/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2014-02-14 / end

Options:

# Session Start: Fri Feb 14 00:00:00 2014
# Session Ident: #whatwg
# [00:00] * Quits: totsinaprops (~totsinapr@gateway/tor-sasl/totsinaprops) (Quit: totsinaprops)
# [00:09] <Hixie> so... is there a spec that has a "must" for firing key-related events?
# [00:12] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
# [00:12] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
# [00:12] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [00:12] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
# [00:15] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
# [00:16] <jamesr__> is there a spec that has even a "should" for firing key events?
# [00:16] <jamesr__> afaik nobody even tries
# [00:16] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [00:17] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
# [00:18] * jorendorff is now known as jorendorff_away
# [00:20] * Quits: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [00:20] <Hixie> yeah, that's what i feared
# [00:20] <Hixie> i'm speccing where the events should go, fwiw
# [00:20] <Hixie> but not which ones they should be!
# [00:23] * Joins: seventh (seventh@185.29.164.175)
# [00:24] * Quits: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [00:29] * Joins: say2joe (~say2joe@209-253-225-97.ip.mcleodusa.net)
# [00:30] <TabAtkins> Hixie: Any clue why <dfn>s can't be nested?
# [00:30] <Hixie> what would it mean?
# [00:30] <TabAtkins> ...two <dfn>s?
# [00:30] <TabAtkins> I have an example of it in my spec, and the validator's flagging it. :/
# [00:31] <Hixie> paste the example here?
# [00:31] <Hixie> it's invalid because i had never seen a use case for it and it seemed likely to be an unintentional mistake
# [00:31] <Hixie> but if there's valid use cases, it can be valid
# [00:31] * Quits: say2joe1 (~say2joe@209-253-225-97.ip.mcleodusa.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [00:31] <TabAtkins> http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css-font-loading/#dom-fontface-fontface
# [00:31] <Hixie> (wouldn't it be really confusing to the user?)
# [00:31] * Hixie looks
# [00:32] <TabAtkins> The Constructor function is <dfn>d, but so are the arguments to the function.
# [00:32] * Joins: shannonmoeller (~shannonmo@pool-108-17-8-225.bflony.fios.verizon.net)
# [00:32] <Hixie> why are the arguments <dfn>ed? that doesn't give the definition of the arguments
# [00:33] <Hixie> that's very confusing
# [00:33] <Hixie> with the multiple #-links showing up and all
# [00:33] <Hixie> i can't tell what's actually being defined
# [00:33] <Hixie> (as a side note, you have a method called Constructor()?)
# [00:33] <TabAtkins> The arguments don't have an independent definition. That's the best place to put it.
# [00:34] <TabAtkins> No, it's the constructor itself.
# [00:34] <Hixie> i wouldn't bother <dfn>ing the arguments at all
# [00:34] <TabAtkins> those are called Constructor in webidl.
# [00:34] <Hixie> ah ok. s/method/constructor/ then probably
# [00:34] <TabAtkins> That's cool, but Bikeshed's data model includes it, which lets me link directly to those arguments.
# [00:34] <TabAtkins> And distinguish each use from other argumetns of the same name.
# [00:34] <Hixie> (also, the constructor has a name (the interface name), so s/Constructor/whateveritsnameis/)
# [00:35] * Quits: jcgregorio_ (~jcgregori@108-192-129-122.lightspeed.rlghnc.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [00:35] <TabAtkins> All right, sure.
# [00:35] <Hixie> i guess if i had to do this, i'd put the <dfn> for the constructor around its name, then put the arguments after it, much like i do in the domintro blocks
# [00:36] <Hixie> as in, <code><dfn>MyFoo</dfn>(DOMString <dfn>arg</dfn>)</code>
# [00:36] <TabAtkins> But why?
# [00:36] <Hixie> that would make it clearer what the terms were
# [00:36] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [00:36] <TabAtkins> If I don't have separatley-defined arguments, I'd definitely do <dfn>foo()</dfn>
# [00:37] <Hixie> i mean, the constructor isn't called "Constructor(DOMString family)", it's called "Constructor" (or actually, "FontFace")
