/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2009-01-04 / end

Options:

  1. # Session Start: Sun Jan 04 00:00:00 2009
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  3. # [00:15] * Quits: danbri (n=danbri@unaffiliated/danbri) (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
  4. # [00:43] * Quits: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-69-140-1-234.hsd1.va.comcast.net) ("8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.")
  5. # [00:52] * Quits: heycam (n=cam@210-84-35-34.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
  6. # [00:53] * Joins: heycam (n=cam@124-168-25-173.dyn.iinet.net.au)
  7. # [01:04] <Hixie> what's with people not actually answering the question with the rdfa thread
  8. # [01:05] <Hixie> was i that unclear?
  9. # [01:06] <takkaria> people think you're asking the wrong questions :)
  10. # [01:13] <Hixie> apparently
  11. # [01:14] <Hixie> i just wish someone would tell me wtf the requirements are and wtf the problem is we're solving
  12. # [01:14] <Hixie> all i hear is "we solved this problem years ago, there's been lots of research, rdfa is the answer"
  13. # [01:14] <Hixie> but i don't even know what the question is!
  14. # [01:15] <Hixie> surely a url to the problem description would be a simple thing to provide if it's such a solved problem
  15. # [01:25] * Joins: tantek (n=tantek@dsl081-245-036.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
  16. # [01:44] * Joins: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@72.14.224.1)
  17. # [01:44] * Quits: Maurice (i=copyman@5ED548D4.cable.ziggo.nl) ("Disconnected...")
  18. # [02:03] * Joins: annevk (n=annevk@cm-84.215.140.104.getinternet.no)
  19. # [02:04] <nessy> rdf is about solving the problem of machine-readable interoperable metadata, FAIK
  20. # [02:05] <nessy> rdfa is a particular implementation of rdf through attributes, which I think is stupid
  21. # [02:05] <nessy> but don't quote me on this :)
  22. # [02:05] <webben> nessy: I don't think that's the sort of problem statement Hixie is looking for.
  23. # [02:05] <nessy> I think it should be done through class names
  24. # [02:05] <nessy> machine-readable interoperable metadata is not a problem?
  25. # [02:06] <webben> nessy: "machine-readable interopable metadata" is a vague solution to (set of) user and author problems.
  26. # [02:06] <webben> nessy: Hixie's email is effectively seeking a catalogue of those problems, I think.
  27. # [02:06] <webben> (or at least of examples of said problems)
  28. # [02:06] <nessy> fair enough :)
  29. # [02:07] <webben> nessy: Hence why the discussion has partly revolved around Natural Language Processing as an alternative.
  30. # [02:07] <nessy> http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-rdfa-scenarios/
  31. # [02:08] <nessy> has an example of 9 use cases
  32. # [02:08] <nessy> it's sort-of asking what is the use case for html
  33. # [02:09] <nessy> kinda difficult to destill the essence
  34. # [02:09] <nessy> anyway - i don't really want to get into the semantic web discussion - better to have that discussion with some semantic web enthousiasts
  35. # [02:23] * Joins: olliej_ (n=oliver@c-67-164-125-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  36. # [02:36] * Quits: tantek (n=tantek@dsl081-245-036.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
  37. # [02:46] * Parts: annevk (n=annevk@cm-84.215.140.104.getinternet.no)
  38. # [02:57] * Quits: kangax (n=kangax@ool-182f8118.dyn.optonline.net)
  39. # [03:00] * Quits: Morphous (i=jan@unaffiliated/amorphous) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  40. # [03:03] * Joins: Morphous (i=jan@unaffiliated/amorphous)
  41. # [03:38] * Quits: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@72.14.224.1)
  42. # [03:39] * Quits: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112) ("Lost terminal")
  43. # [03:41] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@cpe-66-65-132-93.nyc.res.rr.com)
  44. # [04:13] * Joins: tantek (n=tantek@adsl-75-36-184-235.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
  45. # [04:17] * Parts: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  46. # [04:19] * Quits: tantek (n=tantek@adsl-75-36-184-235.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
  47. # [04:25] * Joins: dave_levin_ (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  48. # [04:29] * dave_levin_ is now known as dave_levin
  49. # [04:34] * Quits: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  50. # [04:49] * Joins: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  51. # [04:54] * Joins: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  52. # [05:05] * eric_carlson is now known as ec|away
  53. # [05:20] * Joins: eric_carlson (n=ericc@adsl-67-112-12-110.dsl.anhm01.pacbell.net)
  54. # [05:23] * Quits: ec|away (n=ericc@adsl-67-112-12-110.dsl.anhm01.pacbell.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  55. # [05:43] * Joins: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-109-76.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  56. # [05:48] * Quits: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  57. # [05:55] * Parts: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  58. # [06:07] * Quits: svl (n=me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) ("And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.")
