/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2011-10-07 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Fri Oct 07 00:00:00 2011
  2. # Session Ident: #html5
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  20. # [00:14] <newz2000> Just read the new nexus phone will have 1280x720 screen. They're sure making things harder for people who use media queries to detect screen size.
  21. # [00:14] <newz2000> s/detect/optimize for/
  22. # [00:14] <sean`> haha
  23. # [00:14] <tw2113> they're recreating computers from the ground up
  24. # [00:14] <tw2113> start out with a small phone, soon we are back to a full laptop
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  26. # [00:15] <newz2000> this is a serous challenge. a 720px wide mobile screen is a lot different than even an 800px wide computer
  27. # [00:16] <newz2000> I guess I don't really optimize for 800px wide screens any more, but still
  28. # [00:16] <sean`> isn't retina like the same thing?
  29. # [00:16] <newz2000> Yeah, but it doesn't seem to trigger the same problems with media queries, which is interesting now that you mention it
  30. # [00:17] <sean`> is there a release date?
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  32. # [00:17] <newz2000> supposedly being officially announced next week, but I'll bet it'll be released in early Nov
  33. # [00:17] <newz2000> pure speculation on my part though
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  35. # [00:18] <newz2000> here's a link: http://www.bgr.com/2011/10/06/samsung-galaxy-nexus-full-specs-revealed-verizon-wireless-exclusive/
  36. # [00:18] <sean`> newz2000, check out htc sensation
  37. # [00:18] <sean`> 4,7" lcd, 800x480 4,3" slcd, 960x540 4,3" slcd, 960x540
  38. # [00:18] <sean`> It'll come in those shapessizes
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  42. # [00:19] <newz2000> yeah, I tested one of the newer droids that had a screen like that. That's the first time I realized my standard media query solution wasn't working.
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  44. # [00:19] <sean`> sucks balls
  45. # [00:19] <newz2000> I also tried media="handheld" which didn't work at all (ignored by smart phones)
  46. # [00:20] <sandprickle> I was thinking it would be hard to work with the retina display; this is even harder
  47. # [00:21] <sean`> newz2000, http://rezitech.github.com/syze/
  48. # [00:21] <sean`> could helpy ou out a lot
  49. # [00:21] <newz2000> Hmm, that's very intriguing.
  50. # [00:22] <sean`> anyways, I'm outzies
  51. # [00:22] <newz2000> thanks sean`
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  53. # [00:23] <sandprickle> how hard would it be to use ([min || max]-resolution: xxxdpi)?
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  55. # [00:24] <newz2000> I've not used dpi, does that work in a media query?
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  57. # [00:25] <sandprickle> yeah: http://reference.sitepoint.com/css/mediaqueries
  58. # [00:26] <newz2000> I'll have to give it a try.
  59. # [00:26] <newz2000> the only high res device I have on hand is a windows phone 7, not sure if IE on there is trustworthy to check support of newer standards
  60. # [00:27] <sandprickle> hmm yeah idk
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  67. # [00:40] * GoOz is now known as GoOz`aw
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  77. # [00:53] <JonathanNeal> It is a bit exhaustive to completely rewrite diveintohtml5, but the rewards for maintenance will be great http://www.diveinto.org/html51/
  78. # [00:55] <JonathanNeal> I'm starting with almost no style, just making sure the information appears on each page and is formatted correctly. Then I'll worry about style.
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  95. # [01:37] <sandprickle> best hosting?
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  110. # [01:57] <ExpFist> Man why has HTML5 become such a buzzword lately
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  114. # [02:08] <sandprickle> ikr
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  117. # [02:16] <Pomax> "lately"?
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  119. # [02:17] <tw2113> it's been building as a buzzword since january if not earlier
  120. # [02:17] <tw2113> most likely earlier
  121. # [02:18] <Pomax> try a lot earlier.
  122. # [02:18] <tw2113> go too far back and it was just slow brooding :D
  123. # [02:18] <Pomax> just find the first article that says "I'm sick of people calling ... HTML5" =)
  124. # [02:18] <tw2113> the issue is mostly getting people to properly separate out the different parts
  125. # [02:19] <Pomax> separate out, eh
  126. # [02:19] <tw2113> svg != html5
  127. # [02:19] <Pomax> but yes. most people lob html, css and JS APIs under "html5"
  128. # [02:19] <tw2113> css3 certainly doesn't
  129. # [02:19] <Pomax> for the simple reason that to most people who just look at the web just see "webpages" and that means they must be "html"
  130. # [02:19] <Pomax> bless them.