# [00:37] <TabAtkins> That's a notation convention, not an absolute fact.
# [00:37] <Hixie> (another side note, clicking FontFace in the IDL takes me to a 404)
# [00:37] <TabAtkins> In prose, I usually write them as foo().
# [00:38] <Hixie> i agree
# [00:38] <TabAtkins> Yeah, that 404 is temporary - I just moved some things.
# [00:38] <Hixie> what i tend to do these days is actually not duplicate the arguments there
# [00:38] <Hixie> i just leave them in the IDL and don't bother in the prose
# [00:38] <Hixie> and i refer to them as foo()
# [00:38] <Hixie> (methods and constructors)
# [00:39] <Hixie> mostly i started doing that because it got really hard to write the prose with optional arguments and overloads and so on otherwise
# [00:39] <Hixie> note that the argument names are arbitrary, which would be another reason <dfn> would be inappropriate for them
# [00:39] <Hixie> since you're not really defining that term per se
# [00:40] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
# [00:40] * Joins: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.144.53)
# [00:40] <Hixie> i mean, it's a "local" definition, i guess, for the sake of the following prose
# [00:40] <Hixie> but to the reader it's a bit confusing to have a <dfn>-level definition for that, imho
# [00:40] <Hixie> makes them seem more formally defined than they relaly are
# [00:40] <Hixie> really
# [00:41] <TabAtkins> Arguments do have defined names.
# [00:41] <TabAtkins> You can't see that when calling, but that doesnt' change the fact that they're defined.
# [00:42] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [00:42] <TabAtkins> One thing that might be confusing you is that your publishing pipeline only has global definitions.
# [00:43] * jonlee_|afk is now known as jonlee_
# [00:43] <TabAtkins> Bikeshed's definition data model has nesting relationships - this is defining the "family" argument for the "FontFace()" method of the "FontFace" interface.
# [00:43] * Joins: Streusel_ (~Anonymous@S01061859334846a2.vc.shawcable.net)
# [00:43] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@2001:648:2ffc:1225:a800:ff:fe12:113e) (Excess Flood)
# [00:44] <Hixie> i'm not confused :-)
# [00:44] <Hixie> argument names to IDL-defined methods and constructors are arbitrary, they're just a spec editing help
# [00:44] <Hixie> you could name them all arg1, arg2, arg3, etc and it wouldn't change anything normatively detectable
# [00:45] <Hixie> s/normatively/black-box/
# [00:45] <TabAtkins> They're 'arbitrary' in the same sense that every term in every spec is arbitrary.
# [00:45] <Hixie> right
# [00:45] <Hixie> as opposed to the method name, which isn't arbitrary, say
# [00:45] <Hixie> anyway that's a side issue
# [00:45] <TabAtkins> Exactly. ^_^
# [00:46] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
# [00:46] <Hixie> as far as <dfn> goes, the point is just that it's confusing to users to have nested <dfn>s. to put it as you might put it: "one thing that might be confusing you is that bikeshed's data model has nesting relationships"
# [00:46] <Hixie> whereas people don't tend to think that way
# [00:46] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [00:46] <TabAtkins> ...yes they do.
# [00:46] <TabAtkins> A given "auto" value belongs to a particular property.
# [00:47] <TabAtkins> That's nesting.
# [00:47] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
# [00:47] <TabAtkins> There are like 30 different definitions (or more) of "auto" in CSS.
# [00:47] <Hixie> it's a hierarchy, sure
# [00:47] <Hixie> "nesting" implies more than hierarchy though
# [00:47] <Hixie> it implies scoping
# [00:47] <TabAtkins> I'm implying hiearchy.
# [00:48] <TabAtkins> ...never mind. Let's not have random semantic debates, because they aren't winnable by either side.
# [00:48] <Hixie> k
# [00:48] <TabAtkins> Back to the question - I provided a valid use of nested definition.
# [00:48] <TabAtkins> nested <dfn>s, rather.
# [00:48] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [00:48] <Hixie> whether it's valid or not depends entirely on the semantic debate we were having
# [00:48] * Joins: jcgregorio_ (jcgregorio@nat/google/x-pxqtnfhrfxsnolzr)
# [00:49] <Hixie> imho it's not valid, it's obviously confusing to the reader and is semantically wrong in that the term you're defining doesn't include the other term.
# [00:49] <Hixie> and, the other term probably shouldn't be <dfn>-defined anyway because it's arbitrary and local to that algorithm.
# [00:49] * Quits: shannonmoeller (~shannonmo@pool-108-17-8-225.bflony.fios.verizon.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [00:49] <TabAtkins> Only if you're inferring something weird. A <dfn> is just a <dfn>. The fact that, in this case, the inner definitions are nested in the outer definition, mirroring the markup structure, is irrelevant.
