/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2010-12-20 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Mon Dec 20 00:00:00 2010
  2. # Session Ident: #html5
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  9. # [00:44] <norbert_> anyone around with knowledge about embedding html5 video?
  10. # [00:44] <norbert_> ogv
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  13. # [01:04] <paul_irish> ?ask @ norbert_
  14. # [01:04] <bot-t> norbert_, If you have a question, please just ask it. Don't look for topic experts. Don't ask to ask. Don't PM! Don't ask if people are awake, or in the mood to help. Just ask the question straight out. http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
  15. # [01:05] <norbert_> I'm checking out a website with Firefox 4.0b7 and the page is supposed to show a video, but it's showing an "X" instead of the video; I can right click and pick "View Video" but then an external player starts
  16. # [01:05] <norbert_> webpage in question is http://www.html5-games.org/
  17. # [01:05] <norbert_> the code is: <video src="games/0000001/0000001.ogv" width="240" height="160" controls preload="meta" type='video/ogg; codecs="theora, vorbis"'></video>
  18. # [01:05] <norbert_> it's an ogv file, so the type appears to be correct (video/ogg)
  19. # [01:05] <norbert_> also, this code works on localhost
  20. # [01:07] <norbert_> hm... maybe I need to ask the content provider to set the proper MIME type?
  21. # [01:07] <norbert_> AddType video/ogg .ogv
  22. # [01:07] <norbert_> yeah, that's probably it
  23. # [01:09] <norbert_> sweet success, it works
  24. # [01:09] <norbert_> added that to the .htaccess
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  26. # [01:10] * norbert_ is happy
  27. # [01:15] <paul_irish> sweeeet
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  29. # [01:15] <paul_irish> fuck
  30. # [01:15] <paul_irish> fuck
  31. # [01:15] <paul_irish> ugh damn it.
  32. # [01:15] <l4rk> :O
  33. # [01:16] <paul_irish> i memoserv'd him. hopefully he gets it
  34. # [01:16] <paul_irish> probably not
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  244. # [18:34] <tw2113> good day all
  245. # [18:35] * Joins: miketaylr (~miketaylr@174-152-11-64.pools.spcsdns.net)
  246. # [18:36] <cardona507> top of tha mornin
  247. # [18:38] <paul_irish> hai
  248. # [18:38] <tw2113> sup gangstas?
  249. # [18:38] * cardona507 flashes HTML5 gang sign
  250. # [18:38] <cardona507> sup
  251. # [18:38] <miketaylr> SO IS HTML5 DONE YET?
  252. # [18:39] <cardona507> :p
  253. # [18:39] <tw2113> i heard IE15 will support it completely
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  255. # [18:43] <miketaylr> cool. i'll just wait here until that's out.
  256. # [18:44] <tw2113> eh, why bother. just wait for the rest of them to support them 10x faster
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  258. # [18:50] <danielfilho> miketaylr: it
  259. # [18:50] <danielfilho> ops
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  261. # [18:50] <miketaylr> :P
  262. # [18:50] <danielfilho> miketaylr: it's almost done. just a few hours and it will be baked properly.
  263. # [18:50] <miketaylr> woooo \o/
  264. # [18:50] <danielfilho> :D
  265. # [18:50] <danielfilho> dude.
  266. # [18:50] <danielfilho> I envy all you outside Brazil.
  267. # [18:51] <danielfilho> if you drop an egg on the street, it will get fried in 2 seconds.
  268. # [18:51] <miketaylr> heh, it might freeze here in NYC
  269. # [18:52] <danielfilho> NYC. this are the most wonderful combination of letters.
  270. # [18:52] <Ms2ger> danielfilho, then I envy you!
  271. # [18:52] <danielfilho> I hope to be there next september.
  272. # [18:52] <miketaylr> sweet
  273. # [18:52] <danielfilho> Ms2ger: don't say it. for real.
  274. # [18:52] <danielfilho> I'm a fat, furry and beard guy. I'm suffering. I'm in pain with this sun.
  275. # [18:52] <danielfilho> And don't even think that Brazil == Rio de Janeiro. Because it is not.
  276. # [18:54] <miketaylr> yeah, i lived in teresina for a bit...that was hot
  277. # [18:54] <danielfilho> and we pay little fortunes for x360 and ps3 games. and we have the most expensive macbooks, ipods, ipads and iphones in the whole world.
  278. # [18:54] <danielfilho> hahaha. ok. I'll stop now.
  279. # [18:54] <danielfilho> just wanted to share.
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  281. # [18:55] <tw2113> any of you know of a good site that lists what browsers accept input[type=foo] css arguements?
  282. # [18:56] <danielfilho> caniuse.com ?
  283. # [18:56] <danielfilho> I'm not sure
  284. # [18:56] <miketaylr> ie7+, and the rest?
  285. # [18:57] <miketaylr> or do you want like specific versions of when each browser supported attribute selectors?
