/irc-logs / w3c / #html-wg / 2010-09-09 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Thu Sep 09 00:00:00 2010
  2. # Session Ident: #html-wg
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  5. # [00:18] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10241] The platform specific activation behavior does not work in practice. E.g. http://us.starcraft2.com/dominion/entrance-exam-qna.xml relies on a click event for a display:none input element. The Web is the platform so we should just standardize on that :-) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0355.html> ** [Bug 10239] How about using file-extensions instead of mime-types? It would allow application-specif
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  7. # [00:48] <pimpbot> changes: hixie: Define how to handle <img src='mailto:foo@example.com'> (whatwg r5451) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Sep/0035.html> ** hixie: Make ol[type=x] case-sensitive in HTML. Make <ul type='disc'> case-insensitive in XML. (whatwg r5450) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Sep/0034.html> ** hixie: Make the 'already started' flag actually work. Also, reorder things in the 'run' algorithm
  8. # [00:48] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10247] What should happen when the URL to be fetched is a mailto: URL or some other weird scheme. (Mostly curious in relation to EventSource, but it applies elsewhere too.) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0365.html> ** [Bug 10253] doesn't say anything except what the container type is, and even a type like <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0364.html> ** [Bug 10250]
  9. # [00:48] <pimpbot> planet: Debugging Common Canvas Issues <http://blogs.msdn.com/b/ie/archive/2010/09/08/debugging-common-canvas-issues.aspx> ** State of HTML5 <canvas> in QtWebKit <http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2010/09/08/state-of-html5-canvas-in-qtwebkit/>
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  11. # [01:48] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10584] New: toString does not represent what WebKit and Mozilla do, which is to return only the text within the selection that is visible to the user. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0367.html> ** [Bug 10583] New: toString does not represent what WebKit and Mozilla do, which is to return only the text within the selection that is visible to the user. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bu
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  18. # [02:48] <pimpbot> changes: hixie: typo (whatwg r5452) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Sep/0036.html>
  19. # [02:48] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10254] Missing word in "The address element" section <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0371.html> ** [Bug 10167] HTML5 Polyglot spec breaks RDFa case sensitivity <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0370.html> ** [Bug 10254] Missing word in "The address element" section <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0369.html> ** [Bug 10244] T
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  24. # [03:19] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10399] base64 def in algorithm for put to data URI <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0372.html>
  25. # [04:13] * Quits: MikeSmith (MikeSmith@114.48.63.214) (Ping timeout)
  26. # [04:19] <pimpbot> changes: hixie: Mention FAQs for <dl>. We already have an example. (whatwg r5453) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Sep/0037.html>
  27. # [04:19] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10263] Should there be functions available to add and remove resources to/from the cache using JavaScript? <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0376.html> ** [Bug 10262] autocomplete attribute seams to do more than it should. There should be a 'confidential' attribute that will do all that is mention here and autocomplete=off would only disable autocomplete, but let browsers remember the value for back button
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  34. # [04:49] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10586] New: For good French typography, we need a sup span. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0377.html>
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  46. # [06:19] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10264] This paragraph is phrased awkwardly <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0378.html>
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  50. # [08:20] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10240] Just setting the <script> to "already started" doesn't prevent it from running if we then immediately "run" it. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0379.html>
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  54. # [08:28] * Topic is 'http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010JulSep/0020.html'
  55. # [08:28] * Set by rubys on Thu Sep 02 17:52:30
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  57. # [09:20] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10399] base64 def in algorithm for put to data URI <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0380.html>
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  63. # [10:20] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10583] toString does not represent what WebKit and Mozilla do, which is to return only the text within the selection that is visible to the user. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0383.html> ** [Bug 10584] toString does not represent what WebKit and Mozilla do, which is to return only the text within the selection that is visible to the user. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/201
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  74. # [11:21] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10583] toString does not represent what WebKit and Mozilla do, which is to return only the text within the selection that is visible to the user. <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0385.html> ** [Bug 10587] New: Please remove a redundant "still in foreign" check <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0384.html>
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  81. # [11:51] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10588] New: Infinite loop with <math><mi>EOF <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0386.html>
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  84. # [12:21] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img" <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0399.html> ** [Bug 10462] merge ARIA mapping tables and list <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0398.html> ** [Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img" <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0397.html> ** [Bug 10497] What happens to role of <img al
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  86. # [12:51] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10494] modify aria example and fix spelling <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0403.html> ** "[Bug 10066] replace section 3.2.6 with the alternative spec text provided (ARIA)" (2 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0402.html> ** [Bug 10463] provide a comprehensive HTML5 to accessibility API mapping reference <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/pu
  87. # [12:51] <pimpbot> planet: Create a Sticky Note Effect in 5 Easy Steps with CSS3 and HTML5 <http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/ajaxian/~3/GRSTA4z3FnA/create-a-sticky-note-effect-in-5-easy-steps-with-css3-and-html5>
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  89. # [13:21] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img" <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0404.html>
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  93. # [13:51] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img"" (3 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0406.html>
  94. # [13:51] <pimpbot> planet: Any video site allowing HTML5 embeds? <http://doctype.com/any-video-site-allowing-html5-embeds>
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  104. # [15:52] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img"" (5 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0408.html>
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  108. # [16:52] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10589] New: figure and figcaption shouldn't automatically close p <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0410.html> ** "[Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img"" (6 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0409.html>
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  110. # [17:22] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10589] figure and figcaption shouldn't automatically close p <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0411.html>
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  117. # [17:52] <pimpbot> planet: Firefox 4 and a Virtual Park <http://davidwboswell.wordpress.com/2010/09/09/firefox-4-and-a-virtual-park/>
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  124. # [18:02] <dsinger_> Zakim, code?
