/irc-logs / freenode / #html5 / 2013-11-10 / end

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# Session Start: Sun Nov 10 00:00:00 2013
# Session Ident: #html5
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# [03:31] <bray90820> Am i right that this should be put in the head section
# [03:31] <bray90820> <form method="post" action="http://webdevbasics.net/scripts/pacific.php">
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# [04:03] <CthdralComputer> pop quiz: when did the marquee element make its first appearance in HTML? was it there straight from the get-go, HTML4.01, or earlier?
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# [04:14] <JavierCabrera> hello
# [04:14] <JavierCabrera> someone here?
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# [05:07] <bray90820> can someone tell me what is wrong with this page
# [05:08] <bray90820> http://jsfiddle.net/u78pu/
# [05:08] <bray90820> apparently there is something wrong with the HTML in line 29
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# [05:08] <bray90820> Line 29, Column 22: The for attribute of the label element must refer to a form control.
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# Session Close: Sun Nov 10 11:47:04 2013
#
# Session Start: Sun Nov 10 11:47:04 2013
# Session Ident: #html5
# [11:47] * Disconnected
# [11:57] * Attempting to rejoin channel #html5
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# [11:57] * Topic is 'Ask any question about HTML5 & Friends || HTML5 Spec for Developers: http://developers.whatwg.org || Also: http://html5rocks.com http://diveintohtml5.info http://mzl.la/9giLwR || Channel logs: http://j.mp/cG7UDa'
# [11:57] * Set by marienz!marienz@freenode/staff/marienz on Fri Oct 21 20:53:09
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# [12:46] <doitux_> Hi, is it possible that a browser supports websockets-binary but NO localstorage?
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#
# Session Start: Sun Nov 10 13:46:17 2013
# Session Ident: #html5
# [13:46] * Now talking in #html5
# [13:46] * Topic is 'Ask any question about HTML5 & Friends || HTML5 Spec for Developers: http://developers.whatwg.org || Also: http://html5rocks.com http://diveintohtml5.info http://mzl.la/9giLwR || Channel logs: http://j.mp/cG7UDa'
# [13:46] * Set by marienz!marienz@freenode/staff/marienz on Fri Oct 21 20:53:09
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# [16:59] <doitux_> Hi, is it possible that a browser supports websockets-binary but NO localstorage?
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# [17:01] <patsToms> doitux_, check your broser at http://html5test.com
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# [17:01] <patsToms> s/broser/browser
# [17:02] <joroci> is there a browser with perfect score?
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# [17:08] <doitux_> patsToms: mmh i'am interested in any browser ... do i need to check for localstorage if websockets-binary is supported? i guess localstorage is much older than websockets-binary right?
# [17:09] <patsToms> yes, you should
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# [21:30] <norbert_> hi all
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# [21:31] <norbert_> so... I'm aware of preload="metadata", but I'm wondering if there's any way to embed webm (or ogv) with HTML5's <video> and have it load like YouTube does, so only load 10 seconds or so ahead
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# [21:31] <norbert_> because when I embed a 50 MB file and people only watch some of it, I don't want to send the whole 50 MB to the user
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# [21:32] <norbert_> is there, like, a custom HTML5 player someone created that can do this?
# [21:32] <norbert_> or is this something I would ask W3C to add to the HTML5 specification?
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# [21:56] <moo-_-> norbert_: I think it is controlled on the server side
# [21:56] <moo-_-> norbert_: get a media server which can handle it for you
# [21:57] <norbert_> hm... well, my money is limited
# [21:57] <moo-_-> norbert_: well, if changing W3C specification is not cheap either :(
# [21:57] <norbert_> that's the reason I don't want to send 50 MB to every user who checks only the first 10 seconds of a video
# [21:57] <moo-_-> maybe some javascript trickery
# [21:57] <norbert_> maybe
# [21:58] <norbert_> but I'm wondering, more people must have ran into this
# [21:58] <norbert_> if you have a 500 MB webm file you embed with HTML5's <video>
# [21:58] <norbert_> and someone presses play, it just sends 500 MB?
# [21:58] <moo-_-> norbert_: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/18422517/html5-video-buffered-attribute-features
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# [22:00] <norbert_> thanks
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# [22:02] <norbert_> it's going to be difficult to find a player that does what I want
# [22:02] <norbert_> most allow skipping but buffer everything
# [22:03] <pixelpimp> if i press 'play', assume i'm watching the whole video and buffer at least until i can watch it without pausing
# [22:03] <moo-_-> norbert_: also your server must support ranged http queries
# [22:03] <norbert_> yes
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# [22:06] <norbert_> http://www.longtailvideo.com/support/forums/jw-player/servers-and-streaming/31234/limit-buffering-on-http-pseudo-streaming/
# [22:07] <norbert_> even JWPlayer can't do it, apparently
# [22:07] <norbert_> that's Flash, I know
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# [22:08] <norbert_> still, max 1 minute buffering, you'd think everyone would want that
# [22:08] <norbert_> that I'd be the default
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# [22:08] <norbert_> instead of just loading 500 MB or however large the file is
# [22:08] <norbert_> 1 minute buffer should be more than enough
# [22:10] <norbert_> "A suggestion would be to implement / expose a property called "downloadBufferTarget". It would be the amount of video in seconds the browser tries to keep in the download buffer."
# [22:10] <norbert_> "When a user starts (or seeks in) a video, the browser would try to download "downloadBufferTarget" amount in seconds of video. When "downloaded > currentTime + downloadBufferTarget", downloading would get stalled, until a certain lower treshold is reached (e.g. 50%) and the browser would start downloading additional data."
