/irc-logs / w3c / #css / 2012-11-14 / end

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# Session Start: Wed Nov 14 00:00:00 2012
# Session Ident: #css
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# [17:10] <darktears> damn I have internet connection issue, it's slow...
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# [17:23] <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/11/14-css-irc
# [17:23] <glazou> Zakim, thiw ill be Style
# [17:23] <Zakim> I don't understand 'thiw ill be Style', glazou
# [17:23] <glazou> Zakim, this will be Style
# [17:23] <Zakim> ok, glazou; I see Style_CSS FP()12:00PM scheduled to start in 37 minutes
# [17:23] <glazou> RRSAgent, make logs public
# [17:23] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, glazou
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# [17:56] <TabAtkins> I'm in another meeting, but I'll be here in IRC.
# [17:56] <glazou> TabAtkins: noted
# [17:56] <glazou> seems it's going to be low attendance anyway
# [17:56] <glazou> many people sick
# [17:56] <glazou> Zakim, code?
# [17:56] <Zakim> the conference code is 78953 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), glazou
# [17:56] <Zakim> Style_CSS FP()12:00PM has now started
# [17:57] <Zakim> +??P24
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# [17:57] <glazou> Zakim, ??P24 is me
# [17:57] <Zakim> +glazou; got it
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# [17:57] <Zakim> +plinss
# [17:57] <glazou> plinss: cannot hear you
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# [17:58] <Zakim> +??P28
# [17:58] <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
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# [17:58] <jdaggett> zakim, ??p28 is me
# [17:58] <Zakim> +jdaggett; got it
# [17:58] <florian> Zakim, I am [IPcaller]
# [17:58] <Zakim> ok, florian, I now associate you with [IPcaller]
# [17:58] <Zakim> + +33.9.52.34.aaaa
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# [17:58] <SimonSapin> Zakim: I am aaaa
# [17:59] <glazou> Zakim, aaaa is SimonSapin
# [17:59] <Zakim> +SimonSapin; got it
# [17:59] <SimonSapin> Zakim, I am aaaa
# [17:59] <Zakim> sorry, SimonSapin, I do not see a party named 'aaaa'
# [17:59] <glazou> agenda: http://www.w3.org/mid/50A3AB1D.4090002@disruptive-innovations.com
# [17:59] <Zakim> +??P39
# [18:00] <Zakim> + +1.778.785.aabb
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# [18:00] <glazou> Zakim, ??P39 is leaverou
# [18:00] <Zakim> +leaverou; got it
# [18:00] <Zakim> + +1.415.832.aacc
# [18:00] <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
# [18:00] * dbaron aabb is Mozilla-YVR
# [18:00] * dbaron Zakim, aabb is Mozilla-YVR
# [18:00] * Zakim +Mozilla-YVR; got it
# [18:00] <sylvaing_away> Zakim, [Microsoft] has me
# [18:00] <Zakim> +sylvaing_away; got it
# [18:00] <krit> zakim, aacc is me
# [18:00] <Zakim> +krit; got it
# [18:00] <dbaron> Zakim, Mozilla-YVR has dbaron
# [18:00] <Zakim> +dbaron; got it
# [18:00] <Zakim> +[Microsoft.a]
# [18:01] <dbaron> Zakim, who is on the phone?
# [18:01] <Zakim> On the phone I see glazou, plinss, jdaggett, [IPcaller], SimonSapin, leaverou, Mozilla-YVR, [Microsoft], krit, [Microsoft.a]
# [18:01] <Zakim> Mozilla-YVR has dbaron
# [18:01] <Zakim> [Microsoft] has sylvaing_away
# [18:01] <Zakim> + +1.619.846.aadd
# [18:02] <glazou> Zakim, aadd is hober
# [18:02] <Zakim> +hober; got it
# [18:03] <Zakim> +SteveZ
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# [18:03] <Zakim> + +1.604.312.aaee
