/irc-logs / freenode / #microformats / 2015-11-09 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Mon Nov 09 00:00:00 2015
  2. # Session Ident: #microformats
  3. # [00:02] <KartikPrabhu> i don't see the need to introduce new HTML attributes for everything
  4. # [00:03] <Calli> Oh. So implied properties and nesting is a big part of the diff?
  5. # [00:03] <KartikPrabhu> HTML gives heirarchy and classes tell you the "type" of element so why invent itemprop/itemscope
  6. # [00:03] <Calli> Are implied properties dependent on vocab or part of general parsing rules?
  7. # [00:03] <KartikPrabhu> implied props greatly simplify writing mf2
  8. # [00:03] <KartikPrabhu> general parsing rules
  9. # [00:04] <Calli> KartikPrabhu: Thx. Will look at the parsing rules again. In terms of "new attributes", as far as I am concerned HTML5 is spec'd, released and the attributes exist, so they don't feel new. ;-)
  10. # [00:05] <KartikPrabhu> e.g. <article class="h-entry">Title</article> gives same mf2 as <article class="h-entry><span class="p-name">Title</span></article>
  11. # [00:05] <KartikPrabhu> by "new" I mean for the pubisher to learn
  12. # [00:06] <KartikPrabhu> I really don't need to learn how itemprops/itemscope work to have "data" in my HTML
  13. # [00:06] <KartikPrabhu> so mf2 is easier to learn and write
  14. # [00:06] <kevinmarks> well, microdata is out of html5
  15. # [00:06] <KartikPrabhu> also that ^
  16. # [00:08] <Calli> oh yeah - ok - I've been fooled by old specs
  17. # [00:09] <KartikPrabhu> to me it seems people have given up on microdata for RDFa and now for JSONLD
  18. # [00:09] <Calli> But: I see content that uses itemprop/itemscope and scoped-rels - and it matches the HTML drafts or whatever
  19. # [00:10] <KartikPrabhu> people don't really update their sites to match latest HTML5 spec do they?
  20. # [00:11] <aaronpk> I wonder what is going to come after JSON-LD islands
  21. # [00:12] <KartikPrabhu> Revenge of the XML
  22. # [00:12] <KartikPrabhu> errr sorry WebComponents
  23. # [00:13] <Calli> So comparing microdata vs MF2 (serialization), the main advantage is implied props? Anything else I've missed?
  24. # [00:14] <KartikPrabhu> Calli: IMO the main difference in ease of publishing rather than what happens in the parsing/serialisation
  25. # [00:14] <KartikPrabhu> and implied props is a huge part of that
  26. # [00:15] <aaronpk> also it's just less verbose
  27. # [00:15] <KartikPrabhu> mainly due to implied props right?
  28. # [00:15] <Calli> Yeah - I'm calling out "serialization" to distinguish it from "vocabulary".
  29. # [00:16] <Calli> Don't mean to imply that the main concern is parser developers rather than content creators
  30. # [00:16] <aaronpk> the other main advantage is mf2 has an active community vs one that has moved on to other methods of embedding data :)
  31. # [00:16] <KartikPrabhu> :)
  32. # [00:17] <Calli> Yeah - the community seems really great!
  33. # [00:24] <Calli> Still I feel compelled to give you my perspective as an outsider/newcomer: if I look at pages I'm interested in extracting data from, I see microdata some MF1, no MF2, and no RDFa. I see a draft HTML spec that describes parsing rules that match data that I see in pages I'm interested in. I also see JSON+LD.
  34. # [00:25] <KartikPrabhu> If your goal is to parse specific pages then you'd have to parse whatever they provide
  35. # [00:26] <Calli> Yeah. Which means I need microdata parsing and scoped-rel parsing.
  36. # [00:26] <Calli> Be great if I only needed that right?
  37. # [00:27] <Calli> So I'm trying to understand what are the differences and why they exist?
  38. # [00:27] <KartikPrabhu> I have never looked at microdata parsing so can't tell if there is more to it than that
  39. # [00:34] <Calli> Oh. I had another question about article vs h-entry
  40. # [00:34] <Calli> Ever considered just replacing h-entry with <article>?
