/irc-logs / freenode / #webplatform / 2014-06-03 / end

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  126. # [17:25] <@renoirb> Hi Am
  127. # [17:26] <@renoirb> oops, Hi Amelia that is only editing the wiki without being on IRC :)
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  133. # [18:00] <+eliezerb> renoirb: Heyyyy, some good news comming
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  135. # [18:03] <+eliezerb> renoirb, julee, I would like to introduce you vanessametonini, she is from W3C Brazil :)
  136. # [18:03] * @Garbee waves.
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  138. # [18:03] <+eliezerb> Garbee: :D
  139. # [18:03] <@frozenice> hello there!
  140. # [18:04] <+eliezerb> We are starting to plan a Doc Sprint in Brazil in the next semester
  141. # [18:04] <+eliezerb> In a conf called Web.br
  142. # [18:04] <+eliezerb> Hey frozenice!
  143. # [18:04] <@frozenice> awesome!
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  145. # [18:05] <vanessametonini> hello all!! :d
  146. # [18:05] <@renoirb> Hi eliezerb
  147. # [18:06] * @renoirb waves
  148. # [18:06] <vanessametonini> yeah last week we lanched the teaser of the conference
  149. # [18:06] <@renoirb> Hi vanessametonini, glad to see a W3C office joining in!!
  150. # [18:06] <vanessametonini> it will be in september 25,26 - Sao Paulo
  151. # [18:06] <vanessametonini> http://conferenciaweb.w3c.br/
  152. # [18:06] <vanessametonini> :D
  153. # [18:06] <@renoirb> Talk to shepazu, you might have heard of W3Conf.
  154. # [18:06] <vanessametonini> I am glad to be here too
  155. # [18:07] <vanessametonini> yes yes
  156. # [18:07] <+eliezerb> renoirb: I already started a conversation about this with shepazu
  157. # [18:07] <@renoirb> shepazu is the guy to talk to if you think that your office wants to participate in it.
  158. # [18:07] <@renoirb> sure, I expect no more.
  159. # [18:07] <+eliezerb> renoirb: There is a telcon in one hour?
  160. # [18:08] <@renoirb> I mean, offices are somehow not deeply connected to sites.
  161. # [18:08] <@renoirb> yup
  162. # [18:08] <+eliezerb> Maybe is good opportunity to join in vanessametonini
  163. # [18:08] <@renoirb> (to what I see, though. I’m W3C Team Member for less than a year still)
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  165. # [18:09] * +eliezerb is happy to bring new folks to the game
  166. # [18:09] <@renoirb> yay! \o/
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  169. # [18:09] <@renoirb> Brazilians are among the geekiest people I met.
  170. # [18:09] <vanessametonini> yes eliezerb I will be on the telcon, and if have time we can tell a bit about our plans to the Doc sprint in Brazil
  171. # [18:10] <@renoirb> You have VoIP setup vanessametonini ?
  172. # [18:10] <vanessametonini> renoirb: yes I do
  173. # [18:10] <@renoirb> ok.
  174. # [18:10] <@renoirb> Do your office join irc.w3.org ?
  175. # [18:10] <@renoirb> You could join #webdocs, this is where we command Zakim
  176. # [18:11] <vanessametonini> renoirb: yes we do, on each monthly offices call
  177. # [18:12] <@renoirb> sure :) I just never spoke to anybody from an office
  178. # [18:12] <vanessametonini> hmm I will see there
  179. # [18:12] <vanessametonini> really? haha
  180. # [18:12] <vanessametonini> You say from Brazil's office? renoirb
  181. # [18:12] <@renoirb> ANY office.
  182. # [18:13] <@renoirb> I only met W3C Site team-members.
  183. # [18:14] <@renoirb> I had conversation with Karen Myers about how offices, sites and the W3C works in general in that regard at last TPAC
  184. # [18:14] <vanessametonini> uhum
  185. # [18:15] <vanessametonini> We will be on the next TPAC in Santa Clara... Karen also been here last week :)
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  187. # [18:16] <@renoirb> oh!
