/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2008-11-11 / end

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  45. # [03:06] <jcranmer> hmm, still asks for password
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  134. # [09:25] <hsivonen> Validator.nu now builds on Windows but running it requires deleting the HTML 4 / XHTML 1.0 -related lines from validator/presets.txt
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  140. # [10:01] <hsivonen> the EOT thread took an interesting turn...
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  150. # [10:47] <zcorpan> silli's both doctypes trigger quirks in O9.6
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  174. # [12:53] <zcorpan> tthorsen: <select>TITLE</select> is what you get in ie
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  177. # [13:06] <tthorsen> really? I hadn't tested IE
  178. # [13:06] <tthorsen> So that's consistent with the html 5 specification, but does it make sense?
  179. # [13:09] <takkaria> I imagine very few sites rely on its behaviour, so it doesn't matter so much what happens to it, I guess
  180. # [13:09] <hsivonen> tthorsen: compat is more important than making sense
  181. # [13:10] <zcorpan> tthorsen: see /topic :)
  182. # [13:11] <tthorsen> of course, but in this case everyone does it differently. Isn't that an opportunity to pick the behaviour that makes the most sense?
  183. # [13:11] <takkaria> tthorsen: fwiw, your latest problem with the parsing algorithm is fallout from splitting CDATA/RCDATA processing into its own insertion mode
  184. # [13:12] <hsivonen> tthorsen: of the behaviors available, I prefer just doing the IE thing here
  185. # [13:12] <hsivonen> tthorsen: with my validator developer hat on, I want to avoid non-streamable recovery where possible given compat
  186. # [13:13] <zcorpan> hsivonen: ignoring the characters is certainly streamable
  187. # [13:13] <hsivonen> zcorpan: right. but I don't want to move stuff to head any more than absolutely necessary
  188. # [13:14] <zcorpan> hsivonen: ah
  189. # [13:14] <zcorpan> i thought you were talking about select
  190. # [13:14] * hsivonen thought moving to head was one of the options discussed
  191. # [13:14] * Joins: heycam (n=cam@124-168-34-173.dyn.iinet.net.au)
  192. # [13:14] <hsivonen> I guess I'm not properly in sync with what's being discussed
  193. # [13:15] <tthorsen> I only meant to suggest ignoring any cdata in select unless the current node is an option element.
  194. # [13:16] * Joins: webben (n=webben@nat/yahoo/x-d38a9e281da71d65)
  195. # [13:16] <zcorpan> which matches opera and mostly matches firefox
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  198. # [13:17] <takkaria> zcorpan: are Opera implementing HTML5 parsing, do you know
  199. # [13:17] <jgraham> I would be happy with that fwiw
  200. # [13:17] <takkaria> +?
  201. # [13:18] <zcorpan> takkaria: not yet, alghough we are aligning our current parser
  202. # [13:18] <zcorpan> although
  203. # [13:18] <zcorpan> hmm.. <select><style> and <select><script>
  204. # [13:19] <zcorpan> or at least the latter
  205. # [13:19] <jgraham> hsivonen: How far have you got in making the validator.nu parser talk to gecko?
  206. # [13:19] <zcorpan> the script is inserted in all top-4 browsers
  207. # [13:21] <hsivonen> jgraham: the parser core translates to C++ and compiles against NSPR/XPCOM types. It doesn't talk to Gecko yet. Right now, I'm working on the entity table generator.
  208. # [13:21] <zcorpan> <style> works in webkit and firefox
  209. # [13:21] <hsivonen> jgraham: So no progress since the start of TPAC
  210. # [13:23] <jgraham> hsivonen: Sounds cool. I didn't know what you'd done before TPAC either
  211. # [13:23] <hsivonen> I made a detour into Jing development
  212. # [13:24] <hsivonen> James Clark made a comeback since a 5-year hiatus, so I figured I should get my changes merged upsteam now that the project is under active development
  213. # [13:24] <malware> hsivonen: cool to hear that you now have commit access to the upstream Jing sources
  214. # [13:25] <hsivonen> malware: yeah. Right now there's a validator-nu branch. the trunk isn't suitable for V.nu yet
  215. # [13:26] <malware> I see. well, regardless, I think this may be the first time in history that James has actually enabled collaborative development on any code he's currently working on
  216. # [13:28] * Quits: webben (n=webben@nat/yahoo/x-b7b38d7c6bf84d84) (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
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  218. # [13:29] * broquain1 is now known as broquaint
  219. # [13:38] <malware> re: messages from Tommy Thorsen indicating he's doing active development on a browser engine -- I assume for Kvaleberg -- makes me wonder how high they are aiming and what the business case is for building the engine in-house instead of just using WebKit
  220. # [13:38] * hsivonen notes that thanks to all the Java eclipse goodness, it's nicer to write in Java and translate to C++ than to write in C++.
