/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2012-07-16 / end

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  75. # [02:58] <ChrisLondon> hi all
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  78. # [03:00] <whomp_> i have a vector-art file, and i want to have an create a glow around the filled-in parts of the image when the user puts their mouse over it. how can i do this?
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  117. # [04:19] <ryanseddon> anyone know of a trick to open a link in a new window from a select field in iOS safari? I've tried lots of stuff with no luck
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  125. # [04:35] <rmill> ?toggle
  126. # [04:35] <caniuse> rmill: .toggle(): Bind two or more handlers to the matched elements, to be executed on alternate clicks. http://api.jquery.com/toggle-event/
  127. # [04:35] <bot-t1> .toggle(handler, handler, [handler]): Bind two or more handlers to the matched elements, to be executed on alternate clicks. http://api.jquery.com/toggle/
  128. # [04:35] <rmill> :|
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  305. # [09:39] <norbert_> hey all
  306. # [09:40] <norbert_> to be blunt: is there a solution yet that will allow people to create closed source canvas apps?
  307. # [09:40] <norbert_> or is it still just JavaScript obfuscation and such?
  308. # [09:40] <shwetank> pretty much
  309. # [09:40] <norbert_> that's unfortunate
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  315. # [09:41] <norbert_> how much easier is it, generally speaking, to 'crack' Flash code versus HTML5 canvas code?
  316. # [09:42] <norbert_> for instance, a Flash game, and I want to cheat
  317. # [09:42] <norbert_> versus an HTML5 game and I want to cheat
  318. # [09:42] <norbert_> or if I want all copyrights over the code and make sure nobody can read anything?
  319. # [09:42] <norbert_> I think this is a serious HTML5 problem
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  321. # [09:42] <norbert_> I'm a free software zealot myself, but I still think HTML5 has a real problem in this department
  322. # [09:43] <shwetank> yeah, but the web has always been this way and people have adapted (mostly)
  323. # [09:43] <norbert_> yes, by creating Flash and such
  324. # [09:43] <shwetank> but to answer your question, i would say all else being equal, the flash thing would be more of a hassle to crack, but not by much
  325. # [09:44] <norbert_> and Unity
  326. # [09:44] <norbert_> I'm just curious, do you think game developers will ever switch to HTML5?
  327. # [09:44] * Joins: dotpot (~dotpot@88-119-150-24.static.zebra.lt)
  328. # [09:44] <shwetank> yes, but slowly
  329. # [09:45] <norbert_> I know there are some HTML5 games already out there, but nothing that 'needs' to be closed
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  331. # [09:45] <norbert_> if I were a company and would like to code a closed source HTML5 canvas
  332. # [09:46] <norbert_> I could only obfuscate and try to keep the server side of things closed, right?
  333. # [09:46] <shwetank> yeah
  334. # [09:47] <norbert_> but what if the game becomes extremely popular
  335. # [09:47] <norbert_> and it is multiplayer
  336. # [09:47] <norbert_> wouldn't people start un-obfuscating the code?
  337. # [09:47] <norbert_> I'm don't know much about these obfuscation tools though, how good are they?
  338. # [09:48] <shwetank> well, yeah, but still, i imagine that some amount of major functionality might still be in the server side somewhere
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  340. # [09:48] <norbert_> because I'm thinking that as soon as they know more or less what the application is doing, they can start sending bogus information to the server
  341. # [09:48] <norbert_> and then they can start figuring out what the server is expecting and accepting
  342. # [09:48] <shwetank> they are good for most people, but for the people who know what they are doing, the obfusction tools dont mean much ....
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  344. # [09:49] <norbert_> yeah
  345. # [09:49] <norbert_> so what happens when the server gets hacked?
  346. # [09:49] <shwetank> call a good secuirity specialist?
  347. # [09:49] <norbert_> ok, but would that be any different from what would happen when a server for a Flash game gets hacked?