  188. # [18:17] * @renoirb was in Sao-Paulo last january. A day in, two hours wait to change airports :/
  189. # [18:19] <vanessametonini> haha
  190. # [18:19] <@renoirb> I'm Canadian. I get mad pretty easily when people cut in lines. Brazilians do that all the time
  191. # [18:23] <vanessametonini> haha sorry xD
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  195. # [18:26] <@Garbee> Here is the new rework of W3Fools. http://garbee.github.io/w3fools/ Feedback ofc welcome.
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  200. # [18:42] <vanessametonini> haha
  201. # [18:44] <@renoirb> For people who wants to see Garbee’s work, it starts here https://github.com/Garbee/w3fools/compare/paulirish:master...master#diff-22
  202. # [18:46] <@renoirb> I just truncated database for accounts server, will start running the import for the "real deal"
  203. # [18:46] <@renoirb> shepazu ^
  204. # [18:46] <@Garbee> I'm kinda worried about using the main element though.
  205. # [18:46] <@renoirb> frozenice FYI my last message
  206. # [18:46] <@Garbee> Actually, let me run that through browserstack and check out the screenshots.
  207. # [18:50] <@Garbee> and if anyone wants to see the PR itself, I actually did a revision earlier this year, but feedback caused me to go back and do more work in order to keep the styling: https://github.com/paulirish/w3fools/pull/57
  208. # [18:50] <@Garbee> I also addressed some other content issues that people brought up.
  209. # [18:51] <@renoirb> Did you ever use modern.ie provided VMs, Garbee ?
  210. # [18:51] <@renoirb> I know that browserstack and the likes are nice, but its nice to do the run yourself too
  211. # [18:51] <@Garbee> renoirb: I just downloaded two yesterday to do testing with a new site I'm building.
  212. # [18:51] <@Garbee> http://www.browserstack.com/screenshots/370a384956bf519025e29711d7e18124f7040919
  213. # [18:51] <@Garbee> Oh stack screenshots are perfect for this.
  214. # [18:52] <@Garbee> I was just wondering how older browsers would render things out with the <main> element in use.
  215. # [18:52] <@Garbee> Turns out, no issues at all.
  216. # [18:52] <@Garbee> So it is good to stay.
  217. # [18:52] <@Garbee> W3Fools has no real interaction, so booting a VM for it is overkill.
  218. # [18:53] <@Garbee> I do need to reformat the HTML itself later today though. It is a mess.
  219. # [18:53] <@Garbee> Oh well, I need to go take my grandpa to his protime appointment. See yall later, enjoy your days.
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  228. # [19:04] <AmeliaBR> Telcon in session
  229. # [19:04] <AmeliaBR> scribenick: AmeliaBR
  230. # [19:04] <AmeliaBR> shepazu chairing
  231. # [19:05] * Joins: eliot (836b9fec@gateway/web/freenode/ip.131.107.159.236)
  232. # [19:05] <AmeliaBR> Topic: New members
  233. # [19:05] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: new members on the mailing list, carryover from the DocSprint
  234. # [19:05] <AmeliaBR> jen: Yay!
  235. # [19:06] <@renoirb> Heating lunch
  236. # [19:06] <@renoirb> brb
  237. # [19:06] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: New members seem to be mostly female, which is cool if unexpected
  238. # [19:06] * Joins: dobalina (~dobalina@gateway/tor-sasl/dobalina)
  239. # [19:06] <@renoirb> oh, telcon, joining
  240. # [19:07] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: to Julee, how should we engage new members?
  241. # [19:07] <AmeliaBR> julee: for QA, for content?
  242. # [19:07] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: for everything.