  221. # [13:38] <zcorpan> wow, tfoot, th etc break out of <select> in opera
  222. # [13:39] <zcorpan> http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/js/live-dom-viewer/?%3C!DOCTYPE%20html%3E%0D%0A%3Cbody%3E%0D%0A%3Cscript%3E%0D%0Avar%20elms%20%3D%20%22a%20abbr%20acronym%20address%20area%20b%20base%20basefont%20bdo%20bgsound%20big%20blink%20blockquote%20body%20br%20button%20caption%20center%20cite%20code%20col%20colgroup%20comment%20dd%20del%20dfn%20dir%20div%20dl%20dt%20em%20embed%20fieldset%20font%20form%20frame%20head%20hr%20html%20h1%20h2%20h3%20h4%20h5%2
  223. # [13:39] <zcorpan> 0h6%20i%20input%20iframe%20ilayer%20img%20inlineinput%20ins%20kbd%20keygen%20label%20layer%20legend%20li%20link%20listing%20map%20marquee%20menu%20meta%20multicol%20nextid%20nobr%20noembed%20noframes%20nolayer%20noscript%20object%20ol%20optgroup%20option%20p%20param%20plaintext%20pre%20q%20rt%20ruby%20s%20samp%20script%20select%20small%20sound%20spacer%20span%20spell%20strike%20strong%20style%20sub%20sup%20table%20tbody%20td%20textarea%20tfoot%20
  224. # [13:39] <zcorpan> th%20thead%20title%20tr%20tt%20u%20ul%20var%20wbr%20xmp%22.split(%22%20%22)%3B%0D%0Avar%20div%20%3D%20document.createElement('div')%3B%0D%0Avar%20current%3B%0D%0Afor%20(var%20i%20%3D%200%3B%20i%20%3C%20elms.length%3B%20%2B%2Bi)%20%7B%0D%0A%20%20current%20%3D%20div.cloneNode(false)%3B%0D%0A%20%20current.innerHTML%20%3D%20elms%5Bi%5D%20%2B%20'%3Cselect%3E1%3C'%20%2B%20elms%5Bi%5D%20%2B%20'%3E2%3C%2F'%20%2B%20elms%5Bi%5D%20%2B%20'%3E3%3C%2Fselect%3E
  225. # [13:39] <zcorpan> '%3B%0D%0A%20%20document.body.appendChild(current)%3B%0D%0A%7D%0D%0A%3C%2Fscript%3E
  226. # [13:39] <zcorpan> oops
  227. # [13:40] <zcorpan> ie inserts unknown elements
  228. # [13:42] <zcorpan> #text: 12</plaintext>3</select>
  229. # [13:42] <zcorpan> interesting
  230. # [13:43] <zcorpan> <table> breaks out of <select> in ie
  231. # [13:44] <zcorpan> and all other table elements
  232. # [13:47] <zcorpan> <select><plaintext> is certainly funny in webkit and ie
  233. # [13:47] * Joins: webben (n=webben@nat/yahoo/x-371041ff8f96c152)
  234. # [13:49] <Philip`> Lots of people put <script>s and <br>s inside <select>
  235. # [13:49] <tthorsen> the <script> I can understand, but what's the <br> supposed to do?
  236. # [13:50] <zcorpan> <br> doesn't do anything
  237. # [13:50] <Philip`> Don't ask me to make sense of the web :-)
  238. # [13:50] <Philip`> Also lots of comments in there
  239. # [13:51] <zcorpan> not <style>?
