/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2013-11-13 / end

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  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
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  52. # [01:50] <jamesr__> what happens when you assign 1.9 to an IDL attribute of type 'unsigned long' ?
  53. # [01:51] <jamesr__> ah it floors
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  83. # [02:33] <sangwhan__> Any good ideas for the TTWF submissions that don't get follow up work for the review comments? Give it a deadline and drop review?
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  88. # [02:40] <jgraham> sangwhan__: Depends how useful the test is. If it's basically not that useful just drop it after a while. If it is useful then grab the code and fix it up yourself
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  95. # [02:45] <sangwhan__> sangwhan__: Some of them do fill in blanks in coverage, while not being awfully great so someone needs to sit down and fix it up
  96. # [02:45] <sangwhan__> jgraham: ^
  97. # [02:45] * sangwhan__ needs coffee, brain not working
  98. # [02:46] <jgraham> heh
  99. # [02:46] <jgraham> Yeah. In that case "fork" the contribution and fix it up
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  101. # [02:46] <jgraham> It is a weakness of gh that you can't do that directly
  102. # [02:48] <sangwhan__> Yes, that aspect of GH seems a bit odd. Would have loved to have r/branchname that I could just pull and continue the work (won't say where I saw this)
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  107. # [02:53] <jgraham> :-o
  108. # [02:54] <jgraham> sangwhan__: Yeah :) You *can* get the code with gh, but not push back
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  115. # [03:00] <sangwhan__> Since we use GH's pull mechanism that's a primitive merge i assume we don't/can't use FnT?
  116. # [03:01] <sangwhan__> s/'s/s/
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  157. # [03:46] <jgraham> sangwhan__: What's FnT?
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  159. # [03:47] <sangwhan__> jgraham: fiddle and tweak
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  165. # [03:53] <sangwhan__> jgraham: https://github.com/jensl/FiddleAndTweak
  166. # [03:56] <jgraham> ah
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  168. # [03:57] <jgraham> Can't use that because a) we can't use extensions and b) the critic repo isn't the repo of record
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  170. # [03:57] <jgraham> (it won't interact well with the branch tracking)
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  183. # [04:19] <sangwhan__> Don't think there is a nice way to make that work with GH, yes
  184. # [04:20] <zcorpan_> TabAtkins: IE5-era browsers supported <style>. you need to go back further
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  198. # [04:35] <TabAtkins> zcorpan: Oh jeez.
  199. # [04:35] <TabAtkins> I remember cargo-culting that shit when I started, during IE6.
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  206. # [04:46] <Hixie_> thank you to all the w3cmemes posters for making me more sure than ever that not going to tpac was the right move
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  209. # [04:54] <annevk-cloud> "'I think we can all agree' is the new 'fuck off'" <3
  210. # [04:55] <a-ja> recall a fairly recent change to svg fonts that'd affect acid3?
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  215. # [05:07] <a-ja> N/M....just my bad memory
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  222. # [05:29] <cwilso> zcorpan: IE_3_ supported <style>.
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  226. # [05:48] <masatakayakura> annevk-cloud: Natasha is looking for you to ask whether your Fetch session and her offline web ones can merge
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  279. # [07:29] <zcorpan> cwilso: yeah
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  402. # [11:15] <hober> surely the folks slaving away in shenzhen's meme factory are unsung heroes jeff should be thanking
  403. # [11:16] <darobin> hober: that was a comment for #tpac-chat :)
  404. # [11:16] <hober> no it wasn't
  405. # [11:16] <darobin> yes it was :)
  406. # [11:18] <Ms2ger> TabAtkins, is there a CSS2.1 draft with errata somewhere public?
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  408. # [11:22] * Ms2ger wonders what MikeSmith is testing on his th.js PR
  409. # [11:23] <MikeSmith> did I make a th.js PR?