  243. # [19:08] * Quits: antdillon (~ant@nat/canonical/x-ycitidxqmgjwzold) (Quit: Leaving)
  244. # [19:08] <AmeliaBR> julee: well, we've got the SVG push for the summer
  245. # [19:09] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: we don't want to just say hi and then drop it
  246. # [19:10] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: it would be nice to have an up-to-date list of things that new users could do. Is there anything left in the Web Platform Wednesdays?
  247. # [19:10] <AmeliaBR> julee: I think most of that is done, JS has been taken over by eliots team
  248. # [19:11] <AmeliaBR> ...we have the readiness to do list as well
  249. # [19:12] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: and just encouraging people to start writing documentation
  250. # [19:12] <AmeliaBR> julee: One thing we could do is try to pair up new users with experienced users as a pairing program
  251. # [19:12] <AmeliaBR> eliot: at the least, whomever makes initial contact should follow up after a few weeks
  252. # [19:13] <AmeliaBR> ... also for to-do list, we still need to go through HTML elements and attributes
  253. # [19:14] <AmeliaBR> julee: Over the summer, I think the push should still be SVG, try to establish webplatform as first stop for SVG, then focus on community engagement in the fall
  254. # [19:14] * Joins: Ryan_Lane (~Ryan_Lane@wikimedia/Ryan-lane)
  255. # [19:14] * ChanServ sets mode: +o Ryan_Lane
  256. # [19:14] <AmeliaBR> jen: but we don't want to plan for no new users over the summer and then ignore users that show up
  257. # [19:15] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: and SVG is a little esoteric for some people, HTML is more basic
  258. # [19:16] * @renoirb joined a few minutes ago. I’m listening, and watching batch 39 379 users import.
  259. # [19:17] <AmeliaBR> julee: we need to split it up. I will write something up.
  260. # [19:18] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: We could split it up by main topic area (HTML/CSS/SVG/etc) and have a regular user for each, then ask new users where they would fit bet
  261. # [19:19] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: But right now, it might be more efficient to try to "on-board" a lot of new users all at once with a coordinated effort; I can write an email
  262. # [19:19] <AmeliaBR> eliot: I'm happy to reach out to the two we heard from today
  263. # [19:19] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: I was just thinking to do it on the list
  264. # [19:19] <AmeliaBR> eliot: I like the idea of a personal touch
  265. # [19:20] <AmeliaBR> julee: people who seem to be most successful to integrate are the ones on IRC
  266. # [19:21] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: we could encourage people to join an orientation session on IRC, but it's not something we can schedule once for everyone all over the world
  267. # [19:22] <AmeliaBR> julee: I don't think that it has to be everyone at once, just let people know this is a place to hang out
  268. # [19:22] <@renoirb> +1 on shepazu action item
  269. # [19:22] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: eliot, if you can reach out individually, I'll send a call-out email for anyone else who might have signed up
  270. # [19:22] <AmeliaBR> ACTION on Eliot: personal contact
  271. # [19:23] <@renoirb> wilmoore, yt?
  272. # [19:23] <AmeliaBR> ACTION on shepazu: email list posting
  273. # [19:23] <AmeliaBR> julee: I'll reach out as well
  274. # [19:23] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: and write up?
  275. # [19:23] * @renoirb waves at wilmoore: If you want to join and meet us, we are currently having a meeting.
  276. # [19:24] <AmeliaBR> ACTION on julee: write up a description of how to "on board" new users
  277. # [19:24] <AmeliaBR> NEW TOPIC: SVG
  278. # [19:24] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: lots going on with SVG, lots of feedback from my podcast on The Web Ahead
  279. # [19:25] <AmeliaBR> ... I definitely feel that is the right track for current focus. I have started on a few tutorials, and I think that's something to focus on as well as the reference pages.
  280. # [19:25] <AmeliaBR> ...The last few sprints we've done have been around reference pages, what do people think about Sprints around tutorials?