# [18:03] <rbetts> Zakim, aaee is me.
# [18:03] <Zakim> +rbetts; got it
# [18:04] <Zakim> +??P54
# [18:04] <Zakim> -??P54
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# [18:05] <Zakim> +??P65
# [18:05] <glazou> Zakim, who is on the phone ?
# [18:05] <Zakim> On the phone I see glazou, plinss, jdaggett, [IPcaller], SimonSapin, leaverou, Mozilla-YVR, [Microsoft], krit, [Microsoft.a], hober, SteveZ, rbetts, ??P65
# [18:05] <Zakim> Mozilla-YVR has dbaron
# [18:05] <Zakim> [Microsoft] has sylvaing_away
# [18:06] <Zakim> +Bert
# [18:06] <Zakim> -??P65
# [18:06] <dbaron> has the call been very quiet the last 2 minutes, or have I stopped hearing any sound?
# [18:06] <glazou> I'm talking dbaron
# [18:06] <Bert> Scribe: Bert
# [18:06] * darktears has some problems with his ISP, almost impossible to hear anything, even the "welcome message" :(
# [18:06] <Bert> Topic: Agenda
# [18:07] <Zakim> +Mozilla-YVR.a
# [18:07] <Zakim> +??P70
# [18:07] <dbaron> Zakim, [Mozilla-YVR.a] has dbaron
# [18:07] <Zakim> sorry, dbaron, I do not recognize a party named '[Mozilla-YVR.a]'
# [18:07] <Bert> Dirk: new props in compositing affect Backgrounds and borders
# [18:07] <Zakim> +[IPcaller.a]
# [18:07] <dbaron> Zakim, Mozilla-YVR.a has dbaron
# [18:07] <Zakim> +dbaron; got it
# [18:07] <fantasai> Zakim, IPcaller.a is me
# [18:07] <Zakim> +fantasai; got it
# [18:07] <Bert> ... Can we move them, or should they stay in Compositing?
# [18:07] <Zakim> +Stearns
# [18:07] <Zakim> -??P70
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# [18:08] <Bert> Simon: Me as editor for page?
