaunde: yup :-)
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# [02:53] <edmorley> tbsaunde: that and 706883 come up first in my awesomebar searches for the letter b now, they are so frequent :-(
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# [02:54] <tbsaunde> edmorley: :
# [02:54] <tbsaunde> .
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# [02:56] <Unfocused> gps: i was thinking more of a constant like AddonManager.INSTALL_REASON_WHATEVER, passed through getInstallByURL(), through to AddonInstall.loadManifest(), through to AddonRepository, whether it would determin what src=whatever was put in the url
# [02:56] <Unfocused> really messy though :\
# [02:57] <Unfocused> i wonder if it's even worth all that effort
# [02:57] <gps> assuming there is a src in the url
# [02:57] <Unfocused> yea
# [02:57] <edmorley> oh ffs patch author was missing
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# [02:58] <Unfocused> and for consistancy, other uses of retrieving metadata from amo would get similar treatment (like the periodic background update ping)
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# [02:59] <Unfocused> as i said: messy
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# [02:59] <Unfocused> er, and i suppose it'd be more of a reason=whatever, rather than src=whatever
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# [03:00] <Unfocused> might be worth asking fligtar exactly what amo gains from having that distinction for metadata pings
# [03:00] <Unfocused> if it's not much, it may not be worth it
# [03:01] * Unfocused really wants to rewrite parts of AddonRepository because doing stuff like this is so awkward
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# [03:01] <tbsaunde> o, ffs what do I have to do to get past the commit message hook?
# [03:02] <Unfocused> tbsaunde: iirc, you need a bug number, and a r=person
# [03:02] <Callek> tbsaunde: just one patch, group of patches, or a project-branch merging in?
# [03:02] <Unfocused> but.. yea, what Callek said
# [03:03] <tbsaunde> Callek: project branch merge
# [03:03] <Callek> tbsaunde: which branch?
# [03:03] <tbsaunde> accessibility
# [03:03] * Callek is quite perplexed that it didn't already have the hook there, and scared that we would merge in a bunch of code landings without it
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# [03:04] <tbsaunde> Callek: it hasn't been used for much yet
# [03:04] <tbsaunde> as for why it doesn't have the don't ask me
# [03:05] <Pike> hooks on code style kinda defeat the purpose of a dvcs, sadly
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# [03:05] <tbsaunde> nas for this particular merge I think there's one bad commit and its pretty clear what bug its for (fixup)
# [03:05] <Callek> tbsaunde: so, #1 file an server ops bug to enable that hook on your project branch, #2 do your merge commit with "IGNORE BAD COMMIT MESSAGES" in the first line of the commit message (if you already did your merge commit then do |hg qnew && hg qref -e && hg qfinish| and use that as your commit message)
# [03:05] <mwu> really?
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# [03:05] <gps> Unfocused: so, when Sync installs add-ons, it calls AddonRepository.getAddonsByIDs() from Sync land. does this break any assumptions you had?
# [03:06] <Callek> Pike: not code style, commit-message-style
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# [03:06] <Pike> Callek: even more so
# [03:06] <gps> tbsaunde: https://developer.mozilla.org/En/Developer_Guide/Committing_Rules_and_Responsibilities
# [03:06] <tbsaunde> Callek: thx
# [03:06] <Callek> Pike: its an enforced policy/convention
# [03:07] <Callek> Pike: NOT a dvcs problem
# [03:07] <Unfocused> gps: when it *installs*? how come?
# [03:07] <Pike> Callek: as soon as you enforce rules by hooks, your dvcs isn't distributed no more
# [03:07] <tbsaunde> Callek: it sort of is
# [03:08] <gps> that's how we get the AddonInstall
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# [03:08] <Unfocused> oh, right
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# [03:09] <gps> Unfocused: https://github.com/mozilla-services/services-central/blob/master/services/sync/modules/engines/addons.js#L683
# [03:09] <gps> actually, start at https://github.com/mozilla-services/services-central/blob/master/services/sync/modules/engines/addons.js#L895
# [03:10] <Callek> Pike: its dvcs with a central home....
# [03:10] <Callek> Pike: we might be just hung up on conventions of terms though, which is not important enough for me to argue over
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# [03:10] <gps> so, we could potentially short-circuit this sync one-off stuff in Sync, without having to muck with getInstallFromURL
# [03:10] <Unfocused> so....hm :\ maybe daves comment in bug 682356 (comment 5) may also apply here?
# [03:11] <Unfocused> firebot: bug 682356 comment 5
# [03:11] <firebot> Unfocused: Sorry, I've no idea what 'bug 682356 comment 5' might be.
# [03:11] <gps> and also https://github.com/mozilla-services/services-central/blob/master/services/sync/modules/engines/addons.js#L636
# [03:11] <Unfocused> firebot: you suck
# [03:11] * firebot cries
# [03:11] <gps> I've noticed that sometimes the install isn't part of the result
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# [03:12] <Pike> bed time g'night
# [03:12] <gps> and I have to call AddonManager.getInstallForURL explicitly
# [03:12] <Unfocused> orly? would be interested to know why
# [03:12] <lurking_work> firebot bug 682356#5
# [03:12] <firebot> lurking_work: Sorry, I've no idea what 'bug 682356#5' might be.
# [03:12] <lurking_work> pfft
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# [03:13] <lurking_work> firebot bug 682356#c5
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# [03:13] <firebot> lurking_work: Sorry, I've no idea what 'bug 682356#c5' might be.
# [03:13] <Unfocused> i forgot it's meant to make an install for you... been awhile since i messed with some of this stuff
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# [03:14] <lurking_work> firebot bug 682356
# [03:14] <firebot> lurking_work: Sorry, I've no idea what 'bug 682356' might be.
# [03:14] * lurking_work thinks fire-bot has been unhooked from bugzilla or something
# [03:14] <gps> firebot has lost its edge
# [03:14] <firebot> gps: Sorry, I've no idea what 'has lost its edge' might be.
# [03:14] <lurking_work> maybe he was DDoS'ing Bugzilla :P
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# [03:25] <Unfocused> gps: so, i wonder if it's good enough for AMO if this gets the same treatment as the performance data. as in, metadata pings resulting from the background update check are separated from everything else that can cause a metadata ping
# [03:26] <Unfocused> not very granular, but it may not need to be
# [03:26] <Unfocused> you can kill two birds with one stone, that way
# [03:26] <gps> I just posted a comment
# [03:26] <gps> on 708134
# [03:27] <Unfocused> ok cool
# [03:27] * bc is now known as bc|afk
# [03:28] <gps> I'd like to see some requirements from fligtar for metadata then we can iron out what it looks like on the client
# [03:28] <gps> right now everything is in one API and the expectations aren't clear
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# [03:28] <Unfocused> yea :\
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# [03:29] <Unfocused> and that api isn't helping things here...
# [03:29] * Unfocused shakes fist
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# [03:30] <gps> well, now is a good time to fix it since the daily performance data isn't present in it
# [03:31] <jduell> bz: ping
# [03:32] <@bz> jduell: pong
# [03:32] <Unfocused> gps: those two bugs both need to be on aurora?
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# [03:32] <gps> Unfocused: according to fligtar they do
# [03:33] <gps> since I apparently broke precious metrics with add-on sync
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# [03:33] <jduell> bz: is it possible/likely that an FTP channel could be suspended while it's canceled? The docshell is the thing that would do either of those thing (we don't have any observers that could cancel thing AFIACT)
# [03:33] <@bz> jduell: I have no idea about FTP....
# [03:33] <jduell> bz: What sort of things generally suspend channels?
# [03:34] <Unfocused> ok
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# [03:34] <@bz> jduell: the most common case would be the helper app handler code
# [03:34] <@bz> jduell: which iirc suspends the channel while waiting for the user to decide what to do with the data
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# [03:35] <jduell> bz: and if the user just closes the page/dialog, then we'd presumably cancel and unsuspend, in some order.
# [03:35] <@bz> jduell: yes
# [03:35] <@bz> jduell: one sec
# [03:36] <@bz> actually
# [03:36] <@bz> media code also does suspend/resume, looks like
# [03:37] <@bz> See nsMediaStream.cpp
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# [03:40] <jduell> bz: ok, thanks.
# [03:40] <gps> Unfocused: as far as I'm concerned, we're blocked on fligtar for ping work. I think I'm gonna pack it up for the night
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# [03:41] <derf> bz: BTW, xiphmont confirmed the mousemove issue he was complaining about is gone in today's nightly.
# [03:41] <Unfocused> gps: yep
# [03:41] <@bz> derf: ok
# [03:41] <@bz> derf: it'll be back in tomorrow's, likely
# [03:42] <@bz> derf: since I backed that patch out
# [03:42] <@bz> derf: er, no
# [03:42] <@bz> derf: nevermind, I backed out something else
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# [03:42] <@bz> derf: in any case, good to know
# [03:42] * jmaher|afk is now known as jmaher
# [03:43] <jduell> bz: the helper app stuff is all in uriloader/exthandler? Anywhere else?
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# [03:44] <@bz> jduell: I don't see suspend() calls there, which confuses me
# [03:44] <jduell> bz: I don't actually see any calls in that directory to suspend a channel
# [03:44] <jduell> right
# [03:45] <@bz> jduell: Because I was sure we suspended the channel while we figured out what to do with it...
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# [03:46] * @bz notes we have CSP code suspending channels too
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# [03:47] <jduell> bz: OK, I guess I'll just make sure the FTP e10s code handles the "cancel while suspended" case. Some more work, but safer. (Is any code going to be using e10s necko? Did I hear that even tablets will use single-process soon?)
# [03:48] <@bz> ah
# [03:48] <@bz> ok
# [03:48] <@bz> we _used_ to suspend
# [03:48] <@bz> then we switched to a different way of doing something
# [03:48] <@bz> jduell: b2g
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# [03:48] <@bz> jduell: plans to use e10s
# [03:49] <jduell> bz: aha
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# [03:51] * KaiRo still wishes that tablets would stay with the well-working-there XUL UI builds but sees how diverging between tablets and phones within Android that much is problematic
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# [03:53] <njn> mbrubeck: ping
# [03:53] <njn> http://perf.snarkfest.net/compare-talos/index.html?oldRevs=f33f32134b89&newRev=69236a205e63&tests=a11y,tdhtml,tdhtml_nochrome,a11y_paint,tdhtml_paint,tdhtml_nochrome_paint,tp4,tp4_memset,tp4_pbytes,tp4_rss,tp4_shutdown,tp4_xres,tp4m,tp4m_content_rss,tp4m_main_rss,tp4m_main_rss_nochrome,tp4m_nochrome,tp4m_shutdown,tp4m_shutdown_nochrome,tp5,tp5_memset,tp5_pbytes,tp5_rss,tp5_shutdown,tp5_xres,tp5_pa
# [03:53] <njn> int,tp5_memset_paint,tp5_pbytes_paint,tp5_%cpu_paint,tp5_modlistbytes_paint,tp5_rss_paint,tp5_shutdown_paint,tp5_xres_paint,dromaeo_basics,dromaeo_css,dromaeo_dom,dromaeo_jslib,dromaeo_sunspider,dromaeo_v8,tsspider,tsspider_nochrome,tsspider_paint,tsspider_nochrome_paint,v8,tgfx,tgfx_nochrome,tgfx_paint,tgfx_nochrome_paint,tscroll,tsvg,tsvg_opacity,tzoom,ts,ts_paint,ts_cold,ts_cold_generated_max,t
# [03:53] <njn> s_cold_generated_max_shutdown,ts_cold_generated_med,ts_cold_generated_med_shutdown,ts_cold_generated_min,ts_cold_generated_min_shutdown,ts_cold_shutdown,ts_places_generated_max,ts_places_generated_max_shutdown,ts_places_generated_med,ts_places_generated_med_shutdown,ts_places_generated_min,ts_places_generated_min_shutdown,ts_shutdown,twinopen,tpaint&submit=true
# [03:53] <njn> whoops, sorry
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# [03:54] <njn> make that http://bit.ly/zxSvn7
# [03:54] <philor> note to self: after forking that, add support for &tests=all
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# [03:55] <RyanVM> cool, someone broke packaging such that mozutils.dll is missing from the js shell zip package and from dist/firefox (yet somehow is present in the firefox zip package)
# [03:55] <njn> anyone good at comparing Talos results?
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# [03:56] * njn doesn't know if a 357.84% regression on tsvg_opacity on Mac 10.7 is cause for concern (among other things)
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# [03:56] <ewong> joduinn-afk: HK ping
# [03:57] * RyanVM bets the new mozglue.dll has something to do with it...
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# [03:57] <jbuck> RyanVM: bug 716395 ? I'm looking at that now, actually...
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# [03:57] <jbuck> er, 716397 sorry
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# [03:57] <RyanVM> jbuck: could be related
# [03:58] <RyanVM> jbuck: so yeah, mozutils.dll is not being packaged for win32 js shell and needs to be
# [03:58] <RyanVM> also, it's not being copied to dist/firefox during packaging
# [03:58] <RyanVM> but it does end up in the firefox zip package
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# [03:59] <jbuck> I fixed it in https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691876 originally, but I guess another change broke it... do you happen to have a bug # for this mozglue change?
# [03:59] <RyanVM> but this is a recent regression
# [03:59] <RyanVM> that's what I'm looking for now
# [03:59] <RyanVM> give me a sec
# [04:00] <RyanVM> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=701371
# [04:00] <RyanVM> blame glandium
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# [04:00] <jbuck> heh, that'll do it. thanks for finding that!
# [04:02] <RyanVM> hmm, I wonder if I need a clobber
# [04:02] <RyanVM> that may be my issue
# [04:03] <joduinn-afk> ewong: pong
# [04:03] <RyanVM> jbuck: I bet that's my issue
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# [04:04] <RyanVM> jbuck: too late to check tonight, though. I'll try killing my objdir tomorrow and seeing what happens.
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# [04:05] <njn> anyone have experience with dromaeo?
# [04:05] <njn> bz: ping!
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# [04:06] <tbsaunde> RyanVM: I'm pretty sure glandium clobered when he landed that, so very likely it'll fix it
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# [04:07] <RyanVM> tbsaunde: Sounds good. I'll whine and complain tomorrow if it doesn't :P
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# [04:10] <ewong> joduinn-afk: I hear you're coming to HK.. are you here (your blog sounds like you're here already)?
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# [04:10] <tbsaunde> edmorley: if you still around want to get the infr exception on android? I've never been able to find the retrigger button :(
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# [04:10] <ewong> joduinn-afk: esp. that "Deep Water Bay" part
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# [04:11] <joduinn-afk> ewong: yep, I'm already here, mostly recovered from jetlag and a travel-related-cold
# [04:11] * joduinn-afk leaves for Cambodia, and will then be back in HK on 25th
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# [04:11] * joduinn-afk leaves for Cambodia on the 14th, and will then be back in HK on 25th
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# [04:12] <ewong> joduinn-afk: ahh.. well, Welcome to HK!
# [04:12] <ewong> joduinn-afk: just in time for the CNY too
# [04:12] <joduinn-afk> ewong: will you be around on the 26th?
# [04:13] <joduinn-afk> (chinese new year does complicate things I know)
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# [04:13] <ewong> joduinn-afk: yes..
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# [04:13] <ewong> joduinn-afk: fwiw.. I'm part of the SeaMonkey project, but doing some release engineering assisting for Callek
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# [04:14] <joduinn-afk> ewong: ok, cool. lets meet up on the 26th
# [04:14] <ewong> so definitely interested in Releng.. and IT as well :)
# [04:15] <joduinn-afk> ewong: cool. me too
# [04:15] <ewong> joduinn-afk: the facebook page doesn't say where or what time
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# [04:15] <joduinn-afk> one of the things I love about travelling like this is actually getting to meet the human-that-matches-the-irc-nick :-)
# [04:16] <joduinn-afk> ewong: it does have the time (7:30pm until 10:30pm); we dont have a location figured out yet.
# [04:16] <joduinn-afk> do you have any suggestions?
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# [04:17] <ewong> joduinn-afk: not really.. I'm a dev, I don't go out. :p
# [04:18] * edmorley changes topic to 'Bug 701371 needs clobber on all platforms apart from Linux || m-c: OPEN m-i: OPEN || Next aurora uplift: January 31st || If you are new or want to help, see irc://irc.mozilla.org/#introduction || logs: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/'
# [04:18] <edmorley> tbsaunde: done :-)
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# [04:18] <joduinn-afk> ewong: heh. well, we can try to fix that! :-)
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# [04:23] <tbsaunde> edmorley: thx, and sorry
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# [04:23] <edmorley> tbsaunde: don't be sorry! :-)
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# [04:24] <edmorley> tbsaunde: the retrigger is a blue plus sign, lower left, just above the start and end times for the test/build - if that helps?
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# [04:25] <tbsaunde> edmorley: using screen reader, so plus sign doesn't really help, but near end and start times may :)
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# [04:26] <edmorley> tbsaunde: ah sorry didn't realise. the tooltip is "Rebuild" if that helps?
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# [04:27] <edmorley> tbsaunde: image title even
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# [04:27] <edmorley> tbsaunde: anyway is not a problem to retrigger :-)
# [04:28] <tbsaunde> edmorley: hopefully, I'll take a look
# [04:28] <tbsaunde> edmorley: np, no reason you should have known :-)
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# [05:03] <KWierso> Bas: you around?
# [05:03] <Bas> KWierso: Yup
# [05:03] * jmaher is now known as jmaher|afk
# [05:03] <KWierso> Bas: so I flipped the gfx.content.azure.enabled pref to true, then looked at the graphics section of about:support
# [05:04] <Bas> KWierso: Shouldn't say anything special :)
# [05:04] <KWierso> the "AzureBackend" section doesn't match up with the same size as the other sections
# [05:04] <Bas> It never does I think :)
# [05:04] <Bas> It's weird :)
# [05:05] <KWierso> bas: oh, looking at it with the inspect tool, that row is in its own separate <table> element
# [05:05] <Bas> Hehe :)
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# [05:06] <robarnold> bz: ping? have questions about innerWidth/height behavior on mobile (I can't find documentation explaining the various behaviors I'm seeing)
# [05:06] <njn> can I download a 64-bit version of FF9 ? I'm getting offered the 32-bit version
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# [05:06] <nthomas> ehsan: ping
# [05:07] <Jesse> njn: which OS?
# [05:07] <ehsan> nthomas: hi
# [05:07] <KWierso> njn: I think win64 builds don't get released for official releases
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# [05:07] <nthomas> ehsan: howdy. I was wondering if you're merging pretty much every m-c change to profiling straight away
# [05:07] <ehsan> nthomas: I am
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# [05:08] <ehsan> nthomas: well, my script is
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# [05:08] <nthomas> ehsan: what's the reason for that ? Seems like you could do one a day at 6pm Pacific or so
# [05:08] <KWierso> njn: nothing in here: ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/9.0.1/
# [05:09] <ehsan> nthomas: what's the downside?
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# [05:09] <nthomas> ehsan: taking up build machines
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# [05:10] <njn> KWierso: ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/9.0.1/linux-x86_64/en-US/firefox-9.0.1.tar.bz2 ?
# [05:10] <ehsan> nthomas: so the reason I did that was that I was not sure how to get the same code into both m-c and profiling's nightlies
# [05:10] <KWierso> njn: that's the linux 64 builds, those are officially out there.
# [05:10] * KWierso thought you were talking about win64
# [05:11] <njn> KWierso: linux64 is what I want :)
# [05:11] <nthomas> njn - there's a bug on promoting linux64 on mozilla.org/firefox, I don't know why it's never got any traction
# [05:12] <KWierso> wow, they aren't listed there...
# [05:12] <nthomas> ehsan: hmm, that's hard probably. is it that important ?
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# [05:13] <ehsan> nthomas: I'd like to have that invariant given the option, because I want the people who use the profiling nightly to get the same experience as those on m-c nightlies
# [05:13] <jruderman> 64-bit linux builds should at least show up on the "other systems & languages" page, imo
# [05:13] <ehsan> nthomas: so that we can advertize it as an alternative nightly
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# [05:14] <ehsan> nthomas: technically we don't need builds/tests per push on nightly, but apparently buildbot tries to go back and find the last green revision
# [05:14] <nthomas> ehsan: you really caught our config system with a question it don't like :-S
# [05:14] <ehsan> nthomas: so not getting those builds and tests was not an option
# [05:14] <nthomas> yeah
# [05:14] <njn> nthomas: I'm just doing some benchmarking on linux against Opera and Google, both of which are 64-bit
# [05:15] <nthomas> urgh, teh suck
# [05:15] <nthomas> what a waste of cpu time
# [05:15] <ehsan> nthomas: does buildbot also look at test results? or does it just look for green builds?
# [05:15] <nthomas> just compilation
# [05:15] <edmorley> robcee, ttaubert, dietrich, billm, ehsan, rnewman: (think I've got everyone who merges from m-c) your next m-c pull will require clobbering on all platforms apart from Linux, due to the landing of bug 701371 (it merged from inbound to m-c earlier today)
# [05:16] <rnewman> ah, thanks for the headsup, edmorley
# [05:16] <mbrubeck> njn: pong
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# [05:16] <ehsan> edmorley: which m-c revision is that?
# [05:16] <njn> mbrubeck: can you help me interpret http://bit.ly/zxSvn7 ?
# [05:16] <edmorley> ehsan: cf890c9c3e4c
# [05:16] <ehsan> edmorley: cause https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Profiling seems to be fairly green
# [05:17] <mbrubeck> njn: probably not...
# [05:17] <ehsan> edmorley: well, that _is_ on profiling...
# [05:17] <njn> mbrubeck: there's a bunch of numbers, I know not what they mean
# [05:17] <njn> mbrubeck: at this point I'm ready to push and wait if anyone watching tree-mgmt complains
# [05:17] <Callek> edmorley: "next" well that would have been a notice for a while ago :-P
# [05:18] <mbrubeck> njn: If you see anything that looks like it might be a meaningful regression, you could go to http://graphs-new.mozilla.org/graph.html to see numbers for a range of changesets; it might help you figure out what the normal range of values is.