  240. # [13:51] <zcorpan> or <td>
  241. # [13:51] <Philip`> and an <a> (on http://www.dahmen-quilt.com/)
  242. # [13:52] <Philip`> zcorpan: None that I see, when grepping some thousands of pages and looking through the output manually
  243. # [13:52] <zcorpan> <table><td><select><td>
  244. # [13:53] <zcorpan> oh the spec has in table in select
  245. # [13:53] <Philip`> http://www.inmobiliariaportilla.com/ has a <select><font>
  246. # [13:53] <Philip`> and http://www.roommatelocator.com/ has a <select></font>
  247. # [13:54] <Philip`> http://www.rentjillshouse.com/ has a <td><select></td>
  248. # [13:54] * Quits: mpt (n=mpt@canonical/launchpad/mpt) (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
  249. # [13:55] <zcorpan> it seems the spec needs to fix <select><script>
  250. # [13:56] * zcorpan files a bug
  251. # [13:56] <krijnh> Yay, more mail :)
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  254. # [14:00] <zcorpan> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=6216
  255. # [14:01] <Philip`> http://www.keysmusic.co.uk - <select><ul>
  256. # [14:02] * Joins: Lachy (n=Lachlan@wsip-24-234-142-17.lv.lv.cox.net)
  257. # [14:03] <zcorpan> <isindex> "works" in select in ie
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  259. # [14:12] <tthorsen> zcorpan: fwiw, my preliminary fix for scripts in selects will be to do exactly what we do in "in body", which is: 'Process the token using the rules for the "in head" insertion mode.'
  260. # [14:13] <zcorpan> sounds reasonable
  261. # [14:13] <tthorsen> works for my simple test, too
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  264. # [14:20] <jgraham> tthorsen: Are you using the html5lib test suite?
  265. # [14:24] <tthorsen> I do test markup with it from time to time, but I'm not using it very much.
  266. # [14:25] <tthorsen> Oh. I read you wrong. I've run our engine through some of the tests in the test suite, but not all
  267. # [14:26] <tthorsen> I don't have anything automated, so it would take me a long time to try them all.
  268. # [14:26] <jgraham> OK, just wondering becuase if you have new tests that yu can release under the MIT license it would be great to add them to the test suite
  269. # [14:28] <zcorpan> hmm anne and i wrote a browser runner for the html5lib tests before
  270. # [14:28] <tthorsen> ah, no I'm afraid most of our testing consists of proprietarily licensed tests and testing real-world web sites
  271. # [14:28] <zcorpan> dunno where it is
  272. # [14:31] <jgraham> http://html5.org/parsing-tests/testrunner.htm
  273. # [14:32] <takkaria> tthorsen: you should run against the html5lib test suite anyway, it's very useful
  274. # [14:32] <takkaria> picked up dozens and dozens of issues when I was hacking on hubbub (a C html5 parsing library)
  275. # [14:33] <tthorsen> yeah. I did find a bunch of bugs last time I ran a few of them
  276. # [14:34] <takkaria> actually, I have a bunch of character-encoding tests that I should contribute back to html5lib
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  287. # [15:41] <yecril71> The problem of external pages sniffing the content of
  288. # [15:41] <yecril71> intranet files, or just some characteristics of it,
  289. # [15:41] <yecril71> is similar to the problem of Web sites loading
  290. # [15:41] <yecril71> local resources via the file URL scheme,
  291. # [15:42] <yecril71> only that now the URL scheme is not a distinguishing feature.
  292. # [15:42] <yecril71> Should such limitations be ever implemented, the exact behaviour
  293. # [15:43] <yecril71> should depend on the Internet zone of the embedding document,
  294. # [15:43] <yecril71> just as with XMLHTTPRequest.
  295. # [15:44] <yecril71> For example, Internet sites should not be allowed
  296. # [15:44] <yecril71> to get information about intranet content
  297. # [15:44] <yecril71> or load it.
  298. # [15:54] * Joins: inimino (n=chatzill@c-76-25-166-213.hsd1.co.comcast.net)
  299. # [16:01] <takkaria> Internet zoning an IE concept, though, not a concept of the Web per se
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  304. # [16:20] <yecril71> Interet zoning is a concept that is adequate to the situation of the question.
  305. # [16:21] <yecril71> Which is unintentionally leaking internal data, which is not a concept of the Web either.
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  310. # [16:33] <takkaria> well, yes, but it's something best brought to the attention of browser developers and not mentioned in passing on an IRC channel :)
  311. # [16:36] * Quits: myakura (n=myakura@p4200-ipbf2306marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp) ("Leaving...")