  410. # [11:24] <MikeSmith> I think the Chinese army hackers have comprised my machine
  411. # [11:24] <MikeSmith> so maybe now they're starting to send PRs from my github account
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  429. # [12:26] <Ms2ger> Oh, here I thought I'd actually stumbled on a site that used xhtml
  430. # [12:26] <Ms2ger> Turns out that the extension was .xhtml, but HTTP said text/html; charset=UTF-8
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  439. # [12:53] <hsivonen> It's ridiculous how hard it is to plug the replacement encoding into an existing browser in a secure way without regressing stuff
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  441. # [12:54] <hsivonen> leaving old security problems remain would be so much easier than fixing them
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  446. # [13:01] <hsivonen> part of my problem is that I foresee too many bugs and try to fix them right away
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  453. # [13:08] <hsivonen> annevk-cloud: do we want the replacement encoding to inherit into iframes that are inserted using DOM APIs and show same-origin content?
  454. # [13:08] <hsivonen> annevk-cloud: if yes, why? if no, why?
  455. # [13:09] <hsivonen> (currently, "no" comes naturally)
  456. # [13:09] <hsivonen> (because the test for "doesn't participate in inheritance" and the test for "can't be overridden from menu" are the same)
  457. # [13:10] <hsivonen> though in principle, "yes" might be more secure
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  464. # [13:28] <annevk-cloud> Dunno :/
  465. # [13:29] <hsivonen> currently, it looks like this is the last thing I need to deal with before this replacement thing is ready for review
  466. # [13:29] <hsivonen> this took a lot more work than I expected
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  470. # [13:33] <hsivonen> annevk-cloud: the encoding menu is IE11 is interesting
  471. # [13:33] <hsivonen> 1) It has some DOS encodings that we removed
  472. # [13:33] <hsivonen> 2) It doesn't have ISO-2022-JP
  473. # [13:33] <hsivonen> 3) It doesn't have gbk (GB18030 only)
  474. # [13:33] <hsivonen> 4) It has HZ
  475. # [13:34] <hsivonen> oops sorry. it does have gbk under the other name
  476. # [13:34] <hsivonen> the items move when used!
  477. # [13:35] <hsivonen> 5) It doesn't have some ISO encodings that we retained
  478. # [13:37] <gsnedders> For 5) does it have equiv. Windows codespace encodings?
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  480. # [13:37] <hsivonen> gsnedders: they don't map 1-to-1
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  482. # [13:38] <hsivonen> gsnedders: there are no Windows code page specific to Celtic, Nordic or Romanian
  483. # [13:38] <hsivonen> Windows Central European covers also Romanian
  484. # [13:39] <hsivonen> kudos to MS for burying the ISO-8859-* encodings that were introduced after UTF-8
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  487. # [13:45] <hsivonen> the ISO > 11 situation is totally 927 :-(
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  499. # [13:58] <hsivonen> context for http://w3cmemes.tumblr.com/post/66860522018/jeff-jaffe-tells-robin-berjon-how-it-is ?
  500. # [13:59] <hsivonen> no new w3tmemes during TPAC :-/
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  520. # [14:45] <hsivonen> hmm. Chromium doesn't have Mac & DOS Cyrillic encodings in the menu
  521. # [14:45] <hsivonen> I wonder if they are still supported
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  539. # [15:05] <Jasper> Does anything support https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ime-api/raw-file/default/Overview.html yet? I'm not sure of the status of it.
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  549. # [15:28] <beverloo> annevk-cloud, ping
  550. # [15:28] <beverloo> annevk-cloud, where do I post comments about the notification api? whatwg or w3c list?
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  558. # [15:44] <annevk-cloud> beverloo: whatwg is fine
  559. # [15:44] <beverloo> ok, ty
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  569. # [15:59] <MikeSmith> Jasper: the IME API is not implemented yet
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  572. # [16:04] <SteveF> hey mikey saw you got my billet doux
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  574. # [16:05] <MikeSmith> heh
  575. # [16:05] <MikeSmith> yeah
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  578. # [16:10] <GPHemsley> hmm... apparently Gmail doesn't care that I start my e-mail address name with a quotation mark, it splits at the comma anyway
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  590. # [16:34] <gsnedders> GPHemsley: Comply with the spec? What does this mean?