# [05:19] <edmorley> ehsan: I don't know if glandium clobbered some in advance, there are also some periodic clobbers in there; maybe just lucky :-)
# [05:19] <ehsan> heh, yeah maybe
# [05:19] * ehsan so wishes that clobbering instructions lived in the repo and not in people's heads
# [05:21] <edmorley> ehsan: a client.mk constant that gets incremented every time a clobber is required perhaps
# [05:21] <ehsan> edmorley: please!
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# [05:23] <jdm> jcranmer++
# [05:23] <jcranmer|away> jdm: ?
# [05:23] <jdm> the dynamic nspr logging extension looks so useful
# [05:23] <jcranmer|away> oh
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# [05:23] <jcranmer|away> it's all hacked together
# [05:23] <jcranmer|away> you can read the source code to discover how it works
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# [05:24] <jdm> jcranmer|away: will it be possible to direct bug reporters to it and tell them to enable certain logs, then attach the results to the bug?
# [05:24] <jdm> because if so, you deserve more ++
# [05:24] <ewong> jcranmer|away: nice play-by-play on that bug
# [05:25] <jcranmer|away> jdm: I want some more polish features on it first
# [05:25] <jcranmer|away> like explaining what each of the logs actually means
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# [05:25] <jcranmer|away> ewong: thanks
# [05:26] <Jesse> edmorley:i think "increment" isn't quite right. what if two branches both increment the clobber const for different reasons, and then they merge?
# [05:26] <jcranmer|away> jdm: but, in general, that is kind of my goal
# [05:26] <jcranmer|away> (best part is no more need to futz around with stupid environment variables)
# [05:28] <edmorley> Jesse: true
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# [05:28] <Jesse> tbsaunde: looks like we should enable the commit message hook on the accessibility branch?
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# [05:32] <tbsaunde> Jesse: yeah, filed a bug for it :)
# [05:32] <Jesse> tbsaunde: thanks
# [05:33] <nthomas> tbsaunde: http://hg.mozilla.org/hgcustom/hghooks/file/default/mozhghooks/treeclosure.py will need updating
# [05:33] <nthomas> oh, n/m
# [05:33] <nthomas> different hook
# [05:33] <Callek> nthomas: well that hook would be useful for fridays closure anyway
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# [05:34] <Callek> but yea, enabling http://hg.mozilla.org/hgcustom/hghooks/file/default/mozhghooks/commit-message.py is what they were talking about -- and needs no code changes
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# [05:54] <njn> is Nightly horribly busted? Sunspider isn't working for me
# [05:54] <njn> the page isn't even loading properly
# [05:58] <mwu> njn: wfm on osx 12.0a1 (2012-01-10)
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# [06:03] <njn> mwu: it was something to do with the profile -- the problem manifesed with FF9 with the same profile, and went away with a differnt profile
# [06:03] <njn> weird
# [06:04] <njn> mwu: no, wait, now FF12 is screwing up in a different way
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# [06:05] <mwu> weird
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# [06:06] <njn> mwu: with another new profile it's now fixed
# [06:07] <njn> extraweird
# [06:07] <njn> "The page you are trying to view cannot be shown because it uses an invalid or unsupported form of compression." WTF does that mean?
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# [06:16] <Mook> hmm, how big's a mac build tree (src+obj) these days?
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# [06:17] <mattwoodrow> Mook: 3.5gb ish for a debug build for me
# [06:17] <@bz> njn: it means that it claimed to be gzipped but the data is not valid gzipped data, say
# [06:17] <Mook> mattwoodrow: thanks :)
# [06:17] <@bz> njn: or it claimed to be compressed with an algorithm we don't support
# [06:17] <philor> 3.39 for an opt, but that's x64, not universal
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# [06:40] <jaws> ehsan++
# [06:40] <jaws> ehsan: thank you for providing a patch for bug 171237 \o/
# [06:40] <ehsan> jaws: that was fast :)
# [06:41] <jaws> my inbox count incremented :)
# [06:41] <ehsan> jaws: I have always said that if you want to get something done, you should get the right people pissed off just enough ;)
# [06:41] <jaws> hehe, that is so true
# [06:41] <ehsan> worked in this case :)
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# [06:43] <jdm> ehsan++
# [06:43] <jdm> you are the best
# [06:44] <ehsan> jdm: funny thing, I opened up vim and looked around in order to get a short summary of what needs to be done for this bug
# [06:44] <ehsan> in order to mark it as [mentor=ehsan]
# [06:44] <ehsan> then I said to my self
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# [06:44] <ehsan> $%&^%^! let's just get it fixed :)
# [06:44] <jdm> :D
# [06:44] <ehsan> jdm: system works I guess
# [06:44] <jaws> :D
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# [06:45] <ehsan> ok folks, time to get some sleep in me
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# [06:46] <jlebar|away> gerv|dinner, Can you please give editbugs to :rclick when you get a chance?
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# [06:46] <philor> ehsan: before you go...
# [06:46] <ehsan> philor: ?
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# [06:47] <philor> should I be surprised that something has already finished in a non-clean fashion on your non-clean fashion push?
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# [06:47] <ehsan> philor: bah, lemme look
# [06:48] <philor> I mean, of course I'm not surprised that something does, but that was a little sooner than I expected to actually see it :)
# [06:48] <jdm> jlebar|away: I'm on it
# [06:48] <jlebar|away> jdm, thanks!
# [06:48] <ehsan> philor: problem is that lots of this stuff happens intermittently :(
# [06:48] <ehsan> I've done 5-6 try runs but apparently did not get them all
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# [06:48] <ehsan> philor: I'll backout
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# [06:49] * philor backspaces
# [06:49] <philor> I was willing to retrigger some, and file it if it looked tolerably low frequency, if you'd rather
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# [06:49] <ehsan> philor: if you were around and noticed more such failures, would you mind commenting on the bug with links to the log?
# [06:49] <ehsan> philor: we could do that as well, with me promising to look at those bugs tomorrow
# [06:50] <ehsan> philor: sounds like a plan? :)
# [06:50] <philor> yep, that works
# [06:50] <ehsan> awesome
# [06:50] <ehsan> thanks :)
# [06:50] <ehsan> philor: (the thing which my patch protects against is so bad that I'm willing to postpone handling the fallout to after landing, sorry for the inconvenience :/ )
# [06:51] <philor> ehsan: yeah, understood, that was why I didn't much want you backing out over just one
# [06:51] <ehsan> thanks :)
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# [06:55] <philor> I wouldn't want to suggest that it put a part it doesn't have in a part it doesn't have, or that it pull one out of one it lacks
# [06:56] <nigelb> so much hate for Asa on wired.
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# [06:58] <jaws> he's always taking one for the team
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# [06:58] <jaws> but sometimes he puts himself out there and asks for it
# [07:00] <nigelb> Heh.
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# [07:15] <philor> mmm, https://tbpl.mozilla.org/php/getParsedLog.php?id=8468888&tree=Mozilla-Inbound is filled with awesome
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# [07:20] <philor> and to my great shock, and the bottom of the pile of awesome is a setTimeout
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# [07:21] <jdm> ugh
# [07:21] <jdm> in attempting to write a test to demonstrate a bug, I exposed another bug
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# [07:21] <jdm> and the fix for the first doesn't fix this one
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# [07:24] <kyungtae_kim> Hi, I'm looking for a simple browser source using Gecko and not using XUL UI. Where could I get that? OS is Linux. I analyzed Android fennec source, but it's complex because Java & C++ are mixed, so only C++ source needed.
# [07:25] <mbrubeck> kyungtae_kim: Hmm, there's the MicroB browser for Nokia Maemo devices...
# [07:25] <mbrubeck> I'm not familiar with its code
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# [07:38] <KWierso> kyungtae_kim: epiphany used to use gecko and was non-XUL, but I think they switched to webkit a few years ago
# [07:39] <jdm> does anybody know if it's possible to create a mochitest that uses multiple tabs?
# [07:39] <jdm> window.open interferes with the test I want to run
# [07:39] <jdm> I need two unrelated windows to open
# [07:40] <kbrosnan> mozmill could cover that afik
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# [07:41] <KWierso> kyungtae_kim: this page's examples list has a few things listed for Linux. Not sure if they use XUL or not, though: https://developer.mozilla.org/en/Roll_your_own_browser_-_An_embedding_HowTo
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# [07:50] <philor> why do we still have that ancient junk in the tree rules about "You must check the tree before pushing, and watch the tree for failures after pushing."?
# [07:51] <jdm> just to catch people unawares
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# [07:51] <tbsaunde> philor: because we like to d dream?
# [07:52] <philor> oh, it's so we can make fun of people who star their own!
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# [08:05] <kyungtae_kim> Can I use libxul without using .xul file? Android port do that but I can't understand how to do that.
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# [08:24] <glandium> browserid looks nice, but I get no validation link in the email it sends me
# [08:26] <glandium> ah, got it
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# [08:27] <squib> my biggest issue with browserid is that MDN always forgets who i am :(
# [08:28] <squib> but that's probably not a browserid issue as such
# [08:31] <glandium> mdn has only made it half way... it had me create an actual mdn account when i wanted to edit a content. then i signed off and to sign in, i had to create a browserid account because it uses nothing else
# [08:33] <Callek> is make_libmar l10n nightly failures known from yesterdays nightly?
# [08:34] <Callek> and/or is it seamonkey only?
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# [08:41] <glandium> Callek: could it be related to the mozglue thing?
# [08:42] <Callek> glandium: not sure, maybe -- I thought Pike was talking about l10n failures
# [08:42] <Callek> I'll look tomorrow or day after for sure
# [08:42] <Callek> :-)
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# [08:43] <glandium> Callek: aki had l10n failures, but it seems he was trying to use a new packager.mk with an old build
# [08:43] <glandium> maybe l10n nightlies are doing that
# [08:44] <Callek> glandium: that could certainly have been the issue, i'll wait till tomorrow/day after and check and figure it out from there
# [08:45] <glandium> Callek: i kind of remember something like this having been a problem in the past
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# [08:47] * philor points at rnewman's bright colors and laughs
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# [08:50] <nigelb> Is that the android?
# [08:51] <philor> nah, that was boring mono-color, the windows need-for-clobber is much more colorful
# [08:52] <nigelb> oh, services-central?
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# [08:57] <philor> yeah, I like the green - orange - purple - red effect :)
# [08:57] <nigelb> heh
# [08:57] <nigelb> It is fairly well-coloured :D
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# [08:59] <glazou> bonjour
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# [09:15] <rnewman> philor: believe it or not, I did hit clobber! guess those were already running
# [09:15] <rnewman> alas
# [09:15] <rnewman> and no new landings on m-c for me to pull!
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# [09:16] <rnewman> thanks for starring, anyway :D
# [09:16] <philor> rnewman: I just retriggered the build, after I saw you had clobbered a hair too late
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# [09:16] <rnewman> \o/
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# [09:17] <philor> we're both sure that's it and all it is, but we'll be more sure with visible green
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# [09:18] <rnewman> nigelb: it sure is pretty to have three failing XUL Fennec builds on every push, though, isn't it?
# [09:18] <nigelb> rnewman: Totally :D
# [09:19] <khuey> somebody should toss a -j1 into fennec's mozconfig
# [09:19] <rnewman> heh
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# [09:24] <ewong> khuey: weren't you on a holiday?
# [09:24] <nigelb> someone kline him :P
# [09:26] <Ms2ger> Nah, just on the nice side of the atlantic
# [09:26] <khuey> ewong: I'm working today
# [09:26] <khuey> probably tomorrow
# [09:26] <khuey> taking days off here and there
# [09:26] <nigelb> haha, "nice side of the atlantic"
# [09:26] <nigelb> Ms2ger++
# [09:26] <darktrojan> heh
# [09:26] <Ms2ger> :)
# [09:26] * Ms2ger lands
# [09:27] <glazou> I don't know if it's nice but it's awake :-)
# [09:27] <khuey> yeah
# [09:27] <khuey> I should go sleep off some more of the jetlag
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# [09:27] <ewong> ohh I see..
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# [09:27] <nigelb> just try and stay awake for today and you should reset your clock.
# [09:28] <philor> isn't there something besides -j1 that you can stick in just a makefile somewhere above the troubled parts?
# [09:28] <glandium> philor: -j1 under mobile, probably
# [09:28] <khuey> $(error this is going to break anyways) ?
# [09:28] <khuey> :-P
# [09:29] <philor> .NOTPARALLEL: was what I was thinking of
# [09:29] <khuey> oh, right
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# [09:29] <khuey> hmm, maybe we should do that
# [09:29] <glandium> the other solution is to stop doing cross directory dependencies in makefiles
# [09:30] <khuey> well, yes
# [09:32] <philor> spoken like someone who isn't cc'ed on the bug
# [09:32] <philor> yet...
# [09:32] <khuey> indeed
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# [09:33] <ewong> which bug's that? (just out of curiosity)
# [09:33] <Ms2ger> ewong, I'll cc you :)
# [09:33] <ewong> Ms2ger: it's ok..really..
# [09:33] <khuey> 714553
# [09:33] <philor> should do it with a review request, that's a really subtle way to shove starring spam down someone's throat :)
# [09:33] <Ms2ger> philor++
# [09:33] <khuey> philor: btw I like how you started pasting logs again once we reached an impasse
# [09:34] <ewong> wow.. this is another semi-long bug
# [09:34] <philor> I don't admit it often, but I will shut up when people are actually working
# [09:35] <Ms2ger> philor, you realize this channel is logged, right ;)
# [09:36] <Ms2ger> Hmm, a 3280-byte leak
# [09:36] <glandium> philor: the interesting thing is that a similar bug on native fennec has been fixed
# [09:36] <darktrojan> if they're working they don't have time to read irc logs
# [09:37] <darktrojan> (oi you, get back to work)
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# [09:37] <Ms2ger> :)
# [09:37] <ewong> "Oh sure. I would've fixed that bug anytime... provided I understand what's going on.. :P"
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# [09:40] * Ms2ger usually doesn't understand what's going on in his bugs
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# [09:40] <ewong> "surely you jest"
# [09:42] <ewong> "black magic voodoo".. ya gotta love the comments in bugs like these...
# [09:42] <Ms2ger> Well, er, welcome to Mozilla :)
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# [09:45] <ewong> then again.. I'd say the same thing when looking at Makefile patches.. "black magic Makefile voodoo"
# [09:46] <hsivonen> sigh. still a failing unit test for bookmark import
# [09:46] <khuey> "Hardcore crypto action"
# [09:46] * khuey got a good laugh out of that
# [09:46] <ewong> khuey I dare ask.. bug #714553 is about a race condition?
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# [09:47] <khuey> yes
# [09:47] <ewong> thus philor's asking of -j1
# [09:48] <philor> more of a threat, really
# [09:48] <hsivonen> looks like I need to learn to run xpcshell tests individually
# [09:48] <ewong> ok.. umm "thus philor's threat of -j1"
# [09:49] <glandium> hey i think i have the right fix for that bug
# [09:50] <hsivonen> how nice. xpcshell has different makefile conventions that various mochitests
# [09:50] <hsivonen> *than
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# [09:51] <khuey> xpcshell has different everything conventions than mochitest
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# [09:52] <darktrojan> SOLO_FILE=basename.js make -C objdir/path/to/dir check-one
# [09:52] <darktrojan> hsivonen, ^
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# [09:54] <hsivonen> darktrojan: thanks
# [09:56] * glob *sigh*
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# [10:00] <darktrojan> jhford, ping?
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# [10:00] <darktrojan> what's the matter glob, run out of work to do?
# [10:00] <glob> darktrojan, haha :)
# [10:01] <darktrojan> :-P
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# [10:18] <ewong> err.. what happened to the Windows build instructions? https://wiki.mozilla.org/Mobile/Fennec/Android_OtherBuildEnvs#Windows
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# [10:19] <ewong> I guess I should've asked that in #mobile
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# [10:23] <glandium> ewong: has that ever been actually possible?
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# [10:24] <ewong> glandium: it has.. or at least it was possible last year.. in July..
# [10:25] <ewong> or maybe I was mistaken?
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# [10:27] <khuey> ewong: are you looking to compile (on windows) a fennec that runs on windows or a fennec that runs on android
# [10:27] <ewong> khuey: compiling to run on Windows (at least IIRC, it was under some simulated environment)
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# [10:28] <khuey> ewong: xul fennec can be built to run on windows
# [10:28] <khuey> ewong: native fennec can't
# [10:28] <ewong> ah.. maybe my mozconfig file needs adjustments
# [10:30] <philor> actually, xul fennec can't, unless someone fixed it since one of the flurry of patches to get Win PGO working broke it
# [10:30] <ewong> well it's not building because of some sdk level issue
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# [10:31] <philor> I think it was the media one, but since desktop fennec had been made nightly-only, it was no longer possible to build it on try, which made it no longer tier 1, so despite the fact that we're still burning it hidden every night, it's dead and gone
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# [10:33] <ewong> ok. that explains the empty build instructions for Windows
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# [10:36] <hsivonen> hmm. test_browserGlue_smartBookmarks.js deliberately foils async nsBrowserGlue initialization
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# [10:38] * darktrojan is considering writing a "just run this damn test" script that figures out the magic words to use
# [10:38] <darktrojan> is this useful?
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# [10:39] <hsivonen> darktrojan: yes
# [10:40] <ewong> darktrojan: Heck yeah!
# [10:40] <darktrojan> I thought so, wonder why we don't have one
# [10:41] <hsivonen> grr. there are more tests that deliberately bypass the observers that nsBrowserGlue has for tracking initialization
# [10:41] <darktrojan> heh
# [10:42] <ewong> darktrojan: probably no one felt the urge great enough to do it.. :)
# [10:42] <darktrojan> ewong, I'm hoping the reason isn't "it's damn difficult"
# [10:43] <ewong> darktrojan: same thing with bugs, I believe :)
# [10:43] <darktrojan> heh
# [10:43] <darktrojan> I probably run unit tests more than a lot of people :-/
# [10:43] <ewong> darktrojan: yeah.. "it's damn difficult" is another possible reason.. i.e. change our build configs to use autoconf 2.56+
# [10:43] <darktrojan> mostly because I'm really good at cocking it up \o/
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# [10:45] <ewong> tests? what tests? ;P
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# [10:48] <darktrojan> huh. /me just discovered python does string concatenation without an operator
# [10:49] <ewong> darktrojan: ??
# [10:49] <edmorley> dholbert|afk: sorry to say it but inbound is looking a little toasty :-)
# [10:49] <darktrojan> "a" "b" == "ab"
# [10:49] <ewong> ahh like C strings
# [10:49] <darktrojan> needless to say that wasn't what I wanted
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# [10:52] <glandium> dholbert|afk: looks like the compiler bug was not triggered by warning on errors after all
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# [10:53] <glandium> edmorley: i was about to push, do you want me to backout?
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# [11:02] <edmorley> glandium: sorry was making a cup of tea; I have the backout queued, thanks anyway :-0
# [11:02] <edmorley> :-) even
# [11:03] <glandium> edmorley: do you backout both?
# [11:03] <edmorley> glandium: yeah
# [11:03] <glandium> perfect :)
# [11:05] <edmorley> glandium: done
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# [11:06] <mib_3am1pm> hi
# [11:08] <edmorley> hi :-)
# [11:08] <mib_3am1pm> I'm looking for a way to add active digitizer pen support of the new tablets to the browser events
# [11:08] <mib_3am1pm> something like mousemove or touchmove
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# [11:08] <mib_3am1pm> but for the new pens of the tablets
# [11:09] <glandium> edmorley: thanks
# [11:10] <mib_3am1pm> do you think it have to be an html5 standard or the browser could support it before?
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# [11:15] <edmorley> mib_3am1pm: this channel gets a lot busier during pacific working hours, hopefully someone will be around later who can answer that for you
# [11:17] <micadeyeye> I have problem pulling the mozilla source. see http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1444640
# [11:17] <micadeyeye> what could be wrong please?
# [11:18] <Ms2ger> Are you on a slow connection?
# [11:18] <mib_3am1pm> edmorley: I'm trying on the mobile channel. probably is more appropriate for my kind of question
# [11:18] <micadeyeye> Ms2ger, not really
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# [11:18] <glob> micadeyeye, network instability gets my vote
# [11:19] <micadeyeye> okay. should i using hg clone....
# [11:19] <Ms2ger> I'd try a bundle, but I have no idea where the links for that are
# [11:19] <edmorley> micadeyeye: downloading as a bundle helps some people https://developer.mozilla.org/en/Mozilla_Source_Code_%28Mercurial%29#Bundles
# [11:19] <micadeyeye> ?
# [11:19] <Ms2ger> edmorley++
# [11:19] * glandium hopes the second push won't be coalesced
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# [11:19] <edmorley> glandium: only tests are coalesced at present
# [11:20] <Ms2ger> Really?
# [11:20] <glandium> edmorley: wow, since when?
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# [11:22] <edmorley> Bug 684436
# [11:23] <NeilAway> jdm: how about a browser-chrome test?
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# [11:45] <darktrojan> okay, so far my script can run single xpcshell and mochitests
# [11:46] <darktrojan> and a dir of xpcshell tests
# [11:46] <darktrojan> that covers 90% of the stuff I use
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# [11:49] <edmorley> ship it!
