/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2011-03-19 / end

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  1. # Session Start: Sat Mar 19 00:00:01 2011
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
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  4. # [00:00] <jgraham> But it seems silly to have multiple tracks if they can't be controlled seperately
  5. # [00:00] <Hixie> given the difficulties we've had getting browser vendors to expose UIs (see earlier discussion), i wouldn't count on even a single volume control being made available, frankly
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  8. # [00:01] <jgraham> It also seems a bit silly to worry about the site doing something user-hostile
  9. # [00:01] <Hixie> but it seems bad to design the api on the basis that the UI will expose them all, either way
  10. # [00:01] <Hixie> worrying about sites doing user-hostile things is my day job :-P
  11. # [00:01] <jgraham> Presumably they can already screw with you by continually changing the volume
  12. # [00:01] <TabAtkins> Hixie: All the browsers expose a volume control on <video> and <audio> already. Only one, obviously.
  13. # [00:02] <Hixie> jgraham: it's the unintentional hostility i'm more worried about in this case
  14. # [00:02] <jgraham> (it seems more reasonable to assume that javascript-based video players will expose mixer UIs than browsers)
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  18. # [00:02] <Lachy> for the API, the .volume property should just be the master volume, and then there could be an audio track API, perhaps exposed as a separate object, that lets scripts mute/unmute selected tracks and control their volume.
  19. # [00:03] <Hixie> which one should the UA remember as the preference?
  20. # [00:03] <Hixie> (in UAs that are so fine-grained)
  21. # [00:04] <jgraham> Hixie: That seems like a UA problem
  22. # [00:04] <jgraham> Why can't it remember all of them?
  23. # [00:04] <zewt> i'd expect the API for volume control to be identical for the master volume and each track: they're both just audio tracks--the master volume is just a track sourcing from the individual tracks
  24. # [00:05] <Lachy> are there use cases for also exposing APIs to controll the bass, treble, and surround sound mixers too?
  25. # [00:05] <Hixie> jgraham: it could, sure
  26. # [00:05] <Hixie> jgraham: just trying to understand what you had in mind
  27. # [00:06] <zewt> jgraham: provided tracks are tagged generically enough to meaningfully remember them
  28. # [00:06] <Hixie> Lachy: probably, but i'm hoping to deal with that separately
  29. # [00:06] <jgraham> zewt: Yeah it isn't quite a trivial problem
  30. # [00:06] <zewt> eg. saving the volume for "track 2 of foo.ogv" isn't too useful; but remembering the volume for "commentary tracks on origin http://whatever" is more useful
  31. # [00:06] <jgraham> But neither is form autofill
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  33. # [00:07] <jgraham> So possibly if it improves the user experience enough it will happen
  34. # [00:07] <jgraham> (possibly it won't be that useful though and the people who want it will have to install extensions or something)
  35. # [00:07] <zewt> Lachy: seems like that's pushing the scope out a lot more than volume
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  37. # [00:07] <zewt> jgraham: in this case, i think playing multiple audio tracks simultaneously will be so rare browsers won't optimize it much
  38. # [00:08] <zewt> but who knows, heh
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  40. # [00:08] <Lachy> Hixie, sure, but it's worth keeping in mind for the future. I'm thinking we could have an AudioControl object (or whatever name), in which we can have all the properties for controlling everything related to audio, and that could be exposed as HTMLMediaElement.audioMixer or something
  41. # [00:09] <zewt> yeah, that's what I had in mind above--eg. .volume, .onvolumechange, .mute, .unmute, etc., as an interface exposed for both the master channel and each individual track
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  107. # [04:37] <Hixie> well the css-discuss thread about <table> is pretty much everything i feared and more, and i haven't even updated the spec yet
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  325. # [21:01] <Xdega> does anyone know who maintains this channel?
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  328. # [21:06] <Hixie> Xdega: how do you mean, "maintains"?
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  330. # [21:08] <Xdega> maybe
  331. # [21:08] <Xdega> heh
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  333. # [21:08] <Xdega> well just curious if a link to the forums could be added
  334. # [21:09] <Xdega> forums.whatwg.org
  335. # [21:09] <Xdega> in the welcome message
  336. # [21:09] <Xdega> so i guess anyone that is able to edit the welcome message
  337. # [21:09] * Joins: kal-EL_ (~jor-EL@host182-10-dynamic.117-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
  338. # [21:09] <Hixie> pretty much anyone is able to edit the message, i think, but we have so many links (blog, forums, wiki, spec, etc) that we just put them on www.whatwg.org/ and then link to that instead
  339. # [21:10] <Xdega> kk
  340. # [21:11] <Xdega> also looks like the facebook page is missing a link to the website even. Just a copy paste from wikipedia. (and no whatwg logo)
  341. # [21:12] <Hixie> we have a facebook page? o_O
  342. # [21:12] <Hixie> dunno who's running that
  343. # [21:12] <Xdega> aparently, lol http://www.facebook.com/pages/WHATWG/116109708402918
  344. # [21:12] <Xdega> only 9 likes atm though.
  345. # [21:12] <Hixie> i don't even have a facebook account :-)
  346. # [21:13] <Xdega> that is awkward, cause it's not possible to make a page with the same name, and the person running the page is meant to be a representative of the grp or organization per facebooks terms
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  348. # [21:13] <Hixie> i don't see how to change that page without making a whole facebook profile and stuff
  349. # [21:13] * gsnedders should create an Ian Hickson public-figure page just to like that
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  351. # [21:13] <Hixie> but anyone who does the facebook stuff and cares about this is welcome to do whatever is the appropriate thing
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  353. # [21:14] <Hixie> feel free to make that your contribution to the community :-)
  354. # [21:14] <Xdega> well if i could find out who has that current page I would be more than happy
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  356. # [21:14] <Hixie> doesn't it say?