  286. # [18:57] <paul_irish> tw2113: ie7+ webdevout has a table somewhere with ^
  287. # [18:57] <tw2113> just mostly curious about the earliest versions that would stop with type=submit
  288. # [18:58] <tw2113> sounds like pretty solid support, and fuck IE6
  289. # [18:58] <cardona507> indeed
  290. # [18:58] <tw2113> they can get bare submit buttons
  291. # [18:58] <tw2113> i'll just have to use .nocssgradients for the ones that lack gradient support :D
  292. # [18:58] <miketaylr> i seem to recall that ie7 chokes on [foo=bar] but not elm[foo=bar]
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  295. # [18:59] <tw2113> i've done input[foo=bar] on all my instances, so it's all good
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  316. # [19:25] <piklu> [ I need a web UI guy, jquery + css for a project, If you have time I offer share in the entire thing. I am ready to tell idea if u message ]
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  319. # [19:35] <paul_irish> http://paulirish.com/2010/lazyweb-requests/ everything look good to you guys
  320. # [19:35] <paul_irish> ?
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  328. # [19:49] <paul_irish> tweetedd
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  331. # [19:56] <cardona507> paul_irish: awesome
  332. # [19:56] <cardona507> retweeted
  333. # [19:56] <paul_irish> thxthx
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  353. # [20:22] * Joins: cheilmann (~cheilmann@nat/mozilla/x-totarmzfhbfbvfgp)
  354. # [20:23] <cheilmann> A call for good markup in html5 demos: http://hacks.mozilla.org/2010/12/a-call-for-quality-html5-demo-markup/
  355. # [20:24] * Joins: obert- (~obert@host22-142-dynamic.53-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
  356. # [20:25] <tw2113> still fighting the airlines cheilmann ?
  357. # [20:25] <cheilmann> waiting for my flight tonight
  358. # [20:25] <cheilmann> gave up
  359. # [20:25] <cheilmann> :)
  360. # [20:26] * Joins: BBonifield (~bob@wsip-24-248-161-239.ks.ok.cox.net)
  361. # [20:26] <paul_irish> cheilmann: gotta say. a markup rant seems really out of place on there.
  362. # [20:26] * Joins: vladikoff (~vladikoff@bas1-woodbridge98-2925278655.dsl.bell.ca)
  363. # [20:27] <paul_irish> i mean.. some people have bad markup. it's a fact.
  364. # [20:28] <obert-> i got wicked markup
  365. # [20:28] <paul_irish> the fact that bad markup ends up in html5 demos, blog themes and the google homepage is sorta a fact of life.
  366. # [20:28] <piklu> We have less people @ html5. hmm, not so popular still ?
  367. # [20:29] <tw2113> i tend to promote the doctype whenever i see someone talking about them in #wordpress and #css
  368. # [20:29] <obert-> html5 isnt supported a lot
  369. # [20:29] <l4rk> its not???
  370. # [20:30] <obert-> i doubt
  371. # [20:30] <tw2113> the doctype, as far as i know, breaks nothing
  372. # [20:30] <paul_irish> he sounds like an expert, l4rk
  373. # [20:30] <piklu> obert- sadly, whenever google comes up with fancy html 5 effects a lot of people with IE and Win still dnt see them
  374. # [20:30] <tw2113> every day more and more html5 support is built into development versions of browses
  375. # [20:30] <paul_irish> tw2113: it was designed around that constraint.
  376. # [20:30] * Joins: rwaldron (~rwaldron_@64.119.153.2)
  377. # [20:30] <tw2113> well boo hoo @ the IE users
  378. # [20:30] <piklu> they still are the major division of people
  379. # [20:30] <obert-> ?
  380. # [20:31] <l4rk> think of the children!
  381. # [20:31] * Joins: frozenicce (~deppo@ip-178-202-181-44.unitymediagroup.de)
  382. # [20:31] <l4rk> piklu: http://dowebsitesneedtolookexactlythesameineverybrowser.com/
  383. # [20:31] <tw2113> if they're in a work environment forcing IE6 down their throat...they shouldn't be at our fancy html5 demo pages anyway
  384. # [20:31] <miketaylr> hi rwaldron
  385. # [20:31] <tw2113> instead...actually working
  386. # [20:31] <obert-> depends what you want to archieve perhaps
  387. # [20:31] <tw2113> if they have IE6 at home on computers they control...then they're just nuts
  388. # [20:31] * Joins: unruthless (~unruthles@166.205.140.210)
  389. # [20:31] <rwaldron> hey miketaylr <3
  390. # [20:31] <rwaldron> and ajpiano <3
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  392. # [20:32] <rwaldron> and unruthless <3
  393. # [20:32] <matjas> hey rwaldron ♥
  394. # [20:32] <ajpiano> <3
  395. # [20:32] * matjas wants some lovin’ too
  396. # [20:32] <rwaldron> ok, the list is getting ridic.
  397. # [20:32] <tw2113> <3 everyone <3
  398. # [20:32] <rwaldron> <3 to all my peeps
  399. # [20:32] <piklu> l4rk: the point of saying is html5 is still not being supported by IE, the leader as of yet
  400. # [20:32] <unruthless> ♥ all around
  401. # [20:32] <l4rk> IE is the leader?