# [22:10] <norbert_> that's basically what 99% of the people want, I'd think
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# [22:13] <moo-_-> norbert_: yes
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# [22:15] <norbert_> what are my options if my money is limited but I want to host the file locally and not use an external service like YouTube?
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# [22:15] <norbert_> should I go for FLV for now?
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# [22:19] <norbert_> downloadBufferTarget, as was suggested here http://lists.whatwg.org/htdig.cgi/whatwg-whatwg.org/2011-January/029930.html in 2011, is something that sounds nice
# [22:19] <norbert_> I wonder why that didn't make it
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# [22:23] <norbert_> ranged http queries, plus an HTML5 communication layer like YouTube, that should work in theory
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# [22:29] <norbert_> adaptive streaming that enables buffer control is apparently only available on iOS/Safari
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# [22:32] <smartracer> Hi i have a doubt in html and html
# [22:33] <smartracer> Xhtml
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# [22:38] <norbert_> smartracer: go on
# [22:39] <norbert_> "It is worth pointing out at this point that the browser automatically downloads the video anyway, with or without autobuffer and there is nothing you can do about it. This has bandwidth and loading time issues, particularly if you have a lot of video on your page."
# [22:39] <norbert_> from http://html5doctor.com/the-video-element/
# [22:39] <smartracer> Norbert i learned xhtml on a book it said using xhtml is good than html ok
# [22:39] <norbert_> I don't understand why HTML5's <video> tag is broken from the start
# [22:39] <pixelpimp> rush to get it out there
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# [22:40] <pixelpimp> i'm surprised that after youtube adopted it, it hasn't been very quickly fixed
# [22:40] <smartracer> Now html is developed now it is html5 with many advantages still i need to use xhtml or html5?
# [22:42] <norbert_> smartracer: just use HTML5, it has some of the best features of both HTML 4 and XHTML
# [22:43] <smartracer> But that book says if u need standards u need to go with xhtml.is that right?
# [22:43] <moo-_-> smartracer: which year your book was written?
# [22:43] <moo-_-> smartracer: don't believe everything that is printed
# [22:44] <smartracer> I think its before html5 came
# [22:44] <moo-_-> :)
# [22:44] <moo-_-> smartracer: yes
# [22:44] <norbert_> I would also suggest you write "you" instead of "u", unless you want to come across as a 10 year old
# [22:44] <smartracer> Ok html5 comes under standards? Is that strict ?
# [22:44] <pixelpimp> words of wisdom
# [22:45] <moo-_-> smartracer: though norbert_ has a point, I like various writing styles of different people. If you need help it is better to try to write like a professional and you'll get professional level help too.
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# [22:45] <pixelpimp> All versions of HTML, as well as XHTML, have many standards.
# [22:45] <smartracer> Ok thanks moo
# [22:46] <smartracer> Ok ok thanks friends.i have another doubt.what are the uses of xml? Where xml is mostly used?
# [22:47] <smartracer> Some said it is used for creating pdf, some says it is for web page creation.is that all true?
# [22:49] <norbert_> "XSL Formatting Objects, or XSL-FO, is a markup language for XML document formatting which is most often used to generate PDFs."
# [22:49] <norbert_> it can be used for creating PDF files
# [22:49] <moo-_-> smartracer: XML is a mark-up language used in many kind of different systems
# [22:49] <moo-_-> smartracer: it is base for different domain specific languages (XHTML, MathML, SVG, etc)
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# [22:50] <smartracer> Ya i read you can create tags and languages with xml is that also true?
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# [22:51] <smartracer> Xml is also used at android applications why?
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# [22:53] <moo-_-> smartracer: it is used as a configuration language in may places
# [22:53] <moo-_-> because XML is quite universal format
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# [22:54] <smartracer> Ok ok on today class my faculty created a servlet project for that he created a xml file now i understand
# [22:54] <smartracer> Thanks friends
# [22:55] <moo-_-> smartracer: no problem
# [22:56] <smartracer> Here after i will come here many times.i have tons of doubts
# [22:56] <norbert_> if it's about XML, you may want to give #xml a shot
# [22:57] <smartracer> Ya i went there but no response :(
# [22:58] <smartracer> Its ok curiosity will never sleep.see u later friends.here its 3.28 am.bye
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# [22:59] <norbert_> 3.28 means you're halfway of a timezone
# [22:59] <norbert_> I didn't even know they had half timezones
# [22:59] <moo-_-> norbert_: yes
# [22:59] <norbert_> interesting stuff
# [22:59] <moo-_-> they had quarters too
# [22:59] <moo-_-> don't know if they still do
# [23:00] <norbert_> smartracer: Kolkata, Bangalore, Mumbai, New Delhi ?
# [23:01] <norbert_> apparently they still do, interesting; never knew that
# [23:01] <moo-_-> http://www.worldtimezone.com/faq.html
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# [23:16] <norbert_> are there still 2 HTML5 standards, one from the W3C and one from WHATWG?
# [23:16] <norbert_> or am I mistaken?
# [23:16] <norbert_> moo-_-: maybe you can tell me what you think of the following plan I have
# [23:16] <norbert_> I want to mail to http://lists.whatwg.org/listinfo.cgi/whatwg-whatwg.org
# [23:16] <norbert_> and point them to http://lists.whatwg.org/pipermail/whatwg-whatwg.org/2011-January/thread.html
# [23:16] <norbert_> specifically this post http://lists.whatwg.org/pipermail/whatwg-whatwg.org/2011-January/029967.html
# [23:17] <moo-_-> norbert_: I think you should ask #whatwg channel
# [23:17] <norbert_> that suggests an additional "state3" preload state
# [23:17] <moo-_-> meet the authors
# [23:17] <norbert_> ok
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The end :)