/irc-logs / w3c / #html-wg / 2008-01-10 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Thu Jan 10 00:00:00 2008
  2. # Session Ident: #html-wg
  3. # [00:11] <Philip> http://html4all.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page - hmm, wikispam :-(
  4. # [00:11] * Philip wonders if anyone conveniently has already registered on there and is able to edit it easily
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  51. # [09:36] <Dashiva> It seems somewhat shortsighted to argue about abbr for single-page documents only when much of the web is paged
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  63. # [11:09] <anne> awesome, normal people actually understand the access control spec and are able to explain it to others :)
  64. # [11:10] <anne> http://ejohn.org/blog/cross-site-xmlhttprequest/#comment-296551
  65. # [11:10] <anne> my work is done :
  66. # [11:10] <anne> )
  67. # [11:17] <Philip> But other normal people don't understand it, like in half of the subsequent comments
  68. # [11:24] <anne> that's not a problem
  69. # [11:24] <anne> you only need a few people to get it who can then explain it to the rest
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  71. # [11:38] <anne> also, I doubt much of the others has tried reading the specification
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  76. # [11:53] <anne> DanC, what about Web Forms 2?
  77. # [11:56] <gsnedders> Still only 24 responses
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  79. # [11:57] <hsivonen> gsnedders: it is reasonable to expect people to be alarmed by the note that the questions may change until later today
  80. # [11:58] <anne> I'm more worried about the at least 14 organizations quorum
  81. # [12:41] <Lachy> if I counted correctly, only 8 organisations answered the last survey about publishing the spec
  82. # [12:42] <Lachy> though there were 53 responses total
  83. # [12:43] <Lachy> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/wd11spec/results
  84. # [12:47] <anne> there are more than 14 companies who I think might reply, but probably only if they're paying attention
  85. # [12:50] <Philip> 25% of the current organisational responders didn't respond to wd11spec
  86. # [12:57] <hsivonen> So far there's one Member saying "No": Microsoft
  87. # [12:59] <Philip> hsivonen: Are you looking at the old survey (wd11spec)?
  88. # [12:59] <Philip> (As far as I can see, Microsoft hasn't responded to the new one)
  89. # [12:59] <hsivonen> Philip: oops. yes
  90. # [13:00] <Philip> The clue is in the URL - that survey was from September 2002
  91. # [13:01] <Philip> Or, uh, maybe it wasn't
  92. # [13:01] <hsivonen> Philip: it is surprisingly easy to look at the wrong survey when the questions are so similar
  93. # [13:03] <anne> CURRENT SURVEY: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/wd-html5-spec/results
  94. # [13:03] * anne hopes that helps for the logs of today
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  118. # [17:31] * Philip wishes security wasn't so hard to get right
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  123. # [17:59] <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/01/10-html-wg-irc
  124. # [17:59] * Joins: Zakim (rrs-bridgg@128.30.52.30)
  125. # [17:59] <DanC> agenda + Convene HTML WG teleconference of 2007-01-10T17:00:00Z for up to 60 min
  126. # [17:59] * Zakim notes agendum 1 added
  127. # [18:02] <MikeSmith> trackbot-ng, start meeting
  128. # [18:02] * trackbot-ng HTML Issue Tracking http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/
  129. # [18:02] * trackbot-ng is starting a teleconference
  130. # [18:02] <trackbot-ng> RRSAgent, make logs public
  131. # [18:02] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, trackbot-ng
  132. # [18:02] <trackbot-ng> Zakim, this will be HTML
  133. # [18:02] <Zakim> ok, trackbot-ng, I see HTML_WG()12:00PM already started
  134. # [18:02] <trackbot-ng> Meeting: HTML Issue Tracking Teleconference
  135. # [18:02] <trackbot-ng> Date: 10 January 2008
  136. # [18:02] <DanC> Meeting: HTML WG weekly
  137. # [18:02] <MikeSmith> Zakim, who's here?