  402. # [20:32] <tw2113> IE9 is starting to
  403. # [20:32] <l4rk> Not in my plane of existance
  404. # [20:32] <obert-> i think that if there are ie6 users it is a problem with devs, not a thing to be changed by them
  405. # [20:32] <piklu> l4rk: talking of volume of users that use
  406. # [20:32] <paul_irish> piklu: there is no "is not supported" when you talk about "html5"
  407. # [20:32] <miketaylr> not in the CIS states :)
  408. # [20:32] <l4rk> piklu: Maybe on your sites, stuff we make IE is def not a majority
  409. # [20:33] <cheilmann> paul_irish: it is not an unfortunate event - it is bad practice. Having code that is totally against the ideas you try to promote in a demo is like having a school textbook full of typos
  410. # [20:33] <l4rk> Blanket statistics aren't really applicable
  411. # [20:33] <tw2113> isn't that the case anyway cheilmann ?
  412. # [20:33] <tw2113> textbooks with typos? i am sure i had some
  413. # [20:33] <piklu> paul_irish: as I knew some months back HTML 5 is still not yet officially out ? it has not been finalized
  414. # [20:33] <cheilmann> the concept of DEMO is demonstrating, not hacking together
  415. # [20:33] <paul_irish> cheilmann: are your demos textbook quality markup?
  416. # [20:33] <cheilmann> mine are
  417. # [20:33] <tw2113> piklu, is html4 a finalized thing?
  418. # [20:33] <cheilmann> haven't quite looked at our official ones
  419. # [20:34] <matjas> piklu: CSS 2.1 isn’t fully supported across browsers either, but that doesn’t stop you from using it either.
  420. # [20:34] <obert-> a demo like class class instead class Class would be dangerous:)
  421. # [20:34] <cheilmann> it also doesn't matter - there is simply no excuse for <span onmouseout="buttonOut(2)" onmouseover="buttonOver(2)"
  422. # [20:34] <cheilmann> onclick="buttonClicked(2)" id="button2" class="button">
  423. # [20:34] <cheilmann> <img alt="" src="image/button/2.png">
  424. # [20:34] <cheilmann> </span>
  425. # [20:34] <piklu> @everyone struggling with HTML 5 :: HTML5 is the next major revision of the HTML standard, currently under development.
  426. # [20:34] <matjas> piklu: graceful degradation and progressive enhancement FTW. HTML5 is built around these principles. If you know how to use them, you can absolutely start using HTML5 today.
  427. # [20:34] <ajpiano> but there wasn't an excuse for that before HTML5 either, cheilmann
  428. # [20:35] <Ms2ger> ajpiano, no, he isn't saying that
  429. # [20:35] <cheilmann> ajpiano: that is exactly the point
  430. # [20:35] <obert-> html4 is the future
  431. # [20:35] <piklu> It is not about using it, I am simply asking why do not IE is getting involved ?
  432. # [20:35] <cheilmann> HTML5 is a reboot - we say we want to make everything better and then we show bad code
  433. # [20:35] <cheilmann> that doesn't make sense.
  434. # [20:35] <miketaylr> piklu: they are invovled
  435. # [20:35] <ajpiano> who is "we"
  436. # [20:35] <Ms2ger> HTML 3.2 is the future, based on some sites I see
  437. # [20:35] <matjas> piklu: IE is getting involved, cfr. IE9
  438. # [20:35] <ajpiano> there are always going to be lots of people making shitty demos,
  439. # [20:35] <matjas> Ms2ger: OMG NOOB XHTML2 FTW
  440. # [20:35] <obert-> 4 strict:P
  441. # [20:35] <ajpiano> and writing shitty code
  442. # [20:35] <tw2113> Microsoft is just majorly dragging its feet
  443. # [20:36] <tw2113> they are finally kicking it into gear as they realize there is competition again
  444. # [20:36] <tw2113> and they ARE losing market share
  445. # [20:36] * Joins: bryan (~Bryan@207.239.55.162)
  446. # [20:36] <miketaylr> not a demo, but the markup on this site is the TOPS: http://www.elazigaskf.com/
  447. # [20:37] <obert-> later:)
  448. # [20:37] <piklu> http://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php
  449. # [20:37] * bryan is now known as Guest69357
  450. # [20:37] <tw2113> if i had to request anything from this current "browser war" it's that we don't repeat what happened at the turn of the millenium
  451. # [20:37] <cheilmann> paul_irish: believe me, a rant from me would sound different.
  452. # [20:37] * Quits: bryanmig (~Bryan@207.239.55.162) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  453. # [20:37] <paul_irish> what?
  454. # [20:37] <piklu> IE 6 and IE 8 comes with their OS, and if they dnt support major category is not with us
  455. # [20:37] <paul_irish> that's exactly what this is
  456. # [20:37] <cheilmann> It must be noticed though that 20things had great markup - same way canvasrider had
  457. # [20:37] <miketaylr> 2% woo
  458. # [20:37] <obert-> if the devs got to guarantee that the app is cross-browser, it is a pain
  459. # [20:38] <paul_irish> want some recommendations for your indiana jones demo?
