/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2011-03-30 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Wed Mar 30 00:00:00 2011
  2. # Session Ident: #html5
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  18. # [00:29] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: Mobile Gmail definitely uses custom-rolled scrolling
  19. # [00:30] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: On iOS and Android devices
  20. # [00:30] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: I would not lie :)
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  22. # [00:33] <daleharvey> heh, are you from google? I dont see any way / reason for mobile gmail to use custom scrolling, it doesnt use fixed footers or transitions
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  24. # [00:34] <daleharvey> and since the top toolbar (with archive / delete) is fixed until the scroll completes means they either use native scrolling or added a whole lot of code just to introduce a bug
  25. # [00:34] <paul_irish> http://code.google.com/mobile/articles/webapp_fixed_ui.html
  26. # [00:35] <daleharvey> paul_irish: yeh BrianBlakely pointed that out to me earlier, gonna give it a shot when im finished with this work
  27. # [00:35] <paul_irish> kk
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  30. # [00:42] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: I'm too good for Google (that is actually a lie) — But seriously, the email listing is scrolled inside a container; basically, it's just three <div>s, the header, the footer, and the listing. The listing has overflow hidden, and the emails are scrolled with touch events, transitions, transforms, and getComputedStyle
  31. # [00:43] * Quits: cgcardona (~cgcardona@unaffiliated/cgcardona) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  32. # [00:43] <BrianBlakely> The Gmail implementation is actually buggy compared to iOS, and there isn't place marker on the right-hand side to indicate your scroll position in the list … a couple tell-tale signs
  33. # [00:44] <daleharvey> mobile gmail doesnt have fixed footers or headers, at least for me
  34. # [00:46] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: Device?
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  37. # [00:47] <daleharvey> htc desire, one second I will test nexus s
  38. # [00:47] <BrianBlakely> Huh, maybe they didn't do it for Android — I only have an iPhone, but I thought I read that it was upgraded for both
  39. # [00:48] <BrianBlakely> In any case it's the same concept
  40. # [00:48] <BrianBlakely> It might not be as smooth on Android because the HWA in that browser is non-existant
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  42. # [00:50] <daleharvey> I get the concept, I was just saying I have never seen any implementation that has ever worked semi decently on android
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  44. # [00:51] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: Cool. Is it just slow on Android?
  45. # [00:53] <daleharvey> iscroll constantly stops scrolling, requires refresh, sencha just goes completely off, and googles doesnt do inner scroll
  46. # [00:54] <daleharvey> ill give that article a shot after this stuff
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  58. # [01:08] <BrianBlakely> daleharvey: Cool, I'd be interested to hear about your experience with it
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  112. # [03:09] <hays> would i be advised to implement a website in HTML 5 that I want people to see? heh
  113. # [03:10] <hays> I am thinking of putting together a photo gallery using PHP and then basically driving the interface bus with JS/HTML5
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  115. # [03:11] <hays> Safari would work, and FF4.. and IE9 ? Would that be my audience essentially?
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  117. # [03:12] <zewt> you have to be a bit more specific than "HTML5"
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  119. # [03:14] <hays> Hrmm... Not sure if I can yet... I figured at the basic level the PHP could dish out HTML with the info necessary to display thumbs of photosets and images, and a way to scroll through/select images to be loaded on the screen in a bigger view within the same page.. would this be the canvas element?
  120. # [03:16] <zewt> you can do client-side image viewers without depending on anything particularly new
  121. # [03:18] <hays> I was looking for something about as complex as this, maybe a bit simpler: http://www.aaronhuey.com/
  122. # [03:18] <zewt> gar
  123. # [03:18] <zewt> guessing: without flash :)
  124. # [03:19] <hays> right, with HTML/CSS
  125. # [03:19] <hays> So links to sets over on the left, some sort of image thumb browser, and a way to populate the rest of the page with the image
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  127. # [03:20] <zewt> don't need canvas for that
  128. # [03:21] <zewt> (canvas is fairly reasonably available, though, except for the nontrivial pre-9 IE crowd)
  129. # [03:22] <hays> just some javascript then and maybe newish css support?
