/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2013-04-30 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Tue Apr 30 00:00:00 2013
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
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  4. # [00:04] <Hixie> TabAtkins: is there a CSS equivalent to :-moz-first-node/:-moz-last-node? (matches same as :first-child/:last-child but only if there's no non-whitespace text nodes before/after the node)
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  13. # [00:14] <Hixie> man, describing elements that match :-moz-first-node is a maze of twisty negations
  14. # [00:14] <lecuyer> Hixie: is that meaning that with <div>here's text<span>hi</span></div> that `div span:-moz-first-node` wouldn't match?
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  19. # [00:20] <Hixie> lecuyer: yeah
  20. # [00:21] <Hixie> anyone got a good term to mean "an element or a text node that is not merely inter-element whitespace"?
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  25. # [00:22] <lecuyer> Hixie: "unfortunate" ;)
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  29. # [00:26] <Hixie> I'm going with "purple" until someone has a better term. :-)
  30. # [00:27] <lecuyer> Hixie: are you trying to name a pseudo selector or describe TEXT_NODEs in a spec?
  31. # [00:28] <Hixie> just trying to describe "an element or a text node that is not merely inter-element whitespace" for spec purposes
  32. # [00:29] <astearns> Hixie: didn't you use 'palpable' for something similar?
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  34. # [00:29] <Hixie> that's something else
  35. # [00:30] <Hixie> but yes
  36. # [00:30] <Hixie> unfortunately i went to the thesaurus and none of "palpable"'s synonyms are words i can use
  37. # [00:30] <Hixie> (https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=15993 for context)
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  41. # [00:35] <astearns> Hixie: how about 'substantial'
  42. # [00:35] <Hixie> that could work
  43. # [00:35] <Hixie> noted on the bug
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  45. # [00:36] <TabAtkins> Hixie: There is no equivalent to :moz-first-node/last-node.
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  51. # [00:45] <lecuyer> astearns: how do you feel about arbitrarily nested pseudo-elements?
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  53. # [00:46] <TabAtkins> Hixie: The phrasing we use in CSS for "purple" is "not an anonymous inline containing only collapible whitespace".
  54. # [00:51] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
  55. # [00:52] <Hixie> TabAtkins: hm, good point, white-space:pre should stop this too, huh
  56. # [00:53] <Hixie> though i guess gecko doesn't
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  58. # [00:54] <Hixie> hm, no, gecko _is_ affected
  59. # [00:54] <Hixie> wtf
  60. # [00:56] <MikeSmith> .win 14
  61. # [00:57] <Hixie> TabAtkins: so:
  62. # [00:57] <Hixie> A node is significant if it generates a box that is not an inline box
  63. # [00:57] <Hixie> containing only collapsible whitespace.
  64. # [00:57] <Hixie> ...?
  65. # [00:57] <zewt> let's let win 8 run its course
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  69. # [00:59] <TabAtkins> anonymous inline box
  70. # [01:00] <TabAtkins> ("inline box" also describes inline elements)
  71. # [01:00] <Hixie> is it anonymous if it has an explicit node?
  72. # [01:01] <Hixie> so:
  73. # [01:01] <Hixie> A node is significant if it is an element or if it generates a box that is not
  74. # [01:01] <Hixie> an anonymous inline box containing only collapsible whitespace.
  75. # [01:01] <Hixie> ...?
  76. # [01:01] <TabAtkins> anonymous boxes come from bare text only.
  77. # [01:01] <Hixie> bare text has a node :-)
  78. # [01:01] <Hixie> aren't table rows and such anonymous too?
  79. # [01:02] <Hixie> the ones that are implied?
  80. # [01:02] <TabAtkins> Those aren't anonymous inlines. ^_^
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  83. # [01:02] <Hixie> you said "anonymous boxes"! :-P
  84. # [01:02] <TabAtkins> Bah.
  85. # [01:02] <Hixie> anyway the dfn above is right, right?
  86. # [01:03] <TabAtkins> If you can use HTML node concepts, just say "element node, or text node that doesn't just contain collapsible whitespace".
