/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2010-05-16 / end

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  25. # [02:18] <JonathanNeal> is there an js event for when an <audio> has finished playing?
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  47. # [05:07] * AryehGregor wonders what possessed him to get into an argument about economics on Slashdot
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  61. # [06:36] <othermaciej> AryehGregor: lol!
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  66. # [07:40] <doublec> JonathanNeal, there's an ended event
  67. # [07:40] <doublec> JonathanNeal, see http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/video.html#mediaevents
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  94. # [10:33] <hsivonen> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/33280/xhtmlmod2010/results (Member-only)
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  97. # [10:34] <othermaciej> hsivonen: that's not a lot of responses...
  98. # [10:35] <annevk> wow
  99. # [10:35] <othermaciej> I'm surprised dbaron didn't enter "other comments"
  100. # [10:37] <annevk> with interest like this, there's no need to make a point
  101. # [10:37] <Hixie> i think that pretty much sums it up
  102. # [10:38] <othermaciej> I bet it still goes to REC
  103. # [10:38] <Hixie> duh
  104. # [10:38] <Hixie> if it didn't go to rec that would mean the w3c followed w3c process
  105. # [10:39] <othermaciej> I would love to see the implementation report they used to exit CR
  106. # [10:39] <Hixie> are there any implementation criteria to meet?
  107. # [10:40] <hsivonen> othermaciej: seen the XLink 1.1 impl report?
  108. # [10:40] <othermaciej> I wonder what their exit criteria are
  109. # [10:40] <othermaciej> I wonder why they aren't cited in the AC survey
  110. # [10:41] <othermaciej> there isn't even a link to the spec in the survey
  111. # [10:41] <annevk> hsivonen, is it public?
  112. # [10:41] <hsivonen> secret
  113. # [10:41] <annevk> XLink is such a joke
  114. # [10:42] <annevk> it's extremely unfortunate it went into SVG
  115. # [10:42] <othermaciej> http://www.w3.org/XML/2006/01/xlink11-implementation
  116. # [10:42] <annevk> and MathML too, maybe?
  117. # [10:42] <othermaciej> isn't that it?
  118. # [10:42] <annevk> that's public
  119. # [10:42] <othermaciej> that doesn't appear to be Member-only
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  121. # [10:42] <othermaciej> that's what the REC in TR links to
  122. # [10:42] <annevk> such a joke
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  124. # [10:43] <annevk> SVG implementations only support XLink to the extent that they need to recognize certain attributes of XLink on certain elements
  125. # [10:44] <annevk> I believe according to the XLink guys that is valid usage of XLink...
  126. # [10:44] <othermaciej> I wonder if I should waste Dave Singer's time by asking him to vote no on any PR survey that doesn't cite the CR exit criteria and implementation report
  127. # [10:44] <Hixie> apparently only specs that reality impiges on have to follow w3c process
  128. # [10:45] <annevk> why impose requirements on lalaland?
  129. # [10:45] <othermaciej> I usually tell him not to respond at all on stuff we don't care about
  130. # [10:45] <Hixie> the level of double standard at the w3c is so astronomical it makes a joke of the whole thing
  131. # [10:45] <Hixie> svg 1.2 tiny being my favourite example
  132. # [10:47] <othermaciej> to be fair, getting html5 right is orders of magnitude more important than getting xlink 1.1 right
  133. # [10:48] <Hixie> if the w3c staff admitted that and justified ignoring process on the "unimportant" specs because of that, then i wouldn't feel like that was actually just a coincidence
  134. # [10:49] <othermaciej> I think no one is fussy about process until people complain, generally
  135. # [10:49] <othermaciej> otoh with svg 1.2 there were lots of complaints
  136. # [10:49] <othermaciej> so that's the one that seems like an outlier
  137. # [10:52] <hsivonen> i'm ptretty sure the xlink 1.1 iml report used to be secret
  138. # [10:54] <othermaciej> the xlink 1.1 CR exit criteria did include "There are at least two interoperable implementations of the specification."
  139. # [10:54] <Hixie> of every feature?
  140. # [10:54] <othermaciej> the implementation report doesn't seem to give any evidence for that assertion
  141. # [10:54] <Hixie> is there a test suite? i'd love to learn how xlink is supposed to actually work
  142. # [10:54] <othermaciej> http://www.w3.org/XML/2006/03/xlink11-tests
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  146. # [10:56] <Hixie> in what sense is that a test suite?