  59. # [06:10] * Joins: jruderman (n=jruderma@65.163.90.1)
  60. # [06:10] * Joins: hdh (n=hdh@118.71.79.109)
  61. # [06:14] * Joins: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  62. # [06:31] * Joins: aboodman2 (n=aboodman@70.133.66.187)
  63. # [06:31] * Quits: aboodman (n=aboodman@72.14.229.81) (Nick collision from services.)
  64. # [06:31] * aboodman2 is now known as aboodman
  65. # [06:32] * Joins: aboodman2 (n=aboodman@72.14.229.81)
  66. # [06:38] * Quits: nessy (n=nessy@124-168-169-109.dyn.iinet.net.au) ("Leaving")
  67. # [08:16] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@cpe-66-65-132-93.nyc.res.rr.com)
  68. # [08:28] * Quits: aboodman (n=aboodman@70.133.66.187) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  69. # [09:05] * Quits: hdh (n=hdh@118.71.79.109) ("Leaving.")
  70. # [09:10] * Joins: hdh (n=hdh@118.71.79.109)
  71. # [10:49] * Joins: ROBOd (n=robod@89.122.216.38)
  72. # [10:55] * Joins: Maurice (i=copyman@5ED548D4.cable.ziggo.nl)
  73. # [11:34] * Joins: maikmerten (n=maikmert@L8f29.l.pppool.de)
  74. # [11:50] <Hixie> ooh, the first kickoff was this weekend
  75. # [11:50] * Hixie signs up to ref at the silicon valley regional again
  76. # [11:56] * Joins: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112)
  77. # [11:57] <olliej_> Hixie: ?
  78. # [11:57] <Hixie> usfirst.org
  79. # [11:57] <Hixie> though the "us" is a lie
  80. # [11:57] <Hixie> it's international
  81. # [11:57] <Hixie> (though still heavily us-skewed currently)
  82. # [11:59] * Quits: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112) (Client Quit)
  83. # [11:59] * Joins: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112)
  84. # [12:16] <olliej_> ah
  85. # [12:16] <olliej_> i see
  86. # [12:30] * Joins: cyclist (n=a@sxanth.static.otenet.gr)
  87. # [12:34] * Quits: cyclist (n=a@sxanth.static.otenet.gr) (Remote closed the connection)
  88. # [12:38] * Joins: cyclist (n=a@sxanth.static.otenet.gr)
  89. # [12:40] <cyclist> It seems that if I have a <div> inside a <pre>, the "newline removal" applies for the inner div as well.
  90. # [12:41] <cyclist> for example: <pre> \n <div> \n foo \n </div> \n </pre>
  91. # [12:42] <cyclist> If you set backgrounds to the div and the pre blocks then the <div> occupies
  92. # [12:42] <cyclist> two lines.
  93. # [12:43] * Joins: tndH (n=Rob@adsl-83-100-239-81.karoo.KCOM.COM)
  94. # [12:44] * Quits: cyclist (n=a@sxanth.static.otenet.gr) (Remote closed the connection)
  95. # [12:45] <gpy> anyone have spotify invites left?
  96. # [13:03] * Joins: cyclist (n=a@sxanth.static.otenet.gr)
  97. # [13:03] <cyclist> ok this is really weird:
  98. # [13:04] <cyclist> <pre> \n <div> </div> \n </pre>
  99. # [13:04] <cyclist> is exactly the same as:
  100. # [13:04] <cyclist> <pre> \n <div> \n </div> \n </pre>
  101. # [13:05] <cyclist> (everything without any text, just boxes with background)
  102. # [13:05] <cyclist> but this is hilarious:
  103. # [13:05] <cyclist> <pre> <div> </div> </pre>
  104. # [13:05] <cyclist> without newlines actually occupies 3 lines!
