/irc-logs / mozilla / #developers / 2012-02-08 / end

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# Session Start: Wed Feb 08 00:00:00 2012
# Session Ident: #developers
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# [00:18] <edmorley> mak: wow thanks, didn't expect to start marking and find them all done :-)
# [00:19] <mak> edmorley: you're welcome!
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# [00:34] <nemo> NeilAway: Your suggestion does work
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# [00:35] <nemo> NeilAway: although I couldn't try it at first 'cause I lost my internet for a little while
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# [00:38] * njn just got his hoodie
# [00:38] * njn doesn't like the new tab screen :(
# [00:38] * darktrojan has not got his hoodie :(
# [00:38] <nemo> NeilAway, stuart, cmr: http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase242d.xhtml tests neil's suggestion of using a scaled image instead
# [00:38] <nemo> NeilAway: this obviously saves a ton of memory on the canvas and reduces the amount of work in javascript by a lot
# [00:39] <cmr> 0ms
# [00:39] <cmr> nemo: hows about with my image?
# [00:39] <nemo> cmr: I just changed it back to that
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# [00:39] <nemo> cmr: now. that time is just for the loop, so obviously it'll be ridiculously fast
# [00:39] <nemo> cmr: now. the question is, how would it be implemented in-browser.
# [00:40] <nemo> you know... I think I'll add the canvas creation time to the timing on that one, since the loop is basically non-existent
# [00:40] <jdm> I don't even know who I should talk to to find out if I should expect a hoodie
# [00:40] <jdm> I heard that non-employees were receiving tem
# [00:40] <nemo> hm. doesn't seem to matter
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# [00:41] <nemo> bz_away: yeah, NeilAway's suggestion makes it plenty efficient IMO
# [00:41] <@khuey> jdm: contact Amie
# [00:41] <cmr> nemo: is this lightness value from 0 to 255?
# [00:41] <nemo> cmr: yeah
# [00:41] <jdm> thanks
# [00:41] <darktrojan> what does the hoodie look like?
# [00:42] * njn finds browser.newtab.url, but setting it to about:blank doesn't seem to work
# [00:42] <nemo> cmr: I assume the scaling algorithm automatically handles what happens when transparent pixels are collapsed. The values aren't *quite* the same as iterating over the image, but they are quite close
# [00:42] <darktrojan> pics pls
# [00:42] <nemo> cmr: off by maybe 1 or 2%
# [00:42] <sfink> it's browser.newtab.enabled, I think
# [00:42] <ttaubert> njn: sorry needs a restart for now
# [00:42] <njn> darktrojan: black, with orange drawstring around the hood, "Firefox" sewn into the front, and a small plastic firefox logo sewn onto the left sleeve
# [00:42] <jhammel> darktrojan: http://media.photobucket.com/image/recent/mf37/DreadPirateFezzik.jpg
# [00:42] <cmr> nemo: close enough for it to not matter
# [00:42] <darktrojan> ttaubert, my new tab page doesn't get thumbnails, was that a bug a few days ago?
# [00:43] <darktrojan> my build is out of date
# [00:43] <ttaubert> it still is :)
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# [00:43] <darktrojan> nice jhammel
# [00:43] <darktrojan> ttaubert, it used to get them! :(
# [00:43] <njn> darktrojan: can you view https://www.yammer.com/mozilla.com/uploaded_files/3891523 ?
# [00:43] <heycam> I think the orange drawstring is what makes it
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# [00:43] <jhammel> darktrojan: make sure you get the black one or.... http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-0fN35p9MN8s/TtKL2QU0LiI/AAAAAAAAUS0/rIoxDvhHjsE/s1600/Funny-Demotovational-Invisibility-Cloaks.jpg
# [00:43] * heycam is still waiting for his
# [00:44] <darktrojan> no njn :(
# [00:44] <hub> *sigh* I get an orange on Android opt
# [00:44] <edmorley> njn: you can toggle the newtab matrix off using the cross top right of the content area
# [00:45] <ttaubert> darktrojan: mhh, they unfortunately get lost on crash/forced quit
# [00:45] <njn> darktrojan: http://valgrind.org/njn/hoodie.jpg
# [00:45] <ttaubert> darktrojan: and don't show for pages that redirect
# [00:45] <@khuey> heycam: mine arrived the day after I moved to the SF office
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# [00:45] <heycam> khuey, arrived… in florida?
# [00:45] <njn> darktrojan: that's not a photo of me, BTW
# [00:45] <nemo> bz_away: ok. add the neil suggestion plz/thnx :D - that one it wouldn't matter even if the image was 10000x10000
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# [00:46] <darktrojan> njn I didn't think you'd be wearing a beanie at this time of year
# [00:46] <njn> edmorley: thanks! I see browser.newtabpage.enabled=false is now set in about:config
# [00:46] * njn wonders what browser.newtab.url is supposed to do
# [00:46] <ttaubert> njn: it sets the url used for new tab pages
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# [00:47] <njn> ttaubert: doesn't seem to do anything. Do I need to restart?
# [00:47] <ttaubert> yes, for now, fixed soon
# [00:47] <@khuey> heycam: yes
# [00:47] <njn> ttaubert: np, just curious
# [00:47] <heycam> khuey, oops
# [00:47] <@khuey> heycam: they asked for my address a month earlier :-/
# [00:47] <ttaubert> njn: np :)
# [00:48] <hub> edmorley: how do you guys deal with Android failures?
# [00:48] * jhammel drinks
# [00:48] <@khuey> bsmedberg: ping
# [00:48] <jwatt> wow, Instruments sure makes it hard to create a nicely formatted text file from a profile
# [00:48] <heycam> on windows my debug builds get a bunch of "### ERROR: SymGetModuleInfo64" messages when assertions occur, I think. is there a way I can fix that?
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# [00:50] <cpearce> How do I get a fix into ESR10? Is there a document somewhere saying how?
# [00:51] <darktrojan> cpearce, I think there's an approval-esr10? flag
# [00:51] <jdm> cpearce: I've emailed akeybl about that myself!
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# [00:51] <edmorley> hub: random.choice(['retrigger', 'attempt to manually look up bug and star', 'ignore', '302 philor'])
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# [00:52] <hub> edmorley: the thing is that it is on inbound
# [00:52] <hub> :-/
# [00:52] <darktrojan> ok it's a tracking flag, not an approval
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# [00:52] <darktrojan> edmorley++
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# [00:53] <jhammel> edmorley: if you only responded sooner that is qbo-able ;)
# [00:53] <darktrojan> do it anyway
# [00:54] <edmorley> jhammel: the irony being that the delay was due to me retriggering a bunch of android failures on inbound...
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# [00:56] <@roc> excellent! I found a real PDF I need to read, that pdf.js can render but Adobe Reader can't
# [00:56] <gavin> is it a pdf about pdf.js?
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# [00:56] <@roc> amazingly, no
# [00:56] <darktrojan> roc++
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# [00:58] <@dolske> cpearce: you mean asking about if a bug can get into an ESR, or actually landing a fix for ESR?
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# [01:00] <Cww> cpearce: if you're asking what I think you're asking, we decided that this was going to be chemspilled into 10 and 10ESR
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# [01:00] <gavin> akeybl just sent that info to release-drivers
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# [01:01] * jhammel can't wait for pdf.js
# [01:01] <gavin> cpearce: you're going to want to land on https://hg.mozilla.org/releases/mozilla-esr10/, but wait for releng to provide details
# [01:01] <cpearce> dolske: both. I have a fix that should go into ESR.
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# [01:01] <gavin> (I imagine it might be on the relbranch)
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# [01:02] <@khuey> jhammel: who said you have to wait for it?
# [01:02] <edmorley> hub: basically until bug 690311 is resolved, a good proportion of the 'failures' are not test failures, but pre/post test scripts failing
# [01:02] <jhammel> khuey: is it in nightly yet?
# [01:02] <@khuey> jhammel: there's an extension you can download
# [01:02] <hub> edmorley: ok
# [01:02] <@dolske> aiui, the process is basically the same as getting onto aurora/beta. request approval, when approved land on esr branch (http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/mozilla-esr10)
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# [01:03] <@dolske> worst case you can always just email release-drivers@ and ask. :)
# [01:03] <cpearce> There's no approval flag. Not yet anyway.
# [01:03] <aja> btw....mentioned earlierm ubt never filed.....there's mixed branding on ESR branch builds....blue menu (ok) but orange icons
# [01:03] <@dolske> ah
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# [01:04] <@dolske> probably tracking-firefox10 (set to "?")
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# [01:05] <@dolske> half guessing here, but I think the intention is that the ESR and release it's built on will generally track each other, and that it would be unusual to land on one but not the other.
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# [01:05] <@dolske> but you're the.... 1st? 2nd? bug to through this so I'm sure it will be all new and exciting.
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# [01:15] <edmorley> mbrubeck: btw your email on https://wiki.mozilla.org/Modules/All#Fennec is still the old one, don't know if that's intentional?
# [01:16] <mbrubeck> That email's still valid... I'll just leave it for now.
# [01:16] <mbrubeck> thanks though
# [01:17] <edmorley> mbrubeck: cool just wanted to check :-)
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# [01:17] <edmorley> saves on the spam a bit I guess
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# [01:19] <mbrubeck> Between my various addresses, I get about 200 spam per day.
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# [01:19] <mbrubeck> There's no saving me. :P
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# [01:20] <@khuey> that doesn't get filtered?
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# [01:20] <@khuey> that's some seriously broken spam detection
# [01:20] <derf> Word.
# [01:20] <jwatt> aww, js regexps don't support look behind assertions?
# [01:20] <jwatt> sucks
# [01:20] <edmorley> I only get about 2 a week on my domain after 3-4 years, but I've been super paranoid about it
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# [01:23] <philor> hub: now *there* is what you should be worried about, not Android
# [01:23] <hub> philor: leak in debug :-/ yeah I just saw. wtf.
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# [01:26] <hub> are the links to "analyze the leak" supposed to work?
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# [01:28] <@dolske> you click the link, and a buzzer goes off in philor's cell.
# [01:28] <philor> soon, they'll work soon
# [01:28] <hub> ah ok
# [01:28] <jhammel> philor: the buzzer in your cell? ;)
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# [01:28] <philor> nyet
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# [01:29] <philor> they work on http://tbpl.swatinem.de/
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# [01:29] <philor> but all they do is tell you which test opened a leaked domwindow, if you happen to leak a domwindow, which with that tiny leak you probably didn't
# [01:29] * nthomas|away is now known as nthomas
# [01:30] <philor> while confusing you by claiming that a mochitest-chrome test somehow leaked one when it didn't
# [01:30] <philor> hub: sorry, it has nothing useful to offer
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# [01:33] <hub> philor: thanks
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# [01:35] <tbsaunde> philor: to be fair that patching casuing issues in mochitest-chrome would be /amazing/
# [01:36] <tbsaunde> *causing
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# [01:39] <philor> yeah, it's just that the leak-analysis script is dumb about not knowing mochitest-other is four different test runs, and also about not knowing that test_process.xul hides where its domwindow goes away
# [01:40] <philor> I should just add a manual hack to never claim that that test leaked, it'd be way easier than explaining how dumb the analysis is
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# [01:45] <philor> and speaking of my perfectly reasonable claims, people should not be allowed to do security bugs until I've perfectly mapped their email to their nick
# [01:45] <mbrubeck> khuey: No, about 99% of that *does* get filtered.
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# [01:45] <philor> but I think maybe jwir3|away has reftest orange
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# [01:46] <philor> including, miracle of miracles, actual geniuine Android failure
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# [01:48] <@khuey> mbrubeck: oh, so you only get 2 spam emails a day in your actual inbox?
# [01:48] <edmorley> I'll backout 9062b3e04318 yeah?
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# [01:52] <WG9s> edmorley: I would, on the inbound is not your tryserver even for security bugs rule!
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# [01:53] <akeybl> cpearce: hey sorry was interviewing a candidate. there's no documentation yet, but once approved for mozilla-release we'll also want to land on https://hg.mozilla.org/releases/mozilla-esr10/ (as gavin noted)
# [01:53] <akeybl> let me know if you've got any questions
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# [01:56] <ewong> khuey ping
# [01:56] <@khuey> ewong: pong
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# [01:57] <ewong> khuey smaug gave my bug #693172 patch a r+!! woot!
# [01:57] <@khuey> yay
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# [01:57] <ewong> khuey does it need sr?
# [01:57] <@khuey> don't think so
# [01:58] <ewong> khuey I tested it on try.. and aside for some weirdness in Ru and TEgra, I think it's 'good'
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# [01:59] <@khuey> cool
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# [02:00] <ewong> maybe I'll push it to m-i
# [02:01] <@khuey> please do
# [02:01] <WeirdAl> Does anyone know how this new addons compatibility blocklist works and can explain it to me?
# [02:01] <@khuey> thanks for persevering on this btw
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# [02:07] * @khuey chuckles
# [02:07] <@khuey> watching people go architecture-astronauting on public-webapps is always fun
# [02:08] <edmorley> !seen mak
# [02:08] <firebot> mak was last seen 1 hour, 49 minutes and 3 seconds ago, saying 'edmorley: you're welcome!' in #developers.
# [02:08] <@khuey> he's probably asleep by now
# [02:08] <WeirdAl> khuey: ?
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# [02:08] <edmorley> khuey: oh yeah it's somehow late again :-?
# [02:08] <@khuey> WeirdAl: er, whatwg
# [02:08] <edmorley> :-/ even
# [02:09] * @khuey gets them confused
# [02:09] <@khuey> edmorley: :-? is a good one
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# [02:09] <WeirdAl> I haven't read whatwg for a couple days
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# [02:09] <@khuey> WeirdAl: there's a bunch of people who want to redesign <img>
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# [02:09] <jtcranmer> just like the people who want to stuff everything imaginable into the UA^H^Hserver request headers
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# [02:10] <WeirdAl> heh, really?
# [02:10] <WeirdAl> svg, canvas, audio, video aren't enough? :)
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# [02:13] <WeirdAl> khuey: "responsive images" thread?
# [02:14] <@khuey> WeirdAl: yeah
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# [02:17] <mccr8> Should I be concerned by a red Android "opt test robocop" on Beta? I'm not sure what that is.
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# [02:18] <gavin> do test-failure-screenshots work on OS X?
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# [02:19] <philor> yep
# [02:19] <@khuey> mccr8: please put down your patch. you have 20 seconds to comply.
# [02:19] <mccr8> hah
# [02:19] <gavin> I'm trying to get them working on windows, and they don't work for some reason
# [02:20] <philor> so far the Mac ones work mostly to point out releng bugs around the edges, but they work :)
# [02:20] <gavin> but it seems like the problem is in the automation.py.in code that's shared with mac
# [02:20] <edmorley> philor: so am I correct from what you said earlier, that the multiple M-oth leaks are bogus then?
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# [02:21] <philor> edmorley: nope, they are entirely real, and hub is deeply ashamed about them
# [02:21] <philor> and probably wants you to help him find the exit, not sure about that part
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# [02:22] <philor> what I said was that the leak-analysis script that doesn't work on tbpl.m.o didn't have anything useful to offer anyway, other than a bogus lie about something that is unrelated
# [02:22] <edmorley> ah
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# [02:23] <edmorley> I'd help him find the exit, but looks like he's already gone
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# [02:24] <edmorley> I'm presuming 0b205d34aefc is going to rot 3327d251ce49, so I'm just going to pull both out, save it being my hair instead
# [02:24] <edmorley> philor: and thank you, serves me right for trying to skim read
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# [02:26] <ewong> anyone, particularly sheriffs.. is it safe to push to m-i right now?
# [02:27] <philor> tbsaunde: got any advice for whether or not one of hub's patches could come out without the other?
# [02:27] <edmorley> ewong: not quite yet, thank you for asking :-)
# [02:27] <@khuey> ewong: you should probably wait
# [02:27] <Callek> benefit of m-i, unless the tree screams at you -- usually fine to push
# [02:27] <ewong> oooh Ok..
# [02:27] <Callek> though its _easier_ on people if they are backing something out, to wait a bit -- yes :-)
# [02:27] <Callek> (hence your directed answers)
# [02:28] <ewong> m-i is closed? or is there a merge soon?
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# [02:28] <tbsaunde> philor: unless we knew the second was is at fault they both need to go out
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# [02:28] <edmorley> tbsaunde: seems wise, thank you :-)
# [02:28] <tbsaunde> second depends heavily on the first
# [02:29] <edmorley> ewong: about to push a backout
# [02:29] <ewong> oh
# [02:29] <tbsaunde> np
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# [02:56] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/b45785802731 - Karl Tomlinson - b=724966 make sure to set sRetryGrabTime for retrying grabs r=roc
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# [03:14] <mccr8> is there an existing bug for Android being permaorange on mozilla-release?
# [03:14] <mccr8> all of it. well, it builds okay.
# [03:15] <hub> ok when I run the test on my machine it does not leak :-/
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# [03:15] <hub> *sigh*
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# [03:18] <tbsaunde> hub: do you have debug enabled? you may need trace malloc too
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# [03:21] <philor> mccr8: that's typically the result of either branding, ask mfinkle, or releng, ask... aki maybe
# [03:22] <mccr8> philor: okay, thanks. I filed a bug. I'll CC mfinkle...
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# [03:24] <mccr8> though on the positive side, it means I don't have to attempt to interpret "Summary is empty".
# [03:24] <aki> m-r is the last repo that doesn't have the native/xul android split, so the tests may have changed in a way that broke linux-android
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# [03:24] <mccr8> aki: thanks. Yeah, I figured it might be something like that.
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# [03:37] <philor> you kids today. in my day, we had to star everything by hand, uphill both ways in the snow summer and winter
# [03:38] <edmorley> and on that note, I shall bid you good night! :-)
# [03:38] <philor> and if we wanted to retrigger something, we by god wrote another patch, and lied about it being reviewed, and pushed it!
# [03:41] <@dolske> stars? bah, in MY day we just had lumpy clouds of cold hydrogen gas! And we liked it that way!
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# [03:45] <biesi> philor, hah, back in my day we didn't even bother about lying about reviews
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# [03:55] <mccr8> philor: yeah I was wondering that myself...
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# [03:57] <philor> I meant to do them earlier, but... it was hard to care with the state of the single push :)
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# [03:59] <ewong> is m-i available for pushing?
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# [04:01] <mccr8> ewong: it looks like it is in a decent state to me.
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# [04:02] <ewong> there's a red M-1 on edmorley's backout..
# [04:02] <ewong> w/ empty summary...
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# [04:09] <@bz> anyone here want to do some spec-lawyering and sanity-doublechecking?
# [04:09] <ewong> can someone clarify what that means?
# [04:09] <ewong> re: edmorley's backout red M-1 w/ empty summary
# [04:09] <ewong> Win Opt to be specific
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# [04:11] <heycam> ewong, someone has retriggered it
# [04:11] <ewong> heycam: Oh right.. just noticed that faint 1
# [04:12] <ewong> light grey on white background really isn't easy to see
# [04:12] <heycam> ewong, I think it was just an infrastructure bug, guessing by the log
# [04:12] <heycam> ewong, I think you're fine to land
# [04:12] <ewong> ok
# [04:12] <ewong> heycam: thanks!
# [04:12] <heycam> np
# [04:12] <heycam> bz, what spec?
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# [04:13] <@bz> heycam: ecma-262
# [04:13] <heycam> bz, I'll give it a go...
# [04:14] <@bz> heycam: specifically, ToInt32 and ToUint32
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# [04:14] <ewong> ok.. I've pushed.. now with that bug, I set the target milestone to what? mozilla12? and then wait for someone to push to m-c and set the resolution?
