/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2011-04-16 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Sat Apr 16 00:00:00 2011
  2. # Session Ident: #html5
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  11. # [00:12] <pa7> kadiks: would love to see one too ;)
  12. # [00:13] <kadiks> ^^
  13. # [00:13] <kadiks> thanks for the answer
  14. # [00:13] <kadiks> let's wait ^^
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  17. # [00:22] <robhawkes> kadiks: Like what Ericsson Labs are doing? https://labs.ericsson.com/developer-community/blog/beyond-html5-peer-peer-conversational-video
  18. # [00:23] <robhawkes> Or just the plain Media Capture API?
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  20. # [00:23] <kadiks> yes exactly that, but which browser does it ?
  21. # [00:23] <kadiks> the whole thing (or at least part for the moment)
  22. # [00:24] <robhawkes> Atm that's a custom build of WebKit
  23. # [00:24] <robhawkes> No browser supports it yet
  24. # [00:24] <kadiks> ok, I'll wait ^^
  25. # [00:24] <kadiks> thanks
  26. # [00:24] <robhawkes> The Media Capture API is in Android Honeycomb 3.0
  27. # [00:24] <robhawkes> but the peer to peer stuff isn't anywhere yet
  28. # [00:24] <kadiks> nice !
  29. # [00:25] <robhawkes> http://davidbcalhoun.com/2011/android-3-0-honeycomb-is-first-to-implement-the-device-api
  30. # [00:25] <kadiks> so it is just to capture myself ?
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  32. # [00:25] <robhawkes> Yes
  33. # [00:26] <tw2113> webcam/mic stuff is still regulated to flash last i knew
  34. # [00:26] <kadiks> ok, good
  35. # [00:26] <robhawkes> Also, Mozilla are working on the Media Capture API, but for now you can use their Rainbow experiment which implements the same functionality, ish. https://mozillalabs.com/rainbow/
  36. # [00:26] <kadiks> thanks a lot for that link, I will have a look
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  71. # [02:01] <davidmurdoch> @paul_irish, @skylar_brungardt, Guassian blur with CSS: http://blog.vervestudios.co/blog/post/2011/04/15/Applying-Gaussian-Blur-to-HTML-elements-with-CSS.aspx
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  77. # [02:11] <paul_irish> davidmurdoch: you can do blur with svg filters in ff4
  78. # [02:11] <paul_irish> but
  79. # [02:11] <paul_irish> pretty nice technique :D
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  82. # [02:11] <shepazu> paul_irish: shut up about SVG already, nobody cares
  83. # [02:12] <shepazu> that's a dead Adobe technology from 10 years ago
  84. # [02:12] <paul_irish> haahaha
  85. # [02:12] <paul_irish> i know you have a notify on it.
  86. # [02:13] <paul_irish> ♥
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  88. # [02:13] <shepazu> ♥
  89. # [02:13] <paul_irish> ♡⏝♡
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  97. # [02:32] <danielfilho> hot pink is hot.
  98. # [02:33] <danielfilho> so is leah culver.
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  126. # [03:42] <daleharvey> honeycomb implements the device api, so so awesome
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  135. # [04:03] <Jonz> assuming that app cache is enabled in every browser, is there ever a case where using cookies is preferable to using local storage?
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  138. # [04:06] <tw2113> every time i hear about local storage, i hear "cookies on steroids"
  139. # [04:06] <tw2113> so unless you're against jacked up cookies, i dunno :D
  140. # [04:06] <Jonz> heh
  141. # [04:06] <Jonz> I'm against minimizing my requests I guess
  142. # [04:08] <Jonz> what did I just say
  143. # [04:08] <Jonz> I'm for that.. minimizing http request size
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  165. # [05:27] <random_username> does html5 have any webcam/streaming features? ie <video> tag etc
  166. # [05:31] <danielfilho> random_username: I saw in somewhere that they're studying it, but I'm not sure.
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  168. # [05:32] <buht> hello,
  169. # [05:33] <random_username> so besides a maybe from html5, im looking at either flash or silverlight?
