/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2010-12-08 / end

Options:

  1. # Session Start: Wed Dec 08 17:34:46 2010
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  3. # [17:34] * Now talking in #whatwg
  4. # [17:34] * Topic is 'WHATWG: http://www.whatwg.org/ -- logs: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/ -- stats: http://gavinsharp.com/irc/whatwg.html -- Please leave your sense of logic at the door, thanks!'
  5. # [17:34] * Set by annevk42 on Mon Oct 19 22:03:06
  6. # [17:35] * Joins: sicking (~chatzilla@c-98-210-155-80.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  7. # [17:35] <krijnh> Have no fear, the (smoke producing) Pentium II IRC logging service is here! \o/
  8. # [17:36] <gsnedders> http://google-web-toolkit.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/user/src/com/google/gwt/core/client/impl/StackTraceCreator.java — oh wow.
  9. # [17:36] <gsnedders> That's just scary.
  10. # [17:37] <annevk> krijnh is talking about http://plixi.com/p/61729229 I believe o_O
  11. # [17:37] <krijnh> Yeah
  12. # [17:37] <gsnedders> Tries to read Error.message in Opera to get the stack, which was (well, still is) where the stack was put in Futhark with a non-default preference option.
  13. # [17:37] <gsnedders> Won't work at all in Carakan…
  14. # [17:37] <MikeSmith> damn, krijnh is back
  15. # [17:37] * Quits: peol_ (~andree@unaffiliated/peol) (Remote host closed the connection)
  16. # [17:38] <MikeSmith> now I have to be more careful about what I say
  17. # [17:38] <jgraham> david_carlisle: You are the resident expert on all things X, right :)
  18. # [17:38] <david_carlisle> but you hate us
  19. # [17:38] <annevk> so much hate
  20. # [17:39] <krijnh> I thought we only hate blind people?
  21. # [17:39] <annevk> whenever something bad happens, I always think, oh well, there's also XML
  22. # [17:39] <jgraham> If I have some XPath with a default namespace (XPath 2 has this right?) can I mix explicit prefixes and the default in the same expression?
  23. # [17:39] <david_carlisle> yes
  24. # [17:40] <annevk> krijnh, hmm yeah, can't spread this hate thing thin
  25. # [17:40] <david_carlisle> the default-xpath-namespace just changes the interpretation of unprefixed names, has no effect on prefixed ones
  26. # [17:40] <annevk> dilemma
  27. # [17:40] <jgraham> So if the XHTML ns is the default then //html:div/span should find all span children of div elements both in the XHTMLNS
  28. # [17:40] <jgraham> david_carlisle: Perfect, thanks
  29. # [17:41] <david_carlisle> xpath today
  30. # [17:41] <david_carlisle> xslt tomorrow
  31. # [17:41] <karlcow> MikeSmith: as usual, you are █████████████████████ it's ok.
  32. # [17:41] * Quits: sicking (~chatzilla@c-98-210-155-80.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  33. # [17:41] <david_carlisle> whole world using xml by the weekend
  34. # [17:41] <jgraham> david_carlisle: Actually I quite like XPath
  35. # [17:41] <jgraham> It hasn't made me want to use XSLT yet theough :p
  36. # [17:41] <karlcow> damn, krijnh sanitizer
  37. # [17:41] <jgraham> *though
  38. # [17:42] * aroben is now known as aroben|afk
  39. # [17:43] <david_carlisle> you'd probably prefer xquery anyway (which is basically a cut down xslt, without the xml syntax)
  40. # [17:44] * Joins: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  41. # [17:46] * Quits: mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  42. # [17:47] * aroben|afk is now known as aroben
  43. # [17:48] * Joins: peol (~andree@h55eb1ed3.selukra.dyn.perspektivbredband.net)
  44. # [17:48] * Quits: peol (~andree@h55eb1ed3.selukra.dyn.perspektivbredband.net) (Changing host)
  45. # [17:48] * Joins: peol (~andree@unaffiliated/peol)
  46. # [17:49] <annevk> Safari accepts a different set of encodings compared to Chrome
  47. # [17:50] <annevk> Chrome is way more restricted
  48. # [17:52] * Joins: ChrisLTD (~iMac@ur185.ur.unc.edu)
  49. # [17:52] * Quits: erlehmann (~erlehmann@89.204.153.99) (Quit: Die demokratieerhaltende Whistleblower-Organisation Krautchan freut sich immer über Spenden.)