# [00:50] * Joins: shannonmoeller (~shannonmo@pool-108-17-8-225.bflony.fios.verizon.net)
# [00:50] * Quits: shannonmoeller (~shannonmo@pool-108-17-8-225.bflony.fios.verizon.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [00:50] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [00:50] <TabAtkins> The inner <dfn>s don't change meaning just because there's another <dfn> wrapped around them. The outer <dfn> treats every other inline contained within it neutrally; there doesn't seem to be any reason why it should treat a contained <dfn> differently
# [00:50] * Quits: shi (~decotii@hq.croscon.com) (Quit: Leaving)
# [00:51] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [00:51] <Hixie> i do not disagree with what you are saying, but what you're saying is orthogonal to the problems i described.
# [00:51] <TabAtkins> You're using "arbitrary" as a synonym for "not web-exposed". That's not a useful definition when we're discussing spec definition models.
# [00:51] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102)
# [00:51] <Hixie> no, i mean "arbitrary" as in "the name doesn't matter"
# [00:52] <TabAtkins> Yes, but saying "this definition is arbitrary, thus it shouldn't be <dfn>'d" is wrong.
# [00:52] <TabAtkins> Important terms in specs are <dfn>'d all the time.
# [00:52] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [00:53] <TabAtkins> If you're just saying that you don't think *method arguments* are sufficiently useful to justify <dfn>ing, that's a cool opinion, but I differ in it.
# [00:53] <TabAtkins> And it's irrelevant here.
# [00:53] <Hixie> i think i could be convinced that <dfn>-defining arguments to algorithms before the algorithm is defensible, but if one did do that, i do not think doing it via nested <dfn> would be a good way to do it.
# [00:54] <TabAtkins> In many cases you wouldn't. In a case like what I'm showing you, you do, because that's the syntactic convention I've adopted for defining methods.
# [00:54] <Hixie> sure. we're debating the relative worthiness of that convention.
# [00:55] <TabAtkins> Well, we're debating whether it's sufficiently incorrect as to be worth making *invalid*.
# [00:56] <Hixie> right, i'm arguing it's confusing to the reader, semantically dubious since the names involved aren't really the ones you're marking up, and doesn't justify making validators no longer flag (likely accidentally) nested <dfn>s
# [00:56] <TabAtkins> Your "confusing to the reader" argument is based on the simplistic styling conventions I'm currently using to provide permalinks to <dfn>s.
# [00:56] <Hixie> seriously, i find that presentation really confusing.
# [00:56] <TabAtkins> A different styling would negate your argument; it's not generally valid.
# [00:57] <Hixie> the whole thing is bold italics, and as i hover over it i get permalinks that and i can't work out what they're for
# [00:57] * Joins: jdaggett (~jdaggett@61-121-216-2.bitcat.net)
# [00:57] <Hixie> it's not helpful to define the term but not show what the term is
# [00:57] <TabAtkins> That's cool, *but it's an argument against my current simplistic styling, not the markup*.
# [00:57] <Hixie> no, whether it's confusing or not has to be determined in the absence of any styling.
# [00:58] <Hixie> it'd be much clearer if they were sibling elements
# [00:58] <TabAtkins> The "definition" of the family argument is "family is an argument to the FontFace function", which is implicit in the text it's embedded in.
# [00:58] <Hixie> with punctuation between them
# [00:58] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135) (Quit: weinig)
# [00:58] <TabAtkins> ???
# [00:58] <Hixie> as in, <code><dfn>FontFace</dfn>(DOMString <dfn>family</dfn>, ...)</code> like i suggested earlier
# [00:59] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.216.108) (Quit: othermaciej)
# [00:59] <TabAtkins> You're trying to argue that <dfn>FontFace</dfn>() is, in general, better than <dfn>FontFace()</dfn>?
# [00:59] <Hixie> no, i'm arguing it's better if you also want to <dfn> the arguments.
# [01:00] <Hixie> in the no-argument case i think it's a wash
# [01:00] * Joins: ap_ (~ap@17.114.219.4)
# [01:00] <TabAtkins> So you're arguing that I should change the markup of a function definition based on whether or not I'm defining other things vaguely related to it?
# [01:00] <Hixie> (you could argue it either way, i mean, it's common to think of the method as "foo()", but really it's called "foo")
# [01:00] <TabAtkins> And that it's important enough that it should be considered invalid to not do that?
# [01:00] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:9103:f301:1cc4:3b9e) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [01:00] * ap_ is now known as ap
# [01:00] <Hixie> i'd recommend being consistent throughout, personally
# [01:01] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [01:01] * Quits: shepazu (~shepazu@108-70-132-46.lightspeed.rlghnc.sbcglobal.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [01:01] <Hixie> i do think the confusion resulting from nesting <dfn>s like this is important enough that it should be considered invalid, yes, based on this example at least
# [01:02] * Quits: Streusel_ (~Anonymous@S01061859334846a2.vc.shawcable.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