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  88. # [01:05] <Hixie> that's what i had, but as you made me realise, it's wrong
  89. # [01:05] <Hixie> because what matters is whether the white-space actually gets collapsed or not
  90. # [01:05] <Hixie> that is, white-space:pre matters
  91. # [01:07] <TabAtkins> Yeah, wrong word. I have the right wording in antoher spec. One sec.
  92. # [01:08] <TabAtkins> http://dev.w3.org/csswg/selectors/#the-blank-pseudo "characters affected by whitespace processing".
  93. # [01:08] <TabAtkins> Oh wait, you *want* white-space pre to matter?
  94. # [01:09] <Hixie> apparently
  95. # [01:09] <TabAtkins> In that case, "collapsed whitespace".
  96. # [01:09] <Hixie> (i mean, what i actually want is neither here nor there on this issue)
  97. # [01:09] <TabAtkins> "doesn't contain only collapsed whitespace"
  98. # [01:10] <Hixie> as in:
  99. # [01:10] <Hixie> A node is significant if it is an element or if it is a Text node that does not
  100. # [01:10] <Hixie> contain only collapsed whitespace.
  101. # [01:10] <Hixie> ..?
  102. # [01:11] <TabAtkins> Now it's easier to phrase it in positive terms: "or if it is a Text node that contains anything other than collapsed whitespace".
  103. # [01:12] <Hixie> is "collapsed whitespace" actually defined anywhere? http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-text/#white-space-rules vaguely defines "collapsible", but it seems what i actually want is to invoke hte word "removed" from that algorithm
  104. # [01:13] <Hixie> "A node is significant if it is an element or if it is a Text node that contains preserved white space or text that is not collapsible" ?
  105. # [01:13] * jonlee is now known as jonlee|afk
  106. # [01:13] <Hixie> "A node is significant if it is an element or if it is a Text node that contains preserved white space or characters that are not collapsible white space" ?
  107. # [01:13] <Hixie> with [CSS] at the end :-)
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  109. # [01:14] <Hixie> (Note that this means :-moz-empty and :blank aren't the same after all)
  110. # [01:14] <Hixie> (unless i'm mistaken)
  111. # [01:15] <TabAtkins> i like the last one, though it's verbose. It feels pretty precise.
  112. # [01:15] <TabAtkins> You mean :-moz-only-whitespace?
  113. # [01:15] <Hixie> yeah
  114. # [01:16] <Hixie> i'm wrong though
  115. # [01:16] <TabAtkins> Yes, that is a different condition than Moz's - the selector *cannot* depend on whether white-space:pre is set.
  116. # [01:16] <TabAtkins> It can only rely on whether characters in the content are "normally" collapsible.
  117. # [01:16] <Hixie> the selector doesn't seem to depend on white-space, now i'm just confused
  118. # [01:18] <Hixie> oh duh
  119. # [01:18] <Hixie> i am dumbo
  120. # [01:18] <TabAtkins> Heh.
  121. # [01:18] <Hixie> had a newline, made it look like it was margin plus the line with whitespace
  122. # [01:19] <zewt> wow, new gmail is even worse than i thought
  123. # [01:19] <zewt> i try to scroll down past a compose box, and it scrolls the whole compose instead of letting me leave the compose box scrolled where it is and scroll the whole box
  124. # [01:19] <zewt> gripegripe
  125. # [01:20] <Hixie> WebKit/Blink are affected by white-space, but Gecko isn't
  126. # [01:20] <Hixie> interestingly IE isn't either; I really think my hypothesis above is correct
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  128. # [01:21] <astearns> lecuyer: I have started to become convinced that pseudo-element use cases are better served by HTML templates
  129. # [01:21] <Hixie> TabAtkins: amusingly i tried to give you credit for the big breakthrough i had an now it just looks in the bug like you were wrong, sorry about that :-)
  130. # [01:21] <astearns> lecuyer: CSS doesn't do structure, HTML does. Why invent CSS structure when you can re-use HTML?
