/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2012-03-19 / end

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# Session Start: Mon Mar 19 00:00:00 2012
# Session Ident: #html5
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# [00:34] <tw2113> people test in opera?
# [00:34] <tw2113> jk i was an opera user for awhile
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# [00:44] <Pomax> then you foudn the "close
# [00:44] <Pomax> " button?
# [00:44] <Pomax> that would have been much more snappy without the typo and rogue enter
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# [00:50] <imsky> opera sucks for reals
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# [00:50] <imsky> just tested a project, works in ie/firefox/chrome, but not precious opera
# [00:52] <gdr> what's your project
# [00:53] <imsky> canvas-based room planner
# [00:53] <gdr> interesting
# [00:53] <gdr> +ly lame
# [00:53] <smplstk> like, for interior decorating?
# [00:53] <smplstk> gdr, >:|
# [00:53] <imsky> eh not really associated with interior design, but same concept
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# [00:54] <imsky> gdr lol that's cool
# [00:54] <gdr> :P
# [00:54] <imsky> i was a pissy youth once too
# [00:54] <imsky> got over it tho
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# [00:54] <gdr> implying ones youth judging merely on a few words, eh?
# [00:54] <gdr> I mean right, totally not canadian
# [00:54] <imsky> gdr totally
# [00:55] <imsky> shit man if you're working on something interesting i'd love to see it
# [00:55] <imsky> canvas dev so far has been really nice
# [00:55] <imsky> so if my little project is lame, what do you have?
# [00:55] <gdr> cardboard box
# [00:56] <imsky> right ;)
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# [00:56] <gdr> lemme see
# [00:56] <gdr> your project page imsky
# [00:56] <imsky> you mean the planner thing?
# [00:56] <gdr> sure, or, portfolio, personal site, anything
# [00:57] <gdr> you live in Indiana?
# [00:57] <imsky> shit man you can do a whois?
# [00:57] <imsky> i'm impressed
# [00:57] <gdr> I'm asking because I'm curious what part
# [00:57] <gdr> I lived in Indiana before
# [00:57] <imsky> the good part
# [00:57] <gdr> 'good' part?
# [00:57] <gdr> non-hurricane-part?
# [00:57] <gdr> non-tornado*
# [00:57] <imsky> uhh sure
# [00:58] <gdr> let's see a link
# [00:58] <gdr> imsky
# [00:58] <gdr> I want to laugh
# [00:58] <gdr> need a good one
# [00:58] <imsky> hmm i'm changing my diagnosis
# [00:58] <imsky> from pissy youth to bitter old fart
# [00:58] <imsky> more accurate? ;)
# [00:58] * gdr (RADIO): Negative.
# [00:59] <imsky> well then you're stuck inbetween, insulting strangers on irc
# [00:59] <imsky> what a life you lead
# [00:59] <gdr> who's implying laughing is merely a bad thing?
# [00:59] <imsky> k bud
# [00:59] <gdr> I could be laughing in joy of how great your design is
# [00:59] <gdr> ya know?
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# [01:09] <paul_irish> Pomax: "primary" means something
# [01:09] <paul_irish> i think everyone has a primary
# [01:09] <paul_irish> even if its 60/40
# [01:10] <paul_irish> maybe you use FB for element inspection/style and Chrome for script debugging/console
# [01:10] <paul_irish> but there's a primaryyyyy
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# [01:13] <Pomax> for development?
# [01:13] <Pomax> for use, definitely
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# [01:14] <Pomax> but for dev, at least to me, I can't answer it, because I don't "pick". I don't "do most of the work in one browser", I do my work in an editor, then fire it up in all browsers.
# [01:14] <Pomax> if one or more's off, back to the editor
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# [01:55] <Tangaroa> In deciding what should go into html5 or not, did anyone ever consider allowing any tag to have the src attribute? If so, could someone briefly describe the discussion or point towards an archive of it?
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# [02:11] <JonathanNeal> Hi
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# [02:16] <JonathanNeal> Anyone around interested in working on a project with me? I am putting together a collection of Canvas functions.
# [02:16] <imsky> JonathanNeal: what kind of functions?
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# [02:18] <JonathanNeal> I have a few done already, canvas trim, brightness, contrast.
# [02:19] <JonathanNeal> It's kinda like pixtastic.
# [02:19] <imsky> oh all right. what are you looking for help with?
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# [02:20] <JonathanNeal> Well, to contribute a little and just help keep it alive.
# [02:21] <JonathanNeal> I don't think I've ever had a successful project all on my own, I like playing well with others.