  105. # [13:06] <cyclist> is that part of the standard?
  106. # [13:10] * Quits: cyclist (n=a@sxanth.static.otenet.gr) (Remote closed the connection)
  107. # [13:14] * Joins: annevk (n=annevk@cm-84.215.140.104.getinternet.no)
  108. # [14:19] * Joins: svl_ (n=me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
  109. # [14:21] * svl_ is now known as svl
  110. # [14:29] <hsivonen> google sure doesn't make it easy to file bugs on their services
  111. # [14:33] * Quits: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  112. # [14:42] <annevk> what problem descriptions for the RDF thread have been tried yet?
  113. # [14:43] <annevk> is "being able to add 'arbitrary' metadata to HTML content so that machines can understand what is going on" accurate?
  114. # [14:44] <annevk> maybe I shouldn't try
  115. # [14:47] <hsivonen> http://intertwingly.net/blog/2009/01/03/iCalendar-Validator#c1231033642
  116. # [14:51] <annevk> writing good specs is hard
  117. # [14:51] <annevk> and not just because of the politics
  118. # [15:07] <olliej_> annevk: heh
  119. # [15:21] <jcranmer> I'd say this Charles person is doing a lot of explanation of what RDF will solve
  120. # [15:21] <jcranmer> just not why we care
  121. # [15:22] <jcranmer> he also does a lot of "well, the answer is obvious"
  122. # [15:23] <jcranmer> after being asked the question because the answer was, well, not obvious
  123. # [15:31] * Quits: hdh (n=hdh@118.71.79.109) (Remote closed the connection)
  124. # [15:33] * Joins: hdh (n=hdh@118.71.79.109)
  125. # [15:46] <hsivonen> Hixie: wiki.whatwg.org has gone 500
  126. # [16:04] <hsivonen> Hixie: the spec annotation script connects to a server that has gone 500, too
  127. # [16:05] <hsivonen> why is http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#attr-meta-http-equiv-default-style in the spec?
  128. # [16:10] <Philip`> hsivonen: That's why I just complain about Google service bugs on IRC
  129. # [16:11] * Quits: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  130. # [16:11] <hsivonen> Philip`: ok let's try that
  131. # [16:12] <hsivonen> http://code.google.com/p/jing-trang/source/browse/ has gone 500
  132. # [16:12] <hsivonen> (checkout fails with Reference to non-existent node '/.37722223df817abf.519887ccaff96edb.6c29f3f04d5d1dee' in filesystem 'jing-trang')
  133. # [16:13] <Philip`> (http://jing-trang.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/ fails with that too)
  134. # [16:48] * Joins: weinig (n=weinig@cpe-66-65-132-93.nyc.res.rr.com)
  135. # [17:38] * Joins: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112)
  136. # [18:11] * Joins: shepazutoo (n=schepers@pool-72-71-109-191.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  137. # [18:14] * Quits: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-109-76.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
  138. # [18:19] * Joins: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  139. # [18:30] * Quits: weinig (n=weinig@cpe-66-65-132-93.nyc.res.rr.com)
  140. # [18:38] * Joins: rubys (n=rubys@cpe-075-182-087-110.nc.res.rr.com)
  141. # [18:38] <rubys> http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/MicrosyntaxDescriptions
  142. # [18:39] <rubys> wiki's down
  143. # [18:44] <annevk> forums as well
  144. # [18:44] <annevk> maybe CPU quota limit has been hit, Hixie?
  145. # [18:48] * Joins: virtuelv (n=virtuelv@48.80-202-82.nextgentel.com)
  146. # [18:50] <Philip`> If the wiki is down, how can you validate a page that uses rel values defined therein?
  147. # [18:51] <Dashiva> It becomes a human-verified conformance criteron :)
  148. # [18:52] <Philip`> How can the human verify it, if they can't access the wiki? :-)
  149. # [18:52] <Dashiva> The human can go and visit the data center
  150. # [18:54] <rubys> The reason why I ask is that apparently I can't build hsivonen's checker without access to that page.