  131. # [01:22] <TabAtkins> zewt: I find the new compose *really* useful. It's an interesting behavioral mix of "as tall as all the contents" and "no taller than the screen", which works really well for me most of the time.
  132. # [01:22] <TabAtkins> zewt: In the case you're complaining about, I pop the message out instead, because that's typically what I really want to do anyway.
  133. # [01:23] <zewt> i edit replies nonlinearly, and i often want to skim down to a reply (past the point where the compose box landed) then go back to what I was writing, but now I can't leave the compose box where it is
  134. # [01:23] <zewt> i guess, or i can leave the cursor in place and hit an arrow key to scroll to it
  135. # [01:24] <TabAtkins> That works too (and I'm already used to doing that for text editors, when I need to quickly check another section of the spec for the text I'm currently writing).
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  227. # [05:24] <Hixie> nessy1: yt?
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  234. # [05:40] <abarth> Hixie: does the html spec define what happens if you point an iframe at a SWF?
  235. # [05:40] <abarth> Hixie: I couldn't find it in the navigation algorithm
  236. # [05:40] <abarth> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#navigate step 23 seems to be close
  237. # [05:41] <abarth> but doesn't saw what to do if you get a mime type that should be handled by a plugin
  238. # [05:43] <Hixie> yeah, should do...
  239. # [05:44] <Hixie> step 23 "A type that will use an external application to render the content in the browsing context"
  240. # [05:44] <Hixie> "Follow the steps given in the plugin section, and abort these steps"
  241. # [05:44] <Hixie> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#read-plugin
  242. # [05:44] <abarth> ah
  243. # [05:44] <abarth> thanks
  244. # [05:45] <abarth> so, in CSP
  245. # [05:45] <abarth> we want the document created there to inherit the plugin-types directive from the parent browsing context's CSP policy
  246. # [05:46] <Hixie> wouldn't you always want that?
  247. # [05:46] <abarth> I can write that in the CSP spec
  248. # [05:46] <abarth> no, in general
  249. # [05:46] <abarth> CSP is a per-document policy
  250. # [05:46] <abarth> the policy doesn't spam over child iframes
  251. # [05:47] <Hixie> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#implement-the-sandboxing
  252. # [05:47] <Hixie> says it does
  253. # [05:47] <abarth> yeah, sandbox spams over children
  254. # [05:47] <Hixie> oh that's the sandboxing flags
  255. # [05:47] <Hixie> not CSP
  256. # [05:47] <abarth> right
  257. # [05:47] <Hixie> right
  258. # [05:47] <Hixie> ok
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  260. # [05:47] <abarth> the question is whether we should spec this kind of thing in CSP or in HTML
  261. # [05:47] <Hixie> i don't normatively reference CSP at all so far
  262. # [05:47] <abarth> ok, i can spec it in CSP
  263. # [05:47] <Hixie> so, i'm happy to do it, but it's probably best for HTML to provide a hook for you
  264. # [05:48] <abarth> yeah, can you just give these sorts of documents a name?
  265. # [05:48] <Hixie> yeah, one sec
  266. # [05:48] <abarth> e.g., "a plugin document" ?
  267. # [05:48] <abarth> thanks
  268. # [05:49] <Hixie> "plugin document" it is
  269. # [05:50] <Hixie> what is the name of the thing you're using this for? to ensure iframes can't be used to evade... what?
  270. # [05:50] <Hixie> plugin policies?
  271. # [05:50] <Hixie> plugin directives?
  272. # [05:50] <abarth> yeah, plugin-types let you say which plugin times are allowed
  273. # [05:51] <abarth> so, plugin-types application/pdf
  274. # [05:51] <abarth> would mean that you can only have PDF plugins
  275. # [05:51] <abarth> not SWF or silverlight or whatever
  276. # [05:51] <abarth> that works fine, except that you could bypass it with <iframe>
  277. # [05:51] <abarth> since <iframe> creates a new document
  278. # [05:51] <abarth> which wouldn't have the restriction
  279. # [05:51] <abarth> <iframe src="foo.swf">
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  282. # [05:56] <Hixie> abarth: but what is plugin-types called?