  50. # [17:55] * Quits: cypha (~sallabanc@unaffiliated/cypha) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  51. # [17:57] * Quits: ormaaj (debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/ormaaj) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  52. # [18:00] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachlan@cm-84.215.59.50.getinternet.no)
  53. # [18:00] * Joins: cypha (~sallabanc@69.50.70.12)
  54. # [18:00] * Quits: cypha (~sallabanc@69.50.70.12) (Changing host)
  55. # [18:00] * Joins: cypha (~sallabanc@unaffiliated/cypha)
  56. # [18:03] * Quits: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  57. # [18:03] <annevk> yay
  58. # [18:04] <annevk> something else I figured out
  59. # [18:04] * Quits: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-109-90-161-169.unitymediagroup.de) (Read error: Connection timed out)
  60. # [18:04] <annevk> IE treats aliases of iso-8859-1 as windows-1252, but not iso-8859-1 itself, unless it is loaded directly
  61. # [18:05] * Quits: rimantas (~rimliu@lan-84-240-20-219.vln.skynet.lt) (Quit: Leaving)
  62. # [18:05] * Joins: mokush (~quassel@188.24.42.24)
  63. # [18:05] <annevk> also, Firefox and IE are leading encoding proliferation
  64. # [18:05] <annevk> Firefox foremost I guess
  65. # [18:06] * Joins: maikmerten (~maikmerte@port-92-201-55-199.dynamic.qsc.de)
  66. # [18:06] * Joins: Anti-X (~duckmysic@77.18.228.24.tmi.telenormobil.no)
  67. # [18:06] <annevk> I wonder if they are interested in fixing that
  68. # [18:07] * Quits: reni (~reni@sedkit.inf.u-szeged.hu) (Quit: Leaving)
  69. # [18:07] * Philip` notes that reducing encoding support can be a security risk
  70. # [18:07] * jgraham wishes for a way to tell emacs to check in the current buffer to a vcs after every save (but not to do it for all buffers)
  71. # [18:08] <jgraham> hober: In case you were wondering, that was your queue to say "I've got some code that does just that" :)
  72. # [18:09] <jgraham> er "cue"
  73. # [18:10] <jgraham> silly language
  74. # [18:11] <annevk> Philip`, example?
  75. # [18:11] <karlcow> I wonder if someone wrote a nested tables counter for Web pages…
  76. # [18:14] * Quits: mhausenblas (~mhausenbl@wg1-nat.fwgal01.deri.ie) (Quit: mhausenblas)
  77. # [18:15] * Joins: broquaint (1536faedd8@cpc3-brig17-2-0-cust661.3-3.cable.virginmedia.com)
  78. # [18:17] * Quits: volkmar (~volkmar@gentoo/developer/volkmar) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  79. # [18:17] <Philip`> annevk: Any not-sufficiently-ASCII-like encoding (EBCDIC, ISO-2022-*, etc) - if a server emits it but a browser doesn't support it and uses a default decoder instead, you can get XSS
  80. # [18:18] * Joins: Maurice (copyman@5ED573FA.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  81. # [18:20] <annevk> ah yes
  82. # [18:20] <annevk> I am only testing 7- and 8-bit so far
  83. # [18:20] <annevk> nobody does 7-bit
  84. # [18:20] * aroben is now known as aroben|lunch
  85. # [18:22] * Joins: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  86. # [18:23] * Joins: volkmar (~volkmar@gentoo/developer/volkmar)
  87. # [18:23] * Joins: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
  88. # [18:25] * Quits: yutak_home (~kee@K036185.ppp.dion.ne.jp) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  89. # [18:30] * Joins: micheil (~micheil@99-113-33-97.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
  90. # [18:30] * Joins: Xano_ (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  91. # [18:30] * Quits: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  92. # [18:30] * Xano_ is now known as Xano
  93. # [18:31] * Joins: Athox (~duckmysic@c7376BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no)
  94. # [18:35] * Joins: ormaaj (debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/ormaaj)
  95. # [18:35] * Quits: Anti-X (~duckmysic@77.18.228.24.tmi.telenormobil.no) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  96. # [18:37] * Quits: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  97. # [18:38] <oojacoboo> latest browser stats on my site are surprisingly good
  98. # [18:39] <oojacoboo> IE only 24% with IE6 and IE7 only getting 5%
