/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2011-04-17 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Sun Apr 17 00:00:00 2011
  2. # Session Ident: #html5
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  14. # [00:22] <robhawkes> tomh-: Still looking for people into HTML5 game development?
  15. # [00:22] <tomh-> oh I was just wondering
  16. # [00:22] <tomh-> who else on the internet was interested in html5 gamedev :)
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  20. # [00:29] <robhawkes> Ah, I am! :)
  21. # [00:30] <robhawkes> Seems to be a growing area of interest at the moment
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  23. # [00:30] <robhawkes> I take it you are?
  24. # [00:31] <tomh-> I am yes
  25. # [00:32] <tomh-> made any games yet robhawkes?
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  27. # [00:37] <robhawkes> tomh-: I wrote a book about making games in HTML5! ;)
  28. # [00:37] <robhawkes> But seriously, I'm currently working on Rawkets http://rawkes.com/search/results/a8ae53df2ba2b71e77a6cd5827d709e1/
  29. # [00:38] <tomh-> you wrote a book on it?
  30. # [00:38] <robhawkes> It's a massively multiplayer space shoot-em-up
  31. # [00:38] <tomh-> which one? :P
  32. # [00:38] <robhawkes> Foundation HTML5 Canvas: For Games and Entertainment
  33. # [00:38] <robhawkes> It's on that link I gave you :)
  34. # [00:38] <tomh-> ah cool
  35. # [00:39] <robhawkes> So what cool things are you working on?
  36. # [00:39] <tomh-> do you get into rendering optimization techniques for mobile devices in the book? :P
  37. # [00:40] <tomh-> I'm just looking around for the latest buzz on html5 game dev :)
  38. # [00:40] <robhawkes> Indirectly, perhaps. I don't have a chapter on mobile development. Maybe in the second edition!
  39. # [00:40] <tomh-> I created one game myself
  40. # [00:40] <tomh-> ok
  41. # [00:40] <robhawkes> What was your game?
  42. # [00:40] <tomh-> you don't talk about any rendering optimizations?
  43. # [00:40] <tomh-> eh http://html5.intellicode.nl
  44. # [00:41] <tomh-> made that in like 17 hours so its not really that big ;p
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  46. # [00:42] <robhawkes> Of course, but they are maining things like pixel-snapping and best programming practice. No magic bullets.
  47. # [00:42] <tomh-> ok
  48. # [00:44] <robhawkes> Nice game. I can't win! :P
  49. # [00:44] <tomh-> haha
  50. # [00:44] <tomh-> which level?
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  54. # [00:44] <robhawkes> Oh, I sussed it now
  55. # [00:44] <robhawkes> I was trying to encase the monkey in a stone castle
  56. # [00:44] <paul_irish> hi tomh- ! :) i love this game
  57. # [00:45] <Misiur1> Hi.
  58. # [00:45] <tomh-> hey paul_irish :)
  59. # [00:45] <Misiur1> Is anyone here using firefox 6 (nightly)?
  60. # [00:45] * Joins: coldhead (20144@ninthfloor.org)
  61. # [00:45] <paul_irish> i've been slowly collecting a few things on canvas optimization here http://oksoclap.com/canvasoptimizations <== tomh-
  62. # [00:45] <tomh-> paul_irish: I work at spilgames now as html5 dev :)
  63. # [00:45] <paul_irish> oh no way! hahah that's cool
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  65. # [00:45] <tomh-> lemme check that link
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  69. # [00:46] <tomh-> is that etherpad?
  70. # [00:46] <paul_irish> ya
  71. # [00:46] <paul_irish> private instance that me and some friends use
  72. # [00:47] <robhawkes> paul_irish: I'm so keeping an eye on this etherpad
  73. # [00:47] <paul_irish> eventually i wanna write this up in a big list
  74. # [00:47] <paul_irish> or like.. make canvasoptimiziations.com
  75. # [00:47] <paul_irish> or you can :)
  76. # [00:47] <robhawkes> Is it meant to have Rawkets in the title?