  283. # [05:56] <Hixie> a directive?
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  285. # [06:03] <abarth> yes
  286. # [06:03] <Hixie> k
  287. # [06:03] <Hixie> is there a typographic convention for these?
  288. # [06:04] <Hixie> "<code>plugin-types</code> directive"?
  289. # [06:04] <Hixie> (e.g. CSS properties use "the 'foo' property")
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  291. # [06:04] <abarth> Yeah <code>plugin-types</code>
  292. # [06:04] <abarth> the verb is "enforce"
  293. # [06:04] <abarth> so, you'd say something like "enforce the <code>plugin-types
  294. # [06:05] <abarth> </code> directive
  295. # [06:05] <abarth> "
  296. # [06:05] <Hixie> i'm using "evade"
  297. # [06:05] <Hixie> cos it's the negative
  298. # [06:05] <abarth> :)
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  300. # [06:06] <Hixie> ok, spec is building and change should be committed momentarily
  301. # [06:08] <abarth> thanks
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  380. # [10:32] <annevk> fyi, I might have missed some memos
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  385. # [10:40] <annevk> So I could have sworn I filed a bug on Web IDL to move DOM exceptions there. I guess I didn't...
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  387. # [10:41] <heycam> sounds familiar
  388. # [10:41] <heycam> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-script-coord/2013JanMar/0049.html
  389. # [10:42] <heycam> seems reasonable at this point, too, now that SVGException is gone
  390. # [10:43] <Ms2ger> Working on webidl again? :)
  391. # [10:43] <heycam> next week
  392. # [10:44] <heycam> will be at a web dev conference thurs/fri, so preparing my presentation for then atm
  393. # [10:44] <annevk> W3C mailing list search did not find that for my email combined with the keyword "exception" :/
  394. # [10:44] <annevk> heycam: do I need to file a bug or will you handle it?
  395. # [10:44] <heycam> I'll handle it
  396. # [10:44] <heycam> I've kept a track of what things I've addressed on the list
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  413. # [11:34] <annevk> Wow, that W3C survey is the worst. I give up.
  414. # [11:36] <SimonSapin> annevk: the one to win an ipad?
  415. # [11:36] <annevk> Yes
  416. # [11:36] <SimonSapin> It looks so much like spam that I didn’t even try
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  418. # [11:37] <jgraham> ?
  419. # [11:37] <annevk> I didn't see the iPad bit initially. I thought it was about improving the W3C, but it's a load of bullocks. They've really no idea what they're doing I think...
  420. # [11:37] <SimonSapin> https://twitter.com/w3c/status/328946308146688001
  421. # [11:37] <annevk> Bunch of members, some money, some plans on how to get more money, and that's it...
  422. # [11:38] <annevk> Which is not really what you'd expect from an organization behind the standards of the web.
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  425. # [11:40] <jgraham> Yeah, so after all the first questions were about money, and there were about 30 different boxes to tick for senion management job titles and about 10 for the other 99%, I think I am not the target audience for this survey
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  427. # [11:41] <jgraham> (sorry, 39/9)
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  429. # [11:45] <annevk> The job title one was already ridiculous. And field your organization is involved in did not list "web".
  430. # [11:49] <Workshiva> I wonder what the mimimum money made is to finish the survey
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  436. # [12:02] <svl> I got to page 37 on that survey, and then: "Server Error in '/W3CT' Application."
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  439. # [12:04] <jgraham> svl: Oh, so it's modern art. Makes sesne I guess.
  440. # [12:05] <svl> I managed to get further by hitting back, and then the previous button
  441. # [12:05] <svl> so yes, I'd say that's an accurate description. :)
  442. # [12:05] <jgraham> I think karlcow will approve
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  446. # [12:12] <hallvors> annevk: any further thoughts on the XHR pull request?