  281. # [19:26] * @renoirb laughts
  282. # [19:26] <@renoirb> s/laughts/laughs/
  283. # [19:27] * @renoirb thinks maybe we could do shepazu idea with a weekly Q&A using apear.in
  284. # [19:27] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: The structure I was thinking would involve some sort of Q&A, people asking what they want tutorials about
  285. # [19:27] * Joins: dontcallmedom (~dom@2a01:e35:8782:50e0:19ce:4b62:99a9:3e4)
  286. # [19:27] <AmeliaBR> ...e.g. tutorials I'm working on now are simple questions a lot of people have questions about
  287. # [19:29] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: I like the idea, I think a group collaboration for writing tutorials, with newbies and experts collaborating, could result in well-written explanations
  288. # [19:29] <AmeliaBR> eliot: I agree, but it is also a very different style of writing, more linear rather than just piecewise
  289. # [19:30] <@renoirb> q+
  290. # [19:30] <@renoirb> shepazu q+
  291. # [19:30] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: we could have a sort of sidebar, where people ask questions, and then we follow up with tutorials
  292. # [19:31] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: I think the real core feature of webplatform is the reference docs, tutorials are good, but that's taking attention while the documentation is still not up-to-date
  293. # [19:31] <AmeliaBR> ...making the official documentation be THE resource for W3 documentation
  294. # [19:33] <AmeliaBR> julee: I agree as well, we should focus on the reference first, but we would serve the community well by having a good introductory experience. We could have occasional focus on tutorials, trying to gather feedback on what to write
  295. # [19:33] <AmeliaBR> ...trying to be inclusive in a methodical way
  296. # [19:33] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: it was an idea, maybe something to save for when we've already got the reference stuff
  297. # [19:34] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: It's a good idea, but right now lots of blogs are writing about SVG, and it would be great to have those blogs link to the reference docs at WebPlatform because *nobody* has docs like webplatform.org
  298. # [19:34] <AmeliaBR> ...just general education is too broad.
  299. # [19:35] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: That's valuable feedback. The reference docs have to be place.
  300. # [19:36] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: There are lots of tutorials on the web, there aren't lots of reference docs.
  301. # [19:36] <AmeliaBR> AGREED: Focus on reference docs, think of tutorials later
  302. # [19:36] * @renoirb does q-
  303. # [19:36] <@renoirb> too late.
  304. # [19:37] <AmeliaBR> NEW TOPIC: Infrastructure / SSO update
  305. # [19:37] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: I've been working on the single sign on for a while, it's a complex topic; write now I'm importing the >40 000 user acounts that were in the database
  306. # [19:38] <AmeliaBR> Won't support yet any of the other applications, but it's coming
  307. # [19:38] <AmeliaBR> One change is that we won't log in with a username, but with an email address
  308. # [19:39] <AmeliaBR> ...I've been trying to see if we can also use usernames, that might come later
  309. # [19:39] <AmeliaBR> ...you can test right now on the test wiki. There are still problems
  310. # [19:39] * Joins: ravenzz (~raven@72-18-233-188.static-ip.telepacific.net)
  311. # [19:40] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: I tried yesterday, I did the password reset but it wasn't actually signing me into the wiki
  312. # [19:41] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: I know, I'm still working on it. I'm flushing out the user lists and re-importing it
  313. # [19:41] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: just wanted to make sure you knew
  314. # [19:41] * Quits: dontcallmedom (~dom@2a01:e35:8782:50e0:19ce:4b62:99a9:3e4)
  315. # [19:41] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: We should send an email out warning that the test wiki is being tested for this
  316. # [19:41] <AmeliaBR> ...and let people know what the end result will be
  317. # [19:42] <AmeliaBR> ...to eliot: the annotation system is working on fixing problems with IE.
  318. # [19:42] <AmeliaBR> ...I don't think we should roll out until that is ready.