  151. # [19:00] <annevk> maybe get a copy from Google's cache?
  152. # [19:02] <rubys> this is the fourth thing fetched by the build process that doesn't resolve. The second was from google code: http://code.google.com/p/jing-trang/source/browse/
  153. # [19:02] <rubys> I mean, if you can't trust google to be up, who can you trust? :-)
  154. # [19:07] <annevk> hsivonen was complaining about that earlier as well
  155. # [19:07] <Dashiva> rubys: windows update!
  156. # [19:08] <rubys> Dashiva: doesn't help me much, I'm running Ubuntu :-)
  157. # [19:09] <Philip`> You can only trust your own machine to be up
  158. # [19:10] <Philip`> so what you should do is download all the dependencies to your own computer, and then you'll never have problems accessing them
  159. # [19:11] <rubys> I also tend to prefer fewer dependencies than Henri seems comfortable with.
  160. # [19:11] <Dashiva> Maybe he reckons people won't find his site if google is down :)
  161. # [19:12] <annevk> dependency on wiki.whatwg.org should be fine, but it should not be fatal...
  162. # [19:13] <rubys> Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ExceptionInInitializerError
  163. # [19:13] <rubys> at nu.validator.servlet.VerifierServlet.<clinit>(VerifierServlet.java:85)
  164. # [19:13] <rubys> at nu.validator.servlet.Main.main(Main.java:89)
  165. # [19:14] <rubys> wiki is up
  166. # [19:22] <annevk> not really
  167. # [19:23] <annevk> though sometimes I do get through, seems like the CPU quota thing
  168. # [19:35] * Parts: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  169. # [19:37] * olliej_ is now known as olliej
  170. # [19:46] * Joins: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  171. # [19:47] * Quits: jruderman (n=jruderma@65.163.90.1)
  172. # [20:21] <hsivonen> rubys: right now, I'm not comfortable with the wiki deps, either. :-(
  173. # [20:22] <hsivonen> Dashiva: the wiki dependency is an app startup time dependency--the wiki is not consulted later at run time
  174. # [20:22] <hsivonen> I guess the wiki deps need the same treatment as the spec
  175. # [20:22] <hsivonen> the spec is not checked into the svn of the validator itself
  176. # [20:23] <rubys> how does the validator depend on the spec?
  177. # [20:25] <rubys> btw, I have the checker working. I needed one more dependency, but as the dependency had a file name with 2004 in it, I figured I could get that from where I had gotten the checker working last year.
  178. # [20:28] <rubys> it looks like (a) this checker build process checks out all of the files necessary for the cpp generation, so I can get started with what I have got, and (b) unlike what I remember, the checker build process can be used to update an existing build.
  179. # [20:29] <hsivonen> rubys: the spec is mined for UI strings
  180. # [20:30] <hsivonen> rubys: if you run python build/build.py --help, it lists command line options for overriding the wiki URIs
  181. # [20:30] <hsivonen> hmm. I have forgotten to document some options
  182. # [20:31] <hsivonen> --microsyntax=http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/MicrosyntaxDescriptions
  183. # [20:32] <hsivonen> actually, it's worse than just not documenting stuff. the build script can't override the alt advice URI
  184. # [20:33] <hsivonen> given how easy it is for remote resources to break the validator.nu build script, I'm not very optimistic about the idea of UAs fetching namespace URIs at runtime to load OWL
  185. # [20:37] * Joins: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-69-140-1-234.hsd1.va.comcast.net)
  186. # [20:38] * Quits: shepazutoo (n=schepers@pool-72-71-109-191.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  187. # [20:40] <annevk> hsivonen, didn't DTDs tell us that wasn't going to work, ever?
  188. # [20:41] <hsivonen> annevk: I suppose
  189. # [20:42] * annevk remembers some outcry over the Netscape RSS DTD going dead
  190. # [20:42] <rubys> this stuff should be cached, and tags with ETAGs
  191. # [20:42] <rubys> s/tags/tagged/
  192. # [20:43] <hsivonen> rubys: do you mean the cvsdude repo should seed the cache?
