/irc-logs / w3c / #webapps / 2010-08-19 / end

Options:

  1. # Session Start: Thu Aug 19 00:00:00 2010
  2. # Session Ident: #webapps
  3. # [00:37] * Zakim excuses himself; his presence no longer seems to be needed
  4. # [00:37] * Parts: Zakim (rrs-bridgg@128.30.52.169)
  5. # [01:20] * Quits: shepazu (schepers@128.30.52.169) (Quit: shepazu)
  6. # [02:30] * Quits: karl (karlcow@128.30.54.58) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  7. # [03:15] * Quits: sicking (chatzilla@63.245.220.240) (Ping timeout)
  8. # [03:19] * Joins: sicking (chatzilla@63.245.220.240)
  9. # [03:40] * Quits: sicking (chatzilla@63.245.220.240) (Ping timeout)
  10. # [04:24] * Joins: shepazu (schepers@128.30.52.169)
  11. # [05:09] * Joins: karl (karlcow@128.30.54.58)
  12. # [05:18] * Joins: MikeSmithX (MikeSmith@111.188.107.66)
  13. # [05:19] * Quits: MikeSmithX (MikeSmith@111.188.107.66) (Client exited)
  14. # [05:20] * Quits: MikeSmithXX (MikeSmith@111.188.41.133) (Ping timeout)
  15. # [05:26] * Joins: MikeSmith (MikeSmith@114.48.108.111)
  16. # [06:48] * Quits: shepazu (schepers@128.30.52.169) (Ping timeout)
  17. # [07:07] * Quits: arve (arve@95.34.168.65) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  18. # [07:41] * Quits: hober (ted@174.143.153.77) (Connection reset by peer)
  19. # [07:41] * Joins: hober (ted@174.143.153.77)
  20. # [08:39] * Quits: aroben (aroben@71.58.77.15) (Connection reset by peer)
  21. # [08:57] * Joins: sicking (chatzilla@98.210.155.80)
  22. # [09:23] * Quits: sicking (chatzilla@98.210.155.80) (Ping timeout)
  23. # [10:05] * Joins: arve (arve@213.236.208.22)
  24. # [10:21] * Joins: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172)
  25. # [10:25] * Quits: Martijnc (Martijnc@91.176.57.47) (Ping timeout)
  26. # [10:30] * Joins: Martijnc (Martijnc@91.176.226.153)
  27. # [11:15] * Quits: Lachy (Lachlan@84.215.59.50) (Quit: Leaving)
  28. # [11:15] * Joins: Lachy (Lachlan@84.215.59.50)
  29. # [11:15] * Quits: Lachy (Lachlan@84.215.59.50) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  30. # [11:20] * Quits: Martijnc (Martijnc@91.176.226.153) (Ping timeout)
  31. # [11:25] * Quits: MikeSmith (MikeSmith@114.48.108.111) (Ping timeout)
  32. # [11:28] * Joins: MikeSmith (MikeSmith@114.48.55.215)
  33. # [11:40] * Joins: Lachy (Lachlan@213.236.208.22)
  34. # [11:46] * Quits: Lachy (Lachlan@213.236.208.22) (Quit: Leaving)
  35. # [11:46] * Joins: Lachy (Lachlan@213.236.208.22)
  36. # [11:50] * Joins: Martijnc (Martijnc@91.176.133.3)
  37. # [12:47] * Joins: ArtB (chatzilla@192.100.124.219)
  38. # [12:55] <ArtB> MikeSmith - are you available to help Andrei get Indexed Database API published today (in /TR/)?
  39. # [12:56] <MikeSmith> ArtB: yeah, I reckon I can
  40. # [12:57] <ArtB> mikesmith: the doc is http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/IndexedDB/raw-file/tip/Overview-WD-19-Aug-2010.html
  41. # [12:58] <ArtB> I just asked Andrei to update the "This version" URL to: http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-IndexedDB-20100819/
  42. # [12:58] <ArtB> Other than that change, AFAIK, it's pub ready
  43. # [13:03] * Quits: timeless (timeless@65.75.195.122) (Ping timeout)
  44. # [13:05] <MikeSmith> ArtB: OK
  45. # [13:36] <ArtB> MikeSmith - Andrei just reported the This Version URL is now fixed
  46. # [13:37] <MikeSmith> cool
  47. # [13:37] <MikeSmith> it's probably going to be a couple hours before I can get around to moving it
  48. # [13:37] <MikeSmith> by I will work with the webmaster to make sure it is done by the end of today
  49. # [13:49] <ArtB> thanks MikeSmith!