  460. # [20:38] <cheilmann> sure
  461. # [20:38] <ajpiano> do you have any links to these "bad html5 demos"
  462. # [20:38] <piklu> obert- Supporting you, It is sometimes 4x the effort of developing single page
  463. # [20:38] <paul_irish> use <meta charset=utf-8> instead of that http-equiv shite
  464. # [20:38] <paul_irish> you dont need type attributes on link/style/script elements
  465. # [20:38] * Joins: nimbupani (~Adium@c-24-22-131-46.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  466. # [20:38] <obert-> you couldnt write 'it no works on ie6 but yes in 8 and a bit in 9
  467. # [20:38] <l4rk> obert-: cross browser is fine, it needs to *work* not *look* the same
  468. # [20:38] <paul_irish> you *need* to display:block your html5 sectioning tags like header/footer
  469. # [20:39] <obert-> bah loop:) later
  470. # [20:39] <tw2113> stop catering to the IE6 people :)
  471. # [20:39] <obert-> yeah i know ( http://jsbin something)
  472. # [20:39] <piklu> obert- I will use HTML5 to display my effect on mozilla and than I would have to hire flash developer for the rest of web
  473. # [20:39] <paul_irish> and proper crossbrowser css transforms and box-shadows would be appreciated.
  474. # [20:39] <piklu> lol
  475. # [20:39] <cheilmann> ajpiano: check http://bomomo.com/ - that is the one with the 20 mystery buttons with inline event hand;ers
  476. # [20:40] <obert-> eh box-shadow..all those stuff..mah
  477. # [20:40] <ajpiano> cheilmann, yeah, i agree, all those inline event handlers suck
  478. # [20:40] <paul_irish> cheilmann: i'd much rather see a guy who is capable of making bomomo ship it to the public than hold it back for a while to correct some trivially fixable markup issues.
  479. # [20:41] <ajpiano> also, "people doing a crappy job, don't do a crappy job"
  480. # [20:41] <ajpiano> is just like, obvious advice
  481. # [20:41] <ajpiano> i think :)
  482. # [20:41] <cheilmann> well, if that were the obvious, why do these things keep cropping up?
  483. # [20:42] <ajpiano> because everyone is at different stages of the web development journey
  484. # [20:42] <tw2113> call people out on twitter who do shit markup
  485. # [20:42] <ajpiano> what's old hat to some is news to others
  486. # [20:42] <tw2113> and i mean so shit that dirt is cleaner
  487. # [20:43] * Quits: Wooboy (~simon@host-85-201-4-66.brutele.be) (Quit: Quitte)
  488. # [20:43] <tw2113> sorry for killing the chat with my muckmouth
  489. # [20:44] * Joins: Wooboy (~simon@host-85-201-4-66.brutele.be)
  490. # [20:45] <cheilmann> ajpiano: EXACTLY - so do you want a newbie to come in, see a cool HTML5 demo, look at source and copy and paste really bad ideas?
  491. # [20:45] <paul_irish> cheilmann: do you think an inline event handler is a worse offense than an @import css statement?
  492. # [20:45] * Joins: mokush (~quassel@188.24.42.76)
  493. # [20:45] <cheilmann> yes, as it means when your JS changes you need to change every HTML document with an inline event.
  494. # [20:46] <miketaylr> seeing as how they're both specced standards...
  495. # [20:46] <miketaylr> might not be best-practice, but there's nothing wrong with either
  496. # [20:47] <cheilmann> paul_irish: thanks for the input - fixed the things you told me.
  497. # [20:47] <ajpiano> cheilmann, no, of course not, but my point is like, telling people with bad ideas, hey your ideas are bad, use less bad ideas
  498. # [20:47] <ajpiano> and don't do things if you know they're wrong,
  499. # [20:47] * tw2113 did inline styles once for a rotating image thing for a featured post
  500. # [20:47] <paul_irish> cheilmann: i'd also kill the inclusion of http://code.google.com/apis/maps/documentation/javascript/examples/default.css and just inline its contents
  501. # [20:47] <ajpiano> just strikes me as kind of obvs
  502. # [20:47] <cheilmann> that is not what this post said - it pointed out that the things can be nav lists, menus and buttons
  503. # [20:47] <rwaldron> did i hear
  504. # [20:47] <tw2113> i forget why, but i ended up needing to do it that way
  505. # [20:47] <rwaldron> inline events?
  506. # [20:47] <rwaldron> >:|
  507. # [20:48] <cheilmann> I also didn't say "look at XYZ, that is shit"
  508. # [20:48] <miketaylr> hahah rwaldron
  509. # [20:48] <rwaldron> i say it all the time
  510. # [20:48] * Joins: snover (~Adium@c-75-73-43-136.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
  511. # [20:48] * Quits: snover (~Adium@c-75-73-43-136.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Changing host)
  512. # [20:48] * Joins: snover (~Adium@unaffiliated/snover)
  513. # [20:48] <cheilmann> which would have been a rant
  514. # [20:48] <rwaldron> "look at XYZ, that is shit"
  515. # [20:48] * tw2113 just inline evented himself
  516. # [20:48] <rwaldron> thats like... my motto
  517. # [20:48] <cheilmann> paul_irish: funnily enough all that was a copy of the official HTML5 demo of google maps
  518. # [20:49] <cheilmann> which also has a body onload="" in it
  519. # [20:49] * Joins: dguttman (~dguttman@ip64-75-230-140.aloha.net)
  520. # [20:49] <cheilmann> and the meta issue
  521. # [20:50] <paul_irish> view-source:http://code.google.com/apis/maps/documentation/javascript/examples/map-simple.html this is true.