  99. # [18:39] <oojacoboo> 75% webkit/gecko
  100. # [18:39] <oojacoboo> for an industry and still thinks they live in the 50s
  101. # [18:40] * Joins: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  102. # [18:43] * aroben|lunch is now known as aroben
  103. # [18:45] * Joins: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-109-90-161-169.unitymediagroup.de)
  104. # [18:46] <karlcow> http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc6067.txt
  105. # [18:47] * Joins: agektmr (~Adium@nat/google/x-agttbnnaraxwgpfl)
  106. # [18:49] * Quits: david_carlisle (~davidc@62.231.145.254) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  107. # [18:51] <hober> hmm. http://wiki.whatwg.org/index.php?title=CanvasContexts&diff=5608&oldid=prev
  108. # [18:52] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@YYMYCMX.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  109. # [18:53] <hober> jgraham: get in the habit of hitting C-x v v after you C-x C-s :)
  110. # [18:54] <jgraham> hober: Not really good enough since I don't want to be promted for a commit message
  111. # [18:54] <jgraham> And since the whole deal is that I am likely to forget
  112. # [18:55] <jgraham> (the use case is reducing buggy sites where you remove code and see if the bug still happens. It would be great to have every intermediate step atomatically saved so if you over-reduce you can back up a few steps and try again)
  113. # [18:56] <jgraham> *automatically
  114. # [19:02] * Quits: pauld (~chatzilla@194.102.13.2) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  115. # [19:04] * Quits: workmad3 (~workmad3@cpc3-bagu10-0-0-cust651.1-3.cable.virginmedia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  116. # [19:05] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@dsl-hkibrasgw4-fe41dc00-67.dhcp.inet.fi)
  117. # [19:06] * Joins: miketaylr (~miketaylr@64.9.231.142)
  118. # [19:07] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachlan@cm-84.215.59.50.getinternet.no) (Quit: Leaving)
  119. # [19:07] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachlan@cm-84.215.59.50.getinternet.no)
  120. # [19:08] * Joins: workmad3 (~workmad3@cpc3-bagu10-0-0-cust651.1-3.cable.virginmedia.com)
  121. # [19:08] * Joins: MrOpposite (~mropposit@unaffiliated/mropposite)
  122. # [19:09] <hober> you could do something like (add-hook 'after-save-hook (lambda () (when (something-p) (vc-checkin (buffer-file-name) nil "Commit message"))))
  123. # [19:09] <hober> untested of course
  124. # [19:09] <hober> and the impl of `something-p' is left to the reader :)
  125. # [19:11] * Quits: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-109-90-161-169.unitymediagroup.de) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  126. # [19:11] * Quits: ormaaj (debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/ormaaj) (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
  127. # [19:12] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@c-24-128-189-152.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  128. # [19:12] <hober> ahh, an explanation of the weird wiki edit I noted earlier: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0075.html
  129. # [19:12] * Quits: annevk (~annevk@pat-tdc.opera.com) (Quit: annevk)
  130. # [19:13] * Quits: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  131. # [19:13] * aroben is now known as aroben|lunch
  132. # [19:20] * Joins: mdelaney (~mdelaney@66.109.105.157)
  133. # [19:20] * Quits: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  134. # [19:22] * Joins: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  135. # [19:24] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-24-6-209-6.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  136. # [19:24] * Quits: ChrisLTD (~iMac@ur185.ur.unc.edu) (Quit: ChrisLTD)
  137. # [19:24] * Quits: brendaneich (~brendanei@38.99.102.165) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  138. # [19:25] * Joins: brendaneich (~brendanei@38.99.102.165)
  139. # [19:29] * Quits: brendaneich (~brendanei@38.99.102.165) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  140. # [19:30] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-24-6-209-6.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  141. # [19:33] * Joins: matjas (~matjas@91.182.206.147)