  77. # [00:48] <tomh-> im bookmarking that etherpad :)
  78. # [00:48] <Misiur1> I'd like to read those tips too
  79. # [00:49] <paul_irish> oh and feel free to add to it if you identify more
  80. # [00:49] <paul_irish> hah
  81. # [00:49] <tomh-> I'm still trying to find a good article about those dirty rectangle techniques
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  83. # [00:50] <tomh-> I've also seen some talks about the automatic redraw regions used in crafty
  84. # [00:50] <Misiur1> I'd like to see how will webdevelopment look in 10 years forward
  85. # [00:50] <tomh-> Misiur1: the same, thats when MS caught up with IE on the current standards ;p
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  88. # [00:51] <Misiur1> tomh-: at least moment when current browsers have 75% of market
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  90. # [00:52] <tomh-> paul_irish: I added the link to the crafty blog post about redraw regions
  91. # [00:52] <paul_irish> sweetness! thx
  92. # [00:53] <Misiur1> Hmm, this FF6 has lower scores than FF4
  93. # [00:53] <Misiur1> *according to http://www.browserscope.org/
  94. # [00:54] <robhawkes> Misiur1: You realise FF6 isn't due out for a while yet? :P
  95. # [00:55] <robhawkes> Nightlies are known to be funky
  96. # [00:56] <Misiur1> robhawkes: Yeah, I still have high expectation in mozilla team
  97. # [00:56] <tomh-> robhawkes: do you have a direct link to your game? :P
  98. # [00:56] <robhawkes> Misiur1: Nightly is where they test stuff though, I wouldn't use it to judge support for technologies :)
  99. # [00:57] <robhawkes> tomh-: http://rawkets.com (you need a browser with WebSockets turned on, for now)
  100. # [00:58] <Misiur1> robhawkes: I just though that they use at least newest developments from ff4, but as I can see I was wrong. I'm going to stick with 4 for now.
  101. # [00:58] <tomh-> hehe cool game :D
  102. # [00:59] <robhawkes> Misiur1: They do, but they're also testing new things all the time, which might break something else
  103. # [00:59] <robhawkes> paul_irish: You played Rawkets before?
  104. # [00:59] <Misiur1> robhawkes: Oh. Well, they have still a lot of time.
  105. # [01:00] <paul_irish> god damn it i'm terrible
  106. # [01:00] <paul_irish> its rumpetroll but with shooting!
  107. # [01:00] <paul_irish> :D
  108. # [01:00] <robhawkes> For the record. Rawkets isn't even at a beta level yet ;)
  109. # [01:00] <robhawkes> This was an experimental concept that went public
  110. # [01:00] <paul_irish> do i suck less when it gets out of beta?
  111. # [01:01] <tomh-> haha
  112. # [01:01] <robhawkes> Sure, and I can make you a different colour
  113. # [01:01] <robhawkes> ;)
  114. # [01:01] <tomh-> whats the backend?
  115. # [01:01] <tomh-> or is it all p2p?
  116. # [01:02] <Misiur1> robhawkes: does it check browser version, or just websockets support?
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  118. # [01:03] <robhawkes> tomh-: It's a Node backend with simple WebSockets for communication
  119. # [01:03] <robhawkes> No p2p (not supported yet)
  120. # [01:03] <tomh-> ok
  121. # [01:04] <robhawkes> Misiur1: At the moment it just looks for WebSockets support, but I'm going to use Socket.IO for Flash fallback
  122. # [01:04] <tomh-> I hear a lot of people switching away from node.js again
  123. # [01:04] <robhawkes> Really?
  124. # [01:04] <robhawkes> I'm using it more and more
  125. # [01:04] <tomh-> ah ok
  126. # [01:05] <robhawkes> Recently sussed how to use multiple Node processes across multiple processors on my computer. Allows for some super quick data analysis!
  127. # [01:05] <tomh-> I haven't really used it yet, but I want to read a bit more on how to deal with nested event callbacks in a proper way first :)
  128. # [01:05] <Misiur1> Did you read some inspiring articles, or everything that you saw?
  129. # [01:06] <tomh-> inspiring articles about?
  130. # [01:06] <Misiur1> node
  131. # [01:07] <tomh-> I haven't read any actually
  132. # [01:07] <tomh-> any inspiring articles about node that is :P
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  134. # [01:10] <Misiur1> robhawkes: Rawkets looks incredible :o Also: did you have any favourite articles?
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  138. # [01:13] <davidmurdoch> @paul_irish, sorry...I had to leave my desk right after I posted that link. I could get any SVG filter to work in FF with HTML5 boilerplate (leaving content-type as text/html). Have you been able to do it? It just makes the element disappear whenever I tried.
  139. # [01:14] <robhawkes> Misiur: Thanks. Articles for Node? Not really. I just picked it up through playing around with the documentation, and looking at source code of other Node projects.
  140. # [01:14] <robhawkes> What is it that you're trying to learn?
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  142. # [01:15] <Misiur> robhawkes: well, I'm really missing out lately, and now I'm reading pretty much everything
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  144. # [01:16] <robhawkes> I wouldn't worry about it. Just be aware of what Node does and why it's useful, and if you're not going to use it then that's enough.