  522. # [20:50] * Quits: SlexAxton (~SlexAxton@cpe-70-112-201-108.austin.res.rr.com) (Quit: Leaving...)
  523. # [20:50] * tw2113 makes everyone else wikileak themselves
  524. # [20:51] <cheilmann> http://code.google.com/apis/maps/documentation/javascript/tutorial.html
  525. # [20:53] <rwaldron> paul_irish, cheilmann to be fair - I'm often really discouraged by the quality of the code examples on both MDN and the Google API sites...
  526. # [20:53] <rwaldron> (hence my quest to rewrite all the MDN stuff that sucks)
  527. # [20:53] <rwaldron> /end 2 cents
  528. # [20:54] <rwaldron> cheilmann, in this: http://hacks.mozilla.org/2010/12/spirit-of-indiana-jones-syncing-html5-video-with-maps/
  529. # [20:55] <rwaldron> is there a programmatic reason for leaking variables?
  530. # [20:55] <rwaldron> `hidden` is never declared
  531. # [20:55] <rwaldron> but its assigned
  532. # [20:55] <rwaldron> (that i can seein your examples)
  533. # [20:56] * Quits: Wooboy (~simon@host-85-201-4-66.brutele.be) (Quit: Quitte)
  534. # [20:56] <l4rk> rwaldron: as much as jslint pisses me off, i think good demo code should pass it
  535. # [20:56] <l4rk> even if to just curb stuff like leaked vars ^^
  536. # [20:57] <rwaldron> so, in the actual demo page - this isnt happening
  537. # [20:57] <rwaldron> thats awesome
  538. # [20:57] <paul_irish> ill try to get maps thing fixed. code.google is slowly adding a Feedback link for every page so you can report this shit
  539. # [20:57] <rwaldron> but the embedded examples are different from whats actually being used
  540. # [20:57] <rwaldron> paul_irish, thats super awesome
  541. # [20:58] <ajpiano> it's just like, the internet is always going to be full of a bajillion examples of a gorillion different techniques
  542. # [20:58] <ajpiano> there will inevitably be mistakes
  543. # [20:59] <rwaldron> just kidding, cheilmann your demo leaks the `but` variable
  544. # [20:59] <ajpiano> "make less mistakes" is not advice, it is the struggle of humanity
  545. # [20:59] * Quits: obert- (~obert@host22-142-dynamic.53-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  546. # [20:59] <rwaldron> which is funny.
  547. # [20:59] <rwaldron> right?
  548. # [20:59] <rwaldron> everything but the but
  549. # [20:59] * Joins: wizL (~radiator@93-103-192-160.dynamic.t-2.net)
  550. # [20:59] * tw2113 is surprised by the dominance of Opera for mobile browsing
  551. # [21:00] <tw2113> http://www.alistapart.com/articles/smartphone-browser-landscape/
  552. # [21:00] <cardona507> opera mini ftw
  553. # [21:00] <tw2113> i recently upgraded to opera mobile after molly holzschlag clued me in
  554. # [21:01] <miketaylr> i actually use mini more than mobile on my EVO
  555. # [21:01] <paul_irish> same.
  556. # [21:01] <miketaylr> speed > features
  557. # [21:02] <paul_irish> mini rocks for low bandwidth consumption when traveling
  558. # [21:02] <tw2113> speed is a big issue with fennec on my droid
  559. # [21:02] <tw2113> i almost hate opening that one
  560. # [21:02] <cardona507> fennec is ok on my evo but I like the stock browser better
  561. # [21:02] <cardona507> i love how it wraps texts as you zoom
  562. # [21:02] <miketaylr> yeah i had to uninstall it...i don't think i ever got it to load a page
  563. # [21:03] * Quits: cardona507 (~cardona50@cpe-98-150-147-252.hawaii.res.rr.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  564. # [21:03] * Joins: cardona507 (~cardona50@cpe-98-150-147-252.hawaii.res.rr.com)
  565. # [21:03] <tw2113> maybe future updates will help, until then, i won't bother with it much
  566. # [21:03] * tw2113 reinstalls mini just cause
  567. # [21:04] * Joins: obert- (~obert@host22-142-dynamic.53-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
  568. # [21:04] * Quits: nohk (~nohk@e180099233.adsl.alicedsl.de) (Quit: nohk)
  569. # [21:05] * Quits: cardona507 (~cardona50@cpe-98-150-147-252.hawaii.res.rr.com) (Client Quit)
  570. # [21:05] * Joins: cardona507 (~cardona50@cpe-98-150-147-252.hawaii.res.rr.com)
  571. # [21:06] <cheilmann> just had an interview with a guy from mozilla Taiwan
  572. # [21:06] <cheilmann> he works on ebooks for traditional mandarin
  573. # [21:06] <tw2113> cool
  574. # [21:06] <cheilmann> I had to do right to left bidi before but never top top bottom
  575. # [21:06] <cheilmann> pagination would be fin
  576. # [21:06] <cheilmann> fun
  577. # [21:08] <tw2113> that alistapart article explains why Opera mini manages to work so fast
  578. # [21:09] <rwaldron> cheilmann, see my comments above, re: your code examples
  579. # [21:10] <rwaldron> nothing big, just some leaky undeclared variables
  580. # [21:10] <cheilmann> yeah just declared them
  581. # [21:10] <cheilmann> uploading now
  582. # [21:10] <rwaldron> rad
  583. # [21:10] <cheilmann> the hidden is such a dirty hack :)
  584. # [21:10] <miketaylr> tw2113: here's a more indepth article: http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/opera-binary-markup-language/
  585. # [21:10] * Joins: Mussious (~kamil@dfq71.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
  586. # [21:11] * tw2113 evernotes it
  587. # [21:11] <tw2113> i should probably get back into work mode soon
  588. # [21:12] * Quits: jetienne (~jerome@ivr94-6-82-230-255-246.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  589. # [21:12] * Joins: davidwalsh (~davidwals@75-135-74-55.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
  590. # [21:13] * Joins: expilicious (~zAyghip8@cpc2-ely02-0-0-cust338.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com)
  591. # [21:14] <tw2113> very cool when a band releases instrumental tracks with a CC license
  592. # [21:14] <cheilmann> gotta install the JS tools for textmate on this new computer
  593. # [21:14] <tw2113> if i had the knowledge and ideas, i could remix
  594. # [21:15] * Quits: aSydiK`work (~mickael.m@142.204.133.28)
  595. # [21:17] <tw2113> so you're loving Mozilla so far cheilmann
  596. # [21:18] <Michael> paul_irish, Port those damned dojofx over to jquery ui!