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  132. # [03:24] <zewt> don't even need any fancy css, unless you want to mimic that goofy (sort of annoying) hover effect
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  135. # [03:27] <hays> hmm someone in web is saying to use jquery.. which seems sensible.
  136. # [03:27] <hays> might get me a rather simple implementation of this
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  139. # [03:31] <hays> Thanks for the advice
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  163. # [04:33] <DJTrey> any reason why this isn't playing in firefox 3.6.0
  164. # [04:33] <DJTrey> http://pastebin.com/V8ncecLy
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  174. # [04:46] <grantg> oh senix
  175. # [04:46] <grantg> ...
  176. # [04:46] <grantg> Senix dropped to much altitude
  177. # [04:48] * grantg needs to add a way to short-curcuit the gfx rendering routines in the JS GBC emu for browsers that can't go fullspeed.
  178. # [04:49] <grantg> so frameskip really does reduce CPU load in certain browsers.
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  220. # [06:44] <tw2113> mozilla is really going all out with this releae
  221. # [06:44] <tw2113> release*
  222. # [06:45] <tw2113> or i was simply oblivious last time + the lack of social media refinement in 2008
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  224. # [06:48] <zewt> heh the funny thing is how it doesn't really have a lot of immediately user-visible changes
  225. # [06:48] <zewt> lots of dev-visible stuff
  226. # [06:50] <zewt> ... and it's nice to see people upgrading despite that, since it's a small counter against the usual "must add lots of unnecessary flashy lights to convince people to upgrade or we'll never get new APIs deployed"-itis
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  229. # [06:57] <ralphholzmann> thats quite the inflamation.
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  237. # [07:08] <zewt> pardon?
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  252. # [07:49] <ccl> has anyone used HTML5 Web SQL Databases?
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  325. # [10:12] <simenbrekken> Can someone recommend a good combiner/minifier?
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  350. # [11:02] <Evet> simenbrekken: uglifyjs
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  356. # [11:17] <jetienne> Evet: it may produce invalid js tho
  357. # [11:18] <jetienne> i use google closure compiler
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  366. # [11:44] <Evet> jetienne: ah. allright
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  443. # [14:49] <Jon47> it does have fixed headers for me, not sure about the footers
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  521. # [16:49] * cbarretpoint5 is now known as dmachi
  522. # [16:52] <paul_irish> jetienne: jquery and modernizr use uglify
  523. # [16:52] <paul_irish> sans problems
  524. # [16:57] <jetienne> paul_irish: serious ? well i had 2 miscompiled js with it.
  525. # [16:57] <jetienne> paul_irish: and talked to another personn hitting the same issue yesterday
  526. # [16:57] <paul_irish> o
  527. # [16:57] <jetienne> maybe im just unlucky
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  530. # [17:00] <BrianBlakely> ?tell daleharvey How's the scroll quest coming?
  531. # [17:00] <bot-t> BrianBlakely, Okay.
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  562. # [17:59] <zewt> gar
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  564. # [18:03] <BrianBlakely> ?tell paul_irish One of my interweb associates appreciated your SFHTML5 talk: http://wastingyourlife.co/forums/on-topic/digital-design-development-3978-p28.html#post172858
  565. # [18:03] <bot-t> BrianBlakely, Okay.
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  567. # [18:03] * mike5w3c_ is now known as mike5w3c
  568. # [18:05] <zewt> (gar followup somewhat delayed)
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  570. # [18:07] <zewt> anyone happen to know a way to convince FF4 to not show a placeholder (border, icon) around <img> before an image starts loading? don't want to hide it during the load entirely (eg. until onload), just don't want an ugly, out-of-place placeholder to flash ... think i've worked around this before somehow but it's back in FF4
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  587. # [18:41] <BrianBlakely> zewt: border: none (a guess)
  588. # [18:42] <zewt> nah, it's not a border or outline--seems built into the control (also, there's an icon in there)
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  627. # [19:17] <uf0> what's the mime type for an mp3
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  636. # [19:25] <miketaylr> ?g mp3 mime type
  637. # [19:25] <bot-t> miketaylr, Multimedia MIME Reference - http://www.w3schools.com/media/media_mimeref.asp
  638. # [19:25] <miketaylr> lol
  639. # [19:25] <miketaylr> bad bot-t
  640. # [19:25] <bot-t> see "?not good"
  641. # [19:25] <miketaylr> ?not good
  642. # [19:25] <bot-t> http://bit.ly/9ZCl0F
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  644. # [19:26] <uf0> w3schools? haha i don't trust em
  645. # [19:26] <uf0> i googled, it's audio/mpeg
  646. # [19:26] <uf0> but i wanted to make sure here
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  664. # [20:05] <kevin_b> Hello guys
  665. # [20:05] <kevin_b> I got a stack of canvas, a some weird margin-bottom, did someone ever saw that?