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  147. # [01:18] <Misiur> robhawkes: ok, thanks for your time. I've learned a lot of things lately, like: IRC is really useful, git is great tool, objects in JS are awesome, IE7&8 are now even bigger enemies than IE6 was few years ago
  148. # [01:19] <tomh-> just ignore IE :>
  149. # [01:19] <tw2113> IEwhat?
  150. # [01:20] <Misiur> tomh-: Haha, unfotunately my contracts include IE's (and that's I'm missing out, because I can't use modern solutions).
  151. # [01:20] <tomh-> hehe, go into mobile webdev :)
  152. # [01:21] <robhawkes> It's hit and miss with IE atm. They announce support for a raft of cool features (that should've been supported ages ago, but we'll brush over that), then they drop a clanger like the whole "native HTML5" stuff.
  153. # [01:21] <tw2113> lolz
  154. # [01:21] <robhawkes> And tbh, it's not a prob with the IE team (at least not the people I know), it's the marketing peeps
  155. # [01:22] <tomh-> well chrome and safari on windows are still better than IE
  156. # [01:22] <tw2113> MS is great with spin, they should get into politics, they'd fit in well
  157. # [01:22] <robhawkes> They'll pick a buzzword and run out the freaking room with it! =p
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  159. # [01:23] <Misiur> http://cordobo.com/wp-content/uploads/pure-css-animated-3d-super-mario/ - this + safari == WOW
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  161. # [01:23] <tw2113> FF4 doesn't quite like it
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  163. # [01:26] <Misiur> God, now it's time to get back and work over IE7 not rendering transparent properly...
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  165. # [01:30] <tomh-> well time for sleep
  166. # [01:30] <tomh-> laters
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  180. # [01:59] <davidmurdoch> @paul_irish_, i meant to say that I could NOT get the SVG filters to work.
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  201. # [02:14] <grantg> Ok, who here is responsible for http://www.nyan.cat/ ?
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  203. # [02:16] <tw2113> i regret opening that
  204. # [02:16] <grantg> seriously
  205. # [02:16] <tw2113> time to make others do the same :D
  206. # [02:16] <tw2113> to twitter!
  207. # [02:16] <pa7> regretting too ;)
  208. # [02:16] * Joins: antonkovalyov (~antonkova@205.248.100.252)
  209. # [02:17] <tw2113> go go gadget rogue tweeting
  210. # [02:21] <Misiur> I couldn't stop watching it for 5 minutes
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  213. # [02:28] <grantg> lolwut, http://twitter.com/nyannyancat
  214. # [02:28] <socialhapy> http://bit.ly/fyIOeV @nyannyancat: @craftyhanna NYAAAAAANNNNNNN......!!!! ^^
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  216. # [02:29] * grantg is waiting for the pop tart cat to do a barrel roll. -_-
  217. # [02:30] <grantg> fffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuu, it's audio backend is friggen flash
  218. # [02:30] <grantg> bitch, decode the .mp3 in JS and re-encode it to .WAV in JS. <_<
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  220. # [02:32] <grantg> yes, you can decode unknown codecs in JS and re-encode them to the browser-supported codec of choice. ;)
  221. # [02:32] <grantg> data uri love 4 all
  222. # [02:33] <grantg> --> same with video.
  223. # [02:33] <grantg> actually putImageData the frames to canvas
  224. # [02:33] <grantg> :)
  225. # [02:34] <grantg> </rant>
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  232. # [02:58] <tw2113> which stuff is needed for the 3D stuff we're starting to see?
  233. # [02:58] <grantg> which stuff are you referring to?
  234. # [02:58] <tw2113> i have a strange idea for some 3D like effect + menus
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  236. # [02:59] <tw2113> kind of like the navbar is a 3D rectangle, and when you hover over it, it rotates 90 degrees
  237. # [02:59] <tw2113> to show more info
  238. # [02:59] <grantg> Are you sure you want to use WebGL over CSS 3D animations?
  239. # [02:59] <grantg> I hear IE10 is gonna support CSS 3D. :P
  240. # [02:59] <tw2113> just kind of thinking outloud really
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  242. # [03:00] <tw2113> if anything, i could do it with a bg image and transitions etc
  243. # [03:00] <grantg> you could always fake it, yeah. :P
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  250. # [03:20] <grantg> tw2113: Funny that I left out my HALT opcode dynarec patch from the JS GBC emu for so long.
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  252. # [03:21] <grantg> Should get way faster now on some games.