# [11:49] <darktrojan> k
# [11:50] <glob> don't you need to write testcases first :P
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# [11:52] <darktrojan> get out
# [11:52] <darktrojan> oh you did
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# [11:52] <nigelb> heh
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# [12:00] <edmorley> :-)
# [12:00] <darktrojan> hmm, this may not be the smartest script ever written but it works
# [12:00] <edmorley> sounds like most of the build system
# [12:00] <darktrojan> for various values of "works"
# [12:02] <@smaug> jlebar|away will kick me
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# [12:17] <Ms2ger> smaug, what'd you do now? :)
# [12:18] <@smaug> Ms2ger: well, he designed an API, and I already started to review it...but...maybe I want some different kind of API after all
# [12:18] <Ms2ger> :)
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# [12:20] <micadeyeye> I want to add firefox/fennec to a Media Center (MC) application, such as geexbox and xbmc. I would have to build both apps (say Firefox & Geexbox) from source. To help one add packages to the MC, the MC app itself has a script that generates some files that could be used to build a package. The files are install, build, installdev and meta; their contents can be found here http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1444643. What I want to do is
# [12:20] <micadeyeye> copy the build&make contents in the mozilla source to them. After that, I would build the MC itself, which will pull the FF source and build it alongside. Please advice if it would work.
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# [12:36] <roc> edmorley: what do I do to stop inbound-mergers from closing a bug that's not complete?
# [12:37] <Ms2ger> Mention it in the comment and the whiteboard
# [12:42] <roc> what is the correct term?
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# [12:42] <roc> [please don't close this bug after merging to inbound]?
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# [12:46] <darktrojan> ewong, hsivonen: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1444672
# [12:47] <darktrojan> (woo)
# [12:47] <ewong> nice!
# [12:47] <darktrojan> oh, I missed a bit
# [12:48] <darktrojan> http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1444674
# [12:50] <darktrojan> need to work out how to find the objdir next
# [12:51] <hsivonen> darktrojan: cool
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# [12:51] <hsivonen> the old HTML parser has lots of dead code these days...
# [12:52] <darktrojan> burn it
# [12:52] <darktrojan> burn it all
# [12:52] <hsivonen> I'm on it...
# [12:52] <hsivonen> too bad that it's hard to zap it all in one go thanks to about:blank and the sharing with the XML code path
# [12:52] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
# [12:52] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
# [12:53] <darktrojan> oh btw hsivonen, I filed this https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=713479
# [12:53] <darktrojan> hoping you'll get a chance to fix it :)
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# [12:55] <hsivonen> darktrojan: yeah... always stuff to fix...
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# [12:55] <Ms2ger> hsivonen, I'm always interested in removing dead code ;)
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# [13:01] <hsivonen> Ms2ger: I already made patches :-/
# [13:01] <Ms2ger> Oh, even better :)
# [13:02] * hsivonen tries to keep the patches quick to review by avoiding + lines in the patches :-)
# [13:03] <darktrojan> heh
# [13:04] * AutomatedTester is now known as AutomatedTester|W3
# [13:06] <darktrojan> added reftests
# [13:06] <darktrojan> I think that just about covers all the tests I ever use
# [13:07] <hsivonen> hmm. so currently, we have blocking state in the parser and the parser-blocking script in the script loader
# [13:07] <Ms2ger> Stick it in hg somewhere? :)
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# [13:08] <Ms2ger> Did evilpie land his ScriptLoader/type parsing patch already?
# [13:09] <hsivonen> I wonder if it would be worthwhile to remove to duplication and make the parser ask nsScriptLoader whether there's a parser-blocking script
# [13:09] <hsivonen> Ms2ger: I don't know what patch that is
# [13:09] <Ms2ger> A bit of cleanup
# [13:10] <Ms2ger> Bug 714635, in bz's queue
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# [13:12] <darktrojan> here, you can laugh at my lack of python skills now :) http://hg.mozilla.org/users/geoff_darktrojan.net/scripts/file/ae76509807e4/runtest.py
# [13:12] <darktrojan> or alternatively, download and use what I created
# [13:12] <darktrojan> ewong, ^
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# [13:14] <hsivonen> darktrojan: thank you
# [13:14] <Ms2ger> Lovely
# [13:15] <hsivonen> hmm. I guess I'll settle for refactoring parser unblocking for now and will file a follow-up about removing the need to block the parser explicitly
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# [13:17] <@smaug> hsivonen: so removing that stuff from nsHTMLDocument::EndLoad() doesn't change behavior?
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# [13:19] <@smaug> hsivonen: in cases like: loading page ... <script> document.write("asdf"); spin_event_loop(); document.write("adf");</script>
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# [13:22] <hsivonen> smaug: why would it change anything in that case? ::EndLoad() isn't called when the event loop spins in your example,because the end of stream hasn't been reached
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# [13:23] <@smaug> hsivonen: just wanted to make sure HTML5 parser doesn't continue processing in such case
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# [13:26] <hsivonen> smaug: does spin_event_loop() mean a nested loop?
# [13:27] <@smaug> no
# [13:27] <@smaug> well, nested loop
# [13:27] <@smaug> hmm
# [13:27] <@smaug> well, kind of
# [13:27] <@smaug> there is nested while(some_event_loop_events) dosomething;
# [13:28] <@smaug> hsivonen: I mean case like showModalDialog
# [13:28] <@smaug> hsivonen: do you know what has regressed bug 98654 ?
# [13:29] <hsivonen> smaug: I don't know what regressed it
# [13:29] <hsivonen> smaug: anyway, if ::EndLoad() was previously reached in your example, we'd already be in equal trouble
# [13:30] <hsivonen> smaug: all tests stay green with the patch
# [13:31] <hsivonen> if there are cases that aren't being tested...
# [13:32] <hsivonen> anyway, our nested event loops are fundamentally broken. I don't think it makes sense to work around the fundamental brokenness more carefully
# [13:32] <hsivonen> it would make sense to fix the fundamental brokenness
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# [13:32] <khuey> uh, did somebody mess with firefox's terminal behavior on windows?
# [13:32] <hsivonen> (by introducing separate event queues for each mutually reachable docshell constellation)
# [13:33] <khuey> now when I restart a debug build it pops up a separate terminal
# [13:33] <@smaug> hsivonen: what is wrong with our showModalDialog handling?
# [13:33] <hsivonen> smaug: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=637264
# [13:33] * @smaug isn't sure HTML spec
# [13:33] <@smaug> 's event loops etc handling is correct
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# [13:34] <hsivonen> smaug: well, Gecko's sure isn't correct
# [13:34] <@smaug> alert and xhr sure are wrong
# [13:34] <@smaug> but that is different thing
# [13:34] <@smaug> I was careful to not mention those
# [13:34] <hsivonen> oh. then I don't know how showModalDialog works
# [13:34] <@smaug> (sync xhr)
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# [13:36] <@smaug> hsivonen: showModalDialog works close to how alert works in Gecko
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# [13:38] <@smaug> IIRC chrome has buggy showModalDialog, but Opera and IE, and maybe even Safari has a ok one
# [13:38] <@smaug> though, I haven't tested lately
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# [13:39] <@smaug> (and Gecko has ok showModalDialog too)
# [13:40] <hsivonen> which reminds me that in another patch, I need to add a bit of complexity to avoid tickling alert/sync-xhr brokenness :-(
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# [13:51] <khuey> hsivonen: I'm beginning to share your distaste for old observery netscape code
# [13:52] <hsivonen> khuey: what code are you looking at?
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# [13:52] <khuey> hsivonen: nsDocument::AddCharsetObserver
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# [13:54] <hsivonen> khuey: have fun ;-)
# [13:54] <khuey> :-P
# [13:55] <Ms2ger> For some weird value of fun
# [13:55] <@smaug> I thought khuey would be on vacation. Though, as I said, that would probably mean staying online only 8h/day
# [13:56] <khuey> I'm currently sleeping off jetlag/sickness
# [13:56] <khuey> so I figure if I'm not going to have any fun anyways I can track down this bug
# [13:57] <@smaug> being sick while traveling :(
# [13:57] <derf> khuey: You type pretty well for someone who's sleeping.
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# [13:58] <khuey> derf: I've exhausted my capability to sleep for the moment
# [13:58] * khuey has been asleep for most of the previous 14 hours
# [13:58] <derf> I have that problem a lot.
# [13:58] <khuey> heh
# [13:58] <Ms2ger> Can't sleep, editor will eat me
# [13:58] <khuey> I also am physically incapable of sleeping more than 7 hours at one time
# [13:58] <khuey> which is kind of annoying
# [13:59] <derf> I can sleep up to 9, but that's unusual.
# [13:59] <@smaug> nsPropertyTable is... rather annoying data structure
# [13:59] * khuey plays the CVS archaeology game
# [13:59] <derf> For some reason people find it surprising that I have a limit at all.
# [14:01] <khuey> !seen smontagu
# [14:01] <firebot> smontagu was last seen 1 day, 17 hours, 29 minutes and 13 seconds ago, saying 'tomer: try unicode-bidi: -moz-plaintext' in #mozilla.il.
# [14:01] * khuey wonders if he remembers reviewing this code 10 years ago
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# [14:02] <Ms2ger> He certainly doesn't remember reviewing my weeks-old patches
# [14:02] <Ms2ger> Because he didn't
# [14:04] <gabor> smaug: I converted your test_overlapping_transaction idbtest to an xpcshell test, and it happens to finish too early some times... I think it would fix if I added some more grabEventAndContinueHandler like http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/dom/indexedDB/test/unit/test_overlapping_transactions.js?force=1#79 (for each transaction) and some more yields ofc at line 83
# [14:04] <khuey> bz_sleep: ping :-)
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# [14:05] <gabor> smaug: do you think that the test would still be valid after that change?
# [14:05] <@smaug> gabor: my test?
# [14:05] <@smaug> really, have I added an indexeddb test?
# [14:05] <khuey> gabor: you should be asking sicking ;-)
# [14:05] <gabor> whoops
# [14:06] <gabor> memory failure on my part
# [14:06] <gabor> nevermind that :)
# [14:06] <Ms2ger> Both s-somethings, who knows the difference?
# [14:07] <gabor> khuey: do you know which time zone is sicking?
# [14:07] <gabor> Ms2ger: figures...
# [14:07] <Ms2ger> Pacific
# [14:07] <khuey> yes
# [14:08] <khuey> probably at least 5 hours before he's around
# [14:09] <gabor> I think then I'll just fie a patch and ask for a review...
# [14:09] <gabor> by the way khuey, is there a office in Germany
# [14:09] <Ms2ger> Planned
# [14:09] <Ms2ger> And some wfh'ers
# [14:10] <gabor> Mozilla office I mean just hit the enter too early...
# [14:10] <khuey> gabor: I think we have plans for one in berlin
# [14:10] <gabor> hmm... that would be the closest office for me :)
# [14:10] <khuey> it's still a while off though
# [14:10] <khuey> London is next, I think
# [14:11] <Ms2ger> hg qpo
# [14:11] <khuey> gabor: aren't you in hungary?
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# [14:12] <gabor> khuey: yes I am but Berlin is still closer than Paris I think...
# [14:12] <gabor> only about 8-10 hours with car :)
# [14:12] <khuey> oh, sure
# [14:12] <khuey> but it's still pretty far ;-)
# [14:12] <Ms2ger> What's the closest office to South Fla? Toronto?
# [14:13] <khuey> yeah
# [14:13] <gabor> yeah... I'm affraid Hungary is not in the top section on that list
# [14:14] <khuey> Ms2ger: Air Canada flies direct from West Palm Beach to Toronto too
# [14:14] <khuey> it's 1500 miles to Toronto, 3000 miles to SF
# [14:15] <khuey> from my parents house
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# [14:16] <Ms2ger> Hmm, I didn't realize that the Bahamas where that close
# [14:17] <khuey> you could swim there
# [14:18] <khuey> I wouldn't recommend it
# [14:18] <khuey> but it's possible
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# [14:40] <ttaubert> khuey: you're in Germany?
# [14:41] <@smaug> PL_DHashTable is such a mysterious API
# [14:41] <khuey> ttaubert: I am
# [14:41] <khuey> smaug: hence the multiple layers of wrappers on top
# [14:41] <ttaubert> khuey: cool, welcome! :)
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# [14:41] <khuey> thank you
# [14:42] <MarcoZ> dao: Re your comment in bug 714976, I believe the patch does have reviews, the last one was just to address review comments.
# [14:42] <mounir> khuey: hi
# [14:43] <Ms2ger> khuey, get out already
# [14:43] <dao> MarcoZ: yet there's a review request. If it's not needed, it should be removed
# [14:43] <khuey> :-P
# [14:43] <mounir> khuey: do I need to talk to you for landing large amount of C++?
# [14:43] <khuey> maybe
# [14:43] <khuey> what are you landing?
# [14:44] <mounir> khuey: I would like to land WebSMS and Network API soon (aka in less than 24 hours)
# [14:44] <MarcoZ> dao: Oops didn't see that before. Yeah we'll let hub clear this up first and then re-request checkin.
# [14:44] <mounir> it's a fair amount of C++ (especially WebSMS)
# [14:45] <khuey> is it enabled on windows?
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# [14:46] <mounir> khuey: the api is visible on windows
# [14:46] <khuey> ok, you should do a pgo build on try
# [14:46] <khuey> and we can look at the before/after memory usage
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# [14:47] <mounir> glandium: elfhack is working on Android?
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# [14:48] <mounir> khuey: mk_add_options MOZ_PGO=1
# [14:48] <Yoric> jmaher|afk: ping
# [14:48] <mounir> right?
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# [14:49] <glandium> mounir: yes
# [14:49] <khuey> mounir: something like that
# [14:49] <glandium> mounir: for pgo, too, yes
# [14:52] <mounir> glandium: does this error while loading ring any bell? http://mounir.pastebin.mozilla.org/1444801
# [14:52] <glandium> mounir: clobber
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# [14:52] <mounir> :'(
# [14:52] <jmaher> Yoric: pong
# [14:53] <glandium> mounir: or if you want to do something faster, remove all .so files in the objdir
# [14:53] <Yoric> Hi
# [14:53] <glandium> mounir: and rebuild, that'll be enough
# [14:53] <mounir> glandium++
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# [14:57] <edmorley> roc: adding something with the string"leave open" to the whiteboard ideally (https://wiki.mozilla.org/Tree_Rules/Inbound#Please_do_the_following_after_pushing_to_inbound) since the script I want to create to automate the currently manual marking process will be looking for that
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# [14:58] <edmorley> mounir: topic :-)
# [14:59] <edmorley> glandium: maybe needs a dev.tree-management post?
# [14:59] <mounir> edmorley: any news about this script btw?
# [14:59] <Ms2ger> Did you look into cdleary's script?
# [14:59] <mounir> edmorley: who reads that?
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# [14:59] <edmorley> Ms2ger: it will be the first thing I do when I make a window for working on this
# [15:00] <edmorley> Ms2ger: maybe it might do everything already and save me the hassle :-)
# [15:00] <Ms2ger> Good :)
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# [15:00] <glandium> edmorley: sounds fair, but like mounir said, does it reach enough people?
# [15:00] <edmorley> probably not
# [15:01] <mounir> cross-posting to platform maybe?
# [15:02] * glob|away is now known as glob
# [15:03] <glandium> okay let's do that
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# [15:07] <hsivonen> I wish we could get rid of interface ids now that binary extensions break between versions anyway
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# [15:08] <Yoric> hsivonen: well, we would need some mechanism to prevent extensions from attempting to use an interface whose API has changed.
# [15:09] <khuey> how would QI work then?
# [15:09] <Yoric> (or, more precisely, to report the breakage nicely)
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# [15:09] <Yoric> khuey: I thought that QI was a bug, not a feature :)
# [15:10] <mounir> khuey: btw, are you enjoying the beer?
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# [15:12] <khuey> mounir: haven't had much yet
# [15:12] <hsivonen> khuey: dunno. I expected it could work by C++ compile time class name symbol matching
# [15:12] * khuey got in and went to sleep last night
# [15:12] <hsivonen> is the tryserver broken for linux64 or did I break my patches?
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# [15:13] * hsivonen goes read the bug from the topic
# [15:13] <@smaug> khuey: ping
# [15:13] <@smaug> khuey: how does indexeddb store files ?
# [15:13] <hsivonen> ok. probably my patch is broken
# [15:14] <khuey> smaug: you should ask janv
# [15:14] <khuey> :-)
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# [15:14] <@smaug> janv: ping
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# [15:18] <askalski> hi, how to register a nickname in IRC?
# [15:18] <bhearsum> /msg nickserv register [password]
# [15:19] <hsivonen> IIRC, you also need to connect via ssl
# [15:19] <askalski> hmm, I'm using xchat, totally new to IRC
# [15:19] <askalski> what should I do?
# [15:19] <hsivonen> I know nothing about xchat
# [15:19] <askalski> ok, how to do it other way?
# [15:20] <askalski> I should do ssh/telnet somewhere or what?
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# [15:20] <Ms2ger> Nah
# [15:20] <Ms2ger> Network list -> edit -> Use SSL
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# [15:21] <Ms2ger> askalski, ^
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# [15:22] <askalski> after enabling SSL I can't connect
# [15:22] <askalski> any clues?
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# [15:23] <darktrojan> ssl isn't required
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# [15:23] <askalski> ok, all I need now is to register my name, any way
# [15:23] <espindola> michal, can you take a look at 716576?
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# [15:25] <michal> espindola: it's on the top of my TODO list
# [15:25] <espindola> awesome, thanks
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# [15:27] <@smaug> askalski: IIRC, you need to use port 6697 when connecting to moznet using ssl
# [15:27] <askalski> smaug, : that would explain the problem, it automatically used 9999
# [15:27] <askalski> ok, and what to do then, just type the command the same as a message?
# [15:28] <espindola> dolske, can you take a look at 714960
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# [15:30] <BenB> NeilAway: can I use CSS transitions to animate XUL hidden = false/true?
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# [15:30] <BenB> if so, which CSS property do I put the transition on?
# [15:32] <edmorley> Ms2ger: thanks for merging to m-i, thought I was going to need to do that now
# [15:32] <espindola> !seen dolske
# [15:32] <firebot> dolske was last seen 6 hours, 19 minutes and 8 seconds ago, saying 'yay?' in #foxymonkies.
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# [15:33] <askalski> ok, I got ssl working
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# [15:34] <hsivonen> When installing Nighly on a Windows VM that has never had Firefox or Nightly installed, should I see the profile migrator on the first run?
# [15:35] <BenB> NeilAway: -moz-transition: display 0.5s ease-in; doesn't work, maybe not surprisingly, because display is not a scalar.
# [15:35] <bhearsum> IME, yes
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# [15:35] <bhearsum> the one that tries to import IE settings, right?
# [15:36] <hsivonen> bhearsum: yes
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# [15:40] <edmorley> tbpl is being sloooooooow :-(
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# [15:40] <@smaug> huh, I almost pushed stuff to m-c, when I was going to push to try
# [15:41] <edmorley> there's a hook for stopping "try:" iirc
# [15:41] * jhopkins|away is now known as jhopkins
# [15:41] <edmorley> or more, one of the closes in the commit hook is that
# [15:41] <edmorley> clauses
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# [15:44] <mounir> smaug: you should use the trychooser extension
# [15:44] <mounir> *hg extension
# [15:44] <@smaug> why?
# [15:45] <mounir> you can push to try with: `hg trychooserm -m "try_syntax"
# [15:45] <mounir> so you can't push to m-c
# [15:45] <mounir> by mistake
# [15:45] <@smaug> of course I can push to try if I type hg push
# [15:45] <@smaug> like I did this time
# [15:45] <@smaug> when I push to try I type: tryserver
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# [15:46] <NeilAway> khuey: ooh yes, I see that too; did you track that restart behaviour down?
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# [15:48] <khuey> NeilAway: not yet, was going to bisect after I finish this patch set
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# [15:49] <NeilAway> BenB: depends on what you're trying to do, but you could consider animating the height, width or opacity
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# [15:50] <BenB> NeilAway: ok, but that means I first have to set the height to 0px, then wait 0.5 seconds, then hidden =true.
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# [15:51] <@smaug> I wonder why ABP uses userdata
# [15:51] <@smaug> and uses it so much
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# [15:52] <Wes_> Benb: I've lost context here, but I do pop-up "speech bubbles" in my app by animating scale and translate when popping up, then animating opacity on disappear
# [15:52] <khuey> try is sooo slow
# [15:52] <Wes_> BenB: Are you wanting to wait 0.5 seconds, or ar you doing that because you think it's necessary to trigger the animation?
# [15:52] <BenB> Wes_: my question was: can I use CSS transitions to animate XUL hidden = false/true? NeilAway: -moz-transition: display 0.5s ease-in; doesn't work, maybe not surprisingly, because display is not a scalar.
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# [15:53] <BenB> Wes_: I just want something like a notification bar to animate in, instead of just instantly appearing, that's all.
# [15:53] <Wes_> BenB: I don't know what XUL hidden does, is it like content visibility?
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# [15:54] <BenB> Wes_: heh. XUL hidden = false sets CSS display: none.
# [15:54] <Wes_> BenB: Ah - well, assuming it's content, then you could slide it up with a translation, or fade it in with opacity
# [15:55] <Wes_> BenB: display none is obviously not animateable, but you could fade out with opacity (or lower with translate) and then use the transitionend callback to set the display to none
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# [15:55] <BenB> that's not so obivous to me, and that was my question exactly. <Wes_> BenB: display none is obviously not animateable
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# [15:56] <BenB> for me, it would be logical, if it would animate the height/width. animating opacity wouldn't work, because display: none takes no space, so the other elements must be rearranged.
