/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2007-10-30 / end

Options:

  1. # Session Start: Tue Oct 30 00:00:00 2007
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  3. # [00:05] * Quits: weinig_ (n=weinig@17.255.105.166) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  4. # [00:35] * Quits: tndH (i=Rob@adsl-87-102-45-182.karoo.KCOM.COM) ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.8.0.9/2006120508]")
  5. # [00:55] * Joins: karlUshi (n=karl@dhcp-247-241.mag.keio.ac.jp)
  6. # [01:04] * Quits: h3h (n=w3rd@66-162-32-234.static.twtelecom.net) ("|")
  7. # [01:07] * Quits: hasather (n=hasather@90-231-107-133-no62.tbcn.telia.com) ("leaving")
  8. # [01:08] * Quits: roc (n=roc@202.180.114.137)
  9. # [01:10] * Joins: roc (n=roc@202.180.114.137)
  10. # [01:29] * Quits: kingryan (n=kingryan@corp.technorati.com)
  11. # [01:56] * Joins: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  12. # [01:59] * Quits: jwalden (n=waldo@STRATTON-TWO-NINETY-FIVE.MIT.EDU) ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.8.0.9/2006120508]")
  13. # [02:03] * Joins: KevinMarks (i=KevinMar@nat/google/x-c4d1b0157bf9d516)
  14. # [02:06] * Quits: aroben (i=aroben@unaffiliated/aroben) (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  15. # [02:06] * Joins: aroben (i=aroben@unaffiliated/aroben)
  16. # [02:09] * Joins: jwalden (n=waldo@RANDOM-SIX-FIFTY.MIT.EDU)
  17. # [02:47] * Quits: weinig__ (n=weinig@17.203.15.140)
  18. # [02:47] * Quits: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  19. # [02:53] * Joins: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  20. # [02:56] * Joins: MikeSmith (n=MikeSmit@eM60-254-244-152.pool.emnet.ne.jp)
  21. # [02:57] * Quits: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-146.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  22. # [02:57] * Quits: heyadayo (n=heyadayo@pool-72-87-174-146.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  23. # [02:57] * Joins: heyadayo (n=heyadayo@pool-71-189-38-10.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  24. # [03:00] * Joins: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-71-189-38-10.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  25. # [03:03] * Quits: tantek (n=tantek@000-116-818.area2.spcsdns.net)
  26. # [03:18] * Quits: gavin_ (n=gavin@firefox/developer/gavin) (Remote closed the connection)
  27. # [03:18] * Joins: gavin_ (n=gavin@people.mozilla.com)
  28. # [03:20] * Joins: kfish (n=conrad@61.194.21.25)
  29. # [03:36] * Quits: KevinMarks (i=KevinMar@nat/google/x-c4d1b0157bf9d516) ("The computer fell asleep")
  30. # [03:45] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-61568dfd20a6862a)
  31. # [04:00] * Quits: aroben (i=aroben@unaffiliated/aroben) ("Leaving")
  32. # [04:12] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@adsl-67-124-36-161.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)
  33. # [04:13] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@adsl-67-124-36-161.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  34. # [04:14] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@adsl-67-124-36-161.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)
  35. # [04:21] * Joins: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-71-204-145-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  36. # [04:34] * Quits: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  37. # [04:40] * Joins: bradee-oh (n=bradeeoh@web7.webfaction.com)
  38. # [04:51] <Hixie> wow, the xml wg are revisiting planet earth
  39. # [04:52] <jwalden> ?
  40. # [05:00] <Hixie> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2007Oct/0375.html
  41. # [05:15] <MikeSmith> Hixie - that "revisiting planet earth" comment might make a great title for a blog entry
  42. # [05:18] <MikeSmith> Hixie - btw, has anybody written up a high-level intro or blog entry or something about the offline web apps and client-side DB storage parts of the HTML5 spec?