  125. # [18:02] * rubys changes topic to 'http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010JulSep/0022.html'
  126. # [18:02] <rubys> trackbot, start meeting
  127. # [18:02] * trackbot is preparing a teleconference
  128. # [18:02] * Joins: RRSAgent (rrs-loggee@128.30.52.169)
  129. # [18:02] <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/09/09-html-wg-irc
  130. # [18:02] <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
  131. # [18:02] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, trackbot
  132. # [18:02] * Joins: Zakim (rrs-bridgg@128.30.52.169)
  133. # [18:02] <trackbot> Zakim, this will be html_wg
  134. # [18:02] <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see HTML_WG()12:00PM already started
  135. # [18:02] <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Weekly Teleconference
  136. # [18:02] <trackbot> Date: 09 September 2010
  137. # [18:03] <dsinger_> Zakim, code?
  138. # [18:03] <Zakim> the conference code is 4865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.26.46.79.03 tel:+44.203.318.0479), dsinger_
  139. # [18:03] * Joins: Dzung_Tran (chatzilla@134.134.139.70)
  140. # [18:03] <Judy> zakim, who's here?
  141. # [18:03] <Zakim> On the phone I see Judy
  142. # [18:03] <Zakim> On IRC I see Dzung_Tran, Zakim, RRSAgent, dsinger_, paulc, rubys, Judy, Martijnc-, Julian, Stevef, oedipus, aroben, plh, MikeSmith, arronei, krijnh, mjs, laplink, anne, Jedi,
  143. # [18:03] * Joins: adrianba (adrianba@131.107.0.103)
  144. # [18:03] <Zakim> ... johndrinkwater, Dashiva, pimpbot, phenny, Yudai, jmb, gavin, inimino, scotfl, hsivonen, ed_work_, hober, Shunsuke, CIA-1, webben, Philip, jwm, gsnedders, jgraham, Hixie, drry,
  145. # [18:03] <Zakim> ... trackbot
  146. # [18:03] <Zakim> +dsinger
  147. # [18:03] <Zakim> +[HP]
  148. # [18:03] * dsinger_ zakim, mute dsinger
  149. # [18:03] * Zakim dsinger should now be muted
  150. # [18:03] <Zakim> +Sam
  151. # [18:03] <Zakim> +Matt_May
  152. # [18:03] * Joins: dpenkler (qw3birc@128.30.52.28)
  153. # [18:04] <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
  154. # [18:04] <paulc> zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc
  155. # [18:04] <Zakim> +paulc; got it
  156. # [18:04] * plh zakim, call plh-work
  157. # [18:04] * Zakim ok, plh; the call is being made
  158. # [18:04] <Zakim> +Plh
  159. # [18:05] * plh zakim, who is on the phone?
  160. # [18:05] * Zakim sees on the phone: Judy, [HP], dsinger (muted), Sam, Matt_May, [Microsoft], Plh
  161. # [18:05] * Zakim [Microsoft] has paulc
  162. # [18:05] <dpenkler> zakim, [HP] has dpenkler
  163. # [18:05] <Zakim> +dpenkler; got it
  164. # [18:05] <MikeSmith> Zakim, call Mike
  165. # [18:05] * Joins: janina (janina@66.92.170.178)
  166. # [18:05] <janina> zakim, call janina
  167. # [18:05] <Zakim> ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made
  168. # [18:05] <Zakim> +Mike
  169. # [18:05] <Zakim> ok, janina; the call is being made
  170. # [18:05] <Zakim> +Janina
  171. # [18:05] <Zakim> +Eric_Carlson
  172. # [18:05] * Joins: Laura (lauracarls@131.212.98.217)
  173. # [18:05] * Joins: eric_carlson (eric_carls@17.203.15.26)
  174. # [18:05] <Zakim> +[Microsoft.a]
  175. # [18:05] <adrianba> zakim, [Microsoft.a] has adrianba
  176. # [18:05] <Zakim> +adrianba; got it
  177. # [18:06] <Zakim> + +49.251.280.aaaa
  178. # [18:06] <Julian> Zakim, +49.251.280.aaaa is me
  179. # [18:06] <Zakim> +Julian; got it
  180. # [18:07] <adrianba> ScribeNick: adrianba
  181. # [18:07] <adrianba> Scribe: Adrian Bateman
  182. # [18:07] <adrianba> Chair: Maciej Stachowiak
  183. # [18:07] * Joins: eliot (eliot@72.11.66.122)
  184. # [18:07] <adrianba> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010JulSep/0022.html
  185. # [18:07] <pimpbot> Title: {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-09-09 - LC timeline, distributed extensibility, media accessibility from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-09-08 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from July to September 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
  186. # [18:08] <Zakim> +Laura_Carlson
  187. # [18:08] <janina> zakim, who's here?