# [15:56] <Wes_> BenB: as I understand CSS transitions, they make your attribute values go from A to B, smoothly. Display has a binary attribute, true or false, there is nothing in between. That's why I suggested raising/lowering with translate and/or fading in/out with opacity
# [15:56] <edmorley> note to anyone thinking of merging inbound to m-c, there appears to be a new (fairly frequent) intermitent linux debug M3 orange that I've retriggered a load for, to confirm where it started
# [15:57] <Wes_> BenB: That's why I suggested setting the display to none one the opacity has reached zero, via the transitionend event
# [15:57] <Wes_> BenB: That's why I suggested setting the display to none once the opacity has reached zero, via the transitionend event
# [15:57] <ewong> smaug ping
# [15:58] <BenB> given that this is just style, I would have preferred no code impact and just setting a CSS property, but I'll do it somehow along those lines. thanks.
# [15:58] <@smaug> ewong: pong
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# [15:59] <Wes_> BenB: unfortuantely, IMO, CSS transitions *always* have a code impact, because if you want to make sure the transition is triggered, you have to make sure the style attribute is evaluated before setting the property that you expect to transition
# [15:59] <Wes_> s/IMO/IME/
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# [16:00] <NeilAway> khuey: blame says bug 711692 (bbondy)
# [16:01] <khuey> I'd believe it
# [16:01] <Wes_> I wonder what the code impact would be if gecko didn't coalesce style changes on elements with transition styles already set -- it would make transitions more "reliable" from the perspective of the typical web developer
# [16:01] <khuey> firebot: cid
# [16:01] <firebot> {0x9f165969, 0x5eda, 0x4e5c, {0x92, 0xf3, 0xc8, 0xa9, 0x1f, 0xdd, 0xd0, 0xc0}}
# [16:02] <ewong> smaug I'm a bit confused with this patch .. (bug #693172..) is it sufficient (sorry for the ignorance) for it to build to mean the added lines are ok?
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# [16:03] <NeilAway> khuey: attachment 585742
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# [16:04] <@smaug> ewong: the patch removes nsDOMEventTargetHelper.cpp
# [16:04] <@smaug> that is the file we want to keep
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# [16:05] <bbondy> sorry blame for what?
# [16:05] <ewong> smaug no I mean the patch I have locally.. it removes nsDOMEventTargetWrapperCache.[h|cpp]
# [16:05] <@smaug> ewong: v2 patch is close to right
# [16:05] <@smaug> if you just add the missing bits to it
# [16:06] <@smaug> (the destructor part)
# [16:06] <bbondy> seen above
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# [16:06] <khuey> bbondy: if a debug build of firefox restarts it no longer uses the same terminal
# [16:07] <bbondy> in windows?
# [16:07] <bbondy> is this a problem?
# [16:07] <khuey> yes
# [16:07] <khuey> yes
# [16:07] <bbondy> k pls post and cc me
# [16:07] <khuey> will do
# [16:07] <bbondy> restarts after an update you mean right?
# [16:07] <bbondy> or?
# [16:08] <khuey> no, just restarts in general
# [16:08] <khuey> e.g. if you do firefox.exe -P and choose a profile
# [16:08] <khuey> after we restart the output is going to a new terminal
# [16:08] <bbondy> maybe we use some common code from the udpater for launching a child
# [16:08] <bbondy> k
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# [16:19] <glandium> looks like bug 716657 needs either a backout or a s/MOZILLA/MOZ/
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# [16:20] <Yoric> /msg firebot seen sfink
# [16:20] <Yoric> /msg firebot !seen sfink
# [16:21] <KWierso> alas, poor Yoric...
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# [16:21] <gregglind> strangely hard to figure out: how does one apply a git formatted patch to an Hg?
# [16:21] <froydnj> gregglind: patch -p1 < $file
# [16:21] * Yoric wonders what happened.
# [16:21] <khuey> glandium: dao backed it out
# [16:21] <froydnj> (assuming you're at the top of the source tree
# [16:21] <gregglind> thanks froydnj
# [16:22] <froydnj> gregglind: that'll just modify your working tree, so you'll have to hg commit afterwards
# [16:23] <gregglind> of course. Seems like a weird hole in the hg api.
# [16:24] <froydnj> you can also use patch-converter to convert git format to hg format
# [16:24] <froydnj> which hopefully results in something hg import can use
# [16:25] <gregglind> ah, 'import', I kept looking for 'apply'
# [16:25] <jesup> Not having played with git patches: what occurs when you hg qimport them? (or hg import)
# [16:25] * jesup didn't type fast enough
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# [16:26] <ewong> it serves me right for having two patches for one bug..
# [16:26] <khuey> smaug: ping
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# [16:28] <gregglind> froydnj: hg import my.patch --no-commit #worked fine
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# [16:29] <bz_sleep> compat-by-default for extensions is happening in fx10, yes?
# [16:29] * edmorley keeps on misreading AutoFooRooter as Rooster in the m-c tbpl commit column, rubs eyes
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# [16:31] <edmorley> more caffeine required I think
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# [16:34] <@smaug> khuey: pong
# [16:35] <@smaug> khuey: I guess you were going to say something about XHR
# [16:35] <@smaug> it is a tricky thing
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# [16:36] <Ms2ger> edmorley, np, I wanted to make sure nobody added jsuwords on m-i while I wasn't looking
# [16:36] <edmorley> :-)
# [16:36] <khuey> smaug: yeah
# [16:36] <khuey> smaug: the spec seems kind of silly here
# [16:37] <khuey> smaug: the compressed length isn't very useful to an XHR consumer
# [16:37] <@smaug> khuey: though, it is hard to know the total length
# [16:37] <khuey> smaug: right
# [16:37] <@smaug> so, either you report non-usable values, or total-length is just wrong
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# [16:38] <khuey> or you just don't report total-length for gzipped requests since it's effectively not known
# [16:38] <khuey> ;-)
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# [16:39] <@smaug> khuey: that is what I was thinking
# [16:39] <@smaug> khuey: lengthComputable could be false
# [16:39] <khuey> yeah
# [16:39] <@smaug> this was discussed somewhere....
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# [16:39] <@smaug> maybe in some bug or in webapps
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# [16:41] <khuey> in 614352 sicking says he sent mail
# [16:41] <khuey> no link, of course ;-)
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# [16:44] <edmorley> is tbpl resetting back to the tbpl default page intermittently when adding a comment for anyone else too?
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# [16:46] <Ms2ger> // XXX What does nav do...
# [16:46] <BenB> NeilAway: haha! I was wondering why the notification bar animation in Firefox/toolkit is so slow and sluggish. the one I created is smooth. no wonder, they implement the animation in JavaScript!
# [16:47] <NeilAway> BenB: it probably predates CSS transitions
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# [16:47] <BenB> NeilAway: yeah, but I would have expected that the code was upgraded as soon as CSS transitions landed in Gecko.
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# [16:48] <NeilAway> BenB: sure, but it needs reviews, tests written, etc, etc.
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# [16:49] <BenB> eh... no. working code trumpfs reviews and tests.
# [16:49] <BenB> this JS animation is decidedly not working well.
# [16:49] <NeilAway> bbondy: I commented on the relevant attachment, as noted above (doesn't your client highlight?)
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# [16:50] <bbondy> NeilAway: do you mean my IRC client?
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# [16:51] <bbondy> it highlights if you say bbondy
# [16:51] <BenB> <NeilAway> khuey: blame says bug 711692 (bbondy)
# [16:51] <BenB> 50 mins ago
# [16:52] * jesup updates his parent's firefox from 3.0.x to 9.0.1. Loves that "check for updates" suggests 3.6.13(!!!) as the update.
# [16:52] <bbondy> yes to which I responded blame me for what, then said that I scrolled up and seen just after that.
# [16:52] <@smaug> jesup: make them use Nightly
# [16:53] <edmorley> ehsan: ping
# [16:53] <bbondy> i.e.: :[09:58:36] <bbondy> sorry blame for what?
# [16:53] <bbondy> [10:00:05] <bbondy> seen above
# [16:54] <edmorley> jesup: was addon compat blocking it or something?
# [16:54] <Ms2ger> I installed Nightly on my parents' pc today... Crashed on startup
# [16:54] <@smaug> boo
# [16:55] <@smaug> did you get crash id?
# [16:55] <jesup> No idea. But .13 isn't secure in any case; add-ons not compatible with the latest 3.6.25 (which is surprisingly hard to find on mozilla.org) should be disabled
# [16:55] <KWierso> Ms2ger: was it using the default profile that has 3+ years of cruft built up?
# [16:56] <bbondy> BenB NeilAway: So when I said blame me for what I was responding to the ping. I wanted to know what in particular about the attachment was wrong. And as mentioned I said that I scrolled up and seen just after that.
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# [16:56] <Ms2ger> KWierso, probably more
# [16:56] <khuey> ../../../layout/base/nsPresContext.cpp:1149:75: error: no matching function for call to '<unnamed>::CharSetChangingRunnable::CharSetChangingRunnable(nsPresContext* const, NS_LossyConvertUTF16toASCII)'
# [16:56] <edmorley> ^ makes me dispair (in general, given I wonder how many users out there hit similar things and just switch browser)
# [16:56] <Ms2ger> I doubt it has been changed since I switches to Fx1.0
# [16:56] <khuey> ../../../layout/base/nsPresContext.cpp:127:3: note: candidates are: <unnamed>::CharSetChangingRunnable::CharSetChangingRunnable(nsPresContext*, nsCString&)
# [16:56] <khuey> wtf
# [16:57] <khuey> oh, it's complaining about the const
# [16:57] <BenB> bbondy: ok. I just tried to help.
# [16:57] <khuey> hrm, or is it
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# [16:58] <bbondy> np
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# [17:00] <ehsan> edmorley: hi
# [17:01] <bz_sleep> erm
# [17:02] <bz_sleep> why are we installing Nightly on random users' computers?
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# [17:02] <Ms2ger> I, for one, because I use that computer myself
# [17:02] <khuey> bz_sleep: it's our new testing policy
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# [17:02] <khuey> bz_sleep: 1% of the users on the stable branch get updated to nightlies
# [17:03] <bz_sleep> khuey: heh
# [17:03] <bz_sleep> Ms2ger: ah, I see
# [17:03] * KWierso prepares areyourparentsnightlyyet.com
# [17:03] * bz_sleep is now known as bz
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# [17:03] <glob> khuey, i thought you meant our new testing policy is "use ms2ger's parent's computer"
# [17:04] <khuey> ha
# [17:04] <edmorley> ehsan: I was trying to track down the new intermittent linux debug M3 orange so retriggered at intervals, only to spot once I'd narrowed it down, that the failure uses the new message added in your landing (doh!) https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Mozilla-Inbound&jobname=mozilla-inbound%20debug%20test%20mochitests-3/5&rev=d2ff5d57658d
# [17:04] * Ms2ger notes not to invite khuey over
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# [17:04] <khuey> I thought we established this yesterday when you refused to give me directions from CDG to your house
# [17:04] * smontagu looks for a bidi expert
# [17:05] * ehsan looks
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# [17:05] <Ms2ger> smontagu, ask sm.. Oh
# [17:05] <smontagu> ehsan!
# [17:05] * khuey debates whether or not to ask smontagu questions about code he reviewed 10 years ago
# [17:05] <smontagu> khuey: ask away, I remember it just as well as code I reviewed last week :-P
# [17:06] <glob> lol
# [17:06] <khuey> smontagu: oddly enough, somebody said something to that effect
# [17:06] <khuey> I think it was ms2ger
# [17:06] <bz> mmm
# [17:06] <Ms2ger> smontagu, speaking of code you could have reviewed last week... :)
# [17:06] <bz> Google walking directions from CDG to my house no longer include "Swim across the Atlantic Ocean"
# [17:06] <smontagu> Ms2ger: indeed :(
# [17:06] <khuey> smontagu: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=703133#c53 and the following comments
# [17:06] <ehsan> edmorley: it might be a test which doesn't cleanup correctly
# [17:06] <khuey> particularly bz's comment 55
# [17:07] <Ms2ger> bz, they suggest you canoe instead?
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# [17:07] <bz> Ms2ger: some bullshit about "We could not calculate directions"
# [17:07] <Ms2ger> Boo
# [17:07] <KWierso> bz: you're supposed to walk across the water
# [17:07] <edmorley> ehsan: yeah; happy for me just to file as a new orange?
# [17:08] <bz> khuey: fwiw, I think we should take your patch; it's obviously safer than the other option
# [17:08] <bz> khuey: and this is a rare case
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# [17:08] <bz> khuey: if it happened more often, I'd be more interested in reusing the existing coalescing mechanism
# [17:09] <NeilAway> bbondy: ok, so it was referring to the new console for restart
# [17:09] <ehsan> edmorley: please
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# [17:09] <ehsan> smontagu!
# [17:09] <bbondy> NeilAway: I think we're past that conversation now :)
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# [17:09] <BenB> is element.style. somewhere documented? e.g. that it's div.style.maxHeight and not div.style["max-height"].
# [17:09] <bz> BenB: well, there's a spec....
# [17:10] <bz> BenB: and likely some docs too
# [17:10] <NeilAway> bbondy: good, as long as you know which patch introduced the regression :-)
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# [17:10] <bz> BenB: and you can use getProperty and setProperty with "max-height"
# [17:10] <bbondy> NeilAway: yup thanks.
# [17:11] <Ms2ger> CSSOM, if you were looking for the spec
# [17:11] <BenB> bz: I was hoping for a complete list on MDC. I didn't find anything. unfortunately, it's hard to search for (esp. given the recent Google chances, so that a search for "div.style.maxHeight" (WITH quotes) finds only the HTML attributes)
# [17:11] <bz> or even dom 2 style
# [17:11] <bz> or dom 2 css, whichever
# [17:11] <bbondy> khuey: Did you post for the console thing yet? I didn't get CC'ed if so.
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# [17:11] <bhearsum> jorendorff: is that slave still working ok for you?
# [17:11] <khuey> bbondy: nope
# [17:11] <bbondy> k
# [17:11] <BenB> bz: yeah, I was searching myself crazy on MDC.
# [17:11] <khuey> it's on the todo list
# [17:11] <BenB> bz: thanks for the pointer
# [17:11] <jorendorff> bhearsum: I am very very nearly finished with it.
# [17:11] <khuey> more concerned with why this shit doesn't compile :-)
# [17:12] <bbondy> k, considered done
# [17:12] <jorendorff> bhearsum: found the bug, everything was great
# [17:12] <bhearsum> excellent
# [17:12] <jorendorff> just need to get my tree into a state where I can apply the fix...
# [17:12] * bhearsum takes it off his todo list
# [17:12] <BenB> bz: that dov.style.setProperty() doesn't seem to be documented either
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# [17:13] * BenB is going to make a petition soon "I want a google back that works like 2 years ago"
# [17:13] <bz> BenB: https://developer.mozilla.org/en/DOM/CSSStyleDeclaration documents setProperty
# [17:14] <bz> BenB: sorta
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# [17:14] <BenB> thanks
# [17:14] <bz> BenB: also the other non-CSS2Properties stuff
# [17:16] <smontagu> is this file really called nsPnsPresContext.cpp, or is that a bug in mxr?
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# [17:19] <smontagu> (that refers to https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=61672&action=diff)
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# [17:21] <khuey> that's something wrong with bugzilla
# [17:21] <khuey> the diff I uploaded is fine
# [17:21] <smontagu> khuey: so in bug 103282 comment 31, nhotta says that he is emulating what happens when the user changes fonts in prefs
# [17:21] <khuey> er
# [17:22] <khuey> the diff he uploaded is fine
# [17:22] <smontagu> er yeah, /mxr/bugzilla/
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# [17:22] <bz> mmm
# [17:22] <bz> copy/paste programming
# [17:23] * bz feels the flood of early-2000s memories
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# [17:23] <smontagu> bz: I am not about to cast the first stone wrt that
# [17:23] <Ms2ger> Sounds like editor
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# [17:24] <ehsan> so here's a question
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# [17:25] <ehsan> if we have an HTML page which has an iframe inside it, the load event on the body fires after the iframe has been loaded, right?
# [17:25] * dholbert|afk is now known as dholbert
# [17:25] <bz> yes
# [17:25] <bz> (the load event doesn't fire on the body, but that's incidental)
# [17:26] <ehsan> bz: so, in this test, http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/content/xul/content/test/test_bug398289.html?force=1, nothing should be throwing right?
# [17:26] <dholbert> edmorley, d'oh. thanks for the backout
# [17:26] * bz looks
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# [17:27] <khuey> smontagu: so we don't know if it's needed or not? :-)
# [17:27] <MichaelKohler> hi guys, why is Services.prefs.* not defined in browser/components/feeds/test/chrome/test_423060.xul ?
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# [17:27] <ehsan> oh wait
# [17:27] <ehsan> the problem seems to be elsewhere...
# [17:28] * ehsan looks deeper
# [17:28] <bz> ehsan: nothing obvious should be throwing there
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# [17:28] <ehsan> bz: the problem is worse than I realized, hang on
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# [17:29] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/4de07a341aab - Brian Hackett - Fix non-threadsafe builds, no bug. r=jorendorff
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# [17:29] <bz> ehsan: ok
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# [17:31] <smontagu> khuey: did we even have async style reconstruction in 2001?
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# [17:32] <Ms2ger> smontagu, wasn't khuey like 7 back then?
# [17:32] <bsmedberg> woohoo, going to push XPCOM proxy removal in just a sec
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# [17:34] <Ms2ger> Eek
# [17:34] <Ms2ger> We're really living in the future now
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# [17:35] <smontagu> so it looks to me like bug 355548 is more relevant than bug 103282
# [17:35] <bz> smontagu: probably not
# [17:35] * smontagu passes the hot potato to roc
# [17:37] <firebot> Check-in:
# [17:37] <firebot> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/17a76e33b6fe - Benjamin Smedberg - Bug 715576 - libalerts_s.dylib is incorrectly-named (_s indicates a static library) and links against the static-js library, which is bad. Make it link against either libxul
# [17:37] <firebot> (static-js) or the dynamic-js library correctly, and rename it. r=ted
# [17:37] <firebot> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/4d03df4a60dc - Benjamin Smedberg - Bug 675221 part A: replace XPCOM proxies with runanble for code in XPCOM itself, r=bz
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# [17:37] <firebot> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/ab435575ac33 - Benjamin Smedberg - Bug 675221 part B - remove the implementation of XPCOM proxies, sr=dougt
# [17:37] <KWierso> ick, the list all tabs button/dropdown is only visible with tab overflow now?
# [17:37] <firebot> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/86da3ca1e3ae - Benjamin Smedberg - Bug 675221 addendum to part A - reimplement the recursion check for the console service so that a poorly-written console listener doesn't cause an infinite repeition, r=bent
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# [17:37] <firebot> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/2d79876ee142 - Benjamin Smedberg - Bug 675221 part H - fix test_bug489671 which is throwing exceptions from a console listener, which is supposed to fail to prevent infinite recursion or infinite repetition
# [17:38] <firebot> behavior. r=bz
# [17:38] <edmorley> dholbert: np :-)
# [17:38] <edmorley> Ms2ger: Check :-)
# [17:38] <BenB> smontagu: waitasecond. that bug was fixed 4 YEARS ago and is STILL hidden?
# [17:38] <Ms2ger> edmorley, :)
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# [17:38] <Ms2ger> BenB, hmm, 3.6?
# [17:38] <BenB> smontagu: our policy is to open bugs when they are fixed and released.
# [17:38] * smontagu shrugs
# [17:39] <smontagu> I just found it in CVS blame, don't shoot the messenger
# [17:39] <BenB> Ms2ger: what about it? either it's critical, then it must go in 3.6, or it's not, then it shouldn't matter.
# [17:39] <Ms2ger> If you say so
# [17:40] <BenB> Ms2ger: eh, nevermind. it was fixed long before ff 3.6. I said 4 years ago.
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# [17:40] <khuey> Ms2ger: 12
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# [17:40] <Ms2ger> khuey, 42
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# [17:41] <khuey> Ms2ger: I was 12 in 2001
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# [17:41] <khuey> BenB: I suspect it's the wrong bug number in the commit log
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# [17:41] <BenB> khuey: I am referring to bug 355548
# [17:41] <edmorley> dholbert: actually yeah needed-clobber sounds much more plausible
# [17:41] <gavin> BenB: sometimes bugs are kept close when they reveal a systemic problem that is otherwise still exploitable...
# [17:42] <dholbert> edmorley, yup -- I hope so at least (since it worked on Try)
# [17:42] <Ms2ger> Oh
# [17:43] <bz> BenB: our policy is to _sometimes_ open up bugs once they're fixed
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# [17:43] <bz> BenB: there are exceptions
# [17:43] <BenB> bz: you're being cynical.
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# [17:43] <BenB> bz: no, the policy is to always open
# [17:43] <bz> BenB: no
# [17:43] <bz> BenB: e.g. if the bug affects other browsers, we may not open until they fix too
# [17:43] <BenB> to hide bugs is the *exception*. normally, all bugs must be open. if they are hidden, the only for a limited time.
