/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2012-01-31 / end

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# Session Start: Tue Jan 31 00:00:00 2012
# Session Ident: #html5
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# [01:24] <niftylettuce_> \o
# [01:25] <EasyAt|> -_|¯|_-
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# [01:31] <niftylettuce_> wat.
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# [02:20] <paul_irish> Pomax: here?
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# [02:21] <yedimind> waddup
# [02:21] <paul_irish> like divya said. google webfont loader has events for it
# [02:21] <paul_irish> and i think theres a fonts.com adapter
# [02:21] <paul_irish> and getting you a script from Pomax
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# [02:21] <divya> yeah i think its called monotype: <font name>
# [02:21] <paul_irish> yedimind: https://github.com/Pomax/Font.js
# [02:22] <paul_irish> yedimind: if you look at the source for the webfont loader to detect when a font has loaded
# [02:22] <paul_irish> your eyes will explode
# [02:22] <paul_irish> it is soo damn nasty
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# [02:23] <tw2113> http://twitter.github.com/
# [02:23] <yedimind> oh man
# [02:24] <yedimind> now i gotta read
# [02:24] <yedimind> lol
# [02:24] <JonathanNeal> is there a way to trim whitespace on a <canvas> before or after .toDataURL ?
# [02:24] <yedimind> thanks will go through tihs
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# [02:25] <yedimind> man thats messy
# [02:26] <yedimind> and no better than what i wast thinking of doing to begin with, wihch is just a hack to check how much line height the font is taking in pixels
# [02:26] <yedimind> and if its above/below threshold then i know font loaded/didnt
# [02:26] <yedimind> and load a substitute
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# [02:28] <paul_irish> yedimind:
# [02:29] <paul_irish> yedimind: https://github.com/paulirish/font-face-detect/blob/master/isFontLoaded.js
# [02:29] <divya> what if users are zoomed in and stuff? would it still work?
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# [02:29] <yedimind> divya, probably not
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# [02:32] <JonathanNeal> let me rephrase that last question.
# [02:32] <JonathanNeal> is there a way to trim the empty pixels on a <canvas> so that my .toDataURL is only the area containing something?
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# [02:32] <yedimind> thanks paul_irish
# [02:34] <JonathanNeal> looks like my good friend remy already did this https://gist.github.com/784508
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# [02:38] <tw2113> he does everything
# [02:39] <JonathanNeal> and jdalton fixes everything
# [02:39] <JonathanNeal> and paul_irish knows about all of it always sometimes before its even done
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# [02:44] * tw2113 has a hunch that paul_irish knows what is in HTML7
# [02:49] <JonathanNeal> holograms
# [02:49] <JonathanNeal> <hologram><source src="starwars.hgd"></hologram>
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# Session Close: Tue Jan 31 03:32:18 2012
#
# Session Start: Tue Jan 31 03:32:18 2012
# Session Ident: #html5
# [03:32] * Disconnected
# [03:33] * Attempting to rejoin channel #html5
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# [03:33] * Topic is 'Ask any question about HTML5 & Friends || HTML5 Spec for Developers: http://developers.whatwg.org || Also: http://html5rocks.com http://diveintohtml5.info http://mzl.la/9giLwR || Channel logs: http://j.mp/cG7UDa'
# [03:33] * Set by marienz!marienz@freenode/staff/marienz on Fri Oct 21 20:53:09
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# [03:35] <iamdustan> are there known issues of css 3d transforms and horrible text rendering on the ipad?
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# [05:14] <Pomax> http://pomax.nihongoresources.com/pages/NonsensePalette makes me smile a lot.
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# [06:24] <paul_irish> weird. facebook uses my rAF shim in the like button code.
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# [06:31] <tw2113> and they haven't given you a royalty check? :P
# [06:31] <tw2113> although i'd settle for name credit
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# [06:36] <ryanseddon> paul_irish: is the like button doing crazy polling or something?