# [04:14] <@bz> heycam: as far as I can tell, the return value from these should be the same bit pattern
# [04:15] <@bz> heycam: on a 2s-complement machine
# [04:15] <@bz> heycam: is that the case, or am I missing something?
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# [04:15] <Callek> ewong: 13, but correct
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# [04:15] <ewong> oh 13...
# [04:16] <heycam> bz, let me take a look
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# [04:18] <heycam> bz, I think you're right
# [04:19] <@bz> heycam: in that case, I don't understand our js_DoubleToECMAUint32 impl
# [04:19] <@bz> heycam: seems like it could just call js_DoubleToECMAInt32 and cast the result
# [04:19] <heycam> bz, the only difference between the two is the step 5, right?
# [04:19] <@bz> heycam: afaict, yes
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# [04:21] * @bz is also trying to find modern C/C++ integer conversion rules, because he doesn't like the answers he's reading in k&r
# [04:22] <jtcranmer> bz: promotions or just conversions?
# [04:22] <cmr> hrh
# [04:22] <cmr> *heh
# [04:22] <@bz> conversions
# [04:22] <jtcranmer> more specifically, what's the case?
# [04:23] <@bz> The relevant quote is:
# [04:23] <heycam> I guess you want to know how uint32_t values > 2**31 get converted to doubles?
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# [04:23] <jtcranmer> (the C++ spec is so badly organized that to get anything to make sense you need to know what happens)
# [04:23] <@bz> "When any integer is converted to a signed type, the value is unchaged if it can be represented in the new type and is implementation-defined otherwise"
# [04:23] <@bz> Which means that this code:
# [04:24] <@bz> int8_t f(int32_t i) {
# [04:24] <jtcranmer> "If the destination type is signed, the value is unchanged if it can be represented in the destination type (and
# [04:24] <@bz> return (int8_t)i;
# [04:24] <@bz> }
# [04:24] <jtcranmer> bit-field width); otherwise, the value is implementation-defined."
# [04:24] <@bz> has impl-defined behavior
# [04:24] <@bz> which is not happy.
# [04:24] <jtcranmer> bz: what do you want it to do?
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# [04:25] <jtcranmer> the spec doesn't even guarantee that signed numbers are 2's-complement
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# [04:25] <@bz> jtcranmer: well, ideally for my purposes it would do the same as casting to uint8_t (which the spec _does_ define), then promoting to int or short, then subtracting 2^8
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# [04:25] <@bz> jtcranmer: then casting the result to int8_t
# [04:26] <@bz> jtcranmer: that sequence of operations _does_ have well-defined behavior
# [04:26] <jtcranmer> well, (int8_t)(uint8_t)i still has impl-defined behavior
# [04:26] * @bz knows the spec doesn't guarantee signed numbers are 2's-complement; he's not actually depending on that
# [04:26] <@bz> jtcranmer: yes, it does. But I didn't say to do that, did I?
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# [04:27] <@bz> jtcranmer: actually, what I said is slightly bogus
# [04:27] <jtcranmer> well, the spec won't do that
# [04:27] <@bz> jtcranmer: in that 2^8 should only be subtracted if the intermediate value is >=2^7
# [04:27] <@bz> ok
# [04:28] <@bz> fine
# [04:28] * @bz notes that means we have some code making Assumptions....
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# [04:28] <jtcranmer> largely because defining a conversion to a signed value that compiler vendors would implement
# [04:28] <@bz> that are not supported by the spec
# [04:28] <@bz> seems to be working in practice, but....
# [04:28] <jtcranmer> bleh, let me rephrase
# [04:29] <jtcranmer> to do so would force anyone not using a 2's complement machine to implement 2's complement-to-native signedness characteristics
# [04:29] <jtcranmer> and the compiler people would balk at that
# [04:29] <@bz> right
# [04:29] <@bz> and it hasn't bitten us so far because all the stuff we run on in practice is 2's complement
# [04:29] * @bz wonders whether he should just static assert this somehow and then assume it
# [04:29] <jtcranmer> since we don't actually run on non-2's complement machines, we'd only get 2's-complement-compliant values
# [04:30] <jesup> !seen dmoz
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# [04:30] <firebot> I've never seen a 'dmoz', sorry.
# [04:30] <jesup> !seen dmose
# [04:30] <firebot> dmose was last seen 4 days, 9 hours, 27 minutes and 34 seconds ago, saying 'smaug: thanks for the ping; i'll have a look for find somebody to do that soon....' in #audio.
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# [04:31] <@bz> I mean...
# [04:31] <@bz> I can write out the long well-defined version
# [04:31] <@bz> It just seems like a hassle
# [04:31] <jtcranmer> bz: in this day and age, a non 2's-complement architecture would fall under the category of "weird architecture that breaks half our code"
# [04:31] <jesup> bz: hey, what about the PDP-10 port? ;-)
# [04:32] <jtcranmer> like a 9-bit word
# [04:32] <jesup> exactly!
# [04:32] <@bz> well, yes
# [04:32] <jtcranmer> or hell, 7-bit word
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# [04:32] <jesup> PDP-8 - 12-bit word
# [04:32] <@bz> which is why I have no problem PR_STATIC_ASSERTing it
# [04:32] <@bz> but ok
# [04:32] <@bz> let's assume 2's-complement
# [04:33] <@bz> ok
# [04:33] <jtcranmer> I'd be surprised if such a machine could finish the configure scripts :-P
# [04:33] <@bz> I guess I can do the same thing and cast through the unsigned types
# [04:33] <@bz> because casting from uintN_t to intN_t should "do the right thing", I hope
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# [04:34] <jesup> Sorry, I forgot - PDP-10 was 2's complement.
# [04:35] * @bz writes sucky-looking code
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# [04:35] <@bz> I wonder whether gcc will correctly optimize this code:
# [04:35] <@bz> int32_t i = getSomeInteger();
# [04:35] <@bz> return (int32_t)(uint32_t)i;
# [04:36] <jesup> but there is a GCC for the PDP-10. Not up-to-date though.
# [04:36] <jtcranmer> bz: in machine terms, that code does nothing
# [04:36] <@bz> well, yes
# [04:36] * jesup will stop dredging up history
# [04:36] <@bz> I'd hope so!
# [04:36] <@bz> alright
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# [04:45] <@roc> if anyone complains about our code not being portable to non-2's-complement hardware, I will personally push them off a bridge
# [04:45] <@khuey> is there actually non-2's-complement hardware?
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# [04:45] * @bz would bet some DSPs or something
# [04:45] <mreavy> roc++
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# [04:46] <jesup> Most DSP's are 2's complement (all I've seen)
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# [04:48] <jtcranmer> roc: only pushing them off a bridge?
# [04:48] <jtcranmer> that's too deniable
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# [04:48] <@roc> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ones%27_complement
# [04:49] <@roc> turns out 2s complement is inefficient if your '1' bits are expensive :-)
# [04:50] <jesup> Right - last I know of were the CDC machines in the late 60's (I fixed and booted one donated to the campus ACM - before we scrapped it for all the gold). Boot rom was a board of resistors.
# [04:50] <@roc> which requires me to mention this classic Dlibert: http://dilbert.com/dyn/str_strip/000000000/00000000/0000000/000000/00000/0000/800/859/859.strip.sunday.gif
# [04:50] * Quits: jhammel (jhammel@moz-14240F1C.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: pizza)
# [04:50] <jdm> oh noooo
# [04:50] <jdm> I opened up a github commit with 10k changes
# [04:51] <jdm> firefox was displeased with me
# [04:51] <@bz> heh
# [04:51] <@bz> got a profile?
# [04:51] * Quits: jrmuizel (jrmuizel@moz-20EF8EAA.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Input/output error)
# [04:51] <jdm> bz: I have the profile branch, so I could actually do that
# [04:51] * jdm does that
# [04:51] <darktrojan> is that dilbert url deliberate, or just ironic?
# [04:52] <@bz> jdm: should be reflex! ;)
# [04:52] <mreavy> someone in one of the other channels asked if this should be on our next mozilla t-shirt: http://media-cdn.pinterest.com/upload/193865958929307093_uVS1oNTb_c.jpg
# [04:52] <jdm> they way I distinguish them from the osx search menu is that nightly is called Nightly, and the profiler build is called FirefoxNightly
# [04:52] * jesup mumbles about finally adding a "generate profile" button to our nightly UI...
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# [04:54] <jdm> oh crap
# [04:54] <jdm> I forgot that I also am running a debug build of firefox inside gdb inside gdb
# [04:54] <jdm> no wonder I only have 100mb of free memory
# [04:54] <heycam> debugging your debugger while you profile your firefox?
# [04:54] * Joins: Standard8 (Standard8@8F761026.B5EF4AF6.E96CA9D8.IP)
# [04:54] <jdm> heycam: exactly!
# [04:55] <jdm> next step, profiling the profiler
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# [04:55] * @bz has been tempted to do that
# [04:55] <@bz> if I had symbols for shark..
# [04:56] * @bz is looking forward to the built-in profiler
# [04:56] <@bz> so I can fix peeves
# [04:57] <mreavy> i had the following dilbert hanging outside my office at work for like 10 years (given to me as a gift from a good friend I worked with): http://dilbert.com/dyn/str_strip/000000000/00000000/0000000/000000/00000/0000/700/709/709.strip.gif (I love Alice's expression in the last frame)
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# [04:59] <nigelb> jdm: \o/ Nice to see bugsahoy in mozilla.org stage.
# [04:59] <nigelb> Can't wait to see it live.
# [04:59] <jdm> nigelb: yeah, that will be real soon now
# [04:59] <jdm> I just need to convince myself to boot into windows and fix a couple last accessibility problems
# [05:00] <nigelb> heh
# [05:00] <nigelb> there's a small width problem.
# [05:00] <nigelb> But I'm sure you already know.
# [05:00] <jdm> yeah, someone mentioned that
# [05:00] <jdm> I don't really know anything about web development, so I don't really know how to fix that
# [05:01] <jdm> I don't know what the maximum width of a page should be
# [05:01] <jdm> I really don't want stuff to be shifted below the bug list by default
# [05:01] <jdm> hence my min-width hackery
# [05:01] * armenzg_mtg is now known as armenzg
# [05:01] <nigelb> you should talk to someone in #webdev :)
# [05:01] * armenzg is now known as armenzg_brb
# [05:02] <nigelb> (like during working ours "tomorrow")
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# [05:03] <jdm> that's a good idea
# [05:04] <jdm> bz: do you have any secret tricks for reading shark profiles?
# [05:04] <jdm> which view is most helpful?
# [05:04] <jdm> ooh, 19% in SelectorMatches
# [05:04] * philor|away is now known as philor
# [05:05] <@bz> jdm: that depends on the shark profile
# [05:05] <@bz> jdm: what's most helpful is typically a quick glance at bottom-up, esp after blaming all the unknown library stuff to callers
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# [05:06] <@bz> jdm: followed by usually seeing no obvious hotspots and then looking into the top-down view....
# [05:06] <@bz> jdm: if you're hitting selectormatches, I bet I know what this issue is
# [05:06] <jdm> yeah, I was going to ask if it's worth filing
# [05:06] <@bz> jdm: we really need to make this one style system optimization....
# [05:06] * jdm resists offering to take on the project
# [05:07] <@bz> the project is not that bad
# [05:07] <jdm> that's a really bad habit I have
# [05:07] <@bz> the hard part is that it conflicts with other in-flight changes
# [05:07] <@bz> which are blocked on PGO crashes..
# [05:07] <@bz> well, and the code to be written is a bit finicky
# [05:08] <jdm> bz: which bug is the style system one?
# [05:08] * @bz is looking it up
# [05:08] <@bz> hmph
# [05:09] <@bz> btw
# [05:09] <@bz> you filed this sometime as 633733, right?
# [05:10] <@bz> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=705877
# [05:10] <@bz> is the style system bug that I think should help github
# [05:10] <@bz> based on analysis in bug 704911
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# [05:11] <jdm> heh
# [05:11] <@bz> should probably add some deps here
# [05:11] <@bz> you doing that, or should I?
# [05:11] * Quits: thomaslee (thomaslee@moz-306D3DF4.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: Leaving)
# [05:11] <jdm> I'll do that
# [05:11] <@bz> ok, thanks
# [05:12] <ewong> for https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Mozilla-Inbound&rev=bc6a70cdc0e7, the Android XUL opt J3.. should I retry that?
# [05:12] * @bz sees conversions from double to int64 are undefined, decides to not worry about it
# [05:12] <jlebar> heh, new version of hg does not like qpop'ing patches hg push -f 'ed to try.
# [05:12] <jlebar> "abort: popping would remove an immutable revision". hg, you are too smart for my own good.
# [05:12] <jdm> bz: is the parallel selector matching blocked on 2010 or something?
# [05:12] <@bz> also, conversion from double to uint64 not defined either
# [05:12] <ewong> oh.. it's already being retried
# [05:12] <@bz> jdm: I thought so
# [05:13] <@bz> jdm: in that it built with 2010 at one point
# [05:13] <@bz> jdm: then we upgraded to 2010
# [05:13] <@bz> jdm: and we still get an ICE
# [05:13] <@bz> jdm: khuey filed that bug with MS
# [05:13] <jdm> hooray
# [05:13] <@bz> jdm: we'll see how it goes
# [05:13] <@bz> jdm: I'm tempted to do the ancestor selector thing and then just merge the parallel selector code....
# [05:14] * @bz pretends webidl doesn't specify this junk, just writes code to so "something"
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# [05:16] <heycam> which junk?
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# [05:17] <@bz> heycam: precise conversions between ES Number and 64-bit ints
# [05:17] <@bz> heycam: in both directions
# [05:18] <heycam> bz, oh. well, it's not like they are many uses of long long in IDL, I guess...
# [05:18] <@bz> heycam: and it would matter only in the edge cases
# [05:18] <@bz> heycam: where the double is out or range
# [05:18] <heycam> bz, yeah…
# [05:19] * heycam never did get around to introducing a 53-bit integer type into webidl
# [05:19] <@bz> because the conversion is quite well-defined if the double is smaller than 2^63
# [05:19] <@bz> (in the one direction)
# [05:19] <@bz> One issue is this clause
# [05:19] <@bz> If x < b(253 b 1) or x > 253 b 1, then throw a TypeError.
# [05:19] * Quits: doublec (doublec@moz-55CD7EAB.pn) (Ping timeout)
# [05:19] <@bz> (if you can read that)
# [05:20] <heycam> I can remember what it says
# [05:20] <jtcranmer> I see lots of HR highlighted
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# [05:20] <@bz> uh-huh
# [05:20] <@bz> "If x < -(2^53 - 1) or x > 2^53 - 1 then throw a TypeError"
# [05:20] <jlebar> Help, I've enabled mediawiki's rich editor and now I can't disable it!
# [05:20] <@bz> pretty sure my code is not doing that
# [05:20] <@bz> why is that desirable?
# [05:20] <@khuey> clear your cookies?
# [05:20] <heycam> bz, somebody requested that rather than "choose the closest representable number"
# [05:21] <jlebar> khuey, I guess that's easier than "fix mediawiki"
# [05:21] <heycam> bz, due to it being less surprising
# [05:21] <heycam> for authors
# [05:21] <@bz> erm
# [05:21] <@khuey> jlebar: indeed
# [05:21] <@bz> an exception is less surprising than "do what other programming languages do"?
# [05:21] <heycam> heh
# [05:21] <heycam> well
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# [05:22] <heycam> doesn't seem like a huge deal either way to me
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# [05:23] * @bz just adds an XXX comment for now
# [05:23] <cmr> Eh
# [05:23] <cmr> Throwing an exception will make you aware of the 'problem' if you weren't before.
# [05:24] <@bz> so what I don't understand is this "closest representable number" business
# [05:24] <@bz> why is that an issue here???
# [05:24] * glob|away is now known as glob
# [05:24] <@bz> I can understand if conversion from long long to double threw
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# [05:24] <@bz> when the long long is not exactly representable
# [05:24] <@bz> I think it would be weird, but could understand it
# [05:24] <@bz> but this is coversion from double to long long
# [05:25] <@bz> all we're doing is taking floor
# [05:25] * khuey is now known as khuey|away
# [05:25] <@bz> then reducing mod 2^64
# [05:25] <heycam> but you can't pass in a JS number to get all possible long longs, right?
# [05:25] <@bz> yes
# [05:25] <@bz> but every js number you pass maps to a unique long long
# [05:26] <@bz> after you do that modulo thing
# [05:26] <@bz> you just have some long longs that are never hit
# [05:26] <heycam> sure, but who knows if the actual Number value that you wanted to pass in corresponded to the actual long long you wanted
# [05:26] <@bz> um
# [05:26] <@bz> what do you mean?
# [05:26] <@bz> say I have a number
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# [05:26] <@bz> there are three cases
# [05:27] <@bz> either it's absolute value is less than 2^53
# [05:27] <@bz> and then we just chop off its fractional part and we're done
# [05:27] <@bz> right?
# [05:27] * Parts: RattyAway (Jim_diGriz@C13948AB.BAD01394.F6F5CF2F.IP)
# [05:27] <heycam> yes
# [05:27] <@dolske> "there are 3.0000000000001 cases..." ;)
# [05:27] <josh> Is mozilla-inbound going to be merged again before the nightly builds?
# [05:27] <@bz> Or its absolute value is between 2^53 and 2^64
# [05:27] <@bz> in which case your algorightm will throw
# [05:27] <@bz> er, algorithm
# [05:27] <@bz> or its absolute value is > 2^64
# [05:28] <@bz> in which case it will either throw or not depending on what happens after reducing mod 2^64
# [05:28] <heycam> mm
# [05:28] <heycam> the last bit is a bit funny then
# [05:28] <@bz> it makes absolutely no sense to do it this way
# [05:29] <@bz> and again, every double in the range < 2^64 maps to an obvious uint64_t
# [05:29] <heycam> yeah, that last case is weird given it could throw or not throw depending on what 64 bit integer it ends up being
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# [05:30] <@bz> it's just that you can only get the even ones between 2^53 and 2^54, only the multiples of 4 between 2^54 and 2^55, etc
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# [05:31] <heycam> yeah. maybe api writers should just avoid using long long if they need significant numbers in those ranges.
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# [05:31] * @bz votes so
# [05:31] <heycam> I don't mind to change it back
# [05:31] <@bz> in any case, if we _do_ want to throw, we should do it before taking mod
# [05:31] * heycam should look up who requested the change
# [05:31] <@bz> of course after that there's no point in taking mod. ;)
# [05:32] <heycam> just like [EnforceRange]
# [05:32] <heycam> in fact
# [05:32] <@bz> right
# [05:32] <heycam> maybe it's better just to restrict this throwing behaviour to [EnforceRange]
# [05:32] <@bz> which spec writers can already get
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# [05:32] <@bz> right
# [05:32] <heycam> that's more consistent with the whole mod 2^n thing anyway
# [05:32] <@bz> that would make sense to me
# [05:32] * cjones-errand is now known as cjones
# [05:32] <heycam> do you mind to write a quick mail to public-script-coord?
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# [05:32] <@bz> um... sure
# [05:33] <heycam> (LC comment time again, so I like to be able to track these things)
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# [05:38] <@bz> sent
# [05:39] <heycam> thanks
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# [05:45] <ewong> can someone tell me what I need to do about my m-i push's orange Linux64 debug oth?