# [17:44] <bz> BenB: sure
# [17:44] <BenB> until they are fixed. that's the policy - I helped to create it.
# [17:44] <bz> BenB: all agreed so far
# [17:44] <bz> BenB: <shrug>
# [17:44] <BenB> 4 years doesn't ever count as "limited time"
# [17:44] <bz> BenB: in practice, coordinated disclosure happens
# [17:44] <smontagu> ehsan: so I'm working on bug 712600, and I have all the test cases attached to the bug fixed, but there are still issues with some other testcases from bug 706194
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# [17:44] <bz> BenB: I have no idea why this particular bug is closed
# [17:44] <BenB> bz: 4 years is not "coordinated disclosure", it's "under the rug forever"
# [17:44] * bz hasn't looked at it
# [17:44] <smontagu> and I am losing faith
# [17:45] <smontagu> in the testcases, that is :)
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# [17:45] <bz> chances are, it being closed is just a mistake
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# [17:45] <ehsan> smontagu: I'll look in a second
# [17:45] <bz> but the claim that we open bugs immediately after fixing is just factually incorrect too
# [17:45] <bz> dveditz: should https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=355548 be open?
# [17:45] <smontagu> ehsan: let me know when you're free too look and I'll paste the specific cases in here
# [17:45] <ehsan> ok
# [17:45] <BenB> bz: I said "fixed and released"
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# [17:46] <BenB> bz: and that *is* the policy
# [17:46] <bz> BenB: "released" is implied, of course
# [17:46] <bz> BenB: <shrug>
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# [17:46] <smontagu> Mozilla Policy Implemented Inconsistently Shock Horror
# [17:46] <dholbert> we need some sort of auto-nagger for that, otherwise bugs are bound to slip through the cracks
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# [17:47] <BenB> dholbert: agreed.
# [17:47] <BenB> dholbert: my thought exactly
# [17:47] <bz> yes
# [17:47] <bz> we do
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# [17:47] <Ms2ger> "Dveditz Pings Out Being Asked About PolicyCoincidence?"
# [17:47] <bz> "The security module owner will be the primary person responsible for ensuring that security bug reports are investigated and publicly disclosed in a timely manner, and that such bug reports do not remain in the Bugzilla database uninvestigated and/or undisclosed."
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# [17:48] <bz> That's the closest thing to saying we open things up at http://www.mozilla.org/projects/security/security-bugs-policy.html
# [17:48] <BenB> and here he comes :) --> dveditz has joined this channel
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# [17:48] <bz> BenB: he did that a few mins ago too
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# [17:48] * Ms2ger waves at edmorley
# [17:48] <bz> BenB: my bet is on flaky network plus auto-join
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# [17:48] <@dveditz> sorry, then the vpn clicked in and I had to reconnect
# [17:48] <khuey> well he's in MV so the network is definitely flakey
# [17:48] * khuey ducks
# [17:49] <bz> BenB: in any case, I see nothing about timeframes at http://www.mozilla.org/projects/security/security-bugs-policy.html
# [17:49] <@dveditz> and no, I'm not in MV, but I should be hitting the road in a couple mins
# [17:49] * Ms2ger ducks and whacks khuey
# [17:49] <edmorley> Ms2ger: the daily router reset to clear out the gremlins
# [17:49] <BenB> dveditz: I was just wondering why I found a hidden sec bug that was fixed 4 years ago.
# [17:49] <BenB> dveditz: bug 355548
# [17:50] <BenB> dveditz: and we said we need an auto-nagger that reminds us of such bugs.
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# [17:50] <@dveditz> yeah, right now it's a completely manual process
# [17:50] <@dveditz> there are some very old bugs where the fuzz testcase was a javascript URL
# [17:51] <@dveditz> those will be hard to open because we can't hide bug history on open bugs
# [17:51] <BenB> I'm sure I can make a cron-job that runs a certain bugzilla query and mails it to you, me, and maybe sec-group :)
# [17:51] <@dveditz> but that's maybe a couple dozen at best
# [17:51] <@dveditz> I don't need a list, I've got queries up the wazoo
# [17:51] <glob> BenB, bugzilla has that ability built in, "whining"
# [17:51] <@dveditz> it just takes time to look them over
# [17:51] <ehsan> bz: I've volunteered you for a speedy review :)
# [17:51] <BenB> dveditz: huch? we can indeed hide certain bugzilla comments and open the rest of the bug
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# [17:51] <edmorley> philor: see you're having trouble getting the M3 to load too
# [17:51] <@dveditz> BenB: re-read
# [17:52] <@dveditz> BenB: you cannot hide history, so if the thing you're hiding is in a field (like URL) you cannot hide it
# [17:52] <Ms2ger> ehsan, I'll pass you some reviews in return :)
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# [17:52] <BenB> dveditz: ah, sorry, I didn't understand what you mean with "bug history".
# [17:52] <BenB> understood
# [17:52] <@dveditz> but that's a limited subset -- Jesse stopped doing that
# [17:52] <ehsan> Ms2ger: fair enough!
# [17:52] <glob> BenB, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/editwhines.cgi
# [17:53] <BenB> dveditz: that's not the case for this bug
# [17:53] <philor> edmorley: at least it gave me the precious chance to cc :)
# [17:53] <ehsan> bz: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=717154#c14
# [17:53] * ehsan leaves for lunch
# [17:53] <BenB> dveditz: I hear mozilla is getting new hires. maybe you can get an assistant for looking over them.
# [17:53] <edmorley> philor: just in case you don't get enough bugspam as it is right...? ;-)
# [17:53] <BenB> :)
# [17:53] <ehsan> smontagu: catch up with you when I return?
# [17:53] <@dveditz> BenB: just got an assistant
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# [17:53] <BenB> dveditz: cool! :)
# [17:53] <smontagu> ehsan: I think i'm managing, but I'll ping you again if I need to
# [17:54] <BenB> dveditz: who's the one?
# [17:54] <smontagu> enjoy lunch
# [17:54] <@dveditz> BenB: OK, that one was a bug that affected the 1.8 branch,
# [17:54] <@dveditz> no fix forthcoming so it was hidden to run out the clock on that branch
# [17:54] <@dveditz> but no real trigger to re-find later
# [17:55] <BenB> dveditz: so "slipped through your query net"?
# [17:55] <@dveditz> we're in better shape with more recent branches because I've had all those "affected" flags added
# [17:55] <@dveditz> BenB: I'm prioritizing the more recent bugs, but there's a huge backlog
# [17:55] <@dveditz> another big chunk is hidden WORKSFORME bugs
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# [17:55] <BenB> dveditz: I was thinking of a very simple query: if bug was fixed > 1 year ago and is still hidden, something's wrong. no bug should ever be hidden that long, there's no excuse for that ever.
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# [17:56] <@dveditz> because sometimes they WORKFORME on trunk, but still affect a branch
# [17:56] <@dveditz> so each needs to be individually looked at
# [17:56] <@dveditz> BenB: I can accept that as a guideline but disagree with it as an absolute
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# [17:57] <BenB> dveditz: "guideline" is 1 month :)
# [17:57] <edmorley> dholbert: perhaps bug 715048 is the problem?
# [17:57] <@dveditz> BenB: what if it's fixed on nightly but not released yet? the release cycle is 6 weeks at a minimum
# [17:57] <dholbert> edmorley, ah, possibly
# [17:57] <dholbert> though that bug is purportedly fixed
# [17:58] <@dveditz> we push sec bugs ahead, but not always into beta depending on the risk
# [17:58] <edmorley> dholbert: I meant more from a "we need to keep track of clobbering when we change the in-tree mozconfigs now"
# [17:58] <dholbert> edmorley, in any case, just clobbered
# [17:58] <@dveditz> anyway, I have to hit the road or I won't make it in time for my team mtg
# [17:58] <dholbert> edmorley, ah gotcha
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# [17:59] <BenB> dveditz: ok, thanks!
# [17:59] <BenB> (thanks because I trust you'll look into it)
# [17:59] <@dveditz> this is better as a mail conversation I think -- either mozilla.dev.security or security-group (depending on your taste for open-but-small-audience vs better-audience-but-hidden)
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# [18:00] <@dveditz> 'bye
# [18:00] <BenB> dveditz: snicker (I don't like that tradeoff :) )
# [18:00] <lurking> KWierso: there is a 'tab groups' button on the customize panel you could use
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# [18:00] <@dveditz> I'd suggest dev.planning but I suspect some people there will get snippy and send you elsewhere
# [18:00] <nemo> http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase232.xhtml
# [18:00] <KWierso> lurking: but that doesn't include the "tabs from other computers" item
# [18:00] <@dveditz> I don't like the tradeoff either
# [18:00] <BenB> dveditz: ttl
# [18:00] <BenB> dveditz: I'd like a read-only public list
# [18:01] <lurking> KWierso: never heard of that .. but I don't have other computers
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# [18:01] <KWierso> lurking: if you have sync set up to sync tabs, you get a menu item added to the list all tabs menu that takes you to about:sync-tabs
# [18:02] <lurking> oh, ok... never had a need for sync - no phone devices ....
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# [18:08] <philor> ehsan: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=713423#c27 :)
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# [18:09] <nemo> bz: is there any obvious reason why radial-gradient doesn't play nice w/ border-clip? http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase232.xhtml
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# [18:12] <bz> nemo: no idea
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# [18:13] <nemo> bz: would it be appropriate to ask this in bug form? :)
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# [18:14] <smontagu> Ms2ger: are both patches in bug 714613 still non=obsolete?
# [18:15] <smontagu> I suppose technically yes because you need Assertions.h in the second patch
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# [18:15] <bz> nemo: dunno
# [18:16] <bz> nemo: check the spec? note that it may have changed
# [18:16] <nemo> ah. I was just reading dmo
# [18:16] <nemo> http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-images/#gradient-box
# [18:16] <nemo> gradient-box is defined as padding-box :(
# [18:17] <nemo> should be the clipping box - so border-box if background-clip is changed :( :(
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# [18:17] <nemo> freaken spec writers, always making me sad...
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# [18:18] <Ms2ger> smontagu, yes, but I guess they can be folded
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# [18:22] <tbsaunde> when did thunderbird switch away from 1.9.2?
# [18:22] <nemo> hm. I guess I can probably manage w/ padding box
# [18:22] <BenB> tbsaunde: with TB 5, IIRC.
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# [18:23] <bz> nemo: spec is not set in stone
# [18:23] <bz> nemo: write to www-style, point out the problem?
# [18:24] * BenB imagines the CSS spec on the grave-stone of a web designer
# [18:24] <nemo> guess I care enough about this to sign up for a mailing list and spam a serious one
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# [18:24] <nemo> BenB: carved into a mountain face. in letters of fire 10ft tall. like god's final message to his creation
# [18:25] <nemo> it is a very large mountain
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# [18:25] <BenB> nemo: the 10 commandments were decidedly more ingenious and lasting. ;-)
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# [18:26] <nemo> which set? :-p ok. ok. offtopic and trollish. *drops it*. back to css
# [18:26] <rillian_> nemo, what property do I use to get the letters of fire?
# [18:26] <nemo> rillian_: text-shadow
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# [18:27] <ddahl> I wonder what kind of stupid I am doing here: /usr/bin/ld.bfd.real: libxul.so: hidden symbol `vtable for nsDOMCryptInternalAPI' isn't defined
# [18:27] <nemo> rillian_: http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase67.xhtml
# [18:27] <bsmedberg> ddahl: most commonly that means the symbol just isn't present
# [18:27] <rillian_> nemo, lol
# [18:27] <nemo> rillian_: er. http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase63.xhtml
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# [18:28] <ddahl> bsmedberg: time to switch to clang maybe?:)
# [18:28] <bsmedberg> ddahl: and the vtable is normally emitted in the .o file which defines the first function declared in the class
# [18:28] <bsmedberg> ddahl: this is a linker issue, not a compiler issue, so I'm not sure clang would make a difference
# [18:28] <ddahl> bsmedberg: ah
# [18:28] <bsmedberg> ddahl: is this with a patch you're writing?
# [18:28] <rillian> also, I'm pleased to see tengwar codepoints work in ff
# [18:28] <ddahl> bsmedberg: yes
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# [18:28] <bsmedberg> ddahl: can I see it?
# [18:29] <nemo> rillian: if you have the font - which the page embeds ;)
# [18:29] <ddahl> bsmedberg: yes, 2 shakes
# [18:29] <smontagu> rillian: huh?
# [18:29] <rillian> that explains why it doesn't work in gnome-terminal
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# [18:29] <nemo> rillian: works in *my* gnome-terminal :D
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# [18:30] <rillian> can you suggest a font?
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# [18:31] <bz> benb: "the css spec"?
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# [18:32] <BenB> bz: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS2/
# [18:32] <bz> benb: obsolete
# [18:32] <bz> benb: fwiw
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# [18:32] <bsmedberg> 2.1 FTW
# [18:32] <BenB> bz: so is that webdesigner, because he's dead.
# [18:32] <bz> bsmedberg: that link actually points to 2.1 now
# [18:32] <bz> bsmedberg: it's still obsolete. ;)
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# [18:32] <bsmedberg> hrm
# [18:33] <bz> bsmedberg: or at least large parts of it are
# [18:33] <lurking> nemo: http://www.oregonlive.com/comics-kingdom/?feature_id=Bizarro&feature_date=2012-01-06
# [18:33] <BenB> bz: did we obsolete the web, too?
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# [18:33] <bz> benb: oh, the web part works
# [18:33] <BenB> (sorry)
# [18:33] <bz> benb: it's just obsolete from a UA author point of view
# [18:33] <bz> benb: trying to implement per css2.1 won't get you very far
# [18:33] <BenB> bz: yeah, I know
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# [18:34] <BenB> bz: CSS3 doesn't exist from an page author point of view, because it's simply unreadable.
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# [18:34] <bz> BenB: hmm?
# [18:34] <Waldo> lots of css3 is readable
# [18:34] <bz> BenB: how so?
# [18:34] <Waldo> lots isn't, too
# [18:34] <bz> BenB: http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-selectors/ is just fine readability wise
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# [18:35] <bz> BenB: also happens to be a REC
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# [18:35] <nemo> bz: http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase233.xhtml - well. for my purposes, padding is fine.
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# [18:35] <bz> BenB: so all the selectors stuff in css2.1 is very officially obsolete
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# [18:35] <Ms2ger> Next up: a spec for tables? :)
# [18:35] <ddahl> bsmedberg: just trying to get the boilerplate going with this patch: https://bug649154.bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=587729
# [18:35] <bz> Ms2ger: we should live so long
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# [18:35] <BenB> bz: true, that one's readable. I must have been thinking of something else.
# [18:36] <Ms2ger> bz, you're optimistic :)
# [18:36] <bz> Ms2ger: er...
# [18:36] <bz> Ms2ger: that's a _pessimistic_ comment, typically
# [18:36] <robarnold> bz: ping? have questions about innerWidth/height behavior on mobile (I can't find documentation explaining the various behaviors I'm seeing)
# [18:36] <ddahl> btw: is there a bug where a linefeed is added to each line when you view plaintext in textareas or directly in the window?
# [18:36] <bz> robarnold: ack
# [18:36] <bz> robarnold: what's up?
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# [18:36] <bz> ddahl: yes
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# [18:36] <bz> ddahl: and it's fixed
# [18:37] <bz> ddahl: update to a current nightly?
# [18:37] <bsmedberg> ddahl: you need to implement isupports for nsDOMCryptInternalAPI
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# [18:37] <ddahl> bz: ok, I am not crazy, but need to update Nightly
# [18:37] <bsmedberg> ddahl: the vtable gets emitted with the first function in the class, which in this case is I believe "AddRef"
# [18:37] <robarnold> bz: I'm seeing different behavior for these properties on mobile safari / opera / Android / fennec. How are they supposed to behave when zooming in? Some browsers change the values, others don't
# [18:37] <ddahl> bsmedberg: oh.
# [18:37] <bz> robarnold: undefined
# [18:37] <robarnold> sigh.
# [18:37] <bz> robarnold: nothing defines zooming behavior
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# [18:37] <bz> robarnold: on desktop, zooming changes our innerWidth/height
# [18:37] <robarnold> as far as I can tell, there are 3 or 4 kinds of zooms
# [18:37] <ddahl> bsmedberg: thanks!
# [18:38] <bz> robarnold: yes, that too
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# [18:38] <robarnold> text zoom, dpi zoom, page zoom (like the desktops), and general scaling (mobile + safari/lion)
# [18:38] <Ms2ger> bsmedberg, first function in nsISupports is QI, IIRC
# [18:38] <bz> robarnold: so on desktop, zooming (full zoom, not text zoom) changes the ratio from css pixels to dev ice pixels
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# [18:38] <robarnold> which does affect layout, I've noticed
# [18:38] <bsmedberg> I can't ever remember
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# [18:38] <bz> robarnold: since we report innerWidth/Height in CSS pixels, it changes
# [18:39] <robarnold> the mdn docs don't make it clear that it's CSS pixels
# [18:39] <bz> robarnold: other browsers may do different zooming mechanisms
# [18:39] <bz> robarnold: all web-visible stuff is CSS pixels
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# [18:39] <edmorley> glandium: native android debug was broken by bug 683127, didn't show on inbound since debug is hidden there
# [18:39] <bz> robarnold: always
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# [18:39] <robarnold> ah...I thought there was some device pixels exposed somewhere (maybe canvas?)
# [18:39] <bz> robarnold: in Gecko
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# [18:39] <robarnold> I mostly deal with WebKit. Good to know!
# [18:40] <bz> robarnold: for canvas, backing store pixels (which is not the same thing as screen device pixels) are exposed via imagedata
# [18:40] <Ms2ger> robarnold--
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# [18:40] <robarnold> Ms2ger: why the hate? I work in mobile.
# [18:40] <robarnold> I'm not saying it *should* be that way, but it is right now.
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# [18:40] <WG9s> does anyone have any idea why my own build (Yes I did clobbers) fail to either be able to create an installer or actually run? They get a crash in mozjs.dll.
# [18:40] <glandium> edmorley: broken how?
# [18:40] <WG9s> this is windows other OS's work just fine
# [18:40] <robarnold> bz: ok, sounds like there is no spec or convention, thanks!
# [18:41] <bz> robarnold: yeah, indeed
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# [18:41] <edmorley> glandium: build failure; mozglue/android/APKOpen.cpp:455: error: 'offset' was not declared in this scope
# [18:41] <bz> robarnold: Gecko's behavior, from the site's point of view, is that a zoom basically resizes the window to a smaller size
# [18:41] * robarnold <3's mobile dev...so like the web of the old days
# [18:41] <WG9s> Oddly the officail nightly ran just fine.
# [18:41] <robarnold> bz: except on fennec where it doesn't!
# [18:41] <bz> robarnold: yeah, I have no idea what fennec does
# [18:42] <robarnold> fennec has the oddest behavior of the ones I tested
# [18:42] <WG9s> So, I guess I will only be doing Linux and Android builds for awhile.
# [18:42] <bz> robarnold: and "basically" hides some complexity with fonts
# [18:42] <robarnold> right, relayout
# [18:42] <robarnold> WebKit seems to have two modes - one which performs layout and another which doesn't
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# [18:42] <bz> robarnold: well, changing the effective window width is what does the relayout
# [18:42] <glandium> edmorley: that's the only error?
# [18:42] <bz> robarnold: but we cheat on the fonts a bit
# [18:42] <robarnold> oh?
# [18:43] <bz> robarnold: so if the page has a 10px font and you zoom 2x
# [18:43] <edmorley> glandium: as far as I can see https://tbpl.mozilla.org/php/getParsedLog.php?id=8482265&tree=Firefox
# [18:43] <bz> robarnold: the layout is not the same as if you made the window 2x narrowe and then upscaled the bitmap
# [18:43] <bz> robarnold: because we'll actually use a 20px font
# [18:43] <bz> robarnold: which doesn't quite have 2x the metrics of a 10px font
# [18:43] <robarnold> ah right
# [18:43] <bz> robarnold: but looks better at the 20px size than an upscaled 10px font, of course
# [18:44] <bz> robarnold: I'm a little curious about how this impacts you
# [18:44] <bz> robarnold: presumably you're writing mobile UI of some sort?
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# [18:45] <bz> robarnold: what pain points are you hitting with Fennec?
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# [18:45] <bz> robarnold: (We can fix things; just need to know what they are!)
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# [18:45] <robarnold> it's not pain points, I'm just exploring the various behaviors
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# [18:46] <robarnold> tbh, I don't think we care about Fennec due to marketshare
# [18:46] <robarnold> (same w/Opera I believe)
# [18:46] <WG9s> guess I need to file a blocker bug then.
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# [18:46] <robarnold> bz: I happened across this when running fishie - it seems to assume that innerWidth == device pixels of viewport which is only tru-ish on desktop
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# [18:48] <bz> robarnold: see, that sort of attitude sort of pisses me off
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# [18:48] <bz> robarnold: since "don't care" translates into "explicitly make the page not work in it"
# [18:48] <bz> robarnold: so yes, just like the "old days"
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# [18:48] <glandium> edmorley: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1445056 that will do
# [18:48] <WG9s> actaully i shoudl probably do an hg bisect to figure out what triggered this lame issue first.
# [18:49] <bz> robarnold: hmm
# [18:49] <bz> robarnold: how does fishie manage to assume anything about device px?
# [18:49] <bz> robarnold: I guess it could assume stuff about the relationship between innerWidth and the size of the canvas backing store...
# [18:49] <glandium> edmorley: do you want to land that or should i?
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# [18:50] <edmorley> glandium: great :-) I can land it if that helps
# [18:50] <BenB> bz: pixels in canvas are device pixels or web pixels?
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# [18:50] <bz> BenB: no
# [18:51] <BenB> (when you draw, no the raw memory)
# [18:51] <BenB> bz: that was an either-or, not a yes-no question?
# [18:51] <Ms2ger> Neither
# [18:51] <bz> BenB: "none of the above"
# [18:51] <BenB> ah
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# [18:51] <bz> BenB: that said...
