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  2. # Session Ident: #css
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  142. # [19:31] <gsnedders> Does anyone actually understand quite how the transitions tests work?
  143. # [19:32] * fantasai has no idea, maybe dbaron knows
  144. # [19:33] <fantasai> TabAtkins: I'm here, ping me when you're set up
  145. # [19:33] <dbaron> gsnedders, which transitions tests?
  146. # [19:33] <dbaron> I don't think I know anything about transitions tests in the csswg-test repo... though I know stuff about the Mozilla ones.
  147. # [19:35] <gsnedders> dbaron: the csswg-test ones
  148. # [19:35] <dbaron> gsnedders, where are they?
  149. # [19:35] <gsnedders> they have so much JS involved I'm not quite sure how they work
  150. # [19:35] <gsnedders> dbaron: https://github.com/w3c/csswg-test/tree/master/css-transitions-1
  151. # [19:36] <gsnedders> they seem to be random in Servo. No idea if that's the tests or Servo.
  152. # [19:45] <gsnedders> running them in a background tab in Firefox gets really random results, but foreground tab is totally reproducible.
  153. # [19:45] <gsnedders> I wonder if that's just timer resolution.
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  157. # [20:10] * gsnedders leans towards blaming Servo
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  159. # [20:17] <fantasai> file:///home/fantasai/w3c/csswg/css-break/issues-lc-2015.html#issue-17
  160. # [20:18] <fantasai> http://drafts.csswg.org/css-break/issues-lc-2015#issue-17
  161. # [20:30] <SimonSapin> gsnedders: fairly safe assumption
  162. # [20:31] <gsnedders> SimonSapin: there's just sufficiently much craziness going on there I'm not sure it isn't super timer sensitive and possibly wrong
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  165. # [21:02] <dbaron> gsnedders, I seem to recall pcwalton telling me that Servo does a somewhat crazy thing with transitions that's probably not allowed by the spec... but I've forgotten what it is at this point
  166. # [21:03] <dbaron> (maybe it was ticking them in the middle of other things?)
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  170. # [21:07] <fantasai> https://drafts.csswg.org/css-flexbox/issues-lc-20150514
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  174. # [21:45] <SimonSapin> I think the crazy thing dbaron was talking about is not having synchronization between animations and the values observed through getComputedStyle
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  188. # [23:16] <fantasai> http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/js/live-dom-viewer/?%3C!DOCTYPE%20html%3E%0A%3Cstyle%3E%0A%20div%20{%20display%3A%20flex%3B%20height%3A%20100px%3B%20width%3A%20100px%3B%20border%3A%20solid%3B%20align-items%3A%20center%3B%20}%0A%20p%20{%20position%3A%20absolute%3B%20background%3A%20orange%3B%20margin%3A%200%3B%20}%0A%3C%2Fstyle%3E%0A%3Cdiv%3E%0A%20%20%3Cp%3EA%0A%3C%2Fdiv%3E
  189. # [23:16] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@public.cloak) (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
  190. # [23:28] <fantasai> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/forum/#!topic/blink-dev/MMdPt_5omT4
  191. # [23:28] <fantasai> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=874718
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  193. # [23:39] <fantasai> So there are two cases:
  194. # [23:39] <fantasai> a) Using static pos. In this case flex container decides item's position based on alignment values.
  195. # [23:40] <fantasai> b) Not using static pos. In this case, right now nothing happens, but in the future abspos rules decide items position based on alignment values.
  196. # [23:40] <fantasai> When the switchover happens in b), we need to make sure absposes inside flex containers aren't affected.
  197. # [23:40] <fantasai> Because that will break a lot of pages.
  198. # [23:41] <fantasai> The alignment is done per align-self/justify-self.
  199. # [23:41] <fantasai> We need to not track the parent's align-items/justif-items value on the abspos, because if we do, then stuff inside flex containers will suddenly change behavior
  200. # [23:41] <fantasai> since align/justify-items values intended to affect the in-flow items
  201. # [23:42] <fantasai> will now affect abspos through the abspos's align/justify-self value
  202. # [23:42] <fantasai> By breaking the value passing from parent to abspos child, we leave align/justify-self at its initial value
  203. # [23:42] <fantasai> and so those pages won't break so much
  204. # [23:42] <fantasai> Now in case a), currently align-items/justify-items has some kind of effect on the abspos static position in some browsers.