  188. # [18:08] <Zakim> On the phone I see Judy, [HP], dsinger (muted), Sam, Matt_May, [Microsoft], Plh, Mike, Eric_Carlson, Janina, [Microsoft.a], Julian, Laura_Carlson
  189. # [18:08] <Zakim> [Microsoft.a] has adrianba
  190. # [18:08] <Zakim> [HP] has dpenkler
  191. # [18:08] <Zakim> [Microsoft] has paulc
  192. # [18:08] <Zakim> On IRC I see eliot, eric_carlson, Laura, janina, dpenkler, adrianba, Dzung_Tran, Zakim, RRSAgent, dsinger_, paulc, rubys, Judy, Martijnc-, Julian, Stevef, oedipus, aroben, plh,
  193. # [18:08] <Zakim> ... MikeSmith, arronei, krijnh, mjs, laplink, anne, Jedi, johndrinkwater, Dashiva, pimpbot, phenny, Yudai, jmb, gavin, inimino, scotfl, hsivonen, ed_work_, hober, Shunsuke, CIA-1,
  194. # [18:08] <Zakim> ... webben, Philip, jwm, gsnedders, jgraham, Hixie, drry, trackbot
  195. # [18:08] * Quits: Stevef (chatzilla@94.172.220.38) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.8/20100722155716])
  196. # [18:08] <Zakim> + +1.206.850.aabb
  197. # [18:08] <eliot> zakim, 206.850.aabb is me
  198. # [18:08] <Zakim> sorry, eliot, I do not recognize a party named '206.850.aabb'
  199. # [18:08] <eliot> zakim, 1.206.850.aabb is me
  200. # [18:08] <Zakim> sorry, eliot, I do not recognize a party named '1.206.850.aabb'
  201. # [18:09] <eliot> zakim, +1.206.850.aabb is me
  202. # [18:09] <Zakim> +eliot; got it
  203. # [18:09] <dsinger_> zakim, who is here?
  204. # [18:09] <Zakim> On the phone I see Judy, [HP], dsinger (muted), Sam, Matt_May, [Microsoft], Plh, Mike, Eric_Carlson, Janina, [Microsoft.a], Julian, Laura_Carlson, eliot
  205. # [18:09] <Zakim> [Microsoft.a] has adrianba
  206. # [18:09] <Zakim> [HP] has dpenkler
  207. # [18:09] <Zakim> [Microsoft] has paulc
  208. # [18:09] <Zakim> On IRC I see eliot, eric_carlson, Laura, janina, dpenkler, adrianba, Dzung_Tran, Zakim, RRSAgent, dsinger_, paulc, rubys, Judy, Martijnc-, Julian, oedipus, aroben, plh, MikeSmith,
  209. # [18:09] <Zakim> ... arronei, krijnh, mjs, laplink, anne, Jedi, johndrinkwater, Dashiva, pimpbot, phenny, Yudai, jmb, gavin, inimino, scotfl, hsivonen, ed_work_, hober, Shunsuke, CIA-1, webben,
  210. # [18:09] <Zakim> ... Philip, jwm, gsnedders, jgraham, Hixie, drry, trackbot
  211. # [18:11] <MikeSmith> adrian, you on?
  212. # [18:11] <adrianba> yes
  213. # [18:11] <janina> We don't seem to have any of the chairs?
  214. # [18:11] * rubys is on
  215. # [18:11] <janina> O, good!
  216. # [18:12] <paulc> So is Paul
  217. # [18:12] <paulc> Paul is in Japan doing his best imitation of Mike S!
  218. # [18:12] <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
  219. # [18:12] <MikeSmith> adrianba, can you scribe?
  220. # [18:12] <adrianba> yep, ready to go
  221. # [18:12] <MikeSmith> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010JulSep/0022.html
  222. # [18:13] <pimpbot> Title: {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-09-09 - LC timeline, distributed extensibility, media accessibility from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-09-08 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from July to September 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
  223. # [18:13] <adrianba> Chair: Sam Ruby
  224. # [18:13] <adrianba> Chair: Mike Smith
  225. # [18:14] <adrianba> TOPIC: ACTION items due by Thursday, Sep 9
  226. # [18:14] <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/agenda
  227. # [18:14] <pimpbot> Title: Input for Agenda Planning for the HTML Weekly - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  228. # [18:14] <plh> ACTION-29?
  229. # [18:14] * trackbot getting information on ACTION-29
  230. # [18:14] <trackbot> ACTION-29 -- Philippe Le Hégaret to follow up on the idea of a free-software-compatible license for a note on HTML authoring -- due 2010-09-09 -- OPEN
  231. # [18:14] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/29
  232. # [18:14] <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-29 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  233. # [18:14] <adrianba> plh: first action is mine, doc license
  234. # [18:15] <adrianba> ...PSIG proposed a draft which was rejected by FSF as not compatible with GPL
  235. # [18:15] <adrianba> ...PSIG went to Director to ask for next steps, a survey was prepared but was withdrawn because of some gaps in the PSIG analysis
  236. # [18:15] <adrianba> ...we're fixing the PSIG document and how it maps to HTML WG use cases
  237. # [18:15] <adrianba> ...after that we'll resubmit the survey
  238. # [18:16] <adrianba> ...don't expect any resolution before TPAC on this
  239. # [18:16] <adrianba> ...suggest check back in one month to make sure progress is being made
  240. # [18:16] <MikeSmith> action-29: plan is to put forward another survey to the W3C membership
  241. # [18:16] * trackbot attempting to add comment notes to ACTION-29.