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# [05:46] <philor> ewong: you need to take advantage of the single joy that inbound offers, and completely ignore it
# [05:46] <heycam> ewong, philor has already starred it
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# [05:46] <ewong> philor thanks!
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# [05:46] <darktrojan> you forgot about the other joy of inbound
# [05:46] <philor> just doin' my job, ma'am
# [05:46] <darktrojan> not giving a crap what state it is in before pushing
# [05:47] * rail is now known as rail_away
# [05:47] <philor> no, because that joy isn't guaranteed
# [05:47] <ewong> wow..he's fast with the starring
# [05:47] <ewong> actually.. I'm concerned with the Windows tests.. on try, it was giving me an orange Ru
# [05:47] <darktrojan> someone got him a coffee
# [05:48] <ewong> \o/ for philor!
# [05:48] <philor> ewong: well, *there's* one problem you won't have again
# [05:48] * SeoZ-work[AWAY] is now known as SeoZ
# [05:49] <darktrojan> haha http://www.reddit.com/r/firefox/comments/pawz9/letting_firefox_go/ FIREFOX DOESN'T USE ENOUGH RAM
# [05:49] <philor> since I've been carrying an r+ to turn on Win Ru anywhere other than try around for close to a month now, waiting for there to be enough branches greened up to make it worth turning on
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# [05:51] <jlebar> Warning: Do not upgrade to mercurial 2.1. You will spend hours trying to figure out how to push to try.
# [05:51] <darktrojan> push -f no longer works?
# [05:51] <jlebar> darktrojan, no changes found (ignored 3 secret changesets)
# [05:52] <jlebar> darktrojan, I think I need to mark them as explicitly not-secret.
# [05:52] <darktrojan> secrets, huh
# [05:52] <jlebar> And then mark them as secret again, if I want to qpop them.
# [05:52] <darktrojan> .... right
# [05:52] <jlebar> I understand why they did this, but I can't figure out how to turn it off!
# [05:53] <philor> what does it have in its pocketses? secrets?
# [05:54] <jlebar> [mq]
# [05:54] <jlebar> secret=true
# [05:54] <darktrojan> seems to be really well documented
# [05:54] * Quits: timA (tim@moz-535753DA.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre)
# [05:54] <darktrojan> NOT
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# [05:55] <jlebar> or, secret = false, I think. Yes.
# [05:55] <jlebar> That seems to work.
# [05:56] <jlebar> Ah, but that doesn't fix hg qpop.
# [05:56] <jlebar> geez
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# [06:00] <@bz> Man
# [06:00] <@bz> >> and << are messed up in JS
# [06:01] <@bz> Pop quiz
# [06:01] <@dolske> C!
# [06:01] <@bz> 0xffffffff >> 0
# [06:01] <@bz> what should that return?
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# [06:01] <jdm> bz: {}
# [06:01] <@bz> and once you have that sorted out....
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# [06:01] <@bz> what should 0xffffffff >> 2 return?
# [06:01] <jlebar> bz, Does 0xfffffff get converted to an int first, or something?
# [06:01] <@bz> jlebar: precisely
# [06:01] <heycam> the first one should be… 0?
# [06:01] <@dolske> that's what I woudl guess
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# [06:02] * @bz suggests people try it
# [06:02] <jlebar> So is it >> , or 0xfffffff which is wrong?
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# [06:02] <heycam> no, I was wrong :)
# [06:02] * Quits: peregrino (peregrino@moz-8A26C745.telecom.net.ar) (Quit: peregrino)
# [06:02] <@bz> jlebar: >>
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# [06:02] <heycam> (but the answer makes sense of course)
# [06:02] <@dolske> oh, wait, but that's < 2^33 so should still represent saneness. uh-oh!
# [06:02] <@bz> jlebar: js has sane shift operators, but they're apparently called >>> and <<<
# [06:02] <@bz> er, wait
# [06:03] <@bz> there is no <<<
# [06:03] <@bz> but there is a >>>
# [06:03] <jlebar> worst. programming. language. ever.
# [06:03] <jlebar> brendan doesn't hang out here, does he? :-p
# [06:03] <jdm> asurkov++
# [06:03] <jdm> roping in the contributors
# [06:03] <@bz> So what >> does is conver to a 32-bit signed int
# [06:03] <@bz> then shift that bit pattern
# [06:03] <@bz> and return the resulting 32-bit signed int
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# [06:03] <@bz> and not only that, but....
# [06:04] * @bz double-checks this
# [06:04] <@dolske> this is gonna be great for the 64-bit world of the fut^H^H^Hcurrent.
# [06:04] <cmr> lack of a uint64 it's what's driving me nuts about js... jssha sucks so I'm reimplementing it, and it is not fun.
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# [06:04] <@bz> "Performs a sign-filling bitwise right shift operation on the left operand by the amount specified by the right"
# [06:04] * nigelb wonders how much bz headdesked.
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# [06:04] <@bz> nigelb: hmm?
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# [06:05] <@bz> nigelb: not that much
# [06:05] <@bz> nigelb: I wasn't actually writing js code or anything
# [06:05] <nigelb> ha
# [06:05] <@bz> nigelb: just trying to change parts of the js engine. ;)
# [06:05] <nigelb> much better then.
# [06:05] <nigelb> oh. worse.
# [06:05] <nigelb> :P
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# [06:05] <@bz> oh, and that thing you shift by....
# [06:06] <@bz> guess what happens when you shift by more than 32?
# [06:06] <nigelb> segfault?
# [06:06] <jlebar> bz, mod the shift by 32?
# [06:06] <@bz> yep
# [06:06] <heycam> lol
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# [06:06] <heycam> I didn't know that
# [06:06] * jlebar gets these right only by picking the most bizarre behavior he can think of.
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# [06:06] <@bz> [23:58:53.128] (1 << 33)
# [06:06] <@bz> [23:58:53.131] 2
# [06:06] <jlebar> lol
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# [06:06] <@bz> --
# [06:06] <@bz> [23:59:22.174] (1 << 32)
# [06:06] <@bz> [23:59:22.176] 1
# [06:06] <@bz> (right shifts do the same thing, of course)
# [06:07] <cmr> Wait what
# [06:07] <cmr> js> (1 << 90)
# [06:07] <cmr> 67108864
# [06:07] <@bz> yes
# [06:07] <@bz> 90 mod 32 is 26
# [06:07] <@bz> so you just did 1 << 26
# [06:07] <cmr> feh
# [06:07] <jlebar> It's as though someone was *trying* to make these impossible to use and impossible to implement efficiently.
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# [06:08] <cmr> Though that explains a lot of unexpected behavior I was getting in some tests earlier..
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# [06:08] <@bz> jlebar: I do wonder sometimes
# [06:08] <@dolske> 1 << (0xffffffff >> 0) ;)
# [06:08] <@bz> jlebar: though in all honesty, having >> and >>> makes sense sorta
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# [06:08] <@bz> jlebar: in a language that has no signed vs unsigned types...
# [06:08] <@bz> jlebar: I would have picked >> to be the unsigned one, though
# [06:09] <jlebar> bz, are there rotate operators?
# [06:09] <jlebar> >>>>, or do we just give up?
# [06:09] <heycam> I think it just copies Java for >> and >>> sign extendedness
# [06:09] <@bz> jlebar: that's a syntax error
# [06:09] * bear-afk is now known as bear
# [06:09] <@bz> heycam: oh, really?
# [06:09] * jlebar was kidding about >>>>
# [06:09] <@bz> heycam: that would explain it...
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# [06:10] <@bz> yes
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# [06:10] <@bz> apparently java has the same >> vs >>> thing
# [06:10] * @bz curses Sun and Netscape management
# [06:11] <heycam> ↺ can be the new bit rotate operator
# [06:11] * @dolske wonders if we can spec something reasonable, and define « and » operators. ;-)
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# [06:11] <@bz> and in fact, the mod 32 thing for the shift amount is also from Java
# [06:11] <@bz> On the one hand, Brendan is exonerated
# [06:11] <@dolske> heycam: unicode operators ftw! ^5!
# [06:11] <@bz> on the other hand, wtf?
# [06:11] <@dolske> bz: let's not be too hasty. :)
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# [06:12] <@bz> actually, java only does the mod 32 thing for ints
# [06:12] <@bz> it does mod 64 for longs
# [06:12] <cmr> I dislike the unified Number
# [06:12] <@bz> does java not have unsigned integer types?
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# [06:12] <jlebar> bz, correct.
# [06:12] <@bz> ok
# [06:13] <@bz> so at that point having >> be sign-extending makes some sense
# [06:13] <@bz> sorta
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# [06:13] * jlebar wonders when we'll start optimizing hand-rolled bit rotate code into the bit rotate instruction.
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# [06:13] <jlebar> I guess once someone writes a benchmark.
# [06:13] <@bz> it's just really artificial-seeming in JS, since it's not like we started with a signed int
# [06:13] <@bz> we started with a friggin' double
# [06:13] <@bz> cmr: there's an "obvious" solution to the problem....
# [06:14] <jlebar> Dart?
# [06:14] <@bz> cmr: but it's hard to implement
# [06:14] <jlebar> :D
# [06:14] <cmr> bz: ax muder
# [06:14] <cmr> ?
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# [06:14] <@bz> cmr: redefine Number to be a 128-bit IEEE float
# [06:14] * joduinn-afk is now known as joduinn
# [06:14] <cmr> heh
# [06:14] <@bz> cmr: and then you can represent everything you want
# [06:14] <@bz> cmr: until we want 128-bit ints. ;)
# [06:14] * jlebar is now known as jlebar|sleep
# [06:15] <cmr> bz: http://wiki.ecmascript.org/doku.php?id=harmony:binary_data wee!
# [06:15] <cmr> Still no int64 though!
# [06:15] <cmr> :(
# [06:17] <@bz> heh
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# [06:20] <cmr> I really like python's way of doing things, with the __add__ and the __lshift__ and such making it wicked easy to make your own numeric types.
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# [06:33] <jdm> the debugger landed :o
# [06:33] <jdm> hot
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# [06:33] <jdm> I can now debug my debug debugging debugger debugger
# [06:34] <jdm> if we get a version working for the browser chrome as well, I'm pretty sure I can make that sentence twice as complex to parse
# [06:35] <cmr> You've already broken mine!
# [06:35] <cmr> I take it back
# [06:35] <cmr> Just needed to chug a bit longer
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# [06:51] <@bz> santorum
# [06:51] * @bz wonders what these people are thinking
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# [06:52] <aja> bz: MO likes sweater vests!
# [06:53] <@bz> it's not just MO
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# [06:55] <@dolske> Santorum / Palin '12!
# [06:55] <birtles> bz, can I ask you about the nsAttrValue changes?
# [06:55] <aja> bz: he was the one making appearances in all 3 states repeatedly over last few weeks....just out-hustled others
# [06:55] <@dolske> D:
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# [06:55] <@bz> birtles: of course
# [06:55] <@bz> aja: ah, ok
# [06:56] <birtles> bz, the other patches in that bug basically replace nsAString with nsAttrValue
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# [06:56] <birtles> bz, so we either need to get the string passed in into an nsAttrValue or pass both around
# [06:56] * joduinn is now known as joduinn-afk
# [06:57] <birtles> so I'm wondering, if there any cheap way to get the string into an nsAttrValue?
# [06:57] <Yoric> hi
# [06:57] <@bz> birtles: at the moment, no
# [06:57] <@bz> birtles: we could fix this....
# [06:57] <@bz> birtles: via changes to either nsAttrValue or strings
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# [06:58] <@bz> birtles: you do NOT want to depend on string changes for this bug
# [06:58] <@bz> birtles: but maybe the nsAttrValue changes would be ok....
# [06:58] <birtles> right, that's what I thought
# [06:58] * @bz spent some time today thinking about that
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# [06:59] <birtles> the quickest solution is probably to make some stack class that wraps up either an nsAttrValue or a pointer to a string and pass that along
# [06:59] <birtles> but it's not very nice
# [06:59] <@bz> ah
# [06:59] <@bz> hmm
# [06:59] <@bz> that might be simpler
# [06:59] <@bz> I was thinking a stack subclass of nsAttrValue
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# [06:59] <@bz> that can initialize it with a dependent string
# [06:59] <@bz> and then you have to add that new type throughout nsAttrValue....
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# [07:00] <birtles> that's definitely nicer, but I guess more invasive
# [07:01] <@bz> we might want that elsewhere too
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# [07:02] <birtles> ok, so go with the subclass approach?
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# [07:03] <@bz> I think so
# [07:03] <@bz> double-check that with sicking, please?
# [07:03] <@bz> but I think that's the way to go
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# [07:04] <birtles> ok, will do
# [07:04] <birtles> thanks!
# [07:04] <aja> bz: here's a logic question for you...why would ANYONE vote for "uncommitted" in a non-binding primary? WTF?!
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# [07:05] <@bz> aja: there's this bell curve thing
# [07:05] <aja> rather redundant
# [07:05] <@bz> aja: which means that 50% of the population has an IQ < 100
# [07:05] <@bz> aja: more or less
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# [07:05] <@bz> aja: demographics are somewhat different for primary voters...
# [07:06] <@bz> aja: but still
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# [07:08] <aja> yeah.....you run into 3-sigmas in the strangest places :)
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# [07:10] <jesup> bz: why would one vote in a non-binding primary outside of boredom? ;-)
# [07:10] <@bz> jesup: peer pressure?
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# [07:11] <Mark_Capella> . o O ( posturing is another word )
# [07:13] <Callek> jesup: well the primaries do inform the relevant party whom they should stick as their official nominee
# [07:13] <aja> if i gathered correctly, only republican primary was non-binding....binding for other parties
# [07:13] <Callek> of course its not binding, but if one candidate has 90% of the vote, and the other has 5%. chances are the 5% won't get the nomination
# [07:14] <Callek> jesup: that said US politics is annoying/calculated/and confusing
# [07:14] <aja> then there's florida
# [07:15] <Mark_Capella> (interrupt) Can someone describe how old ... obsolete bugzilla entries are managed, reviewed, trashed? Is there a regular review process?
# [07:15] <Callek> Mark_Capella:
# [07:15] <Callek> err
# [07:15] <kwierso> Mark_Capella: heh
# [07:15] <Callek> Mark_Capella: "on their own merits"
# [07:15] <Callek> Mark_Capella: is there a particular bug you wanted to surface to our attention?
# [07:15] <Mark_Capella> What I mean is, is there like a project manager role?
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# [07:16] <kwierso> depends on the project
# [07:16] <Callek> well there is, but Firefox is a vast project, so we generally treat it as "Module"s and "Module Owners/Peers" who have control over their relevant areas of expertise/code
# [07:16] <Callek> Where there is *some* overlap in certain areas, and others get little love, but we try to fill all gaps.
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# [07:17] <Callek> and sometimes we do forget about an old bug, when we file/decide on a new one, etc.
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# [07:17] <Mark_Capella> ex: While researching for [Good first bug], I see things like Bug 415138 - give names to PlacesUtils getters so they're detectable by dTrace ... seems like it's two bugs crossed into one ... languishing ...
# [07:17] <kwierso> and review whines did get turned on recently, so old patches with requests on them should be getting looked at or cleared out
# [07:17] <Callek> Mark_Capella: so its hard to give you a general policy, but we can help direct you on the right way to proceed
# [07:19] <Callek> Mark_Capella: I think that bug in particular is just not described well enough for a [good first bug] and needs a mentor
# [07:19] <hub> so I have run my backed out patched on the try server and they don't leak unlike the backout reason
# [07:19] <jdm> Mark_Capella: yes, part of the reason I'm pushing for the good first bug tag to die is that most of the bugs not filed in the past six months are not worth looking at
# [07:20] <kwierso> Mark_Capella, Callek: wonder if dietrich would be able to mentor that since he filed it?
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# [07:20] <Callek> Mark_Capella: and in-fact skimming-only of PlacesUtils [http://mxr.mozilla.org/comm-central/source/mozilla/toolkit/components/places/PlacesUtils.jsm] up to line 500 so far, it looks like what that bug calls for would be done already
# [07:21] <Callek> kwierso: If it needs doing I can mentor, I *can't* review there though
# [07:21] * Callek is skimming
# [07:22] <Mark_Capella> Comment #3 on the bug seemed unrelated ... let me re-check
# [07:22] <jdm> hub: sounds like it's worth taking a look at inbound TBPL around your push to see what happened?
# [07:22] <kwierso> Mark_Capella: comment three was just bugspam where he moved bugs around in the system from one component to another
# [07:22] <kwierso> s/moved/mass-moved/
# [07:23] <hub> jdm: yeah it was green before my push. and on try to has a bunch of commits from inbound with mine
# [07:23] <philor> hub: or at the patch you pushed to try on top of them
# [07:23] * Callek sees: http://mxr.mozilla.org/comm-central/source/mozilla/toolkit/components/places/PlacesUtils.jsm#1807 which looks done-ish
# [07:23] <hub> https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=fa2aab4a1071
# [07:23] <Mark_Capella> ah! ... "bug spam"
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# [07:26] <Callek> Mark_Capella: sooo, all the get(ters) are now named... there are still quite a few function _operators_ in that file that don't have related function names
# [07:26] <Callek> (search for |function(|) many of them in foreach
# [07:26] <Callek> type stuff
# [07:26] <Callek> I have no idea if all of them are useful to name, or what thename would be, so I'd be a poor mentor actually
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# [07:27] <Callek> my recommendation is to ask if its resolveable since all the get(ters) are named
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# [07:29] <Mark_Capella> callek: Ahhh ... ok ... then I saw a four year old bug to change a typo ... Bug 418290 - SEC_ERROR_REVOKED_CERTIFICATE message has typo ... It seemed to me there would be a methodology in place to address stuff like that
# [07:30] <Callek> generally the low-impact stuff gets prioritized accordingly
# [07:30] <Mark_Capella> :-P and ignored to death !
# [07:30] <kwierso> that one still isn't done, from what I can tell
# [07:30] <Callek> but yea, in theory we should bump old bugs up higher in priority over time (imo, but I'm not the one to argue there)
# [07:31] * glob is now known as glob|away
# [07:31] <Callek> such that a spelling fix bug, open for 6 years, should eventually be on someones "priority list for this quarter"
# [07:31] <Callek> ;-)
# [07:31] <Mark_Capella> "-P
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# [07:32] <philor> hub: I mean, I'm not much of an expert, but it seems to me that if A+B leak a bunch of nsWeakReferences, and A+B+C do not, and C replaces nsIWeakReference with nsIPresShell*, then the answer is that you want to land all three, not just the two that together leak what the third removes
# [07:33] <kwierso> Mark_Capella: and actually, it now affects four different files
# [07:33] <Mark_Capella> yeah - I did a local file scan and found them
# [07:35] <jdm> bz: one day I'll learn all the subtleties of docshells
# [07:36] <jdm> well, maybe not all of them
# [07:36] <jdm> I'll settle for a few
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# [07:37] <Mark_Capella> :-( the poor participants discussed the proper resolution for two years
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# [07:39] <@bz> jdm: heh
# [07:39] <@bz> jdm: did my question make sense?
# [07:40] <jdm> bz: I think so
# [07:40] <jdm> it at least made me uneasy
# [07:40] <hub> philor: I need to get the third one reviewed but it make sense, is that's the reason
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# [07:41] <@bz> jdm: heh
# [07:41] <jdm> bz: actually, I'm not certain. Since SetDocLoaderParent calls SetUsePrivateBrowsing, it looks like the count will be accurate to me
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# [07:48] <jdm> oh wait
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# [07:48] <jdm> if there's a subframe in the history that is in private mode
# [07:48] <jdm> and we exit private mode and go back...
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# [07:49] <jdm> if the docshell's in the bfcache, it's still alive and the count would still be correct if I'm reasoning correctly about this
# [07:51] <jdm> yeah, I think we're fine
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# [07:52] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/4b9608fd670c - Andreas Gal - Compress input events in gonk backend (bug 718914, r=cjones).