# [02:21] <imsky> hmm all right
# [02:22] <JonathanNeal> Here's what I have thus far https://gist.github.com/2088793
# [02:23] <imsky> pretty cool, put up a demo page, you'll get tons of people helping
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# [02:24] <JonathanNeal> imsky: i have something LIKE a demo @ http://sandbox.thewikies.com/temp-contrast/
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# [02:25] <JonathanNeal> It shouldn't take too much effort to add alpha sampling.
# [02:25] <imsky> nice job
# [02:25] <JonathanNeal> something that makes a certain pixel color go transparent, with a range even.
# [02:26] <JonathanNeal> It would also be nice to have adjustable saturation\.
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# [02:52] <JonathanNeal> I think I need to learn how to convert rgb to hsl
# [02:53] <tw2113> just learn color keywords JonathanNeal
# [02:53] <tw2113> they're all you'll ever need anyway
# [02:54] <JonathanNeal> hahaha "gold"
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# [03:57] <Pomax> JonathanNeal: wikipedia's articles on color conversion are sufficient.
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# [05:43] <teslan> i have a site with 2 url (foreign and english versions) and if i wnated to host it on Heroku and Joyent ... should i just host 2 different sites with 2 different URL and make all content available on both (via fully replicated CouchDB) or would I somehow try to make Heroku and Joyent appear as servers of same site ... if not here then where is this best asked and thanks ;)
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# [05:57] <ajvb> teslan: are you already planning on using two different URLs, or are you going to have a subdomain for the foreign language version?
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# [05:58] <ajvb> teslan: also, you can of course host both sites on the same server.
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# [05:58] <ajvb> no matter what you decide, and whether or not they are linked or seperate.
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# [06:08] <teslan> thanks ajvb: mostly i asked because i have no idea what the implications are , everything from SEO and what if Heroku is down or i get hacked, so maybe i could run on Joyent and for that would i need a separate URL or does it matter at all - as in at registrar i can point different sub-domains to different servers hosts?
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# [06:17] <moo-_-> teslan: you should
# [06:18] <ajvb> teslan: yes, different subdomains can point to different things. For example, at my work we use projectname.companywebsite.com for production testing of the site we are working on. Each "projectname" subdomain points to either different sites-available (Apache) or different servers.
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# [06:18] <ajvb> teslan: subdomains + different servers would probably be your best bet.
# [06:24] <teslan> what about user expectations ... they go to mysite.com and it's down so they need to remember that it offers fr and en versions , which takes them to fr.mysite.com and en.mysite.com - so they do that manually while the main mysite.com page's erver is down ?!?
# [06:26] <moo-_-> teslan: no need to use excessive quotation marks
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# [06:26] <moo-_-> teslan: if the site is down naturally there the users do it manually
# [06:28] <ajvb> teslan: yeah, what moo-_- said basically. Also having country specific top-level domains would be a good idea.
# [06:29] <moo-_-> ajvb: I recommend country level root folders because of 1) search engines punish duplicate content on subdomains 2) cookie issues
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# [06:29] <teslan> so in my case www.TeslaRepublik.com is foreign and www.TeslaRepublic.com is english and I registered both because of expectations ;) now I am curious if I should use them as if they were 2 different sites , put one on Heroku and the other on Joyent and on both sites offer a link to the other
# [06:30] <ajvb> moo-_-: true
# [06:30] <ajvb> teslan: .fr and .com might be a good idea.
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# [06:31] <ajvb> and that will help towards SEO specifc to france.
# [06:31] <teslan> those above are my domains , so is there penalty if they have same content but are both .com ? and is there anyway to tell the SEO they are purposely the same for redundancy ;?)
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# [06:34] <ajvb> teslan: No not really, them being completely different domains thought would change it in the sense of redundancy. (I think)
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# [07:00] <moo-_-> ajvb: teslan: for redundancy and high availability there exist better solutions than creating domains by hand
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# [07:02] <teslan> moo-_-: even when cloud computing hosting is being used?
# [07:02] <moo-_-> of course
# [07:03] <moo-_-> teslan: for example, check Amazon DNS balancing solutoins
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# [07:45] <JonathanNeal> Pomax: which one?
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# [07:47] <JonathanNeal> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturation_(color_theory)
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# [08:04] <niloy> what is the correct html tag for email?
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# [08:56] <v_y> is it possible to make elements transparent to events?
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# [09:26] <niloy> v_y: https://developer.mozilla.org/en/CSS/pointer-events
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# [11:57] <machiolate> anyone know why an <a href..> tag would show up, the text would look like a link, but wouldn't be clickable?