  591. # [16:34] <GPHemsley> hmm?
  592. # [16:34] <gsnedders> GPHemsley: wrt Gmail and quotation marks
  593. # [16:34] <GPHemsley> oh
  594. # [16:35] <GPHemsley> If I type `"John Doe,`, Gmail thinks I'm moving on to the next e-mail address
  595. # [16:35] <GPHemsley> when in reality I was going to type `"John Doe, M.D." <jdoe@example.com>`
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  642. # [17:54] <dglazkov> good morning, Whatwg!
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  665. # [18:35] <Hixie_> so...
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  667. # [18:36] <Hixie_> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=22628
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  670. # [18:37] <Hixie_> if you have multiple BroadcastChannel objects in your Document
  671. # [18:37] <Hixie_> should they all get messages in one task, or separate tasks?
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  697. # [19:09] <matjas> annevk-cloud: some background regarding that tweet: https://github.com/jwerle/url.h/issues/2#issuecomment-28224435
  698. # [19:09] <matjas> annevk-cloud: is there a wiki/list of URL-spec-compliant implementations? if not, there should be
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  700. # [19:11] <matjas> you could enable GH’s Wiki feature on https://github.com/whatwg/url/settings
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  740. # [20:04] <Hixie_> man, you omit one "=" sign between an attribute name and an attribute value, and validator.nu gives you 6 error messages
  741. # [20:04] * Hixie_ adds the "=" sign, feeling suitably chastised
  742. # [20:04] <GPHemsley> ^_^
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  745. # [20:08] <matjas> dglazkov: you’re getting better at this. that single capital ‘W’ really hurt
  746. # [20:08] <Ms2ger> Hixie_, I suspect that's your fault ;)
  747. # [20:09] <Hixie_> spec only says you have to give one error message :-)
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  756. # [20:34] <Hixie_> i'm amused as to how similar the spec path is to mozilla's patch for https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23040 (i looked at the patch after writing mine)
  757. # [20:35] <marcosc> So, I can't find anyone by Microsoft supporting meta "application-name"
  758. # [20:35] <marcosc> s/by/but
  759. # [20:35] <marcosc> but it has quite a bit of usage thanks to Microsoft
  760. # [20:36] <marcosc> it always appears above "msapplication-tooltip" and "msapplication-starturl"
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  786. # [21:00] <marcosc> hmm... is there no <link rel=first>?
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  788. # [21:08] <Hixie_> marcosc: what would it do?
  789. # [21:09] <marcosc> Hixie_: I'm looking for an equivalent to Microsoft's "msapplication-starturl"... which points to the place where the author wants the end-user to end up when a page is bookmarked
  790. # [21:09] <marcosc> well, not quite bookmarked... they use some other terminology... pinned or something
  791. # [21:10] <marcosc> so, when you pin a site, you then click on it, and it takes you to some path... that's what I've gathered so far
  792. # [21:10] <marcosc> (don't actually have a windows box to test on)
  793. # [21:11] <marcosc> Hixie_: I'm trying to build up a coherent story for how "add to homescreen" could work with bits of HTML5
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  795. # [21:11] <marcosc> argh.. HTML, I mean
  796. # [21:11] <Hixie_> ah
  797. # [21:11] <Hixie_> rel=canonical?
  798. # [21:11] <marcosc> ugly, but could work :)
  799. # [21:11] <Hixie_> why ugly?
  800. # [21:12] <marcosc> canonical hard to spell
  801. # [21:12] <marcosc> strange word
  802. # [21:12] <Hixie_> oh well i didn't invent it
  803. # [21:12] <Hixie_> i mean the actual rel=canonical that exists
  804. # [21:12] <marcosc> yeah, wasn't blaming anyone
  805. # [21:12] <marcosc> let me see how often it comes up
  806. # [21:12] <Hixie_> not really clear to me why you'd want to pin something other than what the user said to pin, though
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  808. # [21:13] <Domenic_> Hixie_: if I am at http://warmupreps.com/#starting-strength-squats and click "pin to home" I actually want to pin http://warmupreps.com/ or maybe http://warmupreps.com/#starting-strength
  809. # [21:14] <marcosc> Hixie_: no idea either
  810. # [21:14] <Domenic_> (this is actually a real life thing that happened to me.)
