/irc-logs / w3c / #html-wg / 2009-02-23 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Mon Feb 23 00:00:00 2009
  2. # Session Ident: #html-wg
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  14. # [03:54] <MikeSmith> trackbot, close issue-70
  15. # [03:54] * trackbot attempting to close ISSUE-70.
  16. # [03:54] <trackbot> ISSUE-70 testing to see if tracker mail integration is working -- created by Web UI closed
  17. # [03:55] <MikeSmith> issue: test from IRC to see if tracker mail integration working
  18. # [03:55] * trackbot noticed an ISSUE. Trying to create it.
  19. # [03:55] <trackbot> Created ISSUE-71 - Test from IRC to see if tracker mail integration working ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/71/edit .
  20. # [04:12] <heycam> MikeSmith, is the problem with the HTML telcon minutes permissions a wider problem?
  21. # [04:12] <heycam> i also can't get to SVG minutes/irc from last week
  22. # [04:17] <heycam> (i could get to them on the day they were created, at least)
  23. # [04:17] <MikeSmith> heycam: yeah, that was the same with the HTML WG minutes
  24. # [04:18] <MikeSmith> anyway, I manually changed the perms on the HTML WG minutes
  25. # [04:18] <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/2009/02/19-html-wg-minutes.html
  26. # [04:18] <pimpbot> Title: HTML Weekly Teleconference -- 19 Feb 2009 (at www.w3.org)
  27. # [04:18] <MikeSmith> they were set to team-only.. I don't know when/how they got set to that
  28. # [04:18] <MikeSmith> I can change the SVG WG minutes too if you want
  29. # [04:19] <heycam> yeah that'd be great
  30. # [04:19] <heycam> let me dig up the URLs
  31. # [04:21] <heycam> http://www.w3.org/2009/02/1{5,6,7,8}-svg-minutes.html
  32. # [04:21] <heycam> and http://www.w3.org/2009/02/1{5,6,7,8,9}-svg-irc.html
  33. # [04:21] <heycam> (forgot to generate the -minutes.html for the last day)
  34. # [04:21] <heycam> hmm, it seems some older minutes are also now inaccessible
  35. # [04:23] <heycam> MikeSmith, so also these ones: http://www.w3.org/2009/02/{02,05,09,12}-svg-{minutes,irc}.html
  36. # [04:23] <heycam> the systeam recently changed something with permissions on w3.org didn't they? i wonder if this caused RRSAgent not to be able to set the permissions properly.
  37. # [04:25] <MikeSmith> heycam: OK, gimme a couple of minutes
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  51. # [08:57] <MikeSmith> heycam: I did change the perms on all the SVG WG minutes
  52. # [08:58] <heycam> MikeSmith, thanks a bunch!
  53. # [08:58] <MikeSmith> but we have a general problem in that perms for everything seem to have reverted to team-only
  54. # [08:58] <heycam> MikeSmith, ok
  55. # [09:14] <MikeSmith> hmm, cause actually appears to just be pilot error
  56. # [09:15] <MikeSmith> as in, a somebody accidentally set perms for all files in the http://www.w3.org/2009/02/ to team-only
  57. # [09:25] <MikeSmith> heycam: so we'll need to fix them case-by-case, I think
  58. # [09:31] <MikeSmith> issue: need to make it publicly clear that http://www.w3.org/TR/web-forms-2/ is obsoleted by HTML5
  59. # [09:31] * trackbot noticed an ISSUE. Trying to create it.
  60. # [09:31] <trackbot> Created ISSUE-72 - Need to make it publicly clear that http://www.w3.org/TR/web-forms-2/ is obsoleted by HTML5 ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/72/edit .
  61. # [09:31] <pimpbot> Title: Web Forms 2.0 (at www.w3.org)
  62. # [09:31] <pimpbot> Title: Web Forms 2.0 (at www.w3.org)
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  65. # [10:04] <pimpbot> planet: IITK <http://arunranga.com/blog/2009/02/iitk/>
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  70. # [10:11] <hsivonen> Hixie: "Otherwise, if there is a table element in the stack of open elements, but the last table element in the stack of open elements has no parent, or its parent node is not an element, then the foster parent element is the element before the last table element in the stack of open elements.
  71. # [10:11] <hsivonen> "
  72. # [10:12] <hsivonen> Hixie: is the element before the last table the element on the stack that is one step closer to the root of the stack?