  138. # [18:02] <Zakim> On the phone I see [IPcaller]
  139. # [18:02] <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Sander, aroben_, aroben, Lachy, beowulf, timbl, anne-mac, aaronlev, deltab, zcorpan, gsnedders, tH, ROBOd, anne, mjs, Thezilch, gavin_, MikeSmith, jmb,
  140. # [18:02] <Zakim> ... Dashiva, DanC, krijnh, gavin, Shunsuke, jgraham__, xover, heycam, shepazu, Yudai, Philip, jane, Hixie, trackbot-ng, drry, hsivonen
  141. # [18:02] * DanC Zakim, call DanC-BOS
  142. # [18:02] * Zakim ok, DanC; the call is being made
  143. # [18:02] <Zakim> +DanC
  144. # [18:02] <MikeSmith> Zakim, IPCaller is me
  145. # [18:02] <Zakim> +MikeSmith; got it
  146. # [18:03] <MikeSmith> Zakim, who's here?
  147. # [18:03] <Zakim> On the phone I see MikeSmith, DanC
  148. # [18:03] <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Sander, aroben_, aroben, Lachy, beowulf, timbl, anne-mac, aaronlev, deltab, zcorpan, gsnedders, tH, ROBOd, anne, mjs, Thezilch, gavin_, MikeSmith, jmb,
  149. # [18:03] <Zakim> ... Dashiva, DanC, krijnh, gavin, Shunsuke, jgraham__, xover, heycam, shepazu, Yudai, Philip, jane, Hixie, trackbot-ng, drry, hsivonen
  150. # [18:03] <DanC> Zakim, take up item 1
  151. # [18:03] <Zakim> agendum 1. "Convene HTML WG teleconference of 2007-01-10T17:00:00Z for up to 60 min" taken up [from DanC]
  152. # [18:04] <DanC> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2008JanMar/0001.html
  153. # [18:05] <DanC> ACTION-14 continues
  154. # [18:06] <DanC> agenda + offline-applications-sql (ACTION-13 etc.)
  155. # [18:06] * Zakim notes agendum 2 added
  156. # [18:07] <DanC> agenda + aria-role (ACTION-23 on GR, etc.)
  157. # [18:07] * Zakim notes agendum 3 added
  158. # [18:07] <DanC> ACTION-32 continues
  159. # [18:09] <DanC> agenda + canvas requirement and charter (ACTION-38)
  160. # [18:09] * Zakim notes agendum 4 added
  161. # [18:09] <DanC> agenda + video-codecs (ACTION-39 etc.)
  162. # [18:09] * Zakim notes agendum 5 added
  163. # [18:11] <DanC> agenda + toward HTML 5 spec release (ISSUE-19)
  164. # [18:11] * Zakim notes agendum 6 added
  165. # [18:11] <DanC> Zakim, agenda?
  166. # [18:11] <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda:
  167. # [18:11] <Zakim> 1. Convene HTML WG teleconference of 2007-01-10T17:00:00Z for up to 60 min [from DanC]
  168. # [18:11] <Zakim> 2. offline-applications-sql (ACTION-13 etc.) [from DanC]
  169. # [18:11] <Zakim> 3. aria-role (ACTION-23 on GR, etc.) [from DanC]
  170. # [18:11] <Zakim> 4. canvas requirement and charter (ACTION-38) [from DanC]
  171. # [18:11] <Zakim> 5. video-codecs (ACTION-39 etc.) [from DanC]
  172. # [18:11] <Zakim> 6. toward HTML 5 spec release (ISSUE-19) [from DanC]
  173. # [18:11] * Joins: hober (ted@67.168.62.146)
  174. # [18:12] <DanC> umm... we're below critical mass. I'm going to cancel in a few minutes unless a few more show up
  175. # [18:12] <DanC> Zakim, take up item 6
  176. # [18:12] <Zakim> agendum 6. "toward HTML 5 spec release (ISSUE-19)" taken up [from DanC]
  177. # [18:13] <DanC> "30 answers have been received." -- http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/wd-html5-spec/results
  178. # [18:16] <anne-mac> Zakim, passcode?
  179. # [18:16] <Zakim> the conference code is 4865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), anne-mac
  180. # [18:16] <Zakim> +anne-mac
  181. # [18:16] <anne-mac> Zakim, mute anne-mac
  182. # [18:16] <Zakim> anne-mac should now be muted
  183. # [18:20] <DanC> ACTION-24?
  184. # [18:20] * trackbot-ng getting information on ACTION-24
  185. # [18:20] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-24 -- Gregory Rosmaita to suggest accessibility improvement for "Big issue" marker -- due 2008-01-10 -- OPEN
  186. # [18:20] <trackbot-ng> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/24
  187. # [18:20] * Joins: ChrisWilson (cwilso@131.107.0.102)
  188. # [18:20] <DanC> hmm... withdraw 24?