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  812. # [21:14] <Hixie_> Domenic_: what if you want http://warmupreps.com/#starting-strength-squats ?
  813. # [21:15] <Hixie_> i mean, it seems reasonable to tell the user to pin what they want to pin...
  814. # [21:15] <Domenic_> Hixie_: I never want that. I want a complete workout, not a single page.
  815. # [21:16] <Domenic_> I guess part of the issue is that phone apps usually have very little on a single screen
  816. # [21:16] <Domenic_> E.g. even though the conceptual unit is the workout, you only display a single exercise per screen
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  818. # [21:16] <Hixie_> marcosc: rel=home seems better than rel=canonical actually http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-home
  819. # [21:17] <marcosc> canonical seems to have quite a bit of usage
  820. # [21:17] <marcosc> will check rel=home too
  821. # [21:18] <Hixie_> rel=canonical is more for saying "http://warmupreps.com/?#starting-strength-squats should be http://warmupreps.com/#starting-strength-squats"
  822. # [21:18] <Domenic_> canonical has something to do with googlejuice
  823. # [21:18] <Hixie_> rel=home is more what you want here i think, per that wiki page
  824. # [21:18] <Domenic_> e.g. http://www.domenic.me/ should be http://domenic.me/ is a common usage.
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  831. # [21:28] <Hixie_> so... mutation events. anyone dropped them yet? can i start dropping the spec text about them? what's the story? https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23036
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  842. # [21:49] <Hixie_> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23359 any opinions on how history.back() should act if it's called on the History object of a non-active document?
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  863. # [22:57] <marcosc> Hixie_: yeah, rel=home is what I want indeed. Thanks for the pointer
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  871. # [23:03] <Hixie_> anyone able to translate https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23387 for me?
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  875. # [23:05] <Hixie_> wow, someone should send http://wiki.akosma.com/IPhone_URL_Schemes to the IETF
  876. # [23:05] <Hixie_> send a first-aid crew with it, though, in case people have heart attacks or something
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  887. # [23:15] <aklein> Hixie_: I don't think anyone's dropped them yet (I know Blink hasn't), but I don't know if that means you need to continue to spec them. annevk hasn't bothered to say anything about them in DOM
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  891. # [23:19] <Hixie_> are we expecting them to ever be dropped?
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  894. # [23:22] <aklein> Hixie_: hopefully? we do measure their usage in Blink, and some of them (DOMNodeInserted and DOMSubtreeModified, I think) have enough usage that we're not yet comfortable dropping support.
  895. # [23:23] <Hixie_> if you're not comfortable dropping support, why are we comfortable not speccing them? :-)
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  897. # [23:24] <aklein> that sounds like a good question for Anne :)
  898. # [23:26] <aklein> I'm actually surprised Gecko hasn't tried dropping support, they tend to be less conservative about this stuff
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  901. # [23:26] <mrbkap> dglazkov: ping?
  902. # [23:27] <dglazkov> mrbkap: pong!
  903. # [23:27] <dglazkov> about to run to a meeting
  904. # [23:27] <dglazkov> will be available in an hour?
  905. # [23:27] <mrbkap> dglazkov: sounds good.
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  916. # [23:43] <annevk-cloud> Hixie_: nobody has declared a loss yet and people do not want them specified until then
  917. # [23:44] <annevk-cloud> matjas: how about using the WHATWG wiki?
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  922. # [23:51] <Hixie_> heycam|away: ping https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23744
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  925. # [23:55] <bholley> Hixie_: any thoughts on how to more effectively poke abarth to move the security discussion along?
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The end :)