# [18:08] <dbaron> dbaron: another thread about viewport units and @page rules
# [18:08] <Bert> Topic: ftf
# [18:09] <Bert> glazou: I tried to ping molly.
# [18:09] <Bert> ... No response, so I'm concerned.
# [18:09] <Bert> ... Should we have a backup venue?
# [18:09] <Zakim> -Stearns
# [18:09] <Bert> ... She posted something on wikie, but it was siubject to sponsoring.
# [18:09] <Zakim> +[Microsoft.aa]
# [18:09] <Bert> ... So no firm date and location.
# [18:09] <leaverou> s/wikie/wiki
# [18:09] <Rossen> Zakim, [Microsoft.aa] is me
# [18:09] <Zakim> +Rossen; got it
# [18:10] <Zakim> +Stearns
# [18:10] <Bert> johnd: In bay area, than multiple companies can sponsor.
# [18:10] <Zakim> -Stearns
# [18:10] <Bert> florian: We considered japan ftf in winter earlier, but concern about AC in japan.
# [18:10] <SimonSapin> +1 for keeping japan in june
# [18:10] <Bert> sylvaing: May be difficult for some
# [18:10] * stearns is angry at his phone
# [18:11] <Bert> johnd: Jan/feb would be trickier for me [to sponsor in japan]
# [18:11] * sylvaing_away if it was up to me all meetings would be in tokyo or san diego....
# [18:11] <Bert> ... prefer spring, but maybe cane work on soemthing.
# [18:11] <Zakim> -fantasai
# [18:11] <Bert> glazou: So let's look for spare location Bay Area in Feb.
# [18:11] * fantasai oops
# [18:11] <Zakim> +[IPcaller.a]
# [18:11] <fantasai> Zakim, IPcaller.a is me
# [18:11] <Zakim> +fantasai; got it
# [18:12] <Bert> Topic: lea as co-editor for backgrounds & borders
# [18:12] <Zakim> +??P82
# [18:12] <Bert> fantasai: lea had some interest, filed issues.
# [18:12] <Bert> ... I thought why not have her co-edit with me.
# [18:12] <Zakim> -Mozilla-YVR
# [18:12] <Bert> ... Good way to get a bit momentum, even if slow.
# [18:13] <Bert> ... It remains a low-prio module.
# [18:13] <Bert> ... And I can help Lea along.
# [18:13] <Bert> glazou: You mentioned ytou need ack from Doug?
# [18:13] <Bert> lea: Doug agrees.
# [18:13] <Bert> RESOLVED: Lea co-editor for Backgrounds 4
# [18:14] <darktears> Zakim: +??P82 is me
# [18:14] <Bert> Topic; Simon co-editor for Paged Meda
# [18:14] * sylvaing_away suspects Doug agreed as long as unicorns and werewolves are used in samples
# [18:14] <darktears> Zakim, +??P82 is me
# [18:14] <Zakim> sorry, darktears, I do not recognize a party named '+??P82'
# [18:14] <Bert> Simon: progress is slow. I'm discussion with [...]
# [18:14] <Bert> glazou: Objections?
# [18:14] <Zakim> +Stearns
# [18:14] * Joins: SimonSapin1 (~simon@public.cloak)
# [18:14] <Bert> florian: What was prio for this module? No objection in principle.
# [18:14] * Quits: SimonSapin (~simon@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
# [18:15] * SimonSapin1 is now known as SimonSapin
# [18:15] <Bert> fantasai: High prio for some, but not for browsers.
# [18:15] <darktears> Zakim, ??P82 is me
# [18:15] <Zakim> +darktears; got it
# [18:15] <Bert> ... Important to make progress.
# [18:15] * leaverou sylvaing_away Nah, he's not unreasonable. He only demanded werewolves :P
# [18:15] <Bert> SteveZ: Counter-example: anything with layout seems important.
# [18:16] <Bert> ... It's part of the center of CSS.
# [18:16] <Bert> fantasai: But doens't interact with other modules.
# [18:16] <fantasai> s/modules/layout models/
# [18:16] <Bert> SteveZ: But it should. Why not?
# [18:16] <Bert> florian: In any case we need to make progress on it.
# [18:16] <Bert> glazou: Is css3-page discussed at IDPF?
# [18:17] <Bert> fantasai: Not much, they're using something else.
# [18:17] <Bert> glazou: I guess it's important becaus eof e-books.
# [18:17] <Bert> glazou: Objections to Simon as co-editor?
# [18:17] <Bert> Bert: On the contrary!
# [18:18] <Bert> dbaron: Browsers maybe not workng on it, but may do so in the future.
# [18:18] * Quits: drublic (~drublic@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
# [18:18] <Bert> ... May start to interact later, is a danger.
# [18:18] <Bert> .. We've had that problem in the past.
# [18:18] <Bert> glazou: What does that mean? It should slow down?
# [18:19] <Bert> dbaron: Not necessarily. Don't assume it won't need any changes in the future once browsers start needing it.
# [18:19] * Joins: jet (~jet@public.cloak)
# [18:19] <Bert> glazou: That doesn't seem acceptable.
# [18:19] <Bert> dbaron: There is a difference between listen and comment and implements; and then actually find problems.
# [18:19] <Bert> ... We've had this in the past.
# [18:20] <Bert> florian: You say that going to pR with only implementations other than browsers is prpoblematic?
# [18:21] <glenn> Present+ glenn (IRC only)
# [18:21] <Bert> SteveZ: So dbaron says: if implemented in a product that does't have the whole stack of techs of a browser, it may not be compatible wioth that stack.