  242. # [18:16] <trackbot> ACTION-29 Follow up on the idea of a free-software-compatible license for a note on HTML authoring notes added
  243. # [18:16] <adrianba> MikeSmith: should we keep the action?
  244. # [18:16] <MikeSmith> action-29 due 2010-10-09
  245. # [18:16] * trackbot attempting to change due date on ACTION-29.
  246. # [18:16] <trackbot> ACTION-29 Follow up on the idea of a free-software-compatible license for a note on HTML authoring due date now 2010-10-09
  247. # [18:16] <adrianba> plh: keep it open - we'll check back in a month
  248. # [18:16] <adrianba> TOPIC: New Issues This Week
  249. # [18:16] <adrianba> ISSUE-118?
  250. # [18:16] * trackbot getting information on ISSUE-118
  251. # [18:16] <trackbot> ISSUE-118 -- Specification breaks semantics of existing link relations "index" and "first" -- raised
  252. # [18:16] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/118
  253. # [18:16] <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-118 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  254. # [18:17] * Joins: tinkster (tai@81.2.120.180)
  255. # [18:18] * Quits: dsinger_ (dsinger@66.109.103.117) (Ping timeout)
  256. # [18:18] <adrianba> MikeSmith: we don't have any other information on this, do we need to discuss anything on this today?
  257. # [18:18] <adrianba> rubys: no, it's new - if people want to look at it then it is there
  258. # [18:18] * Quits: Dzung_Tran (chatzilla@134.134.139.70) (Ping timeout)
  259. # [18:18] <adrianba> MikeSmith: this is related to an action outside the group related to a registration I submitted on behalf of the group
  260. # [18:19] <adrianba> ...it isn't purely internal - nothing we can do this week - people should follow-up if they have anything to add
  261. # [18:19] <adrianba> TOPIC: Items Closed Last Week
  262. # [18:19] <adrianba> ISSUE-110?
  263. # [18:19] * trackbot getting information on ISSUE-110
  264. # [18:19] <trackbot> ISSUE-110 -- Change Control for text/html-sandboxed media type -- open
  265. # [18:19] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/110
  266. # [18:19] <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-110 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  267. # [18:20] <adrianba> MikeSmith: we have one change proposal here to change the owner to W3C
  268. # [18:20] <adrianba> ...this is closed and it seems like we have resolution on this
  269. # [18:20] <adrianba> TOPIC: Items Closing This week
  270. # [18:20] <adrianba> MikeSmith: None
  271. # [18:20] <adrianba> TOPIC: New Calls for Consensus / Proposals this Week
  272. # [18:20] <adrianba> ISSUE-116?
  273. # [18:21] * trackbot getting information on ISSUE-116
  274. # [18:21] <trackbot> ISSUE-116 -- provide reference and info about HTML5: Techniques for providing useful text alternatives in html5 spec -- open
  275. # [18:21] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/116
  276. # [18:21] <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-116 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  277. # [18:21] * Joins: Dzung_Tran (chatzilla@134.134.139.72)
  278. # [18:21] <oedipus> regrets+ Gregory_Rosmaita
  279. # [18:21] <adrianba> MikeSmith: this is for text alternatives
  280. # [18:21] <adrianba> ...call for consensus closes on Sep 17
  281. # [18:21] <adrianba> ...we have until then to get in comments and have discussion about it
  282. # [18:22] <adrianba> TOPIC: Issue updates
  283. # [18:22] <adrianba> ISSUE-85?
  284. # [18:22] * trackbot getting information on ISSUE-85
  285. # [18:22] <trackbot> ISSUE-85 -- ARIA roles added to the a element should be conforming in HTML5 -- open
  286. # [18:22] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/85
  287. # [18:22] <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-85 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  288. # [18:22] <adrianba> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=10066
  289. # [18:22] <pimpbot> 10066: faulkner.steve@gmail.com, P1, NEW, replace section 3.2.6 with the alternative spec text provided (ARIA)
  290. # [18:23] <adrianba> MikeSmith: i think we have some more updates based on the mail Maciej sent
  291. # [18:23] <MikeSmith> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Sep/0087.html
  292. # [18:23] <pimpbot> Title: ARIA mapping status from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-09-09 (public-html@w3.org from September 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
  293. # [18:23] <MikeSmith> bug 10066
  294. # [18:23] <pimpbot> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=10066 faulkner.steve@gmail.com, P1, NEW, replace section 3.2.6 with the alternative spec text provided (ARIA)
  295. # [18:23] <adrianba> MikeSmith: that is Maciej's summary of the issues related to bug 10066
  296. # [18:24] <adrianba> rubys: this points out who Maciej thinks who owns which bugs
  297. # [18:24] <adrianba> ...i agree with the assessment - if anyone has comments they should speak up
  298. # [18:24] <adrianba> MikeSmith: next is issue 41
  299. # [18:24] <adrianba> ISSUE-41?