  319. # [19:43] <AmeliaBR> eliot: what's the timeline? Because that effects the strategy
  320. # [19:43] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: I hope it's weeks, not months
  321. # [19:43] <AmeliaBR> ...are there people at MS that we can reach out to for these issues
  322. # [19:44] <AmeliaBR> eliot: yes, but it should probably go through me or you; they know about the project
  323. # [19:44] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: related to annotations, I think that might be the problem with stylesheet bloat; currently there are 57 separate stylesheets for each page
  324. # [19:45] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: I agree, I have had people from Google encouraging us to fix that, but haven't had time
  325. # [19:45] <AmeliaBR> ...one problem is the annotator, but another problem is mediawiki and the memcache clogging things up
  326. # [19:46] <AmeliaBR> ...there's a lot I want to clean up
  327. # [19:46] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: where are all these stylesheets coming from?
  328. # [19:47] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: It's Javascript mostly, 57 scripts, 8 stylesheets.
  329. # [19:47] <AmeliaBR> ...people adding extra features and not thinking of performance
  330. # [19:47] <AmeliaBR> ...many of the scripts are being loaded in the head, when they aren't needed until the end
  331. # [19:48] <AmeliaBR> ...we can't discuss it all here, but needed to bring it up
  332. # [19:48] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: yes, we need to follow up on this
  333. # [19:48] <vanessametonini> AmeliaBR: q+
  334. # [19:49] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: there are a lot of things
  335. # [19:49] <AmeliaBR> vanessameonini:
  336. # [19:49] <AmeliaBR> ??
  337. # [19:50] <AmeliaBR> vanessametonini: Working on an annual programming conference in Brazil, we'd love to create a docsprint
  338. # [19:51] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: that sounds great. Can you send an email to the public list?
  339. # [19:51] <AmeliaBR> vanessametonini: Sure. I really don't know where to start, but I can start that in the mail.
  340. # [19:52] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: We have the DocSprint-in-a-box guidelines. I'd love to go to Brazil if I could!
  341. # [19:53] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: to clarify, the DocSprint-in-a-box is to help organize, lots of documentation
  342. # [19:53] <@shepazu> http://webplatform.jensimmons.com/readiness-markers/
  343. # [19:53] <@renoirb> vanessametonini have a look at http://docs.webplatform.org/wiki/WPD:Doc_Sprint
  344. # [19:53] <AmeliaBR> NEW TOPIC: Readiness markers
  345. # [19:53] <vanessametonini> thanks renoirb
  346. # [19:54] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: any comments on the sample sent out?
  347. # [19:54] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: one concern is that on wide screens it moves far away from the body content
  348. # [19:54] <AmeliaBR> eliot: Also, the link text is not obviously a link
  349. # [19:55] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons, I would also like things to partially scroll with the text, but there's a lot else going on in the page so it's hard to finesse
  350. # [19:56] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: I might be able to help with adjusting the php, create a separate module
  351. # [19:56] <@renoirb> AmeliaBR, i just need to be able to spend time. I have other priorities that takes all my time.
  352. # [19:57] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: It might be a whole rat's nest, I don't know. I kind of made the best of what I had.
  353. # [19:58] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: A few things: the "rivet" circle isn't quite in the right place; If I noticed that, I'm sure designers would really notice
  354. # [19:58] <AmeliaBR> ... also, on mobile, the bar is very dominant. Can we make it smaller?
  355. # [19:59] <AmeliaBR> ... third, I find my eye being drawn away from the content to the bar. It may be too bright, or it may just be new.
  356. # [19:59] <AmeliaBR> eliot: I don't find that.
  357. # [20:00] <AmeliaBR> ...maybe too much real estate on a phone, not sure if that's a major use case.
  358. # [20:00] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: there are lots of layout issues currently on phone. I think ship it, and fix everything later.
  359. # [20:01] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: on eliot's comment re link, maybe add a link icon instead of a vertical underline
  360. # [20:02] <AmeliaBR> eliot: the fixed bar is also somewhat distracting when scrolling on mobile, it initially moves with the page then jumps back
  361. # [20:03] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: is it possible to make the rounded top separate from the bar, so that the round top scrolls away but the bar stays fixed?