# [18:21] <Bert> dbaron: And we have a set of priorities.
# [18:21] <Bert> .. We can't comment on everything.
# [18:21] <Bert> ... There is too much too comment on.
# [18:22] <Bert> glazou: We discussed at ftf. We have 60 docs, too much.
# [18:22] <Bert> ... Chairs are not dictators.
# [18:22] <Bert> ... We cannot say trash everything beyond the first 15.
# [18:22] <Bert> sylvaing: I don't disagree that it is difficult. But we should have that discussion before the poll.
# [18:23] <Bert> SteveZ: One way out is to suggest that we set comment deadlines on things.
# [18:23] * jdaggett oh dear, someone brought up a meta-problem
# [18:23] <Bert> ... Low prio items have deadline further in future.
# [18:23] <glazou> jdaggett: :)
# [18:23] <Bert> ... People like to continue working on things.
# [18:23] <Bert> ... dbaron says there are too many things to comment on. Agree.
# [18:23] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
# [18:23] * sylvaing_away has meta-problems about pseudo-elements
# [18:24] <Bert> ... But you have to keep working. No comments doesn't mean there aren't any.
# [18:24] * fantasai szilles++
# [18:24] <jdaggett> i think the conclusion here is that css3-page needs group discussion
# [18:24] <Bert> glazou: We never move docuemtns to next state without aking the members first.
# [18:24] <jdaggett> i'm not sure more discussion is needed on this right now
# [18:25] <Bert> ... We have all the sensors to avoid implementations by non-browsrs only and to avoid browser pbs in the futre.
# [18:25] * krit seems we left our agenda
# [18:25] <Bert> florian: Even if we don't work on a modules, people may come up with something and that may be worse. Lesser evil to work on it.
# [18:25] <jdaggett> wrap... up... discussion...
# [18:26] * sylvaing_away priorities are not a priority!
# [18:26] <Bert> glazou: Important discussion, but let's do that later, maybe an hour.
# [18:26] * Joins: mollyholzschlag (~mollyholzschlag@public.cloak)
# [18:26] <Bert> .. so back to Simon as co-editor.
# [18:26] <Bert> RESOLVED: Simon is co-editor for css3-page.
# [18:26] <Bert> Topic: font issues
# [18:27] <Bert> johnd: I made a few changes.
# [18:27] <glazou> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Nov/0112.html
# [18:27] <Bert> ... First is 'font-stretch'
# [18:27] <Bert> ... I put the keyowrds in the font shorthand.
# [18:27] <glazou> Zakim, code?
# [18:27] <Zakim> the conference code is 78953 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), glazou
# [18:27] <Bert> ... Parsing font family names makes this tricky.
# [18:28] <Bert> .. Font size thus always has to be there.
# [18:28] <Bert> ... Other keywords don't conflict.
# [18:28] <dbaron> looks good to me
# [18:28] * fantasai too
# [18:28] <Bert> ... Is that Reasonable?
# [18:29] <Bert> simon: I see no ambiguities.
# [18:29] <Bert> glazou: Me neither.
# [18:29] <glazou> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Nov/0114.html
# [18:29] <jdaggett> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Nov/0114.html
# [18:29] <Bert> RESOLVED: Add stretch keywords to font shorthand
# [18:29] * Zakim Bert, you typed too many words without commas; I suspect you forgot to start with 'to ...'
# [18:30] <Bert> johnd: In prev WD I made it so that a font-family name existing on a system gathers all faces in the family.
# [18:30] <Bert> ... then you choose a specific face.
# [18:30] <Bert> ... All these params choose a specifi face.
# [18:30] <Bert> ... Prev WD said look for each character.
# [18:30] <Bert> ... There are some subtle pbs with some faces.
# [18:31] <Zakim> +Molly_Holzschlag
# [18:31] <Bert> ... Some lack support for a char.
# [18:31] <Bert> ... So I changed to match the face first and then check for the char.
# [18:31] * glazou we're going to revisit tucson ftf after fonts sicne molly just joined
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# [18:31] <Bert> ... When you download, you don't know what's in the faces until you download them all.
