/irc-logs / w3c / #css / 2015-09-15 / end

Options:

Previous day, Next day

  1. # Session Start: Tue Sep 15 00:00:00 2015
  2. # Session Ident: #css
  3. # [00:53] * Joins: jdaggett (~jdaggett@public.cloak)
  4. # [01:35] * Joins: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak)
  5. # [01:37] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak)
  6. # [01:38] * Quits: jdaggett (~jdaggett@public.cloak) (jdaggett)
  7. # [01:44] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  8. # [01:46] * Quits: darktears (~darktears@public.cloak) ("Leaving...")
  9. # [01:59] * Joins: jdaggett (~jdaggett@public.cloak)
  10. # [02:09] <fantasai> plinss: Yeah, pushing second heads is definitely not blocked on the hg side
  11. # [02:09] * fantasai just did that twice today :(
  12. # [02:09] * fantasai needs to be more aggressive about rebasing
  13. # [02:35] <fantasai> dauwhe: Verdict on css-inline review?
  14. # [02:35] <fantasai> dauwhe: Anything left to do, or ready to publish?
  15. # [02:36] <fantasai> dauwhe: We gotta give the webmaster some specific instructions on shortnames and spec obsoletion
  16. # [02:36] <fantasai> this round
  17. # [02:37] <Florian> fantasai, dauwhe: I've got some info from Steve Z about how the multiple baseline tables work. Will forward, and you can decide if the spec still makes sense in that light or not. I assume it does, but maybe some tweaks are needed to make it clearer.
  18. # [02:37] <Florian> fantasai: oh wait, you were CCed already.
  19. # [03:01] <fantasai> :)
  20. # [03:02] <fantasai> I think it probably needs to hook into OT better, but that's mostly in the realm of 'dominant-baseline' details.
  21. # [03:02] * fantasai hasn't looked into it in detail
  22. # [03:03] <Florian> I think what it is the spec still makes sense, but maybe we're using pre-established terminology in subtly different ways, leading to confusion for people (like Steve) who're aware of the previous meaning.
  23. # [03:03] <fantasai> hm, looks like Tab and I updated our affiliation listings around the same time. Good times for bibliographers all around.
  24. # [03:04] <fantasai> Florian: Possibly. But what's definitely happening, from what I understand, is we're taking an effect that happens within a font and extrapolating it to also manage alignment across font runs
  25. # [03:04] <fantasai> Florian: So it may not be the terminology is wrong, but the definitions are incomplete
  26. # [03:07] <Florian> right. We're tying <new-behavior> to the dominant baseline, without mentioning that the concept of a dominant baseline pre-exixted and was used for <other-thing>. As far as I can tell, <new-behavior> and <old-thing> are perfectly orthogonal / compatible.
  27. # [03:08] * Quits: adenilson (~anonymous@public.cloak) (adenilson)
  28. # [03:08] <Florian> We may just need to mentin <old-thing> to avoid font-savvy people reacting by saying "that's not what dominant baselines are for".
  29. # [03:08] <Florian> s/mentin/mention/
  30. # [03:09] <fantasai> I don't think they're orthogonal
  31. # [03:09] <fantasai> I think they're doing the same exact thing, except one's scoped to the font and the other is scoped to CSS inline box layout
  32. # [03:09] <Florian> you're right, I miss-spoke. But they are non contradictory
  33. # [03:09] <fantasai> yes
  34. # [03:10] <Florian> (misspoke? mis-spoke? too many sses)
  35. # [03:10] <fantasai> misspoke :)
  36. # [03:11] <fantasai> mis and miss are two different morphemes
  37. # [03:11] <Florian> right. expect "mis" is related to the verb "to miss", which throws me off often enough.
  38. # [03:11] <fantasai> :)
  39. # [03:14] <Florian> Besides, miss-spoke sounds lovely :) But I don't want to create the impression that miss-speaking somehow relates to misspeaking :(
  40. # [03:15] * fantasai thoroughly confused now
  41. # [03:16] <fantasai> TabAtkins: I think bikeshed shouldn't be auto-linking to github for issue-tracking. We don't track issues there currently (though we may want to in the future)
  42. # [03:16] <Florian> miss-speaking => neologism for speaking in a lady-like fashion
  43. # [03:20] <fantasai> github's workflow is really weird when you have to reject a patch for more work (which is reasonably often in a real software project)
  44. # [03:21] <Florian> how is it weird?
  45. # [03:21] <fantasai> Let's say you fix complicated bug X with three layers of patches, A, B, and C.
  46. # [03:22] <fantasai> If I make review comments, then you add another patch D which mixes up the logical changesets, or you have to kill the pull request (and associated comments) and start over. At least that's what I understand.
  47. # [03:23] <fantasai> A system built around something like mercurial queues would work much better for this, because you can go back and revise the changesets in your queue.
  48. # [03:23] <fantasai> and then resubmit them for review.
  49. # [03:23] <fantasai> and if you're versioning the patch queue, you can even diff the patches and go back and forth there.
  50. # [03:23] <Florian> why can't you add patch D at the end of the branch, and push again?
  51. # [03:24] <Florian> the Pull request is automatically updated with the new commit
  52. # [03:24] <fantasai> You can, but then you've lost the organization of the patches
  53. # [03:24] <Florian> you mean it's not really patch D, but it's changing patch A to A'?