  73. # [10:13] <Hixie> yeah
  74. # [10:13] <Hixie> the element above it
  75. # [10:13] <Hixie> since for some reason this stack is upside down
  76. # [10:14] <Hixie> i really should fix that
  77. # [10:14] <Hixie> but i'm really scared of breaking everything if i do
  78. # [10:14] <Hixie> or worse, of breaking exactly one minor thing somewhere
  79. # [10:16] <hsivonen> I think I now implement the spec-wise correct errors for xmlns:xlink as well as other xmlns:foo attributes
  80. # [10:16] <hsivonen> but I don't support the Uhhhhhh syntax for them at this time
  81. # [10:16] <hsivonen> I thought I did, but it turns out I don't, and I'm not adding it now
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  93. # [12:04] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6613] New: Allow in XHTML" ( message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0036.html>
  94. # [12:19] * Parts: annevk (opera@58.1.246.136)
  95. # [12:39] <hsivonen> pimpbot thinks bug titles are RSS 2.0 titles :-(
  96. # [12:39] <pimpbot> hsivonen: Huh?
  97. # [13:04] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6462] Self-reference and cyclic references in headers=''" (1 message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0039.html> ** "[Bug 6438] Error in step 9.4 of the internal algorithm for scanning and assigning header cells" (1 message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0038.html> ** "[Bug 6336] XSLT-compat doctype only allowed for use by XSLT" (1 message
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  99. # [13:34] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6613] Allow in XHTML" (1 message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0040.html>
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  102. # [14:35] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6614] New: Restricting multiple character encoding declarations per document" (1 message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0041.html>
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  110. # [15:02] <Stevef> jgraham: am around if you want to discuss anything further
  111. # [15:03] <jgraham> Stevef: OK, have to go to a meeting now
  112. # [15:03] <jgraham> biab
  113. # [15:03] <Stevef> jgraham: no problem
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  115. # [15:05] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6614] Restricting multiple character encoding declarations per document" (1 message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0042.html>
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  122. # [16:07] <pimpbot> planet: What's the key difference between HTML4 and HTML5? <http://stackoverflow.com/questions/134727/whats-the-key-difference-between-html4-and-html5>
  123. # [16:19] <rubys> danc: who is allowed to remove spam on the esw wiki?
  124. # [16:19] <rubys> http://esw.w3.org/topic/canon%2Btoner--provided%2Bfinished?action=Despam
  125. # [16:20] <DanC> anybody (who makes an account for himself/herself)
  126. # [16:20] <pimpbot> Title: canon+toner--provided+finished - ESW Wiki (at esw.w3.org)
  127. # [16:20] <rubys> "You are not allowed to use this action."
  128. # [16:20] <DanC> hmm
  129. # [16:35] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6614] Restricting multiple character encoding declarations per document" (2 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0043.html>
  130. # [16:46] <rubys> http://esw.w3.org/topic/IETF_HTML5_Meeting_March_2009
  131. # [16:46] <pimpbot> Title: IETF HTML5 Meeting March 2009 - ESW Wiki (at esw.w3.org)
  132. # [16:48] * karl appreciates a lot the work of Sam in different venues around html 5. Respect and Bow.
  133. # [16:49] <hsivonen> does the IETF meeting itself require an NDA?
  134. # [16:49] <DanC> on the contrary
  135. # [16:49] <DanC> http://www.ietf.org/NOTEWELL.html
  136. # [16:49] <DanC> "A participant in any IETF activity acknowledges that written, audio and video records of meetings may be made and may be available to the public."
  137. # [16:50] <hsivonen> ok. the first paragraph might be read to imply that the HTML meeting's non-requirement of NDA is in contrast to the main IETF meeting
  138. # [16:50] <hsivonen> first para here, that is: http://esw.w3.org/topic/IETF_HTML5_Meeting_March_2009
  139. # [16:50] <pimpbot> Title: IETF HTML5 Meeting March 2009 - ESW Wiki (at esw.w3.org)
  140. # [16:50] * DanC hasn't actually read the first paragraph; catches up...
  141. # [16:51] <rubys> I had some email exchange with a number of likely participants. My sole intent was to capture the sentiment that we not pick a location in which access to the location itself required a participant to sign an NDA.
  142. # [16:51] <DanC> ah... now I see... "non-disclosure" is a somewhat typical policy at high tech companies in the area.
  143. # [16:52] <rubys> It is a wiki, improvements welcome!