  447. # [12:13] <annevk> hallvors: I don't get email from GitHub so I didn't know you replied yet :)
  448. # [12:13] <hallvors> GitHub spams way too much ;-)
  449. # [12:14] <annevk> That's probably why I disabled it. I do get some OS notifications now and then, if I happen to be online.
  450. # [12:14] <jgraham> Yeah, it relly does
  451. # [12:14] <jgraham> *really
  452. # [12:15] <annevk> hallvors: so I think the main question is why browsers feel the need to terminate the request in that case.
  453. # [12:15] <annevk> hallvors: because the whole point of checking this in open() is so that the Document can go away. If the document can never go away...
  454. # [12:16] <hallvors> it's probably just simpler to avoid zombie requests associated with no longer existing windows..
  455. # [12:17] <hallvors> you mean - open() needs a document (to resolve URLs and such) but the rest of the algorithm doesn't?
  456. # [12:18] <hallvors> - and that's the point of making open() throw but not interrupt anything else
  457. # [12:19] <hallvors> I think we should go ask a couple of implementors at this point :)
  458. # [12:19] <annevk> Yes and agreed
  459. # [12:20] <hallvors> (though I note that they seem to have collectively voted for "terminate the request" already)
  460. # [12:20] <annevk> smaug____: ^^
  461. # [12:20] <hallvors> -Gecko, Presto and Chromium, that is -
  462. # [12:20] <hallvors> don't have IE 10 and the test framework doesn't really work in IE8
  463. # [12:21] <annevk> I have IE10, do you have a URL?
  464. # [12:22] * ShaneHud1on is now known as ShaneHudson
  465. # [12:22] <smaug____> annevk: not sure I understand the question ..
  466. # [12:22] <smaug____> something about XHR
  467. # [12:22] <wilhelm> hallvors: browserstack.com is your friend.
  468. # [12:23] <annevk> smaug____: window1 does something like new window2.XMLHttpRequest; then does .open(); then at some point window2 is navigated
  469. # [12:24] <annevk> smaug____: given that all the information for the request is known, why is it terminated?
  470. # [12:24] <hallvors> (window2 might also be removed: IFRAME removed, popup closed etc)
  471. # [12:24] <smaug____> I'd expect XHR is terminated
  472. # [12:24] <hallvors> http://w3c-test.org/web-platform-tests/submissions/103/XMLHttpRequest/ look at the tests with -multi-window in name
  473. # [12:24] <annevk> smaug____: correct, but why?
  474. # [12:24] <smaug____> annevk: because all the network connections related to window2 are cancelled
  475. # [12:24] <smaug____> there is a load group
  476. # [12:25] <smaug____> and all the loads (network connections) in that group are terminated
  477. # [12:26] <annevk> hallvors: looks like IE follows the spec, assuming the tests match what you think should happen
  478. # [12:26] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  479. # [12:26] <hallvors> wilhelm: I suppose browserstack.com doesn't let me attach a debugger and step through some random stuff in IE ;-)
  480. # [12:26] <hallvors> annevk: what exactly do the tests say in IE?
  481. # [12:27] <annevk> for 4 I get 'assert_equals: responseText is empty on inactive document error condition expected "" but got "bottom\n"'
  482. # [12:27] <annevk> for 2 I get 'assert_throws: open() when associated document's IFRAME is removed function "function() { client.open("GET", "folder.txt"..." did not throw'
  483. # [12:27] <hallvors> smaug____: is that implementation hard to change if the spec says something else?
  484. # [12:27] <annevk> for 3 I get 'assert_throws: send() when associated document's IFRAME is removed function "function() { client.send(null) }" did not throw'
  485. # [12:27] <smaug____> I don't see reason to change it ;)
  486. # [12:28] <annevk> for 5 I get 'assert_throws: function "function() { client.open("GET", "...") }" threw object "TypeError: Permission denied" that is not a DOMException INVALID_STATE_ERR: property "code" is equal to undefined, expected 11'
  487. # [12:28] <smaug____> but yes, it would be somewhat hard to change
  488. # [12:28] <hallvors> smaug____: me neither but the spec currently dictates something else :)
  489. # [12:28] <hallvors> so you'll have to convince Anne if you don't want to change it ;-)
  490. # [12:28] <smaug____> and it would be odd to change
  491. # [12:29] <annevk> I suspect I reverse engineered IE as I remember at some point bz asking questions about the multi-window stuff and saying there were compatibility issues there.