  253. # [03:22] <grantg> Funny how it already can get below 20% CPU usage on chrome even before the patch. :)
  254. # [03:22] <grantg> lower CPU usage than emulators coded in C++ and assembly
  255. # [03:23] <tw2113> lower resources = win
  256. # [03:23] <tw2113> regarding need for it
  257. # [03:23] <grantg> --> and lower memory usage
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  259. # [03:23] <grantg> gambatte can nom up to 500 MB for some reasons. :/
  260. # [03:23] <grantg> Mine does a few dozen megs
  261. # [03:24] <grantg> and that's even with a hella lot of caching
  262. # [03:25] <grantg> x-coord of SPR/OAM RAM being cached for DMG ROMs, tile caching for each possible tile render direction, white noise cached
  263. # [03:25] <grantg> all the sound variables cached hella lot
  264. # [03:25] <grantg> :|
  265. # [03:26] <grantg> shit I guess desktop emu writers didn't think of.
  266. # [03:26] <grantg> or care to do
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  268. # [03:27] <grantg> oh, and the memory bank controller chip address line offset caching. <--
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  271. # [03:28] <grantg> big win there
  272. # [03:29] <grantg> if none of this was done, it'd be running at 10 fps max
  273. # [03:34] <grantg> also the gfx rendering was unrolled where possible, so some portions of the rendering process can have 8 pixels rendered at the same time without a conditional for each.
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  275. # [03:38] <grantg> A wild hipster appears: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uYsjs_xleg
  276. # [03:42] <grantg> From the people who brought you nyad.cat : http://www.lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalala.com/
  277. # [03:44] <grantg> and http://nyanpig.com/
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  286. # [03:58] <tw2113> ping paul_irish_ :D
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  290. # [04:02] <tw2113> actually, my question could be asked of anyone....what's a good book for a javascript n00b?
  291. # [04:02] <tw2113> i'm willing to start as if i know nothing
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  295. # [04:11] * psynaptic is now known as psynaptic|away
  296. # [04:14] <grantg> BEST SHIT EVER - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loSzpvq73FY
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  299. # [04:20] <grantg> tw2113: The internet is a good book. ;)
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  307. # [04:32] <tw2113> grantg i'd like something a bit more concise than that :P
  308. # [04:32] <grantg> hwh
  309. # [04:32] <grantg> heh
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  314. # [04:47] <moshee> Amnesia's only scary if you're super high
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  335. # [06:47] <grantg> paul_irish_: ping
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  337. # [06:47] * grantg is releasing another youtube video, but this time chrome
  338. # [06:48] <grantg> on purpose to show what the hell is buggy with web audio in chrome
  339. # [06:48] <grantg> and has been buggy since feb
  340. # [06:48] <grantg> <_<
  341. # [06:49] <grantg> WebKit Web Audio in Chrome:Y U NO USE HARDWARE INTERRUPTS OR PROPER OS CALLBACKS?
  342. # [06:49] <grantg> *AUDIO HARDWARE INTERRUPTS
  343. # [06:49] <grantg> timer based re-fill is a no-no and usually a root cause of the clickity and the poppity
  344. # [06:50] <grantg> because timer callbacks can always run late
  345. # [06:50] <grantg> due to line-ups
  346. # [06:51] <grantg> while audio hardware based callbacks, well, are deterministic on the hardware state
  347. # [06:51] <grantg> :/
  348. # [06:52] <grantg> and if the hardware based is correct, then the JS callback isn't being called enough
  349. # [06:52] <grantg> though reading the audio hardware data should give enough stats to determine exactly how much is needed
  350. # [06:52] <grantg> so there's no clickity and poppity even on slight delays.
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  355. # [07:21] <grantg> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjX1xXKWXtI
  356. # [07:21] <grantg> :/
  357. # [07:21] <grantg> chrome Y U NO
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  359. # [07:25] <tw2113> always testing in the latest greatest builds?
  360. # [07:26] <grantg> yeah
  361. # [07:26] <tw2113> just making sure
  362. # [07:26] <grantg> been the same result since feb
  363. # [07:26] <tw2113> lols chrome blows
  364. # [07:27] <tw2113> jk don't bootme
  365. # [07:27] <grantg> heh
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  367. # [07:27] <grantg> with that much clickity and poppity it just might. :/
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  369. # [07:29] * tw2113 browses amazon for vinyl albums to add to his wishlist
  370. # [07:29] <tw2113> what a travesty...not a single talking heads album shown yt
  371. # [07:29] <tw2113> yet*
  372. # [07:30] <grantg> heh
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  448. # [12:15] <obert-> :) http://html5demos.com/history/
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  453. # [12:23] <Casperin> neat :)
  454. # [12:24] <tomh-> obert-: got stats on what browsers that work?
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  456. # [12:27] <tomh-> oh nvm http://caniuse.com/#search=history
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The end :)