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  668. # [20:08] <kevin_b> using latest webkit
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  685. # [20:33] <uf0> paul_irish: you around?
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  690. # [20:41] <Jon47> don't pester the heroes, if you've got a question just ask the room
  691. # [20:41] <uf0> it's a h5bp thing
  692. # [20:41] <uf0> which is owned by Paul Irish
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  694. # [20:42] <mikesusz> .... and we all use it
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  696. # [20:44] <miketaylr> ?hero
  697. # [20:44] <bot-t> <linda_hoxman>: HERO HERO HERO HERO HERO HERO
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  700. # [20:45] <diamonds> uf0: I'm looking into my crystal ball...
  701. # [20:46] <diamonds> your question has to do with.... media queries!
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  703. # [20:46] <Jon47> lol, for people who didn't get that linda hoxman thing: http://irclogs.ls-themes.org/freenode/jquery/logs/2009-12-04
  704. # [20:47] <miketaylr> :)
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  706. # [20:48] <diamonds> uf0: did I get it?
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  716. # [21:03] <moo-_-> haha that linda thing is wonderful
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  726. # [21:07] <paul_irish> uf0: ask already
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  729. # [21:11] <uf0> lol there we go
  730. # [21:11] <uf0> so i'm looking at this link
  731. # [21:11] <uf0> http://blogs.msdn.com/b/ieinternals/archive/2011/03/27/http-406-not-acceptable-php-ie9-standards-mode-accepts-only-text_2f00_css-for-stylesheets.aspx
  732. # [21:11] <uf0> by Eric Law and I have see some of your comments
  733. # [21:12] <uf0> my question
  734. # [21:12] <uf0> why in the htaccess file you don't have a mime type set for CSS/JS files
  735. # [21:12] <uf0> ?
  736. # [21:12] <uf0> if this can cause an issue in IE9
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  738. # [21:13] <uf0> or have type="text/css" in the link tag
  739. # [21:14] <uf0> diamonds: nope HTML :)
  740. # [21:14] <uf0> but good try, I am doing alot of mobile these days
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  742. # [21:14] <diamonds> uf0: oh... my crystal ball must be broken
  743. # [21:14] <diamonds> I guess you'll just have to come out and ask your question next time!
  744. # [21:15] <uf0> i don't want to ask the question three zillion times
  745. # [21:15] <uf0> as I've done before
  746. # [21:15] <uf0> that's why I did a 'you around' ?
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  749. # [21:21] <diamonds> uf0: pi isn't the only person who can answer your h5bp questions :)
  750. # [21:21] <diamonds> if you don't ask the community you might miss out on some valuable inpute!
  751. # [21:21] <paul_irish> what he said
  752. # [21:22] <paul_irish> fairly certain that apache serves css and js default with text/css|javascript
  753. # [21:22] <paul_irish> so the explicit mimetype isnt neccessary
  754. # [21:22] <paul_irish> but i'd be happy to add it in for explicit's sake
  755. # [21:22] <paul_irish> pull request away, brah
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  770. # [21:42] <uf0> so what is this IE9 bug then?
  771. # [21:42] <uf0> that Eric talks about in the post
  772. # [21:42] <uf0> diamonds: true that! will do next time
  773. # [21:43] <uf0> i don't want to add things just to be more explicit
  774. # [21:44] <uf0> but if it does fix something then yeah sure
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  778. # [21:48] <uf0> there's two place
  779. # [21:49] <uf0> <link rel="stylesheet" href="css/style.css"> so instead if we do <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="css/style.css">
  780. # [21:49] <uf0> will that help, or does it not matter
  781. # [21:51] <hober> no, that doesn't help
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  783. # [21:54] <CrashTest_> Is there some best practice for managing multiple languages in a standalone web app?