  170. # [05:33] <random_username> never looked into live streaming, but there must be simpler alts
  171. # [05:34] <buht> i used to do a lot of .net code, some aspx pages, wcf, wpf,m$ shit mainly.... but now im interested in html5's capabilities... ive ordered a couple books on html5 and javascript (learning this now) and im wondering... what back end options do i have to handle events and server side work needed now? key reason i want html5 and javascript is platform independency
  172. # [05:35] <buht> appreciate any recommendations.... what is there to do the back end server side events and communication that is supported on most all of browers like safari, chrome, firefox
  173. # [05:35] <random_username> buht: php+ajax+jquery
  174. # [05:36] <buht> random, ok. any other options or is that pretty much it?
  175. # [05:36] <random_username> all you ever need, but there are alternatives
  176. # [05:36] <buht> what are the alternatives... just want to know options...
  177. # [05:36] <buht> asp.net would require .net framework thus limiting it mainly to IE right?
  178. # [05:37] <random_username> ruby on rails, if your 1337
  179. # [05:38] <buht> random_username: also, i likely need to host this all on IIS because a core of my companies producs use IIS/SQL
  180. # [05:39] <buht> random_username: so would php, ajax, and jquery work with IIS?
  181. # [05:39] <danielfilho> buht: you can use any backend technology
  182. # [05:39] <buht> danielfilho: asp.net ?
  183. # [05:40] <danielfilho> most of those so called web 2.0 uses rails, python or whatever.
  184. # [05:40] <danielfilho> you must use a backend that fills your needs on the serverside.
  185. # [05:40] <danielfilho> yup. asp.net fits well.
  186. # [05:40] <danielfilho> do you know html5 boilerplate?
  187. # [05:40] <buht> danielfilho: id honestly like ot stick with asp.net because i understand much of it already...
  188. # [05:40] <danielfilho> sure.
  189. # [05:41] <buht> danielfilho: but with asp.net wouldnt events triggered from the web site require a .net framework download?
  190. # [05:41] <danielfilho> the best language is the one that you know the most.
  191. # [05:41] <buht> danielfilho: i must be able to hit the safari, chrome, firefox, and ie markets (yes i know ie has shit support for html5 right now)
  192. # [05:41] <danielfilho> i'm not familiar with IIS
  193. # [05:41] <danielfilho> but it is a server-side functionality
  194. # [05:42] <buht> danielfilho: yes, its serverside, but the events triggered.... dont those need .net framework on the client?
  195. # [05:42] <danielfilho> no, ie works fine.
  196. # [05:42] <buht> ie seems to fail miserable with canvas
  197. # [05:42] <danielfilho> you have pollyfils
  198. # [05:42] <buht> never heard of it
  199. # [05:42] <danielfilho> you can say like
  200. # [05:43] <danielfilho> there are great examples of it using yepnope and modernizr
  201. # [05:43] <danielfilho> will show you
  202. # [05:43] <buht> what is it
  203. # [05:43] <danielfilho> ?g modernizr
  204. # [05:43] <bot-t1> danielfilho, Modernizr - http://www.modernizr.com/
  205. # [05:43] <danielfilho> ?g yepnope
  206. # [05:43] <bot-t1> danielfilho, yepnope.js | A Conditional Loader For Your Polyfills! - http://yepnopejs.com/
  207. # [05:43] <danielfilho> check those links out
  208. # [05:43] <danielfilho> yepnope is a conditional loader
  209. # [05:43] <danielfilho> you do like
  210. # [05:44] <buht> ill read up on both of them.
  211. # [05:45] <danielfilho> yepnope({ test: Modernizr.video, yep:document.write('<video ... </video>'), nope: document.write('<embed ... </embed>') });
  212. # [05:45] <danielfilho> this is the combination of yepnope with modernizr.
  213. # [05:45] <buht> so you think i can use an asp.net server on IIS, and still use html5 and javascript with safari, firefox, and chrome?
