/irc-logs / w3c / #webapps / 2013-04-15 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Mon Apr 15 00:00:01 2013
  2. # Session Ident: #webapps
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  45. # [14:36] <ArtB> FYI, I just added some new subitems for WebIDL, Testing and AppCache http://www.w3.org/wiki/Webapps/April2013Meeting#Potential_Topics
  46. # [14:41] <darobin> ArtB: did you see what http://www.w3.org/mid/516BC214.7020600@w3.org ?
  47. # [14:41] <darobin> I would feel more comfortable if you'd weigh in
  48. # [14:42] <darobin> rather than just inviting people to attend your group's meetings without asking you :)
  49. # [14:46] * Quits: shepazu (schepers@public.cloak) ("is sleepy")
  50. # [14:46] <ArtB> darobin, I'm totally fine with this but I'm not responsible for the hosting. It could be too late.
  51. # [14:47] <ArtB> (for the April 25-26 meeting)
  52. # [14:48] <darobin> ArtB: yeah, I wasn't so much thinking about logistics as much as on the principle
  53. # [14:48] <darobin> I think that it would be extremely useful to increase communication with TC39
  54. # [14:48] <ArtB> makes sense to me
  55. # [14:48] <darobin> and giving them a little bit of time in WebApps would go a long way
  56. # [14:48] <ArtB> ok
  57. # [14:48] <darobin> note that logistics wise, I think that WebApps already has TC39ers attending, so it could just be a question of scheduling it
  58. # [14:48] <ArtB> (I'm not sure about the bit-o-time be real useful but it's certainly worth a try)
  59. # [14:49] <ArtB> ok, that'd be great. Do you have any specific names?
  60. # [14:50] <Ms2ger> darobin, as long as you check they don't bring rotten tomatoes into meetings about WebIDL
  61. # [14:50] <darobin> Ms2ger: why would I want to check that? so long as no one tells them that starting work on that spec was my idea we're fine aren't we? O:-)
  62. # [14:51] * Ms2ger accidentally lets that slip on es-discuss
  63. # [14:51] <darobin> ArtB: no, I don't have the db — I was thinking that slightlyoff might be there but apparently not
  64. # [14:51] <darobin> I'll see if I can dig something up
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  71. # [15:26] <Yves> perfect, thanks!
  72. # [15:31] * Joins: dom (dom@public.cloak)
  73. # [16:06] <dom> jgraham, I'm not sure I get how I am supposed to plug github notifications into your script
  74. # [16:06] <dom> (which otherwise is already working great, cf https://w3c-test.org/web-platform-tests/submissions/ )
  75. # [16:08] <jgraham> dom: You need to register a webhook
  76. # [16:08] <jgraham> Using the github api
  77. # [16:08] <darobin> can't you just register in the UI?
  78. # [16:08] <dom> but that requires exposing your script as a CGI, right?
  79. # [16:08] <jgraham> to get push, pull_request and issue_comment events
  80. # [16:08] <jgraham> Yes, somewhere the script has to be exposed
  81. # [16:09] <jgraham> Not necessarily on w3c-test.org of course
  82. # [16:09] <darobin> we can make that somewhat recursive and have the script be a checkout that's updated automatically :)
  83. # [16:10] <dom> jgraham, any chance I could make you make it react to email notifs instead?
  84. # [16:10] <jgraham> You W3C people love your email notifications, don't you :p
  85. # [16:10] <darobin> heh
  86. # [16:11] <darobin> dom: I don't know if you can get email for all of those events
  87. # [16:11] <dom> well, email has reasonably good fail over mechanisms
  88. # [16:11] * Ms2ger remembers how much fun email caused for tinderbox at Mozilla
  89. # [16:11] <jgraham> Sure, I guess it is a more reliable message channel. But I don't know if you can actually get all the data you need
  90. # [16:12] <jgraham> and programming against email messages doesn't seem much like fun
  91. # [16:12] <dom> yeah :/
  92. # [16:12] <darobin> yeah, I wouldn't bet on that
  93. # [16:12] <darobin> the email hooks do send you some amount of data, but you have to parse it out of the message
  94. # [16:12] <jgraham> Maybe more companies should expose their APIs over SMTP rather than HTTP
  95. # [16:12] <darobin> and I'm not sure they promise it won't change
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  97. # [16:12] <darobin> I also don't think that the email hook gets things like comments and new issues
  98. # [16:13] <darobin> I reckon it only gets pushes
  99. # [16:13] * dom wonders if there are webhook-to-smtp systems
  100. # [16:13] <darobin> dom: is it a big deal to set it up CGI?
  101. # [16:14] <darobin> using that "web" thing and all
  102. # [16:14] <dom> probably not, but having high confidence on its reliability would likely be
  103. # [16:14] <dom> and given the history of w3c-test.org in that regard, I'm not too enthused
  104. # [16:14] <jgraham> You don't really need high confidence in its reliability
  105. # [16:15] <darobin> dom: this isn't a life-or-death application
  106. # [16:15] <darobin> I say ship it and if it's too unreliable then we'll see
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  108. # [16:15] <jgraham> One helpful enhancement would probably be to make just calling sync.py with no arguments try to update all pull requests that already exist
  109. # [16:16] <jgraham> Then you have an easy way to recover many types of missed events
  110. # [16:16] <dom> that would help for sure
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  112. # [16:16] <darobin> note that even for the pull things that rely on email I still set up a cron job once a day in case something drops
  113. # [16:17] <darobin> at some point we could do the same here
  114. # [16:17] <dom> hmm... jgraham, your script currently assumes that what is posted is always true
  115. # [16:17] <jgraham> I don't understand?