  43. # [05:18] <MikeSmith> or presentation
  44. # [05:18] <Hixie> not yet to my knowledge
  45. # [05:18] <MikeSmith> damn
  46. # [05:18] <MikeSmith> hoping there was something I could steal from
  47. # [05:18] <Hixie> if you write one feel feel free to blog it on the whatwg blog :-)
  48. # [05:19] <MikeSmith> I will write one, I guess. Unless I can sweet talk somebody else into doing it
  49. # [05:20] <MikeSmith> What would be useful is something that describes the problem it is solving
  50. # [05:20] <MikeSmith> I guess I could crib from some of the stuff that's been published about Gears
  51. # [05:21] <MikeSmith> One thing I'm noticing more and more these days is how often my supposedly always-connected mobile handset is not actually always connected
  52. # [05:21] <MikeSmith> e.g., when I'm in the subway on the way to and from work
  53. # [05:22] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-61568dfd20a6862a) (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  54. # [05:30] <Hixie> the use case for the offline stuff is pretty simple
  55. # [05:30] <Hixie> using a web app when you're offline :-)
  56. # [05:30] <Hixie> the db stuff is mostly to have structured local data when you're offline
  57. # [05:31] * jwalden really wishes the SQL stuff forced the use of parameter binding instead of only making it possible :-\
  58. # [05:31] <Hixie> how can we?
  59. # [05:32] <jwalden> if in parsing the query pattern you ever encounter a literal value, bail
  60. # [05:32] <Hixie> oh that would suck big time
  61. # [05:32] <jwalden> a little annoying for the constant parts of queries, but surely there'll be a saved query mechanism
  62. # [05:32] <Hixie> you couldn't even do "SELECT * FROM data WHERE count > 1" without parameters
  63. # [05:34] <jwalden> yeah, it's the price you'd pay for eliminating injections, barring the use of a user-provided pattern
  64. # [05:37] <Hixie> imho that's too high a price
  65. # [05:38] <jwalden> I think the big problem is that there's so much cut-and-paste of bad examples that just concatenate lots of strings, and this feels like the only way to ever deal with that problem
  66. # [05:39] <jwalden> if only the standard mechanism for constructing queries were parameter binding in PHP and friends...
  67. # [05:44] <Hixie> yeah
  68. # [05:44] <Hixie> it's not that big a deal here of course
  69. # [05:45] <Hixie> well, i guess it's somewhat an issue
  70. # [05:45] <jwalden> I don't think it's unreasonable for a client-side SQL injection to be an XSS vulnerability reasonably often
  71. # [05:45] <Hixie> yeah
  72. # [05:45] <Hixie> fair enough
  73. # [05:46] * Joins: othermaciej (n=mjs@dsl081-048-145.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
  74. # [05:48] * heycam` is now known as heycam
  75. # [05:48] * Quits: roc (n=roc@202.180.114.137)
  76. # [05:51] * Quits: csarven (n=nevrasc@modemcable130.251-202-24.mc.videotron.ca) ("http:/www.csarven.ca")
  77. # [06:19] * Quits: othermaciej (n=mjs@dsl081-048-145.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
  78. # [06:33] * Joins: othermaciej (n=mjs@dsl081-048-145.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
  79. # [06:39] * Quits: doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137)
  80. # [06:41] * Joins: KevinMarks (n=KevinMar@c-98-207-134-151.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  81. # [07:43] * Joins: maikmerten (n=merten@ls5laptop14.cs.uni-dortmund.de)
  82. # [07:50] * Joins: doublec (n=doublec@203.211.96.54)
  83. # [07:50] * Quits: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-71-204-145-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) ("8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.")
  84. # [08:01] * Joins: billyjack (n=MikeSmit@eM60-254-198-80.pool.emnet.ne.jp)
  85. # [08:02] * Quits: MikeSmith (n=MikeSmit@eM60-254-244-152.pool.emnet.ne.jp) (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  86. # [08:03] * billyjack is now known as MikeSmith
  87. # [08:13] * Joins: jacobolus1 (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  88. # [08:14] * Quits: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-71-189-38-10.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Nick collision from services.)
  89. # [08:14] * jacobolus1 is now known as jacobolus
  90. # [08:17] * Joins: heyadayo2 (n=heyadayo@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  91. # [08:24] * Joins: roc (n=roc@121-72-44-11.dsl.telstraclear.net)
  92. # [08:27] * Quits: heyadayo (n=heyadayo@pool-71-189-38-10.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  93. # [08:29] * Quits: karlUshi (n=karl@dhcp-247-241.mag.keio.ac.jp) ("Where dwelt Ymir, or wherein did he find sustenance?")