  362. # [20:03] <AmeliaBR> jensimmons: Maybe. It would be super-hacky, but I could test it out.
  363. # [20:03] <AmeliaBR> ...or we could get rid of the rivet altogether.
  364. # [20:04] <AmeliaBR> ...I also still want to work on the color set. I've written up a list of what needs to change that I can send to renoirb so he can fix up the main wiki.
  365. # [20:05] <AmeliaBR> renoirb: I can work with you (jensimmons) to figure things out.
  366. # [20:06] * Quits: ckwalsh (~ckwalsh@facebook/engineering/ckwalsh) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  367. # [20:06] <AmeliaBR> NEW TOPIC: QA
  368. # [20:07] <AmeliaBR> ...and other open items
  369. # [20:08] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: For QA I think we should all just schedule time on IRC together. I'll send a proper email reply
  370. # [20:08] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: for tables, can we just do this manually
  371. # [20:08] <@renoirb> Thanks AmeliaBR
  372. # [20:09] <AmeliaBR> AmeliaBR: I think manually would be more work, for now we can at least make the lists readable with CSS
  373. # [20:09] <AmeliaBR> PS. To renoirb or jensimmons, can you make that happen? I'm not set up on github and won't have time in the near future
  374. # [20:10] <AmeliaBR> shepazu: meeting for next week, I won't be available, can someone else chair?
  375. # [20:10] <AmeliaBR> eliot: I'll try to organize things.
  376. # [20:10] <AmeliaBR> meeting adjourned
  377. # [20:11] * Quits: @chrismills (~chrismill@52.183.208.46.dyn.plus.net) (Quit: Off to find beer and rock and roll...)
  378. # [20:41] * Quits: jerryitt (uid17132@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bubdhuwbolicgzoq) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  379. # [20:45] * Quits: @julee (~Adium@c-50-184-87-81.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: Leaving.)
  380. # [20:48] * Quits: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
  381. # [21:05] * Joins: ckwalsh (~ckwalsh@facebook/engineering/ckwalsh)
  382. # [21:09] * Quits: ravenzz (~raven@72-18-233-188.static-ip.telepacific.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  383. # [21:31] <AmeliaBR> A couple follow-ups:
  384. # [21:32] <AmeliaBR> renoirb, can you edit the main CSS file as described in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webplatform/2014Jun/0005.html
  385. # [21:33] <AmeliaBR> I was going to suggest that jensimmons do it at the same time as the readiness markers CSS, but we've sent her back to do some more fussing with them so I'm not sure when it will happen
  386. # [21:33] * offSchub is now known as DenSchub
  387. # [21:34] <AmeliaBR> To frozenice, Garbee and eliezerb: Can you give me a positive confirmation that you'll be able to help out with the "QA Sprint" (http://docs.webplatform.org/wiki/WPD:Projects/June2014_QA_Sprint)
  388. # [21:35] <AmeliaBR> (I signed you up as part of the usual suspects, but I haven't talked with any of you directly)
  389. # [21:36] <@Garbee> Yup. I'm good with that so long as I'm in the HTML/DOM range of topics. I'm fairly good at that stuff.
  390. # [21:37] <@frozenice> yeah, I guess I can do some work :)
  391. # [21:37] <+eliezerb> AmeliaBR: Yes, I will! I'm need some action in my life!
  392. # [21:37] <+eliezerb> AmeliaBR: Yes, I will! I need some action in my life!*
  393. # [21:37] <@frozenice> eliezerb: you finished that paper yet? :P
  394. # [21:37] <+eliezerb> I'm here, my deadline is 5th June
  395. # [21:37] <AmeliaBR> eliezerb: Ha! I think we might need an intervention if this is the most exciting thing on your June schedule!