  144. # [16:52] * rubys notes karl's appreciation
  145. # [16:52] <DanC> i.e. "let's have the meeting in conference room B down the hall" says bob@hitech.com; then fred reminds bob "no, we'd have to get everybody to sign NDAs before we could let them in the building"
  146. # [16:52] <hsivonen> rubys: I understand the point now
  147. # [16:53] <karl> btw rubys the criteria from one stage of specification to another stage are *entrance* criteria not exit criteria. There is a minor difference in semantics which has its importance. For example, a spec can jump one step if all the criterias of entrance in next stage are met.
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  153. # [17:40] <karl> https://wiki.mozilla.org/BespinServerAPI
  154. # [17:40] <pimpbot> Title: Labs/Bespin/ServerAPI - MozillaWiki (at wiki.mozilla.org)
  155. # [17:41] <karl> Bespin has a python backend server
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  170. # [19:40] <DanC> karl, does it use JSON on-the-wire?
  171. # [19:40] * DanC takes a look...
  172. # [19:41] <DanC> ah... good... uses real HTTP error codes...
  173. # [19:41] <DanC> hmm... cleartext password
  174. # [19:42] <DanC> hmm... "POST (or GET) /register/logout/ "... GET for logout seems kinda odd, but I suppose it's reasonably safe
  175. # [19:42] <Philip> Depends on your definition of "safe"
  176. # [19:43] <DanC> screw case: clients start to depend on it, then due to prefetching annoyances they change the API to just POST; then the earlier clients are kinda screweed
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  178. # [19:43] <DanC> but in short, yes, it uses JSON
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  180. # [19:44] <DanC> not clear to me how lost updates are prevented
  181. # [19:44] * Philip has seen forums where people put <a href="/logout">Some harmless text</a> in their sigs, and they seemingly never get tired of that trick
  182. # [19:44] <DanC> eek! I think I just broke my office chair
  183. # [19:45] <Philip> Have you been using it to slide around your office staging mock pirate battles?
  184. # [19:46] <DanC> no, just leaned back a bit.
  185. # [19:46] <Philip> Oh, that's much less exciting
  186. # [19:46] <DanC> whew. I just had to screw it back together
  187. # [19:46] <DanC> meanwhile... on http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/agenda ...
  188. # [19:46] <pimpbot> Title: Input for Agenda Planning for the HTML Weekly - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  189. # [20:07] <DanC> this "Example canvas element use - accessibility concerns" thread... I hesitate to open it up... if I ignore it, will it go away?
  190. # [20:09] <gsnedders> Eventually
  191. # [20:09] <gsnedders> How many bikesheds we manage to paint before then is debatable.
  192. # [20:09] * DanC finds Boris's msg of 18 Feb 2009 11:24:24 -0500 worth reading
  193. # [20:11] <DanC> hmm... maciej's msg of 18 Feb 2009 10:30:10 -0800 makes me wonder how much rich text editing HTML 5 is intended to cover
  194. # [20:12] <Philip> DanC: I think you can ignore that thread
  195. # [20:13] <Philip> DanC: Mostly it consists of people saying that it would be good if people only used canvas accessibly
  196. # [20:13] <Philip> and then failing to suggest practical ways to encourage that
  197. # [20:14] * Philip would be interested in solutions that could work, but can't think of any and hasn't seen any suggested
  198. # [20:31] <karl> Philip: because it is not about canvas, but about applications domains. It would be like saying how can I make C or python accessible.
  199. # [20:32] <karl> maybe a way to deal with it is can we hook accessibility messages into the API that is visible by the OS?
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  201. # [20:35] <karl> maybe a similar fallback mechanism than the one used for java applets loaded by object element
  202. # [20:36] <karl> that doesn't solve the accessibility of the application running into canvas, but that says at least here there is something programmatic
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  204. # [21:00] <Philip> karl: You can do it programmatically by creating an HTML representation of your canvas state and storing it as the canvas element's fallback content
  205. # [21:01] <Philip> The problem is trying to find a solution that's less rubbish than that :-)
  206. # [21:07] <karl> :)
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  210. # [21:37] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 6607] wrapping text to limit line length without a table" (1 message in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2009Feb/0044.html>
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  213. # [23:03] <karl> gsnedders: in the list of content location/uri you sent me. What are the issues exactly?
  214. # [23:03] <karl> http://stuff.gsnedders.com/contentlocation.txt
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The end :)