/irc-logs / freenode / #microformats / 2013-02-24 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Sun Feb 24 00:00:00 2013
  2. # Session Ident: #microformats
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  5. # [00:58] <impomatic> I guess this is okay? http://twitcode.org/show/340/h-cite-citations
  6. # [00:58] <impomatic> The only thing not really marked up is the publisher.
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  8. # [01:32] <Loqi> https://twitter.com/devaputradwik :: Memperbaiki Warning Missing required field updated dan hCard author: BismillahirrahmanirrahimMULTI PASTE - Goo... http://www.multipaste.web.id/2013/02/memperbaiki-warning-missing-required-field-updated-dan-hCard-author.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
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  13. # [03:06] <Loqi> [[User:kslgrrnkt]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=User:kslgrrnkt&rcid=67659 * Kslgrrnkt * (+1849) lol. It would be nice if we knew when to expect a purchase.
  14. # [03:07] <Loqi> [[Special:Log/block]] block * Tantek * blocked [[User:Kslgrrnkt]] with an expiry time of infinite (account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites
  15. # [03:07] <Loqi> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Tantek * deleted "[[User:kslgrrnkt]]": content was spam
  16. # [03:07] <@tantek> impomatic - those look good!
  17. # [03:08] <@tantek> are those going on a particular page on the web?
  18. # [03:08] <@tantek> if/when you do post them, it would be great if you could add the URL here: http://microformats.org/wiki/h-cite#web_citation_examples_in_the_wild
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  60. # [15:24] <tommorris> tantek: ping. back on british soil. had a crack at doing h-cite to bibtex. the semantics match up quite nicely.
  61. # [15:26] <tommorris> then I got angry at how all languages suck at ISO 8601.
  62. # [15:26] <tommorris> so started porting gjones' isodate.js to Java.
  63. # [15:27] <tommorris> also, Ruby doesn't implement ISO 8601 properly.
  64. # [15:27] <tommorris> Date.iso8601("2012-12") == Date.iso8601("2012-012")
  65. # [15:27] <tommorris> returns true
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  70. # [16:13] <Loqi> [[iso-8601]] http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=iso-8601&diff=50193&oldid=43229&rcid=67662 * TomMorris * (+143) /* ISO 8601 implementations in programming libraries */ Ruby, but no ordinal dates
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  73. # [16:45] <@tantek> tommorris - that's pretty funny (about Ruby getting ISO8601 wrong)
  74. # [16:46] <tommorris> and now my post grumbling about it is on the front page of hacker news
  75. # [16:49] <Loqi> [[iso-8601]] http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=iso-8601&diff=50194&oldid=50193&rcid=67663 * TomMorris * (+157) /* ISO 8601 implementations in programming libraries */ +microformat-node
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  77. # [17:00] <@tantek> well done tommorris!
  78. # [17:01] <tommorris> note to future generations: sorry about the technological singularity not happening, we're still struggling with date-times.
  79. # [17:01] <@tantek> that's a great post! classic tommorris rant style. :) http://tommorris.org/posts/8114
  80. # [17:03] <@tantek> tommorris, did you mean "I hope Rails apps [are] doing input validation…" ?
  81. # [17:03] <tommorris> yeah, was gonna fix that
  82. # [17:03] <tommorris> was on shaky 3G. now home
  83. # [17:05] <tommorris> so, I was looking at h-cite to BibTeX. the only problem I'm having is that BibTeX requires a "type".
  84. # [17:05] <tommorris> like "book", "article", "url" etc.
  85. # [17:05] <tommorris> Book is fairly easy. If it has an ISBN, it's a book.
  86. # [17:05] <@tantek> we don't do required properties any more
  87. # [17:06] <@tantek> how about just pad it with type="citation"
  88. # [17:06] <tommorris> set everything as @misc ;)
  89. # [17:06] <tommorris> so, h-cite to bibtex seems like a very, very compelling use case.
  90. # [17:06] <@tantek> yes. http://everythingismiscellaneous.com
  91. # [17:06] <tommorris> to roll it out on somewhere like Wikipedia, it'd be very useful to be able to export to BibTeX.
  92. # [17:07] <tommorris> hence why I'm looking at it. I've spent loads of time writing BibTeX by hand
  93. # [17:07] <@tantek> "type" is such a horrible vocabulary term to mean anything. so overloaded.
  94. # [17:07] <tommorris> well, it isn't used in BibTeX.
  95. # [17:07] <tommorris> a BibTeX entry is of the form:
  96. # [17:07] <@tantek> is it called "medium" then?
  97. # [17:08] <tommorris> @book{Smith2005, title = {My book about things}, author = {John Smith}}
  98. # [17:08] <tommorris> type is just what I'm using to refer to the word that comes after the @ and before the {
  99. # [17:09] <@tantek> where's their taxonomy of @ "types"?