# [06:36] <paul_irish> also that.
# [06:37] <paul_irish> if you profile or timeline with a like button
# [06:37] <paul_irish> you get spammed with its activity.
# [06:37] <ryanseddon> i'm pretty sure the +1 button does riduclous settimeout too
# [06:37] <ryanseddon> ridiculous*
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# [06:43] <paul_irish> dude started es6-compat-table https://twitter.com/#!/paulmillr/status/164214272249962497/photo/1/large :D
# [06:43] <socialhapy> ★ Tweet from paulmillr: @paul_irish @kangax done. I’ve also rewritten tables to make them work in node.js. will submit pullreq today. http://t.co/WEMhIBHg ★ http://bit.ly/xJw7HN
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# [06:53] <ryanseddon> Awesome! Is es6 offical yet or is it more es6 == es.next
# [06:53] <ryanseddon> official*
# [06:53] <paul_irish> there is a draft spec
# [06:53] <paul_irish> fwiw
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# [07:18] <JonathanNeal> hey paul_irish or divya did you guys share the criteria for a good polyfill?
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# [07:20] <JonathanNeal> as someone who often re-invents the wheel, i'm always interested to know if my stuff isn't as late to the party as it seems.
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# [07:20] <jetienne> omorning
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# [07:23] <paul_irish> JonathanNeal: we started to but dont think it got captured
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# [07:23] <JonathanNeal> i would really love to write more and better tests, especially after the work we've done with the html5shiv
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# [07:33] <paul_irish> JonathanNeal: offline is an area where people have tremendous problems
# [07:34] <paul_irish> dunno if that interests you
# [07:35] <JonathanNeal> lemme look
# [07:35] <JonathanNeal> interesting, is this stuff like manifest?
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# [07:36] <JonathanNeal> is using a manifest file as much as a beast for other people as it was for me?
# [07:37] <paul_irish> ya
# [07:37] <JonathanNeal> i could take a multi-step approach to this, create a manifest builder
# [07:38] <paul_irish> manifest file tooling is one things that mostly solved
# [07:38] <paul_irish> haha. whoops
# [07:38] <JonathanNeal> wait huh?
# [07:38] <paul_irish> sec.
# [07:38] <JonathanNeal> k
# [07:38] <paul_irish> but like.. assuming that there is no connection.. always saving data to localstorage.. syncing it back up to the server in batches
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# [07:39] <paul_irish> and the manifest / localstorage / offline checking code to make that a reality
# [07:39] <JonathanNeal> yea, when i tried to write a webapp that actually worked without an internet connection on my iphone it was a beast, and how can i sync to the server without erroring the app because it wants the internet.
# [07:39] <paul_irish> in something that could be generalized
# [07:39] <paul_irish> yeah
# [07:39] <paul_irish> really hard.
# [07:39] <paul_irish> this this this is why people go for native apps
# [07:40] <paul_irish> because they think they will be fast and it feels like a better chance they'll work without a connection
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# [07:40] <JonathanNeal> yea
# [07:41] <paul_irish> things that make manifests:
# [07:41] <paul_irish> Manifested: http://manifested.dregsoft.com/
# [07:41] <paul_irish> ManifestR - http://westciv.com/tools/manifestR/
# [07:41] <paul_irish> https://github.com/jamesgpearce/confess
# [07:41] <paul_irish> and the h5bp build script
# [07:41] <paul_irish> and then for validators you have
# [07:42] <paul_irish> http://manifesto.ericdelabar.com/
# [07:42] <paul_irish> http://manifest-validator.com/
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# [07:43] <JonathanNeal> goodness
# [07:43] <JonathanNeal> well that's cool.
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# [07:54] <JonathanNeal> reading up on the offline.html
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# [07:59] <JonathanNeal> whereas mark wrote about .manifest files @ http://www.diveinto.org/html5/offline.html i see others talking about appcache @ http://www.html5rocks.com/en/tutorials/appcache/beginner/
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# [08:03] <JonathanNeal> BED TIME!!!!