  54. # [03:25] <fantasai> Let's say A was removing bad code, B was setting up new APIs, and C was switching to those APIs throughout the code.
  55. # [03:25] <fantasai> Yeah
  56. # [03:25] <fantasai> If you fix errors in B and C with patch D, then when someone tries to understand what you did, it's all garbled up again
  57. # [03:25] <fantasai> after you did such a nice job keeping them neatly reviewable
  58. # [03:25] <Florian> There's always a tension between logical commits vs chronological commits. I tend to rewrite history like there's not tomorrow to get the best logical commits before I share them, but once I do, I switch to chronological
  59. # [03:26] <Florian> s/not/no/
  60. # [03:26] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak)
  61. # [03:26] <fantasai> You me like there's no yesterday :)
  62. # [03:26] <Florian> :)
  63. # [03:26] <Florian> I wonder what happens if you rewrite history on that same branch, and then force-push. Does github show something that makes sense?
  64. # [03:26] <fantasai> queues lets you manage changesets without fully committing them
  65. # [03:27] <fantasai> No idea
  66. # [03:27] <fantasai> I haven't tried
  67. # [03:27] <fantasai> maybe it does something sane. That'd be nice
  68. # [03:28] <Florian> alternatively, you can point to the PR in the bug it's trying to fix, and if the one you send is rejected, you close it, create a new one (with clean logical commits), and point to that one as well from the bug.
  69. # [03:33] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  70. # [04:01] * Joins: estellevw (~estellevw@public.cloak)
  71. # [04:26] <TabAtkins> fantasai: I still plan to add an "editor db" to Bikeshed, so auto-genned specs will get our most up-to-date affiliation.
  72. # [04:27] * fantasai just ran perl -pi -e
  73. # [04:27] <TabAtkins> fantasai: And I agree, probably best to omit the GH issue tracking for now, since there's no issues at all right now.
  74. # [04:27] <TabAtkins> I'll add it to our defaults.
  75. # [04:27] * fantasai thanks :)
  76. # [04:31] <TabAtkins> Hmmm, that's not actually possible right now, without killing the "inline in spec" link too.
  77. # [04:31] <TabAtkins> I'll have to fix this.
  78. # [04:31] <dauwhe> fantasai: starting to review now. Darned day job :(
  79. # [04:35] <TabAtkins> Florian: How to properly amend a PR http://blog.adamspiers.org/2015/03/24/why-and-how-to-correctly-amend-github-pull-requests/
  80. # [04:40] * Joins: dauwhe_ (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  81. # [04:46] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  82. # [04:49] <dauwhe_> fantasai: Not starting to review now. Can't pull from repo; can't even get to drafts.csswg.org :(
  83. # [04:53] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  84. # [04:53] * Quits: dauwhe_ (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  85. # [05:14] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak)
  86. # [05:21] * Quits: estellevw (~estellevw@public.cloak) ("Snuggling with the puppies")
  87. # [05:21] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  88. # [05:49] * Joins: estellevw (~estellevw@public.cloak)
  89. # [06:15] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  90. # [06:16] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  91. # [06:31] * Quits: estellevw (~estellevw@public.cloak) ("Snuggling with the puppies")
  92. # [06:32] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  93. # [06:56] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  94. # [07:03] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak)
  95. # [07:10] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  96. # [07:13] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  97. # [07:36] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  98. # [07:44] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  99. # [08:37] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  100. # [08:43] * Quits: myles (~Adium@public.cloak) ("Leaving.")
  101. # [08:44] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  102. # [08:51] * Quits: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  103. # [08:52] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak)
  104. # [08:56] * Joins: antonp (~Thunderbird@public.cloak)
  105. # [08:59] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  106. # [08:59] * Joins: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak)
  107. # [09:03] * Quits: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  108. # [09:10] * Joins: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak)
  109. # [09:22] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak)
  110. # [10:04] <Florian> Bert: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2015JulSep/0210.html and https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2015JulSep/0213.html
  111. # [10:04] <Florian> What's the next step?
  112. # [10:12] <Florian> TabAtkins, fantasai: TL;DR: github does the right thing with force pushes, so just rewrite history, and (force) push again to the PR branch. Good to know.
  113. # [10:31] * Joins: lajava (~javi@public.cloak)
  114. # [10:40] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  115. # [10:47] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  116. # [11:07] * Quits: jdaggett (~jdaggett@public.cloak) (jdaggett)
  117. # [11:27] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@public.cloak)