  147. # [10:57] <othermaciej> in the sense that it was linked from the implementation report in the section with a header of "Test Suite"
  148. # [10:58] * Hixie points back to his comment about the process being a joke half the time
  149. # [10:58] <othermaciej> I am having a hard time running those tests in my browser because they are served with a Content-type of "charset=utf-8"[sic]
  150. # [11:00] <annevk> also uses external entity references
  151. # [11:00] <othermaciej> if I load one by hand after downloading I get a blank page - not sure if that is a pass or fail
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  155. # [11:31] <annevk> http://twitter.com/t/status/14075258381
  156. # [11:31] <annevk> tantek is so much ahead of us
  157. # [11:35] <othermaciej> so, the last version of XHTML Modularization 1.1 to link to an implementation report linked to this: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2006/m12n-11-implementation.html
  158. # [11:35] <othermaciej> the PER doesn't have a link to an impleentation report at all
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  162. # [11:59] <Hixie> http://blogs.msdn.com/ericlippert/archive/2010/04/12/ignoring-parentheses.aspx#comments <-- i guess microsoft really _doesn't_ care about interop with their .NET framework afterall, who knew
  163. # [11:59] <Hixie> *feigned surprise*
  164. # [12:01] <othermaciej> seems like an issue with the C# language, not the .NET framework
  165. # [12:02] <Hixie> yes
  166. # [12:02] <Hixie> C# is part of .NET
  167. # [12:03] <othermaciej> anyway, I'm not that surprised that they ruled out changing the compiler, but I am surprised that they ruled out changing the spec
  168. # [12:06] * annevk is interested in why Hixie was reading that :)
  169. # [12:07] <Hixie> it was about 4 links out from a reddit comment
  170. # [12:07] <Hixie> i'm just browsing the web :-)
  171. # [12:10] <annevk> aah reddit
  172. # [12:10] <othermaciej> Hixie: crazy talk!
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  187. # [13:31] <karlcow> hmmm
  188. # [13:31] <karlcow> http://www.webmonkey.com/2010/02/html_cheatsheet/
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  200. # [14:50] <othermaciej> Firefox seems to have gaps between every line when you select text - has it always done that?
  201. # [14:50] * othermaciej ca't beliee he never noticed
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  203. # [14:50] <variable> othermaciej: I don't see that on my copy
  204. # [14:51] <othermaciej> I'm testing in Firefox 3.6.3 on a Mac
  205. # [14:51] <othermaciej> example site: http://slashdot.org/
  206. # [14:51] <othermaciej> if my selection spans multiple lines, I see gaps w/o the selection color between the lines
  207. # [14:55] <variable> othermaciej: http://isis.poly.edu/~eitan/files/scrshot-no-spanbreak.jpg
  208. # [14:56] <othermaciej> I wonder what is wrong with my copy
  209. # [14:56] <variable> othermaciej: I just tested on /.
  210. # [14:56] <variable> same issue
  211. # [14:57] <othermaciej> by "same issue" do you mean that you do see gaps, or that you don't?
  212. # [14:58] <variable> othermaciej: I see the gaps on /.
  213. # [14:58] <variable> but I don't see them on the webchat for freenode
  214. # [14:58] <othermaciej> very weird
  215. # [14:58] <variable> and I see them on half the lines in the The connection has timed out page on firefox
  216. # [14:58] <variable> (if it breaks <p> I think I see the gaps else I don't>
  217. # [14:58] <variable> s/t>/)//
  218. # [14:59] * variable makes testcase now
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  220. # [15:01] <variable> othermaciej: got it: there is a gap if it breaks <p> or multiple <br>s but not one <br> or no <p>
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  222. # [15:01] <variable> there was a thread about this on www-style recently. IIRC IE attempts to only select text along with FF but opera attempts to select elements as well (not sure what that means re gaps)
  223. # [15:02] <othermaciej> slashdot doesn't seem to have multiple <br>s or <p>s in the article summaries
  224. # [15:03] <othermaciej> yeah, I know they won't select gaps between paragraphs, but I see gaps between lines in a single paragraph
  225. # [15:03] <othermaciej> which I was not expecting
  226. # [15:03] <variable> odd. Report a bug to FF?
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  230. # [15:34] <Dashiva> #public-deja-vu
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  285. # [19:34] <Philip`> http://www.oracle.com/database/berkeley-db/db/index.html - "based on the ubiquitous SQLite version 3 API, Berkeley DB provides a drop-in compatible SQL database library and command line tool"
  286. # [19:34] * Philip` wonders if that's compatible enough for web browser use
  287. # [19:36] <Philip`> Oh, apparently it's basically the SQLite frontend with the storage implementation rewritten to use BDB, or something along those lines
  288. # [19:36] <Philip`> so it's probably compatible but not really independent
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  310. # [21:18] <annevk> isn't the Firefox selection related to line boxes and line-height and all? seems more logical than it being related to <br> and what not
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  314. # [21:32] <annevk> hmm, whatwg.org is down
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  322. # [22:18] <annevk> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-iri/2010May/0012.html -- so the status report is that it's not really anywhere yet?
  323. # [22:19] <annevk> basically I'm at a loss how that email addresses what is discussed in its first paragraph
  324. # [22:28] <Hixie> well i've no idea what happened to my server
  325. # [22:28] <Hixie> it was up, just not doing anything web-related
  326. # [22:29] <Hixie> looks like we had some sort of runaway process around 3am/4am
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  342. # [23:44] <zcorpan_> http://forums.whatwg.org/viewtopic.php?t=4299 - someone know enough about rdfa and microdata to answer this?
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  345. # [23:54] <Dashiva> @content is done with a <meta>, isn't it?
  346. # [23:54] <zcorpan_> yeah, but what does @resource do
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  348. # [23:56] <Dashiva> It... RDFs
  349. # [23:58] <Dashiva> Seems like it can be used in multiple ways. Covered by itemscope and itemtype, I'd say.
  350. # Session Close: Mon May 17 00:00:00 2010

The end :)