/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2014-04-26 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Sat Apr 26 00:00:00 2014
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
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  18. # [00:26] <sicking> abarth: ping
  19. # [00:26] <abarth> sicking: hiya
  20. # [00:27] <sicking> abarth: do you guys have any special rules regarding loading data from filesystem:// in sandboxed pages?
  21. # [00:27] <abarth> we've certainly had bugs in that area
  22. # [00:28] <abarth> but I thought we fixed them
  23. # [00:28] <abarth> the problem was that those URLs contain an origin string
  24. # [00:28] <abarth> and sandboxed iframes have origins that can't be represented a strings
  25. # [00:29] <sicking> that's not quite the attack I was thinking of though
  26. # [00:29] <abarth> https://code.google.com/p/chromium/codesearch#chromium/src/third_party/WebKit/Source/platform/weborigin/SecurityOrigin.cpp&l=47
  27. # [00:29] <abarth> i think we solve that problem with the security origin cache
  28. # [00:29] <abarth> which lets us use a memory address to represent a unique origin in some cases
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  31. # [00:46] <sicking> abarth: speaking of origins. Did you see the recent discussion about origins for blob: URLs and data: URLs?
  32. # [00:47] <sicking> abarth: i put forward a proposal to fix the current mess of origins in data: URLs. I believe that different browsers still have different security handling of data:
  33. # [00:47] <sicking> a very handwavy proposal still
  34. # [00:51] <abarth> sicking: oh, what's the proposal
  35. # [00:52] <abarth> ?
  36. # [00:52] <sicking> abarth: basically treat data: as out-of-origin unless the loader explicitly opts in to something else
  37. # [00:52] <sicking> at least in cases where the contents of the data: can run script
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  39. # [00:53] <abarth> ah, something like that could work
  40. # [00:53] <sicking> so for <iframe src="data:..."> it would be considered something similar to a sandboxed origin, unless you do <iframe src="data:..." allowinheritorigin?
  41. # [00:53] <sicking> >
  42. # [00:53] <sicking> we're working towards doing something similar internally in gecko
  43. # [00:54] <abarth> there's a little trickiness there
  44. # [00:54] <abarth> because you haven't linked the allowinheritorigin to the contents of the data URL in a strong way
  45. # [00:54] <sicking> yeah, navigation would get tricky
  46. # [00:55] <abarth> the trouble we have in our implementation is that when we're asked to load a URL in a frame
  47. # [00:55] <sicking> is that what you mean?
  48. # [00:55] <abarth> (yes)
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  50. # [00:55] <abarth> we don't have a fool-proof way to figure out where the load request came from
  51. # [00:56] <sicking> just shoot from the hip, that's what we do :)
  52. # [00:56] <sicking> docshell is awesome
  53. # [00:56] <abarth> that might just be some work for us to boil that ocean and keep careful track of where the load comes from
  54. # [00:56] <abarth> it's harder in WebKit, but I guess that's more Apple's problem now
  55. # [00:56] <sicking> i think the idea would be to default all places to "treat data: as sandbox-origin", and then only whitelist particular code paths
  56. # [00:56] <abarth> in WebKit, the URL of the load can be mutated in arbitrary ways in the middle of the load
  57. # [00:57] <abarth> Blink still has all that machinery, but we can rip it out
  58. # [00:57] <sicking> hmm... interesting
  59. # [00:57] <sicking> we have similar abilities
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  61. # [00:58] <sicking> an addon can redirect and say "don't load that URL, load this one instead"
  62. # [00:58] <abarth> what if they give a data URL?
  63. # [00:58] <abarth> does it get the origin of the site that originally asked to load http://example.com ?
  64. # [00:58] <sicking> it's a bit of a mess what we do now, so i don't know
  65. # [00:58] <sicking> but the idea would be to treat it as sandbox-origin
  66. # [00:59] <abarth> yeah, that makes sense
  67. # [00:59] <abarth> what's the usecase for making it same-origin?
  68. # [00:59] <abarth> i'm curious why srcdoc doesn't work instead
  69. # [01:00] <sicking> for workers i think there are strong use cases
  70. # [01:00] <sicking> i.e. doing new Worker("data:...")
  71. # [01:00] <abarth> oh, that case is much easier than the iframe case
  72. # [01:00] <sicking> in which case you want to consider the URL same-origin
  73. # [01:00] <abarth> because there's no navigation to worry about
  74. # [01:00] <sicking> right
  75. # [01:01] <sicking> for <iframe> i'm not sure. I'm sure people do use <iframe src="data:...">, but i'm not sure if they have strong use cases
  76. # [01:01] <abarth> so, you'd write new Worker("data:...", { dataURLsInheritOrigins: true } ) ?
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  78. # [01:01] <sicking> yeah, something like that
  79. # [01:01] <sicking> *handwave*
  80. # [01:01] <abarth> yeah, that would be easy for us to implement
  81. # [01:02] <abarth> the worker loading path is complicated, but it's just a straight line :)
  82. # [01:03] <sicking> heh
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  85. # [01:03] <sicking> a question is what to do if you write: new Worker("http://...", { dataURLsInheritOrigins: true })
  86. # [01:04] <sicking> and the http server redirects to data:
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  88. # [01:04] <sicking> I'd be inclined to say that it should be treated like sandbox-origin (which means that it'll fail)
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  92. # [01:10] <abarth> I think we block redirects to data URLs entirely
  93. # [01:15] <sicking> ah
  94. # [01:15] <sicking> we don't
  95. # [01:16] <sicking> but we always treat them as sandbox-origin I think
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  148. # [04:04] <Domenic_> Hixie: https://www.dropbox.com/s/pk685ndmevf2jee/Screenshot%202014-04-25%2022.03.08.png
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  150. # [04:09] <zewt> the vertical gradient is a bit unpleasant, but I don't see that when I load it
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  152. # [04:09] <zewt> by the way, vertical tabs ^5
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  154. # [04:10] <Hixie> Domenic_: it's all changed now :-)
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  156. # [04:11] <Hixie> (what was the problem with that screen shot?)