  597. # [21:18] <Michael> k10x
  598. # [21:21] <cheilmann> OK, all linted and fixed
  599. # [21:21] <cheilmann> I stopped failing the crock
  600. # [21:22] * Joins: moshee (~moshee@unaffiliated/moshee)
  601. # [21:22] <cheilmann> yeah it is amazing fun
  602. # [21:23] * Quits: cocoadaemon (~cocoadaem@2a01:e35:8a99:e90:20d:93ff:fe3b:868c) (Quit: cocoadaemon)
  603. # [21:23] * Quits: davidwalsh (~davidwals@75-135-74-55.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Quit: Reading http://davidwalsh.name)
  604. # [21:25] * Quits: Boohemian (~Boohemian@wrls-249-70-209.wrls-client.fas.harvard.edu) (Quit: ciao)
  605. # [21:28] * boaz is now known as protip
  606. # [21:29] <tw2113> the mozilla gradient implementation is the one getting adapted by the W3C right?
  607. # [21:29] * rwaldron is now known as prototype
  608. # [21:29] * prototype is now known as rwaldron
  609. # [21:30] <miketaylr> tw2113: well, almost
  610. # [21:31] <miketaylr> it's different enough that old -moz-gradients will probably break
  611. # [21:31] <miketaylr> oh wait...adapted...not adopted
  612. # [21:31] <tw2113> i just would like to place a futureproof declaration at the end of my selector
  613. # [21:31] <miketaylr> ?gl
  614. # [21:31] <bot-t> http://goodluckwiththatdude.com/
  615. # [21:32] <tw2113> so i would just have to delete the prefix versions
  616. # [21:32] <miketaylr> it's not set in stone, but the latest version is on the latest draft of the images module
  617. # [21:32] <miketaylr> ?g w3c css3 images module
  618. # [21:32] <bot-t> miketaylr, CSS Image Values and Replaced Content Module Level 3 - http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-images/
  619. # [21:32] <tw2113> got it
  620. # [21:33] <tw2113> feck you apple magic mouse
  621. # [21:33] <tw2113> thing is too sensitive some days
  622. # [21:34] * Joins: aSydiK`work (~mickael.m@142.204.133.28)
  623. # [21:35] <cheilmann> end of the month?
  624. # [21:36] <tw2113> 11 more days or so
  625. # [21:37] <tw2113> i should see if i could get my manager to pony up the money for a family pack for forklift2
  626. # [21:37] * Joins: drizzd_ (~drizzd@p5B22FA21.dip.t-dialin.net)
  627. # [21:37] <tw2113> it will likely increase my productivity
  628. # [21:37] <tw2113> i can equal it out by spending more time in here
  629. # [21:38] <cheilmann> forklift tocks
  630. # [21:39] <tw2113> i think the easy server to server transfer may sell him on it for himself since he does all the dev > live pushes
  631. # [21:40] * Joins: jacine (~jacine@drupal.org/user/88931/view)
  632. # [21:41] <tw2113> look out, it's jacine
  633. # [21:41] * Quits: drizzd (~drizzd@p5B22EE2A.dip.t-dialin.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  634. # [21:41] <tw2113> she is too able to kick my butt
  635. # [21:41] <jacine> hey guys :D
  636. # [21:41] <cheilmann> to be fair, who isn't?