  193. # [20:43] <annevk> can't the validator SVN carry a copy of the page that's updated from time to time and used when the wiki page is not available?
  194. # [20:44] <hsivonen> annevk: yes
  195. # [20:44] <rubys> and furthermore, running instances should update their own private cache when they can successfully fetch the wiki page
  196. # [20:45] <hsivonen> rubys: fwiw, the main reason why jars aren't checked in is that I don't want to deal with all the license compliance stuff that would come with distributing the binaries
  197. # [20:45] * rubys nods
  198. # [20:54] * Quits: tndH (n=Rob@adsl-83-100-239-81.karoo.KCOM.COM) ("ChatZilla 0.9.84-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.0.1/2008072406]")
  199. # [20:55] * Quits: ROBOd (n=robod@89.122.216.38) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  200. # [20:55] * Quits: aboodman2 (n=aboodman@72.14.229.81) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  201. # [20:55] * Quits: jgraham (n=jgraham@web22.webfaction.com) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  202. # [20:55] * Quits: takkaria (n=takkaria@isparp.co.uk) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  203. # [20:55] * Quits: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  204. # [20:55] * Quits: svl (n=me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  205. # [20:55] * Quits: eric_carlson (n=ericc@adsl-67-112-12-110.dsl.anhm01.pacbell.net) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  206. # [20:55] * Quits: YaaL (i=yaal@hell.pl) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  207. # [20:55] * Quits: wilhelm_ (i=wilhelm@trivini.no) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  208. # [20:55] * Quits: gpy (i=gpy@193.138.219.74) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  209. # [20:55] * Quits: gsnedders (n=gsnedder@host86-136-52-180.range86-136.btcentralplus.com) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  210. # [20:55] * Quits: drry (n=drry@it17.opt2.point.ne.jp) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  211. # [20:55] * Quits: heycam (n=cam@124-168-25-173.dyn.iinet.net.au) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  212. # [20:55] * Quits: kinetik (n=kinetik@121.98.132.55) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  213. # [20:55] * Quits: hendry (n=hendry@webvm.net) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  214. # [20:55] * Quits: Simetrical (n=Simetric@wikipedia/simetrical) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  215. # [20:55] * Quits: grimboy_ (n=grimboy@78-105-162-250.zone3.bethere.co.uk) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  216. # [20:55] * Quits: broquaint (i=1007b358@spc1-brig11-0-0-cust544.asfd.broadband.ntl.com) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  217. # [20:55] * Quits: jcranmer (n=jcranmer@remote.csl.tjhsst.edu) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  218. # [20:55] * Quits: raspberry-lemon (n=lemon@raspberry-style.net) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  219. # [20:55] * Quits: rubys (n=rubys@cpe-075-182-087-110.nc.res.rr.com) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  220. # [20:55] * Quits: wakaba (n=wakaba@189.164.210.220.dy.bbexcite.jp) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  221. # [20:55] * Quits: Dashiva (i=Dashiva@wikia/Dashiva) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  222. # [20:55] * Quits: hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  223. # [20:55] * Quits: Yudai (n=Yudai@p02fed3.kngwnt01.ap.so-net.ne.jp) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  224. # [20:55] * Quits: deltab (n=deltab@82-36-30-34.cable.ubr02.smal.blueyonder.co.uk) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  225. # [20:55] * Quits: olliej (n=oliver@c-67-164-125-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  226. # [20:55] * Quits: syp (n=syp@lasigpc9.epfl.ch) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  