  300. # [18:24] * trackbot getting information on ISSUE-41
  301. # [18:24] <trackbot> ISSUE-41 -- Decentralized extensibility -- open
  302. # [18:24] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/41
  303. # [18:24] <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-41 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  304. # [18:24] <adrianba> MikeSmith: few items listed in the agenda
  305. # [18:25] <adrianba> rubys: we have three proposals left from the original 5 or so
  306. # [18:25] <adrianba> ...of those one is fully formed, the other two need updating
  307. # [18:25] <adrianba> ...we have volunteers for one but not the other - if someone would like to do that they should speak up
  308. # [18:25] * Joins: dsinger_ (dsinger@17.244.75.254)
  309. # [18:26] <adrianba> ...if they are not updated then they may fall away (i expect one to be updated)
  310. # [18:26] <adrianba> TOPIC: Last Call Timeline
  311. # [18:26] <adrianba> MikeSmith: hope everyone has seen the significant announcement from Maciej on behalf of the chairs
  312. # [18:26] <rubys> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Sep/0074.html
  313. # [18:26] <pimpbot> Title: Timeline to Last Call from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-09-08 (public-html@w3.org from September 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
  314. # [18:27] <adrianba> ...this is a breakdown of the time line for getting to last call with milestones and consequences for missing the milestones
  315. # [18:27] <adrianba> ...everyone in the group should read and provide feedback
  316. # [18:27] <adrianba> ...first deadline is oct 1 for bugs to be filed
  317. # [18:27] <adrianba> ...to be considered before last call, bugs after this will be treated as last call comments
  318. # [18:28] <adrianba> ...bottom line is if you have bugs you want to file you should get them in now
  319. # [18:28] <adrianba> q+
  320. # [18:28] * Zakim sees adrianba on the speaker queue
  321. # [18:28] <MikeSmith> q?
  322. # [18:28] * Zakim sees adrianba on the speaker queue
  323. # [18:28] * rubys bad echo
  324. # [18:28] <plh> ack ad
  325. # [18:29] * Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
  326. # [18:29] * plh zakim, who is making noise?
  327. # [18:29] * Zakim plh, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: [Microsoft.a] (77%), Judy (49%), Plh (2%), Mike (28%)
  328. # [18:29] <plh> zakim, mute Judy
  329. # [18:29] <Zakim> Judy should now be muted
  330. # [18:30] <adrianba> adrianba: how will we make sure that work is done through the milestones?
  331. # [18:30] <MikeSmith> adrianba: how are the chairs going to make sure that work happens during the time between the milestones instead of everybody waiting until just befor the milestone deadlines?
  332. # [18:30] <paulc> Adrian: How do we spread out the work over each work period so it does not all occur near the end?
  333. # [18:30] <adrianba> rubys: i don't have a specific answer right now - we're working with ian on how bugs will be processed - we also need to focus on other issues too
  334. # [18:30] <paulc> We need feedback from spec Editors on their readiness to accept this timeline:
  335. # [18:30] <paulc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Sep/0094.html
  336. # [18:30] <pimpbot> Title: RE: Timeline to Last Call from Eliot Graff on 2010-09-09 (public-html@w3.org from September 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
  337. # [18:31] <adrianba> MikeSmith: comments and questions to the milestones and time line are welcome on public-html
  338. # [18:31] * plh zakim, who is making noise?
  339. # [18:31] <adrianba> paulc: i'm not sure how many editors of specs we have on
  340. # [18:31] * Zakim plh, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: [HP] (5%), [Microsoft] (44%)
  341. # [18:31] <adrianba> ...we also asked other editors if this was an acceptable time line
  342. # [18:31] <adrianba> ...there is a message from Eliot but we need to follow-up with other editors to see how many specs will follow this plan
  343. # [18:32] <Zakim> + +1.415.595.aacc
  344. # [18:32] <mjs> hi all
  345. # [18:32] * mjs is here now
  346. # [18:32] * oedipus is now known as oedipus_away
  347. # [18:32] <adrianba> MikeSmith: i think part of the point is that the other editors have the opportunity to speak up and say that they want their specs to progress at the same rate
  348. # [18:32] <adrianba> TOPIC: ISSUE-9 media accessibility requirements overview, Janina
  349. # [18:32] <adrianba> ISSUE-9?
  350. # [18:32] * trackbot getting information on ISSUE-9
  351. # [18:32] <trackbot> ISSUE-9 -- how accessibility works for <video> is unclear -- open
  352. # [18:32] <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/9
  353. # [18:32] <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-9 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
  354. # [18:33] <janina> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements
  355. # [18:33] <adrianba> MikeSmith: meant to do this last week but had some technical issues
  356. # [18:33] <pimpbot> Title: Media Accessibility User Requirements - HTML accessibility task force Wiki (at www.w3.org)
  357. # [18:33] <adrianba> Janina: this is the user reqs doc that has come out of the media subteam in the a11y TF
  358. # [18:33] <mjs> Zakim, +1.415.595.aacc is me
  359. # [18:33] <Zakim> +mjs; got it
  360. # [18:33] <rubys> zakim, aacc is mjs
  361. # [18:33] <Zakim> sorry, rubys, I do not recognize a party named 'aacc'
  362. # [18:33] <adrianba> ...this is not an inventory of what is or isn't supported
  363. # [18:33] <adrianba> ...it is what kind of resources and control are needed by people with a11y reqs
  364. # [18:34] <adrianba> ...it is a user requirements not a user agent requirements doc
  365. # [18:34] <MikeSmith> mjs, can you take over on chairing for the remainder of the call?