  142. # [19:33] * Quits: cying (~cying@c-24-23-135-168.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: cying)
  143. # [19:36] * aroben|lunch is now known as aroben
  144. # [19:41] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-24-6-209-6.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  145. # [19:46] * Joins: brendaneich (~brendanei@12.53.227.10)
  146. # [19:47] * Joins: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-109-90-161-169.unitymediagroup.de)
  147. # [19:50] * Joins: jwalden (~waldo@nat/mozilla/x-iydybardzvrvmqxu)
  148. # [19:50] * Quits: workmad3 (~workmad3@cpc3-bagu10-0-0-cust651.1-3.cable.virginmedia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  149. # [19:58] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@nat/mozilla/x-vmtrpsapupgmbfiy)
  150. # [20:02] * Quits: brendaneich (~brendanei@12.53.227.10) (Quit: brendaneich)
  151. # [20:04] * Joins: jamesr_ (~jamesr@nat/google/x-kmmsslhdulbsdghf)
  152. # [20:06] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@c-2e98e355.410-6-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)
  153. # [20:06] * Joins: ojan (~ojan@nat/google/x-rgqocpanwjtuscto)
  154. # [20:12] * Joins: mpt_ (~mpt@5e054677.bb.sky.com)
  155. # [20:12] * Quits: mpt_ (~mpt@5e054677.bb.sky.com) (Changing host)
  156. # [20:12] * Joins: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  157. # [20:12] * Quits: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Client Quit)
  158. # [20:14] * Joins: cying (~cying@173-228-29-224.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  159. # [20:16] * Quits: miketaylr (~miketaylr@64.9.231.142) (Remote host closed the connection)
  160. # [20:18] * Quits: mdelaney (~mdelaney@66.109.105.157) (Quit: mdelaney)
  161. # [20:19] * Joins: ChrisLTD (~iMac@ur185.ur.unc.edu)
  162. # [20:23] * Quits: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-109-90-161-169.unitymediagroup.de) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  163. # [20:26] * Joins: boaz_ (~boaz@64.119.153.2)
  164. # [20:27] <zcorpan> "“Accept” and “Accept-Language” are fairly important" - http://calendar.perfplanet.com/2010/bloated-request-response-headers/
  165. # [20:28] * Quits: ChrisLTD (~iMac@ur185.ur.unc.edu) (Quit: ChrisLTD)
  166. # [20:28] * Joins: mdelaney (~mdelaney@2620:0:1b00:1191:d69a:20ff:febf:89a0)
  167. # [20:30] * Joins: henrikbjorn (~Henrik@c83-249-65-238.bredband.comhem.se)
  168. # [20:30] <zcorpan> hmm, maybe we should kill the Referer header for same-origin requests?
  169. # [20:31] <zcorpan> or will that Break The Web?
  170. # [20:32] * Joins: MikeSmith_ (~MikeSmith@EM111-188-37-104.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp)
  171. # [20:33] <zcorpan> sadly we won't be able to remove the User-Agent header
  172. # [20:33] <zcorpan> (at least we haven't added it for websockets!)
  173. # [20:33] * Joins: brendaneich (~brendanei@nat/mozilla/x-geqbqkrimumagkjm)
  174. # [20:33] <AryehGregor> Just use SPDY, then most of this stuff is only sent once, and is compressed to boot.
  175. # [20:34] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:0:1b00:1191:226:4aff:fe14:aad6)
  176. # [20:34] <zcorpan> i haven't read up on SPDY yet
  177. # [20:35] <Peter-> zcorpan: many anti-hotlink scripts rely on that
  178. # [20:35] <Peter-> although they usually accept no referer too
  179. # [20:35] <zcorpan> Peter-: if they accept no referer then it should be fine
  180. # [20:36] * Quits: MikeSmith (~MikeSmith@EM114-49-33-197.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  181. # [20:36] * MikeSmith_ is now known as MikeSmith
  182. # [20:38] * Quits: crash\ (bouncer@lubyte.de) (Quit: lubyte.de)
  183. # [20:42] * Joins: crash\ (bouncer@lubyte.de)
  184. # [20:45] * Joins: david_carlisle (~davidc@dcarlisle.demon.co.uk)
  185. # [20:46] * Joins: yod1 (~thereaux@fw.vdl2.ca)
  186. # [20:48] * Quits: paul_irish (~paul_iris@c-76-21-40-62.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  187. # [20:48] <Hixie> so... i'm confused
  188. # [20:48] <Hixie> is elliot's draft normative or not?