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# [11:58] <machiolate> <a href="http://www.utube.com/watch3488382"> Link </a> is the syntax
# [11:59] <machiolate> the "Link" looks like a link but isn't clickable
# [12:00] <aQustic> could that you have another element positioned over it...
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# [12:00] <machiolate> ahhh, thanks!
# [12:01] <machiolate> lol... didn't have enough line breaks
# [12:01] <machiolate> you rock, thanks again man
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# [12:33] <shwaiil> hi
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# [12:34] <shwaiil> Q: How to stretch a image properly in html5 keeping the quality ? Thanks =)
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# [12:39] <andrewjbaker> shwaiil, one way to achieve this is to use canvas. The problem is that whether to apply sub-pixel interpolation when resizing images is implementation defined.
# [12:40] <shwaiil> andrewjbaker: thanks a lot for looking. I want to read more about it, because I know how to do it in CSS but... I remember seeing some html5 sites
# [12:40] <shwaiil> where the image was resized and apparently the quality didnt changed much or didnt changed at all
# [12:40] <shwaiil> andrewjbaker: what should I search for on google ? "html5 canvas interpolation resizing"
# [12:42] <andrewjbaker> This might help, if you're keen on sticking w/ CSS... http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7615009/disable-interpolation-when-scaling-a-canvas
# [12:42] <andrewjbaker> Scroll down to the last answer.
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# [12:44] <andrewjbaker> The way to do it w/ canvas is to resize your canvas, then grab the image data from the original image and write your own resizing algo that works on individual pixels. It's a bit of effort.
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# [12:48] <shwaiil> andrewjbaker: oh I see. So the best way would be using CSS ?
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# [13:20] <Pomax> JonathanNeal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSL_color_space#Converting_to_RGB and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSL_color_space#General_approach
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# [15:01] <shawn_dones> sup peeps?
# [15:01] <Pomax> coffee
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# [16:03] <shawn_dones> MMM Coffee
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# [16:04] <moo-_-> mmmm.... beeer
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# [16:40] <JonathanNeal> Pomax: within RGB, I'm trying to adjust the saturation.
# [16:41] <Pomax> yeah, that'll require representing each RGBA pixel as HSVA/HSLA, changing the S value, and then mapping back to RGB.
# [16:41] <JonathanNeal> Eep, I was hoping there was a saturation calculation within rgba.
# [16:43] <JonathanNeal> a 400x400 image represents a for loop that goes 160,000 times; that's a lot of calculations to stick in there.
# [16:44] <JonathanNeal> but ... I could do it.
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# [16:48] <WebDragon> JonathanNeal: nice thing about Opera's Dragonfly, you can get it to inspect-element, then change the prefs on how it displays color to hsl -- change the saturation by inline-editing the color while in debugging mode and then switch the prefs BACK to rgb and copy the numbers out to paste in the real css file
# [16:49] <WebDragon> probably can do it similarly with other editors, but I do this all the time in opera
# [16:54] <andrewjbaker> JonathanNeal, if you don't fancy writing it yourself, you can take this for a spin: http://www.pixastic.com/
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# [16:55] <andrewjbaker> This demo in particular: http://www.pixastic.com/lib/docs/actions/hsl/
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# [17:02] <Pomax> andrewjbaker to the rescue
# [17:02] <andrewjbaker> LOL..
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# [18:33] <JonathanNeal> hi
# [18:34] <JonathanNeal> andrewjbaker: i was using pixtastic, but i wanted to keep referencing my original canvas element.
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# [18:35] <JonathanNeal> or sometimes i wanted to continue modifying an existing canvas element, and pixtastic would keep creating a new one. Also, I wanted to render the final image back to png, pixtastic does a beautiful job modifying images, but it is for display only, I believe proprietary IE filters are used to do some of the magic.
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# [18:35] <JonathanNeal> Cutting my own made sense, plus it was very educational.
# [18:36] <andrewjbaker> Cool.
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# [21:05] <uf0_work> guys.. sass or less?
# [21:05] <Pomax> sass.
# [21:06] <Pomax> let's not promote a syntax that rapes css.
# [21:06] <uf0_work> referring to less with that last comment?
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# [21:07] <uf0_work> Pomax: in your opinion why sass over less, or at least your main reason
# [21:07] <Pomax> very much so. Less, no matter what it can do, completely ruins CSS
# [21:08] <Pomax> a JS error here or there, and your entire styling breaks down because the CSS is not legal without LESS massaging
# [21:08] <Pomax> so, SASS.
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# [21:08] <uf0_work> ok.