  637. # [21:41] <cheilmann> :)
  638. # [21:42] <tw2113> true
  639. # [21:42] <tw2113> i let it happen if they're super cute
  640. # [21:46] * Parts: unruthless (~unruthles@166.205.140.210)
  641. # [21:47] * Joins: [1]piklu (~piklu@122.177.167.61)
  642. # [21:47] <cheilmann> check out the meeting room names: http://www.flickr.com/photos/codepo8/5277827279/sizes/o/in/photostream/
  643. # [21:48] * Quits: piklu (~piklu@122.177.171.85) (Disconnected by services)
  644. # [21:48] * [1]piklu is now known as piklu
  645. # [21:49] * tw2113 queues up Ed Byrne
  646. # [21:50] <tw2113> gotta love a company with a sense of humor
  647. # [21:51] <cheilmann> don't forget dogs: http://www.flickr.com/photos/codepo8/5277826773/
  648. # [21:52] <tw2113> ooh, refreshments cooler....is that a pay-per setup? or do you just go up and grab what you want?
  649. # [21:53] <tw2113> :O drinking on the job
  650. # [21:53] * Joins: murz (~mmurraywa@wcproxy.msnbc.com)
  651. # [21:53] <cheilmann> all free
  652. # [21:53] <paul_irish> speaking of not free
  653. # [21:53] <paul_irish> impactjs seems pretty damn hot
  654. # [21:53] <tw2113> another company that i think would be fun.....Red Hat
  655. # [21:54] <paul_irish> http://impactjs.com/
  656. # [21:54] * Quits: Michael (~disney@unaffiliated/jabberwock) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  657. # [21:55] * Joins: drizzd (~drizzd@p5B22E589.dip.t-dialin.net)
  658. # [21:55] <tw2113> i need to get myself a markerboard for personal office use
  659. # [21:57] * Quits: miketaylr (~miketaylr@65.88.88.174) (Quit: miketaylr)
  660. # [21:58] <cheilmann> in yahoo london we had paint on the wall that worked as a whiteboard
  661. # [21:58] <cheilmann> that was win
  662. # [21:59] <tw2113> suggest that to the mozilla people
  663. # [21:59] * Quits: drizzd_ (~drizzd@p5B22FA21.dip.t-dialin.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  664. # [21:59] <obert-> cheilmann wut?
  665. # [22:00] <cheilmann> http://www.ideapaint.com/work/ideapaint/
  666. # [22:01] <obert-> are there a lot of 'mann' out there?
  667. # [22:01] * Quits: matjas (~matjas@91.182.201.104) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  668. # [22:01] <obert-> i read about Heilmann almost ;)
  669. # [22:02] * Quits: jmburnz (~jmburnz@222-154-239-240.adsl.xtra.co.nz) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  670. # [22:02] * Joins: jmburnz (~jmburnz@222-154-239-240.adsl.xtra.co.nz)
  671. # [22:03] <obert-> lol
  672. # [22:03] <cheilmann> a few
  673. # [22:03] <cheilmann> it is annoying - a few years ago my search bots for "heilmann" only brought things talking about my articles
  674. # [22:03] <cheilmann> now there is a baseball player, a painter, a German idiot politiician...
  675. # [22:04] <cheilmann> Time to have lots of children and counteract that
  676. # [22:04] <tw2113> good luck finding me, there's some famous reverend with my name
  677. # [22:04] <obert-> christian is workin for yahoo.co.uk
  678. # [22:04] <obert-> cool idea the wallpaper:P
  679. # [22:05] <tw2113> paint
  680. # [22:06] <obert-> mhmh:P
  681. # [22:08] * Joins: matjas (~matjas@91.182.210.175)
  682. # [22:09] * Joins: dmachi (~dmachi@pool-72-66-195-134.ronkva.east.verizon.net)
  683. # [22:09] * Quits: dmachi1 (~dmachi@pool-72-66-195-134.ronkva.east.verizon.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  684. # [22:12] <cheilmann> not anymore
  685. # [22:12] <cheilmann> I left yahoo
  686. # [22:12] * Quits: ryanoverbey (~ryanoverb@wrls-249-143-74.wrls-client.fas.harvard.edu) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
  687. # [22:12] <obert-> ;)
  688. # [22:12] <obert-> wont to play with yahoo and lover sadness then
  689. # [22:14] <obert-> think that i know a girl with the nick 'ya' :D
  690. # [22:15] <tw2113> good debate....yahoo! vs Yahoo Serious
  691. # [22:15] <tw2113> which yahoo is better?
  692. # [22:15] <obert-> ya.hoo
  693. # [22:16] <cheilmann> OK, time to set up about.me http://about.me/chrisheilmann
  694. # [22:17] <tw2113> what is about.me? just kind of like a centralized hub that connects all your profiles together?
  695. # [22:17] <obert-> was talkin about http://icant.co.uk/
  696. # [22:17] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@91.181.48.19) (Quit: nn)
  697. # [22:18] <obert-> too many evangelist out there
  698. # [22:18] <cheilmann> damn it michaelarrington is already taken
  699. # [22:18] <cheilmann> just when I wanted to use a goatse picture
  700. # [22:19] <cheilmann> oh right
  701. # [22:19] <cheilmann> icant needs updating
  702. # [22:20] <cheilmann> that needs fixing anyways - as it is built live with delicious
  703. # [22:27] <cheilmann> fixed
  704. # [22:29] <tw2113> hee, i half jokingly complained about our company's DNS on twitter last week
  705. # [22:29] <tw2113> and how it seems to only refresh once a day or however infrequently it does
  706. # [22:29] <tw2113> they finally responded asking about it
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  714. # [22:41] <tw2113> from an efficiency standpoint, cheilmann, would you suggest learning javascript before trying to dive into a lot of YQL stuff? or would php be just as suitable, which I have more familiarity with
  715. # [22:42] <cheilmann> php is totally fine
  716. # [22:42] <cheilmann> json_decode() ftw
  717. # [22:42] <tw2113> good, a lower hurdle for me. the next parts would be figuring out how to do what i want with the data it pulls in for me
  718. # [22:43] <cheilmann> print it out and make a paper hat
  719. # [22:43] <cheilmann> you'd look fetching, I am sure.