  189. # [20:49] <hober> he says it's normative, but he's removed all normative language from statements that *don't* just say what's already said in another spec
  190. # [20:56] * Quits: Rik` (~Rik`@mozilla-paris-222-194.cnt.nerim.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  191. # [20:56] <Philip`> Launchpad seems to fail if you disable Referer
  192. # [20:56] <Philip`> so you'll break that part of the web, at least
  193. # [20:57] <zcorpan> Philip`: ok
  194. # [20:57] <Hixie> hober: that sounds like a huge recipe for confusion
  195. # [20:58] * Quits: plainhao (~plainhao@208.75.85.237) (Quit: plainhao)
  196. # [21:01] * Quits: KaOSoFt (~maxzagato@unaffiliated/kaosoft) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  197. # [21:01] <hober> Hixie: indeed
  198. # [21:01] * Joins: fishd_ (~fishd@nat/google/x-sgpowcodsjlkuzcb)
  199. # [21:01] <hober> it would have made more sense for him to do the opposite: drop RFC2119 terminology when restating reqs from html&xml specs
  200. # [21:01] <hober> and only use RFC2119 terms for *additional* restrictions
  201. # [21:03] * Quits: fishd (~fishd@nat/google/x-hftkgxidbmijrehi) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  202. # [21:04] <zcorpan> what would make sense is if it didn't have additional restrictions, just non-normatively describe the intersection of the restrictions in the text/html and xhtml5 restrictions
  203. # [21:05] <hober> I'm assuming that the spec is intended to define a useful/interesting subset of that intersection
  204. # [21:05] <zcorpan> still, i don't see the usefullness of it, so i don't care
  205. # [21:05] <hober> that's where the additional restrictions would come in
  206. # [21:05] <hober> but yeah, if it's just intended to describe the actual intersection, no additional normative reqs are necessary
  207. # [21:06] * Quits: brendaneich (~brendanei@nat/mozilla/x-geqbqkrimumagkjm) (Quit: brendaneich)
  208. # [21:06] <zcorpan> i don't know what the intention is. maybe the intention is just to waste people's time
  209. # [21:10] * Quits: jeremyselier (~Jeremy@2a01:e35:2eec:80a0:fa1e:dfff:feec:469) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  210. # [21:12] * Quits: cardona507 (~cardona50@cpe-98-150-147-252.hawaii.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  211. # [21:13] * Joins: brendaneich (~brendanei@nat/mozilla/x-uevftgnustofnrsm)
  212. # [21:15] * Joins: KaOSoFt (~maxzagato@190.253.128.176)
  213. # [21:15] * Quits: KaOSoFt (~maxzagato@190.253.128.176) (Changing host)
  214. # [21:15] * Joins: KaOSoFt (~maxzagato@unaffiliated/kaosoft)
  215. # [21:16] * Quits: yod1 (~thereaux@fw.vdl2.ca) (Quit: Leaving.)
  216. # [21:24] * Joins: roc (~chatzilla@203-97-204-82.dsl.clear.net.nz)
  217. # [21:26] * Quits: FireFly (~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly) (Quit: swatted to death)
  218. # [21:27] * Quits: maikmerten (~maikmerte@port-92-201-55-199.dynamic.qsc.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  219. # [21:27] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.246.16.23)
  220. # [21:28] * Joins: FireFly (~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly)
  221. # [21:29] * Joins: Rik` (~Rik`@pha75-2-81-57-187-57.fbx.proxad.net)
  222. # [21:29] <zcorpan> twitter says @johnfoliot is "similar to me"
  223. # [21:30] * Quits: david_carlisle (~davidc@dcarlisle.demon.co.uk) (Quit: david_carlisle)
  224. # [21:31] * Quits: agektmr (~Adium@nat/google/x-agttbnnaraxwgpfl) (Quit: Leaving.)
  225. # [21:35] <karlcow> zcorpan: the moustache maybe
  226. # [21:36] <zcorpan> i don't have one!