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# [07:53] <hub> philor: also note that in opt the leak didn't happen.
# [07:53] <aja> btw....aware ofn flash preview that uses protected mode on win7+ ?
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# [07:53] <philor> hub: no leak checking in opt
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# [07:55] <hub> philor: ah ok
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# [08:01] <akeybl> philor: Would you mind checking whether or not the OS X debug build from https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Mozilla-Release&rev=18ce5e304e97 is something to be concerned about?
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# [08:12] <jdm> oh no
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# [08:12] <jdm> I forgot I'm still debugging firefox
# [08:12] <jdm> and now I'm trying to link
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# [08:13] <jdm> boom, an extra 3gb of memory right there
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# [08:16] <philor> akeybl: bug 725214, though it doesn't do anything to help you decide about the impact or whether you want to wait on a retriggered build
# [08:17] * philor rolls the dice and triggers one, anyway
# [08:18] <akeybl> philor: thanks - so we're just hoping we land on a 10.5 build machine?
# [08:18] <akeybl> nice
# [08:18] <akeybl> :)
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# [08:21] <philor> akeybl: no, we will not get one, we're hoping to get lucky despite getting a 10.6, like the other push on m-r, and like both pushes on esr10
# [08:21] <akeybl> ah I see the opposite
# [08:22] <philor> the hang isn't certain, just common
# [08:22] <akeybl> I see OK
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# [08:23] <philor> "The worse that can happen is we getting more oranges," says espindola rather too prophetically :)
# [08:27] * philor goes back to https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Mozilla-Release&onlyunstarred=1 to avoid looking at Android
# [08:30] <philor> actually, we only need one boxcar, let's throw a few more dice
# [08:31] <heycam> windows try builds are a bit backed up today :/
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# [08:33] <philor> builds, or tests?
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# [08:35] <philor> or, since I know the answer to that, tests, not builds
# [08:35] <heycam> tests
# [08:35] <heycam> yes
# [08:36] <philor> the XP slaves in particular take a lot of hand-holding that they don't often get during a releng work-week
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# [08:38] <philor> jdm: how are you managing to crash only on 10.6 debug?
# [08:38] <jdm> uh oh
# [08:38] <jdm> probably the assert
# [08:39] <jdm> I knew I should have ignored my gut and left out the safety checks
# [08:39] <philor> assertions: lovely when they bite other people, not so much when they bit their creator
# [08:39] <jdm> yeah, I need backing out
# [08:40] <jdm> I'm on it unless you say otherwise
# [08:41] <philor> I'll let you, my connection tonight isn't inspiring much of anything, certainly not confidence in pushing
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# [08:42] <philor> wow, "because 10.6 was the first debug done" wouldn't have been in my first several guesses
# [08:43] <jdm> yeah, that's quite the race upset
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# [08:45] <jdm> philor: is there a quicker way to select multiple builds than the link in the bottom left?
# [08:46] <philor> jdm: click one, cmd+click the rest
# [08:46] <jdm> I can feel my future rsi gloating
# [08:46] <jdm> excellent
# [08:46] <philor> or if you like dragging, click one, open the comment box, drag the rest onto it
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# [08:47] <sfink> or if you like the keyboard, j/k through the builds and use the spacebar to select
# [08:47] <jdm> ooh, I like that last one
# [08:47] <jdm> I didn't know about space
# [08:47] <sfink> or if you're like me, do nothing and wait to see if philor does it for you
# [08:48] <philor> you'd think since I bitched about space, I'd remember we did it anyway
# [08:49] <philor> truth is, I never try to use it to scroll while I've got something selected, so I never get the reminder *or* feel the loss
# [08:50] <sfink> ah! I don't remember you complaining about space, and couldn't figure out what the problem might be. If I ever used it to scroll, I probably would've paid more attention.
# [08:51] <philor> I do use it, but apparently only in a weird contextual way
# [08:52] <sfink> and jdm, while you're pondering your divorce from the mouse, you might want to consider the c key for bringing up the comment box after you've selected the builds
# [08:52] <jdm> :o
# [08:52] <jdm> sfink you must teach me everything you know
# [08:53] <sfink> then <tab> <enter> to submit the comment, and no mousie at all
# [08:53] <jdm> this is the best
# [08:53] <jdm> I'm going to star everything
# [08:53] <jdm> even the green builds
# [08:53] <sfink> :0
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# [08:53] <jdm> "a for effort"
# [08:53] <jdm> "great job on this build!"
# [08:54] <jdm> "just dropping in to say hi"
# [08:54] * philor takes the rest of the evening off
# [08:54] <philor> best Tom Sawyer fence painting I've ever seen on tbpl :)
# [08:54] <sfink> Ok, you can learn everything I know by clicking on that "Help" dropdown in the upper left. Or at least, everything I knew back when I implemented all this crap.
# [08:55] <jdm> johnath: your brown noise suggestion was fantastic
# [08:55] <jdm> I just remembered that it has been playing for the past 10 minutes
# [08:55] <hub> how can I have hg know about rebasing like git?
# [08:55] <hub> .rej is so 1999
# [08:56] <sfink> brown noise? I know about white and pink, but brown? /me goes to wikipedia...
# [08:56] <jdm> hub: there's an extension, but it's broken things before
# [08:56] <jdm> in really frustrating and random ways
# [08:57] <jdm> sfink: http://t.co/xEE2YZFA - set to brown, volume high, and oscillation high
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# [09:00] <sfink> hub: rebasing when? hg pull --rebase can give you a merge editor. I assumed hg rebase would do the same. Or do you mean qpop, pull -u, qpush?
# [09:01] <jdm> sfink: oh no, not --rebase :(
# [09:01] <sfink> I likes it.
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# [09:01] <jdm> I hope you like cleaning up after it when it vomits all over inbound
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# [09:01] <hub> sfink: yeah mq
# [09:01] <sfink> Supposedly, the main cause of vomit has been fixed since... er... 1.7 or something?
# [09:02] <sfink> I haven't had problems in ages.
# [09:02] <hub> I call rebase because that what would happen if I was using git
# [09:02] <jdm> sfink: I don't believe we ever definitely cleared up whether that was true or not.
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# [09:03] <sfink> hub: obviously, opinions vary, but I always apply all of my mq patches that I can and then do hg pull --rebase. And I have my .hgrc configured to use kdiff3 for the resulting merges.
# [09:03] <sfink> jdm: Yeah, there was at least one false report of it being fixed, but I really haven't had a problem with it in a long time now.
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# [09:04] <jdm> holy crap
# [09:05] <jdm> enough websockets intermittent oranges?
# [09:05] <jdm> philor: you said you were taking the night off >:(
# [09:05] <philor> well, yeah, but I didn't *mean* it!
# [09:06] <philor> and yeah, if you want your tests to look awful, lump them by running them all through a single file
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# [09:19] <mak> heycam: ping
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# [09:25] <heycam> mak, pong, but just for 1 minute or so
# [09:25] <mak> heycam: so, there is a Paint regression on your mac 10.7 patch
# [09:25] <heycam> mak, oh :(
# [09:25] <mak> heycam: I wonder if it was expected or I should backout it while you check what's up
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# [09:26] <heycam> mak, this is a Tpaint regression?
# [09:26] <mak> I think so, it's marked only as Paint though
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# [09:27] <heycam> mak, ok, well I am not sure -- the patch does cause the window to animate when it is created, that could cause a delay, but without knowing exactly what the test is measuring I don't know
# [09:27] <heycam> mak, maybe best to back out until I can look at it tomorrow
# [09:27] <mak> ok, it's not so small, it's a 15% regression
# [09:27] <heycam> heh
# [09:27] <mak> I will do, thanks
# [09:27] <heycam> thanks
# [09:27] * heycam -> dinner
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# [09:52] <ohsix> is there an extension to export/import browser history? or drag and drop between Library(s), or trivial merge of some of the sqlite tables
# [09:57] <mak> ohsix: not for history. though you may just use Sync
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# [09:58] <j-b> bsmedberg: hello. ARe you around?
# [09:58] <ohsix> well i've got separate sessions that i just want to merge the history into a clean or another profile
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# [09:59] <Callek> ohsix: you can setup Sync to merge data too
# [10:00] <ohsix> interesting, i'll have to see about that then
# [10:00] <Callek> if you have distinct profiles, and its also relevant to note, that the same session does not _have_ to be accessible while you're setting up another one (if you write down or print/etc. your sync key)
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# [11:10] <darktrojan> my live bookmarks keep saying they failed to load
# [11:10] <darktrojan> even when they didn't
# [11:10] <darktrojan> :(
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# [11:11] <mak> darktrojan: heh, I think there is already a bug filed, though I'm rewriting all of that
# [11:12] <mak> I just have to fix the hundreds bugs I introduces
# [11:12] <mak> introduced
# [11:12] <darktrojan> did you break it?
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# [11:12] <mak> no
# [11:12] <mak> it's a bug that exists from some time
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# [11:12] <darktrojan> hmm, it's only happened to me recently
# [11:13] <mak> I meant that it's not worth to fix it since it's being rewritten
# [11:13] <darktrojan> chop chop then
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# [11:13] <mak> well, recently we had network issues I think, I wonder if those livemarks point to mozilla?
# [11:13] <darktrojan> nope
# [11:13] <mak> hm, no idea then
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# [11:13] <darktrojan> they load fine, but the error message never goes away
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# [11:45] <kanru> noob question.. what is the difference between nsRefPtr and nsCOMPtr? And when to use which one?
# [11:46] <tbsaunde> kanru: nsRefPtr is for concrete classes like nsFoo and nsCOMPtr is for interfaces like nsIFoo
# [11:46] <NeilAway> darktrojan: hey, 5th time lucky (I got xhtml today!)
# [11:46] <darktrojan> \o/
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# [11:46] <darktrojan> I get it most days tbh
# [11:46] <NeilAway> darktrojan: I was getting worried, because I had 4 htmls in a row
# [11:47] <darktrojan> must be something about the time of day you read it
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# [11:47] <NeilAway> darktrojan: that's a random time after 10:11 UTC
# [11:47] <kanru> tbsaunde: thanks!
# [11:47] <darktrojan> so precise
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# [12:28] <edmorley> bbondy++
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# [12:57] <mak> edmorley: merging?
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# [12:58] <edmorley> yeah will do :-)
# [12:58] <mak> edmorley: I was about ot merge 06b063c001b6 though don't want to overlap
# [12:59] <edmorley> I was going to merge once I'd got rid of the last half dozen overnight bugmail ; if you'd rather than I don't mind :-)
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# [13:00] <mak> no hurry
# [13:01] <mak> half dozen eh... I usually get 200 overnight :D
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# [13:02] <edmorley> the last half dozen sadly
# [13:02] <edmorley> turning off auto-CC on reply, has helped though (for the marking bugs case)
# [13:02] <edmorley> I've still got newsgroups & rest of planet to go through, but I'll do those post merge
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# [13:16] <heeen> is it possible to disable the -moz- prefix for CSS3 rule matching
# [13:16] <heeen> e.g. make gecko accept transition: instead of -moz-transition
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# [13:17] <edmorley> kutsurak: I'm about to file a bug to request level 1 commit access, so you can use try-server, if you are interested?
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# [13:19] <kutsurak> edmorley: sure!
# [13:20] <NeilAway> stupid xp setup wizard
# [13:20] <NeilAway> "Welcome to XP" (click Next) "Thank you!" (click Finish")
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# [13:20] <kutsurak> edmorley: although, I had a few difficulties understanding the output last time... Is there any documentation about it?
# [13:21] <cers> heeen: I don't suppose a solution like prefixfree is what you're after?
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# [13:23] <edmorley> kutsurak: the documentation for TBPL is pretty poor (unless there is something new I've not seen) unfortunately
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# [13:23] <edmorley> kutsurak: I can try to explain it, if that helps?
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# [13:24] <kutsurak> edmorley: If it's not a lot of trouble sure :)
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# [13:24] <edmorley> kutsurak: oh and re: the bug I've just CC'd you onto, you'll need to also state what login email for SSH, as well as steps 3-5
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# [13:25] <kutsurak> ok, i'll check it out. thanks!
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# [13:25] <edmorley> kutsurak: I'll just do this inbound merge (gotten distracted) and I'll do my best to explain TBPL :-)
# [13:26] <kutsurak> Thanks.
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# [13:31] <hsivonen> paul: Is there a way to take a screenshot on Ubuntu in a way that doesn't misrepresent the top panel in Unity?
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# [13:32] <hsivonen> maybe I have to make the window non-maximized to avoid a bug that adds a panel shadow to screenshots only
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# [13:33] <paul> hsivonen: ?
# [13:33] <paul> hsivonen: I usually do: sleep 5 && import -window root /tmp/s.png
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# [13:34] <hsivonen> paul: doesn't work for me. an extra shadow that covers the Firefox tab bar gets added
# [13:34] <hsivonen> I'll post a screenshot of a non-maximized situation
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# [13:35] <paul> weird
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# [13:37] <edmorley> kutsurak: ok, so TBPL stands for tinderbox pushlog and is the much nicer version of the old style tinderbox view (which only a few projects still use, eg http://tinderbox.mozilla.org/showbuilds.cgi?tree=ThunderbirdTrunk). If you go to https://tbpl.mozilla.org/ , the view is just like the normal pushlog (https://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/pushloghtml) - ie: new changesets at the top, older at the bottom - with each 'pus
# [13:39] <edmorley> https://tbpl.mozilla.org/ defaults to mozilla-central, for the other trees (including try), use the "Tree: ... <more>" navigation
# [13:39] <kutsurak> OK
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# [13:41] <edmorley> The build/test results on the right are grouped by platform & also whether optimised/debug builds ; the "B" is the compilation and make-check stage, M(.....) are all the mochitests, R (...) reftests & T (...) talos tests (see https://developer.mozilla.org/en/Mozilla_automated_testing for differences)
# [13:43] <edmorley> "N" is the same as "B", but for Nightly builds
# [13:44] <edmorley> the help menu top left explains what the different colours mean, asterisks next to failures mean that someone has added a comment to explain what the failures was (known as starring)
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# [13:45] <kutsurak> All right. The thing I was not understanding last time was why some of the builds failed, and if it was my patch responsible
# [13:45] <edmorley> when clicking on an 'orange' test/build result, TBPL will try to search bugzilla for known intermittent failures ('random oranges') and offer them as suggestions
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# [13:47] <edmorley> so if you push to try and the suggestions match the test failure shown, then you know it was instead an unrelated intermittent failure
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# [13:47] <kutsurak> Ah :)
# [13:49] <edmorley> however, some things to bear in mind: leaks don't get suggestions so you have to search manually (boo), Android tests fail for no reason anyway (well, until bug 690311 improves the situation) & if your try run was pulled from an already broken mozilla-central tip, then even unknown failures might not be yours
# [13:50] <kutsurak> I guess with some experience it will become easier.
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# [13:50] <edmorley> apart from that, it works pretty well :-)
# [13:51] <edmorley> yeah, unfortunately it's really a matter of just getting used to it
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# [13:51] * mak waits for edmorley writing all this stuff to a wiki page :)
# [13:52] <kutsurak> OK well, I'll have training wheels on (ie I'll be asking around) at first :)
# [13:52] <edmorley> also, if you click on any test/build in TBPL, you'll get a blue cross in the bottom panel (in the middle) that retriggers it (you'll need an LDAP login, that level 1 will give you... though you may need to request a password separately from the main level 1 application bug)
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# [13:53] <edmorley> kutsurak: yeah - feel free to ask if you see oranges you are not sure about (anyone pushing checkin-neededs will tend to double-check the TBPL links you paste in the bugs anyway)
# [13:54] <kutsurak> Thanks a lot. :)
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# [13:55] <edmorley> one other thing that confused me at first, was that when pushing to try, it will often appear that your push including a load of other changesets that aren't the ones you were trying to test - this just means try hasn't seen those "brand new on mozilla-central changesets" before, and is perfectly normal
# [13:55] <edmorley> s/including/included/
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# [13:56] <jdm> oh, how cute, we apparently deadlocked in the deadlock detector
# [13:57] <jdm> I guess we should add another layer of deadlock detection to avoid that in the future
# [13:57] <mak> and did it detect itself?
# [13:57] <jdm> nope
# [13:57] <mak> damn
# [13:57] <jdm> actually I'm guess about the deadlocking; we may have just crashed
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# [13:59] <mak> it's like a politician detector, it detects others misbehavior with one hand while approving his own with the other one
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# [14:04] <jdm> hmm, I wonder if I should go to bed, or just admit that the time for sleeping has passed?
# [14:04] <edmorley> mak: I've saved the notes above & added an item to my misc mozilla tasks todo list - agree better docs would be good
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# [14:06] <edmorley> kutsurak: oh and I forgot to say, both summary and full build/test logs links can be found bottom left when clicking on any build/test in TBPL (helpful if TBPL times out loading a log, or if you are not sure if the failure was yours)
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# [14:18] <NeilAway> bah, vc10 apparently needs .net4
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# [14:40] <johnath> jdm: :) glad to hear it
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# [14:44] <jimm> NeilAway: ping
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# [14:52] <jimm> NeilAway: was curious if you might like to pick up the review in bug 373266 roc can't get to until next week. If not, no big deal the patches can wait.
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# [15:03] <hsivonen> has anyone done the scripting to see what the statcounter slope would look like for Firefox >= 4?
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# [15:11] <edmorley> hsivonen: version breakdown?
# [15:12] <kutsurak> edmorley: heh I screwed up the attachment didn't I?
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# [15:13] <edmorley> kutsurak: bugzilla autodetects it incorrectly sometimes, easy enough to change :-)
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# [15:13] <glob> kutsurak, what's the bug number?