  492. # [12:29] <smaug____> then the behavior of var img = new window2.Image(); img.src = "foo.gif"; should be changed too
  493. # [12:29] <hallvors> (or vote for accepting https://github.com/whatwg/xhr/pull/3 ;))
  494. # [12:29] <annevk> If those are gone.... Then we can do something else.
  495. # [12:29] <smaug____> and Audio and whatelse
  496. # [12:30] <annevk> smaug____: I think those are different. They use the entry script's document.
  497. # [12:30] <smaug____> so?
  498. # [12:30] <annevk> smaug____: so window2 is not very relevant there.
  499. # [12:31] <smaug____> well, if you just pass such Img object from window2's context
  500. # [12:31] <annevk> smaug____: whereas for XMLHttpRequest it is
  501. # [12:32] <annevk> Might still be some oddities with the prototype chain I suppose... Meh
  502. # [12:33] <wilhelm> hallvors: Yes, it only has the built-in devtools.
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  505. # [12:35] <annevk> Sooo anyway. If we go with that kind of fetch management. We should probably document that in some way centrally. So a global scope can just say that it terminates all ongoing fetch requests and they report to their callers in an appropriate fashion.
  506. # [12:36] <annevk> E.g. I doubt you'd get a network error if some part of the response has already been retrieved. It would probably just terminate earlier, although maybe we should signal that kind of error still if we can trust Content-Length somehow?
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  509. # [12:38] <annevk> Awesome, http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html uses <header> to mean <head>.
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  511. # [12:39] <hallvors> for XHR I think firing an error event makes sense
  512. # [12:39] <annevk> And uses identifiers that start with a digit. That should never have been disallowed.
  513. # [12:40] <annevk> hallvors: that's too simple. What if data is already being processed?
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  516. # [12:46] <hallvors> well, what happens if there is some network error while data is being processed but the request is not completed?
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  518. # [12:49] <annevk> I think you cannot distinguish that from Content-Length being wrong at the moment.
  519. # [12:49] <hallvors> is there no error event?
  520. # [12:50] <annevk> The "network error" bit is really only distinguishing up until all header data has been processed. I think after that you'd just get load.
  521. # [12:51] <annevk> Fetch will define most of that and XMLHttpRequest will simply reference it at that point, hopefully obsoleting most of the text around the subject.
  522. # [12:55] <hallvors> But spec does say under "infrastructure for send()": If there is a network error -> In case of DNS errors, TLS negotiation failure, or other type of network errors, this is a network error.
  523. # [12:57] <annevk> Yeah I'm not sure that's accurate
  524. # [12:57] <annevk> Well, most of it is of course. It's not clear if it's a network error if the server just stops transmitting at some point. Or you close the receiving end.
  525. # [13:00] <hallvors> So if the server just closes down the connection and you haven't received "Content-Length" amount of data, you think the script should not be informed with an error event that something odd happened?
  526. # [13:01] <annevk> I'm saying is not informed, because browsers have to deal with faulty Content-Length. Reporting it in some fashion might still make sense though.
  527. # [13:01] <hallvors> BTW Anne - I wanted to ask you about this: https://github.com/hallvors/web-platform-tests/commit/890a45686adceb8be18c3fa832ab54ad1fd5b7b5
  528. # [13:02] <hallvors> As the spec is written one still gets the readystatechange event with readyState 4, then an error event.
  529. # [13:02] <annevk> Right, I'm saying that I think the specification is wrong there.
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  531. # [13:02] <hallvors> Yes. This is actually a bit awkward.
  532. # [13:03] <hallvors> scripts that see readystatechange and readyState == 4 shouldn't have to wait for a potential error event to be certain that the request finished OK
  533. # [13:03] <annevk> Regarding the test, yeah, credential throwing was removed.