  94. # [08:32] * Quits: kfish (n=conrad@61.194.21.25) ("-> kobe")
  95. # [08:37] * Quits: psa (n=yomode@posom.com) (Remote closed the connection)
  96. # [08:55] * Hixie resorts the 400+ e-mails that were in the semantics folder into other folders
  97. # [08:55] <Hixie> down to 193 now
  98. # [09:08] <Hixie> man safari on windows can't handle the html5 spec well
  99. # [09:15] <jacobolus> what does it break?
  100. # [09:15] <jacobolus> oh, you mean the page of the spec
  101. # [09:15] <jacobolus> does it just not like big pages/
  102. # [09:30] <jacobolus> are any browsers planning to implement http://www.w3.org/TR/access-control/ ?
  103. # [09:31] <Dashiva> I'd hope Opera is with anne being editor and all :)
  104. # [09:31] * Joins: virtuelv (n=virtuelv@pat-tdc.opera.com)
  105. # [09:33] * Joins: tndH_ (n=Rob@adsl-87-102-45-182.karoo.KCOM.COM)
  106. # [09:33] * tndH_ is now known as tndH
  107. # [09:34] <jacobolus> hmm. any browsers with >= 1% market share? ;)
  108. # [09:34] <Hixie> yeah it's a big page issue
  109. # [09:34] <Hixie> the access-control spec is needed by xmlhttprequest 2
  110. # [09:35] * Hixie replies to a long thread asking for <center> and <dir> to be brought into html5
  111. # [09:35] <jacobolus> when is it likely such stuff will see implementation? 2008? 2010?
  112. # [09:35] * Hixie says no
  113. # [09:35] <Hixie> jacobolus: yeah, around then
  114. # [09:37] * gsnedders is finally making movement on http-parsing
  115. # [09:37] <jacobolus> Hixie: I haven't really looked at recent discussion on the html wg list. out of idle curiosity, does it look like IE will try to implement most of html5?
  116. # [09:38] * Joins: tailok_ (n=tailok@p57A0D347.dip.t-dialin.net)
  117. # [09:38] <Hixie> jacobolus: microsoft has not commented either way
  118. # [09:38] <jacobolus> hmm. I wonder if that's good or bad.
  119. # [09:39] <Hixie> in practice, them commenting that they intend to implement something rarely has any bearing on whether they implement it or not
  120. # [09:39] <Hixie> so it's neither good nor bad
  121. # [09:40] <Hixie> what would be good is seeing them implement it
  122. # [09:40] <jacobolus> heh
  123. # [09:45] * Quits: tailok (n=tailok@p57A0FC6F.dip.t-dialin.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  124. # [10:19] <Hixie> down to just 119.
  125. # [10:23] * Quits: MikeSmith (n=MikeSmit@eM60-254-198-80.pool.emnet.ne.jp) ("Less talk, more pimp walk.")
  126. # [10:25] * Quits: Lachy_ (n=Lachy@pat-tdc.opera.com) ("Leaving")
  127. # [10:25] * Joins: Lachy (n=Lachy@pat-tdc.opera.com)
  128. # [10:36] <Hixie> 86
  129. # [10:36] <Hixie> bed time now
  130. # [10:50] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-2f8133d199ff8bb9)
  131. # [11:07] * Parts: doublec (n=doublec@203.211.96.54)
  132. # [11:54] * Joins: roc_ (n=roc@121-72-2-220.dsl.telstraclear.net)
  133. # [11:54] * Quits: hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober) ("ERC Version 5.3 (devel) (IRC client for Emacs)")
  134. # [11:54] * Joins: ROBOd (n=robod@89.122.216.38)
  135. # [12:11] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@adsl-67-124-36-161.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  136. # [12:12] * Quits: roc (n=roc@121-72-44-11.dsl.telstraclear.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  137. # [12:21] * Joins: yod (n=ot@bas11-montreal02-1128536925.dsl.bell.ca)
  138. # [12:21] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@adsl-67-124-36-161.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)
  139. # [12:35] * Quits: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  140. # [12:36] * Joins: jacobolus1 (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  141. # [12:50] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-2f8133d199ff8bb9) ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  142. # [12:51] * Joins: dev0 (i=Tobias@dslb-088-076-251-028.pools.arcor-ip.net)
  143. # [13:08] * Quits: dev0_ (i=Tobias@unaffiliated/icefox0) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  144. # [13:15] * Quits: jacobolus1 (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  145. # [13:51] * Joins: aaronlev (n=chatzill@c-66-31-86-217.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
  146. # [14:28] * Joins: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  147. # [14:45] * Quits: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  148. # [15:02] * Quits: jwalden (n=waldo@RANDOM-SIX-FIFTY.MIT.EDU) ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.8.0.9/2006120508]")
  149. # [15:19] * Quits: yod (n=ot@bas11-montreal02-1128536925.dsl.bell.ca) ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  150. # [15:20] * Joins: yod (n=ot@bas11-montreal02-1128536925.dsl.bell.ca)
  151. # [15:20] * Quits: yod (n=ot@bas11-montreal02-1128536925.dsl.bell.ca) (Client Quit)
  152. # [15:21] * Joins: yod (n=ot@bas11-montreal02-1128536925.dsl.bell.ca)
  153. # [15:35] * Joins: billmason (n=billmaso@ip156.unival.com)
  154. # [15:36] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-fa72c9a11db4e915)
  155. # [15:48] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-fa72c9a11db4e915) ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  156. # [15:58] * Joins: jacobolus (n=jacobolu@pool-72-87-174-211.plspca.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  157. # [16:20] * Quits: maikmerten (n=merten@ls5laptop14.cs.uni-dortmund.de) (Remote closed the connection)