  189. # [18:21] <MikeSmith> action-24?
  190. # [18:21] * trackbot-ng getting information on ACTION-24
  191. # [18:21] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-24 -- Gregory Rosmaita to suggest accessibility improvement for "Big issue" marker -- due 2008-01-10 -- OPEN
  192. # [18:21] <trackbot-ng> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/24
  193. # [18:21] <DanC> close action-24
  194. # [18:21] * trackbot-ng attempting to close ACTION-24.
  195. # [18:21] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-24 suggest accessibility improvement for "Big issue" marker closed
  196. # [18:23] * DanC wonders if ChrisWilson has any input re the survey... stands by, assuming CW is dialing in...
  197. # [18:24] <ChrisWilson> zakim, phone number?
  198. # [18:24] <Zakim> I am sorry, ChrisWilson; I do not know a number for number?
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  203. # [18:24] <DanC> Zakim, passcode?
  204. # [18:24] <Zakim> the conference code is 4865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), DanC
  205. # [18:24] <MikeSmith> Zakim, code?
  206. # [18:25] <Zakim> the conference code is 4865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), MikeSmith
  207. # [18:25] * Joins: dedridge (opera@121.72.5.194)
  208. # [18:25] <ChrisWilson> thx
  209. # [18:25] <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
  210. # [18:25] <ChrisWilson> Zakim, Microsoft is me
  211. # [18:25] <Zakim> +ChrisWilson; got it
  212. # [18:25] <anne-mac> Zakim, unmute me
  213. # [18:25] <Zakim> anne-mac should no longer be muted
  214. # [18:25] <DanC> Zakim, who's talking?
  215. # [18:25] <MikeSmith> Zakim, mute me
  216. # [18:25] <Zakim> MikeSmith should now be muted
  217. # [18:25] <Zakim> DanC, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: anne-mac (31%), ChrisWilson (12%), MikeSmith (30%)
  218. # [18:26] * anne-mac thought he was muted...
  219. # [18:26] <MikeSmith> I'm muted now, so that echo ain't me...
  220. # [18:26] <DanC> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/wd-html5-spec/results
  221. # [18:26] * anne-mac is locally muted
  222. # [18:27] <DanC> Zakim, close this item
  223. # [18:27] <Zakim> agendum 6 closed
  224. # [18:27] <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
  225. # [18:27] * ChrisWilson is sorry he's late; family issue this morning.
  226. # [18:27] <Zakim> 1. Convene HTML WG teleconference of 2007-01-10T17:00:00Z for up to 60 min [from DanC]
  227. # [18:27] <DanC> Zakim, close item 1
  228. # [18:27] <Zakim> agendum 1, Convene HTML WG teleconference of 2007-01-10T17:00:00Z for up to 60 min, closed
  229. # [18:27] <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
  230. # [18:27] <Zakim> 2. offline-applications-sql (ACTION-13 etc.) [from DanC]
  231. # [18:27] <DanC> Zakim, next item
  232. # [18:27] <Zakim> agendum 2. "offline-applications-sql (ACTION-13 etc.)" taken up [from DanC]
  233. # [18:27] <DanC> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/agenda
  234. # [18:27] <DanC> ACTION-13?
  235. # [18:27] * trackbot-ng getting information on ACTION-13
  236. # [18:27] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-13 -- Chris Wilson to talk to WebAPI and WAF WGs about their role in offline API stuff and how they work with and contribute to the discussion -- due 2007-12-13 -- OPEN
  237. # [18:27] <trackbot-ng> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/13
  238. # [18:28] <DanC> Zakim, mute me temporarily
  239. # [18:28] <Zakim> DanC should now be muted
  240. # [18:28] <DanC> Zakim, mute anne temporarily
  241. # [18:28] <Zakim> anne-mac should now be muted
  242. # [18:28] <Zakim> DanC should now be unmuted again
  243. # [18:28] * DanC thinks the echo is anne
  244. # [18:28] <Zakim> anne-mac should now be unmuted again
  245. # [18:28] <MikeSmith> Zakim, unmute me
  246. # [18:28] <Zakim> MikeSmith should no longer be muted
  247. # [18:29] <MikeSmith> Zakim, mute me
  248. # [18:29] <Zakim> MikeSmith should now be muted
  249. # [18:29] <DanC> ACTION-13 continues for 2 weeks
  250. # [18:29] <DanC> Zakim, next item
  251. # [18:29] <Zakim> agendum 3. "aria-role (ACTION-23 on GR, etc.)" taken up [from DanC]
  252. # [18:30] <DanC> ACTION-23 continues
  253. # [18:30] <DanC> Zakim, mute anne temporarily
  254. # [18:30] <Zakim> anne-mac should now be muted
  255. # [18:30] <MikeSmith> Zakim, unmute me
  256. # [18:30] <Zakim> MikeSmith should no longer be muted
  257. # [18:30] <Zakim> anne-mac should now be unmuted again
  258. # [18:31] <anne-mac> Zakim, who makes noise?