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# [08:34] <taipres> can someone give me a hand
# [08:34] <taipres> is a simple problem but I can't figure it out
# [08:34] <taipres> http://cheapvpsdeals.info in the source search for tlogo.jpg
# [08:34] <taipres> it's suppose to link to the homepage, the code looks completely fine to me but it doesn't link anywhere
# [08:34] <taipres> tlogo is the main pic up top
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# [08:43] <jetienne> taipres: it isnt visible on the page. use element inspector to check it
# [08:43] <taipres> try again sorry
# [08:43] <taipres> was playing around with it, refresh
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# [08:54] <easypie> should i substitute div for section? is this the appropriate way of using nav? can i use nav for div id='login' ? here's the code: http://dpaste.org/kakwj/
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# [08:55] <easypie> ^ substitute section for div*
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# [09:51] <jetienne> q. i would like something similar to require.js, but smaller (require.js is 12k after min+gzip). any recommendation ?
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# [09:58] <paul_irish> ?g curl.js @ jetienne
# [09:58] <bot-t> jetienne, curl.js (javascript page curl image effect) - http://curl.netzgesta.de/
# [09:59] <paul_irish> hahah lol
# [09:59] <jetienne> paul_irish: thanks mate
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# [09:59] <paul_irish> http://unscriptable.com/2011/03/30/curl-js-yet-another-amd-loader/
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# [10:01] <paul_irish> however jetienne
# [10:01] <jetienne> yep ?
# [10:01] <paul_irish> 12k is tiny
# [10:01] <paul_irish> and consider the benefits of r.js
# [10:01] <jetienne> well the core of my lib is 2.2k :)
# [10:01] <jetienne> could i make my code compatible with both ?
# [10:01] <paul_irish> i just dont think the diff between 5 and 12 k will manifest in any significant way to a user
# [10:02] <paul_irish> and you'd be better off shipping
# [10:02] <paul_irish> :)
# [10:02] <jetienne> ok ok i will bite the bullet :)
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# [10:03] <paul_irish> filesize is such a rabbithole of wasted javascript developer's time
# [10:03] <paul_irish> IMO :)
# [10:03] <JakeA> if the core of your js lib is just 2.2k, deliver it in the same js file as your loader
# [10:03] <JakeA> no point wasting another request on it
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# [10:04] <JakeA> in fact, if your combined script size is < 60k, probably best to just bang it all in a single request
# [10:04] <paul_irish> JakeA: what do you use for build process ?
# [10:05] <jetienne> JakeA: there is a core lib. which doesnt use require.js (or similar). but i would like the plugins to use require.js (or similar) to handle interdependcies
# [10:05] <JakeA> We're running on django, we've made a template tag to output multiple <script src="…"> during dev & a single minified script on live
# [10:06] <paul_irish> tight
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# [12:41] <shadykhan> is it proper syntax if i use a div inside a section?
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# [13:03] <davidbanham> I'm working with <video> on an embedded platform and getting an error spat into Firebug that's identified as Video Error Object.
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# [13:04] <davidbanham> Nothing exists on The Googles about a "Video Error Object". I'm stumped. Can anyone give me a shove in the right direction?
# [13:06] <shwetank> shadykhan: yeah, its fine .. though try to minimise it in there, i would say
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# [15:07] <Armen|Work> goodmorning
# [15:07] <ryan_tait> morning
# [15:09] <Armen|Work> i'm working on an editor/ide for html5 projects, but i can't think of a name for it
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# [15:11] <xec> "htmlceptional"
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# [15:13] <xec> "html like a boss"
# [15:14] <Armen|Work> "hlab" does sound fancy
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# [15:18] <xec> can i get 10 street cred points if you end up with that name?
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# [15:19] <qawsedrf> why does a simple replaceState on an iframe's history always throws an exception in firefox ?
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# [15:42] <qawsedrf> can someone help em fix this problem (check in ff) - http://www.webdevout.net/test?0c&raw ?
# [15:42] <qawsedrf> PLZZZ...
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# [15:44] <Armen|Work> what is the problem?
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# [15:48] <qawsedrf> the page is reloaded when you click the link in the iframe in FF. but chrome is fine
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# [15:57] <Armen|Work> wouldnt it be more reliable to manipulate the DOM instead of using open/write/close?
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# [16:13] <qawsedrf> Armen|Work: i was doing that before. but then if i am loading multiple assets like jquery framework file from google's cdn, jquery ui file, twitter boostrap css file, etc. then modifying the dom directly is a problem.
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# [16:14] <qawsedrf> maybe i can attach load event to each of them then, but kinda more complex. there can be other problems too.