  348. # [09:49] <shwetank> i dont think so
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  350. # [09:50] <norbert_> so there should probably be communication between the app and the server that's somehow encrypted
  351. # [09:51] <norbert_> and then the whole client app can be open, maybe even un-obfuscated
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  353. # [09:51] <shwetank> yeah
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  355. # [09:52] <norbert_> what I'm thinking about is a situation where a very popular HTML5 multiplayer game would be changed on the client side to talk to a different server
  356. # [09:52] <norbert_> I guess the only way for a company to keep control over what's happening is to make the encryption and communication with the server impossible to break
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  358. # [09:53] <norbert_> or people might move away from the official server and just use a cracked client that communicates with another server that says "yeah, do whatever you want"
  359. # [09:53] <shwetank> well, nothing is impossible to break, but yeah, difficult
  360. # [09:54] <norbert_> there is a Flash game, for example, at everybodyedits.com
  361. # [09:54] <norbert_> where you need to pay real money to get certain items in the game
  362. # [09:54] <norbert_> I'm wondering how it would work if it were coded in HTML5
  363. # [09:55] <norbert_> probably the same
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  365. # [09:55] <shwetank> yeah, actionscript and javascript are both based on ecmascript
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  368. # [09:58] <norbert_> so, that multiplayer Flash application I mentioned sends the players's position on the screen to the server
  369. # [09:58] <norbert_> if that client would be HTML5, couldn't the player more easily change what is being send to the server?
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  371. # [09:59] <norbert_> hm... maybe a little, I guess, but even with Flash people could still use a package inspector
  372. # [09:59] <shwetank> yup
  373. # [10:00] <norbert_> well, thanks for reading my ramblings and giving feedback :)
  374. # [10:01] <shwetank> no problem :)
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  411. # [10:50] <dahlfors> if people start doing more games in html5 - I bet they will start keeping certain parts of the games serverside, so it can't be copied
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  414. # [10:52] <dahlfors> an the general rule - if it is on the web, people can decompile it in one way or the other - not mattering if it is flash or html5
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  430. # [11:16] <shwetank> dahlfors agreed
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  434. # [11:22] <Xarthok> so does html5 have more security flaws over flash at the moment?
  435. # [11:22] <asher^> no
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  520. # [13:37] <LogeshPaul> Help!
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  522. # [13:37] <LogeshPaul> I want to set letter-spacing: 0.3px ?
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  524. # [13:38] <LogeshPaul> It's only accepting letter-spacing: 1px; I don't need 1px letter space.
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  526. # [13:40] <dahlfors> it is always in steps of 1px
  527. # [13:42] <dahlfors> Xarthok: webgl has had some major security flaws though. there's been webgl code around that takes down all os x machines
  528. # [13:42] <dahlfors> :)
  529. # [13:42] <LogeshPaul> dahifors: Okay, is there any other way? thanks
  530. # [13:43] <dahlfors> no, there is not. pick a font that renders properly, or set letter-spacing in 1px adjustments
  531. # [13:43] <LogeshPaul> yeah selecting the correct font will help
  532. # [13:43] <LogeshPaul> Thanks for your help :)
  533. # [13:44] <dahlfors> as a guy into typography, this is why I hope there will be 200+ ppi displays for the masses in a few years
  534. # [13:44] <dahlfors> for proper typography on the web
  535. # [13:45] <dahlfors> could improve readability quite a lot
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  613. # [14:36] <sarbull> hello world, what are the main differences betwen html5 and html
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  650. # [15:33] <eltigre> hey, is it possible to do synchronous REST API requests with Websockets?
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  672. # [16:03] <Pomax> eltigre, why would you need a websocket for that, why not just spin off a webworker?
  673. # [16:03] <eltigre> Pomax, the problem was that I wanted to make cross domain xlm-http-requests
  674. # [16:04] <eltigre> Pomax, and yes by now I know I can't use websockets to make normal http calls
  675. # [16:04] <Pomax> websockets are unlikely to save you there, getting the remote server to support CORS is far more effective
  676. # [16:04] <Pomax> have it whitelist your requests and done.
  677. # [16:04] <eltigre> Pomax, I have no influence on the remote server...
  678. # [16:04] <eltigre> Pomax, whitelist?