  784. # [21:54] <CrashTest_> I am not finding squat searching.
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  786. # [21:55] <moo-_-> CrashTest_: javascript + gettext libraries exist
  787. # [21:55] <moo-_-> gettext is kind of standard tool
  788. # [21:55] <moo-_-> for any programming language
  789. # [21:55] <CrashTest_> Sweet, thanks moo
  790. # [21:55] <CrashTest_> moo-_-: ^
  791. # [21:55] <moo-_-> then there is XML based localization spefication
  792. # [21:55] <moo-_-> i18n attributes
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  804. # [22:07] <CrashTest_> if gettext-js works that looks like what I will probably go with
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  806. # [22:09] <moo-_-> CrashTest_: nice
  807. # [22:09] <moo-_-> CrashTest_: are you developing on windows?
  808. # [22:09] <CrashTest_> moo-_-: No, usually on Linux
  809. # [22:10] <moo-_-> CrashTest_: well it does not matter
  810. # [22:10] <moo-_-> get kde po editor
  811. # [22:10] <moo-_-> or poedit
  812. # [22:10] <moo-_-> makes writing translation strings easy
  813. # [22:10] <CrashTest_> Really? Checking it out! Though.... I may not actually be responsible for creating the po files
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  816. # [22:11] <moo-_-> CrashTest_: give poedit for your translators. they learn to use it easly and cannot screw up the whole file.
  817. # [22:11] <CrashTest_> moo-_-: Very nice! Just installed it.
  818. # [22:11] <diamonds> .
  819. # [22:11] <CrashTest_> looking now
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  828. # [22:17] * diamonds_ is now known as diamonds
  829. # [22:18] <CrashTest_> moo-_-: That will help either way, thanks for your help.
  830. # [22:19] <moo-_-> np
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  841. # [22:37] <paul_irish> CrashTest_: look at https://github.com/nimbupani/html5boilerplate-site the Makefile.. the /scripts
  842. # [22:38] <paul_irish> it grabs the /src folder and mixes it with the /locale files and outputs to /built
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  847. # [22:46] <CrashTest_> paul_irish: will do, right after I finish watching your HTML5 Boilerplate presentation
  848. # [22:46] <CrashTest_> :)
  849. # [22:47] <CrashTest_> paul_irish: Oh cool!
  850. # [22:47] <paul_irish> yeah i mean this is custom to our site
  851. # [22:47] <paul_irish> but
  852. # [22:47] <paul_irish> its somewhat generalized
  853. # [22:47] <CrashTest_> Yeah
  854. # [22:47] <paul_irish> you'll see the {% blocktrans action
  855. # [22:47] <paul_irish> i think you could steal it and run with it
  856. # [22:49] <CrashTest_> Oh yeah, I get it!
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  872. # [23:13] <uf0> so what is this IE9 bug then?
  873. # [23:13] <uf0> http://blogs.msdn.com/b/ieinternals/archive/2011/03/27/http-406-not-acceptable-php-ie9-standards-mode-accepts-only-text_2f00_css-for-stylesheets.aspx
  874. # [23:13] <uf0> if apache apache serves css and js default
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  876. # [23:14] <paul_irish> unless you can prove to me that apache (with h5bp htaccess) serves a non text/css type for css files...
  877. # [23:15] <paul_irish> then i think you can worry a little less.
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  879. # [23:15] <uf0> i'm not trying to prove, i'm trying to prevent
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  881. # [23:15] <uf0> as I haven't experienced it
  882. # [23:15] <uf0> but what Eric says makes me wonder
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  884. # [23:16] <uf0> if should be more explicit, and if there's a point to add that in h5bp
  885. # [23:16] <uf0> that's it
  886. # [23:16] <paul_irish> i know
  887. # [23:16] <uf0> if it isn't necessary and it's not a bug at all then fine
  888. # [23:16] <paul_irish> it looks that way to me
  889. # [23:16] <paul_irish> but
  890. # [23:17] <paul_irish> i'm not digging in too deep to it
  891. # [23:17] <uf0> gotcha
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The end :)