  312. # [16:37] <Philip`> The same-origin security restrictions are needed to avoid providing ways around any firewall restrictions, not just for the internet/intranet divide
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  315. # [16:38] * Parts: zcorpan (n=zcorpan@pat.se.opera.com)
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  317. # [16:45] <yecril71> Can you describe a situation when the data leak does not sit in the Intranet?
  318. # [16:47] <yecril71> And the purpose of this channel is to formulate recommendations for all browser developers
  319. # [16:47] <yecril71> where they feel the need to act in the same way.
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  328. # [17:05] <Philip`> yecril71: There are lots of internet sites where access is restricted to certain IPs, e.g. I can access various academic papers if I'm using my university's internet connection, and it would be a data leak if someone else on the internet could access those resources via my browser
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  332. # [17:33] * Lachy is surpised by what they call a continental breakfast over here in the US. There wasn't even any toast!
  333. # [17:37] <MikeSmith> Lachy: "continental" is this case is a euphemism for "miniscule"
  334. # [17:39] <Philip`> Where "minuscule" is a euphemism for "not all-you-can-eat pancakes"?
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  338. # [17:42] <MikeSmith> eating lots of pancakes is a great way for visitors to fit in with America life, by helping them to reach the typical "American size" (euphemism for "fat")
  339. # [17:43] * jmb so failed at that last week
  340. # [17:43] * Quits: tthorsen (n=tommy@home.kvaleberg.no) ("Leaving")
  341. # [17:44] <MikeSmith> follow up your pancake breakfast with a stop by AM/PM to get a 32-ounce Coca-Cola, and in the evening, enjoy a great movie at the cinema while eating popcorn for a container the size of a garbage pail
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  344. # [17:46] <jcranmer> continental = coffee + donuts, in my experience
  345. # [17:46] <jcranmer> often times OJ as well; if you're lucky, you'll find a waffle machine
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  384. # [20:10] <hsivonen> Hixie: the single-page version of the spec links to itself instead of the multipage version
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  387. # [20:14] <takkaria> Leif has high hopes for web developers
  388. # [20:15] <Lachy> there doesn't really seem to be very much interesting sessions for me to attend today at pubcon. It's all about marketing :-(
  389. # [20:15] <Lachy> I might skip some sessions today and go explore Vegas
  390. # [20:16] <blooberry> lachy: a tuesday in November should be a pretty good time to do that. How are the throngs? And the weather?
  391. # [20:17] <Lachy> the weather is good today
  392. # [20:17] <Lachy> what are "throngs"?
  393. # [20:17] <blooberry> I was there last year at the end of november and it was great weather except for a torrential downpour that the Las Vegas drainage system seemed ill-equipped to handle
  394. # [20:17] <blooberry> throngs = the crowds
  395. # [20:17] <Lachy> in what language?
  396. # [20:18] <blooberry> english 8-} http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/throng
  397. # [20:20] <Lachy> ok
  398. # [20:21] <blooberry> what parts of vegas interest you? and are you on the strip? (if so, which end)
  399. # [20:21] <Lachy> I'm at the Las Vegas Convention Center
  400. # [20:21] <Lachy> it's not too far from the strip
  401. # [20:23] <Lachy> I have to go to some of the casinos later. Where exactly is the strip?
  402. # [20:24] <Lachy> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=3150+Paradise+Road,+Las+Vegas,+NV+89101&sll=36.128516,-115.162833&sspn=0.01409,0.021479&ie=UTF8&z=17&g=3150+Paradise+Road,+Las+Vegas,+NV+89101&iwloc=addr
  403. # [20:24] <Lachy> that's the map of the convention centre
  404. # [20:25] <blooberry> Once you get to the strip, there's a shuttle you can take up/down the strip. It is much longer than the maps make them look
  405. # [20:26] <blooberry> that's because all the hotels are soooo damn huge. Takes forever to get from one end of one to another.
  406. # [20:27] <Lachy> I'll probably go there later in the week, if not tonight, and gamble all my life savings away
  407. # [20:27] <Lachy> this session is over. I'm going to pack up and go. CYA
  408. # [20:27] <blooberry> woohoo! 8-}
  409. # [20:27] <blooberry> k.
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  412. # [20:49] * Philip` guesses that "pubcon" is not a con about pubs
  413. # [20:51] <Philip`> blooberry: Is the strip longer than it looks in GTA:SA?
  414. # [20:52] <gsnedders> Touché, Philip`.
  415. # [20:52] <gsnedders> But there again, that's the best I have to go by too.