  214. # [05:45] <danielfilho> totally!
  215. # [05:45] <danielfilho> you can abstract front-end to back-end.
  216. # [05:45] <buht> i just thought if one were to hit an asp.net server page that has .net shit in it, they needed framework downloaded on the client?
  217. # [05:45] <buht> maybe that is only for silverlight?
  218. # [05:46] <danielfilho> nope
  219. # [05:46] <danielfilho> if you want that webcam thing, you have to use silverlight or flash today.
  220. # [05:46] <danielfilho> unfortunately
  221. # [05:46] <danielfilho> as long as I know.
  222. # [05:46] <buht> i dont need any webcam thing
  223. # [05:47] <danielfilho> wait.
  224. # [05:47] <buht> i want to server data up from a web server , with information from a sql2k8 DB, to an html5 web site, with some javascript on it too
  225. # [05:47] <danielfilho> I got confused with random_username then
  226. # [05:47] <danielfilho> :D
  227. # [05:47] <buht> server -> server
  228. # [05:47] <danielfilho> ok
  229. # [05:47] <danielfilho> so
  230. # [05:47] <danielfilho> you just have to make the markup to be written using html5 tags.
  231. # [05:47] <danielfilho> ;)
  232. # [05:47] <random_username> yeah cheers dan
  233. # [05:47] <danielfilho> no need to change any server-side code
  234. # [05:47] <buht> ok. and events listed in html5, will call events on my asp.net back end?
  235. # [05:48] <danielfilho> except those that outputs the markup
  236. # [05:48] <danielfilho> the events are javascript
  237. # [05:48] <buht> and i can pass image dayta, lots of image data, to the web browser in html5 too?
  238. # [05:48] <buht> i see.
  239. # [05:48] <buht> i just ordered my first javascript book
  240. # [05:48] <buht> the html5 canvas abilities look promising for my needs... ive yet to learn all new stuff in html5 so i dont know if anything is better
  241. # [05:49] <danielfilho> think like this
  242. # [05:49] <danielfilho> everything you could do with ordinary html, can be done with html5.
  243. # [05:49] <buht> i need to basically load up. say 80, image frames, and play them at varying frame rates...
  244. # [05:49] <buht> say 15fps, 30fps, 60fps.... i think i need javascript to do that work
  245. # [05:49] <danielfilho> but better, even in a semantically way
  246. # [05:49] <danielfilho> change the frame rate of images?
  247. # [05:50] <danielfilho> how could it be done?
  248. # [05:50] <buht> would canvas be the right approach?
  249. # [05:50] <danielfilho> ah
  250. # [05:50] <danielfilho> get it.
  251. # [05:50] <buht> no not of images... of frames being played
  252. # [05:50] <buht> image frames...
  253. # [05:50] <danielfilho> make a gif-like animation with images.
  254. # [05:50] <danielfilho> *got it
  255. # [05:50] <buht> well i have to do a lot of post processing on those frames... so i need to stop on any frame of choice
  256. # [05:50] <danielfilho> well, you can do it with canvas
  257. # [05:50] <buht> or step through frames...
  258. # [05:50] <buht> window level, zoom,
  259. # [05:50] <buht> draw.
  260. # [05:50] <buht> etc
  261. # [05:50] <danielfilho> nice
  262. # [05:51] <danielfilho> will show you something
  263. # [05:51] <buht> so would u say <Canvas> ?
  264. # [05:51] <danielfilho> that is really great and I think that could help you
  265. # [05:51] <danielfilho> http://animatable.com/
  266. # [05:51] <danielfilho> but isn't public yet.
  267. # [05:51] <danielfilho> so, it shows that you can do what you want :D
  268. # [05:51] <danielfilho> you can do your thing with css3
  269. # [05:52] <buht> watching now.
  270. # [05:52] <danielfilho> ;)
  271. # [05:53] <danielfilho> anyway, you're in the right place. i'm the one with less knowledge about html5 here... here stands some of the monsters of this subject :)
  272. # [05:54] <danielfilho> modernizr is an initiative from paul_irish. yepnope from SlexAxton.