  116. # [16:17] <dom> yeah, sorry I'm not being very clear
  117. # [16:18] <dom> what gets POSTed is assumed to be coming from github necessarily
  118. # [16:18] <dom> and thus is trusted
  119. # [16:18] <dom> so one could POST that there pull request is worth mirroring
  120. # [16:18] <dom> if they know the end point URL
  121. # [16:18] <jgraham> That's a reasonable point
  122. # [16:19] <darobin> "The Public IP addresses for these hooks are: 207.97.227.253/32, 50.57.128.197/32, 108.171.174.178/32, 50.57.231.61/32, 204.232.175.64/27, 192.30.252.0/22."
  123. # [16:19] <darobin> so you could check at least that
  124. # [16:19] <darobin> you could also add a secret as part of the URL
  125. # [16:19] <dom> arguably that could be left to the CGI deployment layer
  126. # [16:20] <dom> secret URLs, brrr
  127. # [16:20] <darobin> dom: well, there are two layers here
  128. # [16:20] <darobin> there's finding the thing, and then there's passing extra info
  129. # [16:20] <darobin> you could tell the GH hook to post to /path/to/script?sikkrit=RobinIsDaft
  130. # [16:21] <darobin> that makes it harder to guess
  131. # [16:21] <darobin> add to that blocking to the aforementioned IPs and I think you're making it harder to break than socially engineering us would be
  132. # [16:21] <jgraham> Could use PubSubHubbub
  133. # [16:21] <darobin> (note that that's how the email hook is protected, it uses a shared secret)
  134. # [16:21] <jgraham> That seems to have some kind of origin verification built in
  135. # [16:22] <dom> I was thinking more on the line of using the hook purely as the notification, and then use https to fetch the actual data
  136. # [16:23] <dom> re-using a reasonably well-tested way to ensure we're getting data from who we think we're getting data from :)
  137. # [16:23] <darobin> that makes sense too
  138. # [16:24] <jgraham> Well that seems quite tedious
  139. # [16:24] <darobin> also, if it's something that can work pure-pull then it means we can apply the same daily cron fallback trick
  140. # [16:24] <darobin> jgraham: the idea is to have a computer do it
  141. # [16:24] <jgraham> Tedious to script I mean
  142. # [16:24] * darobin is Mr Clarity
  143. # [16:24] <jgraham> Since you are given all the data and then you have to figure out a URL to grab all the data from again
  144. # [16:25] <dom> they don't give you this in the webhook? what a pity
  145. # [16:25] <jgraham> I guess they might give you the URL
  146. # [16:26] <dom> doesn't look like it https://help.github.com/articles/post-receive-hooks :(
  147. # [16:26] <darobin> mmmm, but that's just for pushes
  148. # [16:28] <darobin> oh, right, there are no other notifications in the hook system — I thought there were more
  149. # [16:28] <jgraham> I think something like data["pull_request"]["url"] shoudl give the API URL (from memory)
  150. # [16:29] <darobin> so, how about we do this differently...
  151. # [16:29] <darobin> we could use a... manifest!
  152. # [16:29] <darobin> on push, check the manifest (URL known), and grab the list of PRs to deploy from it
  153. # [16:30] <darobin> since changing the manifest to add a PR requires a push, the notifications are the right ones
  154. # [16:30] <darobin> and write-access is okay
  155. # [16:30] <darobin> I mean it's checke
  156. # [16:30] <darobin> checked
  157. # [16:31] <darobin> it's a bit more of a hurdle for us, but not huge — the modifications can be done online by editing in the GH UI
  158. # [16:31] <darobin> *and* this can work as an email hook
  159. # [16:31] * Ms2ger wonders what darobin is on about
  160. # [16:31] <darobin> s/ about// ?
  161. # [16:32] <jgraham> That sounds like a rewrite :(
  162. # [16:32] <Ms2ger> darobin, French cheese?
  163. # [16:32] <jgraham> Not that I mind if it's clearly a better solution, but I don't think it is
  164. # [16:32] <darobin> I don't know man, I'm just trying to look for a solution...
  165. # [16:32] <darobin> I can't say I like it either
  166. # [16:32] <darobin> Ms2ger: why just French?
  167. # [16:32] <dom> I think we'll go for the webhook and try to secure it as much as we can
  168. # [16:32] <jgraham> I have never used PubSubHubbub, but it looks like it solves this for us
  169. # [16:33] <dom> and then we can switch to pubsubhubbub once someone manages to type it without typo
  170. # [16:33] <jgraham> So using that would be my first instinct
  171. # [16:33] <darobin> I am leery of solutions involving names I can't type
  172. # [16:33] <Ms2ger> pshb
  173. # [16:33] <darobin> that WFM though, was just looking at alternatives
  174. # [16:35] <jgraham> It is a really very badly named idea
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  176. # [16:48] <darobin> yeah you can smell the stale beer just on the name
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The end :)