  50. # [13:50] <anne5> seems xhr tests will take a little longer before they start working
  51. # [13:50] <anne5> apparently running scripts was not taken in as requirement for test.w3.org o_O
  52. # [14:10] <MikeSmith> anne5: I think we need to ask plh to push back on that
  53. # [14:10] <MikeSmith> that was not the intent when we asked the systems team to set up that system
  54. # [14:10] <MikeSmith> and it was not a limitation that was communicated to us
  55. # [14:11] <MikeSmith> if it had been, they would have been told it wasn't acceptable
  56. # [14:11] <anne5> i asked already
  57. # [14:11] <anne5> but it appears this will take time again
  58. # [14:12] <anne5> initially it would all be ready when i announced the test suite
  59. # [14:12] <anne5> then it became august 17 because syncing wasn't working
  60. # [14:12] <anne5> then it turned out scripts didn't work
  61. # [14:12] <anne5> self-hosting would've been easier
  62. # [14:14] <MikeSmith> yeah, well, I'd rather not give up every time we run into a problem, instead of trying to get it fixed
  63. # [14:14] <MikeSmith> I am sure we are going to eventually expose other limitations in the setup
  64. # [14:15] <anne5> i haven't given up yet, but W3C is not making it easy
  65. # [14:16] <anne5> not blaming you btw, just complaining in general
  66. # [14:17] <MikeSmith> yeah, sure, understood
  67. # [14:17] <MikeSmith> but for better or worse this is pretty much how most systems team I have worked with operate
  68. # [14:18] <MikeSmith> their initial answer to anything that requires any extra work from them is often No
  69. # [14:18] <MikeSmith> and the way to get them to say Yes is to make them understand you're serious
  70. # [14:19] <MikeSmith> and the best way to do that in this case is to ask plh to make it clear
  71. # [14:20] <MikeSmith> Philippe "W3C DOM" Le Hégaret understands why scripting support is important for running tests
  72. # [14:30] * ArtB nods in agreement i.e. +1 to MikeSmith
  73. # [14:31] * Quits: arve (arve@213.236.208.22) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  74. # [14:34] * MikeSmith nods in agreement to ArtB nod of agreement :)
  75. # [14:47] * Quits: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172) (Connection reset by peer)
  76. # [14:47] * Joins: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172)
  77. # [14:52] * Joins: fjh (fjh@66.30.252.41)
  78. # [15:44] * Joins: aroben (aroben@71.58.77.15)
  79. # [15:55] * Quits: fjh (fjh@66.30.252.41) (Quit: fjh)
  80. # [16:13] * Joins: shepazu (schepers@128.30.52.169)
  81. # [16:15] * Joins: timeless_mbp (timeless@88.115.8.36)
  82. # [16:46] <anne5> well yeah, the alternative is to avoid dealing with the systems team
  83. # [16:51] <MikeSmith> anne5: you will always be dealing with a systems team somewhere
  84. # [16:51] <MikeSmith> unless you run all your software on machines you have root access to
  85. # [16:52] <MikeSmith> as far as I can see
  86. # [16:52] <MikeSmith> I don't think having stuff hosted on a machine you don't have root access to is not really self-hosting
  87. # [16:52] * Joins: fjh (fjh@66.30.252.41)
  88. # [16:53] <anne5> hosting providers are typically far more liberal in my experience
  89. # [16:53] <anne5> sufficiently liberal for things not to matter
  90. # [16:54] <anne5> maybe one day I should learn to run my own server; bandwidth is getting pretty good these days and there won't be too much traffic anyway
  91. # [16:55] <MikeSmith> I've been doing that for my domain for some years now
  92. # [16:56] <anne5> where is your server then?
  93. # [16:56] <MikeSmith> http://www.bytemark.co.uk/ is the hosting company
  94. # [16:57] <MikeSmith> this is for my http://sideshowbarker.net/
  95. # [16:57] <anne5> ah; i meant putting a server at home
  96. # [16:57] <MikeSmith> and for several other virtual domains
  97. # [16:57] <MikeSmith> ah
  98. # [16:57] <anne5> i have a pretty good deal at dreamhost which gives me access to most things
  99. # [16:57] <MikeSmith> OK
  100. # [16:59] <anne5> whoa, it took two weeks after the review period to get web perf through
  101. # [16:59] <anne5> didn't realize that
  102. # [17:23] * Joins: MikeSmithX (MikeSmith@111.188.28.26)
  103. # [17:25] * Quits: MikeSmith (MikeSmith@114.48.55.215) (Ping timeout)
  104. # [17:37] * MikeSmithX is now known as MikeSmith
  105. # [17:55] * jgraham wonders if we will just get PHP or if other CGI-capable alternatives will be avaliable
  106. # [18:07] <MikeSmith> jgraham: dunno
  107. # [18:08] <MikeSmith> I guess those actually working on testing -- e.g., HTML WG testing TF -- should decide what they want to ask for
  108. # [18:08] <anne5> server-sent events and xhr both use PHP
  109. # [18:08] <anne5> might need .htaccess control at some point and what I'd really like is the ability to omit the Content-Type header