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# [16:14] <qawsedrf> doc open/write/close was really easy and eliminated all issues
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# [16:17] <Armen|Work> apparently not ;)
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# [16:23] <edwinjm> qawsedrf: seems like the window.onload is also triggered in the iframe in Fx, but not in Chrome
# [16:24] <edwinjm> qawsedrf: you can do a check to see if the window is the topmost frame
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# [16:44] <qawsedrf> edwinjm: i am not sure i get you, could you try editing that code and show me what you mean ?
# [16:44] <qawsedrf> Armen|Work: heh, ye :P
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# [16:44] <qawsedrf> but trust me, manipulating dom has more issues. even with simple html and css inserting, they soemtimes render different which si so weird.
# [16:45] <qawsedrf> so doc open/write/close is best, but just this 1 issue. dunno, maybe firefox is lame
# [16:45] <qawsedrf> chrome is always so good :/
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# [16:47] <edwinjm> qawsedrf: try putting the js between if (window.frames.parent != window) {...}
# [16:47] <edwinjm> (i haven't tried this myself)
# [16:48] <qawsedrf> it is something that you can also observe in any realtime pastebin
# [16:48] <qawsedrf> edwinjm: i will try
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# [16:50] <qawsedrf> edwinjm: then the JS code does not get executed at all
# [16:50] <qawsedrf> because window.frames.parent is === wiundow
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# [16:50] <edwinjm> euhm, mistake, make != into ==
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# [16:52] <qawsedrf> edwinjm: the page gets loaded in the iframe once
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# [16:55] <edwinjm> :qawsedrf: so it's fixed?
# [16:56] <qawsedrf> edwinjm: no, i dont want it to load even once. as in chrome
# [16:58] <edwinjm> qawsedrf: oh :-( I don't have any other options right now
# [16:59] <qawsedrf> :(
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# [17:15] <qawsedrf> sucks
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# [17:42] <ish10> ok important question. Drawing images. Canvas or img tag
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# [17:47] <Jon47> canvases can contain images?
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# [17:54] <divya> what does it even mean
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# [17:57] <Armen|Work> must be klingon
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# [18:21] <PainBank> Jon47: yes it can
# [18:22] <Jon47> thanks p-bank
# [18:23] <PainBank> it even renders jpegs. ;)
# [18:23] <JonathanNeal> woo woo
# [18:23] <JonathanNeal> html5shiv now helps more than just old ie.
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# [18:24] <PainBank> how is performance of html5 apps on Torch Browser for playbook? Anyone?
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# [18:28] <pocopina> how frequent are stable releases of opera desktop?
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# [18:31] <divya> pocopina: Opera 11.6 and Opera 11.61 were within a month
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# [18:33] <pocopina> divya: soooo, just basically whenever they have something ready? do they have public docs regarding release cycle strategy and support strategy? being lazy really.. i will search if nobody knows.
# [18:34] <divya> this is the doc we have http://www.opera.com/support/kb/view/991/
# [18:38] <pocopina> reading that it does seem that there is no schedule to stable releases though. i mean there is a cycle, beta, beta 2, rc, etc. but i take it this is ad hoc?
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# [18:39] <pocopina> this seems to back that hypothesis up.. http://www.opera.com/docs/changelogs/windows/
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# [19:13] <mightym> Im building a small todo app in html5. Works fine so far but i have a problem: If the user visits http://www.mydomain.com/ he is prompted to login. If he is logged in on / a different template is served -> my main application template. Plus a cookie is set for session handling.
# [19:13] <mightym> Now he can add/delete/edit his todos. While he is online the todos are saved on the server. I also added a cache manifest for my site and use local storage to save his todos when he's offline. This works fine so far.
# [19:13] <mightym> My Problem: If the user is online and logs himself out of the site, and the server isn't serving the main application template anymore, the browser uses the offline version of the site. But he should only use it if the browser is offline, not when the server is sending another template on the same path.