  720. # [22:44] <tw2113> good idea
  721. # [22:47] <cheilmann> http://www.nooooooooooooooo.com/
  722. # [22:47] <cheilmann> handy
  723. # [22:47] <Moo--> cheilmann: with php, yes
  724. # [22:47] <tw2113> lol @ blurring IE6 randomly
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  728. # [23:00] <cheilmann> amelie filter
  729. # [23:00] <cheilmann> :)
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  735. # [23:23] <tw2113> cardona507, regarding the tweet just now, it was KFC
  736. # [23:23] <cardona507> what makes you think it was you?
  737. # [23:23] <tw2113> fast food -> security -> developer
  738. # [23:23] * Quits: Mussious (~kamil@dfq71.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  739. # [23:24] <cheilmann> working on a music fader
  740. # [23:24] <cardona507> how do you know that all of my friends don't follow a similar course?
  741. # [23:24] <tw2113> sounds like my employment timeline since january 2008
  742. # [23:24] <cheilmann> crossfading songs in audio looks like fun
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  745. # [23:27] * krunkosaurus_ is now known as krunkosaurus
  746. # [23:27] <tw2113> is anyone else with me on the idea that marketers are just evil? and that it's good that we became developers
  747. # [23:28] <tw2113> a case where we can actually show work done? as opposed to just being paid to talk to people and try to sell them stuff?
  748. # [23:28] <cardona507> *cough*SEO*cough*
  749. # [23:29] <tw2113> SEO people talk to the pages they help create?
  750. # [23:29] <tw2113> :P
  751. # [23:29] <cardona507> I'll set my spiders loose on you
  752. # [23:29] <cardona507> mwa ha ha
  753. # [23:29] <tw2113> i think i'm just glad i didn't get into much marketing
  754. # [23:30] <tw2113> i might have liked building a bit more subconsciously than first realized
  755. # [23:30] <tw2113> i was a lego baby afterall
  756. # [23:30] <cardona507> yes legos
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  758. # [23:32] * Parts: piklu (~piklu@122.177.167.61)
  759. # [23:32] <cheilmann> Marketers on the internets? Never! http://about.me/lisalarter
  760. # [23:32] <mokush> does anybody know why requirejs does not work on opera mobile? and a possible workaround?
  761. # [23:33] <tw2113> i'll look into getting an about.me page later tonight
  762. # [23:33] <cheilmann> make it as cool as hers
  763. # [23:34] <cheilmann> then you will have 213123123123123 twitter followers in a day!
  764. # [23:34] <l4rk> mokush: check the tracker
  765. # [23:34] <l4rk> file a bug if something doesn't exist
  766. # [23:34] <tw2113> nah, then i'd have to list a delicious profile
  767. # [23:34] <tw2113> and i don't have one :)
  768. # [23:35] <cheilmann> http://socialmediadouchebag.net/
  769. # [23:36] * Joins: sneakers (~sneakers@c-67-160-33-201.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  770. # [23:36] <tw2113> what about @css3hootchie ?
  771. # [23:36] <sneakers> How do I convert an .avi video into webm format?
  772. # [23:37] <tw2113> ritual sacrifice
  773. # [23:37] <cardona507> those about.me pages are loud
  774. # [23:37] * Quits: sean` (~Sean@D97A9F8D.cm-3-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Quit: Leaving)
  775. # [23:37] <cardona507> what would dieter rams say?
  776. # [23:38] <mokush> l4rk: I found something on an article, saying that commonjs will not work with opera mobile, and the same reason applies to requirejs.
  777. # [23:38] <mokush> I didn't want to open up a ticket on something that everybody knows about, and can't be fixd
  778. # [23:39] * Quits: Thasmo (~thasmo@d86-32-185-119.cust.tele2.at)
  779. # [23:39] <cheilmann> sneakers ffmpeg
  780. # [23:40] <cheilmann> http://www.webmproject.org/tools/encoder-parameters/#10_sample_command_lines
  781. # [23:41] <cheilmann> http://www.mirovideoconverter.com/ also works
  782. # [23:43] <tw2113> bbl, go home time
  783. # [23:43] <paul_irish> mvc ^ is the jam
  784. # [23:43] <tw2113> chris, if i don't see you by then, i hope you actually get a flight
  785. # [23:43] * Quits: tw2113 (~tw2113asw@fedora/tw2113) (Quit: Leaving)
  786. # [23:44] <cheilmann> yeah just traded a Firefox T-shirt for a lift to the airport
  787. # [23:44] <cheilmann> video encoding search results are so spammy
  788. # [23:44] <cheilmann> all these "trial version" encoders for Windows
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  794. # Session Close: Tue Dec 21 00:00:00 2010

The end :)