# [15:13] <hsivonen> edmorley: no, I meant everything >= 4 summed together
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# [15:14] <kutsurak> glob: for my access request? Bug 725265
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# [15:14] <kutsurak> edmorley: thanks :)
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# [15:15] <glob> kutsurak, thanks; i was going to investigate bugzilla's autodetection stuff, but that doesn't seem to be a problem
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# [15:15] <edmorley> glob: yeah sorry 'incorrectly' was a bit of a paraphrase
# [15:17] <hsivonen> what's the protocol for giving someone the bit that allows them to file bugs as NEW (as opposed to UNCONFIRMED)?
# [15:18] <hsivonen> zcorpan@gmail.com should have that bit
# [15:18] <glob> hsivonen, you ask a bmo admin
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# [15:19] <glob> hsivonen, i agree, done
# [15:19] <@ted> hsivonen: the privilege is CANCONFIRM, fwiw
# [15:19] <hsivonen> glob: thank you
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# [15:20] <@bz_sleep> hsivonen: whom do you need canconfirmed?
# [15:20] <@bz_sleep> hsivonen: or did glob deal?
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# [15:20] <jdm> hsivonen: by the way, I have the privilege bit that can canconfirm
# [15:20] <jdm> so feel free to ping me about these things
# [15:20] <glob> bz, i sorted it
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# [15:21] <@bz> cool
# [15:21] <hsivonen> jdm: ok. thanks
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# [15:35] <Matti> glob: no editbugs for that user ?
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# [15:37] <glob> Matti, wasn't requested, and i don't see any patches/testcases
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# [15:52] <hsivonen> aargh. we already have nsParserUtils
# [15:53] <hsivonen> and what a weird class it is considering its name
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# [16:06] * mak suspects qfold just destroyed part of his patch
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# [16:13] <edmorley> hsivonen: sorry delayed response, was on a work call - this is something I've been playing about with previously that might help with usage:
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# [16:14] <edmorley> hsivonen: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1479849 and data source http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1479850 (save latter to firefox_updates.csv in same folder)
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# [16:14] <edmorley> after loading, press each of the firefox versions <4 to hide them from the graph
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# [16:15] <edmorley> graph is stacked usage, so looking at just top edge will give you the summed >=4 usage
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# [16:15] <hsivonen> edmorley: thank you
# [16:16] <NeilAway> jimm: not unless you ship me a Windows 7 PC for testing...
# [16:17] <jimm> NeilAway: ah, we need to get you a new laptop. :) What are you running these days? XP?
# [16:17] <NeilAway> jimm: indeed
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# [16:17] <edmorley> hsivonen: I've pieced the data together manually from multiple downloads of https://metrics.mozilla.com/stats/firefox_updates.csv over the last couple of months, since it only shows the last 2 weeks (and there is no longer a publicly available CSV for the last few years worth, sadly)
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# [16:18] <hsivonen> edmorley: ok. so absolute numbers are going up even it relative numbers on statcounter are going down
# [16:19] <edmorley> hsivonen: it would appear so, yes
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# [16:20] <edmorley> the metrics team no doubt has better dashboards for this kind of thing behind the metrics wall
# [16:20] * philor|away is now known as philor
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# [16:20] * Ms2ger didn't know Mozilla sent its hoodies from Wyoming
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# [16:27] <cers> Ms2ger: you also just got one?
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# [16:27] <Ms2ger> I did \o/
# [16:27] <Ms2ger> Now my Fx4beta T-shirt...
# [16:28] <cers> yeah - this hoodie is awesome
# [16:28] <tbsaunde> we're getting hoodies? O>o
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# [16:30] <Ms2ger> tbsaunde, you didn't get an email?
# [16:31] <tbsaunde> Ms2ger: no
# [16:31] <Ms2ger> (A few months ago, I think)
# [16:31] * mak wonders what's the delay between german and italian mail service, 1 month? :p
# [16:31] <Ms2ger> Heh
# [16:31] <Ms2ger> mak, it's UPS to your doorstep ;)
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# [16:32] <mak> Ms2ger: it's italian ups.
# [16:32] <Ms2ger> Uh-oh
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# [16:35] <daim> Please somebody can confirm that Thebes api is no more exported from libXUL in trunk ?
# [16:36] <Ms2ger> That may very well be correct
# [16:37] <cers> tbsaunde|mtg: are you on mozillians.org?
# [16:37] <daim> ho, and there is a easy way to revert that (i.e export Thebes API again) ?
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# [16:41] <NeilAway> bbondy: bah, I just discovered nsLocalFileWin::HasFileAttribute
# [16:41] * NeilAway crosses off Italy from the list of potential Ms2ger addresses
# [16:42] <Ms2ger> daim, I think you want khuey
# [16:42] <bbondy> ...checking
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# [16:43] <bbondy> NeilAway: Oh I noticed that horrible function but I didn't optimize it yet because it wasn't causing any significant slowdowns
# [16:44] * Yoric hopes to be able to get os.file production ready soon.
# [16:44] <Yoric> (but we are not there yet)
# [16:44] <bbondy> NeilAway: It's only called from: isHidden, IsSpecial, IsWritable which aren't used that much
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# [16:46] <daim> khuey: Is there a fondamental reason that Thebes API is no more exported from libXUL ? or should I file a bug for that ?
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# [16:48] <@khuey> daim: those are supposed to be internal only symbols, which is why we're not exporting them anymore
# [16:48] <@khuey> daim: what did we break?
# [16:48] * jwir3|away is now known as jwir3
# [16:48] <daim> all my work :-)
# [16:48] <@khuey> heh
# [16:49] <@khuey> what does your stuff do?
# [16:49] <daim> Image processing
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# [16:50] <@khuey> mak: did 716163 make today's nightly
# [16:50] <mak> khuey: yes
# [16:50] <daim> so, I have some specialized binary components using Thebes to pass surfaces to canvas element in C++
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# [16:50] <@khuey> mak: why is the bug still open then?
# [16:50] <@khuey> daim: ok
# [16:51] <@khuey> daim: can you pastebin the linker errors you get?
# [16:51] <mak> khuey: first cause the reporter is testing the fix, second cause the extension author never replied
# [16:51] <daim> mainly for optimization and direct buffer access
# [16:51] <mak> khuey: the fixed bug is a dependency, fwiw
# [16:51] <daim> khuey: ok
# [16:51] <@khuey> mak: ah, ok
# [16:51] <mak> I suppose we may want to mark the bug as "leaking" on amo
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# [16:53] <mak> ted: today's nightly should have the fix for the hangs after idle, so please let me know if it helps
# [16:53] <daim> khuey: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1479864
# [16:54] <daim> khuey: I found that may come from a change from http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-release/source/gfx/thebes/gfxTypes.h#51
# [16:54] <daim> no
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# [16:55] <daim> now set to http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/gfx/thebes/gfxTypes.h#50
# [16:55] <jdm> huh
# [16:56] <jdm> I don't even know what to make of the SML Events message in mozilla.dev.tech.js-engine
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# [16:58] <@khuey> daim: hmm, ok
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# [17:02] <daim> khuey: I'm recompiling with changes reverted, needed other defines seems still there in config.mk
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# [17:03] <@khuey> daim: well yeah, if you revert the stuff where we stopped exporting the symbols it'll work again
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# [17:06] <daim> khuey: that's what I'm going to do, I juste wanted to know if that was intentional or not: I can manage my own set of patches for my personal needss
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# [17:07] <@khuey> daim: ok, that's the way to go then
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# [17:10] <AryehGregor> Ms2ger, so how am I supposed to interpret try server results? It seems some tests failed; do I get to assume they're not my fault?
# [17:11] <Ms2ger> I'm happy to claim you didn't cause leaks in test suites you didn't touch
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# [17:12] <AryehGregor> Ack, I hate whoever decided Ctrl-L means "clear backscroll" in XChat.
# [17:12] <AryehGregor> It always gets me when I have the wrong window focused . . .
# [17:12] <Ms2ger> ^
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# [17:14] <Ms2ger> Interpreting tbpl is a bit of a black art, unfortunately
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# [17:14] <AryehGregor> Ms2ger, so it seems there was a reftest failure here, but I can reasonably assume that it was unrelated to me because I wasn't touching anything editor- or rendering-related? https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=592efbbd58f2
# [17:14] <AryehGregor> I was afraid of that.
# [17:15] <AryehGregor> Are these just flaky tests that fail randomly ("random orange")?
# [17:15] <Ms2ger> That one doesn't seem to have a reftest failure?
# [17:15] <Ms2ger> Unless you mean J1, those are js-engine tests
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# [17:15] * tbsaunde|mtg is now known as tbsaunde
# [17:15] <AryehGregor> Oh, it's a mochitest, I guess? https://tbpl.mozilla.org/php/getParsedLog.php?id=9162034&tree=Try
# [17:16] <AryehGregor> "19768 ERROR TEST-UNEXPECTED-FAIL | /tests/editor/libeditor/text/tests/test_bug600570.html | Pasting and setting the value directly should result in the same rendering"
# [17:16] <tbsaunde> cers: yes
# [17:16] <Ms2ger> Ah
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# [17:16] <cers> tbsaunde: ahh - I think I got the email through there
# [17:16] <Ms2ger> AryehGregor, so if you click the orange '3'
# [17:16] <Ms2ger> You get that TEST-UNEXPECTED-FAIL line
# [17:16] <AryehGregor> Right.
# [17:16] <Ms2ger> And (*) Bug 718316 - Intermittent test_bug597331.html | The caret should be displayed correctly after reframing and/or test_bug600570.html | Pasting and setting the value directly should result in the same rendering, where the reference image lacks a focus outline
# [17:17] <AryehGregor> Oh, I see.
# [17:17] <AryehGregor> Nice.
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# [17:17] <Ms2ger> So if you click that star, it turns yellow
# [17:17] <AryehGregor> It took a while to appear, and I was too impatient and clicked through to someplace else before it did.
# [17:17] <AryehGregor> What does that do, subscribe me to the bug?
# [17:17] <Ms2ger> Ah, yes
# [17:17] <Ms2ger> Fortunately not
# [17:18] <Ms2ger> Once you've picked the bug (there could be multiple), you can click "add a comment"
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# [17:18] <philor> heh
# [17:18] <Ms2ger> Which adds a comment to the bug on your behalf, and a link to the bug on the build
# [17:19] <AryehGregor> I guess I shouldn't worry about things like "TEST-UNEXPECTED-FAIL | automation.py | child process 2300 still alive after shutdown" either?
# [17:19] * Ms2ger eyes philor
# [17:19] <Ms2ger> Ah, Android
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# [17:19] <Ms2ger> Oh, not Android
# [17:19] <philor> bug 603147
# [17:19] <Ms2ger> Thank you
# [17:20] <Ms2ger> AryehGregor, meet philor, our resident expert on intermittent oranges
# [17:20] <AryehGregor> "Comment 648"
# [17:20] <AryehGregor> This random-orange bug sure got a lot of automated spam.
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# [17:20] <philor> one of our more popular flavors of orange
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# [17:21] <philor> and yet, we persist in not doing anything about it
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# [17:22] * philor snags that WinXP M4
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# [17:23] <tbsaunde> cers: well, I don't understand why I didn't get one, but shrug I don't really need another sweat shirt type thing
# [17:23] <philor> woo, comment 700
# [17:23] <Ms2ger> Ah, 3280 bytes
# [17:23] <AryehGregor> I don't have to worry about blue, right? Just orange?
# [17:23] <Ms2ger> And red, and maybe possibly purple
# [17:23] <AryehGregor> What are red and purple?
# [17:23] <Ms2ger> Red is build failure
# [17:24] <AryehGregor> Oh, right. Makes sense.
# [17:24] <philor> and other stuff
# [17:24] <Ms2ger> Purple should be infra
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# [17:24] <philor> except when the infra is "once Windows fails a test that way, we fail to kill the process"
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# [17:25] <AryehGregor> Why does "buildbot.slave.commands.TimeoutError: command timed out: 2400 seconds without output, killing pid 57191" not get linked to a bug? I see two relevant-ish-looking bugs.
# [17:25] <philor> blue, though, really is blue, except when it just keeps retrying forever
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# [17:26] <philor> because the linking to the bug happens from the test filename, the part between the pipes in "TEST-BAD-THING | foopy.html | It didn't go well"
# [17:27] <AryehGregor> And there is no test name there?
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# [17:27] <Ms2ger> This is higher-level than the test runner
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# [17:29] <Ms2ger> And Android is... *sigh*
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# [17:29] <AryehGregor> Most of my pushes seem to have memory leaks in some of the mochitests . . . I guess I can ignore that?
# [17:29] <AryehGregor> Also: when there are bugs filed for random orange, why don't the tests get marked random so they don't distract everyone?
# [17:30] <Ms2ger> Ah
# [17:30] <Ms2ger> Because theoretically they could still be testing something useful
# [17:30] <philor> no
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# [17:30] <Ms2ger> And if they're a pain, maybe someone will fix them
# [17:30] <AryehGregor> But no one will notice, because any failure will be assumed to be random because the test output thing links you to the bug?
# [17:30] <AryehGregor> And there are random failures on every single commit . . .
# [17:30] <philor> because we lack any memory of previous runs to tell us the difference between random and permanent
# [17:31] <Ms2ger> That, too
# [17:31] <AryehGregor> But reftests, for instance, can be marked random in reftest.list, right?
# [17:31] <AryehGregor> Ooh, here's one that's a real failure for one of my commits.
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# [17:31] <philor> or rather, we lack any automated memory, so we use my memory as a substitute
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# [17:31] <AryehGregor> My reftest failed on Android XUL opt.
# [17:31] <Ms2ger> You may get the impression philor is a bitter man
# [17:32] <Ms2ger> He is
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# [17:32] <philor> they can indeed
# [17:32] <AryehGregor> Should I redo the patch with some fails-if magic for Android XUL opt?
# [17:32] <AryehGregor> https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=772dc5196079
# [17:33] <philor> they might as well be removed instead, though, because a reftest marked as random can fail ten thousand times in a row without triggering anything
# [17:33] <Ms2ger> All Android, in fact
# [17:33] <Ms2ger> The test failed on Android Native too, as you can see on https://tbpl.mozilla.org/?tree=Try&rev=772dc5196079&noignore=1
# [17:33] <AryehGregor> Ooh, magic?
# [17:34] <AryehGregor> Why didn't that appear by default?
# [17:34] <AryehGregor> So should I just do fails-if(Android)?
# [17:34] <Ms2ger> I think that works
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# [17:34] <Ms2ger> It didn't appear by default because it contains permanent oranges
# [17:34] <AryehGregor> Oh, so the whole suite is disabled? That's . . . useful.
# [17:35] <AryehGregor> . . . why isn't the first priority when a test randomly fails to disable it?
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# [17:35] <AryehGregor> Is it really useful to annoy people constantly? I mean, if it's a bug, then file a bug and let it be handled like any bug.
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# [17:35] <Ms2ger> Ah, "ignored"
# [17:36] <AryehGregor> Alternatively, if there's any bug I really want fixed, clearly I should get a test-case checked in that randomly fails until that bug is fixed, because it seems like it would be a good way to get people to work on it.
# [17:36] <Ms2ger> It would make philor hate you
# [17:36] <AryehGregor> Is there a way to see what the test/ref images were for the Android failure?
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# [17:36] <Ms2ger> That's not a good way to work around here :)
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# [17:37] <Ms2ger> AryehGregor, "open reftest analyzer"
# [17:37] <Ms2ger> May or may not work on non-Gecko browsers
# [17:37] <AryehGregor> Yeah, it didn't work in Chrome.
# [17:38] <@bz> we don't have a way for users to add extension-to-type mappings via the Firefox UI, eh?
# [17:38] <Ms2ger> Maybe?
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# [17:38] <@khuey> bz: Options -> Applications?
# [17:39] <Ms2ger> There's that one tab that hangs my browser
# [17:39] <Ms2ger> What khuey said
# [17:39] <@khuey> I guess you can't add them there though
# [17:39] <@khuey> only modify
# [17:39] <@bz> right
# [17:39] <@bz> that's the thing
# [17:39] <@bz> and you can't modify either
# [17:39] <Matti> but Options -> Applications is very limited. You can't change a type as example
# [17:39] <@bz> not the "which type does this map to?"
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# [17:40] <@khuey> 288 nsTArray<nsIScrollPositionListener*> mListeners;
# [17:40] <Matti> look in mimetypes.rdf :-)
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# [17:40] <@khuey> non-owning ptrs for the loss
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# [17:44] <snorp> josh: ping?
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# [17:48] <edmorley> ted++
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# [17:49] <@bsmedberg> khuey: "owning"?
# [17:49] <@bsmedberg> khuey: nsIScrollPositionListener isn't refcounted
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# [17:49] <Ms2ger> Lovely name for a not-refcounted class
# [17:50] <@bz> like nsIFrame!
# [17:50] <@bsmedberg> yeah, I was told not to change the name because of the tree churn
# [17:50] <@khuey> bsmedberg: ah, well then
# [17:50] <Ms2ger> Report those people to the police
# [17:50] <@bsmedberg> at least as part of the nsQueryFrame patch which actually made nsIScrollPositionListener non-refcounted
# [17:50] <Ms2ger> I believe roc made that a company policy
# [17:51] <@khuey> bsmedberg: btw I would appreciate a quick review on that plugin sg bug ;-)
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# [17:51] <@ted> edmorley: ?
# [17:51] <@bsmedberg> I missed the email apparently!
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# [17:51] <@khuey> bsmedberg: 657588
# [17:51] * @khuey heads into the office
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# [17:52] <edmorley> ted: bug 697205 c#6
# [17:52] <@ted> ah
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# [17:52] <edmorley> :-)
# [17:52] <@bsmedberg> khuey|away: I... think that's the wrong patch
# [17:52] <Pike> oh the irony, "via Camera on iOS"
# [17:52] <@bsmedberg> it has tabbrowser.xml changes in it?
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# [17:53] <@bsmedberg> and typeaheadfind stuff?
# [17:54] <@ted> Pike: yeah, i considered that
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# [17:55] <@ted> but i didn't feel like dealing with an android phone :-P
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# [17:57] <jlebar> smaugIC, ping?
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# [18:04] <philor> mbrubeck: so, I just shift+reloaded tbpl, and then starred a test_audio_event_adopt.html etc. on the first try :)
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# [18:05] <josh> snorp: ?
# [18:06] <snorp> josh: so I'm getting closer on the click-to-play stuff
# [18:06] <josh> good, anything I can help with?
# [18:06] <snorp> josh: looks like part of the problems is that nsObjectLoadingContent bails early because it already has a mInstanceOwner
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# [18:07] <snorp> if I stop the plugin first before playing it we can get past that, but still doesn't work
# [18:07] <snorp> I'm also confused by the presence of two nsObjectLoadingContent instances
# [18:07] <snorp> one of them is just totally bogus (no mime type, uri, etc)
# [18:07] <josh> snorp: How can I reproduce this?
# [18:07] <snorp> josh: enable tap to play in fennec
# [18:07] <snorp> and try to use a plugin :)
# [18:07] <snorp> (tap it)
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# [18:07] <snorp> I don't know if it's possible to repro in desktop
# [18:08] <josh> I don't have a debug setup on a mobile phone
# [18:08] <josh> I should make one, but that would take me a while
# [18:09] <snorp> it looks like with a little hackery you could make it go on desktop
# [18:09] <snorp> but I'm not sure
# [18:09] <snorp> if you can figure out how to call PlayPlugin() it should work
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# [18:10] <snorp> you'd need to enable plugins.click_to_play
# [18:10] <snorp> how do I get a web console for chrome context?
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# [18:14] <josh> snorp: Enabling plugins.click_to_play on a Mac OS X Firefox build shows the click to play UI but clicking does nothing, is that your problem?