227. # [20:55] * Quits: othree (n=othree@140.118.5.39) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  228. # [20:55] * Quits: psa (n=yomode@71.93.19.66) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  229. # [20:55] * Quits: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-69-140-1-234.hsd1.va.comcast.net) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  230. # [20:55] * Quits: maikmerten (n=maikmert@L8f29.l.pppool.de) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  231. # [20:55] * Quits: Morphous (i=jan@unaffiliated/amorphous) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  232. # [20:55] * Quits: annevk (n=annevk@cm-84.215.140.104.getinternet.no) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  233. # [20:55] * Quits: gavin_ (n=gavin@firefox/developer/gavin) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  234. # [20:55] * Quits: JohnResig (n=JohnResi@74.201.254.36) (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
  235. # [20:56] * Joins: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-69-140-1-234.hsd1.va.comcast.net)
  236. # [20:56] * Joins: rubys (n=rubys@cpe-075-182-087-110.nc.res.rr.com)
  237. # [20:56] * Joins: webben (n=webben@91.85.205.112)
  238. # [20:56] * Joins: svl (n=me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
  239. # [20:56] * Joins: annevk (n=annevk@cm-84.215.140.104.getinternet.no)
  240. # [20:56] * Joins: maikmerten (n=maikmert@L8f29.l.pppool.de)
  241. # [20:56] * Joins: ROBOd (n=robod@89.122.216.38)
  242. # [20:56] * Joins: aboodman2 (n=aboodman@72.14.229.81)
  243. # [20:56] * Joins: eric_carlson (n=ericc@adsl-67-112-12-110.dsl.anhm01.pacbell.net)
  244. # [20:56] * Joins: Morphous (i=jan@unaffiliated/amorphous)
  245. # [20:56] * Joins: olliej (n=oliver@c-67-164-125-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  246. # [20:56] * Joins: heycam (n=cam@124-168-25-173.dyn.iinet.net.au)
  247. # [20:56] * Joins: jgraham (n=jgraham@web22.webfaction.com)
  248. # [20:56] * Joins: takkaria (n=takkaria@isparp.co.uk)
  249. # [20:56] * Joins: kinetik (n=kinetik@121.98.132.55)
  250. # [20:56] * Joins: syp (n=syp@lasigpc9.epfl.ch)
  251. # [20:56] * Joins: grimboy_ (n=grimboy@78-105-162-250.zone3.bethere.co.uk)
  252. # [20:56] * Joins: wilhelm_ (i=wilhelm@trivini.no)
  253. # [20:56] * Joins: YaaL (i=yaal@hell.pl)
  254. # [20:56] * Joins: drry (n=drry@it17.opt2.point.ne.jp)
  255. # [20:56] * Joins: gsnedders (n=gsnedder@host86-136-52-180.range86-136.btcentralplus.com)
  256. # [20:56] * Joins: gpy (i=gpy@193.138.219.74)
  257. # [20:56] * Joins: hendry (n=hendry@webvm.net)
  258. # [20:56] * Joins: Simetrical (n=Simetric@wikipedia/simetrical)
  259. # [20:56] * Joins: JohnResig (n=JohnResi@74.201.254.36)
  260. # [20:56] * Joins: gavin_ (n=gavin@firefox/developer/gavin)
  261. # [20:56] * Joins: othree (n=othree@140.118.5.39)
  262. # [20:56] * Joins: hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober)
  263. # [20:56] * Joins: Yudai (n=Yudai@p02fed3.kngwnt01.ap.so-net.ne.jp)
  264. # [20:56] * Joins: psa (n=yomode@71.93.19.66)
  265. # [20:56] * Joins: broquaint (i=1007b358@spc1-brig11-0-0-cust544.asfd.broadband.ntl.com)
  266. # [20:56] * Joins: jcranmer (n=jcranmer@remote.csl.tjhsst.edu)
  267. # [20:56] * Joins: raspberry-lemon (n=lemon@raspberry-style.net)
  268. # [20:56] * Joins: Dashiva (i=Dashiva@wikia/Dashiva)
  269. # [20:56] * Joins: wakaba (n=wakaba@189.164.210.220.dy.bbexcite.jp)
  270. # [20:56] * Joins: deltab (n=deltab@82-36-30-34.cable.ubr02.smal.blueyonder.co.uk)
  271. # [21:05] * Quits: hdh (n=hdh@118.71.79.109) ("Leaving.")
  272. # [21:07] * Quits: maikmerten (n=maikmert@L8f29.l.pppool.de) (Connection timed out)
  273. # [21:28] * Joins: roc (n=roc@202.0.36.64)
  274. # [21:32] * Joins: tndH (n=Rob@adsl-83-100-138-56.karoo.KCOM.COM)
  275. # [21:37] <Dashiva> And as we're talking about how last week has gone downhill, it plunges into the swamp....
  276. # [21:37] <gsnedders> Yeah, it really isn't very good any more.