# [18:51] <glandium> edmorley: that's the only error, and the offset variable was removed, and where it was used, it's now always 0, so it's pointless to log
# [18:51] <bz> BenB: I believe canvas coordinates are in the space established by the width and height properties
# [18:52] <bz> BenB: which are just pixels
# [18:52] <bz> BenB: or more precisely units
# [18:52] <BenB> unit = meter? *duck*
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# [18:52] <bz> no
# [18:52] <bz> ok
# [18:52] <bz> back up
# [18:52] <bz> so think about canvas
# [18:52] <BenB> bz: nevermind, it's ok
# [18:52] <bz> You have something like <canvas width="M" height="N">
# [18:52] <bz> right?
# [18:53] <BenB> not right, I have nothing :)
# [18:53] <bz> that establishes a drawing surface with height N units and width M units
# [18:53] <bz> all drawing to the surface uses coordinates in those same units
# [18:53] <bz> These aren't pixels
# [18:53] <BenB> bz: oh, nice
# [18:53] <bz> they're just units
# [18:53] <robarnold> bz: yeah, it displays the innerWidth/innerHeight numbers as the backing store size
# [18:53] <BenB> bz: and the page would draw <canvas width="M" height="N"> with the size of MxN web pixels, correct?
# [18:54] <bz> now if you don't specify any width/height styles for the canvas, the image will be drawn to the screen at MxN CSS pixels
# [18:54] <BenB> bz: so, essentially, canvas pixels end up having web pixel size?
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# [18:54] <bz> but if you do this:
# [18:54] <edmorley> glandium: shall I just rs=edmorley it?
# [18:54] <bz> <canvas width="M" height="N" style="height: 10px; width: 20px">
# [18:54] <BenB> bz: yeah, got you
# [18:54] <bz> Then the image is drawn at 10x20
# [18:54] <BenB> robarnold: you got that, too?
# [18:55] <bz> And there's the separate issue of canvas backing store; each unit could correspond to more than one pixel in the backing store
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# [18:55] <bz> robarnold: <sigh>
# [18:55] <BenB> bz: so if M=100 n=200, one canvas pixel ends up being 1/10 web pixel, clear and logical. nice.
# [18:55] <bz> robarnold: demos written by browser vendors are so full of fail....
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# [18:55] <bz> BenB: one canvas unit ends up being 1/10 web pixel
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# [18:55] <bz> BenB: I'd really rather not call the canvas units "pixels" because that confuses things
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# [18:56] <bz> BenB: e.g. getImageData on a canvas width="100" height="200" is allowed to return an array with a length that's not 80000
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# [18:56] <bz> BenB: becaause nothing says there's one backing store pixel per square unit
# [18:56] <robarnold> bz: it's not like FB's were much better :)
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# [18:57] <bz> robarnold: good demos/benchmarks are _hard_, yeah
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# [18:57] <BenB> bz: you mean 20000? that *is* surprising, though.
# [18:57] <Ms2ger> BenB, one each for rgba
# [18:57] <bz> BenB: no, 80000, since there are 4 entries per backing store pixel
# [18:57] <BenB> ah, ok
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# [18:57] <bz> robarnold: and the set of people who can write a good one is sort of small
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# [18:58] <glandium> edmorley: you can
# [18:58] <BenB> bz: the same small set that are good at implementing the spec in a browser? :)
# [18:58] <bz> robarnold: (likely a proper subset of the set of people who really understand all the relevant specs and at least two of the relevant browser impls)
# [18:58] <bz> BenB: smaller
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# [18:58] <bz> BenB: I can implement a spec, and I can critique an existing demo, but I can't write a good one from scratch
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# [18:59] <bz> anyway
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# [18:59] <bz> back to fixing broken tests
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# [18:59] <Ms2ger> bz, enjoy :)
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# [18:59] <bz> Ms2ger: I have no plans to
# [18:59] <BenB> bz: you're of a lot more use writing good browser code than good tests, anyway :)
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# [18:59] <bz> Ms2ger: esp. since for some of them I can't tell why they're broken. :(
# [19:00] <Ms2ger> Boo, tests
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# [19:00] <bz> Ms2ger: if you care...
# [19:00] <bz> Ms2ger: https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=05ba0d82edeb
# [19:00] <BenB> bz: just one line answer: how's your study going and will you work for Mozilla soon?
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# [19:00] <BenB> "good. no." ;-P
# [19:00] <bz> Ms2ger: the Linux debug reftest fails
# [19:00] <bz> BenB: hmm?
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# [19:01] <bz> BenB: context?
# [19:01] <BenB> bz: none
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# [19:01] <bz> Ms2ger: any idea what the hell those are smoking? ;)
# [19:01] <Ms2ger> Oh, hmm, I seem to need to escape that & on the command line
# [19:02] <Ms2ger> I was wondering why you'd be looking at dholbert's push :)
# [19:02] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/d037afa60874 - Mike Hommey - Bug 683127 - Don't try to log the offset, since it is no longer used. Fixes debug Android build failure; rs=edmorley
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# [19:03] <bz> Ms2ger: heh
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# [19:06] <Ms2ger> bz, no idea
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# [19:07] <bz> Ms2ger: it was a long shot anyway
# [19:07] <bz> Ms2ger: thanks for looking...
# [19:07] <Ms2ger> Np
# [19:07] * bz goes back to the really broken test for now, will deal with these AA issues later
# [19:07] <Ms2ger> Always happy to be unhelpfully helpful :)
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# [19:08] <blizzard> fabrice1: ping
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# [19:08] <fabrice1> blizzard: pong
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# [19:08] <blizzard> fabrice1: hey, is the take-a-picture with the input tag stuff working in native fennec builds?
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# [19:10] <espindola> armenzg_lunch: ping
# [19:10] * Ms2ger wonders how often he'll hear "neverendum" the next few days
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# [19:11] <edmorley> Ms2ger: following UK news?
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# [19:12] <Ms2ger> The BBC is better than what we have here, I'm afraid
# [19:12] <fabrice1> blizzard: yes
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# [19:12] <blizzard> fabrice1: ok
# [19:12] <evilpie> edmorley: hint hint :O
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# [19:13] <edmorley> Ms2ger: yeah they're not bad; just wish they'd drop the flash players already (and not just for mobile)
# [19:13] <Ms2ger> My long wave radio doesn't need flash ;)
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# [19:14] <fabrice1> blizzard: this uses the default camera app
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# [19:14] <bkero> win 52
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# [19:15] <blizzard> fabrice1: right
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# [19:19] <ehsan> smontagu: ping
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# [19:33] <jlebar> Waldo, ping?
# [19:34] <Waldo> jlebar: pong
# [19:34] <jlebar> Waldo, Is it a good time to talk about linked lists?
# [19:34] <Waldo> jlebar: sure; got tied up last night myself, never circled back
# [19:34] <jlebar> Waldo, Heh, I know that feeling.
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# [19:35] <jlebar> Waldo, Leaving the name aside for a moment, what alternative semantics would you want us to consider?
# [19:35] <Waldo> jlebar: I don't know that I do; I simply want to be sure I've considered the possibilities enough to be satisfied with these particular ones
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# [19:36] <armenzg> espindola: pong
# [19:36] <armenzg> (going into short meeting)
# [19:36] <espindola> armenzg: sorry if it is a silly question
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# [19:36] <espindola> but wouldn't it be easier to move the full 10.5 debug build + testing
# [19:36] <espindola> to 10.6
# [19:36] <espindola> in one stop
# [19:36] * jimm is now known as jimm-lunch
# [19:37] <espindola> step
# [19:37] <espindola> instead of splitting the leaktests and moving those first?
# [19:37] <jlebar> Waldo, I guess one possibility would be not putting the next/prev pointers in the node itself.
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# [19:37] <jlebar> Waldo, That is, the linked list node is {prev, next, T*}.
# [19:37] <jlebar> Waldo, But I don't think we want, that, since then you can't do T->Remove().
# [19:38] <armenzg> espindola: I'm confused on what you are trying to say
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# [19:38] <espindola> armenzg: your last bug comment
# [19:38] <armenzg> testing on 10.5 *rev3* machines is independent on where the builds happen
# [19:38] * wlach is now known as wlach|lunch
# [19:38] <armenzg> I assume that the final goal is to build 10.5/10.6 & 10.7 on 10.7 machines
# [19:38] <espindola> the leak tests currently run in the same machine that does the build, no?
# [19:38] <espindola> correct
# [19:39] <armenzg> but for now we're just moving all *current* builds on 10.6 machines
# [19:39] <Waldo> jlebar: yeah, I'm pretty sure that's right
# [19:39] <armenzg> the only build that was not happening on 10.6 machines was the 10.5 leak builds
# [19:39] <armenzg> espindola: correct
# [19:39] <espindola> armenzg: ah, ok, so you are moving the build itself, right?
# [19:39] <armenzg> yep
# [19:39] <Waldo> JSContexts are circular now, e.g. and need built-in-ness
# [19:39] <armenzg> just the build
# [19:39] <bz> hmm
# [19:39] <espindola> ok. My misunderstanding then. I understood that you were splitting the test in a new pass
# [19:39] <bz> how around is mstange?
# [19:40] <jlebar> Waldo, What do you mean circular? You mean JSContexts are part of a circular linked list?
# [19:40] <armenzg> espindola: ah OK
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# [19:40] <armenzg> thanks for checking
# [19:40] <Waldo> jlebar: yeah; they have a JSCList at their start, just a rebranded PRCList
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# [19:40] <jlebar> Waldo, I see. Would this LinkedList class work for them? I presume so...
# [19:41] <Waldo> jlebar: I think maybe
# [19:41] <blassey> coop: ping?
# [19:41] <Waldo> jlebar: just pondering possibilities, mostly
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# [19:41] <coop> blassey: pong - just looking for dial-in info
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# [19:42] <blassey> we're in the warp core vidyo room
# [19:42] <Waldo> changing existing code has greater costs, usually, than considering what form it should take in the first place
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# [19:42] <blassey> coop|mtg: 95312
# [19:43] <jlebar> Waldo, For sure. If one can know what form it should take in the first place. :)
# [19:43] * Waldo wonders if webkit uses DoublyLinkedList for RenderObject or not
# [19:43] <jlebar> Waldo, I didn't see that use in my search.
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# [19:44] <Waldo> yeah, you're right
# [19:44] <Waldo> wonder if there's some reason for that
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# [19:44] <MichaelKohler> I had a level 1 access (to try) in 2009/2010. How can I reactivate that?
# [19:45] <jlebar> Waldo, http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1445089
# [19:45] <dholbert> MichaelKohler, file a bug, I suspect?
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# [19:45] <jlebar> Waldo, They just implement the doubly-linked list themselves.
# [19:45] <MichaelKohler> dholbert: okay, I will thanks
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# [19:45] <jlebar> in RenderObjectChildList.
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# [19:46] <jlebar> Waldo, Looks like they do it this way because they have lots of logic surrounding insert/remove.
# [19:47] <dholbert> MichaelKohler, (I'd just follow http://www.mozilla.org/hacking/committer/ , noting in the first comment of the bug that you had commit access previously, which will probably skip the need for ssh key / committer's agreement & possibly voucher)
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# [19:47] <dholbert> MichaelKohler, (& link to the original bug # where you got L1, for reference)
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# [19:47] <MichaelKohler> dholbert: okay, thanks
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# [19:48] <dholbert> MichaelKohler, no problem
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# [19:50] * bz writes async code
# [19:50] <bz> such a pain
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# [19:51] <bz> function changeFocusAndAwaitSyntheticMouse(callback, winToFocus,
# [19:51] <bz> winToAwaitMouseEventIn) {
# [19:51] <bz> SimpleTest.waitForFocus(function() {
# [19:51] <bz> winToAwaitMouseEventIn.mozRequestAnimationFrame(function() {
# [19:51] <bz> SimpleTest.executeSoon(callback);
# [19:51] <bz> });
# [19:51] <bz> }, winToFocus);
# [19:51] <bz> }
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# [19:51] <BenB> bz: this is precisely how I do it, too.
# [19:52] <BenB> bz: works well for me. much less pain than having the function elsewhere.
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# [19:52] <bz> BenB: it's the layers of layering that piss me off
# [19:52] <BenB> I know
# [19:52] <BenB> (great minds think alike ;) )
# [19:52] * sfleiter|away is now known as sfleiter
# [19:52] <BenB> bz: nag brendan that he builds something nice into the language
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# [19:53] <bz> oh, I could use a generator
# [19:53] <bz> but....
# [19:53] <bz> the fact that I have to know to wait for all those things is the problem
# [19:54] <BenB> bz: you don't get around the nesting, if you want code clarity
# [19:54] <Waldo> bz: "promises" seem to be what the cool kids are using these days for that stuff, like in http://dutherenverseauborddelatable.wordpress.com/2011/12/13/os-file-step-by-step-the-schedule-api/
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# [19:54] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/d85920b5691b - Mike Hommey - Fixup for bug 683127 part 4: Avoid RefPtr.h using JS_Assert. r=tglek
# [19:55] <bz> BenB: I want to not have to think about when my events might or might not happen.. ;)
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# [19:56] <BenB> bz: oh, that's a question of a sane API. I always define async functions as: doFooBar(successCallback, errorCallback)
# [19:56] <smontagu> ehsan: pong
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# [19:56] <bz> hmph
# [19:56] <bz> these other failing tests I wrote
# [19:56] * bz wonders why they fail
# [19:56] <BenB> bz: whereby doFooBar guarantees that exactly one of them will be called
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# [19:57] <@stuart> bye
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# [19:57] <ehsan> smontagu: ok, so which bug were you talking about?
# [19:57] <BenB> bz: in this case, waitForFocus() should have an errorCallback that gets called when a certain timeout triggers.
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# [19:58] <bz> BenB: why would that help?
# [19:58] <smontagu> ehsan: bug 712600
# [19:58] <smontagu> but the case which is still problematic is not in the bug
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# [19:58] <BenB> bz: because waitForFocus would guarantee you that you get called eventually, your processing wouldn't stop when the focus never happens.
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# [19:59] <BenB> bz: it's these situations that are the nasty parts of async processing, but it's just a matter of a sane API.
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# [19:59] <smontagu> ehsan: <p dir="ltr"><bdi>א</bdi><bdi>ב</bdi></p>
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# [20:00] <smontagu> expected rendering is ‭אב
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# [20:03] <bz> hmm
# [20:03] <bz> maybe it's the button
# [20:03] <gps> exit
# [20:03] <bz> The fact that our reftests run with the mouse over the window is such a PITA
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# [20:06] <bz> smaug: ping
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# [20:08] <nemo> rillian: WRT font, I was using code2000 - I don't know if it embeds it at the draft code point. the font on that page is stripped down and cloned to a couple of places.
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# [20:08] <nemo> rillian: code2000 has a lot of neat esoteric characters though, although not exactly much actual character
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# [20:09] <ddahl> in XPIDL, unsigned long corresponds to PRUint32, correct?
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# [20:09] <Ms2ger> Yes
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# [20:09] <ddahl> I keep seeing this error: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1445101
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# [20:09] * Ms2ger frowns
# [20:09] <Ms2ger> ddahl, new file?
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# [20:10] <Mossop> ddahl: You still have the first argument wrong there
# [20:10] <Ms2ger> True
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# [20:10] <Ms2ger> But that should error when compiling
# [20:10] <Mossop> Also, the pro's just copy the C++ method definition out of the .h file that xpidl generates
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# [20:10] <Ms2ger> So I think the .cpp just isn't being compiled
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# [20:11] <ddahl> i think i need to go somewhere quiet and fold up into a fetal position
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# [20:11] <ehsan> smontagu: so for the purpose of that testcase, we want to treat bdi as it never existed right?
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# [20:11] <smontagu> ehsan: no
# [20:12] <smontagu> that would give אב
# [20:12] <Ms2ger> ddahl, that's my reaction to editor... (hi ehsan!)
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# [20:12] <ehsan> smontagu: oh yes, you're right
# [20:12] <ehsan> hmm
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# [20:12] * ehsan reads comment 0 again
# [20:12] <ddahl> i'm suprised there are not more ex-gecko hackers who are crack-whores
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# [20:13] <bz> ddahl: hmm?
# [20:13] <bz> ddahl: crack is a pale substitute for fixing a randomorange
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# [20:14] <bz> ddahl: so there's no need for us to try it!
# [20:14] <ddahl> bz: LOL
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# [20:14] <Ms2ger> That's right onto qbe
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# [20:14] <smontagu> ehsan: I say again, the cases in the bug itself are fixed, essentially by splitting inline parents at <bdi> boundaries
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# [20:14] * bz thinks he's fixed two so far, while trying to get this patch landable
# [20:14] <Ms2ger> bz+=2
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# [20:14] <ddahl> HOLY SHIT IT COMPILED AND LINKED
# [20:15] * coop is now known as coop|mtg
# [20:15] <ddahl> thanks guys
# [20:15] * blizzard breaks it
# [20:15] <bz> does it run?
# [20:15] <ehsan> smontagu: ok, so what is the problem?
# [20:15] <ddahl> arrggghh
# [20:15] <smontagu> ehsan: IIRC even <bdi>א</bdi> <bdi>ב</bdi> works
# [20:15] <bz> when it runs, does it crash?
# [20:15] <Ms2ger> bz, that's secondary
# [20:15] <ehsan> smontagu: (sorry I've lost the scrollback)
# [20:15] <bz> if not, does it do what it should?
# [20:15] <ddahl> bz: lets not get ahead of ourselves!
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# [20:15] <bz> and if so, is what it should do what we really want to be doing? ;)
# [20:15] <bz> ddahl: ;)
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# [20:15] <bz> It's like Maslow's pyramid for patches
# [20:15] <ddahl> bz: it will, I am just happy the boilerplate is in place:)
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# [20:16] <smontagu> ehsan the problem is e.g.: <p dir="ltr"><bdi>א</bdi><bdi>ב</bdi></p>
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# [20:16] <smontagu> when you have two bdis with nothing between them
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# [20:17] <ehsan> smontagu: in which case you should not be splitting the parent
# [20:17] <ehsan> right?
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# [20:18] <camd> bz: ping! got a minute?
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# [20:18] <bz> camd: pongyes
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# [20:18] <smontagu> ehsan: in which case splitting the parent doesn't help, because we treat them as a single right-to-left run
# [20:18] <camd> bz: thanks. so WRT reproducing the GC issue: I got an email about a test case that gives me long GC times, but not sure if it's really relevant
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# [20:19] <camd> If I load google reader and just look at one of my feeds, then scroll up and down a lot...
# [20:19] <smontagu> ehsan: and I don't see how to fix it without making line layout O(n^2)
# [20:19] <camd> I'm getting GC times in the 280ms - 315ms ranges.
# [20:19] <bz> camd: once you stop scrolling, do they stay in that range?
# [20:19] <camd> lots of pausing while scrolling
# [20:19] <ehsan> smontagu: so, maybe before deciding whether to split the parent, you can look at the prev and next sibling to see if they're bidi:isolate?
# [20:20] * bz notes that for him 300ms is a _fast_ gc
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# [20:20] <camd> bz: well, it seems like it doesn't need to do a GC again if I'm not scrolling around
# [20:20] <camd> so maybe this is a non-starter.
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# [20:20] <camd> bz: so we're really only looking at gc times slower than 500ms or so?
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# [20:20] <bz> well
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# [20:21] <bz> we're looking at gc times that are high
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# [20:21] <bz> and gcs that are happening often
# [20:21] <bz> it's worth filing a bug on the reader thing
# [20:21] <camd> but, ok, I just saw my gc go again and it was 271
# [20:21] <bz> just to have someone investigate
# [20:21] <bz> can you paste one of your gc log lines?
# [20:21] <camd> sure, standby
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# [20:22] <camd> GC mode: full, timestamp: 1326309327823093, duration: 278 ms.
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# [20:22] <camd> bz: is that what you mean?
# [20:22] <bz> that's what I mean
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# [20:23] <bz> but you're using an fx10 build or something, right....
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# [20:23] <camd> yep
# [20:23] <bz> (a current nightly would log a lot more useful infothere)
# [20:23] <bz> so if you see that behavior in a current nightly too, that would be good to see the output from
# [20:23] <smontagu> builds are too slow
# [20:23] <camd> hmm, actually 9.0 in this case....
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# [20:23] <bz> fwiw, here's what current output is like:
# [20:23] <bz> GC(T+140155.4) Type:Glob, Total:462.8, Wait:3.5, Mark:324.1, Sweep:131.6, FinObj:10.3, FinStr:0.6, FinScr:3.1, FinShp:16.2, DisCod:6.9, DisAnl:63.6, XPCnct:11.0, Destry:0.8, End:12.6, +Chu:0, -Chu:5, Reason: API
# [20:24] <Ms2ger> Say what? :)
# [20:24] <bz> (yes, I know it seems less readable at first glance!)
# [20:24] <camd> ok, let me try a nightly and see what I get… just a minute...
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# [20:25] <terrence> bz: what is your heap size currently?
# [20:25] <camd> bz: GC(T+36.1) Type:Glob, Total:227.7, Wait:0.4, Mark:159.1, Sweep:64.9, FinObj:10.2, FinStr:1.0, FinScr:2.0, FinShp:9.0, DisCod:3.7, DisAnl:22.4, XPCnct:4.8, Destry:0.6, End:7.0, +Chu:0, -Chu:0, Reason: API
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# [20:26] <camd> I jumped to GC times of 227 as soon as I loaded FF 12 (12 - 01-10)
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# [20:27] <bz> terrence: which number are you actually looking for?
# [20:27] <bz> terrence: presumably from about:memory
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# [20:27] <bz> terrence: js-gc-heap?
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# [20:29] <edmorley> hsivonen: does bug 717198 need addon-compat / dev-doc-needed ?
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# [20:30] <bz> terrence: ping?