  41. # [00:34] <aaronpk> most of the new usage of microformats2 has been in the social web space
  42. # [00:35] <Calli> aaronpk: yeah - that stuff is new to me and looks very cool
  43. # [00:35] <KartikPrabhu> Calli: mf2 does not assume that a given HTML tag corresponds to some microformat
  44. # [00:35] <aaronpk> Calli: one of the goals of mf2 is to not dictate which html elements people use, so the ability to use h-entry on things other than <article> is good, and also means smaller spec with fewer edge cases
  45. # [00:36] <Calli> makes sense
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  47. # [00:44] <Calli> And how stable is the MF2 parsing spec?
  48. # [00:45] <aaronpk> the guts of it hasn't changed in a long time. there are a couple things in the works right now but it's things like how to add things like language attributes
  49. # [00:52] <Calli> thanks
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  51. # [01:33] <Loqi> [@MujahideenHckr] RT @SmallMarketi: RT https://twitter.com/scriptzteam/status/663514105513426944 IP.Blog 2.6: SEO Improvements and Microformats - http://newz.scriptz-team.info/IPS-News-And-Updates/078819-IP-Blog-2-6-SEO-Improvements-and-Microformats.html (http://twtr.io/15qPgCHnqYY)
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  53. # [01:36] <Loqi> [@e_realis] RT @SmallMarketi: RT https://twitter.com/scriptzteam/status/663514105513426944 IP.Blog 2.6: SEO Improvements and Microformats - http://newz.scriptz-team.info/IPS-News-And-Updates/078819-IP-Blog-2-6-SEO-Improvements-and-Microformats.html (http://twtr.io/15qPxUC0uts)
  54. # [04:24] <Loqi> [@seoshake] RT @scriptzteam: IP.Blog 2.6: SEO Improvements and Microformats - http://newz.scriptz-team.info/IPS-News-And-Updates/078819-IP-Blog-2-6-SEO-Improvements-and-Microformats.html (http://twtr.io/15qe5bh8W94)
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  97. # [12:24] <Loqi> [[code-tools]] http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=code-tools&diff=65304&oldid=65201&rcid=101692 * Jenifferhomes * (+21)
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  122. # [16:37] <Loqi> [@AllTheTwits] santa: please provide tutorials on microformats for my colleagues (god!) (http://twtr.io/15rjwPsdiuf)
  123. # [16:45] * Joins: fuzzyhorns (~fuzzyhorn@73.38.57.191)
  124. # [16:46] <Loqi> [@OshikanRelation] RT https://twitter.com/scriptzteam/status/663744370814922752 IP.Blog 2.6: SEO Improvements and Microformats - http://newz.scriptz-team.info/IPS-News-And-Updates/078819-IP-Blog-2-6-SEO-Improvements-and-Microformats.html (http://twtr.io/15rkoZwou2g)
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  132. # [17:46] <Loqi> [@solanolandtrust] What a great quote for this #MotivationalMonday. Get outside with our events calendar! http://solanolandtrust.org/CalendarList.aspx?hCalendar=1 https://twitter.com/solanolandtrust/status/663758191906410496/photo/1 (http://twtr.io/15rqgcpKJUG)
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  135. # [18:19] <Loqi> [@AllTheTwits] I'm hoping to put together an event called ExtensibleCamp about XML/API/Semantic Web/RSS/OPML/microformats etc (http://twtr.io/15ru5guwHvH)
  136. # [18:31] <Loqi> [@CALandTrusts] RT @solanolandtrust: What a great quote for this #MotivationalMonday. Get outside with our events calendar! http://solanolandtrust.org/CalendarList.aspx?hCalendar=1 https:/… (http://twtr.io/15ruFGJStDb)
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  143. # [19:01] <kylewm> AllTheTwits found tommorris!
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  169. # [23:49] <Loqi> [@seoshake] RT @scriptzteam: IP.Blog 2.6: SEO Improvements and Microformats - http://newz.scriptz-team.info/IPS-News-And-Updates/078819-IP-Blog-2-6-SEO-Improvements-and-Microformats.html (http://twtr.io/15sPpQJRybp)
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  172. # [23:59] <Loqi> [@seoshake] RT @scriptzteam: IP.Blog 2.6: SEO Improvements and Microformats - http://newz.scriptz-team.info/IPS-News-And-Updates/078819-IP-Blog-2-6-SEO-Improvements-and-Microformats.html (http://twtr.io/15sQiLX58QY)
  173. # Session Close: Tue Nov 10 00:00:00 2015

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