  277. # [21:37] <gsnedders> Damned Mr Last Week.
  278. # [21:38] <Philip`> Dashiva: I think you should set up your own Last Week-like blog
  279. # [21:38] <gsnedders> And call it Next Week in HTML5!
  280. # [21:39] <gsnedders> I mean, if you're a teamster, you should be able to know what's gonna happen!
  281. # [21:39] <Philip`> Backdate all the blog posts, and nobody will ever realise that you can't actually read the future
  282. # [21:40] <Dashiva> Last week on last week
  283. # [21:41] * Joins: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-106-232.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  284. # [21:43] * Quits: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-106-232.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net) (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
  285. # [21:43] * Joins: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-106-232.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  286. # [21:57] * Joins: doublec (n=chris@202.0.36.64)
  287. # [21:58] * Parts: rubys (n=rubys@cpe-075-182-087-110.nc.res.rr.com)
  288. # [21:58] * Joins: aaronlev (n=chatzill@e176244164.adsl.alicedsl.de)
  289. # [22:02] * Joins: sverrej (n=sverrej@cm-84.208.153.202.getinternet.no)
  290. # [22:06] * Quits: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-69-140-1-234.hsd1.va.comcast.net) ("8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.")
  291. # [22:06] * Quits: ROBOd (n=robod@89.122.216.38) ("http://www.robodesign.ro")
  292. # [22:07] * Quits: heycam (n=cam@124-168-25-173.dyn.iinet.net.au) ("bye")
  293. # [22:07] * Quits: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-106-232.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  294. # [22:23] * Quits: sverrej (n=sverrej@cm-84.208.153.202.getinternet.no) (Connection timed out)
  295. # [22:23] * Joins: sverrej (n=sverrej@cm-84.208.153.202.getinternet.no)
  296. # [22:26] * Joins: tantek (n=tantek@adsl-63-195-114-133.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net)
  297. # [22:29] * Quits: tantek (n=tantek@adsl-63-195-114-133.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) (Client Quit)
  298. # [22:30] * Quits: aaronlev (n=chatzill@e176244164.adsl.alicedsl.de) (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  299. # [22:42] * Joins: shepazu (n=schepers@pool-72-71-106-232.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
  300. # [22:43] * Quits: sverrej (n=sverrej@cm-84.208.153.202.getinternet.no) (Connection timed out)
  301. # [22:43] * Joins: dave_levin (n=dave_lev@c-98-203-247-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  302. # [22:52] * Quits: doublec (n=chris@202.0.36.64) ("Leaving")
  303. # [22:55] * Joins: doublec (n=chris@202.0.36.64)
  304. # [23:04] * annevk thought the bit about chaals was funny in the latest lastweek
  305. # [23:05] * Joins: dbaron (n=dbaron@c-69-140-1-234.hsd1.va.comcast.net)
  306. # [23:07] <annevk> http://robertbrook.com/html-5-validation-and-openid-validation/
  307. # [23:08] <Philip`> People really like using trailing slashes in HTML5
  308. # [23:08] <annevk> http://adactio.com/journal/1540 mentions a bunch of HTML5 articles I missed
  309. # [23:09] <annevk> e.g. http://forabeautifulweb.com/blog/about/more_on_developing_naming_conventions_microformats_and_html5/ and http://jontangerine.com/log/2008/03/preparing-for-html5-with-semantic-class-names and http://boblet.tumblr.com/post/60552152/html5
  310. # [23:11] <annevk> Philip`, he uses both, no?
  311. # [23:11] * annevk thinks part of his stuff is leftover from WordPress
  312. # [23:34] * Quits: Maurice (i=copyman@5ED548D4.cable.ziggo.nl) ("Disconnected...")
  313. # [23:39] * Joins: heycam (n=cam@clm-laptop.infotech.monash.edu.au)
  314. # [23:45] * Joins: nessy (n=nessy@124-168-169-109.dyn.iinet.net.au)
  315. # [23:45] * Parts: erlehmann (n=erlehman@86.59.25.121)
  316. # [23:51] * Quits: bzed (n=bzed@devel.recluse.de) (Remote closed the connection)
  317. # Session Close: Mon Jan 05 00:00:00 2009

The end :)