  366. # [18:34] <MikeSmith> q?
  367. # [18:34] * Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
  368. # [18:34] <mjs> MikeSmith, yes
  369. # [18:34] <adrianba> ...we need to engineer solutions but as was pointed out in a recent conversation we should not assume that the full WG has agreed on thes reqs
  370. # [18:34] <MikeSmith> chair: Maciej
  371. # [18:34] <adrianba> ...so before we get down to engineering solutions it seems prudent to ask the group if we agree that the reqs are accurate
  372. # [18:35] <adrianba> ...if something is missing we need to add it
  373. # [18:35] <adrianba> ...equally if something is here that shouldn't be now is the time to discuss that
  374. # [18:36] <rubys> did we lose janina again?
  375. # [18:36] <paulc> Did we lose Janina?
  376. # [18:36] <Zakim> +[Apple]
  377. # [18:36] <Zakim> -dsinger
  378. # [18:36] * plh zakim, who is on the phone?
  379. # [18:36] * Zakim sees on the phone: Judy (muted), [HP], Sam, Matt_May, [Microsoft], Plh, Mike, Eric_Carlson, Janina, [Microsoft.a], Julian, Laura_Carlson, eliot, Cynthia_Shelly, mjs, [Apple]
  380. # [18:36] * Zakim [Microsoft.a] has adrianba
  381. # [18:36] * Zakim [HP] has dpenkler
  382. # [18:36] * Zakim [Microsoft] has paulc
  383. # [18:37] <plh> zakim, drop Janina
  384. # [18:37] <Zakim> Janina is being disconnected
  385. # [18:37] <MikeSmith> Zakim, drop janina
  386. # [18:37] <dsinger_> Zakim, apple has dsinger
  387. # [18:37] <Zakim> -Janina
  388. # [18:37] <Zakim> sorry, MikeSmith, I do not see a party named 'janina'
  389. # [18:37] <Zakim> +dsinger; got it
  390. # [18:37] <Judy> zakim, unmute me
  391. # [18:37] <Zakim> Judy should no longer be muted
  392. # [18:37] <janina> zakim, call janina
  393. # [18:37] <Zakim> ok, janina; the call is being made
  394. # [18:37] <Zakim> +Janina
  395. # [18:38] * Martijnc- is now known as Martijnc
  396. # [18:38] <adrianba> ...this way when we get to technologies to build with we've agreed on what we need to support
  397. # [18:38] <adrianba> ...section 1 is a crash course on what the different issues are for people and media
  398. # [18:38] <adrianba> ...all the tech requirements are section 2 and 3
  399. # [18:39] <adrianba> ...in section 2, describe video
  400. # [18:39] <adrianba> ...this has been around since the 80s, used in analog and digital broadcast
  401. # [18:39] <adrianba> ...uses the silences to add description by voice of what is happening
  402. # [18:40] <adrianba> ...in section 2.2 you also have the ability to do textual description rather than the expensive addition of a recorded voice
  403. # [18:40] <adrianba> ...2.3 if you can do text and audio you may not need to be limited to the timeframe of original video
  404. # [18:40] <adrianba> ...in education situations you may need more time than is available in pauses or silences
  405. # [18:40] <adrianba> ...which can be supported in a computer environment in a way that couldn't be done in traditional broadcast
  406. # [18:41] <adrianba> ...concept of extended time where you pause and restart to allow a longer description
  407. # [18:41] <adrianba> ...2.4 concept implemented primarily in the UK - clear audio - for people losing their hearing
  408. # [18:42] <adrianba> ...probably only used in a professional situation - create an additional audio track with most of the incidental sounds removed
  409. # [18:42] <adrianba> ...only main sounds like speech remain - people can use their remaining hearing more effectively
  410. # [18:42] <adrianba> ...removing less essential sounds improves recognition
  411. # [18:43] <adrianba> ...being done with digital broadcasting at least in the uk
  412. # [18:43] <adrianba> 2.5 comes from electronic book publishing - make content available for people who can't read a book
  413. # [18:44] <adrianba> janina: the idea is that if you can map the DOM structure to next / previous you make it more accessible
  414. # [18:44] <adrianba> ...getting the balance between all and only high-level is hard
  415. # [18:44] <adrianba> ...in real time you could adjust the level of detail
  416. # [18:44] <adrianba> ...moving forward to captioning - it is the word most often thought of as making video accessible
  417. # [18:45] <adrianba> ...also can be used in a noisy environment so most familiar
  418. # [18:45] <adrianba> ...very close to subtitles but not the same
  419. # [18:45] <adrianba> ...important events may also be mentioned in captioning
  420. # [18:45] <adrianba> ...traditionally from broadcast but because this is computer mediated we can support additional capabilities
  421. # [18:46] <adrianba> ...2.8 sign language translation - oldest that predates something electronic
  422. # [18:46] <adrianba> ...often prefer whatever is happening signed for them
  423. # [18:46] <adrianba> ...but for people who became deaf later in life learning a new language is harder
  424. # [18:46] <adrianba> ...also different locales have different signing
  425. # [18:47] <adrianba> ...so we've had text tracks, additional audio tracks, etc.