  100. # [17:09] <@tantek> some made up hierarchy of crap like schemaorg?
  101. # [17:10] <tommorris> well, mostly in the code used by BibTeX
  102. # [17:10] <@tantek> like do they have 5, 10, or 150 of them?
  103. # [17:11] <tommorris> about 20
  104. # [17:11] <tommorris> it dictates the rendering of the citation
  105. # [17:12] <@tantek> are these 20 documented on the web?
  106. # [17:12] <@tantek> or is this a LMGTFY...
  107. # [17:13] <tommorris> mostly.
  108. # [17:13] <@tantek> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BibTeX#Entry_types
  109. # [17:14] <tommorris> I can pop up some real-life BibTeX files. ;)
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  111. # [17:14] <tommorris> I think "url" is considered a type by some.
  112. # [17:14] <@tantek> wow what a dated set of "types"
  113. # [17:16] <tommorris> but still ridiculously useful and in daily use by academics, students and others.
  114. # [17:17] <Loqi> [[BoostYourBust84743507]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=BoostYourBust84743507&rcid=67664 * VerlenesguxxdswyhDae * (+169) New page: Increase Your Breast Size Naturally with [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeDH3Oug8gs Boost Your Bust]! Proven system. All natural ways. My Honest Boost Your Bust Review.
  115. # [17:18] <tommorris> BibTeX annoys me in many ways, but still widespread in academia. ensuring we can get data out as BibTeX is a really compelling and easy win.
  116. # [17:19] <Loqi> [[Special:Log/block]] block * Tantek * blocked [[User:VerlenesguxxdswyhDae]] with an expiry time of infinite (account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites
  117. # [17:19] <Loqi> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Tantek * deleted "[[BoostYourBust84743507]]": content was spam
  118. # [17:19] <@tantek> interesting. I wonder what this world is that consumes BibTeX.
  119. # [17:20] <tommorris> mathematicians, academic computer scientists, some philosophers, some physical scientists
  120. # [17:20] <tommorris> some of the academic journal publishers offer BibTeX for download
  121. # [17:20] <tommorris> Google Books does too
  122. # [17:21] <tommorris> and the whole DOI system allows you to retrieve BibTeX
  123. # [17:21] <@tantek> sure, that's for retrieving BibTeX - but who actually consumes it?
  124. # [17:22] <tommorris> well, storing it for your own use when writing papers
  125. # [17:22] <@tantek> might be interesting to write a BibTeX -> h-cite converter for taking existing BibTeX data and using it as referencing in blog posts.
  126. # [17:22] <tommorris> BibTeX to h-cite is easy. there are a fair few implementations of BibTeX parsing
  127. # [17:22] <tommorris> I've been using the Ruby BibTeX library (hence my grumbles about ISO 8601 date formats in Ruby)
  128. # [17:23] <@tantek> wow bibtex (screw their capitalization, don't need it for understanding) predates the web!
  129. # [17:24] <tommorris> yep.
  130. # [17:24] <tommorris> there's a huge amount of cruft management in the tex world
  131. # [17:25] <tommorris> like, the transition to support Unicode. because obviously (la)tex predated Unicode
  132. # [17:27] <tommorris> when compiling a bibliography recently, the process often involved:
  133. # [17:27] <tommorris> 1. going to google books
  134. # [17:27] <tommorris> 2. typing in ISBN number, finding book
  135. # [17:27] <tommorris> 3. clicking BibTeX export
  136. # [17:27] <tommorris> 4. opening up file that downloads in text editor
  137. # [17:27] <tommorris> 5. copying into main bibliography file.
  138. # [17:28] <tommorris> 6. reformatting slightly for consistency
  139. # [17:28] <tommorris> there must be a better way. ;)
  140. # [17:28] <@tantek> so even google books bibtex export can't get it right then
  141. # [17:29] <@tantek> we have a better chance with h-cite to bibtex?
  142. # [17:30] <@tantek> tommorris - if there are implementations that support an @url bibtex type, perhaps you should add that in an "Extended types" subsection under http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BibTeX#Entry_types and list/cite the implementations.
  143. # [17:31] <tommorris> yeah. I'll have a dig around and document on both microformats.org and wp
  144. # [17:31] <@tantek> just so you don't redo this: http://microformats.org/wiki/citation-formats#BibTeX
  145. # [17:33] <tommorris> when I was an undergrad, I made my own BibTeX citation style template which I popped up on Github - https://github.com/tommorris/tomstyle
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  156. # [19:05] <Loqi> [[User:Fakhricool]] NM http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=User:Fakhricool&rcid=67667 * Fakhricool * (+2752) Bank Mandiri Bank Terbaik di Indonesia
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  178. # [22:29] <Loqi> https://twitter.com/QueenWaqo :: @Princess_Idil As much as I wanna do that I can't tho it's tight on my HCard n it's Sunday :(
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The end :)