  259. # [18:31] <Zakim> I don't understand your question, anne-mac.
  260. # [18:31] <DanC> DanC: anybody know how many designs are in play?
  261. # [18:31] <DanC> CW: I think they're down to 1
  262. # [18:31] <DanC> DanC: details? pointer?
  263. # [18:31] <DanC> CW: not sure...
  264. # [18:31] <MikeSmith> anne-mac, who's making noise?
  265. # [18:31] <DanC> ack anne
  266. # [18:31] * Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
  267. # [18:31] <MikeSmith> Zakim, who's making noise?
  268. # [18:32] <Zakim> MikeSmith, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: anne-mac (57%)
  269. # [18:32] <DanC> anne: I think we're done, yeah...
  270. # [18:32] <DanC> DanC: pointer?
  271. # [18:32] * Quits: timbl (timbl@128.30.5.98) (Quit: timbl)
  272. # [18:32] <DanC> anne: role attribute and [what?]
  273. # [18:33] <ChrisWilson> 'role' attribute and "aria-*"
  274. # [18:33] <MikeSmith> aaronlev - has there been a final decision of a single set of markup for ARIA?
  275. # [18:33] <anne-mac> aria-'property'
  276. # [18:33] <DanC> DanC: is this in the html 5 spec?
  277. # [18:33] <DanC> anne: not yet
  278. # [18:33] <DanC> Zakim, next item
  279. # [18:33] <Zakim> agendum 4. "canvas requirement and charter (ACTION-38)" taken up [from DanC]
  280. # [18:34] * Joins: chaals (chaals@84.77.8.70)
  281. # [18:34] <DanC> ACTION-38 continues
  282. # [18:34] <DanC> Zakim, mute anne
  283. # [18:34] <Zakim> anne-mac should now be muted
  284. # [18:34] <DanC> discussion between DC, CW continues re canvas and charter
  285. # [18:35] <DanC> Zakim, next item
  286. # [18:35] <Zakim> agendum 5. "video-codecs (ACTION-39 etc.)" taken up [from DanC]
  287. # [18:35] <DanC> action-39?
  288. # [18:35] * trackbot-ng getting information on ACTION-39
  289. # [18:35] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-39 -- Chris Wilson to chairs to discuss action on video/audo codec and container with Philippe et al post the video workshop -- due 2007-12-20 -- OPEN
  290. # [18:35] <trackbot-ng> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/39
  291. # [18:36] <aaronlev> MikeSmith: yes, aria-'property' as anne said
  292. # [18:36] <MikeSmith> aaronlev - thanks
  293. # [18:37] <DanC> DanC: PLH and Chris L have the ball on this.
  294. # [18:37] <DanC> DanC: we could suggest something for the html5 spec meanwhile...
  295. # [18:37] <DanC> CW: what'st here now is OK
  296. # [18:37] <DanC> DanC: yeah.
  297. # [18:37] <DanC> close action-39
  298. # [18:37] * trackbot-ng attempting to close ACTION-39.
  299. # [18:37] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-39 Chairs to discuss action on video/audo codec and container with Philippe et al post the video workshop closed
  300. # [18:37] <DanC> close ACTION-39
  301. # [18:37] * trackbot-ng attempting to close ACTION-39.