  396. # [21:38] * @Garbee sighs.
  397. # [21:38] <+eliezerb> frozenice: When I finish it, I will go to the QA
  398. # [21:38] <@Garbee> Why did I not run the new W3Fools site through spellcheck?
  399. # [21:38] <@frozenice> good
  400. # [21:38] * +eliezerb goes back to the paper
  401. # [21:38] <@frozenice> ah, the new w3fools, I wanted to look at that
  402. # [21:38] * Joins: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be)
  403. # [21:39] <@frozenice> got distracted with the guitar...
  404. # [21:39] <@Garbee> I need to run it through a grammar thing too. It does seem a bit wordy.
  405. # [21:40] <AmeliaBR> Spell check first, publish later is *so* twentieth century.
  406. # [21:41] <@Garbee> hehe, but only having one obvious mispelling is good though. ;)
  407. # [21:41] * +eliezerb is looking to frozenice as his father O.o
  408. # [21:41] <@frozenice> *heavy breathing* I am your father!
  409. # [21:42] <AmeliaBR> My WPD edit statistics are heavily inflated by multiple minor edits on the same page... somehow I just don't notice those things in Preview mode!
  410. # [21:42] * Quits: +jensimmons (~jensimmon@drupal.org/user/140882/view) (Quit: jensimmons)
  411. # [21:42] <@Garbee> AmeliaBR: Yea not surprising.
  412. # [21:42] <@Garbee> Preview has some bugs.
  413. # [21:42] <@Garbee> At least had anyways, not sure if they've been fixed or not.
  414. # [21:42] <AmeliaBR> Garbee: it does, but I can't blame them for the simple grammar and spelling mistakes!
  415. # [21:43] <@frozenice> AmeliaBR: any plans to register your nick with freenode's NickServ?
  416. # [21:44] <AmeliaBR> Would that get me a fancy + or @ in front of my name?
  417. # [21:44] <@frozenice> :)
  418. # [21:44] <AmeliaBR> I really haven't explored any of the details of how this works, just enough that it works when I need it!
  419. # [21:45] <@frozenice> you can explore NickServ as a next step then
  420. # [21:45] <AmeliaBR> I will add it to the to-do list. I think figuring out github is higher priority, though.
  421. # [21:46] <@frozenice> yup, just let me know :)
  422. # [21:46] <AmeliaBR> thanks!
  423. # [21:49] <@frozenice> Garbee: "no real community ... *was* around" instead of *were*?
  424. # [21:50] <@Garbee> frozenice: Oh, thanks for pointing that out. I actually need to tweak that a bit since MDN was around just didn't have much steam.
  425. # [21:50] <@frozenice> ok
  426. # [21:51] <@frozenice> maybe add a comma after "Further"
  427. # [21:54] <@frozenice> maybe move the link to the first occurence of "W3C" (only the 3rd is a link now)
  428. # [21:55] <@Garbee> Just pushed some grammar edits in the first paragraph.
  429. # [21:56] <@Garbee> And good catch on that link.
  430. # [21:56] <@frozenice> maybe replace "however" in the start of the 2nd paragraph with a comma
  431. # [21:57] <@frozenice> "*convered* by the W3C"
  432. # [21:57] <@Garbee> I don't think replacing that with a comma would make much sense. Right now it is a phrase showing contradiction. Replacing however with a comma doesn't seem to make sense to me.
  433. # [21:58] <@frozenice> just sounds odd to me, something's missing in the middle
  434. # [21:58] <@frozenice> maybe add an abbr to PHP (SQL next to it has one)
  435. # [21:58] <@Garbee> convered instead of "convened"?
  436. # [21:59] <@frozenice> was just highlighting the typo :)
  437. # [21:59] <@Garbee> That isn't a typo.
  438. # [21:59] <@Garbee> And yea I'm seeding in abbreviations now everywhere they should go.