  131. # [02:20] <OzDave_mbp> http://www.google.com/trends?q=html5
  132. # [02:20] <sandprickle> even the W3C does it: http://www.w3.org/html/logo/
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  134. # [02:20] <Pomax> I can't take W3C serious anymore
  135. # [02:20] <Pomax> not after the jungle-fever theme they pulled on their spec site for CSS
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  137. # [02:20] <tw2113> that logo kind of sparked the issue
  138. # [02:21] <sandprickle> Pomax: I haven't seen that
  139. # [02:21] <Pomax> let's see if it's still there
  140. # [02:21] <Pomax> it was, to say the least, utterly bonkers
  141. # [02:22] <sandprickle> hehe
  142. # [02:22] <Pomax> nope, can't find it anymore.
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  149. # [02:33] <ryanseddon> rad firefox 10 finally has 3d css!
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  151. # [02:38] <OzDave_mbp> http://labs.adobe.com/wiki/index.php/Wallaby fails on cs3 and flash 8 FLA I will have to upgrade if I want to take that export path however the list is weaksauce so its faster by hand.
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  204. # [04:32] <Conti> anyone here screwing with jquery mobile?
  205. # [04:33] <Conti> the documentation isn't fully complete yet and i'm wondering how to use a header/footer button element to submit a form
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  252. # [06:35] <moshee> any way to make a new Worker() with code inline instead of a seperate js file?
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  258. # [06:40] <moshee> oh, blobs... meh
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  337. # [08:58] <JonathanNeal> heyo
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  342. # [09:01] <thatryan> heyo
  343. # [09:04] <thatryan> pre-ordering?
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  345. # [09:07] <tw2113> thatryan i came to a realization tonight
  346. # [09:07] <tw2113> a couple actually
  347. # [09:07] <grantg> which game?
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  349. # [09:10] <JonathanNeal> thatryan: pre-ordering?
  350. # [09:10] <thatryan> iphone
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  352. # [09:10] <grantg> oh
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  354. # [09:11] <grantg> You all want the iPhone 4S that badly?
  355. # [09:11] <JonathanNeal> Hahaha
  356. # [09:11] <JonathanNeal> Good idea.
  357. # [09:11] <thatryan> lol it is new and shiny, i must have it :)
  358. # [09:11] <grantg> just put an "S" sticker on the back of your iPhone 4
  359. # [09:11] <JonathanNeal> Does it cost money to pre-order?
  360. # [09:12] <tw2113> iWhat?
  361. # [09:13] <thatryan> lol
  362. # [09:13] <grantg> The disappointment is what killed Steve. :P
  363. # [09:13] <tw2113> maybe he made his exit before blame could be placed on him?
  364. # [09:13] <JonathanNeal> whoa
  365. # [09:14] <tw2113> too soon still?
  366. # [09:14] <thatryan> no his Consciousness is now known as "Siri"
  367. # [09:14] <JonathanNeal> let's be nice to the living and the dead.
  368. # [09:14] <tw2113> too bad flash didn't go first
  369. # [09:14] <grantg> lol
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  371. # [09:15] <grantg> This showcase video of the iphone 4s sucks - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
  372. # [09:15] <grantg> that hand... it's too perfect
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  374. # [09:16] <moshee> damn it grantg
  375. # [09:17] <grantg> problem?
  376. # [09:17] <moshee> :(
  377. # [09:18] <moshee> so anyone want to help me figure out why my perlin noise is not working?
  378. # [09:18] <grantg> moshee: Always the first to fall for a rickroll, eh?
  379. # [09:18] <tw2113> i can legitimately claim to not have had much Steve Jobs influence
  380. # [09:18] <tw2113> i barely ever paid attention to the guy
  381. # [09:20] <moshee> I prettty much copied this pseudocode line for line into javascript
  382. # [09:20] <moshee> why doesn't it work :(((
  383. # [09:20] <tw2113> i should clarify, no direct influence
  384. # [09:22] <JonathanNeal> If I wanna facepalm, I'll watch a Joel Osteen video.