  302. # [18:37] <trackbot-ng> ACTION-39 Chairs to discuss action on video/audo codec and container with Philippe et al post the video workshop closed
  303. # [18:37] <DanC> Zakim, next item
  304. # [18:37] <Zakim> I do not see any non-closed or non-skipped agenda items, DanC
  305. # [18:37] <DanC> Topic: next meeting
  306. # [18:38] <DanC> CW: regrets next week
  307. # [18:38] <DanC> DanC: ok, I'll chair next week
  308. # [18:38] <DanC> ADJOURN.
  309. # [18:38] <DanC> RRSAgent, draft minutes
  310. # [18:38] <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/10-html-wg-minutes.html DanC
  311. # [18:39] <Zakim> -anne-mac
  312. # [18:39] <Zakim> -ChrisWilson
  313. # [18:39] <DanC> RRSAgent, make logs world-access
  314. # [18:39] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, DanC
  315. # [18:39] <Zakim> -MikeSmith
  316. # [18:39] <DanC> Zakim, list attendees
  317. # [18:39] <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been DanC, MikeSmith, anne-mac, ChrisWilson
  318. # [18:39] <DanC> RRSAgent, draft minutes
  319. # [18:39] <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/10-html-wg-minutes.html DanC
  320. # [18:39] * Parts: chaals (chaals@84.77.8.70)
  321. # [18:40] <DanC> Chair: DanC
  322. # [18:40] <DanC> RRSAgent, draft minutes
  323. # [18:40] <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/10-html-wg-minutes.html DanC
  324. # [18:40] <Zakim> -DanC
  325. # [18:40] <Zakim> HTML_WG()12:00PM has ended
  326. # [18:40] <Zakim> Attendees were DanC, MikeSmith, anne-mac, ChrisWilson
  327. # [18:45] * Joins: laplink (link@193.157.66.108)
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  329. # [19:00] * Quits: ChrisWilson (cwilso@131.107.0.102) (Quit: ChrisWilson)
  330. # [19:01] <Lachy> oops, I forgot about the telcon.
  331. # [19:01] * Lachy reads the logs
  332. # [19:04] * Joins: timbl (timbl@128.30.5.98)
  333. # [19:07] * Quits: Sander (svl@86.87.68.167) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
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  347. # [20:54] * Quits: laplink (link@193.157.66.108) (Client exited)
  348. # [21:00] * Quits: adele (adele@17.203.15.207) (Quit: adele)
  349. # [21:03] * Zakim excuses himself; his presence no longer seems to be needed
  350. # [21:03] * Parts: Zakim (rrs-bridgg@128.30.52.30)
  351. # [21:19] <jgraham> If anyone knows who is responsible for the html4all wiki (or is just on the mailing list) it might be nice to drop them a note suggesting they take some anti-spam measures
  352. # [21:33] * Joins: adele (adele@17.203.15.207)
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  360. # [22:31] <gsnedders> my organisation: flagging everything I need to-do/reply-to in email, even if it's just notification of a new comment on some social networking site :P
  361. # [22:33] * Quits: timbl (timbl@128.30.5.98) (Quit: timbl)
  362. # [22:34] <Philip> Oh, that reminds me that I marked an email as to-do a week ago and then forgot about it
  363. # [22:44] <gsnedders> Philip: I have one from 2005.
  364. # [22:46] <Philip> That sounds highly organised - all my emails from around 2005 are just in a folder named InboxOld, and the ones from around 2004 are in a folder named d302f378
  365. # [22:51] <gsnedders> yeah, my email is well organised… compared with this desk at least :)
  366. # [22:51] <gsnedders> Why do I always title my homework then procrastinate?
  367. # [22:52] <Hixie> the csswg continues to amaze me in their lack of ability to get it
  368. # [22:52] * gsnedders passes it to the csswg
  369. # [22:52] <Hixie> oh they know
  370. # [22:52] <Hixie> hell i've blogged about it and posted about it publicly at least twice
  371. # [22:53] * gsnedders moves an email into another folder, just to prove that his projects are orgranised
  372. # [22:54] <Hixie> oldest e-mail in my todo pile (also known as my INBOX) is from march 2004
  373. # [22:55] <gsnedders> anne: you mind if I procrastinate my revision for exams next week further by drafting something for XML5 charset detection?
  374. # [22:55] <gsnedders> heh. my second oldest in 2007. :P
  375. # [22:55] * Quits: smedero (smedero@192.223.6.251) (Quit: smedero)
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  382. # Session Close: Fri Jan 11 00:00:00 2008

The end :)