# [19:13] <mightym> Someone a hint for me? Thanks in advance!
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# [19:15] <leaetMika> Hello I did the design of my website and I need help to star the integration in HTML5
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# [19:16] * leaetMika is now known as Flashdev
# [19:17] <Flashdev> Hi I have my design ready I can show you what it look like I need a liitle help to start the integration
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# [19:20] <pocopina> has anyone here had experience mixing yepnope.js style feature detection with a automated testing suite. i.e. fail/pass tests for when a feature is present and when it isn't?
# [19:23] <Flashdev> Hi I have my design ready I can show you what it look like I need a liitle help to start the integration
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# [19:28] <mightym> thank you anyway!
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# [19:30] <Flashdev> Nobody to help ?
# [19:30] <Flashdev> I have my design ready I can show you what it look like I need a liitle help to start the integration
# [19:30] <JonathanNeal> Flashdev: neat user name.
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# [19:31] <Flashdev> lol
# [19:31] <Flashdev> @JonathanNeal you think that why nobody reply to me
# [19:31] <Flashdev> let me change that
# [19:32] <JonathanNeal> No, it's a great name.
# [19:32] <JonathanNeal> Are you from the Flash world?
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# [19:32] <JonathanNeal> Hahahaha.
# [19:32] <HTML5Dev> here I am
# [19:32] <HTML5Dev> yes I am Flash dev
# [19:32] <JonathanNeal> That's great. Flash is my goto for HTML5 polyfills.
# [19:32] <JonathanNeal> I only just arrived so I have no idea what you need help with, but maybe I can.
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# [19:35] <PainBank> HTML5Dev: are you a Flash IDE person or as3 coder?
# [19:35] <HTML5Dev> as3 coder
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# [19:40] <JonathanNeal> HTML5Dev: oooo, did you ever work with ExternalInterface?
# [19:40] <HTML5Dev> lol a lot
# [19:40] <HTML5Dev> call from flash to JS
# [19:40] <HTML5Dev> or from JS to flash
# [19:40] <HTML5Dev> very useful
# [19:41] <JonathanNeal> http://sandbox.thewikies.com/flash/ & http://sandbox.thewikies.com/flash/Main.as ... I had little idea what I was doing but I wrote this to polyfill <audio>. Sometime I'd love to know if I was writing awful actionscript.
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# [19:42] <PainBank> HTML5Dev: what is your link and what are you kind of feedback are you looking for?
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# [19:43] <JonathanNeal> You should call yourself Flashdev like you started. There's nothing wrong with welcoming Flash people to HTML5.
# [19:43] * HTML5Dev is now known as FlashDev
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# [19:43] <FlashDev> ok
# [19:43] <FlashDev> ;)
# [19:44] <JonathanNeal> All right!
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# [19:45] <carminec> this is an important meeting right here, someone should write it down for posterity! ;)
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# [19:50] <JonathanNeal> It seems FlashDev is already familiar with HTML and CSS, it's just a matter of getting acquainted with the new elements.
# [19:50] <FlashDev> yes lets spek here
# [19:50] <FlashDev> from the top
# [19:51] <FlashDev> should I start by the <header>
# [19:51] <FlashDev> and put my nav inside ?
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# [19:51] <JonathanNeal> <header><h1></h1><nav></nav></header>
# [19:52] <FlashDev> i am not familiar with the <nav> tag
# [19:52] <jarek> FlashDev: it doesn't really matter that much
# [19:52] <JonathanNeal> In your case, based on the mockup you shared, you actually have two site titles, "web developer", and your name.
# [19:53] <jarek> FlashDev: you could use div everywhere as well, it would still work
# [19:53] <FlashDev> o that good to know
# [19:53] <JonathanNeal> jarek is right, all html5 elements do are markup the document more precisely.
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# [19:53] <JonathanNeal> well ... and some of them have cool powers, like <video>,<canvas>, etc.
# [19:54] <JonathanNeal> but at heart, they're just ways of communicating information.
# [19:54] <FlashDev> ok and to center my website is there a new markup in html5 ?
# [19:54] <FlashDev> or still div auto margin ?
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# [19:54] <JonathanNeal> still "margin: 0 auto;" usually.