  385. # [09:23] <tw2113> instead you get me?
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  387. # [09:24] <Zerodigit> damn i got rickrolled, and i thought that would never happen to me again
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  389. # [09:26] <grantg> heh
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  395. # [09:36] <JonathanNeal> bleh http://www.diveinto.org/html51/article-detect.html
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  435. # [10:59] <RLa> so html5 crappy doctype breaks with xslt?
  436. # [11:00] <RLa> anyone using xslt here, how to produce html5 doctype without hacks?
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  438. # [11:01] <RLa> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3387127/set-html5-doctype-with-xslt
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  469. # [11:29] <Wolthers> anyone at frontiers?
  470. # [11:29] <Wolthers> -i+e
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  472. # [11:30] <RLa> ok, here's the issue in w3 tracker: http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/54
  473. # [11:31] <aQustic> yup
  474. # [11:31] <RLa> not all of us use crappy php to "echo" out their markup
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  485. # [11:49] <aQustic> great talk divya
  486. # [11:49] <divya> thnx aQustic!
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  515. # [13:17] <hermanus> I'm wondering what the best wrapper would be for wordPress widgets. Most modern themes put them in asides, but according to the html5 spec aside should be related to the content. that's mostly not the case with wordpress widgets. so what would the best wrapper be, aside or something like section? thanks
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  517. # [13:19] <RLa> most wp widgets i have seen are related to the content
  518. # [13:21] <RLa> things like last random n posts, tag clouds etc.
  519. # [13:21] <RLa> they are related but not part of the content
  520. # [13:21] <RLa> when displaying single post
  521. # [13:22] <hermanus> hmm ok, so that counts as related? it's related to the content of the website, but not to the article itself
  522. # [13:26] <hermanus> wordpress has an aside post format that is meant for showing articles/qoutes/whatever that are related to the current article. that's correct use of aside, at least, that's how I interpreted the specs
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  531. # [13:38] <huskyr_> hi guys
  532. # [13:38] <huskyr_> i'm sure there's a new wonderful CSS3 property for figuring out if an element has a scrollbar
  533. # [13:39] <huskyr_> i just can't find it
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  535. # [13:42] <root66> does anyone have experience with multiplayer gaming via websocket? is it worth persuing?
  536. # [13:42] <root66> realtime movement, I mean
  537. # [13:42] <root66> not turn-based
  538. # [13:43] <jetienne> root66: yes and yes
  539. # [13:44] <root66> do you only use one socket perclient, or a capability-like system where one socket is dedicated to streaming updates and another for sending?
  540. # [13:44] <jetienne> root66: websocket is bidirectionnal, you dont need too
  541. # [13:44] <jetienne> two
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  543. # [13:45] <root66> yeah, but sending in the middle of the stream interrupts it until you receive an ack for the bit you sent, no?
  544. # [13:45] <jetienne> root66: no. tcp is way more subtle than that :)
  545. # [13:46] <jetienne> root66: you can easily take off a little socket.io example and play with it
  546. # [13:46] <root66> actually i'll probably create some sort of test for it
  547. # [13:46] <jetienne> root66: it will help you understand and likely reassure you on the performance
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  549. # [13:47] <root66> like see how many lines are processed in 30 seconds when it is only receiving, vs if something is sent out every 10 lines or so
  550. # [13:47] <root66> if I repeated that a few times and took the averages that should be a pretty good tell
  551. # [13:47] <root66> anyway thanks for the vote of confidence
  552. # [13:47] <jetienne> root66: yep such a bench would be usefull before actually starting
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  555. # [13:48] <jetienne> root66: if you go socket.io there is a #socket.io
  556. # [13:48] <root66> ok
  557. # [13:49] * GoOz`aw is now known as GoOz
  558. # [13:52] <mokush> on iOS, if I use a translate3d(0,0,0), and then use transitions to change the left property of a node, will it be hw accel? or do I need to use 3dtransforms to move it around, in order to have hw acc?
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  625. # [15:42] <chrisdev> anyone know how to disable the cache in Chrome during web development?
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  629. # [15:48] <hermanus> you can change the header via php, so just include a php file that changes the headers to no caching
  630. # [15:49] <hermanus> ah but that's only php, so nonsense
  631. # [15:49] <hermanus> use .htaccess
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  633. # [15:51] <RLa> does SHIFT+Refresh also work in chrome?