  227. # [21:36] * Joins: maikmerten (~maikmerte@port-92-201-55-199.dynamic.qsc.de)
  228. # [21:43] * Joins: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-109-90-161-169.unitymediagroup.de)
  229. # [21:46] * Quits: cypha (~sallabanc@unaffiliated/cypha) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  230. # [21:46] * Quits: maikmerten (~maikmerte@port-92-201-55-199.dynamic.qsc.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
  231. # [21:47] * Joins: cypha (~sallabanc@unaffiliated/cypha)
  232. # [21:53] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@c-24-128-189-152.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
  233. # [22:03] * Joins: bckenny (~bckenny@nat/google/x-pmffmudzfdcpmskl)
  234. # [22:04] * Joins: colourcooker (~colourcoo@5356C5E6.cm-6-7d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  235. # [22:06] * Joins: yod (~thereaux@fw.vdl2.ca)
  236. # [22:06] * Joins: david_carlisle (~davidc@dcarlisle.demon.co.uk)
  237. # [22:07] * Joins: paul_irish (~paul_iris@173-228-44-56.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  238. # [22:10] * Joins: nattokirai_ (~nattokira@y079250.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp)
  239. # [22:11] * Quits: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  240. # [22:12] * Joins: Xano (~bart@524BF837.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  241. # [22:13] * Quits: Athox (~duckmysic@c7376BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  242. # [22:15] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  243. # [22:16] * Quits: henrikbjorn (~Henrik@c83-249-65-238.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  244. # [22:16] * Quits: boaz_ (~boaz@64.119.153.2) (Quit: boaz_)
  245. # [22:17] * Joins: Anti-X (~duckmysic@c7376BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no)
  246. # [22:21] * Joins: workmad3 (~workmad3@cpc3-bagu10-0-0-cust651.1-3.cable.virginmedia.com)
  247. # [22:23] * Quits: paul_irish (~paul_iris@173-228-44-56.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  248. # [22:28] * Quits: matjas (~matjas@91.182.206.147) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
  249. # [22:32] * Joins: agektmr (~Adium@nat/google/x-wgvznbrxeipcbtpb)
  250. # [22:32] * Joins: ormaaj (debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/ormaaj)
  251. # [22:34] * Quits: peol (~andree@unaffiliated/peol) (Remote host closed the connection)
  252. # [22:34] * Quits: colourcooker (~colourcoo@5356C5E6.cm-6-7d.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  253. # [22:38] * Quits: MrOpposite (~mropposit@unaffiliated/mropposite) (Quit: Leaving)
  254. # [22:40] * Joins: erlehmann (~erlehmann@89.204.153.123)
  255. # [22:48] * Quits: cyphase (~cyphase@adsl-99-27-201-72.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  256. # [22:50] * Quits: yod (~thereaux@fw.vdl2.ca) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  257. # [22:53] * Quits: mokush (~quassel@188.24.42.24) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  258. # [22:56] * Joins: yod (~thereaux@fw.vdl2.ca)
  259. # [22:57] * Joins: annevk (~annevk@33.115.34.95.customer.cdi.no)
  260. # [22:58] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@dsl-hkibrasgw4-fe41dc00-67.dhcp.inet.fi) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  261. # [23:00] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.246.16.23) (Quit: othermaciej)
  262. # [23:02] * Joins: Aleoss112 (~AleossIRC@204-83-16-179.regn.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca)
  263. # [23:02] * aroben is now known as aroben|meeting
  264. # [23:03] * Quits: ROBOd (~robod@92.86.244.107) (Quit: .)
  265. # [23:04] * Quits: Aleoss (AleossIRC@69-11-81-218.regn.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  266. # [23:06] * Quits: Anti-X (~duckmysic@c7376BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  267. # [23:07] * Quits: Aleoss112 (~AleossIRC@204-83-16-179.regn.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  268. # [23:07] * Joins: cyphase (~cyphase@adsl-99-22-95-80.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
  269. # [23:07] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  270. # [23:08] * Quits: yod (~thereaux@fw.vdl2.ca) (Quit: Leaving.)