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# [18:14] <snorp> josh: no.
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# [18:15] <snorp> josh: on mobile we have stuff that calls nsObjectLoadingContent::PlayPlugin when you tap
# [18:15] <snorp> josh: you should be able to reproduce the actual problem on desktop if you can do something similar
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# [18:17] <edmorley> philor: wow this is awesome :-)
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# [18:20] <philor> it doesn't actually make any sense, fetching the log should only have been burning a second or two, but it does seem to work
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# [18:21] <edmorley> philor: yeah but weren't we losing the logs due to multiple cache locations in the doohicky
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# [18:21] <philor> edmorley: we were losing the cache, but that just meant that we fetched it from ftp.m.o twice instead of just once
# [18:22] <edmorley> ok
# [18:22] <edmorley> i'm still quite unsure of how half of tbpl works
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# [18:22] <edmorley> (other than 'magic')
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# [18:23] <philor> so before, two processes both fetch the log taking a second or two, then the one that has to look up bugs times out after 20 seconds, now, one fetches it while the other waits, then the other somehow manages not to time out
# [18:23] <philor> yeah, magic
# [18:23] <@bz> edmorley: any sufficiently convoluted code is indistinguishable from magic?
# [18:24] <jtcranmer> bz: any code is indistinguishable from magic?
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# [18:24] <nemo> bz: So, yeah, I don't know if you caught that last part of that blathering yesterday, but Neil suggested the obvious of scaling the image way down before calculating the average pixel luminance - no high memory usage or heavy JS looping - can do a 5000x5000 image basically in a millisecond :)
# [18:24] <edmorley> philor: ah so less clownshoes :-)
# [18:24] <@bz> jtcranmer: depends on how much you know about how code works
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# [18:24] <@bz> nemo: ah, cute
# [18:24] <nemo> bz: http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase242d.xhtml <- scaling it way down
# [18:24] <nemo> bz: http://m8y.org/tmp/testcase242c.xhtml <- sampling a smaller area instead (512x512 max)
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# [18:25] <@bz> nemo: I see tiems in the 60-200ms range on that testcase on my machine
# [18:25] <@bz> nemo: for the first calculation for a given image
# [18:26] <nemo> bz: yeah, the very first time you write the huge image to the canvas, it is a little slow
# [18:26] <nemo> after that it is fast
# [18:26] <nemo> I have no idea why. something in firefox
# [18:26] <nemo> bz: frankly, I'd be more inclined to go with just writing 512x512 of the image, or skipping really large images
# [18:26] * khuey|away is now known as khuey
# [18:26] <@khuey> bsmedberg: oops
# [18:26] <@bz> nemo: we have an image cache
# [18:26] <@bz> nemo: for canvas
# [18:26] <nemo> ahh
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# [18:26] <@bz> nemo: that might be it
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# [18:27] <@khuey> bsmedberg: it's better now
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# [18:27] <nemo> bz: I'm a bit puzzled as to what the image cache would be doing though. after all, the image is already loaded to the screen!
# [18:27] <nemo> bz: and it is being downscaled way down to the canvas. unless that downscale is actually that slow
# [18:27] <nemo> which seems a bit silly
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# [18:28] <nemo> can't believe the image lib is *that* inefficient
# [18:28] <Ms2ger> nemo, may be image format
# [18:28] * Ms2ger doesn't remember the details
# [18:28] <nemo> Ms2ger: but the image was unpacked to be rendered to the screen
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# [18:28] <nemo> Ms2ger: so if you write it to the canvas, it is already basically a pixmap no?
# [18:28] <cers> nemo: sigh, clicking change image on that test has borked my firefox - loading a really large image I'm assuming
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# [18:28] <nemo> cers: yep! :D
# [18:29] <nemo> cers: borked is astounding though
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# [18:29] <cers> nemo: I guess it'll come back alive sooner or later
# [18:29] <nemo> cers: 2nd image is 9,921px × 7,016px
# [18:29] <nemo> you must not have much memory
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# [18:29] <Ms2ger> nemo, have a look at the code... It's called CanvasImageCache, IIRC
# [18:29] <@bsmedberg> Phew, people are still maintaining the binary xforms addon?
# [18:29] <nemo> cers: it was a stress test of worst case - but really, that's exaggerated, if this was limited to images of a million pixels or less, I think it'd work great
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# [18:29] <cers> nemo: after osx gobbles up around 1gb for itself, I have about 1gb left for everything else
# [18:30] <nemo> ouch
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# [18:32] <nemo> cers: huh. my mac mini only *has* a gig of memory...
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# [18:33] <mbrubeck> philor: \o/
# [18:33] <cers> nemo: probably doesn't hare memory with the gfx though, does it?
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# [18:34] <cers> nemo: on the second image in test d: Finished in: 69137ms, including writing to canvas. Average brightness of 251.24167175000002
# [18:35] <nemo> hehe
# [18:35] <nemo> cers: well, yeah, I'd suggest skipping for images of over a certain size and/or only writing a 512x512 chunk of the image for sampling. Still think it works better on stuff like the circuit diagram than the current charcoal colour
# [18:36] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/b584b4be0a00 - Kyle Huey - Fix Bug 657588. r=bsmedberg
# [18:36] <nemo> cers: WRT gfx card, this one says Intel GMA 950 - so my guess is yeah, probably is using system memory too
# [18:36] <Ms2ger> Looks like khuey got a fast review
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# [18:40] <cers> nemo: yeah, I've seen people complain about transparent images
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# [18:41] <Ms2ger> edmorley has sg access?
# [18:41] <jhammel> sg?!?
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# [18:42] <@khuey> Ms2ger: once I attached the right patch I did
# [18:42] <Ms2ger> :)
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# [18:43] <edmorley> Ms2ger: yeah, got it about 3 weeks ago
# [18:44] <Ms2ger> Excellent
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# [19:02] <nemo> does Firefox use libpng?
# [19:02] <@bz> yes
# [19:03] <nemo> bz: m'k. I was running pngcrush on an image, and it crashed repeatedly in libpng 1.5.8 on my 32 bit system, but was fine in libpng1.2.46 on my 64 bit system
# [19:03] <nemo> bz: http://m8y.org/images/dragon.png <- an old image I had lying around that I decided to crush out of curiosity.
# [19:04] <nemo> interestingly, http://m8y.org/images/dragon2.png which was a convert dragon.png dragon2.png also crashed, even though the file colourmap is different
# [19:04] <nemo> *** glibc detected *** pngcrush: double free or corruption (!prev): 0x080625b0 ***
# [19:04] <nemo> /usr/lib/libpng15.so.15(png_free_default+0x2f)[0xb773485f]
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# [19:05] <nemo> the 1.5.8 is also on my gentoo system, but the cflags are pretty darn minimal, and this is the first time I ran into it
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# [19:05] <@bz> nemo: I wonder what version we have...
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# [19:06] <nemo> other images seem to work fine
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# [19:06] <@khuey> bz: 1.4.8, roughly
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# [19:06] <@khuey> we probably have some additional fixes on top
# [19:06] <@bz> yeah, that would make sense
# [19:06] <@bz> based on the CHANGES file
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# [19:38] <dougt> roc: ping?
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# [19:40] <louisremi> bz: hi, here's the doc about deviceorientation to Transform 3D http://developer.mozilla.org/en/Using_Deviceorientation_In_3D_Transforms
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# [19:41] <Pike> glandium: do you have an idea for the regex in the .properties parser still? maybe it's not too bad to just hack getEntity with something line-based instead
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# [19:43] <glandium> Pike: haven't figured what's wrong yet. I'm still trying to make sense of the quadruple backslashes
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# [19:44] <Pike> glandium: basically, it's \\ does \, and then there's the literally \\, which is a single line string ending in a \, and the
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# [19:44] <Pike> single \, asking for a multi-line string
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# [19:45] <Pike> glandium: it's trying to eat all r"\\" and r"\.", and then figure out if there's a odd-numbered r"\$" in the line
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# [19:49] <anant> ehsan_xchat: ping
# [19:50] <ehsan_xchat> anant, hey
# [19:51] <anant> ehsan_xchat: dan wrote up a description of what we want with a -webapp flag to firefox: https://etherpad.mozilla.org/webapp-flag-req
# [19:51] <anant> would love for you to go over the proposal and advise us on the best possible implementation path
# [19:52] <ehsan_xchat> anant, cool
# [19:52] <ehsan_xchat> anant, is there a bug on file for this?
# [19:52] <ehsan_xchat> that might be a better place for discussions
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# [19:52] <anant> sounds good, I will make a bug right now
# [19:53] <ehsan_xchat> great
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# [19:54] <anant> ehsan_xchat: what component would you recommend for this, XUL? General?
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# [19:55] <ehsan_xchat> anant, Toolkit::Startup and Profile SYstem
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# [19:55] <nemo> bz: fwiw I decided to poke glennrp 'bout that png thing since he's active in both pngcrush and libpng, and crash was at pngmem.c:586 although I didn't investigate further
# [19:56] <firebot> Check-in: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/65f4832b1e96 - Serge Gautherie - Bug 725349. (Av1) Add a missing space to log messages. r=gavin.sharp.
# [19:56] <nemo> uh
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# [19:56] <nemo> huh. first time I noticed firebot reports checkins to m-c
# [19:57] <@khuey> that's because firebot doesn't report checkins over a certain size
# [19:57] <@khuey> and most of the time people do big merges
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# [20:00] <yvan> how much of a concern would people have if we were to suggest that people commiting to Mozilla controlled repos digitally sign their commits?
# [20:00] <yvan> with a view to making it a requirement for contributors
# [20:00] <jdm> yvan: to what purpose?
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# [20:01] <jdm> (keep in mind that I have no idea what is required to digitally sign a commit)
# [20:01] <ehsan_xchat> jdm, good job on the pb stuff :)
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# [20:01] <yvan> it is a discussion kang and I have had, the goal is to provide a level of integrity checking between the originator of a commit and the checkin process
# [20:01] <jdm> ehsan_xchat: yeah, I'm excited about how quickly I'm getting feedback
# [20:02] <ehsan_xchat> yep
# [20:02] <Ms2ger> yvan, isn't pushing over ssh enough?
# [20:02] <ehsan_xchat> jdm, btw, I meant to ask you
# [20:02] <@bsmedberg> !@$#%^& xpcshell
# [20:02] <robcee> bz: still on?
# [20:02] <ehsan_xchat> jdm, I need to find somebody to help with 590640
# [20:02] <robcee> wanna meet us over in #devtools?
# [20:02] <ehsan_xchat> jdm, it's not exactly suitable as a good first bug
# [20:03] <ehsan_xchat> jdm, do you happen to know somebody who has a bit of gecko hacking experience and could help with that?
# [20:03] <ehsan_xchat> jdm, I can answer questions etc
# [20:03] <Ms2ger> robcee, bz has a lot of meetings, I hear
# [20:03] <yvan> that ensure that the communication channel has integrity, and this is a very remote threat, but there is always the possibility of injecting code if an attacker has access to the servers that a repo resides on (either through compromise or malicious admin scenario)
# [20:03] <jdm> ehsan_xchat: actually, I just might
# [20:03] <ehsan_xchat> but the person needs to be comfortable hacking around C++ code in the editor and debugger
# [20:03] <ehsan_xchat> really?
# [20:03] <ehsan_xchat> that's super awesome!
# [20:03] <Ms2ger> yvan, at that point we're already lost, no?
# [20:03] <jdm> ehsan_xchat: I'll see if jhk is interested
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# [20:04] <nemo> Ms2ger: well, I guess the point is it could be validated after the fact
# [20:04] <nemo> Ms2ger: since they wouldn't control all your private keys
# [20:04] <nemo> Ms2ger: so some process could tediously go over all the checkins and check to see if they'd been modified
# [20:04] <@khuey> is cryptographic signing needed to notice the repo being mucked with?
# [20:04] <@khuey> isn't this what the cset hashes are for?
# [20:05] <ehsan_xchat> khuey, in git and mercurial yes
# [20:05] * Ms2ger leaves the discussion to people who know what they're talking about, watches Jon Stewart instead
# [20:05] <@khuey> yvan: ^
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# [20:06] <nemo> khuey: er. that just verifies integrity from revision to revision, no? a patient person could rebuild the entire repo to hide a change from first commit no?
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# [20:06] <@khuey> nemo: but when you pull won't hg notice that the hashes don't match?
# [20:06] <nemo> oh. good point :D
# [20:06] <nemo> khuey: they don't control the remote. right.
# [20:06] <yvan> khuey: there are theoretical attack scenarios, and I am not familiar with all of them.
# [20:06] <nemo> yay for decentralisation! :D
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# [20:07] <@khuey> yvan: I think if you want us all to do a lot more work there needs to be a real threat scenario that's only preventable this way :-)
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# [20:07] <nemo> khuey: yeah. they'd have to have control of every single dev machine, at which point, as Ms2ger pointed out, you're already screwed :)
# [20:08] <Pike> yvan: that sounds like "yikes", I have 100+ localization contributors that will less know what you're trying to do that I
# [20:08] <yvan> khuey: I admit that my interest in promoting this is demonstrating that it is feasible to do this on a large, rapidly changing codebase, and kang has more knowledge on the attack scenarios
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# [20:08] <yvan> Pike: hence the flame retardant suit.
# [20:08] <Pike> yvan: I think we should go the opposite direction, tbh
# [20:09] <robcee> bz: ping!
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# [20:09] <@bz> robcee: pong
# [20:09] <robcee> hi!
# [20:09] <@bz> robcee: finishing up previous meeting; there in a sec
# [20:09] <robcee> are we still on?
# [20:09] <robcee> ok :)
# [20:09] <yvan> can you expand on that? the goal here is to improve integrity related controls on contributed code
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# [20:11] <Pike> yvan: I will likely start a discussion on how to get from ssh keys to being able to work on our repos from the web
# [20:11] <yvan> the other part of the code signing question are the right people to chat with about this (releng, devs, infra, etc)
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# [20:12] <Pike> yvan: I also go by l10n@mozilla.com, so I'm among those that should be in that discussion :-)
# [20:12] <WeirdAl> Hey, folks - who would know Mozilla's accessibility code really well? We're looking at bug 719561 and have traced the hang to that code, but we need help in isolating the hang
# [20:12] <Ms2ger> WeirdAl, surkov, tbsaunde, davidb
# [20:13] <davidb> hi
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# [20:13] * davidb looks
# [20:13] <WeirdAl> hi, david :) There's a tool called XMSAALib that can reproduce the exact same hang very easily
# [20:13] <WeirdAl> http://www.codeproject.com/Articles/33272/XMSAALib-a-non-MFC-class-to-retrieve-accessibility
# [20:14] <WeirdAl> key point is that with this tool, English-language FF hangs as well, so no special localization needed
# [20:15] <jdm> msucan++
# [20:15] <WeirdAl> another key point is that this did _not_ happen in FF8 and below
# [20:15] <davidb> hmm
# [20:15] <davidb> so first of all, we don't want them using MSAA if possible
# [20:15] <davidb> because that will cause degraded perf
# [20:16] <davidb> for the whole FF session
# [20:16] <msucan> jdm: ?
# [20:16] <jdm> msucan: your interactions with new contributors are inspirational
# [20:16] <WeirdAl> I'll note that for our guys.
# [20:16] <jdm> keep it up
# [20:16] <davidb> WeirdAl: yeah so long term we need to find them another way.
# [20:16] <msucan> jdm: thank you. i am happy to see contributors help us fix bugs
# [20:16] <davidb> WeirdAl: in the short term, what do we know about the hang?
# [20:16] <yvan> Pike: that is a good goal; moving integrity controls into the source control commit means you can accept less stringent authentication schemes, so that would move you in the direction of easing a dependency on ssh
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# [20:17] <davidb> WeirdAl: is this 100% repro?
# [20:17] <Ms2ger> Woo, msucan++
# [20:17] * Parts: AopicieR (AopicieR@moz-1B410FBA.adsl.alicedsl.de)
# [20:17] <msucan> jdm: and i think we should always do our best to help new contributors, because they are what drive mozilla forward
# [20:17] <WeirdAl> davidb: according to our engineers, we're making a legal API call into the FF a11y code, while the video is playing, and it hangs. It's not quite 100% reproducible, but damned close
# [20:17] <davidb> msucan++
# [20:17] <msucan> thank you guys :)
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# [20:18] <davidb> WeirdAl: are you in-process or out of process?
# [20:18] * jhford-work-away is now known as jhford-work
# [20:18] <msucan> (i need to thank all the writers of MDN - linking to docs for all the stuff is awesome!)
# [20:18] <yvan> in any case, nobody screamed that is a terrible idea, so I will start a more formal discussion, including documenting the reasons why we want this very clearly.
# [20:19] * timA is now known as IRCMonkey27303
# [20:19] <WeirdAl> davidb: out of process
# [20:19] <davidb> ok
# [20:19] <Pike> yvan: you might be deaf, though
# [20:19] <Pike> but I'm happy to read a real proposal
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# [20:20] <davidb> WeirdAl: jimm are you aware of bug 718561?
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# [20:20] <WeirdAl> jimm: 719561 actually
# [20:21] * rail_away is now known as rail
# [20:21] <davidb> oops
# [20:21] <davidb> thanks
# [20:21] <jimm> davidb, nope
# [20:21] <davidb> jimm: i'm thinking you might have the best insight.
# [20:21] <davidb> WeirdAl: why do you need to use MSAA?
# [20:22] * Quits: grubshka (grubshka@moz-81C99DC.w86-216.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout)
# [20:22] <jimm> "Updater.exe from Ask Toolbar causes non-English Firefox to hang when viewing Flash videos in YouTube and certain websites"
# [20:22] <WeirdAl> *sigh* I don't know why we do it...
# [20:22] <jimm> That's got to be the crziest bug title I've ever seen
# [20:22] <WeirdAl> we do some pretty dense things here
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# [20:22] <davidb> I'd love to help you not use MSAA
# [20:22] <yvan> Pike: I am not in the office today, so if there is a mob forming, they will have to find me first :) the big thing is that I wanted to make sure there were no instant 2 line reasons that said we shouldn't do this because of xyz.
# [20:23] <WeirdAl> davidb: should we take this to another IRC channel?
# [20:23] <davidb> yep
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# [20:23] <jimm> davidb: so, looks like the guy from Ask is working on it?
# [20:23] <davidb> WeirdAl: #accessibility
# [20:23] <Pike> yvan: localizers won't get it, can do that in one line
# [20:23] <davidb> jimm ^
# [20:23] <WeirdAl> <== the guy from Ask :)
# [20:23] <Pike> yvan: also, I'm in Berlin, I'd need to send half-a-planet-missiles anyhow
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# [20:24] <yvan> Pike: that is not a reason to not do it, that is a reason to do it slowly, and as an optional item initially while we gauge the response and learn how to make it easy for people.