  357. # [21:14] <Xdega> already working with the forums, trying to get them a little more active. I think facebook could be a good window
  358. # [21:14] <Hixie> cool
  359. # [21:17] <Xdega> well just submitted a report to facebook for a "fake page" If it gets removed I will make a new one heh.
  360. # [21:19] <Xdega> also trying to find a way to convert the mailing list to RSS feed, and then will work on implementing some kind of integration with Twitter RSS and Mailing list RSS on the forums :D
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  362. # [21:21] <Hixie> neat
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  381. # [22:02] <Xdega> so how would I go about getting access to submit an article for the WHATWG Blog?
  382. # [22:03] <Hixie> i should be able to do it but since we removed the admin link i don't remember the page to do it from :-(
  383. # [22:03] <gsnedders> Xdega: Can you not just create an account?
  384. # [22:03] <Xdega> not seeing the option >.<
  385. # [22:04] <gsnedders> Oh, "User registration is currently not allowed."
  386. # [22:04] <gsnedders> Hixie: Is that deliberate, do you know?
  387. # [22:04] <Hixie> not sure
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  389. # [22:06] * gsnedders doesn't really want to change that
  390. # [22:06] <gsnedders> Xdega: what's your email (pm is fine if you don't want it logged)?
  391. # [22:06] <gsnedders> Xdega: And choose a username.
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  393. # [22:15] <gsnedders> Xdega: Just ask here when you want to publish something, then someone with admin perms should be able to publish it for you.
  394. # [22:15] <Xdega> ok. well i plan on writing an article later (maybe tommorow). I will let you guys know.
  395. # [22:16] <Xdega> although it appears I have the ability to click "publish" from the WP dashboard.
  396. # [22:17] * Joins: jacobolu_ (~jacobolus@pool-71-174-34-88.bstnma.east.verizon.net)
  397. # [22:19] <jgraham> gsnedders: I think it is deliberate
  398. # [22:19] <jgraham> Once you have an account you can publish
  399. # [22:19] <jgraham> But you have to ask for an account
  400. # [22:19] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@pool-71-174-34-88.bstnma.east.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  401. # [22:20] * Quits: alrra (592f527d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.47.82.125) (Quit: Page closed)
  402. # [22:22] <Xdega> well time for me to bounce, thanks for the account.
  403. # [22:23] * Parts: Xdega (4c54f095@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.84.240.149)
  404. # [22:25] <jgraham> boing
  405. # [22:26] * Ms2ger hits jgraham over the head with a balloon
  406. # [22:28] * gsnedders watches jgraham get entagled in the balloon and float up and away
  407. # [22:29] * Ms2ger gets his crossbow
  408. # [22:29] * jacobolu_ is now known as jacobolus
  409. # [22:30] <gsnedders> Ms2ger: Trying to harm the opposition by making me have to work in the same room as that guy?
  410. # [22:30] * jgraham gets out his bra-ket notation
  411. # [22:31] <gsnedders> Well, for the occasions when I'm in Lkpg :P
  412. # [22:31] <Ms2ger> You're a student. What do you mean, work?
  413. # [22:32] <gsnedders> Ms2ger: I work part-time for Opera. And when I work in an office, I tend to work in the same room as jgraham.
  414. # [22:34] <jgraham> Are you saying that when you go to the other offices you don't work?
  415. # [22:36] * Joins: cooto (~Adium@pc-246-246-120-200.cm.vtr.net)
  416. # [22:36] <gsnedders> jgraham: What do you think they do in Göteborg if not play Quake 3?
  417. # [22:36] * Quits: cooto (~Adium@pc-246-246-120-200.cm.vtr.net) (Client Quit)
  418. # [22:37] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@91.181.45.131) (Quit: nn)
  419. # [22:38] * Quits: tw2113 (~tw2113@fedora/tw2113) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  420. # [22:42] * Joins: michaeln (~michaeln@nat/google/x-hdurowwigfkqnbwe)
  421. # [22:48] * Joins: alrra (592f527d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.47.82.125)
  422. # [22:58] * Quits: davidwalsh (~davidwals@75-135-74-55.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Quit: Reading http://davidwalsh.name)
  423. # [23:06] * Quits: alrra (592f527d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.47.82.125) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  424. # [23:07] * Quits: FireFly (~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly) (Quit: swatted to death)
  425. # [23:09] * Quits: Stikki (~lordstich@dsl-pribrasgw1-ff17c300-80.dhcp.inet.fi) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  426. # [23:12] * Quits: michaeln (~michaeln@nat/google/x-hdurowwigfkqnbwe) (Quit: Leaving.)
  427. # [23:13] * Quits: Martijnc (~Martijnc@91.176.64.112) (Quit: Martijnc)
  428. # [23:14] * Joins: Stikki (~lordstich@dsl-pribrasgw1-ff17c300-80.dhcp.inet.fi)
  429. # [23:16] <smaug____> (Stikki did sound immediately someone from Finland, even before noticing the domain ;) )
  430. # [23:23] * Joins: nimbupani (~Adium@c-24-18-47-160.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
  431. # [23:40] * Joins: troma (troma@AMontpellier-551-1-126-249.w90-9.abo.wanadoo.fr)
  432. # [23:41] * Quits: troma (troma@AMontpellier-551-1-126-249.w90-9.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Client Quit)
  433. # [23:49] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-43-115.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  434. # Session Close: Sun Mar 20 00:00:00 2011

The end :)