  426. # [18:47] <adrianba> ...these need to be in sync and are not always the same length
  427. # [18:47] <adrianba> ...2.9 sometimes only having a transcript is useful
  428. # [18:48] <adrianba> ...section 3 - we need controls that are device independent so that what ever device is connected can stop/start/forward/rewind/etc
  429. # [18:48] <adrianba> ...real time ability to control the dom depth of next/previous
  430. # [18:48] <adrianba> ...3.3 fortunately this is in the spec already - need to be able to speed up or slow down
  431. # [18:49] <adrianba> ...great that this is already in spec - is required
  432. # [18:49] <adrianba> ...3.4 most of this is not new - older than the web itself
  433. # [18:49] <adrianba> ...generally going to be in authoring guidance
  434. # [18:49] <adrianba> ...discovery and activation important - need to be able to choose what is available
  435. # [18:50] <adrianba> ...3.6 what kinds of properties need to be available
  436. # [18:50] <adrianba> ...3.7 need to be able to control placement on screen and some of the styling needs to be under user control
  437. # [18:50] <adrianba> ...3.8 the need to be able to control which output device audio is pointed at - various reasons why you want the described video audio to go to a different device than the primary resource
  438. # [18:51] <adrianba> ...that's the walkthough - any questions?
  439. # [18:51] <adrianba> mjs: thanks for covering all that, any questions or comments?
  440. # [18:51] <MikeSmith> q?
  441. # [18:51] * Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
  442. # [18:51] <adrianba> ...i hope everyone takes a closer look at the document and reviews and follows up on the mailing list
  443. # [18:51] <Judy> q+
  444. # [18:51] * Zakim sees Judy on the speaker queue
  445. # [18:52] <adrianba> ...would be good to have discussion of the document
  446. # [18:52] <mjs> ack Judy
  447. # [18:52] * Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
  448. # [18:52] <adrianba> judy: janina, we had talked about mentioning some of the next steps in the media sub-team - could you outline those so people know what to expect?
  449. # [18:52] <adrianba> ...also wanted to mention that if people are interested they are welcome to join
  450. # [18:52] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img" <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0414.html> ** [Bug 9817] Details element Focus problem <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0413.html> ** [Bug 10066] replace section 3.2.6 with the alternative spec text provided (ARIA) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0412.html>
  451. # [18:52] <adrianba> janina: i can provide a pointer here
  452. # [18:52] <janina> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Media_Accessibility_Checklist
  453. # [18:52] <pimpbot> Title: Media Accessibility Checklist - HTML accessibility task force Wiki (at www.w3.org)
  454. # [18:53] <adrianba> janina: this is what we are currently focusing on - if you look at the table we are mapping the user requirements into the types of technology to support them
  455. # [18:53] <adrianba> ...from that we expect to prioritise on which technologies still need attention
  456. # [18:54] <adrianba> ...that's what the MUST, SHOULD, MAY is for - they start as MUST but probably don't all stay that way
  457. # [18:54] <adrianba> ...next we look at different technologies (e.g. TTML or WebSRT) to see what capabilities there are and what might be missing
  458. # [18:54] <adrianba> ...can we use existing things - they may be almost everything there already
  459. # [18:54] <adrianba> mjs: thanks, any other questions?
  460. # [18:55] <adrianba> TOPIC: Other business
  461. # [18:55] <adrianba> mjs: Julian sent an item ahead of time
  462. # [18:55] <plh> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=10399
  463. # [18:55] <pimpbot> 10399: julian.reschke@gmx.de, P2, RESOLVED INVALID, base64 def in algorithm for put to data URI
  464. # [18:55] * plh zakim, who is on the phone?
  465. # [18:55] * Zakim sees on the phone: Judy, [HP], Sam, Matt_May, [Microsoft], Plh, Mike, Eric_Carlson, Janina, [Microsoft.a], Julian, Laura_Carlson, eliot, Cynthia_Shelly, mjs, [Apple]
  466. # [18:55] * Zakim [Microsoft.a] has adrianba
  467. # [18:55] * Zakim [HP] has dpenkler
  468. # [18:55] * Zakim [Microsoft] has paulc
  469. # [18:55] * Zakim [Apple] has dsinger
  470. # [18:55] * plh Julian?
  471. # [18:55] * plh we can't hear you if you speak
  472. # [18:56] <adrianba> julian: this issue i raised an small editorial issue - it seems the editor agrees with the issue but chose not to fix because he doesn't agree with the way i raised the issue
  473. # [18:56] <adrianba> ...i'm not sure how to proceed
  474. # [18:56] <adrianba> ...perhaps someone else can pick this up?