  158. # [16:52] * Joins: Lachy_ (n=Lachlan@ti200710a340-3908.bb.online.no)
  159. # [18:54] * Disconnected
  160. # [18:54] * Attempting to rejoin channel #whatwg
  161. # [18:54] * Rejoined channel #whatwg
  162. # [18:54] * Topic is 'WHATWG (HTML5) -- http://www.whatwg.org/ -- Logs: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/ -- Please leave your sense of logic at the door, thanks!'
  163. # [18:54] * Set by Hixie on Tue Apr 03 03:10:22
  164. # [18:54] * Joins: tantek___ (n=tantek@h460d06a6.area2.spcsdns.net)
  165. # [18:57] * Quits: tantek (n=tantek@h460e278b.area3.spcsdns.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  166. # [18:57] * Joins: KevinMarks (i=KevinMar@nat/google/x-a57186a5ec81200a)
  167. # [19:02] * Quits: jruderman (n=jruderma@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com) (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  168. # [19:02] * Quits: tantek___ (n=tantek@h460d06a6.area2.spcsdns.net)
  169. # [19:08] * Quits: tantek_ (n=tantek@000-123-916.area2.spcsdns.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  170. # [19:15] * Quits: tantek__ (n=tantek@000-125-477.area2.spcsdns.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  171. # [19:22] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-8e5ccfcfe50b3071) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  172. # [19:27] * heyadayo2 is now known as heyadayo
  173. # [19:31] * Joins: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  174. # [19:33] <Hixie> apparently we are web experts http://www.heise.de/english/newsticker/news/98175
  175. # [19:34] * Joins: tantek (n=tantek@adsl-63-195-114-133.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net)
  176. # [19:37] * Quits: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  177. # [19:38] * Joins: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  178. # [19:38] * Quits: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  179. # [19:38] <othermaciej> Hixie: cool
  180. # [19:38] * Joins: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  181. # [19:44] <Dashiva> It also implies whatwg is a subset of the w3c, as I read it
  182. # [19:44] <hsivonen> also SGML
  183. # [19:44] <hsivonen> more PR work still ahead
  184. # [19:46] * Joins: YaaL (i=yaal@hell.pl)
  185. # [19:47] * Quits: virtuelv (n=virtuelv@pat-tdc.opera.com) ("Leaving")
  186. # [20:08] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-c1c1fab6a8ac7116)
  187. # [20:19] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-c1c1fab6a8ac7116) ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  188. # [20:21] * Quits: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  189. # [20:21] * Joins: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  190. # [20:25] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-471caeaeb879bf25)
  191. # [20:30] * Quits: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  192. # [20:31] * Joins: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  193. # [20:35] * Quits: roc_ (n=roc@121-72-2-220.dsl.telstraclear.net)
  194. # [20:35] * Hixie is trying to sort his random grabbag of e-mails into categories
  195. # [20:35] <Hixie> i'm afraid certain e-mails covered a large number of subjects and they ended up mostly in random folders
  196. # [20:42] * Quits: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  197. # [20:43] * Joins: DrChirs (n=IceChat7@204-16-231-250-accuradio.pkh.ord.sparkplugbb.net)
  198. # [20:44] * Joins: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  199. # [20:56] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  200. # [20:57] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-471caeaeb879bf25) ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  201. # [20:59] * Joins: weinig_ (n=weinig@17.255.110.196)
  202. # [21:00] * Quits: weinig_ (n=weinig@17.255.110.196) (Client Quit)
  203. # [21:02] * Joins: weinig_ (n=weinig@17.255.110.196)
  204. # [21:02] * Quits: markp (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (No route to host)
  205. # [21:05] * Joins: jruderman (n=jruderma@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)
  206. # [21:07] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  207. # [21:08] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  208. # [21:13] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  209. # [21:14] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@17.203.15.140) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  210. # [21:15] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  211. # [21:19] * Joins: jwalden (n=waldo@STRATTON-SIX-NINETEEN.MIT.EDU)
  212. # [21:20] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  213. # [21:21] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  214. # [21:27] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  215. # [21:28] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  216. # [21:28] * Quits: hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober) ("ERC Version 5.3 (devel) (IRC client for Emacs)")
  217. # [21:29] * weinig_ is now known as weinig
  218. # [21:35] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  219. # [21:36] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  220. # [21:41] <othermaciej> does anyone here know if there is an IRC channel for ES4 spec discussion?