  439. # [22:00] <@frozenice> is "convered" a real word? o0
  440. # [22:00] <@Garbee> oh.
  441. # [22:00] <@Garbee> That should be "covered"
  442. # [22:00] <@frozenice> ah
  443. # [22:01] <@Garbee> Good catch there! I was completely missing that one.
  444. # [22:02] <@Garbee> Oh, I see what that was retyping it.
  445. # [22:02] <@frozenice> educating others: "the best way... *is*"
  446. # [22:02] <@Garbee> Chrome Dev Tools autohinting.
  447. # [22:02] <@Garbee> I must have tabbed in convened and then rewritten part of it.
  448. # [22:03] <@frozenice> "examples of exemplary" maybe find a synonym for exemplary :)
  449. # [22:03] <@Garbee> I'll just kill the first examples of* I thought that was wordy but was rushing.
  450. # [22:04] <@frozenice> "full of people willing to help point people" synonym for 2nd people
  451. # [22:04] <@Garbee> point you*
  452. # [22:04] <@frozenice> you could link the channels
  453. # [22:04] <@Garbee> and drop the you after that.
  454. # [22:05] <@Garbee> yup, irc:// those.
  455. # [22:05] * Joins: julee (~Adium@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
  456. # [22:05] * ChanServ sets mode: +o julee
  457. # [22:05] <@frozenice> I'll take another look after your changes, afk for a few minutes
  458. # [22:06] <@frozenice> Garbee: meanwhile this could help! :D http://courses.cs.vt.edu/cs3604/support/Writing/writing.caveats.html
  459. # [22:06] <@Garbee> Cool, I'll look over that in a bit.
  460. # [22:06] <@Garbee> need to go get a dog from a haircut.
  461. # [22:07] <@Garbee> But yea, this draft was just done quickly to get the new content in front of people with the design back in place.
  462. # [22:07] <@Garbee> For this exact reason. ;)
  463. # [22:07] <@Garbee> Other people will spot my errors faster than myself.
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  466. # [22:33] <@frozenice> Garbee, another thing to think about: as many visitors will be non-native english speakers, it might be good to use simpler english, there are quite a few complicated words there
  467. # [22:34] <@frozenice> not as simple as simple.wikipedia.org (with their top ~1000 most common words), but simpler than now :)
  468. # [22:35] <@frozenice> don't forget to check the link! I'm off for the night, see you tomorrow
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  476. # [23:01] <@Garbee> Wow, just spent a whole day pretty much redoing W3Fools.
  477. # [23:01] <@Garbee> I need more water.
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  479. # [23:03] <David_Bradbury> Thank you for doing that! It has needed an update for a bit :)
  480. # [23:04] <@Garbee> Yea I know.
  481. # [23:04] <@Garbee> I set out to redo it all back in Jan/Februray.
  482. # [23:04] <@Garbee> But then I had to rollback and add styles back and do other stuff, and things just got away from me.
  483. # [23:04] <@Garbee> :/
  484. # [23:05] <@Garbee> But, this gets it out of the way and done. And people can shut their mouths about it being outdated since the current content should be pretty rock solid for a while.
  485. # [23:05] <@Garbee> And it won't be difficult to maintain it at this point.
  486. # [23:05] <@Garbee> ntm just making it serve a better purpose. All kinds of wins.
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  491. # [23:14] <David_Bradbury> Awesome. I keep putting off getting a web development course going that I've planned to do for awhile. A solid video course that teaches standards-based code; good, maintainable practices in HTML, CSS, and JS; how to read documentation and use it to solve problems; and how to get more involved in the many projects out there.
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  497. # [23:32] <@Garbee> I keep trying to think through a beginner course for WPD.
  498. # [23:32] <@Garbee> I realized our original plan is just too big.
  499. # [23:33] <@Garbee> We need to scale back and actually use a framework to get people going with, since teaching them how to do a lot of the basics of a framework will take too much time and effort to maintain.
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The end :)