  273. # [05:55] <buht> kind of neat... hes sportin addidas
  274. # [05:55] <buht> hehe
  275. # [05:55] <danielfilho> hahaha
  276. # [05:55] <buht> so what ill be doing is...
  277. # [05:55] <buht> or need t do is....
  278. # [05:56] <buht> i have several images already.... with multiple frames comprising a multi-frame image that can be played....
  279. # [05:56] <buht> im going to strip the frames out....
  280. # [05:56] <buht> i want to feed them to a canvas, or something better if there is something better
  281. # [05:56] <buht> and play them using that.
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  283. # [05:56] <buht> i sort of did this mock-up the other night using javascript examples from the web.
  284. # [05:57] <danielfilho> I think so. I didn't get the whole idea very well, but I think that's is a way to do it.
  285. # [05:57] <buht> but now im not sure if i can use an asp.net backend or not. sounds like i can
  286. # [05:57] <danielfilho> yes
  287. # [05:57] <danielfilho> you totally can :)
  288. # [05:57] <buht> i was worried like events wouldnt work right.
  289. # [05:57] <buht> but if events today are all tied ot javascript, then of course they will
  290. # [05:57] <danielfilho> once again, this frame-image-animation thing has nothing to do with your backend.
  291. # [05:57] <danielfilho> only if you want to render in some different format or things like that.
  292. # [05:58] <buht> is it javascript that does the handling of grabbing files from a server?
  293. # [05:58] <danielfilho> nope, it's your backend that picks the images
  294. # [05:58] <buht> yes
  295. # [05:58] <buht> but what recieves them?
  296. # [05:58] <danielfilho> you can do through json or xml
  297. # [05:58] <buht> javascript?
  298. # [05:58] <buht> json?
  299. # [05:58] <danielfilho> send to your front-end and then make the magic with javascript or css.
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  302. # [05:59] <buht> when u send to front end, what begin and end points were made? like the server picked the data...
  303. # [05:59] <buht> and sent it to what some javascript handler?
  304. # [06:00] <buht> im going to need to write a method, or function, to tell the server to spit out say 80-100 images (really frames im going to stack in a canvas)
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  306. # [06:00] <buht> just was curious as to what opens the channel to push or pull that data...
  307. # [06:00] <danielfilho> you can have an .aspx that generates on your file system an .xml (or json) file, that your javascript requests, like $.getJSON form jquery
  308. # [06:00] <danielfilho> ?g $.getJSON buht
  309. # [06:00] <bot-t1> danielfilho, javascript - Catch $.getJSON error - Stack Overflow - http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4645993/catch-getjson-error
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  312. # [06:01] <danielfilho> yes
  313. # [06:01] <danielfilho> is the javascript.
  314. # [06:01] <buht> so i could....
  315. # [06:01] <danielfilho> http://api.jquery.com/jQuery.getJSON/
  316. # [06:01] <buht> 1. hava javascript send a request to my server to dish up some files...
  317. # [06:01] <buht> 2. the server feeds a list to the javascript function
  318. # [06:01] <danielfilho> exactly
  319. # [06:02] <buht> 3. the javascript somehow opens a channel to grab them?
  320. # [06:02] <buht> is this jquery stuff, all part of javascript and supported by the big browsers?
  321. # [06:02] <danielfilho> yup. you request via javascript, the server gives what js wants, then you filter and prepare the data to be shown. that's how it happens.
  322. # [06:03] <danielfilho> no, jquery is a javascript framework. see jquery.com
  323. # [06:03] <buht> must it be downloaded?
  324. # [06:03] <danielfilho> well, we've got something to read :)
  325. # [06:03] <danielfilho> you call as <script type="text/javascript" src="/path/to/the/jquery.min.js"></script>
  326. # [06:04] <danielfilho> or from google's cdn
  327. # [06:04] <buht> ok so my users will not have to download the framework before seeing ym web site function correctly
  328. # [06:04] <buht> because that is what i want to avoid.