  205. # [23:43] <fantasai> It's inconsistent. It's possible this breaks some pages to make it not have an effect.
  206. # [23:43] <fantasai> But because of case b), we need to make sure it has no effect.
  207. # [23:44] <fantasai> So I think we need to change Flexbox to match Align: to have align-self and justify-self on abspos elements *not* take their parent's aling/justify-items value.
  208. # [23:44] <fantasai> cbiesinger: ^
  209. # [23:44] <fantasai> https://drafts.csswg.org/css-flexbox/issues-lc-20150514#issue-5
  210. # [23:44] <fantasai> This is Flexbox Issue 5
  211. # [23:48] <fantasai> https://drafts.csswg.org/css-flexbox/issues-lc-20150514#issue-12
  212. # [23:48] * cbiesinger looks
  213. # [23:49] <TabAtkins> cbiesinger: All it means is copying over the text from Align that says "justify/align-self:auto" stays as it is on abspos elements, and acts like either start (on replaced) or stretch (non-replaced).
  214. # [23:50] <cbiesinger> *sigh* you guys need to stop changing the spec all the time
  215. # [23:50] <TabAtkins> Which means that the static positioning of abspos elements will not respect justify/align-items on the flexbox by default.
  216. # [23:50] <TabAtkins> Dude, we're trying to.
  217. # [23:50] <cbiesinger> I don't understand why you want to make that change?
  218. # [23:50] <TabAtkins> But as we're trying to get all the layout systems to work together we either have to have lots of tiny inconsistencies, or smooth out small errors we didn't know about.
  219. # [23:51] <TabAtkins> Reasoning outlined above.
  220. # [23:51] <fantasai> cbiesinger: we're accepting your proposal in https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Jul/0357.html
  221. # [23:51] <fantasai> is basically what we're doing.
  222. # [23:51] <fantasai> We were confused and didn't see the error, and then you were like 'uhh, you're not making sense'
  223. # [23:51] <TabAtkins> And yeah, lol, this is precisely what you asked for. ^_^
  224. # [23:51] <fantasai> and indeed we weren't, so now we're agreeing with you
  225. # [23:51] <cbiesinger> hah
  226. # [23:52] <cbiesinger> well, I was only talking about computed style, not about behavior :p
  227. # [23:52] <cbiesinger> well that's not right
  228. # [23:52] <cbiesinger> anyway
  229. # [23:52] <TabAtkins> Wait, so you want it to stay as "auto", but then still *act like* the flexbox's align-items value, at least for the purpose of computing static pos?
  230. # [23:53] <cbiesinger> no, I'm confused
  231. # [23:53] <cbiesinger> I'm not sure what I want :p
  232. # [23:53] <fantasai> lol
  233. # [23:53] <TabAtkins> (It's required to ignore the parent's align-items for normal (non-static) positioning, because that's today's behavior - absposes are put in the start/start corner, and possible stretched.)
  234. # [23:53] <cbiesinger> haven't firefox and edge implemented inheriting of the value & positioning accordingly?
  235. # [23:53] <cbiesinger> (for static pos)
  236. # [23:54] <TabAtkins> No.
  237. # [23:54] <cbiesinger> huh
  238. # [23:54] <TabAtkins> At least, Firefox hasn't done things in any consistent manner.
  239. # [23:54] <TabAtkins> As far as we can tell.
  240. # [23:54] <fantasai> I think https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=874718 is still open
  241. # [23:54] <cbiesinger> lol. what did they do?
  242. # [23:54] <cbiesinger> ah I see
  243. # [23:55] <cbiesinger> Blink is not as far behind as I thought! \o/
  244. # [23:55] * fantasai :)
  245. # [23:55] <cbiesinger> so your reasoning makes sense, though you'd still change a justify-self: right; item that's not statically positioned
  246. # [23:57] <cbiesinger> this *does* mean that an abspos child of a flexbox no longer behaves like "a single flex item in a container"
  247. # [23:57] <TabAtkins> Yes.
  248. # [23:57] <TabAtkins> It solely pays attention to a non-auto justify/align-self.
  249. # [23:57] <TabAtkins> (Like every other abspos does, per Align.)
  250. # [23:57] <cbiesinger> yeah
  251. # [23:59] <cbiesinger> well I do like that consistency
  252. # Session Close: Wed Dec 02 00:00:00 2015

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