# [18:31] <Bert> ... So this avoids downloading them all.
# [18:32] <Bert> ... Some font faces have e.g., arabic in normal, but not in italic face.
# [18:32] <Bert> ... Not common, but does occur.
# [18:32] <Bert> ... In that case you should fallback to regular face.
# [18:32] <Bert> ... I'd rather introduce exception like that than to have general rules.
# [18:33] <Bert> Bert: What exceptions?
# [18:33] <Zakim> +SteveZ.a
# [18:33] <Zakim> -SteveZ
# [18:33] <Bert> johnd: E.g., older Arial has arabic only in regular and not in italic.
# [18:33] <Bert> ... Browsers would automatically use the regular and synthesize the italic.
# [18:33] <Bert> ... They're exceptional cases and I'd like the spec to leave wiggle room for that.
# [18:34] <glenn> i guess jdagget means "synthesize oblique (and pretend its italic)"
# [18:34] <Bert> fantasai: Seems fine, but if UA is capable, what is the *better* behavior?
# [18:34] <Bert> ... Allow both behaviors?
# [18:34] <Bert> fantasai: You said practicval considerations.
# [18:34] <glenn> s/jdagget means/jdaggett means/
# [18:35] <Bert> ... Can UAs deal with them in different ways, take the cost?
# [18:35] <Bert> johnd: There are all these itneractions. E.g., witjh downlodable fonts.
# [18:35] <Bert> ... Doing style matching for soem cases and not for others.
# [18:35] <shepazu> http://reference.sitepoint.com/css/propertyref
# [18:35] <Bert> ... You may end up with wildly diofferent style, if that is the font that has the glyph.
# [18:36] <Bert> ... Particularly on Windows.
# [18:36] <Bert> ... Windows has ways to fold different fonts into a family.
# [18:36] <Bert> ... Would rather stay away fom it.
# [18:36] * glazou windows introduces incongruities ? really ?-)
# [18:36] * sylvaing_away yes. we don't call them Maps though
# [18:36] <Bert> ... Previous WD was just something I introduced.
# [18:37] <Bert> ... I dont' think it is better. Solves some cases.
# [18:37] <glazou> sylvaing_away: only surface splittable cover keyboard ?
# [18:37] <Bert> ... Rather leave UAs some wiggle room than have a general rule.
# [18:37] <Bert> sylvaing: What's the impact on [?]
# [18:37] <sylvaing_away> s/[?]/existing content
# [18:37] <Bert> johnd: None.
# [18:37] <glazou> s/[?]/existing wefonts
# [18:38] <Bert> ... When I thought through what the previous rule meant for downlodable fonts I thought: no.
# [18:39] <Bert> RESOLVED: Wrt issue above: use the Editor's draft version.
# [18:39] <jdaggett> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Sep/0507.html
# [18:39] <Bert> Johnd: Next is syntax issue.
# [18:39] <glazou> and http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Oct/0279.html
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# [18:40] <Bert> ... @font-feature-values rule
# [18:40] <Bert> ... For features only in a certain font.
# [18:40] <Bert> ... What you need is min-variable syntax, associate name with a selector value, only for a given font family.