  634. # [15:51] <RLa> or is that CTRL+Refresh
  635. # [15:51] <RLa> using it myself
  636. # [15:51] <RLa> in firefox to update the whole page
  637. # [15:52] <hermanus> in chrome is just run in in private mode
  638. # [15:52] <hermanus> is = i
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  655. # [16:04] <hermanus> command + shift + r works in chrome for reloading everything
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  660. # [16:07] <chrisdev> thanks guys!
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  671. # [16:22] <chachan> I'm using Google Chrome 16.0.899 and it's eating my processor =/ I think I'm going to give it a try to Chromium
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  737. # [17:26] <Thiago_> What?
  738. # [17:26] <Thiago_> This a public chat for discussion about HTML5?
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  745. # [17:31] <hermanus> imagine that
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  748. # [17:32] <kollapse> Speaking of which, why does Firefox bork out on displaying Webfonts on one of my localhost sites ??
  749. # [17:32] <kollapse> Firefox 6.0 that is. All other browsers work fine.
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  754. # [17:38] <Ms2ger> Got the mime type set up correctly?
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  758. # [17:40] <kollapse> Ms2ger: Me ?
  759. # [17:40] <Ms2ger> Yep
  760. # [17:40] <kollapse> Ms2ger: Mimetype of the font ?
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  762. # [17:40] <Ms2ger> Yep
  763. # [17:41] <kollapse> You mean if it is set up correctly in Firefox or in the server ?
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  774. # [17:50] <JonathanNeal> mornin'
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  786. # [17:57] <JonathanNeal> Would anyone be interested in helping me edit diveintohtml5 for accuracy with present technologies?
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  795. # [18:10] <niftylettuce_> JonathanNeal: hmm
  796. # [18:11] <niftylettuce_> anyone have an old 2G sittin round? i'd snag it for some cash, all the folks on eBay are ridiculous :(
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  808. # [18:24] <shwetank> JonathanNeal: I think I could help out, especially with any bits related to Opera
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  811. # [18:25] <Epeli> Can anyone share his/her experiences with Android tablets in here http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7690038/which-android-tablets-are-usable-for-web-development
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  815. # [18:26] <JonathanNeal> shwetank: thank you!
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  826. # [18:39] <niftylettuce_> Epeli: do you have the A7275 model?
  827. # [18:39] <niftylettuce_> Epeli: of your desire z
  828. # [18:40] <Epeli> niftylettuce_: how can i tell?
  829. # [18:40] <niftylettuce_> Epeli: is it tmobile? canadian phone by Bell?
  830. # [18:40] <niftylettuce_> Epeli: Canadian version is A7275, t-mobile is different
  831. # [18:40] <niftylettuce_> tmobile logo at top vs. htc logo at top
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  833. # [18:41] <Epeli> No. This is a unlocked bought from Finland.
  834. # [18:41] <Epeli> It has HTC logo
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  845. # [18:52] <T-Co> Epeli, That is really interesting. Please let me know as well if you get any real answers?
  846. # [18:53] <Epeli> T-Co: I'll try remember to post it here
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  848. # [18:53] <T-Co> Epeli, You can email me as well, if it's not too much to ask. antti.rintala@gmail.com
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  850. # [18:54] <Epeli> T-Co: Maybe you could just star the question in SO?
  851. # [18:54] <T-Co> I've not yet bought a dev device, but I'm about to. It would be nice to buy one that you really can dev against :)
  852. # [18:54] <Epeli> you can also help by up voting it
  853. # [18:54] <T-Co> Epeli, True that. Will do
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  861. # [19:03] <T-Co> Epeli, Seems that I need reputation to vote :P
  862. # [19:03] <T-Co> Oh well, at least I got to star it :)
  863. # [19:03] <Epeli> that kinda sucks
  864. # [19:03] <Epeli> oh well
  865. # [19:04] <T-Co> Epeli, Out of personal curiosity, what have you done with node.js lately?
  866. # [19:04] <Epeli> T-Co: An asset manager is one https://github.com/epeli/node-pile#readme
  867. # [19:05] <Epeli> also I'm doing an Etherpad like drawing app at work
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  869. # [19:08] <T-Co> Epeli, Interesting...