  475. # [18:57] <adrianba> mjs: i haven't had chance to study this - it looks like two different mutually exclusive changes
  476. # [18:57] <adrianba> ...the editor took this as two issues and rejected the first
  477. # [18:57] <adrianba> ...i would be happy to take this on and see what i can do to move this forward
  478. # [18:57] <adrianba> ...i will contact you offline if i have any questions
  479. # [18:57] <adrianba> mjs: any other business or comments on this item?
  480. # [18:58] <adrianba> TOPIC: Scribe for next meeting
  481. # [18:58] <adrianba> mjs: volunteers?
  482. # [18:58] <adrianba> ...next week sam is chairing
  483. # [18:58] <adrianba> ...i will volunteer to scribe
  484. # [18:58] <adrianba> TOPIC: Adjournment
  485. # [18:58] <adrianba> mjs: see you all next week
  486. # [18:58] <Zakim> -Matt_May
  487. # [18:58] <MikeSmith> Mike, drop Mike
  488. # [18:58] <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
  489. # [18:58] <Zakim> -Eric_Carlson
  490. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Janina
  491. # [18:59] <Zakim> -mjs
  492. # [18:59] * Quits: dpenkler (qw3birc@128.30.52.28) (Quit: Page closed)
  493. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Julian
  494. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Plh
  495. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Sam
  496. # [18:59] * Parts: janina (janina@66.92.170.178)
  497. # [18:59] <Zakim> -[HP]
  498. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Judy
  499. # [18:59] <Zakim> -eliot
  500. # [18:59] <Zakim> -[Apple]
  501. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Laura_Carlson
  502. # [18:59] <adrianba> rrsagent, make minutes
  503. # [18:59] <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/09-html-wg-minutes.html adrianba
  504. # [18:59] <Zakim> -[Microsoft.a]
  505. # [18:59] * Quits: eliot (eliot@72.11.66.122) (Quit: Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm)
  506. # [18:59] <adrianba> rrsagent, make logs public
  507. # [18:59] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, adrianba
  508. # [18:59] <Zakim> -Mike
  509. # [19:00] * Quits: Dzung_Tran (chatzilla@134.134.139.72) (Ping timeout)
  510. # [19:00] <Zakim> -[Microsoft]
  511. # [19:01] <Zakim> HTML_WG()12:00PM has ended
  512. # [19:01] * Quits: Laura (lauracarls@131.212.98.217) (Quit: Laura)
  513. # [19:01] <Zakim> Attendees were Judy, dsinger, Sam, Matt_May, paulc, Plh, dpenkler, Mike, Janina, Eric_Carlson, [Microsoft], adrianba, Julian, Laura_Carlson, eliot, Cynthia_Shelly, mjs
  514. # [19:01] <adrianba> rrsagent, make minutes
  515. # [19:01] <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/09-html-wg-minutes.html adrianba
  516. # [19:01] <pimpbot> Title: HTML Weekly Teleconference -- 09 Sep 2010 (at www.w3.org)
  517. # [19:02] * Quits: dsinger_ (dsinger@17.244.75.254) (Quit: Rooms • iPhone IRC Client • http://www.roomsapp.mobi)
  518. # [19:03] * Quits: adrianba (adrianba@131.107.0.103) (Quit: Bye!)
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  532. # [20:23] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 10481] Default role of <IMG> should be "img"" (2 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0415.html>
  533. # [20:24] * Parts: eric_carlson (eric_carls@17.203.15.26)
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  538. # [20:50] * Quits: tinkster (tai@81.2.120.180) (Ping timeout)
  539. # [20:53] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 9817] Details element Focus problem <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0416.html>
  540. # [20:55] * Zakim excuses himself; his presence no longer seems to be needed
  541. # [20:55] * Parts: Zakim (rrs-bridgg@128.30.52.169)
  542. # [21:12] * Parts: Judy (jbrewer@128.30.52.169)
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  544. # [21:23] * Parts: rubys (rubys@98.27.59.221)
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  550. # [21:59] * MikeSmith_ is now known as MikeSmith
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  554. # [22:53] <pimpbot> bugmail: "[Bug 10591] conflicting info for table element in aria section" (2 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0421.html> ** [Bug 10066] replace section 3.2.6 with the alternative spec text provided (ARIA) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0419.html> ** [Bug 10591] conflicting info for table element in aria section <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public
  555. # [23:14] * Joins: karl (karlcow@128.30.54.58)
  556. # [23:24] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10493] "ARIA restricts usage of this role to one per page" is an unclear statement <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0431.html> ** [Bug 10465] provide correct aria mapping and role info for the table element <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0430.html> ** "[Bug 10593] thead, tfoot and tbody conflicts in aria section" (2 messages in thread) <http://lists.w3.org/Arc
  557. # [23:52] * Joins: shepazu (schepers@128.30.52.169)
  558. # [23:54] <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10594] conforming use of various aria attributes not specified <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0434.html> ** [Bug 10066] replace section 3.2.6 with the alternative spec text provided (ARIA) <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Sep/0433.html> ** [Bug 10594] New: conforming use of various aria attributes not specified <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugz
  559. # Session Close: Fri Sep 10 00:00:00 2010

The end :)