# [20:30] <bz> camd: hmmm
# [20:30] <bz> camd: ok
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# [20:31] <camd> bz: something interesting there? :)
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# [20:31] <Ms2ger> // Mike wrote something for me along these lines in nsSelectionController,
# [20:31] <Ms2ger> // but I don't think it's ready for use yet - revisit.
# [20:31] * Ms2ger checks how old that is
# [20:31] <bz> camd: nope
# [20:31] <bz> Ms2ger: old
# [20:31] <bz> Ms2ger: since it's talking about mjudge
# [20:31] <bz> Ms2ger: at least 9 years, I would guess
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# [20:32] <Ms2ger> October 2000
# [20:32] <terrence> bz: sorry... intense debugging session here
# [20:32] <Ms2ger> Bug v
# [20:32] <Ms2ger> Bug 50742*
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# [20:32] <terrence> bz: yes... approximate js heap size
# [20:32] <bz> terrence: 357.00 MB -- js-gc-heap
# [20:33] <bz> terrence: says about:memory
# [20:33] <terrence> bz: how about total rss for hte process?
# [20:33] <Ms2ger> Hmm, it was moved there
# [20:33] <bz> 1,510.04 MB -- resident
# [20:33] <bz> 1,213.14 MB -- explicit
# [20:33] <terrence> bz: hmm... as I thought, your gc's are abnormally slow :-)
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# [20:33] <bz> terrence: "great"
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# [20:33] <bz> terrence: abnormally in what sense
# [20:33] <terrence> bz: most of the samples I know scale linearly with rss
# [20:33] <bz> terrence: that you have a similar heap/rss but yours are faster?
# [20:33] <bz> ok
# [20:34] <terrence> bz: I.e. a 3GB heap == 500ms of GC
# [20:34] <bz> ok
# [20:34] <bz> well
# [20:34] <bz> so...
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# [20:34] <bz> right now I'm seeing 500ms GCs
# [20:34] <terrence> bz: mine is 1.2GB and about 200ms
# [20:34] <bz> which is _good_
# [20:34] <bz> I start to worry when they get to 1800ms
# [20:34] <bz> note that I restarted the browser recently
# [20:35] <bz> (a day or so ago)
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# [20:35] <terrence> bz: I think some websites just generate more garbage than others and that we stop scaling linearly when we have lots of fragmentation
# [20:35] <bz> well, I guess 38 hours
# [20:35] <bz> ok
# [20:35] <bz> that's entirely possible
# [20:35] <terrence> terrence: I think generation gc is our best bet... but then I would think that since I'm working on it ;-)
# [20:35] <bz> looking at the data, looks like mark is 2/3 of the GC time
# [20:35] <bz> yeah
# [20:36] <bz> I agree that for use cases like mine it's the best bet
# [20:36] <terrence> bz: wow, did i just address that to myself rather than saying /me?
# [20:36] <bz> though it would be good to know whether that's true
# [20:36] <Ms2ger> Bug 46554, August 2000, apparently
# [20:36] <bz> e.g. to know whether my GCs actually collect mostly recent stuff
# [20:36] <bz> terrence: yes, you did
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# [20:37] <Ms2ger> bholley! :)
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# [20:37] <jesup> terrence: 750ms GC, 3.9GB RSS (Fedora15 x64), but 3.5s CC times... (fast xeon)
# [20:37] <bholley> Ms2ger: doing your reviews!
# [20:37] <bholley> :-)
# [20:37] <Ms2ger> I noticed! :)
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# [20:37] <bz> jesup: my cc is ok, but I'm using one of smaug's test builds. ;)
# [20:37] <bz> CC(T+141072.7) collected: 52 (178 waiting for GC), suspected: 5473, duration: 162 ms.
# [20:37] <bz> Purple cleanup 3 times before CC, min 2 ms, max 2 ms, avg 2 ms, total 7 ms, removed 820
# [20:38] <Ms2ger> bholley, (yeah, the indentation is different in my other tree :))
# [20:38] <terrence> jesup: mccr8 is who you should talk to
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# [20:38] <terrence> bz: ah, is smaug on the case now too?
# [20:38] <Ms2ger> So, anybody seen bent lately?
# [20:39] <ted> "[14:31:57.933] Use of XMLHttpRequest's responseType attribute is no longer supported in the synchronous mode in window context."
# [20:39] <ted> bummer :-(
# [20:39] <jesup> terrence: we've talked. My CC edges dump is too big for him :-)
# [20:39] <bz> terrence: smaug's been working on cc perf, yeah
# [20:39] <terrence> jesup: a good test case for incremental cc at least
# [20:39] <bz> ted: that might change again
# [20:39] <ted> heh
# [20:39] <Ms2ger> ted, still stop the sync xhr
# [20:39] <ted> broke a demo of mine
# [20:39] <jesup> THis is probably partly an extension issue, I suspect.
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# [20:39] <Ms2ger> It kills kittens
# [20:39] <bz> ted: there have been two instances of hard-to-fix breakage
# [20:39] <ted> Ms2ger: it's just a demo, it was the simplest thing
# [20:40] <bz> ted: well
# [20:40] * bholley would give Ms2ger crap about storing notes to himself inline, but it's one hell of a patch queue ;-)
# [20:40] <bz> ted: we don't care about breaking demos, really
# [20:40] <ted> yeah
# [20:40] <ted> just annoying
# [20:40] <terrence> jesup: that would be my guess as well... those cc times are too high to be anything but a bug somewhere
# [20:40] <bz> ted: the breakage for emscripten and the other thing, whatever it's called, is a bigger issue
# [20:40] <jesup> I've seen it get to 12s :-/
# [20:40] <bz> ted: the only obvious way to fix them is to back the change out or have them stop using typed arrays for this use case.....
# [20:40] <Ms2ger> They said they could use workers, no?
# [20:40] <bz> Ms2ger: could they?
# [20:41] <bz> Ms2ger: I must have missed this
# [20:41] * Ms2ger was rather surprised
# [20:41] <azakai> bz, Ms2ger: yes, emscripten and mandreel should use workers
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# [20:41] * Ms2ger looks ta his inbox
# [20:41] <azakai> don't back that at on our account ;)
# [20:41] <azakai> *out
# [20:41] <bz> So you'd basically kick the load off to a worker and then have the page JS resume onmessage?
# [20:42] <azakai> well, the entire compiled code should be in a worker. then it can use sync xhr with arraybuffers etc. normally. a worker is the right solution anyhow
# [20:42] <bz> effectively pretending like the scheduler suspended the C code?
# [20:42] <bz> oh
# [20:42] <bz> move all the compiled code to a worker
# [20:42] <bz> hmmm
# [20:42] <bz> yeah, ok
# [20:42] <azakai> yeah. that code can often lag the main thread, which is bad. it should be in a worker
# [20:42] <azakai> (we already do that in some projects)
# [20:42] <bz> wow
# [20:42] <bz> the checkin-needed list is back to sane size!
# [20:43] <Ms2ger> And my reading list is way too big :)
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# [20:43] * bz pushes a few more things from it
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# [20:44] <Ms2ger> jlebar, oh, come on, we steal example.org but not example.net? :/
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# [20:48] <AryehGregor> What's the right Bugzilla component for Selection bugs?
# [20:49] <bz> AryehGregor: Core:Selection
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# [20:49] <AryehGregor> Oops, I didn't see that one.
# [20:49] <AryehGregor> Thanks.
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# [20:50] <bz> AryehGregor: we have too many components. :(
# [20:50] <AryehGregor> (first thing I should have looked for . . .)
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# [20:50] <bz> AryehGregor: (also in related news, the web has too many moving parts)
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# [20:53] <WG9s> bz:and way too many non-moving parts as well ;-)
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# [20:54] <bz> taras: ping?
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# [20:55] <taras> bz: pong
# [20:56] <NeilAway> ddahl: (actually QueryInterface is the first method, according to nsISupportsBase.h)
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# [20:56] <bz> taras: I can e-mail you a sessionstore file
# [20:56] <Ms2ger> NeilAway, indeed, and XPConnect relies on that
# [20:56] <bz> taras: the one I mailed the folks looking into gc/cc lag stuff
# [20:56] <WG9s> So, the entire perspective might be. It's hard to keep up, but some people are not even trying.
# [20:57] <NeilAway> Ms2ger: oh, I see you mentioned that, sorry
# [20:57] <bz> taras: but that assumes you don't plan to hand the file out to people....
# [20:57] <smontagu> is there a way to make file:///Users/smontagu/mozwork/hgtree/mozilla/layout/tools/reftest/reftest-analyzer.xhtml load a specific results file?
# [20:57] <taras> bz: i'll ping you if i dont get a public-safe one
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# [20:57] <bz> smontagu: the file input at the bottom?
# [20:57] <bz> taras: ok
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# [20:58] <smontagu> bz: I mean a way to specify the input file in advance without using the file input
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# [20:59] <smontagu> so I can refresh results with one click rather than 4
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# [20:59] <bz> ah
# [21:00] <bz> it doesn't have built-in support for that
# [21:00] <bz> you'd need to add it
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# [21:01] <NeilAway> edmorley: they used to use RealPlayer for Internet radio, did you want to go back to that?
# [21:01] * NeilAway actually found the RealPlayer version easier to use than the iPlayer version
# [21:01] <edmorley> oh my I'd forgotten about that
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# [21:05] <bz> AryehGregor: ping
# [21:05] <AryehGregor> bz, pong.
# [21:05] <edmorley> MichaelKohler++
# [21:05] <bz> AryehGregor: so document.open
# [21:05] <bz> AryehGregor: what's the desired end state?
# [21:05] <AryehGregor> What do you mean?
# [21:06] <bz> AryehGregor: what should the selection look like once document.open has run?
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# [21:06] <AryehGregor> bz, getSelection().rangeCount == 0, same as if you load a new page.
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# [21:06] <AryehGregor> That seems to be how IE and Opera behave.
# [21:06] <bz> AryehGregor: I thought you had a separate proposal to always make the selection contain a range
# [21:06] <bz> AryehGregor: how does this interact with that?
# [21:07] <AryehGregor> It supersedes it. :) I only suggested that because I was confused by this bug.
# [21:07] <bz> AryehGregor: ah, ok
# [21:07] <AryehGregor> I thought on a fresh page load, Gecko always has the selection's range collapsed to (document, 0).
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# [21:07] <MichaelKohler> edmorley: ?
# [21:07] <AryehGregor> In fact, that was just an artifact of my testing, because Live DOM Viewer was calling document.open(), and that left the old selection around but collapsed because all the children got removed.
# [21:07] <bz> AryehGregor: right
# [21:07] <bz> AryehGregor: ok, gotcha
# [21:07] <jlebar> Ms2ger, What, you expected something reasonable out of our test harness?
# [21:07] <edmorley> MichaelKohler: for taking on bug 558425 :-)
# [21:08] <AryehGregor> It looked like WebKit didn't behave that way because it doesn't clear setInterval on document.open(), so I was Ctrl-F5ing between tests anyway, which happened to also reset selection.
# [21:08] <bz> AryehGregor: yep
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# [21:08] <bz> AryehGregor: document.open is such utter crap. :(
# [21:08] <AryehGregor> No argument here.
# [21:09] <AryehGregor> Spec-wise, the change in requirement also affects history.back()/forward(), but Gecko might have already been correct in those cases anyway -- I didn't test.
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# [21:09] <bz> AryehGregor: hmm
# [21:09] <MichaelKohler> edmorley: ah, it makes me sad to see a bug being assigned and re-assigned to nobody twice ;)
# [21:09] <bz> AryehGregor: would one want to clear selections in pages going into bfcache?
# [21:09] <bz> AryehGregor: I'd argue no
# [21:09] <bz> AryehGregor: just have to condition the clearing on that boolean
# [21:10] <AryehGregor> You'd want to reset to the old page's selection, yes?
# [21:10] <AryehGregor> Still not preserve the current page's.
# [21:10] <bz> sure
# [21:10] <bz> but selection objects are per-page anyway
# [21:10] <bz> so all you need to do is not clear the old selection when going into bfcache
# [21:10] <bz> and then things are fine
# [21:10] <bz> that is, the object identity of window.selection changes on page navigations
# [21:11] <bz> so...
# [21:11] <AryehGregor> Hmm, I should probably test for that too.
# [21:11] <bz> or whatever the api for getting it is
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# [21:12] <AryehGregor> It's window.getSelection().
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# [21:17] <armenzg_mtg> espindola: how far are we to stop using the 10.5 sdk?
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# [21:22] <espindola> armenzg_mtg: depends on how long we are to moving the 10.5 debug build to a machine that has the 10.6 sdk :-)
# [21:22] <espindola> armenzg_mtg: all tests pass with the opt build when using the 10.6 sdk
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# [21:22] <espindola> if the same is true with debug
# [21:23] <espindola> we would be done
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# [21:23] <espindola> rail: see bug 715397
# [21:23] <espindola> armenzg_mtg: that is
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# [21:23] <espindola> armenzg_mtg: and in particular https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=c7fec001ba99
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# [21:26] <armenzg_mtg> espindola: OK. I wanted to hear it explicitely
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# [21:27] <espindola> armenzg: in summary, all depends on the debug build
# [21:27] <armenzg> once the 10.7 builders are up; do you think that we could do 1) opt build that works for 10.5/10.6/10.7, 2) debug builds for 10.5, 10.6 and 10.7 ?
# [21:27] <espindola> if it is clean, we are done
# [21:27] <armenzg> assuming we're using 10.6 sdk
# [21:27] <espindola> if it finds a month long bug, we are not
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# [21:27] <armenzg> OK
# [21:28] <armenzg> I have the patch almost ready
# [21:28] <espindola> armenzg: the 10.7 builders should have the 10.6 sdk, and we would use that
# [21:28] <armenzg> I think I found a clean way of writing it
# [21:28] <armenzg> OK
# [21:28] <espindola> so we should be producing the same binaries we are now
# [21:28] <espindola> *should*
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# [21:28] <armenzg> espindola: do you know any long term goals as switching to the 10.7 sdk? or nothing yet?
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# [21:29] <espindola> I know we will have to do it one day, but I don't know of any plans
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# [21:29] <sproing> hey everyone, can someone explain me please why my cache never goes beyond 220MB?
# [21:29] <sproing> is this by design?
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# [21:31] <AryehGregor> Oh . . . IE switches to an entirely new Selection object if you call document.open().
# [21:31] * AryehGregor revises
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# [21:31] <MichaelKohler> sproing: check Preferences -> Advanced -> Network .. there is a checkbox to limit the cache size
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# [21:33] <MichaelKohler> can anyone tell me why Services.prefs is undefined in browser/components/feeds/test/chrome/test_423060.xul and works in all other tests?
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# [21:35] <khuey> did you import Services.jsm?
# [21:35] <MichaelKohler> let me check
# [21:35] <sproing> I checked this settings and it is set to 1024 and i don't have checked "Override automatic cache management" either
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# [21:36] <MichaelKohler> so maybe 220MB is the limit defined by "automatic cache management".. I dunno, sorry
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# [21:36] <sproing> yeah, i tough the same but dunno either. thanks anyway
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# [21:37] <MichaelKohler> khuey: doesn't seem to be imported.. thanks :)
# [21:38] <MichaelKohler> << stupid me
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# [21:39] <khuey> MichaelKohler: np
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# [21:39] <sproing> anyone have any idea what is the size of cache of automatic cache management?
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# [21:39] <Ms2ger> biesi?
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# [21:41] <armenzg> thanks espindola
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# [21:45] <mbrubeck> sproing: The code for that is here: http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/netwerk/cache/nsCacheService.cpp#601
# [21:45] <espindola> armenzg: np
# [21:46] <mbrubeck> sproing: It sets the max to a percentage of the available disk space.
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# [21:47] * khuey grmbles
# [21:47] <khuey> bitten by const temporaries again
# [21:48] <gaston> js/xpconnect/src/XPCJSRuntime.cpp:1881:error: invalid conversion from 'PRInt64*' to 'int64_t*'
# [21:48] <Ms2ger> gaston, sorry!
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# [21:48] <gaston> oh, you mean it's already fixed ?
# [21:48] <Ms2ger> No
# [21:48] <Ms2ger> But I broke you
# [21:48] <gaston> grr i'm so tired of those conflicting types errors i'm the only one experiencing :)
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# [21:49] <edmorley> gaston: landed today, so likely not something specific to your build setup
# [21:49] <Ms2ger> I'd love to move to stdint-only, myself
# [21:49] <Ms2ger> edmorley, yeah, it is
# [21:49] <Ms2ger> Only really obscure platforms break ;)
# [21:50] <edmorley> oh I thought gaston meant his patch queue had bitrotted
# [21:50] <gaston> sprinkling a cast to (int64_t*), but i'm pretty sure it's not the way to go....
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# [21:50] <Ms2ger> gaston, I was going to do that, but I wasn't sure you needed it
# [21:51] <bjacob> Hey, I started this wiki page about improving our internal Strings classes:
# [21:51] <bjacob> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Platform/Fix_Strings
# [21:51] <bjacob> Please expand it with your ideas!
# [21:51] <Ms2ger> Kill them all
# [21:51] <khuey> is "nuke it from orbit" an acceptable idea?
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# [21:51] <Ms2ger> khuey, :)
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# [21:52] <bjacob> khuey: unfortunately, i hear that we still need to handle strings
# [21:52] <gaston> Ms2ger: i'll send the bug report to you if it fixes it :)
# [21:52] <Ms2ger> Please do :)
# [21:52] <gaston> strings are overrated
# [21:52] <bjacob> strings mean thongs in french
# [21:52] <khuey> bjacob: lets just steal qt's string code
# [21:52] <Ms2ger> Not just in French
# [21:52] <gaston> :)
# [21:53] <Ms2ger> As long as we don't use the jseng's strings, they're unusable
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# [21:53] <bjacob> khuey: QStrings sure have a much nicer API, and I believe that WebKit strings derive from that. What I don't know at all is how they compare performance wise, and whether any switch would be feasible (i'm afraid not)
# [21:54] <bjacob> khuey: so in that wiki page i'm NOT discussing ditching existing strings classes,
# [21:54] <bjacob> khuey: i'm just discussing what we can do to improve incrementally
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# [21:55] <Ms2ger> Does the tuple stuff still exist?
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# [21:55] <khuey> no
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# [21:55] <khuey> all gecko strings are flat
# [21:55] <Ms2ger> bjacob, do you know about nsPrintfCString?
# [21:55] <bjacob> khuey: what? operator+ still returns a nsSubstringTuple
# [21:56] <khuey> oh god
# [21:56] <bjacob> Ms2ger: no i didn't
# [21:56] <khuey> don't talk about nsPrintfCString
# [21:56] <bjacob> khuey: isn't that a neat optimization? (the operator+ returning a tuple)
# [21:56] <jdm> heh
# [21:56] <Ms2ger> khuey, I hear it's been fixed
# [21:56] <Ms2ger> bjacob, in theory, I'm sure it is :)
# [21:57] <Ms2ger> Can't say that I know why we got rid of them
# [21:57] <khuey> AIUI, because ropes don't help that much
# [21:57] <khuey> and add a lot of complexity
# [21:57] <khuey> we might still have them for operator +
# [21:57] <khuey> but adding strings together is pretty rare
# [21:58] <Ms2ger> Unless you need to optimize JS benchmarks :)
# [21:58] <khuey> yeah, well, that's their cross to bear now
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# [22:03] <edmorley> ehsan: I'm presuming the next time the dictionary thing occurs, observing what the value of spellchecker.dictionary is would be useful?
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# [22:04] <ehsan> edmorley: perhaps. ideally, you should fire up inspector and look at the .lang property of the element
# [22:04] <ehsan> and also let us know what dictionaries you have installed
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# [22:05] <edmorley> ehsan: I'll keep more of an eye out next time
# [22:06] <ehsan> edmorley: thanks
# [22:06] <Wes_> Is it possible to remove the top 1px of artwork from firefox in fullscreen mode without re-compiling? (I'm doing a kiosk-style demo)
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# [22:07] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/7c7d2a8db7ff - Kyle Huey - Bug 703133: Flush layout data asynchronously on charset changes. r=bz
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# [22:16] <NeilAway> bjacob: have you not heard of nsPrintfCString?
# [22:16] <NeilAway> bah, scrollback strikes again
# [22:17] * gavin was just about to say
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# [22:17] <NeilAway> well, at least Ms2ger left already, so he can't nag me twice in one day
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# [22:18] <Callek> NeilAway: haha
# [22:18] <bjacob> NeilAway: i hadn't. does it do exactly what I was asking for?
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# [22:20] <bjacob> NeilAway: is that a different class though? isn't that weird?
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# [22:22] <NeilAway> bjacob: hmm, it's more like the old AppendPrintf that was limited in the number of characters that it accepted
# [22:22] * NeilAway hadn't noticed that jmuizelaar had enhanced it
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# [22:23] <NeilAway> bjacob: except that its buffer is 15 characters rather than 31
# [22:23] * bjacob removed stuff from the wiki page
# [22:24] <bjacob> there only remain 2 todo items, but i'm sure with some imagination we can find more issues. then it would be nice to write good docs
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# [22:24] <NeilAway> bjacob: you can override nsPrintfCString's buffer size, but a) it's not automatic b) it causes an allocation
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# [22:25] <NeilAway> bjacob: so AppendPrintf is superior in that it dynamically determines the size, but inferior because of all the extra allocations it does
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# [22:26] <NeilAway> bjacob: now, what was it you were asking for again? ;-)
# [22:26] <Waldo> firebot: ping
# [22:26] <firebot> Waldo: pong
# [22:26] * roc cheers the removal of XPCOM proxies
# [22:26] <Waldo> gaston: we can get those on Windows, too, and worse yet, for {u,}int32_t
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# [22:26] <Waldo> gaston: Ms2ger likely counts that as a really obscure platform ;-)
# [22:27] * Waldo wonders why Ms2ger doesn't like the JS string hierarchy
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# [22:27] <Waldo> 'cause it seems to work perfectly for JS
# [22:27] <zpao> philor: have you seen any oranges lately due to timing out while waiting for the server to start (on mochitests)
# [22:27] <zpao> i found bug 522617, but that's long closed
# [22:28] <Waldo> and note that for DOM it'd be pretty nice, too, because then you're only flattening at the last moment, not (potentially) earlier just because you're passing an artificial boundary in the browser engine
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# [22:28] <Waldo> gaston: just curious, is int64_t long long for you, and PRUint64 just long? or what's the underlying disagreement?
