/irc-logs / w3c / #html-wg / 2007-05-28 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Mon May 28 00:00:00 2007
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  54. # [07:08] <Pavlaras> You will develop HTML 4.01 to HTML 5 ?
  55. # [07:09] <Pavlaras> ?
  56. # [07:09] <Pavlaras> http://www.w3schools.com/w3c/w3c_html.asp
  57. # [07:10] <Pavlaras> W3C will not continue to develop HTML. Future W3C work will be focusing on XHTML.
  58. # [07:10] <Pavlaras> Is it true ?
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  99. # [16:28] * beowulf wonders why the spec has a section called Writing HTML documents if it's not about writing HTML documents
  100. # [16:30] <hsivonen> beowulf: it is about writing documents. it is just too precise and tells too much to the taste of some readers
  101. # [16:31] <hsivonen> beowulf: I guess a tutorial should explore the permissible options less and just give copy-paste cargo cult boilerplate
  102. # [16:31] <beowulf> *slump*
  103. # [16:32] <Philip`> I'm not sure what readers would want the <!DOCTYPE HTML> requirement written out as sixteen steps
  104. # [16:32] <zcorpan_> perhaps the spec should include a non-normative copy-paste cargo cult boilerplate
  105. # [16:32] <beowulf> Philip`: you have to define the readers first, but yes
  106. # [16:33] <Philip`> beowulf: I can't think of any obvious definitions of 'readers' that would care about that detail :-)
  107. # [16:33] <beowulf> i do
  108. # [16:34] <beowulf> i'm just a web designer
  109. # [16:34] <beowulf> (it makes no difference to my job though, just my understanding)
  110. # [16:34] <Philip`> Would it be just as good to tell you "Documents must start with <!DOCTYPE HTML> (case-insensitively)"?
  111. # [16:34] <beowulf> the designers I work with wouldn't care though, they'd just want cargo cult boilerplate
  112. # [16:35] <Philip`> (or maybe also say spaces around the "HTML" are optional, though I'm not sure why anybody would ever want to do that)
  113. # [16:35] <beowulf> Philip`: it would in this case, but there's going to be situations throughout the spec where things will need to be explained at different levels IMHO
  114. # [16:36] <Philip`> Ah, fair enough
  115. # [16:37] <beowulf> it's fair enough to say that DOCTYPE just needs boiler plate, but i sort of think this group should include full explanations too
  116. # [16:37] <hsivonen> Philip`: strictly speaking, there's a difference between saying "Documents *must* start with <!DOCTYPE html> (case-insensitively)" (false) and "Start your documents with the string <!DOCTYPE html>." (reasonable advice)
  117. # [16:38] <beowulf> being even stricter, you should say "Begin your documents..." :)
  118. # [16:39] <beowulf> should these tutorials include information on legacy doctypes?
  119. # [16:39] <hsivonen> beowulf: probably not
  120. # [16:39] <beowulf> better put, are they tutorials on HTML or HTML5?
  121. # [16:39] <Philip`> I suppose that distinction could be avoided if it was a separate document that didn't use the RFCwhatever terminology for "must" and was just written in English instead
  122. # [16:40] <Philip`> (Maybe you could do the same in a non-normative part of the normal spec, but that might become quite confusing)
  123. # [16:40] <beowulf> Philip`: i like the RFC MUST COULD SHOULD, and i don't think there's a simpler and clearer way of doing that sort of thing
  124. # [16:41] <zcorpan_> there is a COULD? :)
  125. # [16:42] <zcorpan_> btw, knock yourselves out: http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/HTML5_Tutorial
  126. # [16:46] <Philip`> (http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/User:Daohkfeng - spam?)
  127. # [16:48] <hsivonen> yeah. spam
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  129. # [17:09] * Lachy added him to the wiki's blocked user list
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  132. # [17:47] <beowulf> i started something on that wiki tutorial thing, then got a phonecall, then got another, so apologies for the mess i've left...
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  138. # [20:23] <zcorpan_> hmm, is it only me who can't connect to freenode?
  139. # [20:25] <Dashiva> I'm on zelazny, no problems
  140. # [20:31] <zcorpan_> :|
  141. # [20:31] <zcorpan_> oh now it works
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The end :)