  679. # [16:05] <Pomax> servers can indicate who are allowed to use their resources cross-origin-ly
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  681. # [16:05] <eltigre> hm hm
  682. # [16:05] <Pomax> using cross origin information in the http header response
  683. # [16:05] <Pomax> and then in our request you can sticl in cross origin request information
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  685. # [16:06] <Pomax> even if you don't control the remote server, you should be able to contact whoever does. If they don't want to do cross origin resource sharing, then using a websocket basically means you're circumventing their policy and they are probably allowed to cut you off without notice =)
  686. # [16:06] <eltigre> hm... as I said I have no influence on the remote server... it's an Appengine thing and the developer doing that API might not want to change a lot about it
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  688. # [16:07] <Pomax> if it's an app engine, they'd probably benefit from a "*" CORS rule
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  690. # [16:07] <eltigre> Pomax, yes, but it's more of an issue of the developer not wanting to complicate things instead of not wanting me to access it
  691. # [16:08] <Pomax> yeah, you hear that argument a lot, but surprisingly often that's an assumption, not actually the result of checking =)
  692. # [16:09] <Pomax> email's free, find out. In the mean time you could use a websocket but you'd have to write your own code to "wait" for the response
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  695. # [16:14] <eltigre> Pomax, cross domain whitelisting works only for flash... and that's what I actually wanted to avoid
  696. # [16:16] <Pomax> not it doesn't? O_o
  697. # [16:16] <Pomax> it's a generic HTTP request/response mechanism for arbitrary response content
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  700. # [16:18] <eltigre> ah now I am getting to that CORS thing
  701. # [16:19] <eltigre> problem is google sent me on a wild goose chase about people just complaining how cross domain requests suck
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  704. # [16:21] <Pomax> lol
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  777. # [17:37] <ManT> I have pictures location, what is the asiest way to get a name without path?
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  780. # [17:41] <Pomax> ManT: imageLocation.match(/\/([^/]+)$/)[1];
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  782. # [17:41] <Pomax> ManT: imageLocation.match(/([^/]+)$/)[1]; if you use relative links like src="lol.gif"
  783. # [17:41] <ManT> Thanks Pomax!
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  923. # [19:50] <jeffsmykil> Is there an easier way to deal with click events in canvas other than finding the location that was clicked and manually figuring out what is there?
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  938. # [19:55] <joeytwiddle> jeffsmykil: this may be of interest http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/the-canvas-element.html#hit-regions
  939. # [19:55] <joeytwiddle> although it doesn't look easy, and may not even work yet
  940. # [19:55] <joeytwiddle> perhaps better to find a library that does it for you
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  957. # [20:07] <jeffsmykil> joeytwiddle: ty for the response
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  959. # [20:07] <jeffsmykil> joeytwiddle: im using fabricjs right now
  960. # [20:07] <jeffsmykil> i would like to use kinetic but that 0 compatibility with excanvas
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  962. # [20:08] <xaq> hey guys, any idea on how getUserMedia/Stream API adoption is progressing? It would be great to have support for audioTrack streaming into audio contexts or audio elements, as well as streaming arraybuffers to remote hosts.
  963. # [20:08] <xaq> Does anyone know what kind of timetable we're dealing with on being able to implement that in chrome-dev / opera next / etc.?
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  966. # [20:10] <jeffsmykil> joeytwiddle: is there a more appropriate/active place to be asking Canvas questions?
  967. # [20:12] <techrush> #javascript is busier sometimes but the level of help you get depends on whos around
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  969. # [20:14] <jeffsmykil> thank you techrush
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  996. # [20:38] <Salvager> how do i add a gradient/blur border to only the bottom of a div, that allready have a background image?
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  1126. # [22:55] <David_Bradbury> Use a second background image? Use a box-shdow to fake it?
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  1130. # [23:00] <David_Bradbury> Are four-point transformations possible in CSS3?
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  1139. # [23:10] <windsurfer> How can I figure out what's making my web app's GUI slow?
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  1142. # [23:11] <David_Bradbury> Chrome Dev Tools, Firebug, etc...
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  1146. # [23:11] <windsurfer> David_Bradbury: Right, how do I use them for the GUI? Network is fine.
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  1152. # [23:14] <David_Bradbury> In Chrome, go to the "Timeline" tab and start recording. Take a look at what is holding it up. In my experience slow-downs are usually from unintentionally making too many calls through the DOM
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  1156. # [23:19] <windsurfer> So it seems like it's spending most of the time in "Paint". I guess that means it's out of my hands?
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  1160. # [23:31] <David_Bradbury> Well, you can try to work to reduce the number of times you're redrawing the page
  1161. # [23:34] <David_Bradbury> http://www.html5rocks.com/en/tutorials/speed/html5/ has some good tips.
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  1176. # Session Close: Tue Jul 17 00:00:00 2012

The end :)