  534. # [13:04] <hallvors> OK, test will be aligned shortly :)
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  536. # [13:04] <hallvors> I guess we could spec a request.errorState property .. or something.
  537. # [13:05] <hallvors> request.errorState = 0 means no problem, 1 means network error..
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  539. # [13:05] <annevk> We already that with .status being 0
  540. # [13:05] <annevk> And non-zero meaning no network error. But there's other classes of errors such as mismatched Content-Length...
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  575. # [14:35] <SteveF> hober: you awake?
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  583. # [14:52] <djc> so I can't create an account on www.w3.org/Bugs, is that something I can complain about here?
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  585. # [14:52] * ImBcmSlp is now known as ImBcmDth
  586. # [14:52] <djc> keeps saying I have an invalid token, even when I say I want to commit anyway
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  590. # [15:00] <annevk> djc: best to ask in #sysreq on the W3C IRC server
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  607. # [15:22] <djc> annevk: thanks, that worked
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  609. # [15:22] <annevk> yw
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  617. # [15:33] <annevk> Grmbl. HTTP authentication fffffffffuuuuuuuu. Man, have to actually hit a key multiple times these days to repeat it.
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  626. # [16:00] <matjas> annevk: which OS?
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  633. # [16:06] <annevk> matjas: OS X
  634. # [16:06] <matjas> annevk: then check this out: https://github.com/mathiasbynens/dotfiles/blob/f21a29cd78d65300e6853338864b5c9507f0e1ca/.osx#L148-L152
  635. # [16:07] <annevk> matjas: haha, madness
  636. # [16:07] <matjas> run those two commands, reboot, and you’ll be able to comfortably type ffffffffuuuuuuu again
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  687. # [17:20] <gsnedders> What kind of security question is "What is your mother's first name?". That's a matter of public record!
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  693. # [17:32] <tantek> gsnedders: http://tantek.com/2013/059/t5/high-school-city-grow-up-security-facebook-fail
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  695. # [17:35] <Ms2ger> gsnedders, what's her maiden name? :)
  696. # [17:36] <gsnedders> Ms2ger: That's also a matter of public record. ;P
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  698. # [17:39] * marcosc notes nerds making mom jokes.
  699. # [17:41] <Ms2ger> Yo momma's maiden name's so fat, it isn't accepted as an answer to the security question?
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  711. # [18:22] <dglazkov> good morning, Whatwg!
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  727. # [18:50] <annevk> Is someone working on making specification annotations work better across specifications?
  728. # [18:50] <annevk> I'd like to annotate some bits in "Fetch" with "needs review and tests" or some such
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  731. # [18:52] <annevk> Also, http://fetch.spec.whatwg.org/#basic-fetch is becoming increasingly more complicated to follow. I guess that needs some restructuring too. Maybe separate out the various URL schemes?
  732. # [18:52] <tantek> annevk - there's a whole Open Annotation community group at W3C that has a big RDF model/schema/vocab for annotations and everything - I'm sure they'd be willing to help you out. ;)
  733. # [18:53] <annevk> tantek: suggestion troll? :p
  734. # [18:53] <tantek> more like a combination of "good morning humor" and "be careful what you ask for" :)
  735. # [18:54] <tantek> though I suppose there's a question of in which direction is the trolling occuring
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  738. # [18:54] * Ms2ger assumes tantek is the troll :)
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  743. # [19:02] <annevk> http://html-differences.whatwg.org/
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  752. # [19:20] <Redface> hi
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  839. # [21:45] <cabanier> Hixie: ping
  840. # [21:46] <annevk> Hixie: with respect to strategy, I'd rather do the minimum possible I suppose
  841. # [21:46] <annevk> Hixie: I hope at some point we can figure out a sane way to define all the event stuff
  842. # [21:46] <annevk> Hixie: event loop stuff*
  843. # [21:52] <cabanier> Hixie: do you remember why measureText requires the font to be local. Why not enforce CORS?
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  909. # Session Close: Wed May 01 00:00:00 2013

The end :)