  329. # [06:04] <danielfilho> they do, but they do it as part of the page. no need to extras downloads or prompting for permissions.
  330. # [06:04] <buht> oh ok.
  331. # [06:04] <danielfilho> like it is an image, or a css.
  332. # [06:04] <buht> they dont need ot download a package and click buttons and shit
  333. # [06:04] <danielfilho> nope.
  334. # [06:04] <buht> it just does it
  335. # [06:04] <danielfilho> no need to do it.
  336. # [06:05] <buht> like loading any stylesheet or something
  337. # [06:05] <danielfilho> exactly
  338. # [06:05] <buht> k
  339. # [06:05] <buht> thanks for your help and tips.... im a standalong app c# dabbler, i dont code for a living... i play with it
  340. # [06:05] <buht> learning javascript seems like a must-know these days
  341. # [06:06] <danielfilho> nice!
  342. # [06:06] <danielfilho> anytime you need, come over here and ask
  343. # [06:06] <danielfilho> everyone is pretty elegant and likes to help :)
  344. # [06:06] <buht> i will for sure... ill become a reg in no time
  345. # [06:06] <danielfilho> neat :)
  346. # [06:06] <buht> been using irc for about 17 years
  347. # [06:06] <danielfilho> well, be welcome. gotta go home now. it's 1h03am here and still at work
  348. # [06:07] <buht> word. where from?
  349. # [06:07] * Joins: obert- (~obert@host60-200-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
  350. # [06:07] <danielfilho> Brazil
  351. # [06:07] <buht> thx again daniel.
  352. # [06:07] <danielfilho> no problem. see you!
  353. # [06:07] <buht> l8r.
  354. # [06:07] <buht> guess ill have to grab an irc client again..
  355. # [06:07] <buht> been years...
  356. # [06:08] <buht> though this web one has the basic needs
  357. # [06:08] <buht> ttyl. excellent help in here for sure!
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  377. # [07:09] <tw2113> sup cgcardona
  378. # [07:10] <cgcardona> what up dawg?
  379. # [07:10] <cgcardona> messin with some codeigniter. You?
  380. # [07:13] * Quits: bot-t1 (temp01@unaffiliated/temp01/bot/bot-t) (Quit: Rebooting..)
  381. # [07:13] * Joins: bot-t (temp01@unaffiliated/temp01/bot/bot-t)
  382. # [07:14] <tw2113> preparing to return to a menu with z-index issues
  383. # [07:14] <tw2113> i can not seem to manage to get the menu to appear above some images
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  386. # [07:16] <tw2113> wb
  387. # [07:17] <cgcardona> dude my internet connection sucks sometimes. I can't explain why I get kicked off :-/
  388. # [07:17] <tw2113> gnomes hate you for some reason
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  392. # [07:17] <cgcardona> i hope not :(
  393. # [07:18] <cgcardona> i have a couple in my front yard garden
  394. # [07:18] <tw2113> didja see my tweets regarding the domains i got?>
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  495. # [13:23] <Putr> hi. Is it possible to pan a canvas? (click and drag)
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  497. # [13:29] <robhawkes> Yes, but it's not built in
  498. # [13:30] <robhawkes> Putr: You could make the canvas extend larger than a masking viewport, then add JS to move the canvas when dragged
  499. # [13:30] <Putr> ok so i found this http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2390962/html-canvas-intelligent-drawing
  500. # [13:30] <Putr> robhawkes: ye that's what it says. So i thought. If the canvas get's 2 big i could pause and redraw (to limit memory usage)
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  502. # [13:31] <Putr> but how much memory does canvas use? how big can it get?