  118. # [11:40] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  119. # [11:48] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  120. # [12:16] * Quits: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  121. # [12:41] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  122. # [12:49] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  123. # [13:08] * Quits: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  124. # [13:16] * Joins: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak)
  125. # [13:20] * Joins: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak)
  126. # [13:23] * Quits: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  127. # [13:35] * Joins: jdaggett (~jdaggett@public.cloak)
  128. # [13:42] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  129. # [13:49] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  130. # [14:00] * Joins: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak)
  131. # [14:02] * Joins: plh (plehegar@public.cloak)
  132. # [14:05] * Quits: jdaggett (~jdaggett@public.cloak) (jdaggett)
  133. # [14:05] * Quits: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  134. # [14:08] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  135. # [14:09] * Joins: dauwhe_ (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  136. # [14:09] * Quits: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  137. # [14:24] * Quits: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  138. # [14:31] * Joins: rego (~smuxi@public.cloak)
  139. # [14:46] * Joins: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak)
  140. # [15:03] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@public.cloak)
  141. # [15:35] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@public.cloak) ("Leaving")
  142. # [15:35] * Joins: Ms2ger` (~Ms2ger@public.cloak)
  143. # [16:54] * Joins: adenilson (~anonymous@public.cloak)
  144. # [17:05] * Quits: dauwhe_ (~dauwhe@public.cloak) ("")
  145. # [17:15] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@public.cloak) ("8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.")
  146. # [17:42] * Joins: dauwhe (~dauwhe@public.cloak)
  147. # [18:13] * Quits: Rossen_ (~Rossen@public.cloak) ("Page closed")
  148. # [18:19] * Joins: estellevw (~estellevw@public.cloak)
  149. # [18:29] * Quits: estellevw (~estellevw@public.cloak) ("Snuggling with the puppies")
  150. # [18:31] * Joins: myles (~Adium@public.cloak)
  151. # [18:54] * Joins: antonp1 (~Thunderbird@public.cloak)
  152. # [18:54] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@public.cloak)
  153. # [19:01] * Quits: antonp (~Thunderbird@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  154. # [19:01] * antonp1 is now known as antonp
  155. # [19:02] * Quits: Florian (~Florian@public.cloak) (Client closed connection)
  156. # [19:04] * Quits: Ms2ger` (~Ms2ger@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  157. # [19:13] * Joins: Ms2ger` (~Ms2ger@public.cloak)
  158. # [19:18] * Quits: myles (~Adium@public.cloak) ("Leaving.")
  159. # [19:33] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@public.cloak)
  160. # [19:39] * Quits: Ms2ger` (~Ms2ger@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  161. # [19:49] * Joins: bkardell_ (~uid10373@public.cloak)
  162. # [19:49] <dbaron> TabAtkins, https://github.com/w3ctag/spec-reviews/issues/71 -- TAG can't find the spec
  163. # [19:49] <dbaron> (although we're not sure what review is needed)
  164. # [19:52] <dbaron> found it now
  165. # [19:52] * Joins: darktears (~darktears@public.cloak)
  166. # [19:54] * Joins: myles (~Adium@public.cloak)
  167. # [20:08] * Quits: lajava (~javi@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  168. # [20:58] * Quits: Hamatti (~jumasan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  169. # [21:32] * Joins: glazou (~glazou@public.cloak)
  170. # [21:34] * fantasai waves to glazou
  171. # [21:35] <glazou> hellllo my dear :-d
  172. # [21:42] <fantasai> glazou: you doing okay?
  173. # [21:50] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@public.cloak) (tantek)
  174. # [22:23] * Quits: glazou (~glazou@public.cloak) (glazou)
  175. # [22:51] <fantasai> TabAtkins: Something's broken in bikeshed https://validator.w3.org/nu/?doc=https%3A%2F%2Fdrafts.csswg.org%2Fcss-inline%2F
  176. # [22:51] <fantasai> TabAtkins: It's generating weirdly invalid markup
  177. # [22:52] <fantasai> TabAtkins: nm, found the problem
  178. # [22:54] <TabAtkins> Weirdly invalid input does generate weirdly invalid output, yes.
  179. # [23:05] <fantasai> :)
  180. # [23:05] <fantasai> plinss: Can you do something about drafts.csswg.org/robots.txt ?
  181. # [23:05] <fantasai> plinss: I can't run the link checker on any of our documents, which is a problem
  182. # [23:06] <plinss> fantasai: yeah, but I need to disable the spamot defenses first, will do after the tag f2f
  183. # [23:06] <fantasai> Okay
  184. # [23:07] * fantasai tosses a copy of the impending WD onto her server for link checking
  185. # [23:28] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  186. # [23:50] * Quits: plh (plehegar@public.cloak) ("Leaving")
  187. # [23:59] * Quits: abucur___ (~sid19072@public.cloak) ("Connection closed for inactivity")
  188. # [23:59] * Quits: cabanier (~sid15093@public.cloak) ("Connection closed for inactivity")
  189. # Session Close: Wed Sep 16 00:00:00 2015

Previous day, Next day

Think these logs are useful? Then please donate to show your gratitude (and keep them up, of course). Thanks! — Krijn