# [19:55] <FlashDev> ok thanks i will start with that and let you know when I am done
# [19:55] <FlashDev> thanks guys for the help
# [19:55] <jarek> FlashDev: there are many ways to do this, but none of them is the right one
# [19:55] <FlashDev> ok @jarek thanks !
# [19:55] <JonathanNeal> Thank you for not using the <center> element. Elements that described the way something LOOKED have been removed. Elements should describe meaning (not merely appearance).
# [19:55] <jarek> FlashDev: "margin: 0 auto" should work on all browsrs
# [19:56] <jarek> FlashDev: but there are also e.g. CSS tables
# [19:56] <JonathanNeal> jarek: IE8+, right?
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# [19:56] <jarek> JonathanNeal: right
# [19:58] <jarek> last time I checked flash, it was using sematic tags :P
# [19:58] <jarek> though it was plain XML with mxml namespace, much better than HTML5 mess
# [19:59] <carminec> jarek: yup, that is flex
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# [20:02] <danielfilho> for the webkit/chrome guys in the room: do I suggest something on bugs.webkit.org just as a new bug? Don't it have a way to suggest a new feature?
# [20:02] <danielfilho> just for sure I don't do the wrong thing.
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# [20:08] <jarek> danielfilho: afair there are already many feature requests on Bugzilla
# [20:08] <jarek> e.g. https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=68469
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# [20:09] <jarek> though maililng list is used for discussing addition of major features
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# [20:10] <jarek> (I'm not webkit/chrome guy)
# [20:12] <PainBank> FlashDev: take a look at some MVC HTML5 frameworks.
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# [20:13] <goddard> is there a way i can get access to a web cam yet?
# [20:15] <jarek> goddard: not yet, but it's being worked on: http://dev.w3.org/2011/webrtc/editor/getusermedia.html
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# [20:17] <danielfilho> jarek: thank you! :)
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# [20:25] <FlashDev> @PainBank MVC htm5 like http://html5boilerplate.com/ ?
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# [20:27] <divya> FlashDev: lol no thats not MVC
# [20:27] <divya> FlashDev: like ember.js backbone.js
# [20:27] <JonathanNeal> but it's still pretty cool :)
# [20:27] <FlashDev> little confuse how to start
# [20:28] <FlashDev> I was starting typing html from the text editor
# [20:28] <FlashDev> <!doctype html>
# [20:28] <FlashDev> <html lang="en">
# [20:28] <FlashDev> <head>
# [20:28] <FlashDev> not using anything
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# [20:37] <JonathanNeal> <!doctype html> is perfect, that's exactly how it starts.
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# [20:38] <JonathanNeal> FlashDev: do you know how to use gist?
# [20:38] <FlashDev> gist or git ?
# [20:38] <JonathanNeal> it's like git, but great for sharing small amounts of code.
# [20:38] <mnemoc> gist is github's paste service
# [20:39] <FlashDev> no I use git
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# [20:51] <paul_irish> JonathanNeal: do you want to be included in the browsehappy refresh?
# [20:52] <Samuel_Roldan> Hi everyone, has anyone encounter a bug in HTML5 where an element does not take the specified width? http://stackoverflow.com/questions/9085702/how-to-fix-width-bug-in-html5
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# [20:54] <JonathanNeal> paul_irish: yes!
# [20:56] <tw2113> yes!
# [20:56] <tw2113> what are we agreeing with?
# [20:57] <JonathanNeal> whatever i can do to help.
# [20:57] <JonathanNeal> we're agreeing with paul_irish
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# [20:59] <tw2113> ah
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# [21:00] <JonathanNeal> going to lunch for a bit.
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# [21:05] <paul_irish> Samuel_Roldan: use normalize.css