  503. # [13:32] <robhawkes> You'd have to experiment with it and find out
  504. # [13:32] <robhawkes> It depends what you're doing I suppose
  505. # [13:32] <Putr> ok :) cool
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  545. # [15:29] <Putr> how do i, in canvas control what image is on top (if two are overlaying)
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  553. # [15:52] <Ms2ger> Putr, the last one you draw is on top, it's like in Paint
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  555. # [15:54] <Putr> Ms2ger: ye I've had some inconsistency with that across browsers
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  562. # [16:10] <Putr> Ms2ger: this is in fact not true
  563. # [16:10] <Putr> it's true for opera
  564. # [16:10] <Putr> but chrome and safari use threads and it's compleatly random
  565. # [16:14] <zewt> i doubt that, it would be a catastrophic bug; can you give a small example
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  636. # [19:47] <tw2113> afternoon thatryan antonkovalyov and robhawkes
  637. # [19:47] <antonkovalyov> hey
  638. # [19:47] <thatryan> hey man
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  640. # [19:48] <zatan> can I get this in PDF format ?
  641. # [19:48] <zatan> http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec-author-view/
  642. # [19:48] <Ms2ger> Sure, just print it ;)
  643. # [19:49] <matijsb> http://docraptor.com/ otherwise?
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  645. # [19:49] <Ms2ger> Princexml.com
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  647. # [19:51] <robhawkes> tw2113: Hi :)
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  649. # [19:52] * tw2113 is going to watch divya present at WordCamp Seattle
  650. # [19:52] <tw2113> http://live.blazestreaming.com/wcsea/2011/developer.html if you want the live stream
  651. # [19:52] <tw2113> it'll be 20 minutes or so
  652. # [19:53] <zatan> Ms2ger, I am asking PDF not a paper format
  653. # [19:53] <matijsb> zatan: print to PDF
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  655. # [19:54] <zatan> matijsb, got it :) Ms2ger sorry :)
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  682. # [20:28] <tw2113> it's miketaylr :O
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  687. # [20:33] <miketaylr> sup tw2113 :)
  688. # [20:33] <tw2113> watching nimbupani at wordcamp seattle
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  690. # [20:33] <miketaylr> oh cool
  691. # [20:34] <miketaylr> is that where you live?
  692. # [20:34] <tw2113> no
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  694. # [20:34] <tw2113> i'm having to stream it
  695. # [20:34] <miketaylr> aha
  696. # [20:34] <miketaylr> is she on right now?
  697. # [20:34] <tw2113> yup
  698. # [20:34] <miketaylr> link?
  699. # [20:34] <tw2113> http://live.blazestreaming.com/wcsea/2011/developer.html
  700. # [20:34] <miketaylr> thx dude
  701. # [20:35] <tw2113> i get the feeling she's mostly done, but if you want, i am sure it'll be posted later
  702. # [20:35] <miketaylr> heh "before i finish" first thing i hear
  703. # [20:35] <tw2113> lols
  704. # [20:35] <tw2113> wordcamps are good at posting afterthefact, just give a day or two
  705. # [20:36] <miketaylr> that's cool
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  708. # [20:38] <tw2113> dude, she spelled "holla" wron
  709. # [20:38] <miketaylr> turned away just long enough to pay attn to divya and my 18 m.o. is licking the bottom of his shoe >:|
  710. # [20:38] <tw2113> wrong*
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  714. # [20:43] <tw2113> i'll keep my eye out for it miketaylr and send the link your way
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  716. # [20:44] <miketaylr> gracias amigo
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  754. # [22:09] <josefrichter> anyone using history.js? the latest version pushes urls like /#./kuchyne (with redundand dot) - why??
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  759. # [22:19] * nbari|away is now known as nbari
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  771. # [22:41] * Immortal is now known as Erkan
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  776. # [22:51] <tw2113> nimbupani I saw you live from South Dakota
  777. # [22:51] <nimbupani> surreal tw2113
  778. # [22:51] <tw2113> it's like i was there, but not
  779. # [22:54] * Rob- is now known as robhawkes
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  788. # [23:19] <tomh-> hey anyone into html5 game development?
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  803. # Session Close: Sun Apr 17 00:00:00 2011

The end :)