  416. # [20:52] <Philip`> ?
  417. # [20:52] * hsivonen thought San Andreas was Los Angeles, not Las Vegas
  418. # [20:53] <Philip`> hsivonen: It's Los Angeles, San Francisco and Las Vegas
  419. # [20:53] <gsnedders> hsivonen: LA, SF, and LV
  420. # [20:53] * gsnedders can't type quickly enough yet on this Dvorax keyboard
  421. # [20:53] <gsnedders> *Dvorak
  422. # [20:54] <Philip`> Dvorax sounds like the leader of a quite nasty alien species
  423. # [20:54] <hsivonen> ah
  424. # [20:54] <gsnedders> Philip`: Just using GTA as a reference :)
  425. # [20:55] <hsivonen> hrm. the entity table has lost line breaks since I last tried to scrape it
  426. # [20:55] <gsnedders> That has nothing to do with me.
  427. # [20:58] <hsivonen> scraping HTML with regexps is so brittle... :-(
  428. # [20:59] <Philip`> It's a shame you don't have a better way of parsing HTML
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  435. # [21:17] <hsivonen> http://ejohn.org/blog/css-animations-and-javascript/#comment-322033
  436. # [21:18] <hsivonen> an outside-HTML5 case for using the event loop definition
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  449. # [22:21] <roc> othermaciej: would you mind posting to the list to explain your position on cross-origin <video> loads?
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  462. # [23:02] <othermaciej> roc: what more needs explanation?
  463. # [23:02] <othermaciej> roc: I said I think they should be supported
  464. # [23:02] <othermaciej> roc: I think the reasons why are obvious (you stated some of them)
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  466. # [23:03] <roc> I guess I'm curious about which pros and cons carry weight with you and which don't
  467. # [23:04] <roc> obviously you're not concerned about information leakage from intranets, and I'd like to know why that is
  468. # [23:05] <othermaciej> I think leaking the size of files is not that huge a deal, at least if it is limited only to audio or video files
  469. # [23:07] <roc> ok
  470. # [23:08] <roc> What about duration? In the future, what about cue points? Caption data?
  471. # [23:09] <othermaciej> I think media plugins mean sites are already exposed to leaking that kind of information
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  473. # [23:09] <othermaciej> well maybe not cue points or caption data as text embedded in the media file
  474. # [23:10] <roc> I'm torn over how much to weigh the media plugins argument. It's strong on its face, but on the other hand, being just as secure as plugins is kind of a low bar
  475. # [23:10] <othermaciej> I know, but this also isn't an area of plugin security people complain about
  476. # [23:11] <othermaciej> much as they don't complain that you can get width and height of a cross-site embedded image
  477. # [23:11] <roc> it's possible that's just because no-one's got around to figuring out how bad it is
  478. # [23:11] <roc> like clickjacking
  479. # [23:13] <roc> FWIW, Jonas and I were in favour of same-origin restrictions plus Access Control, but others aren't, and your opinion carries a lot of weight with me so now I'm totally unsure!
  480. # [23:13] <Hixie> i don't understand why people are even giving lip service to this ridiculous idea of inventing a new DRM format for fonts
  481. # [23:13] <roc> But I'd like Hixie to chime in since he filed that W3C bug
  482. # [23:13] * Hixie looks up
  483. # [23:13] <Hixie> wassup?
  484. # [23:14] <roc> the question of same-origin restrictions for media elements
  485. # [23:15] <Hixie> my concern was caption data on intranet videos being made accessible in a future version of the spec, primarily
  486. # [23:15] <roc> ok
  487. # [23:15] <Hixie> (i don't want to have to introduce a "use access control because i want caption data" flag later)
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  492. # [23:21] <roc> why would that flag be needed? Does Access-Control-Allow-Origin not come back unless we asked for it?
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  498. # [23:26] <hsivonen> roc: have you analyzed how bad the safe part of the API would be if the unsafe parts of the API were turned off when loading cross-site without AC?
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  500. # [23:26] <roc> it's not clear what is safe, really.
  501. # [23:27] <roc> is leaking the video size safe? The format? The duration?