# [21:05] <Samuel_Roldan> Hey paul_irish, i'm actually using it as we speak and still
# [21:05] <paul_irish> hm
# [21:05] <dilvie> what is the browsehappy refresh?
# [21:06] <paul_irish> Samuel_Roldan: looks like you're zoomed out
# [21:06] <Samuel_Roldan> DOH!
# [21:06] <Samuel_Roldan> dude
# [21:06] <Samuel_Roldan> oh man
# [21:06] <Samuel_Roldan> FML
# [21:06] <paul_irish> :D
# [21:06] <paul_irish> indeed.
# [21:06] <Samuel_Roldan> paul_irish <-- you're awesome
# [21:06] <paul_irish> lol
# [21:07] <Samuel_Roldan> I'm just like that, i'll be adding a "Looks like you're zoomed out, DOH!" during dev.
# [21:08] <paul_irish> dilvie: not recommending IE to poeple on OSX. having a page to point windows XP users at (e.g. dont upgrade to IE8)
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# [21:08] <paul_irish> divya: also. might as well combo this with supported-browsers, etc
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# [21:08] <paul_irish> HMM
# [21:08] <divya> wat
# [21:09] <paul_irish> browsehappy
# [21:09] <paul_irish> merge efforts
# [21:09] <divya> so what needs to be refreshed?
# [21:09] <divya> just need a subpage no?
# [21:09] <divya> best ask hugo to do it.
# [21:09] <paul_irish> divya: right. initial scope is subpage for winXP
# [21:09] <divya> i dont think it is appropriate to have too many designers involved
# [21:09] <divya> yeah
# [21:09] <dilvie> paul_irish: rock and roll. =)
# [21:10] <paul_irish> beyond that is OS/Browser detection and recommending based from taht
# [21:10] <divya> well technically
# [21:10] <paul_irish> beyond that is folding in what we have planned on that lazyweb issue
# [21:10] <divya> xp and os x is the same
# [21:10] <divya> but why do we need os x
# [21:10] <divya> if we are only showing that page to IE6
# [21:11] <divya> but i am unsure if that is what lazy web issue was about.
# [21:11] <divya> WHAT I MEAN IS
# [21:11] <paul_irish> its not
# [21:11] <paul_irish> different concerns
# [21:11] <divya> the lazy web issue outputs text
# [21:11] <divya> yeah
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# [21:11] <divya> i dont think they should be tied together
# [21:11] <divya> also we should focus on the xp thing.
# [21:11] <divya> otherwise the page is cool
# [21:11] <paul_irish> https://github.com/paulirish/lazyweb-requests/issues/39
# [21:11] <socialhapy> ★ Issue #39 on lazyweb-requests, reported by nimbupani (7m, 1w ago): A healthy choose your browser page
# [21:11] <divya> very few of other browsers on older versions of it.
# [21:11] <paul_irish> just saying if we're building a "you need this browser for this site" site
# [21:12] <divya> yeah even then.
# [21:12] <paul_irish> it seems to have overlap with browsehappy
# [21:12] <divya> i dont think so.
# [21:12] <divya> we are not building a site.
# [21:12] <divya> we are building something that returns value
# [21:12] <divya> err a string
# [21:12] <paul_irish> a webservice
# [21:12] <paul_irish> sure
# [21:12] <divya> yes
# [21:12] <divya> its not a site
# [21:12] <paul_irish> well its gotta live somewhere
# [21:12] <paul_irish> :)
# [21:12] <divya> yeah but its not browsehappy
# [21:12] <divya> its not a page n00bs will hit
# [21:12] <divya> ever.
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# [21:13] <paul_irish> as far as project mgmt is concerned. people who would want to help on browsehappy would also probably be interested in helping for supportingbrowsers
# [21:13] <divya> i dont think so.
# [21:13] <paul_irish> :)
# [21:13] <divya> because it is very different set of concerns.
# [21:13] <divya> browsehappy targets a n00b crowd
# [21:14] <divya> and more useful for designers
# [21:14] <paul_irish> i'm just starting to feel that there are too many sites in play
# [21:14] <divya> not cutting edge demo creators
# [21:14] <paul_irish> okay how about this
# [21:14] <divya> first of all chooseyourbrowser is not a site.
# [21:14] <divya> browsehappy does one thing and does it well.
# [21:14] <paul_irish> html5please.com/supporting-browsers/api/json?features=...
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# [21:15] <paul_irish> yes maybe possibly?