  110. # [18:08] <anne5> there must be a setting for that somewhere
  111. # [18:14] <jgraham> I just have a <del>mild</del>strong preference for not writing PHP :)
  112. # [18:14] <jgraham> But I am not yet sure which parts of HTML5 testing will require server-side support
  113. # [18:15] <jgraham> (clearly many parts of other specs will)
  114. # [18:15] <jgraham> (e.g. websockets)
  115. # [18:15] <jgraham> (to test the API we will need to run a WS sserver)
  116. # [18:15] <jgraham> Which is an even harder requirement as it is not just a CGI script
  117. # [18:17] <jgraham> But it has to be flexible enough that we can get it to return more-or-less arbitary byte sequences
  118. # [18:17] <MikeSmith> having PHP support added to the test server to address the problem of lack of scripting support is one of those "now you have two problems" kind of things
  119. # [18:17] <jgraham> So a typical off-the-shelf implementation won't be good enough
  120. # [18:32] * Parts: dandaman (Daniel.Sau@216.52.240.243)
  121. # [18:38] * Quits: karl (karlcow@128.30.54.58) (Ping timeout)
  122. # [18:40] <anne5> if you don't add PHP support someone will have to rewrite the XHR tests
  123. # [18:40] <anne5> and until that happens I'll prolly host them elsewhere
  124. # [18:45] <MikeSmith> I think we can get PHP added
  125. # [18:45] <MikeSmith> especially if others on the HTML WG testing TF chime in
  126. # [18:48] <anne5> i doubt HTML needs much networking
  127. # [18:48] <anne5> well, a bit of course
  128. # [18:48] <anne5> anyway, i guess i'll see after the css meeting
  129. # [18:48] <anne5> if nothing has really happened by then i'll look into something else
  130. # [18:51] <ArtB> anne5, MikeSmith - FYI, I think we are going to need server-side support to test the Widgets Access spec
  131. # [18:51] <ArtB> but I don't know what Marcos and Robin are planning
  132. # [19:02] * Quits: Lachy (Lachlan@213.236.208.22) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  133. # [19:17] * Quits: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172) (Ping timeout)
  134. # [19:18] <MikeSmith> ArtB: ok
  135. # [19:31] * Joins: sicking (chatzilla@63.245.220.240)
  136. # [19:34] * Joins: Lachy (Lachlan@84.215.59.50)
  137. # [20:06] * Quits: Lachy (Lachlan@84.215.59.50) (Quit: Leaving)
  138. # [20:06] * Joins: Lachy (Lachlan@84.215.59.50)
  139. # [20:25] * Joins: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172)
  140. # [20:38] * Quits: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172) (Client exited)
  141. # [20:39] * Joins: smaug_ (chatzilla@91.154.40.172)
  142. # [20:51] <ArtB> Thanks MikeSmith re http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-IndexedDB-20100819/ and to the Editors!
  143. # [20:53] <MikeSmith> I didn't do anything
  144. # [20:53] <MikeSmith> really
  145. # [20:53] <MikeSmith> the webmaster did it
  146. # [20:54] <MikeSmith> this is my "do all with out doing" approach
  147. # [20:54] <MikeSmith> "arrive without traveling"
  148. # [21:46] <jgraham> MikeSmith: But you have a reputation for being awesome, so when something good happens people naturally assume you were involved
  149. # [21:46] <jgraham> :)
  150. # [21:47] <MikeSmith> heh
  151. # [21:47] <MikeSmith> I do have a reputation, that's pretty clear at least
  152. # [21:48] <MikeSmith> and I think "awesome" is a good word for it for sure
  153. # [21:50] <MikeSmith> but then there's "shock and awe" awesome, and "awesome" <snicker> awesome, etc.
  154. # [21:51] <anne5> also wtf that's awesome
  155. # [21:51] <MikeSmith> yeah, that sounds more like me
  156. # [21:51] <MikeSmith> I like that one
  157. # [21:51] <MikeSmith> my niece spells it "osome"
  158. # [21:52] <MikeSmith> I love her spelling
  159. # [21:52] <MikeSmith> I think her spelling of all words should become standard
  160. # [21:53] <MikeSmith> she doesn't care about spelling stuff right, she just wants to share her thoughts
  161. # [21:53] <MikeSmith> which are osome thoughts
  162. # [21:53] <MikeSmith> and she herself is osome
  163. # [21:53] <MikeSmith> she's 8 years old or something
  164. # [21:54] <ArtB> as texting moves to younger and younger children, a new language will emerge :)
  165. # [21:54] <hober> there is no charge for osomeness
  166. # [21:54] <MikeSmith> heh
  167. # [22:25] * Quits: ArtB (chatzilla@192.100.124.219) (Quit: Happy trails ...)
  168. # [22:42] * Quits: anne5 (annevk@83.85.115.123) (Quit: anne5)
  169. # [23:23] * Joins: MikeSmithX (MikeSmith@114.48.129.228)
  170. # [23:25] * Quits: MikeSmith (MikeSmith@111.188.28.26) (Ping timeout)
  171. # [23:27] * Quits: ilkka (ilkka@188.40.120.199) (Client exited)
  172. # [23:27] * Joins: ilkka (ilkka@188.40.120.199)
  173. # [23:42] * Quits: aroben (aroben@71.58.77.15) (Connection reset by peer)
  174. # Session Close: Fri Aug 20 00:00:00 2010

The end :)