  221. # [21:42] <Hixie> dunno, but if you find out please do let me know
  222. # [21:42] <othermaciej> I emailed Brendan to ask
  223. # [21:43] <othermaciej> ggaren and I have decided to start attending the conference calls and see what is going on in there
  224. # [21:43] <Hixie> anything fun?
  225. # [21:43] <Hixie> i think technically google has joined now too, but i don't have the time to join calls and stuff
  226. # [21:43] <othermaciej> I am somewhat concerned that ES4's compatibility story is not as good as HTML5
  227. # [21:43] <othermaciej> also, Microsoft and Yahoo are trying to derail the process
  228. # [21:43] <othermaciej> those are the two things I have learned
  229. # [21:44] <Hixie> interesting
  230. # [21:44] <Hixie> why yahoo?
  231. # [21:45] * Quits: maikmerten (n=maikmert@T6ddf.t.pppool.de) (Remote closed the connection)
  232. # [21:46] * Joins: roc (n=roc@202.180.114.137)
  233. # [21:46] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  234. # [21:46] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  235. # [21:50] <othermaciej> why yahoo? I am not sure
  236. # [21:50] <othermaciej> either Crockford's personal biases or some weird cozying up to Microsoft
  237. # [21:51] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@17.255.110.196)
  238. # [21:55] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@17.255.110.196)
  239. # [21:56] * Joins: weinig_ (n=weinig@17.203.15.140)
  240. # [22:12] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-40007b58c6e97c33)
  241. # [22:12] * Quits: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-40007b58c6e97c33) (Remote closed the connection)
  242. # [22:13] * Joins: doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137)
  243. # [22:14] <Philip`> I need to stop writing HTML frontends for applications, and start using a real platform instead
  244. # [22:14] <Hixie> whatcha missing?
  245. # [22:15] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@17.255.110.196) (Connection timed out)
  246. # [22:15] <Philip`> I spent a couple of hours writing something today, and found a crash bug in Opera and a layout bug in Firefox 3 - it would be nicer if things actually worked :-(
  247. # [22:16] <roc> file it!
  248. # [22:17] <Philip`> On the other hand, it's nice to be able to write a couple of dozen lines of JS to combine an SVG file from GraphViz with a load of data in HTML tables from some Perl script, to create prettily coloured graphs of the data
  249. # [22:18] <Philip`> roc: I was trying to get work done, so I just gave up and used FF2 instead :-)
  250. # [22:18] <Philip`> but I have more time now so I'll try to reproduce it
  251. # [22:18] <Hixie> Philip`: i hate to tell you this but "real platforms" are just as crashy :-P
  252. # [22:18] <roc> if you don't have time to search for dups or make a reduced testcase, just file with whatever big testcase you have and someone else will do the work
  253. # [22:20] <roc> we are trying really really hard to fix layout regressions for FF3 so if you file a bug and it's a real bug, not a situation where we're being more standards compliant, we'll fix it for FF3
  254. # [22:33] * Quits: ROBOd (n=robod@89.122.216.38) ("http://www.robodesign.ro")
  255. # [22:34] * Quits: doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137)
  256. # [22:37] * Joins: doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137)
  257. # [22:42] <jacobolus> anyone know if there's a bug in mozilla's bugzilla about server-sent events, or any info about people working on getting support for them into gecko?