# [20:24] <@smaug> !seen gandalf
# [20:24] <@killer> I don't know who gandalf is.
# [20:24] <firebot> gandalf was last seen 7 hours, 34 minutes and 10 seconds ago, saying 'promising that one day I'll return, when only my homeland gets in shape' in #l10n-drivers.
# [20:25] * Ms2ger kills killer
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# [20:31] <@ehsan> anant: commented on the bug
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# [20:32] <edmorley> jlebar++ on the heads up https://groups.google.com/d/topic/mozilla.dev.platform/6la6uX7S54w/discussion
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# [20:32] <Ms2ger> jlebar++
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# [20:34] <edmorley> If browserid forgets my email and password one more time (and then on top MDN does it's forcing you to do the shift + F5 dance), I think I'm going to lose it :-(
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# [20:34] <@ehsan> all the more reason to be using the hg trychooser extension
# [20:34] <jlebar> ehsan, how does that get around the problem?
# [20:34] * bwin is now known as bwinton
# [20:35] <@ehsan> jlebar: we can make trychooser run that command in the background ;)
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# [20:35] <jlebar> ehsan, I mean, I guess it could be updated to run that.
# [20:35] <jlebar> Ah, yes.
# [20:35] <@ehsan> jlebar: I wouldn't get my hopes up on upgrading hg.m.o ;)
# [20:35] * jlebar thought it somehow worked around the problem as is.
# [20:35] * Quits: maikmerten (maikmerten@moz-A74A4367.dynamic.qsc.de) (Quit: Leaving)
# [20:35] <@ehsan> nope
# [20:35] <@ehsan> no magic bullets
# [20:35] <@ehsan> or ponies
# [20:36] <@ehsan> sorry to disappoint you ;)
# [20:36] <jlebar> ehsan, Yeah. The hg guys really threw us a curveball here. :(
# [20:36] <jlebar> No easy way to turn it off.
# [20:36] <@ehsan> why is that a useful feature btw?
# [20:36] <jlebar> Well, in general, you don't want to rebase a rev you've pushed to someone else.
# [20:36] <@ted> josh: ping
# [20:36] <jlebar> or qimport it, or whatever.
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# [20:36] <jlebar> Our workflow of push -f'ing patches to a public repository was not anticipated.
# [20:37] <@ted> heh
# [20:37] <@ehsan> jlebar: I guess that would break more workflows than just that
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# [20:37] * @bz pushes changesets around repos all the time on his hard drive
# [20:37] <Ms2ger> Other people who misread "-f'ing patches"?
# [20:37] <@ehsan> I've seen git screw up rebases and merges too
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# [20:37] <@bz> and then I modify them....
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# [20:37] <@ehsan> so _maybe_ that's useful
# [20:37] <@ehsan> I just can't see it
# [20:37] <jlebar> ehsan, quite possibly. It seems kind of arrogant not to give us a way to turn it off.
# [20:37] <Ms2ger> Let's move to git
# [20:37] <jlebar> Seeing as it's just an advisory kind of thing that you can override anyway.
# [20:37] <@ehsan> heh
# [20:38] * @bz votes for RCS
# [20:38] <@bz> on a zipfile
# [20:38] <@bz> of the repo
# [20:38] <Ms2ger> bz, vote overturned
# [20:38] <@ehsan> I'm surprised why it's not an "extension" which you can just turn off
# [20:38] <jlebar> How about we just keep the source on bz's computer and e-mail him patches? That's probably better than RCS.
# [20:38] <@ted> there isn't any way to get DumpJSStack to go somewhere other than stdout on windows, is there?
# [20:38] <@ted> (if you're already in the debugger)
# [20:38] <@bz> jlebar: heh
# [20:38] <Ms2ger> jlebar, that's what I do
# [20:38] <jlebar> lol
# [20:38] <@ehsan> ted: easiest way, run firefox | cat
# [20:39] <Ms2ger> Then he emails back with a million comments
# [20:39] <@ehsan> oh
# [20:39] <@ted> jlebar: i've definitely come around to thinking that git's model of disposable branches is way better than mq
# [20:39] <@ted> ehsan: yeah, i'm already in a debugger
# [20:39] <@ehsan> missed the part about being already in the debugger
# [20:39] <@bz> ted: lemme check
# [20:39] <@ehsan> sorry
# [20:39] <@ehsan> impossible ;)
# [20:39] <@bz> ted: yeah, it explicitly sends to stdout
# [20:39] <@ted> sucks
# [20:39] <@ehsan> oh wait
# [20:39] <@bz> 283 fputs(buf, stdout);
# [20:39] <@bz> Now...
# [20:39] <@ehsan> there's an output tab
# [20:39] <@ehsan> in the debuggeer
# [20:39] <@bz> you could breakpoint in xpc_DumpJSStack
# [20:39] <@ehsan> that should capture it?
# [20:39] <@ehsan> unless it's an opt build
# [20:39] <@ted> i think i filed a bug asking for it to OutputDebugString when there's a debugger attached
# [20:39] <@bz> at which point you have it in a char*
# [20:40] <jlebar> ted, I've been using git for a month or so now, and I like disposable branches a lot. But the story with updating those branches and then pushing patches is not great.
# [20:40] <@bz> and then you can do whatever with it
# [20:40] <@ted> ehsan: this is a nightly
# [20:40] <@ted> jlebar: yeah, i'm not really sure how that interacts with our workflow
# [20:40] <jlebar> ted, Like, I update my patch, rebase -i, and now I have a new cset. But my old cset is gone from the history.
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# [20:40] <jlebar> ted, At least with mq, all my patch versions are in a repository.
# [20:40] <@ted> true
# [20:40] <jlebar> Not like I can read the diffs in that repo...
# [20:40] <@ehsan> jlebar: not in git
# [20:40] * Ms2ger does
# [20:40] <Ms2ger> Read those diffs, that is
# [20:41] <@ehsan> ted: sorry, don't know how you would do that
# [20:41] <jlebar> ehsan, I mean, I know I can go back to the rev using reflog. But it's hard to go back more than one version, for all practical purposes.
# [20:41] <biesi> bz, ted: conceivably you can do stdout=fopen("foo.txt", "w");
# [20:41] <jlebar> ehsan, And I can't go back a version on another machine.
# [20:41] <@bz> depending on what stdout is
# [20:41] <Mook_as> ted: bug 390328 has a really stale patch that made it take a FILE*, IIRC
# [20:41] <@bz> e.g. on Mac it's just a macro
# [20:41] * Quits: jfkthame (jfkthame@6A297B7F.A1C12133.9542EC20.IP) (Quit: jfkthame)
# [20:41] <Ms2ger> It's C++, what else than a macro would it be?
# [20:41] <@ted> yeah, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=640542 is what I filed
# [20:41] <@ted> oh well
# [20:42] <@ehsan> jlebar: yeah, reflogs are not synced between repos
# [20:42] <jlebar> ehsan, If we had more of a github pull request workflow, I'd just add commits atop commits until I passed review. But we don't do it like that.
# [20:42] <@ted> i think i can repro this 100% with this session restore
# [20:42] <@ehsan> which makes things hard
# [20:42] * Quits: anant (anant@moz-BBE3ABD.mv.mozilla.com) (Ping timeout)
# [20:42] <@ted> so maybe i just restart firefox from a console
# [20:42] <@ehsan> yes
# [20:42] <gkw> ehsan: ping
# [20:42] <@ehsan> jlebar: the way we use hg is weird
# [20:42] <@ehsan> gkw: hi
# [20:42] <Ms2ger> ehsan, ur wierd
# [20:42] <@ted> sucks, even windbg doesn't give me a good stack here
# [20:42] <@ted> i wonder wht
# [20:42] <@ted> why
# [20:42] <@bz> Ms2ger: um... a template?
# [20:42] <@ehsan> Ms2ger: that I am ;)
# [20:43] <Ms2ger> bz++
# [20:43] * Quits: anky (anky@DFA27AF2.9D848627.A3D1B221.IP) (Client exited)
# [20:43] <@ted> bsmedberg: ping
# [20:43] <gkw> ehsan: question about silent updates: have we considered the scenario where people don't quit their browser for months in a row? I hope silent updates won't trip over this
# [20:43] <@bsmedberg> ted: pong
# [20:43] <@ted> bsmedberg: i have bug 723473 in windbg
# [20:43] <tbsaunde> ehsan: jlebar you could create a new branch each time before rebasing I suppose
# [20:43] <@ted> i have a session restore that 100% reproduces it
# [20:43] <tbsaunde> so you'd have mypatch-v1 mypatch-v2 etc as brancehs
# [20:43] <jlebar> tbsaunde, That would get old pretty quick, I think.
# [20:43] <@ehsan> gkw: what do you mean by consider? those people won't get updates no matter what we do
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# [20:43] <@ted> interestingly, windbg fails to give me a full stack
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# [20:43] <mccr8> gkw: one solution would be to make the browser more unstable the longer it is up. ;)
# [20:44] <@bsmedberg> ted: debug or release build?
# [20:44] <@ted> bsmedberg: it's a nightly, so PGO'ed
# [20:44] <tbsaunde> that said I don't do that, but I very rarely want to go back versions of a patch
# [20:44] <@ehsan> tbsaunde: jlebar I use git tags for doing that
# [20:44] <@ehsan> and I have found it useful
# [20:44] <@ted> i could try spinning a local debug build and using this same session, i guess
# [20:44] <@bsmedberg> ted: would it be possible to see if your session-restore can repro this in a debug build?
# [20:44] <jlebar> I guess tags would work.
# [20:44] <@ted> that's gonna seriously cramp my browsing style for the next 20 mins while i rebuild
# [20:44] <@bsmedberg> ted: I suspect that we're double-freeing, and a debug heap smasher would find that a lot more easily
# [20:44] <@ted> okay
# [20:44] <@ted> i'll give it a spin
# [20:44] <gkw> ehsan: e.g. if a person quits and starts Firefox towards the end of our 6 week train, and next quits and starts 7-8 weeks later, when 2 trains have passed
# [20:44] <Ms2ger> See, git is wasting our time already
# [20:45] <@ehsan> gkw: for now, we don't redownload and reapply a newer update if one is found, but with background updates, that would be easier
# [20:45] <tbsaunde> ehsan: yeah tags seems more reasonable
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# [20:45] * @bsmedberg wonders how saveable a session restore is
# [20:45] <@ted> bsmedberg: do you know how new of a m-c i need to have that plugin change?
# [20:45] <Ms2ger> It's like ESR
# [20:45] <@ehsan> gkw: so when you restart, you would always be running the latest version
# [20:45] <tbsaunde> Ms2ger: compared to the amount of time we waste on hg?
# [20:45] <jlebar> Ms2ger, I just wasted my morning with the stupid hg phases thing. Sounds like all tools are a waste of time. Thus RCS.
# [20:45] <@ted> looks like my m-c is ~ a week out of date
# [20:45] <gkw> ehsan: you mean w/ background updates?
# [20:45] <@ehsan> gkw: but this is a problem which we should fix by prompting
# [20:45] <@bsmedberg> ted: 01-31
# [20:45] <@ehsan> gkw: yes
# [20:45] <@ted> okay, so what i have is new enough
# [20:45] <@ted> thanks
# [20:45] <gkw> i see
# [20:46] <@bz> An alternative to RCS, by the way, with similar performance characteristics, is hardcopy
# [20:46] <@bz> unique hardcopy
# [20:46] <@bz> whoever has it in his hands has the "lock"
# [20:46] <@bz> you edit it.
# [20:46] <@bz> Then you mail it to whoever wants to make the next change.
# [20:46] <gkw> ehsan: so background & silent updates are best friends, two different projects, but they both relate to updates
# [20:46] * gkw was confused by the two for awhile
# [20:46] <@ted> bsmedberg: incidentally, this plugin change has made my firefox pretty crashy on both mac and win :-/
# [20:46] <@ted> presumably because i use flashblock
# [20:46] <@ehsan> bz: I believe that is called SourceSafe Without Repository Corruption Bugs
# [20:46] * Quits: Boriss (FlyingToas@moz-62AAA429.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: Boriss)
# [20:47] <Ms2ger> bz, if it's as fast as the hoodies... ;)
# [20:47] <@bsmedberg> ted: yeah, we have some obvious issue with flashblock, it's on my list to figure out
# [20:47] <gkw> ehsan: silent updates have landed. is background updates coming soon? or has it landed?
# [20:47] <@ted> Ms2ger: i just got my hoodie the other day
# [20:47] <@ehsan> gkw: silent updates is like an umbrella term really :)
# [20:47] <@ehsan> it doesn't mean anything specific ;)
# [20:47] <Ms2ger> ted, I got mine today, still waiting for my Fx4 beta T-shirt and my pony
# [20:47] <@ehsan> gkw: the thing which has landed is technically the removal if the UAC dialog
# [20:47] <@ted> bsmedberg: ~1-2 crashes a day on my mac
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# [20:47] * @ehsan wishes we were better at picking names
# [20:48] <gkw> i see
# [20:48] <gkw> thanks!
# [20:48] <@ehsan> np :)
# [20:48] <@ted> picking names is not the problem here
# [20:48] <@ted> it's scoping
# [20:49] <@ted> lots of things are large projects with many bits
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# [20:49] <Bas> ehsan: We basically introduced a high privilege service to do the update, right?
# [20:50] <Wes> ted: I got a hoodie the other day, too. My wife and kid are fighting over who gets to wear it first.
# [20:50] <@ted> hah
# [20:50] <@ted> the hoodies are pretty slick
# [20:50] * davehunt is now known as davehunt|away
# [20:50] <jtcranmer> I have the package, but I haven't actually taken it out yet
# [20:51] <@ehsan> Bas: correct
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# [20:52] <Bas> ehsan: Out of curiousity, how high do we estimate the risk somebody finds a way to inject illegal code/libraries into that service so it can do something really terrible? :)
# [20:52] <@ehsan> Bas: we made that pretty damned hard :)
# [20:52] <NeilAway> ted: I keep meaning to patch assertions to use OutputDebugString too
# [20:52] <Bas> ehsan: Awesome! :)
# [20:52] <@ted> NeilAway: that'd be clever, but i'm more likely to run debug builds from the console
# [20:53] * Quits: timA (tim@moz-535753DA.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Max SendQ exceeded)
# [20:53] <@ted> whereas i frequently wind up attaching to a nightly build to figure out what's wrong
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# [20:53] <Bas> ehsan: The reason I'm asking is somebody told me about something cool a couple of months ago where they spoofed a DNS on a network or something to pretend to be the updater and give a false update. Sounded interesting.
# [20:53] <Bas> The update server, anyway
# [20:54] <NeilAway> ted: yeah, but I don't like having to switch from the debugger to the console to see why it stopped at DebugBreak
# [20:54] <@ted> we check the SSL cert of the updater, don't we?
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# [20:54] <@ted> NeilAway: ah, good point
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# [20:54] <Bas> ted: *shrugs* no idea, could be, I didn't see it work or anything. And I don't know enough about SSL to know how hard it would be to work around that.
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# [20:56] <@ted> you'd have to get a cert into our cert store, presumably
# [20:56] * jwir3|lunch is now known as jwir3
# [20:56] <@ted> since i don't think we give the user a way to override that
# [20:56] <@ted> or figure out a way to spoof a cert by hacking a CA'
# [20:56] <Bas> ted: *nods* any CA would do, presumably?
# [20:56] <@ted> i'm not sure if we check that the CA matches what we expect
# [20:56] <@ted> we do that for some things, like addons, i think
# [20:56] * Bas nods.
# [20:56] <Bas> Ah, interesting.
# [20:57] <@ted> we're signing the update mars nowadays
# [20:57] <@ted> as part of the silent update process
# [20:57] <@ted> i suspect we're only trusting a particular cert chain there, but i could be wrong
# [20:57] <Bas> Interesting! Thanks, that solves a lot of my curiosity about the process :)
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# [20:58] <@ted> i think signing the mar is more to verify that the update that the elevated process is being asked to install is valid
# [20:59] <@ted> and wasn't swapped around by some other program
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# [21:01] <@ehsan> Bas: our service does not access the network at all
# [21:01] <Bas> ehsan: we feed it locally?
# [21:01] <@ehsan> yes
# [21:01] * Bas nods.
# [21:02] <NeilAway> bbondy: no, the reason I mention HasFileAttributes is that possibly IsDirectory should call HasFileAttribute(FILE_ATTRIBUTE_DIRECTORY) and then put all the Resolve goodness into HasFileAttribute instead
# [21:02] <bbondy> ah ok
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# [21:04] <bbondy> NeilAway: Would you prefer I do that in that bug you just reviewed or just something to do once I optimize HasFileAttribute?
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# [21:06] <bbondy> Bas: any chance of getting to bug 722225 this week?
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# [21:07] <Bas> bbondy: I'll do it right now.
# [21:07] <bbondy> sweet thanks
# [21:07] <Bas> bbondy: (well, after dinner, but today, anyway :))
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# [21:08] <bbondy> sounds great, thank you!
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# [21:10] <nemo> Pike: so. just curious, because we have a small localisation project ourselves. How do you ensure the reliability of submitted localisations for minor languages?
# [21:10] <nemo> to avoid a Minecraft scenario
# [21:11] <Bas> bbondy: Nice idea btw! In the longer term we should extend this and not try either 10.0 or 10.1 if both failed and the graphics card didn't change maybe? That would cut us another 50-ish ms on non-D3D10 hardware?
# [21:11] <edmorley> mfinkle: xul failing on inbound
# [21:11] <nemo> Pike: http://www.vg247.com/2012/01/29/racial-slur-slips-into-minecraft-translation-project/ I mean...
# [21:11] <bbondy> Bas: Didn't even think of that, I'll do a follow up bug on that idea in the next week or so.
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# [21:12] <Pike> nemo: we don't crowdsource to begin with
# [21:13] <bbondy> Bas: One thing is if we don't try either one then we aren't protected against hardware/DX changes.
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# [21:13] <bbondy> whereas this change currently protects against that by just setting a preference for which to try first before the other
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# [21:13] <Pike> nemo: trivial crowdsourcing always falls for that, and folks that do non-trivial crowdsourcing don't say how they do it
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# [21:14] <nemo> Pike: ah. but if someone says "I want to translate language X" - and X is so rare that you have no one else to crosscheck...
# [21:14] * timA is now known as IRCMonkey1066
# [21:14] <Pike> we do have problems with a few languages not keeping up, though. need to pick that discussion up again
# [21:14] <nemo> Pike: for us, that's for fairly large languages just 'cause we don't have that many contributors :(
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# [21:14] <bbondy> Bas: let me know if you have any ideas on that detection so we won't always ignore 10.0 and 10.1 over time.
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# [21:15] <nemo> Google Code-In had that problem for projects that accepted translations for languages that no mentors spoke. People signing up for translations and feeding them into google translate.
