/irc-logs / w3c / #css / 2014-10-24 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Fri Oct 24 00:00:00 2014
  2. # Session Ident: #css
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  24. # [01:47] <fantasai> TabAtkins: ah, right
  25. # [01:47] * fantasai forgot
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  77. # [11:43] <ppk___> TabAtkins: (or anyone else) So here's my transition thing.
  78. # [11:43] <ppk___> An element has no border defined. I transition it from that state to 5px solid. I interpret that has the element initially having border: 0, and it transitions to 5px.
  79. # [11:44] <ppk___> That works in all browsers, BUT if you try to transition it back from 5px to the implied 0, it fails. Again, in all browsers.
  80. # [11:44] <ppk___> Similar: if I transition undefined letter-spacing to 5px or something, it works in all browsers but Firefox, which rejects the transition.
  81. # [11:47] <ppk___> So I'm trying to figure out how browsers handle implied values such as the one above. See http://quirksmode.org/css/transitions/impliedvalues.html for compatibility (not yet officially published, so rough around the edges).
  82. # [11:47] <ppk___> Can anyone help me with that?
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  86. # [12:27] <SimonSapin> ppk___: I don’t know much about transitions, but "undefined" properties should get the initial value, which is defined in spec
  87. # [12:27] <SimonSapin> the initial value of border-width is "medium", not 0. But border-style: none (which is the initial) forced border-width to compute to zero
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  90. # [12:49] <ppk___> Right, that initial value makes sense.
  91. # [12:50] <ppk___> So first it transitions from (computed) 0 to 5px, and then back from 5px to medium?
  92. # [12:50] <ppk___> Hmmm, complicated, but it does explain what's going on.
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  115. # [16:22] <TabAtkins> SimonSapin, ppk___: Well, they don't get the initial value, but rather the element's existing (non-animated) value.
  116. # [16:24] <TabAtkins> ppk___: There's absolutely no reason for it to inconsistent based on direction, which makes me suspect something else is going on. Did you put the 'transition' rule in the "end" state only? (Like, div:hover{transition: border 1s;} ?)
  117. # [16:25] <TabAtkins> Wait, never mind, it's totally doing that. Huh.
  118. # [16:26] <TabAtkins> Ah, I got it.
  119. # [16:27] <TabAtkins> So, border-style isn't actually transitionable.
  120. # [16:27] <TabAtkins> When you go from A=>B, the B state sets border-style to solid, and the transition picks up the width change from 0px to 5px, so you get a transition.
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  123. # [16:28] <TabAtkins> When you go back from B=>A, the A state sets border-style to none, and now, even though the border-width is transitioning from 5px to 0, it's ignored and treated as 0.
  124. # [16:29] <TabAtkins> Border default values really don't work well for transitions.
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  127. # [16:39] <ppk___> Ah, right! Thanks.
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  129. # [16:41] <ppk___> But now for the letter-spacing test on the same page. The initial value seems to be normal. Firefox interprets this as a non-transitionable value, but all the other browsers transition fine. Is this a Firefox bug, or a bug in all other browsers, or a legitimate difference of opinion?
  130. # [16:43] <TabAtkins> Firefox bug, I think. 'normal' should compute to 0, and there's no other weird effects going on, so it should transition.
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  133. # [16:52] <ppk___> That's what I thought. Thanks for confirming.
  134. # [16:53] <TabAtkins> ppk___: Initial value of 'left' isn't 0, it's "auto", which isn't transitionable to a number.
  135. # [16:53] <TabAtkins> Dunno what Safari is apparently doing.
  136. # [16:55] <ppk___> Chrome used to do the same, I think. But it's changed that.
  137. # [16:55] <ppk___> And yes, this seems to be a Safari bug.
  138. # [16:56] <ppk___> text-indent is an IE bug.
  139. # [16:57] <TabAtkins> I just love all the fun transitions/animations/transforms features that Safari implemented and never told anyone about. It's like a treasure hunt1
  140. # [16:57] <TabAtkins> !
  141. # [16:57] <ppk___> I'm kind of shying away from doing transform tests because the combinations can get so horribly complicated.
  142. # [16:58] <ppk___> But once I get transitions done animations should be easy.
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The end :)