# [21:16] <divya> you mean we have supporting-browsers page hosted on h5please?
# [21:16] <divya> so whats this browsehappy integration?
# [21:17] <paul_irish> it was an idea that you've mostly convinced me out of
# [21:17] <divya> o good.
# [21:17] <divya> so now we are back to supporting browsers idea?
# [21:17] <paul_irish> yes
# [21:17] <divya> okay yeah basically shorter url but essentially that
# [21:17] <paul_irish> both ideas good. probably separate people involved. separate audiences.
# [21:17] <paul_irish> yes great
# [21:17] <divya> ofc
# [21:17] <divya> browsehappy should exist
# [21:17] <divya> just not with supporting browsers
# [21:18] <paul_irish> kk. im pulling thatryan into browsehappy. anyone else?
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# [21:18] <divya> wait isnt hugo doing it?
# [21:18] <divya> as I said if it was hugo's project we should probably let him continue as his.
# [21:18] <paul_irish> if possible
# [21:18] <divya> we should wait for his response.
# [21:18] <paul_irish> from what i understand Wordpress took the project from WASP to update it. got the domain for free, etc. and then they hired Hugo as designer to make it
# [21:18] <divya> or ask for a response.
# [21:19] <paul_irish> so i think its not a passion project for hugo
# [21:19] <divya> yeah, exactly, ask hugo on what he thinks is the best way to proceed.
# [21:19] <divya> maybe, but you would not be that happy when someone snatches what you worked on without even asking you.
# [21:20] <divya> it is polite and decent to ask for a response before randomly involving ourselves or others.
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# [21:21] <paul_irish> ++
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# [21:25] <paul_irish> question. if @chromiumdev renamed to something... what should it be?
# [21:25] <paul_irish> @chromedevrel ? @chromedev ?
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# [21:25] <divya> chromedev
# [21:26] <paul_irish> @chrome5rocks
# [21:26] <divya> …
# [21:26] <dilvie> lol
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# [21:36] <tw2113> @theotherfirefox
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# [21:41] <PainBank> FlashDev: http://emberjs.com/
# [21:41] <FlashDev> @PainBank thanks
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# [22:11] <JonathanNeal> paul_irish: was there more to share about browse happy?
# [22:12] <JonathanNeal> FlashDev: back.
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# [22:47] <dilvie> why does browsehappy blink at me?
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# [23:29] <JonathanNeal> Sometime I'd love someone to explain to me the way modern websites are setup.
# [23:30] <JonathanNeal> I'm seeing more things setup now where there's an 'image' directory that contains all the static content for the website.
# [23:31] <JonathanNeal> sometimes called 'assets' or something else. And then another directory where the logic is.
# [23:31] <JonathanNeal> so all the urls are handled through some router or controller, i imagine.
# [23:32] <JonathanNeal> Anyway, I'm dumb to this, so if there's a simple example out there I could use to learn, I'd love to have it shared with me.
# [23:32] <levifig> back
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# [23:54] <Jon47> JonathanNeal I think one reason you want the static resources separated from the programming logic is so that you can set very easily the permissions separately - regular browsers can access the script that invokes the controllers and stuff and any images/javascript/css they need, but they can be restricted from accessing the libraries and configuration files and such
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# [23:55] <divya> Fyrd: JonathanNeal got questions about caniuse.com api
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# [23:55] <Fyrd> Shoot!
# [23:55] <JonathanNeal> hi!
# [23:55] <Fyrd> Hi JonathanNeal!
# [23:55] <divya> Fyrd: basically we are trying to create a service to solve this problemo https://github.com/paulirish/lazyweb-requests/issues/39
# [23:55] <socialhapy> ★ Issue #39 on lazyweb-requests, reported by nimbupani (7m, 1w ago): A healthy choose your browser page
# [23:56] <JonathanNeal> May I, and if so, how "do i use" the "can i use" api?
# [23:57] <Fyrd> JonathanNeal: Let me answer you first and look at that page later. :)
# [23:57] <Fyrd> Firstly, there's not really an API as such, mostly a data dump.
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# [23:58] <Fyrd> Secondly, I'm working on having that dump be available here. In fact, it is: https://github.com/Fyrd/caniuse/
# [23:58] <Fyrd> So, here being github. :)
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# [23:59] <JonathanNeal> Fyrd, and also divya, will there be problems accessing it raw through github vs raw through a gh-page?
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# [23:59] <Fyrd> What kind of problems do you mean?
# Session Close: Wed Feb 01 00:00:00 2012

The end :)