# [21:15] <nemo> just for the $100 task payout - supposedly was common w/ contributors from India where I guess $100 goes a lot farther
# [21:15] <Pike> nemo: if you have a consistent set of people, your localization sucks from the get-go, or is good. it's hard to get from a good and popular one to one with profanity. Mixed-in English strings hurting the UX is a different issue, which we in fact face
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# [21:16] <Pike> nemo: yeah, but real suck shows up technically during our beta process, so they never get released on par with the other releases
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# [21:16] <Pike> I read that thread about code-in, too, or at least skimmed through it
# [21:17] <@ted> bsmedberg: okay, running this session in a debugger
# [21:17] <@ted> bsmedberg: first i'm hitting an assertion
# [21:17] <@bsmedberg> that might be good! ;-)
# [21:17] <@ted> in plugin-container
# [21:17] <@bsmedberg> enh
# [21:17] <Pike> nemo: fx needs 6k strings, plus about 10 bugs with all kinds of shit, nobody does that for fun. you gotta be passionate about firefox. also, we don't pay
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# [21:18] <nemo> ah. fair point. to pull it off for a minor language you'd have to go to a lot of effort for a juvenile prank that would probably be caught in beta anyway.
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# [21:19] <@ted> bsmedberg: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1480020
# [21:19] <@ted> is that assertion
# [21:19] <nemo> unfortunately that doesn't help *us* :)
# [21:19] <@ted> dunno if that tells you anything
# [21:19] <@bsmedberg> CreateWindowEx failed for winless placeholder!
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# [21:20] <@ted> yeah
# [21:20] <@bsmedberg> that's... surprising, but probably not directly related to this bug
# [21:20] <@ted> okay
# [21:20] <@ted> i think i probably just shot myself in the foot by hitting that assertion though
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# [21:22] <@khuey> is there a way to run mochitest in an infinite loop?
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# [21:22] <@bsmedberg> shell scripting...
# [21:22] <@khuey> heh
# [21:23] <jhammel> while true; do....
# [21:23] * @khuey sets --repeat=90000
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# [21:26] <@ted> khuey: i thought bent added that
# [21:26] <@ted> like repeat till failure
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# [21:26] <bent> it's in runtestsvmware.py
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# [21:26] <bent> i think
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# [21:27] <bent> maybe i added it to runtests.py
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# [21:28] <edmorley> bah the backout script gets confused when my editor is already open and doesn't keep the message
# [21:28] * Cwiiis is now known as CwiiisAway
# [21:29] <edmorley> mak: btw, have added a "ok to push?" y/n to my local copy of the backout script, saves the |hg qfin -a && hg push ssh-default|
# [21:30] <mak> edmorley: good idea
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# [21:30] <mak> edmorley: you should set the editor to open a new instance
# [21:30] <mak> in Mercurial.ini
# [21:30] <edmorley> yeah, just looking up the docs for that now
# [21:30] <mak> provided your editor is good enough to support that
# [21:30] <edmorley> notepad++
# [21:30] <jhammel> so not vi or emacs then :)
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# [21:30] <mak> it can do
# [21:30] <mak> pspad cannot, iirc
# [21:31] <mak> btw, atm I use Scite with a custom theme, and works like a charm
# [21:31] * mattwoodrow|away is now known as mattwoodrow
# [21:32] * jhammel wonders if there will be an editor he can stand in his lifetime
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# [21:33] <mak> well, I have the same problem on Mac, can't find one free and satisfying
# [21:33] <@ted> emacs
# [21:33] <mak> using textWrangler but it's not that usable for my taste
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# [21:34] <mconnor> mak: I'm a fan of textedit.
# [21:34] <mconnor> er
# [21:34] <mconnor> textmate
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# [21:34] <mconnor> not free, but works very well
# [21:35] * mconnor will pay for tools if they're worth it
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# [21:35] <mak> mconnor: ah ok, textedit was a bit too much simple >D
# [21:35] <mak> I also heard of sublimeText
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# [21:36] <mak> though looks like if I have a choice I like to use FOSS
# [21:36] <@ted> bsmedberg: okay
# [21:36] <@ted> http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1480041
# [21:36] <@ted> is what i get in this debug build
# [21:37] <@ted> which is that other crash
# [21:37] <@ted> naturally
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# [21:38] <Bas> bbondy: So I'd simply store the VENDOR ID and DEVICE ID of the graphics card (can be retrieved through gfxInfo), if anything changes, try again, false positives don't matter, false negatives are a little worse..
# [21:39] <bbondy> Bas: ok cool thx
# [21:39] <@ted> bsmedberg: so, i'm crashing here: http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/dom/plugins/base/nsPluginHost.cpp#982
# [21:39] <@ted> aURL looks valid, but its vtable is dead memory
# [21:39] <@ted> firebot: 0xdddddddd
# [21:39] <firebot> ted: 0xDDDDDDDD is MSVC's dead memory marker (memory that has been freed)
# [21:39] <@ted> yup
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# [21:40] <@bsmedberg> hrm
# [21:40] <Bas> ted: fwiw, dddddddd is -during- a free.
# [21:40] <Bas> After a free it becomes FEEEFEEE
# [21:40] <Bas> So sounds like a race.
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# [21:40] <@ted> interesting
# [21:40] <@bsmedberg> uh
# [21:40] <@ted> that doesn't make much sense, we don't free XPCOM objects off the main thread
# [21:40] <@ted> do we?
# [21:41] <Bas> Or a child calling a function in the vtable of a parent?
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# [21:41] <Bas> (I'm just guessing, didn't even look at the function)
# [21:41] <@bsmedberg> ted: is there more stack?
# [21:41] <@ted> nope
# [21:41] <@ted> that's all MSVC has
# [21:41] <@bsmedberg> crap
# [21:41] <@ted> i can DumpJSStack
# [21:41] <@ted> if that'd help
# [21:42] <Bas> ted: For reference: http://www.nobugs.org/developer/win32/debug_crt_heap.html#table
# [21:42] <@ted> i think the JIT made the debugger unhappy
# [21:42] <@ted> Bas: thanks
# [21:42] <@bsmedberg> damn, I thought all the JITcode has frame pointers
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# [21:43] <@ted> i did too
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# [21:43] <@ted> but it doesn't seem to get me out of this
# [21:43] <@bsmedberg> ted: the nsObjectLoadingContent in frame 2-3
# [21:43] <@bsmedberg> ted: does it still have reasonable data?
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# [21:44] <@ted> http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1480055
# [21:44] <Bas> bsmedberg ted: fwiw, I've seen JIT code mess up stack traces in the past in local builds.
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# [21:45] * @ted wonders how much heap this process is using and if he could just send a full dump to bsmedberg
# [21:46] <@ted> ~387MB
# [21:46] <@bsmedberg> ted: I'd need the build+symbols too
# [21:46] <@ted> true
# [21:46] <@ted> what's a few more tens of megs between friends
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# [21:46] <@bsmedberg> ted: don't bother, I think I can probably get this locally with some random browsing
# [21:46] <@smaug> did something in nsIPrivateBrowsingService change recently ?
# [21:46] <@ted> okay
# [21:46] <@bsmedberg> ted: are you using the default ABP rules?
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# [21:46] <@ted> bsmedberg: i'm using flashblock, not adblock
# [21:46] <@bsmedberg> ok
# [21:46] <@bsmedberg> are you using the default settings?
# [21:47] <@ted> yeah
# [21:47] <@ted> i clicked this huffington post link from facebook and crashed
# [21:47] <Bas> ted: Also, my interpretation of 'during' might be wrong if HeapFree is somehow delayed, not sure.
# [21:47] <@ted> i can't repro just by loading that page separately
# [21:47] <@ted> but restoring this session is instant crash
# [21:47] <@bsmedberg> ted: well, actually...
# [21:47] <@ted> bsmedberg: i'm going to save off a full memory dump regardless
# [21:47] <@bsmedberg> nsObjectLoadingContent.mURI is now 0x21ed1240
# [21:48] <@bsmedberg> but in the stack it was 0x1f68b9c0
# [21:48] <@ted> yeah
# [21:48] <@bsmedberg> so it must have changed after the beginning of InstantiatePluginInstance
# [21:48] <@bsmedberg> interesting!
# [21:48] <@ted> apparently that's an about URI
# [21:49] <@ted> nsNestedAboutURI
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# [21:50] <edmorley> mak: -multiInst added, works well now :-) (once I realised there were editor= lines in my .hgrcs overriding mercurial.ini, doh)
# [21:50] <@ted> about:blank FWIW
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# [21:50] <@ted> with the mBaseURI pointing at some gmail thing
# [21:51] <mak> edmorley: heh. I remember that option now that you reported it
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# [21:51] <mib_4tln93> hi
# [21:51] <mib_4tln93> When will repair bugs https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=678800
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# [21:57] <lurking> mib_4tln93: doesn't look like anytime soon - its not assigned and have been marked UNCONFIRMED -
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# [22:01] <edmorley> jimm: don't know if you've seen https://groups.google.com/d/topic/mozilla.dev.tree-management/_yUe9mobQHA/discussion ?
# [22:02] <Standard8> bsmith: would you be happy if I hg transplanted the patches on bug 712363 to mozilla-aurora?
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# [22:03] <mib_4tln93> lurking: Been marked new, Then turned to UNCONFIRMED https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_activity.cgi?id=678800
# [22:03] <@ted> bsmedberg: i dumped a full dump
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# [22:03] <@ted> i'll upload it with the build+symbols and email you details
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# [22:03] <jimm> edmorley: I'm going to back both out, and run each through try
# [22:03] <@ted> it's my normal browsing session, so uh, don't steal all my passwords
# [22:04] <lurking> mib_4tln93: indeed - I read the bug -
# [22:04] <jhammel> ooh! ETRADE cookie
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# [22:04] <edmorley> jimm: thank you :-)
# [22:04] <bsmith> Standard8: Yes, that is fine. If it isn't done by you today, I will do it this evening
# [22:04] <Standard8> bsmith: ok thanks
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# [22:06] <edmorley> jimm: want me to back out?
# [22:06] <jimm> edmorley: sure, if you have the time
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# [22:09] <@ted> bsmedberg: details in email
# [22:09] * @ted -> doctor
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# [22:11] <mak> uh-oh, bad regression in Ts... jimm
# [22:11] <jimm> it's being backed out
# [22:11] <mak> jimm: ah (un)cool!
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# [22:12] <jimm> I'm guessing it was probably my patch that did it. I'll figure it out using try.
# [22:12] * mak should read some backlog before pinging others
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# [22:18] <edmorley> jimm: done
# [22:18] <BenWa> If you have multiple heads in the default branch which ones does TBPL pick up for testing? Always tip?
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# [22:18] <jimm> edmorley: thanks!
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# [22:20] <Mossop> So is our grand scheme for getting rid of flash to just break it, because playing any flash video completely destroys my current Nightly :(
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# [22:21] <BenWa> Mossop: no, we've landed a big refactoring for plugins so breakage is very hard to avoid
# [22:21] <gavin> Mossop: flashblock?
# [22:21] <ohsix> BenWa: bug #? (interested in what, and i don't follow that close)
# [22:21] <gavin> ohsix: bug 90268
# [22:21] <Mossop> gavin: Nope
# [22:22] <Mossop> Adblock plus I guess
# [22:22] <ohsix> thanks
# [22:22] <tan> Starting Nightly on Linux didn't change, did it? Suddenly when I run cd ~/firefox && ./firefox nothing happens.
# [22:22] <tan> safe mode won't even open
# [22:22] <lurking> Mossop: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=723154
# [22:22] <Mossop> Oh apparently not adblock plus
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# [22:28] <@roc> Mossop: on my machine, playing Flash destroys all browsers (since my latest Windows update)
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# [22:35] <Mossop> roc: Huh, maybe a windows update problem then?
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# [22:35] <tan> hm, nevermind. pkill firefox several times fixed it :P
# [22:36] <Mossop> roc: My last updates were installed nearly two weeks ago so I don't think it's that
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# [22:36] <lurking> Mossop: I've not had any issues like roc mentioned win7 x64 fully up-to-date
# [22:36] <@roc> yeah, it's probably just my Windows 7 install that has rotted
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# [22:38] <lurking> I also using the latest Flash beta 5 I believe it is 11.2.202.197
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# [22:39] <Mossop> Oh there we go, getting it to send crash reports now
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# [22:40] <Mossop> Or rather it says the plugin crashed and that it will send the crash report but it got throttled so I have no way to see it :(
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# [22:41] <NeilAway> bbondy: well, I'm expecting at least one more follow up consistency bug
# [22:41] <Matti> roc:Did you already deleted the flash data in %appdata% ?
# [22:42] <bbondy> NeilAway: ok will do in the followup, will post this week
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# [22:43] <lurking> My Pro-tip for Flash is to use the Adobe Flash un-installer, and install clean previously downloaded version of Flash - Using their updater to update over as always been iffy IMO.
# [22:44] <@roc> Mattno
# [22:45] * NeilAway wonders whether jlebar(?) filed a bug on hg push -f making the changeset immutable in latest hg
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# [22:45] <jlebar|mac> NeilAway: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=725362 ?
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# [22:46] <jlebar|mac> NeilAway: pain in the ass. But you know, apparently nobody at Mozilla runs hg pre-releases. Like we tell other people to do with Firefox. :)
# [22:47] <NeilAway> jlebar|mac: heh
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# [22:49] <Mossop> Excellent, looks like a gfx driver problem https://crash-stats.mozilla.com/report/index/bp-4ba6fd68-3ef8-4916-ac49-2a2d92120208
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# [22:55] <lurking> Mossop: dual video cards ?
# [22:55] <Mossop> Yes
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# [22:58] <jlebar|mac> Can someone please give cbrocious@mozilla.com editbugs privilege?
# [22:58] <jlebar|mac> Oh, jdm has got it. ^
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# [22:59] <ohsix> did that guy learn how to ride a bike yet
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# [23:07] <@smaug> ttaubert: ping
# [23:07] <ttaubert> smaug: hey
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# [23:08] <@smaug> ttaubert: do you happen to know what could create canvas elements in hiddenwindow document
# [23:08] <ttaubert> smaug: the thumbnail service
# [23:08] <ttaubert> ehy?
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# [23:08] <ttaubert> why?
# [23:09] <@smaug> ttaubert: they just show up in cycle collection log
# [23:09] <@smaug> and are something reasonable new
# [23:09] <ttaubert> ah ok
# [23:09] <ttaubert> yes, they are :)
# [23:09] <@smaug> ttaubert: so, what is keeping them alive?
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# [23:10] <@smaug> the service has a pointer to them?
# [23:10] <ttaubert> smaug: nothing should keep them alive. they're created and use for ctx.drawWindow(). then we read them
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# [23:10] <ttaubert> after that they should be cycle collected
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# [23:11] <@smaug> ttaubert: the log I'm looking at has plenty of canvas elements with refcnt=1
# [23:11] <ttaubert> mh
# [23:11] <@smaug> and that one reference is unknown
# [23:11] <ttaubert> http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/browser/components/thumbnails/PageThumbs.jsm#191
# [23:11] <ttaubert> this is where they're created
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# [23:13] <@smaug> ttaubert: who calls capture() ?
# [23:13] <ttaubert> smaug: http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/browser/base/content/browser-thumbnails.js#79
# [23:13] <edmorley> !szeen bbondy
# [23:14] <edmorley> !seen bbondy
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# [23:14] <firebot> bbondy was last seen 32 minutes and 4 seconds ago, saying 'NeilAway: ok will do in the followup, will post this week' in #developers.
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# [23:14] <ttaubert> smaug: btw, there is a new patch soon to be landed that does not pass the canvas around anymore
# [23:14] <ttaubert> but the canvas shouldn't be held alive for a long time (I think)
# [23:14] <ttaubert> we don't event append it to the DOM
# [23:15] <ttaubert> s/event/even/
# [23:15] <@smaug> ttaubert: I need to recreate the CC log to see whether those canvas elements were there only temporarily
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# [23:16] <@smaug> ttaubert: ok, this other log doesn't have them
# [23:17] <ttaubert> yippieh
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# [23:19] <WeirdAl> jimm: you were right, FF8 has the hang :(
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# [23:19] <WeirdAl> maybe our code wasn't triggering it then for some reason
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# [23:27] <NeilAway> !seen jwein
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# [23:27] <gavin> NeilAway: jaws|away
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# [23:34] <WeirdAl> whoops, wrong channel
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# [23:40] <MattN> edmorley: can I just fix https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=294260#c55 and comment 56 in that bug?
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# [23:43] <edmorley> MattN: for c#55 I'm sorting out a handful of similar changes in bug 725429, so might be easier if I deal with there? for c#56, I can get kutsurak to include it in his bug 702388 followup perhaps
# [23:43] <edmorley> if that makes things easier for you? :-)
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# [23:43] <MattN> ok, if you can handle both that's fine but if I was going to fix one I might as well fix both
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# [23:44] <vingtetun> jwir3: ping, is http://vingtetun.org/tmp/columns.html a know bug?
# [23:44] <jwir3> hi vingtetun
# [23:44] <vingtetun> hey
# [23:45] <edmorley> MattN: neither will break the build, and I've filed bug 725429 anyway since that comment (mainly for things unrelated to your bug), so happy to deal with both :-)
# [23:45] <jwir3> vingetun: Let me see, just a second
# [23:45] <vingtetun> sure thanks
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# [23:45] <MattN> edmorley: ok, I'm adding a comment to my bug so people know it's being followed-up on. Thanks :)
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# [23:46] <edmorley> MattN: cool, sorry for not adding such a comment after the others :-)
# [23:46] <jwir3> vingtetun: Ah, so this has to do with how column frames are treated when there's overflow?
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# [23:46] <MattN> np
# [23:47] <jwir3> vingtetun: IOW, you're asking whether or not it's known that the column boxes extend outside of the frame when there is too much text?
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# [23:47] <vingtetun> jwir3: yeah, i was expecting them to create more columns horizontally
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# [23:48] <vingtetun> since i have set a constraint on the height
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# [23:48] <vingtetun> (i'm using a nightly - i have not tried on a regular firefox)
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# [23:49] <jwir3> vingtetun: Yes, I think this is known: bug 531793
# [23:50] <jwir3> surprising that it hasn't been fixed yet, though...
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# [23:50] <vingtetun> i have seen this bug but the guy mentionned it works with the constraint on the 'height' property, but not with 'max-height'
# [23:50] <vingtetun> "The behaviour is correct if using the "height" property instead."
# [23:51] <jwir3> oh yeah, I missed that
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# [23:54] <Waldo> dholbert: why isn't bug 458167 P1 critical?
# [23:54] * Waldo ducsk
# [23:54] <vingtetun> jwir3: so do you want me to open a bug for it?
# [23:54] <Waldo> er, ducks
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# [23:55] <dholbert> Waldo, I don't know why its not!
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# [23:55] <jwir3> vingtetun: Yeah, that is probably a good idea. If you could cc me on it, too, that would be appreciated! Also maybe mention that it's slightly different than bug 531793 and that it could be a regression.
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# [23:55] <vingtetun> will do
# [23:55] <vingtetun> thanks
# [23:55] <jwir3> vingtetun: Thanks!
# [23:55] <dholbert> Waldo, (it was me wasting some time while waiting for builds to finish back in 2008 :D)
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# [23:57] <Waldo> dholbert: well played
# [23:57] <Waldo> dolske, jhammel: ^
# [23:57] <dholbert> :)
# [23:58] <dholbert> Waldo, its nothing, really
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# [23:59] <vingtetun> jwir3: done, bug 725485
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# [23:59] <jwir3> vingtetun: Thanks a lot!
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# Session Close: Thu Feb 09 00:00:00 2012

The end :)