# [18:41] <Bert> s/min-/mini-/
# [18:41] <jdaggett> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Oct/0279.html
# [18:41] <Bert> glazou: I agree with dbaron to prefer to @ sign.
# [18:41] <Bert> johnd: Some concerns with that.
# [18:42] <dbaron> glazou said that he prefers Variation B, but with the @ sign
# [18:42] <Bert> ... With @-signs (variation A in the message) doesn't look like property name.
# [18:42] <Bert> .. I prefer that.
# [18:42] <SimonSapin> we have property-like descriptors in @font-face and @counter-style
# [18:42] <glenn> doesn't like @ syntax
# [18:42] <Bert> ... Because it *doesn't* look like something that already exists.
# [18:42] <oyvind> @keyframes already has "from" and "to"
# [18:43] <oyvind> etc
# [18:43] <Bert> fantasai: Other thing is that the values cascade.
# [18:43] <glenn> doesn't think it necessary to make it look different
# [18:43] <Bert> ... That is not clear in the A syntax.
# [18:43] <Bert> ... In the B syntax tht is clear.
# [18:43] <Bert> johnd: It is not a cascade, just some override.
# [18:44] <Bert> fantasai: In first syntax, in some cases an @rule sobliterates an earlioer rule.
# [18:44] <Bert> ... In 2nd syntax it behaves very much like selectors.
# [18:44] <Bert> ... No specificity, but otherwise the same.
# [18:45] <Bert> glazou: We have font descriptors, they are not properties either.
# [18:45] <Bert> johnd: in @font-face, yes.
# [18:45] <Bert> fantasai: No pref either way.
# [18:45] <glenn> every new sub-syntax requires additional cognitive load for users, negatives of which outweigh reuse of existing syntax
# [18:46] <Bert> dbaron: No strong pref for A or B, but if B, then with @-sign.
# [18:46] <Bert> johnd: So we go with B with @-sign?
# [18:46] <stearns> no strong preference
# [18:46] <glenn> strong pref against @ syntax
# [18:46] <Bert> ... I'd like A, but don't care that strongly.
# [18:46] * fantasai has a stronger preference for B
# [18:46] * leaverou strongly prefers B too
# [18:46] <Bert> glazou: readability, coherence with rest of CSS.
# [18:47] <Bert> ... Seems we have stronger pref for B overall.
# [18:47] * leaverou B is more consistent with the rest of the language
# [18:47] <Bert> RESOLVED: syntax B with an @-sign.
# [18:47] <Bert> Topic: ftf (cont'd)
# [18:47] <Zakim> -fantasai
# [18:47] <glenn> can't we separate adopting 2nd syntax and using @-sign?
# [18:47] <Bert> molly: You can follow progress on the wiki.
# [18:47] <dbaron> http://wiki.csswg.org/planning/tucson-2013
# [18:48] * fantasai trying to reconnect
# [18:48] <Bert> ... We had incredible support from city and from university of Tucson.
# [18:48] <glenn> jdaggett: suggest you make CSSFontFaceRule in ED a 'partial' interface
# [18:48] <Bert> ... We've been offered a couple of locations.
# [18:48] <Bert> ... We have the univ and the city fighting over who hosts us!
# [18:49] <Bert> ... Constraints in Feb on dates.
# [18:49] <SimonSapin> is 1 day later possible?
# [18:49] <Bert> ... Gem show, rodeo, etc.
# [18:49] <Zakim> -SimonSapin
# [18:49] <SimonSapin> because of fosdem
# [18:50] <Bert> ... Challenge is finding the best political way between univ and city.
# [18:50] <Zakim> +SimonSapin
# [18:50] <Bert> ... Biosphere 2 is just outside Tucson.
# [18:50] <Bert> ... We have been offered it as a location, with private tour.
# [18:50] <Bert> ... Including apartments with kitchens.
# [18:51] <Bert> ... Beuatiful out there.
# [18:51] <Bert> ... We could do a hybrid: 1st day at Univ on sight.
# [18:51] <Bert> .. Mayor wants to provide a welcome and a banquet.
# [18:51] <Bert> ... So which to choose. In town, we woul dneed multiple hotels.
# [18:51] <Bert> ... Not very difficult, everything is aroudn the university.
# [18:52] <jdaggett> i think the question is whether a sponsor is needed or not
# [18:52] <Bert> ... Facilities are good
# [18:52] <jdaggett> i.e. a sponsor for the venue
# [18:52] <dbaron> This sounds like we're going to end up spending a bunch of time listening to speeches in exchange for this sponsorship.
# [18:52] <Bert> glazou: Dates: some people asked for a day later.
# [18:52] <Zakim> +[IPcaller.a]
# [18:52] <Bert> ... So start on Tuesday.
# [18:52] <Bert> molly: that would be fine.
# [18:53] * jdaggett i'm not willing to ride a rodeo bull in exchange for sponsorship
# [18:53] <Bert> florian: I can't, anyway.
# [18:53] <jdaggett> what about the money... ?
# [18:53] <Bert> Ted: as a 15-year old, [...]
# [18:54] <Bert> Molly: Tuscon reaaly wants to be a good host for us.
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# [18:54] <Bert> ... Biospehere would be a differen model, but it is the Biospehre.