  271. # [23:08] * Joins: Aleoss112 (AleossIRC@69-11-81-218.regn.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca)
  272. # [23:11] * Joins: Anti-X (~duckmysic@c8F76BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no)
  273. # [23:11] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.246.16.23)
  274. # [23:13] * Quits: f1lt3r_bocoup (~f1lt3r@64.119.153.2) (Remote host closed the connection)
  275. # [23:14] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@GYKCLI.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi)
  276. # [23:14] <annevk> hmm, updating html5-diff
  277. # [23:14] <annevk> I guess I can do that
  278. # [23:14] <annevk> even though technically I'm on vacation
  279. # [23:16] * aroben|meeting is now known as aroben
  280. # [23:16] * Quits: bckenny (~bckenny@nat/google/x-pmffmudzfdcpmskl) (Remote host closed the connection)
  281. # [23:18] * Quits: Maurice (copyman@5ED573FA.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  282. # [23:20] * Joins: sicking (~chatzilla@c-98-210-155-80.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  283. # [23:27] <Hixie> so http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/complete.html#playing-the-media-resource says that play() loads the resource "if necessary"
  284. # [23:27] <Hixie> which some people have interpreted as meaning "if the src='' attribute has changed"
  285. # [23:28] <Hixie> but i really just meant if the element is in the empty state
  286. # [23:28] <Hixie> anyone have a better way of phrasing this that is both accurate and helpful?
  287. # [23:31] * Joins: bfrog (~tburdick@unaffiliated/themonotone)
  288. # [23:33] * Quits: BlurstOfTimes (~blurstoft@168.203.117.107) (Remote host closed the connection)
  289. # [23:33] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  290. # [23:42] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@GYKCLI.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  291. # [23:42] <zcorpan> Hixie: "loading the media resource if it hasn't already started loading, and beginning playback."
  292. # [23:43] <Hixie> what's "the media resource"?
  293. # [23:43] <zcorpan> see the spec! :)
  294. # [23:43] <Hixie> well there's two here, right
  295. # [23:43] <Hixie> silvia interpreted as meaning the one that was specified in src=""
  296. # [23:43] <Hixie> even if the one previously specified had started playing already
  297. # [23:45] <zcorpan> i don't follow. if you change src="", it gets loaded regardless of play()
  298. # [23:45] <Hixie> <source src>, sorry
  299. # [23:45] <bfrog> is websocket going to be fixed and out in another year or so do you guys think?
  300. # [23:45] <bfrog> or is it going to be a never ending draft
  301. # [23:45] <annevk> I wish I'd know
  302. # [23:45] <Hixie> bfrog: dunno, ianfette in #chromium might know
  303. # [23:45] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.246.16.23) (Quit: othermaciej)
  304. # [23:45] <Hixie> or ask the hybi chairs what their timetable is
  305. # [23:45] <zcorpan> Hixie: prepend "current"
  306. # [23:46] <zcorpan> hmm maybe that'll confuse things
  307. # [23:46] <annevk> WebSockets went out of WHATWG and does not appear to be going anywhere :/
  308. # [23:46] <Hixie> zcorpan: yeah i think that someone who misinterpreted "as necessary" would misinterpret "current media resource" in the same way
  309. # [23:47] <bfrog> whats the alternative to websocket anyways, there doesn't seem to be anything particularly good that can replace it easily
  310. # [23:47] <zcorpan> Hixie: maybe the text about loading isn't helpful
  311. # [23:47] * Joins: miketaylr (~miketaylr@64.9.231.142)
  312. # [23:48] <annevk> bfrog, there's none
  313. # [23:48] <annevk> bfrog, apart from prolly using Flash or something crazy like that
  314. # [23:48] <bfrog> right
  315. # [23:49] <Hixie> zcorpan: yeah, maybe i should just remove that
  316. # [23:53] * Joins: paul_irish (~paul_iris@c-76-21-40-62.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  317. # [23:54] * Joins: dglazkov (d8ef2d13@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.239.45.19)
  318. # [23:58] * Quits: david_carlisle (~davidc@dcarlisle.demon.co.uk) (Quit: david_carlisle)
  319. # [23:59] * Joins: homata (~homata@58x158x182x50.ap58.ftth.ucom.ne.jp)
  320. # Session Close: Thu Dec 09 00:00:00 2010

The end :)