  502. # [23:27] <roc> it's possible to imagine scenarios where each of these reveals something the intranet owner doesn't want revealed
  503. # [23:28] <hsivonen> I wonder if it's actually a good idea that MS has an intranet zone setting
  504. # [23:28] <hsivonen> (I've always thought it was a bad idea)
  505. # [23:28] <roc> it's helpful in some ways
  506. # [23:28] <roc> I don't know we'd want to rely on it
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  514. # [23:39] <hsivonen> Hixie: do you count a font-specific compression scheme without root strings as DRM?
  515. # [23:41] <hsivonen> Hixie: <devilsadvocate>Is JPEG DRM when a stock photo licenser allows distribution as JPEG but not as CMYK TIFF?</devilsadvocate>
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  518. # [23:45] <Philip`> HTML5 parses "<code><pre>...</code></pre>..." badly - it puts the second piece of text inside <code>, unlike browsers, which breaks http://blogs.sun.com/bblfish/entry/rest_apis_must_be_hypertext (around the JSON example)
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  520. # [23:46] <Hixie> roc: it would be needed if we allowed cross-site today and then had to disable access to captions when we introduced captions
  521. # [23:47] <Hixie> hsivonen: no, compression schemes (that can be supported by the platform) are fine
  522. # [23:47] <Hixie> hsivonen: no, that's just a license
  523. # [23:48] <Hixie> Philip`: send feedbackj
  524. # [23:48] <Hixie> back
  525. # [23:48] <Hixie> no j
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  527. # [23:48] <roc> Hixie: when you say "a flag", you mean an internal flag defined in the spec that's set for cross-origin videos, or some kind of flag that has to be set by users?
  528. # [23:48] * Quits: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.244.17.160) (Nick collision from services.)
  529. # [23:49] * othermaciej_ is now known as othermaciej
  530. # [23:49] <Hixie> i meant a flag for developers to set to say "ok this video should be loaded with AC so that i can get the captions", but i see that wouldn't be the only way to do it; regardless, i'd not really want a mode in which half the API is disabled because of lack of AC
  531. # [23:50] <Hixie> so "both"
  532. # [23:52] <roc> ok
  533. # [23:52] <roc> can you fight it out with maciej and let me know the result? thanks
  534. # [23:52] <Hixie> hehe
  535. # [23:52] <Hixie> maciej doesn't want restrictions?
  536. # [23:53] <roc> he wants either "cross-origin loads allowed with no restrictions on API" or "cross-origin loads allowed but with a restricted API"
  537. # [23:53] <Hixie> ah
  538. # [23:53] <Hixie> does he have reasons? (/me pokes othermaciej)
  539. # [23:53] <roc> I probed him about that just before in the channel
  540. # [23:53] <othermaciej> I think requiring Access-Control for any cross-origin media embedding is too much a developer hardship compared to plugin-based solutions that handle this fine
  541. # [23:54] <Hixie> fair point
  542. # [23:54] <Hixie> so we'd need anne to introduce a third mode in AC
  543. # [23:54] <Hixie> that returns the content despite it failing an ac check
  544. # [23:55] <Hixie> but with a "disable dangerous apis" option
  545. # [23:55] <Hixie> though frankly i'm a little concerned about exposing intranet videos of any kind
  546. # [23:56] <Hixie> i mean, if someone tricked me into going to their site, and had prior knowledge of where we put videos of our important internal events, they could get information about how long our internal meetings were going for
  547. # [23:56] <Hixie> which is a good indication of whether things are healthy or not at the company
  548. # [23:56] <Hixie> well, dunno about good
  549. # [23:56] <Hixie> but it's an indication anyway
  550. # [23:57] <Hixie> not to mention they could determine things like what bitrate we were using, information that i wouldn't personally be comfortable leaking explicitly, so why would i want to leak it accidentally?
  551. # [23:57] * olliej is now known as fakeolliej
  552. # [23:58] <othermaciej> I also believe the perceived security risks are partially imaginary as no one even complains about the same behavior for plugins; I could see the future API risks but I think exposing some parts of the API only for same-origin or if AC check passes is a better compromise than limiting any video to same-origin/AC
  553. # [23:58] * gavin can't imagine why anyone would be worried about leaking the bitrate of internal videos
  554. # [23:58] <othermaciej> I would perhaps feel differently if AC were already more widely deployed in the infrastructure so it were not seen as much of an authoring hardship relative to plugin-based solutions
  555. # [23:59] <Hixie> i certainly understand and sympathise with your position
  556. # [23:59] <roc> so do I
  557. # Session Close: Wed Nov 12 00:00:00 2008

The end :)