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  871. # [19:12] <T-Co> Epeli, Do you have any experience using socket.io with backbone? I'm thinking about using the same backbone models in node as well as in frontend. node-pile sounds interesting though...
  872. # [19:13] <Epeli> Well, yes and no. I'm using both, but I have not used Backbone models in Node. Yet.
  873. # [19:14] <Epeli> you can find few packages that does that from search.npmjs.org if you search for "backbone models"
  874. # [19:15] <Epeli> but I have no experiences with those yet
  875. # [19:15] <T-Co> Hmm, yeah, I have to take a look at those.
  876. # [19:16] <T-Co> Epeli, I found this to be interesting: http://andyet.net/blog/2011/feb/15/re-using-backbonejs-models-on-the-server-with-node/
  877. # [19:17] <Epeli> Yeah, I have read it.
  878. # [19:18] <T-Co> I thought you might've
  879. # [19:19] <Epeli> Couble of things bugs me in Backbone when using it in Node. It does not use Node-style callbacks (callback should be always the last arg) and events (bind vs. on, trigger vs. emit).
  880. # [19:20] <T-Co> ah
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  917. # [20:36] <landonf> Hey all. Sorry for the tangental question, but anyone remember the name of the consulting company Twitter brought in to help reboot their organization?
  918. # [20:37] <landonf> Was it … Pivotal Labs? Ah ha. Sorry. Apparently asking the question jogged my memory :)
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  985. # [22:53] <mari00> hi all, i am trying to figure out the right way to use the nav element. i am trying to create a series of images that function as priamry navigation for a website. my first instinct is to place the images in divs, but i am nto sure how to combine this with the nav element
  986. # [22:55] <manuchill> i would use the nav element and within that list items, see code snippet @ http://html5doctor.com/element-index/#nav as an example
  987. # [22:58] <mari00> manuchill: then where would i link in the images?
  988. # [22:58] <mari00> sorry if that is a naive question. i am still new to webdesign.
  989. # [22:59] <manuchill> is images really the way to go? is it possible to solve it with text?
  990. # [23:01] <mari00> It's part of the design
  991. # [23:01] <mari00> Definitely not optional
  992. # [23:01] <mari00> The images are the links...
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  994. # [23:05] <manuchill> mari00, have a look at http://jsfiddle.net/UqM6p/, instead of the text "Nav link" you could use your images
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  996. # [23:07] <mari00> looking now
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  999. # [23:10] <mari00> manuchill: right ok...i see how that could work, but waht i'm wondering is why i need the <ul> list at all. i'm not sure what the point of this nav element is at all actually.
  1000. # [23:10] <mari00> i know that is a bit theoretical...
  1001. # [23:11] * Parts: mishunov (~spliter@164.247.189.109.customer.cdi.no)
  1002. # [23:14] <manuchill> from a semantic point of view, the nav indicates/represents a section of a page that links to other pages or to parts within the page: a section with navigation links
  1003. # [23:15] <manuchill> you don't have to use <ul> within the nav element, but most of the times its the element that fits best for this purpose
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  1009. # [23:20] <mari00> manuchill: ok i see i think what you mean. the priamry point of the nav element is purely semantic. (but what practical advantage does this provide?) more immediately, the problem here in using the ul is that i will need to add extra css to essentially make the elements of the list dissapear. what i would otherwise have is just a series of divs (or even just img tags) encased by <a> elements. the positioning and styling of the links and all wo
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  1012. # [23:24] <manuchill> mari00, have a look at http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/Overview.html#the-nav-element the green paragraphs, its not just sematics but also screen readers..... and maybe in the near future also specific targeted by search engine crawlers
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  1029. # [23:47] * Parts: plh_ (~plh@w3cdhcp109.w3.org) ("no more cookies")
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  1032. # [23:56] * Quits: johnkpaul (~johnkpaul@pool-96-250-167-7.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  1033. # [23:56] * Quits: tw2113 (~tw2113@fedora/tw2113) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  1034. # [23:56] * Quits: CrashTest_ (~CrashTest@c-66-235-13-127.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net) (Quit: CrashTest_)
  1035. # Session Close: Sat Oct 08 00:00:00 2011

The end :)