# [22:29] <Waldo> (or vice versa)
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# [22:32] <khuey> where does one find old firefox releases?
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# [22:33] * khuey thought it was supposed to be ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/
# [22:33] <bhearsum> should be....
# [22:33] <bhearsum> looks like they're there, to me
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# [22:33] <Callek> khuey: don't go there from http:// since it redirects to mirror network, ftp://ftp.mozilla.org... it is
# [22:33] <khuey> uh
# [22:33] <khuey> weird
# [22:34] <bhearsum> yeah, it's not ideal
# [22:34] <khuey> the latest version was 3.5.something
# [22:34] <khuey> and then I refreshed
# [22:34] <khuey> and they were there
# [22:34] <bhearsum> huh
# [22:34] <bhearsum> i bet you cancelled the page load partway through
# [22:35] <khuey> I don't think I did
# [22:35] <khuey> the connection might have choked or something though
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# [22:35] <bhearsum> s/you/something/
# [22:35] <khuey> yeah
# [22:35] * khuey is on a pretty flimsy network put together with stolen wifi and multiple vpns
# [22:35] <bhearsum> ah
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# [22:41] <nemo> khuey: "stolen" isn't "stolen" unless you ran aircrack :)
# [22:41] * mattwoodrow|away is now known as mattwoodrow
# [22:41] <nemo> I have an open wifi for neighbours to use
# [22:41] <khuey> yeah, I know
# [22:42] * khuey leaves his wifi open at home too
# [22:42] <Waldo> bleh, bz left
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# [22:42] <khuey> most people think I'm silly for some reason
# [22:42] <nemo> khuey: well. mine is rate limited, and firewalled off from main network
# [22:42] <nemo> khuey: also I put a warning in the name about monitoring, although I'm not actually logging right now
# [22:42] <nemo> but you know. in case I want to
# [22:43] <mbrubeck> I have open wifi too. Houses here are spread out enough that I only have a handful of neighbors in range.
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# [22:43] <darktrojan> my wifi can only be used with a palantir
# [22:44] <nemo> palantir has low-bandwidth video. lot of snow.
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# [22:45] <darktrojan> that's what the flames are for
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# [22:48] <hub> Aurora on Mac eat 1GB of RSS, with 282MB unclassified and 538MB in js
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# [22:49] <edmorley> khuey, nemo: why open out of interest?
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# [22:51] <nemo> edmorley: politeness, philosophical opposition to demonisation of open wifi
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# [22:51] <nemo> edmorley: if I like having open wifi, I feel I should also have open wifi. I'm just careful how I do it is all.
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# [22:51] <nemo> s/having/using/
# [22:52] <jhammel> i guess i'm too paranoid/not knowledgeable enough about network security to have an open wifi network
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# [22:53] <MichaelKohler> zpao: ping
# [22:53] <zpao> MichaelKohler: pong
# [22:53] <MichaelKohler> zpao: is it okay to implement bug 558425 here: http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/browser/components/sessionstore/src/nsSessionStore.js#397 ?
# [22:54] <edmorley> nemo: fair enough :-) (in comparison I have 14 wireless networks in range here, so plenty of people in range of mine, so I wouldn't dream of opening it up)
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# [22:55] <nemo> edmorley: about same number around here
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# [22:55] <nemo> edmorley: mostly verizon wifi users
# [22:55] <zpao> MichaelKohler: yea, seems like a fair place to start
# [22:55] <nemo> edmorley: verizon wifi is technically excured... by 40 bit WPA where the first 2 or 3 chars are identical to the network name
# [22:55] <nemo> edmorley: basically, you can "hack" verizon wifi just by trial and error
# [22:55] <MichaelKohler> zpao: okay, I'll get back in touch with you when I get a first WIP patch
# [22:56] <nemo> edmorley: 36^2 combinations I think
# [22:56] <nemo> s/excured/secured/
# [22:56] <zpao> MichaelKohler: excellent. good to see you back in sessionstore land :)
# [22:56] <khuey> edmorley: well, the last apartment I lived in, we had shared ethernet provided by the apartment complex
# [22:56] <MichaelKohler> zpao: you remember me? wow :)
# [22:56] <edmorley> nemo: ha
# [22:56] <khuey> edmorley: so there wasn't much point to locking down the wireless ;-)
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# [22:57] <zpao> MichaelKohler: it's definitely been a while. i actually briefly looked back at your safe mode stuff a month or 2 ago
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# [22:59] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
# [22:59] <edmorley> khuey: true :-) (I don't use the wifi here either since I actually like to get the full 40meg)
# [22:59] <njn> what IRC command can I use to find out which channels a person is logged into?
# [22:59] <jhammel> /whois
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# [22:59] <camd> bz: ping
# [23:01] <njn> jhammel: that doesn't tell me which channels they're on
# [23:01] * njn is trying to find jorgev
# [23:01] <jhammel> huh, it does for me
# [23:01] <jhammel> (irssi)
# [23:01] <Waldo> === njn: member of #amo, #addons, #metrics, @#memshrink, #developers, and #jsapi
# [23:01] <njn> jhammel: huh, not with Chatzilla
# [23:01] <Waldo> from /whois
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# [23:01] <Waldo> in ChatZilla
# [23:01] <camd> mccr8: Would you be interested / able to join QA in a 3:30 meeting about the GC / CC investigation?
# [23:02] <njn> Waldo: but he's not on any of those channels, AFAICT
# [23:02] <zpao> njn: then he's not connected. whois is an irc command afaik so even chatzilla should be able to do it
# [23:02] <jhammel> njn: abict he is not in any channels
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# [23:02] <Waldo> njn: that was from /whois njn
# [23:03] <camd> mccr8: that's 3:30 PT, fwiw
# [23:03] <mccr8> camd: sure
# [23:03] * rail is now known as rail_away
# [23:03] <jhammel> although i guess(?) there are hidden channels?
# [23:03] <camd> mccr8: are you onsite in MV?
# [23:03] <mccr8> camd: I am.
# [23:03] <njn> Waldo: oh, I see the list for myself. So jorgev must not be on any channels ATM
# [23:03] <camd> cool. OK, so we'll meet in Zombocom near the QA bullpin...
# [23:03] <njn> ok, thanks
# [23:03] <Waldo> possible
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# [23:03] <camd> mccr8: ttyt, thanks
# [23:04] <njn> Waldo: I would have expected him to be on #addons or #amo if he's on anywher
# [23:04] <Waldo> *shrug*
# [23:04] * NeilAway wonders why he doesn't see njn as a member of #amo or #addons - maybe channel modes?
# [23:04] <Waldo> could you have mistyped a nick?
# [23:05] <philor> zpao: like, every single mochitest on a particular build, a build on a recent merge from mozilla-central?
# [23:05] <MichaelKohler> zpao: one more question.. do we want to overwrite the existing file if there are two crashes on one specific day or just add (1) or something like that?
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# [23:06] <zpao> philor: it looks like it's every single mochitest on a build (win only) - https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Fx-Team&rev=932d5d369d4e
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# [23:06] <philor> zpao: clobbering time!
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# [23:07] <gavin> NeilAway: he's not in those channels
# [23:07] <philor> zpao: glandium's message to whichever newsgroup it was, planning maybe, made it sound like it could hit any platform, even though I've only seen it on Windows, so you might as well clobber everything
# [23:07] <BenB> <rant> wow, our CSS transitions are really broken/incomplete. (bug 571344, bug 537143, bug 683696)
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# [23:08] <MichaelKohler> philor: AFAICT it never happens on Linux builds
# [23:08] <zpao> philor: ah thanks, i should read up on my newsgroups
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# [23:11] <zpao> MichaelKohler: i'd rather not overwrite anything down this path. it might make sense to get more accurate on the file (include -HH-MM)
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# [23:11] <MichaelKohler> zpao: okay, does definitely make sense. what about the maximum files?
# [23:12] <MichaelKohler> *maximal number of files
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# [23:12] <zpao> MichaelKohler: let's go pref controlled, default 10, -1=unlimited? (not sure we want to do 0)...
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# [23:13] <MichaelKohler> zpao: I don't think 0 is a good idea (that would mean no backup at all)
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# [23:14] <zpao> MichaelKohler: right, though that's possible now too (restore_from_crash == false)
# [23:14] <MichaelKohler> mh
# [23:15] <MichaelKohler> then I guess 0 and positive values = number of files and -1=unlimited is the best way
# [23:15] <zpao> yea, for now. it shouldn't be hard to change. i hadn't give it much thought before now
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# [23:18] <MichaelKohler> zpao: perfect, thanks
# [23:18] <jesup> 10 sessionstores could be large if you have ones like I do (20-25MB); some others have reported 50MB. A single google search in one tab can add 200-800Kb
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# [23:19] <jesup> MichaelKohler: bug 669603
# [23:19] <jorendorff> who knows about NodeLists?
# [23:19] <zpao> jesup: yea, it could. those aren't typical though (and i thought we moved the google problem out of sessionstore.js)
# [23:19] <jorendorff> particularly the proxy-ness of them
# [23:19] <khuey> peterv
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# [23:19] <zpao> oh we didn't finish that yet... ttaubert!
# [23:20] <jduell> khuey: do you know if we have any portable code for getting CPU utlilization?
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# [23:20] <khuey> jduell: not that I'm aware of
# [23:20] <jduell> khuey: dang.
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# [23:21] <ttaubert> zpao: woot, that bug is stuck :/
# [23:21] <jesup> zpao: Nope, not done, and blocked on deciding what the correct on-crash behavior is
# [23:21] <ttaubert> zpao: basically because the cache has bad side-effects
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# [23:22] <jorendorff> gal: can you tell me about the new implementation of NodeLists?
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# [23:23] <zpao> jesup: i thought the on-crash behavior was going to be "as close as possible as current behavior"
# [23:23] <jesup> Not with that patch
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# [23:23] <jesup> If you watn current behavior, you need a different solution
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# [23:23] <ttaubert> zpao: bug 711465 blocks
# [23:24] <zpao> ttaubert: right right
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# [23:25] <MichaelKohler> zpao: I'll get back in touch with you within the next days
# [23:25] <jesup> Probably the data lost from m.d.performance can be retrieved from google (argh). Suggestions involved leveldb, flat files, a journal-type mechanism and only adding deltas (with occasional cleanups), etc
# [23:25] <NeilAway> who knows about the browser UI for bookmarks?
# [23:26] <zpao> MichaelKohler: i'll try to be quick with feedback/reviews :) thanks for picking that up
# [23:26] <MichaelKohler> zpao: np
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# [23:26] <MichaelKohler> zpao: thanks for answering my questions
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# [23:27] <jesup> zpao: we do need to solve the sessionstore.js size problem (bug 669603) in some manner. It's causing real UI interaction problems ("jank" though as always I hate the term)
# [23:27] <zpao> jesup: https://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.platform/browse_thread/thread/22db7ef0faff6999/51978492acbbb58d?pli=1 is part of it
# [23:27] <espindola> !seen mak
# [23:27] <firebot> mak was last seen 29 hours, 50 minutes and 59 seconds ago, changing nick to mak|afk.
# [23:27] <zpao> for some reason i can't find your original comment
# [23:27] <espindola> I think I found and interesting bug with asyncClose
# [23:27] <jesup> yes, I think the interesting stuff (from shaver, bz, etc) was in .performance
# [23:28] <espindola> who should I discuss it with?
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# [23:29] <jesup> zpao: yes, thank the admins who removed the .performance group instead of renaming it to .archive or some such. Original message was x-posted to platform, follow-ups to performance though only some used it
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# [23:29] <jesup> I still have the headers in my newsreader, but no articles
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# [23:31] <jesup> My original message is in my Sent folder, I can add it somewhere
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# [23:32] <jesup> http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1445359
# [23:32] <zpao> heh, i just found it in my inbox & pasted it right before you
# [23:33] <nemo> Does anyone know if SPDY is safe to enable? I'm a bit nervous about protocol level changes, but quite a few people I know use beta or alpha.
# [23:33] <nemo> Was wondering if anyone had voiced any concerns about it, in terms of it opening new attack opportunities
# [23:33] <nemo> like session hijacks or somesuch
# [23:34] <jesup> zpao: I don't have shaver/bz/bsmedberg's/etc responses though
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# [23:37] <taras> bent: ping
# [23:38] <zpao> jesup: i don't either (i didn't get dev.platform to my inbox). google has https://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.performance/browse_thread/thread/22db7ef0faff6999/6921a65b0a56d186 but that doesn't include everything either... sigh
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# [23:38] <taras> jesup: also regarding size probem, is it the per-tab size?
# [23:38] <taras> size problem
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# [23:39] * jorendorff sees dombindings_gen.h
# [23:39] <bent> taras, hi
# [23:40] <taras> bent: when an addon causes a freeze or jank
# [23:40] <taras> is there a specific place in the code we can detect that?
# [23:40] <jesup> It's that sites can store (in each tab) up to a lot of data (2MB?), even if they're deep in the history of the tab. A single google search can add 200-800KB to that tab. Multiple by the number of tabs in use... and each site can store data (though few are as bad as google)
# [23:41] <taras> jesup: so the problem is that we are reserializing same data over and over?
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# [23:41] <taras> seems like writing out 2mb once should be ok(assuming it's rare)
# [23:41] <bent> taras, i don't think so
# [23:42] <bent> taras, wait, do you mean plugin?
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# [23:42] <taras> bent: err, sorry yes
# [23:42] <bent> ah ok
# [23:42] <jdm> is there a DOM event that fires after all script blocks have run to completion?
# [23:42] <bent> there's a timeout for plugins
# [23:42] <bent> and a handler
# [23:42] <jdm> it could be the load event, I just don't know
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# [23:42] <jesup> taras: yes, we're collecting (expensive) and re-JSON-ing all the data on every re-save (pretty much a few seconds after almost any action)
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# [23:43] <taras> jesup: that sounds stupid
# [23:43] <zpao> taras: the problem is that it's part of a js object that's stringified before writing to disk
# [23:43] * jmaher is now known as jmaher|afk
# [23:43] <jesup> taras++
# [23:43] <taras> bent: link?
# [23:43] <jesup> Which is why the bug has "architectural problem" in the title
# [23:43] <njn> dholbert, mounir: ping
# [23:43] <bent> taras, on parent side there's this: https://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/dom/plugins/ipc/PluginModuleParent.cpp#221
# [23:43] <taras> jesup: that sounds entirely solvable, i was worried it was something harder
# [23:44] <bent> taras, child side https://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/dom/plugins/ipc/PluginModuleChild.cpp#533
# [23:44] <zpao> so dietrich was going to start working on the "quick" fix of not recollecting unnecessary data, which should take out a large chunk of the collection problem
# [23:44] <njn> dholbert, mounir: I set --enable-warnigs-as-errors and I get this: content/html/content/src/nsHTMLTableElement.cpp:709:12: error: variable ‘rv’ set but not used [-Werror=unused-but-set-variable]
# [23:44] <khuey> it's a filed bug
# [23:44] <taras> jesup: dietrich has it on his q1 guals to fix this bugger
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# [23:44] <jesup> I know at least 6 ways to solve it (of varying levels of acceptability). None of the good ones are simple...
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# [23:44] <dholbert> njn, pong
# [23:45] <taras> jesup: ok
# [23:45] <dholbert> njn, there's a bug already, mats has a fix
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# [23:45] <zpao> jesup: once the collection is minimal, the problem point becomes stringify
# [23:45] <dholbert> njn, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=716904
# [23:45] <bent> taras, nothing for jank though
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# [23:45] <jesup> Shaver's lost post had a good rundown of sample ways to solve it
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# [23:46] <jesup> zpao: yes, because stringifying the object uses huge amount of ram and time.
# [23:46] <njn> dholbert: why doesn't it break the tinderboxes?
# [23:46] <dholbert> njn, they're running older GCC versions that don't have that warning
# [23:46] <dholbert> unused-but-set-variable is relatively new (maybe new in 4.6?)
# [23:46] <jesup> zpao: if I remember my experiments, most of the pain is in JSON
# [23:46] <njn> dholbert: the linux tinderboxes aren't running 4.6? oh
# [23:47] * Joins: espindola (espindola@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP)
# [23:47] * njn turns of --enable-warnings-as-errors
# [23:47] <dholbert> njn, alternately, you can import mats' fix
# [23:47] <zpao> jesup: yea, i fixed a big problem in stringifying, so it's better but not idea
# [23:47] <dholbert> njn, (that's what I did)
# [23:47] <dholbert> njn, you also need a fix from me for nsCheapSets that's on m-i but not m-c yet
# [23:47] <khuey> nsCheapSets needs to get stabbed in teh face
# [23:47] <njn> dholbert: I'll just wait a little longer while the kinks are ironed out
# [23:48] <jesup> zpao: The real solution is to get out of the "one big object" model
# [23:48] <dholbert> njn, sounds good
# [23:48] <njn> dholbert: +1 for doing all this, however
# [23:48] <zpao> jesup: if we can move that off the main thread then we'll be pretty much as good as we can be without a new architecture
# [23:48] <dholbert> njn, all credit to Volkmar, he's been driving this!
# [23:48] <khuey> zpao: considered using indexeddb?
# [23:48] <njn> dholbert: both of you are doing good stuff
# [23:48] <dholbert> thanks :)
# [23:48] <zpao> khuey: it's definitely on my radar
# [23:48] <khuey> it'll serialize object graphs for you
# [23:48] <jesup> zpao: yes, though you spike memory use by ~3-4x the file size last I checked, so it's still not good
# [23:49] <khuey> and do the i/o off the main thread
# [23:49] <khuey> etc
# [23:49] <dholbert> khuey, you're on windows 7, right?
# [23:49] <khuey> dholbert: yes
# [23:49] <dholbert> khuey, if you get a chance, can you confirm https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=717381 ?
# [23:49] <jesup> zpao: indexeddb was one of the serious suggestions.
# [23:49] <zpao> khuey: err, leveldb right? indexeddb is something else
# [23:49] <jesup> Sorry, leveldb
# [23:50] * Quits: espindola (espindola@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP) (Client exited)
# [23:50] <jesup> (too many db's)
# [23:50] <zpao> indeed
# [23:50] * njn realizes that by managing to debug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710594#c28 just from a crash stack trace, he's earnt some kind of Gecko/XPCOM badge
# [23:50] <khuey> zpao: no, indexeddb
# [23:51] * njn levels up
# [23:51] <khuey> Achievement Unlocked: Diagnose a reference counting problem without a debugger
# [23:52] <jesup> Primary idea was to get the session storage data out of the sessionstore.js file, or break the sessionstore.js file into discrete updateable objects in a DB so updating one doesn't hit all the others (and you can make good use of 'dirty' bits, etc)
# [23:52] <njn> khuey: what's a debugger?
# [23:52] * njn levels down
# [23:52] <khuey> njn: printf
# [23:53] <njn> khuey: ah, that I know
# [23:53] <khuey> dholbert: is the azure pref live?
# [23:53] <jesup> shaver suggested flat files-per-tab... Not sure I want to go there
# [23:53] <khuey> or do I need to restart?
# [23:53] * Quits: madhava (madhava@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP) (Quit: madhava)
# [23:53] <dholbert> khuey, not sure; I suspect you need to restart
# [23:53] <jesup> he also suggested a bunch of other stuff if we can ever find the message
# [23:53] <zpao> yea, flat files per tab is overkill
# [23:53] * Parts: BenB (ben@B911518A.DD7DF417.DDA41192.IP) (Konversation terminating Quasselstrippen)
# [23:54] <dholbert> khuey, (thanks! Marek has written tons of cool SVG demos and is a generally stand-up guy, so I feel an obligation to not leave one of his bugs UNCO for too long. :))
# [23:54] * Quits: vladan (vladan@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP) (Ping timeout)
# [23:54] <zpao> jesup: bam http://old.nabble.com/SessionStore-size---Bloat-in-sessionstore.js-from-Google-and-others-causing-major-UI-freezes-td32091916.html
# [23:54] * Joins: vladan (vladan@F2D29657.F60B0462.67AC9B1.IP)
# [23:55] <khuey> dholbert: looks the same for me with it on or off
# [23:55] <khuey> dholbert: though, I'm on a nightly from 1/8
# [23:55] <khuey> think it may have regressed recently?
# [23:56] <dholbert> khuey, I think the azure pref only started doing something useful recently
# [23:56] <dholbert> khuey, (not sure)
# [23:56] * juanb|afk is now known as juanb
# [23:57] * khuey updates
# [23:57] * Quits: stevee (Miranda@moz-BEBDF855.cable.virginmedia.com) (Quit: Miranda IM - Multi protocol instant messenger @ www.miranda-im.org)
# [23:58] * Joins: victorporo (victorporo@BCAA178E.F4308271.4873E54D.IP)
# [23:58] * Quits: victorporo (victorporo@BCAA178E.F4308271.4873E54D.IP) (Connection reset by peer)
# [23:59] <bent> zpao, indexeddb ftw!
# [23:59] * Quits: victorporof (victorporo@BCAA178E.F4308271.4873E54D.IP) (Ping timeout)
# [23:59] * Quits: pascalc (chatzilla@moz-56C5326B.rev.sfr.net) (Ping timeout)
# [23:59] <khuey> dholbert: can't reproduce
# [23:59] <khuey> bent: srsly!
# Session Close: Thu Jan 12 00:00:01 2012

The end :)