  157. # [04:11] <Domenic_> Ohhh, that's nicer
  158. # [04:11] <Domenic_> the overflowing text and the weird color distribution when not in a 3x3 grid
  159. # [04:11] <Hixie> meh, not sure it's that much better. i'm still not really hapy with it overall.
  160. # [04:12] <Hixie> happy
  161. # [04:12] <Domenic_> it's definitely better.
  162. # [04:12] <Domenic_> It'd be nice if the groups were always on the same line
  163. # [04:12] <Hixie> hmmm
  164. # [04:13] <zewt> if there was some way to have CSS derive colors using a formula taking the X and Y position relative to some position into account, and maybe select colors in an HSV color space, you could have the items select colors in some smart way based on how they're laid out dynamically :P
  165. # [04:13] <zewt> (was: re: no)
  166. # [04:14] <zewt> it's sort of weird how resizing the page in chrome makes chrome freeze up for 1-2 seconds
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  168. # [04:14] <zewt> i'd think it'd just lay out the stuff that's visible, and do some really fast rough estimation for the rest just to guesstimate the scrollbar
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  172. # [04:16] <zewt> oops, i forgot that opening the inspector on the spec is a mistake
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  174. # [04:18] <zewt> fwiw, I have no idea what the "watch for updates" checkbox means
  175. # [04:18] <zewt> (not so much asking for an explanation as pointing out the page seems unobvious)
  176. # [04:18] <Hixie> it does pretty much exactly what it says
  177. # [04:18] <zewt> the text says to me "click here to sign up for emails when something changes", but that doesn't make sense with a checkbox
  178. # [04:19] <Hixie> that's the "Edit Subscriptions" button
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  181. # [04:21] <Hixie> Domenic_: ok, they stick together now
  182. # [04:22] <Domenic_> Hixie: nice, I think that's a definite win.
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  331. # [13:47] <annevk> lol Apple still uses DTDs and stuff http://www.macrumors.com/2014/04/25/touch-id-ipad-biometrickit/
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  344. # [14:20] * GPHemsley wants to work on space travel specs!
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  415. # [20:00] <manu> In space, the only MUST is survival.
  416. # [20:01] <manu> (bad spec jokes, or a great tag line to a standardization movie set in space)
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  446. # [21:32] <smaug____> xhr spec is getting hard to follow :(
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  463. # [22:43] <zcorpan> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=81752 yay productive
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  465. # [22:49] <jgraham> Well maybe if WebKit starts getting left behind they will give up with the stop energy on specwise correctness changes
  466. # [22:50] <jgraham> Alternatively buy some popcorn and enjoy the show
  467. # [22:51] <jgraham> Alternatively spend a few seconds reviewing https://critic.hoppipolla.co.uk/r/1393 instead ;)
  468. # [22:55] <zcorpan> jgraham: SharedWorker should never propagate error to window per spec, but dunno if you need to care about that in this test. i think i checked for it in some other sharedworker tests
  469. # [22:55] <jgraham> zcorpan: Yeah, I guess that's a bug in Gecko
  470. # [22:55] <zcorpan> yep
  471. # [22:56] <jgraham> But having this test be stable in the face of that bug is useful, especially if we check for it elsewhere
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  473. # [22:57] <zcorpan> makes sense
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  476. # [23:06] <jgraham> zcorpan: Thanks
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  492. # [23:35] <Hixie> jgraham: how's the spec's header? still too ugly?
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  495. # [23:46] <IZh> Hixie: What about to make red image [WHATWG] on every page of developers site to be a link to whatwg.org?
  496. # [23:47] <IZh> Hi.
  497. # [23:47] <Hixie> that's benschwarz's
  498. # [23:48] <IZh> benschwarz: Hi.
  499. # [23:50] <IZh> Hixie: and what is yours? ;-)
  500. # [23:52] <Hixie> my what?
  501. # [23:52] <jgraham> Hixie: Well I don't exactly like it, but it's no worse than the rest of the spec now :)
  502. # [23:52] <Hixie> jgraham: ok, same as me then :-)
  503. # [23:52] <Hixie> jgraham: definitely open to better ideas if you have any btw :-)
  504. # [23:53] <IZh> Hixie: responsibility. I'm new here and don't know yet who makes what. :-)
  505. # [23:53] <Hixie> aah
  506. # [23:53] <Hixie> i do the html spec
  507. # [23:53] <Hixie> http://whatwg.org/html
  508. # [23:53] <Hixie> benschwarz: does the conversion to developers.whatwg.org
  509. # [23:53] <Hixie> (much like you do the conversion to pdf)
  510. # [23:54] <Hixie> anne does most of the other specs, like url, xhr, dom
  511. # [23:54] <Hixie> jgraham and zcorpan and others do a lot of testing and spec review
  512. # [23:54] <Hixie> smaug and others do implementation
  513. # [23:55] <IZh> I see. :-) It would be nice to note it somewhere on the site. :-)
  514. # [23:58] <IZh> By the way, offline caching is a coolest idea. Why not all sites in the XXI century use it? :-) It's Very useful for mobile browsing.
  515. # Session Close: Sun Apr 27 00:00:00 2014

The end :)