# [18:54] <Bert> ... Can also do a day in town and take a shuttle the next day.
# [18:54] <dbaron> s/as a 15-year old/speaking not for Apple but for my inner 15-year-old/
# [18:55] <Bert> ... Money: you have to pay for you own travel and hotel nights.
# [18:55] * sylvaing_away any plan that involves jdaggett riding a bull and Ted's inner 15yo cannot go wrong
# [18:55] <Bert> ... But the facilities are donated.
# [18:55] <Bert> ... I also want community involved. I'm looking for banquet sponsor, e.g.
# [18:55] <Bert> ... we have funds coming in, form city, from local groups.
# [18:56] <Bert> ... There has to be a formal photo op, etc.
# [18:56] <Bert> glazou: We can thank the city like we did in Lyon:
# [18:56] <Bert> ... We organize a Meet-up.
# [18:56] <Bert> Molly: excelletn, I nknow where to do that.
# [18:56] * sylvaing_away 90% of my knowledge of Arizona comes from watching Breaking Bad. This is exciting...
# [18:57] <mollyholzschlag> lol
# [18:57] <Bert> glazou: We present our work, my BluGriffon, Mozilla firefox, etc,
# [18:57] <Bert> SteveZ: Biosphere: I need to be back on Friday. If we're too far out of town, catcjhing a flight on Thu may be difficult.
# [18:57] <Bert> Molly: tehre are shuttles. May have to leave an hour earlier.
# [18:58] <dbaron> Biosphere looks like it's a 1 hour drive from the Tucson airport and a 2 hour drive from the Phoenix airport -- Phoenix may be a good option given the connections from it
# [18:58] <Bert> SteveZ: Early leaving is OK, as long as I can do it.
# [18:58] * jdaggett translation: toothpaste ok going through security!!
# [18:58] <Bert> molly: We need somebody to get you there. There is ample time, no stress. Not like CDG airport...
# [18:58] <glazou> eheh
# [18:58] <glazou> jdaggett: ROFL
# [18:59] <Bert> ... Woulkd be helpful if people could put their needs, concerns on wiki.
# [18:59] <Bert> ... Then I can respond.
# [18:59] <glazou> jdaggett: in fact it means toothpaste is still forbidden but weapons are allowed :-)
# [18:59] <Bert> .... Some kind of outreach event, as glazou suggested, would indeed be fabulous.
# [18:59] <jdaggett> naturally...
# [18:59] <sylvaing_away> in AZ the metal detector rings if you're not carrying a gun
# [18:59] <Bert> ... My brother is excited. Other people, too.
# [19:00] <Bert> ... We can also do everything on Univ campus and just go visit the Biosphere.
# [19:00] <jdaggett> +1 for biosphere
# [19:00] <Bert> ... But being there is awesome.
# [19:00] <Bert> glazou: So one day in town and rest in Biospehereis possible?
# [19:00] <Bert> molly: yes.
# [19:01] <Bert> SteveZ: Meet-up might have to be *before* the CSS mneeting then.
# [19:01] <Bert> molly: Another optionis two days at Bio and 3rd day in town.
# [19:02] <Bert> glazou: People from aborad probabaly have to stay overnight anyway.
# [19:02] <Bert> molly: We just need to figure out the days we're in town.
# [19:02] <Bert> glazou: Can you deal with this input so far and report back asap?
# [19:02] <Bert> florian: Maybe a doodle for the dates?
# [19:03] <Bert> glazou: I think molly need firm dates.
# [19:03] <Bert> molly: Please, use the wiki. It's easiest for me. Put your dates there, too.
# [19:03] <Bert> ... any special needs.
# [19:04] <Bert> glazou: So, if possible, try 5-7, if not possible keep 4-6.
# [19:04] <Zakim> -SteveZ.a
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# [19:04] <Zakim> -[Microsoft.a]
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# [19:04] <Zakim> -rbetts
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# [19:04] <glazou> I only hope they're not going to keep us in biosphere2 for months :-D
# [19:05] <Zakim> -darktears
# [19:05] <Zakim> Style_CSS FP()12:00PM has ended
# [19:05] <Zakim> Attendees were glazou, plinss, [IPcaller], jdaggett, +33.9.52.34.aaaa, SimonSapin, +1.778.785.aabb, leaverou, +1.415.832.aacc, sylvaing_away, krit, dbaron, [Microsoft],
# [19:05] <Zakim> ... +1.619.846.aadd, hober, SteveZ, +1.604.312.aaee, rbetts, Bert, Mozilla-YVR, fantasai, Stearns, Rossen, darktears, Molly_Holzschlag
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The end :)