# [21:08] <uf0_work> another question
# [21:08] <Armen138> so sass requires server side code?
# [21:08] <uf0_work> is there a web compiler for sass
# [21:08] <uf0_work> ?
# [21:08] <uf0_work> sort of like simpless
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# [21:09] <Pomax> you can generate your css from scss using sass, then link against those compiled css files
# [21:09] <Pomax> at least, as far as I can remember
# [21:10] <uf0_work> how though?
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# [21:10] <uf0_work> how do you generate css from scss using sass, that is*
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# [21:12] <Pomax> run it through the sass compiler (http://sass-lang.com/tutorial.html)
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# [21:13] <uf0_work> cool
# [21:13] <uf0_work> thanks Pomax
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# [21:25] <JonathanNeal> Updated the HTML5 Canvas goodies thanks to TabAtkins http://sandbox.thewikies.com/temp-canvas/
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# [21:31] <Pomax> JonathanNeal: I don't quite understand what your code does, but 0% saturation does not show a uniformly grey circle... O_o
# [21:32] <Pomax> it does some interesting things at 0 saturation, sliding brightness back and forth
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# [21:37] <JonathanNeal> I can assure you that the 0 saturation is 0 saturation. However, to properly desaturate an image one would want to desaturate the levels un-evenly.
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# [21:48] <JonathanNeal> Pomax, are you familiar with context.translate and context.rotate ?
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# [21:50] <ExpFist> I hate context.rotate so much
# [21:50] <ExpFist> How you need to rotate items is a good demonstration of everything wrong with HTML5 /rant
# [21:51] <jetienne_> ExpFist: we can feel how pasionate you are :)
# [21:51] <ExpFist> :V
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# [21:56] <ExpFist> I learned how to animate stuff with HTML5 before learning AS3, and now I cringe animating things in HTML5
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# [21:56] <ExpFist> AS3 object.rotate(90) - done
# [21:56] <ExpFist> HTML5, clear canvas, rotate canvas, draw object, rotate canvas back, draw the rest of the stuff. Repeat for each frame. Shoot self in face
# [21:57] <grantg> heh, apparently http://www.twitch.tv/mrnerdswagger is using my javascript gbc emulator
# [21:57] <grantg> lol
# [21:57] <grantg> Funny seeing people use it for twitch.tv
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# [22:14] <ddilinger> toying arround with canvas, i must be doing something wrong though, trying to just draw the vertical lines of a grid, but it should draw 6 with a px width of 1 and i'm getting 3 with a px width of maybe 10 : http://pastehtml.com/view/brwmp6ukl.html
# [22:14] <ddilinger> heres what i get in chrome, incase its different elsewhere: http://i.imgur.com/CL3M9.png
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# [22:15] <Pomax> canvas coordinates don't map to pixels, they map to between pixels.
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# [22:16] <Pomax> if you want 1px thin, crisp lines, you'll have to add 0.5 to all your coordinates.
# [22:16] <ddilinger> hmm, thats what the var b = o.gridThickness / 2; is supposed to be for
# [22:17] <ddilinger> i thought, i'm very new to this
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# [22:18] <Pomax> comparison: http://jsfiddle.net/eLLzd/
# [22:19] <JonathanNeal> I want to rotate a canvas image from its center, i am not sure what the math is to rotate from the center, something with translate, I imagine.
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# [22:21] <ddilinger> Pomax: hmm, interesting thanks that makes it alot clearer. I'm still left with one issue if you dont mind, with the number of lines. i thought it should put 6 grid lines equally spaced across, but i only get 3
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# [22:26] <Pomax> JonathanNeal: http://jsfiddle.net/eLLzd/3/
# [22:26] <ddilinger> oh i figured it out, something odd with creating the canvas through jQuery function, i'll stop doing that
# [22:27] <Pomax> translate the coordinate system so it's centered on your canvas, rotate that sucker, then translate it back
# [22:27] <JonathanNeal> Pomax: oh duh, i wasn't doing the second translation!
# [22:27] <Pomax> heh
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# [22:36] <JonathanNeal> My trim function is faulty.
# [22:38] <JonathanNeal> But now it is fixed!
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# [22:45] <JonathanNeal> Pomax: what's your twitter?
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# [23:06] <Pomax> JonathanNeal: TheRealPomax
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# [23:08] <JonathanNeal> Thank you :D
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# [23:58] <xarxer> is target="" okay to use in anchors?
# Session Close: Tue Mar 20 00:00:00 2012

The end :)