  258. # [22:42] <jacobolus> the bugzilla search for "server sent events" returns large numbers of unrelated bugs
  259. # [22:43] <Philip`> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=401775 - I hope that's a real bug because otherwise I'll have to fix my code instead :-(
  260. # [22:43] * Quits: weinig_ (n=weinig@17.203.15.140)
  261. # [22:43] <jacobolus> ah, here. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=338583 nevermind
  262. # [22:44] * Quits: kingryan (n=kingryan@corp.technorati.com)
  263. # [22:47] <Hixie> btw i learnt more about aria recently and the "live region" idea, though over-engineered in waiaria, does seem generally useful
  264. # [22:52] * Joins: virtuelv (n=virtuelv@51.80-203-76.nextgentel.com)
  265. # [22:52] <Philip`> Incidentally, it's slightly irritating how GraphViz's SVG output raises CSS warnings in Firefox/Opera
  266. # [22:52] <Hixie> which warnings?
  267. # [22:53] <Philip`> "font-weight:regular" is apparently invalid
  268. # [22:53] <Hixie> ah yes, that's quite invalid.
  269. # [22:54] <virtuelv> Philip`: 'normal'
  270. # [22:54] <Hixie> henri has by far the most outstanding feedback e-mails in my pile
  271. # [22:55] <virtuelv> mildly related: Do any browsers actually implement the numeric font weights?
  272. # [22:55] <Philip`> I suppose I could fix it by using sed on the SVG file, though that'd feel kind of dirty and non-XML-ish
  273. # [22:55] <Hixie> and the three folders with the most comments are WF2 (any forms-related problems, no new suggestions), semantics-links (<a>, <link>, rel, rev, etc), and semantics-mathematics (which is now basically anything related to namespaces in text/html)
  274. # [22:58] * Quits: doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137)
  275. # [23:00] <jwalden> interesting, didn't know someone had a patch to implement server-side DOM events
  276. # [23:00] <roc> neither did I
  277. # [23:02] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  278. # [23:03] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  279. # [23:04] * Quits: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  280. # [23:07] * Joins: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  281. # [23:12] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  282. # [23:12] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  283. # [23:17] * Joins: roc_ (n=roc@202.180.114.137)
  284. # [23:18] * Quits: roc (n=roc@202.180.114.137) (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  285. # [23:19] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  286. # [23:20] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  287. # [23:24] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@17.255.110.196)
  288. # [23:25] * Joins: csarven (n=nevrasc@bas2-montreal02-1096700952.dsl.bell.ca)
  289. # [23:26] * Quits: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  290. # [23:27] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  291. # [23:28] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  292. # [23:29] * Joins: doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137)
  293. # [23:30] * Quits: tailok_ (n=tailok@p57A0D347.dip.t-dialin.net) ("Goodbye")
  294. # [23:30] * Joins: othermaciej (n=mjs@17.255.106.186)
  295. # [23:31] <othermaciej> Hixie: apparently #jslang on irc.mozilla.org is the place, gonna join there as soon as I find out the right port and other stuff for Mozilla IRC
  296. # [23:33] <Hixie> mozilla irc supports ssl btw
  297. # [23:33] <Hixie> on 6669 i think
  298. # [23:33] <Hixie> let me know if anyone can join
  299. # [23:34] * Joins: mpt (i=mpt@conference/ubuntu-developer-summit/x-f49bcd5e1583ffc8)
  300. # [23:35] <jwalden> 6697
  301. # [23:35] <jwalden> othermaciej, Hixie: ^
  302. # [23:37] * Quits: virtuelv (n=virtuelv@51.80-203-76.nextgentel.com) ("Leaving")
  303. # [23:41] * Quits: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net) (Remote closed the connection)
  304. # [23:41] * Joins: markp_ (n=mark@adsl-221-112-103.rmo.bellsouth.net)
  305. # [23:45] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@17.255.110.196) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  306. # [23:46] * Joins: Charl (n=charlvn@c1-115-3.wblv.isadsl.co.za)
  307. # [23:53] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@17.203.15.140)
  308. # [23:56] * Joins: hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober)
  309. # Session Close: Wed Oct 31 00:00:00 2007

The end :)