# [01:02] * Joins: shepazu (~shepazu@108-70-132-46.lightspeed.rlghnc.sbcglobal.net)
# [01:02] <Hixie> (gotta go, mtg)
# [01:02] <TabAtkins> Ignoring the permalinks, you wouldn't be confused in the slightest.
# [01:02] <TabAtkins> The permalinks are something I added myself - they are completely unconnected to the example.
# [01:02] <Hixie> (ignoring the permalinks, i'd be completely unaware of the inner <dfn>s, meaning they'd be pointless)
# [01:02] <Hixie> (afk)
# [01:02] <TabAtkins> They're link targets!
# [01:02] <zewt_> hixie plays magic the gathering
# [01:03] * zewt_ is now known as zewt
# [01:03] <TabAtkins> ...and?
# [01:03] <TabAtkins> Ah, mtg
# [01:03] <TabAtkins> Okay.
# [01:05] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135)
# [01:06] * Quits: wirepair (fbi@random.supermario.org) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [01:06] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [01:06] * jonlee_ is now known as jonlee_|afk
# [01:06] * Quits: JosephSilber (~Joseph@ool-44c3e80a.static.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [01:07] * Joins: wirepair (~x@random.supermario.org)
# [01:11] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [01:11] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [01:14] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.216.108)
# [01:14] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: sicking)
# [01:14] * jonlee_|afk is now known as jonlee_
# [01:14] <jamesr__> TabAtkins: you're setting a bad example for all the kids reading public-webapps. tsk tsk
# [01:15] <TabAtkins> Urgh, now I have to either add more explicit metadata to the nested argument definitions and type links, or add a dummy <span> around the whole thing solely to move the metadata args to.
# [01:16] * Quits: wirepair (~x@random.supermario.org) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [01:16] * Joins: wirepair (~x@random.supermario.org)
# [01:17] <zewt> the shitty attempts at moderation are the most common thing that make me consider unsubscribing from that list; they're always much more unpleasant than anything they're in response to
# [01:21] * Quits: wirepair (~x@random.supermario.org) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [01:22] * Joins: wirepair (fbi@206.223.224.3)
# [01:22] * Quits: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@66-194-1-26.STATIC.twtelecom.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [01:23] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [01:24] * Quits: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.144.53) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [01:24] * jonlee_ is now known as jonlee_|afk
# [01:25] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134) (Quit: sys.exit(0) # computer went to sleep)
# [01:27] * Quits: wirepair (fbi@206.223.224.3) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [01:27] * Joins: wirepair (~x@206.223.224.3)
# [01:29] * Joins: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134)
# [01:32] * Joins: sgalineau (~sylvaing@192.150.10.204)
# [01:36] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [01:40] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [01:42] * Quits: [[zz]] (~zz]]@node-1952.pool-101-109.dynamic.totbb.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [01:43] * Joins: [[zz]] (~zz]]@node-izf.pool-101-108.dynamic.totbb.net)
# [01:47] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
# [01:49] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [01:50] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
# [01:53] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [01:56] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
# [01:57] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
# [01:58] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.216.108) (Quit: othermaciej)
# [02:00] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [02:00] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.216.108)
# [02:05] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [02:07] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:09] * Quits: 18WAFR5MG (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-yhqgzljwksiguxcf) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:10] * Joins: scrollback (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-uuunqagducggkbay)
# [02:10] * Quits: jorgepedret (~jorgepedr@64-46-23-103.dyn.novuscom.net) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [02:12] * Quits: scrollback (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-uuunqagducggkbay) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [02:12] * Joins: jernoble (~jernoble@76.74.153.41)
# [02:13] * Joins: 92AAAE2HI (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-dvvizrxtdqpvnrsc)
# [02:13] * Quits: 92AAAE2HI (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-dvvizrxtdqpvnrsc) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:14] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135)
# [02:15] * Joins: 92AAAE2H4 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-oibhwwnuzsigmbht)
# [02:16] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:17] * Quits: sgalineau (~sylvaing@192.150.10.204) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
# [02:18] * Quits: 92AAAE2H4 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-oibhwwnuzsigmbht) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:19] * Joins: 16WAAO8JQ (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-tmeqjsgxajrboota)
# [02:21] * Quits: 16WAAO8JQ (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-tmeqjsgxajrboota) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [02:21] * Joins: 92AAAE2KV (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-tkkwfkbreyillftl)
# [02:25] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
# [02:25] * Joins: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be)
# [02:28] * Quits: ap (~ap@17.114.219.4) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [02:29] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:7851:ff38:96d3:4163)
# [02:29] * Quits: llkats (~llkats@206.169.83.230) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:30] * Quits: seventh (seventh@185.29.164.175) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [02:30] * Quits: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [02:31] * Quits: danielwrobert (~Adium@wsip-68-15-24-46.sd.sd.cox.net) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [02:31] * Quits: 92AAAE2KV (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-tkkwfkbreyillftl) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:32] * Joins: 36DACHZFE (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-stvgzxzlwiiwytnn)
# [02:34] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
# [02:35] * Quits: 36DACHZFE (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-stvgzxzlwiiwytnn) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:35] * Joins: 77CABGL7I (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-yjuftuxxckicdwqd)
# [02:38] * heycam is now known as heycam|away
# [02:39] * Quits: say2joe (~say2joe@209-253-225-97.ip.mcleodusa.net) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [02:42] * Quits: 77CABGL7I (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-yjuftuxxckicdwqd) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:44] * Joins: 36DACHZLG (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-eskjkuuzehaojbhp)
# [02:45] * Quits: 36DACHZLG (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-eskjkuuzehaojbhp) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:46] * Joins: 36DACHZMD (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-gavrsabmzbfaidey)
# [02:46] * Quits: 36DACHZMD (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-gavrsabmzbfaidey) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:47] * Joins: 16WAAO8V0 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-ynvecfrpqwhgotmu)
# [02:49] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@75-144-246-6-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
# [02:49] * Quits: 16WAAO8V0 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-ynvecfrpqwhgotmu) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:49] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [02:49] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [02:50] * Joins: 20WAA7Z5Y (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-warhovwmqqkzzyne)
# [02:53] * Quits: 20WAA7Z5Y (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-warhovwmqqkzzyne) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:54] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135) (Quit: weinig)
# [02:54] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Read error: Operation timed out)
# [02:54] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [02:54] * Joins: 18WAFR9IP (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-laokyohsefrvwbch)
# [02:56] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:7851:ff38:96d3:4163) (Quit: ap)
# [02:56] * Quits: 18WAFR9IP (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-laokyohsefrvwbch) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:57] * Quits: beowulf (~sstewart@host109-158-229-141.range109-158.btcentralplus.com) (Quit: Lost terminal)
# [02:57] * Joins: hoobdeebla (~hoobdeebl@ip70-190-42-239.ph.ph.cox.net)
# [02:58] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [02:58] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135)
# [02:59] * Joins: 77CABGMI9 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-clbijmrlqqmutifo)
# [02:59] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [03:01] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
# [03:02] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134) (Quit: sys.exit(0) # computer went to sleep)
# [03:11] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.114.218.135) (Quit: weinig)
# [03:13] * Quits: jernoble (~jernoble@76.74.153.41) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [03:13] * jernoble_ is now known as jernoble
# [03:13] * Quits: SamB (Sam@207-172-123-137.c3-0.upd-ubr1.trpr-upd.pa.cable.rcn.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [03:18] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [03:20] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [03:20] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: sicking)
# [03:21] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.216.108) (Quit: othermaciej)
# [03:22] * Quits: hoobdeebla (~hoobdeebl@ip70-190-42-239.ph.ph.cox.net)
# [03:24] * Joins: SamB (~SamB@2001:470:1f07:57:3486:f523:9652:9655)
# [03:26] * Quits: 77CABGMI9 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-clbijmrlqqmutifo) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [03:26] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [03:26] * Joins: 45PAAEB59 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-ajnzcmofrghscbrx)
# [03:29] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [03:29] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [03:30] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [03:30] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
# [03:33] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [03:34] * Joins: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat)
# [03:38] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [03:38] * Joins: scor (~scor@c-98-217-11-242.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
# [03:38] * Quits: scor (~scor@c-98-217-11-242.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Changing host)
# [03:38] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
# [03:38] * Quits: 45PAAEB59 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-ajnzcmofrghscbrx) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [03:39] * Joins: 18WAFR957 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-xkxxqbxbskpddjvd)
# [03:40] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Client Quit)
# [03:40] * Joins: llkats (~llkats@206.169.83.230)
# [03:45] * Quits: llkats (~llkats@206.169.83.230) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [03:48] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [03:53] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [03:55] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [03:56] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: sicking)
# [04:00] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [04:01] * Joins: JosephSilber (~Joseph@ool-44c3e80a.static.optonline.net)
# [04:01] * Joins: newtron_ (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [04:04] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [04:06] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@206-248-163-123.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [04:06] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [04:10] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
# [04:12] * Joins: deniak (~denis@35.133.122.109.rev.sfr.net)
# [04:18] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-106.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
# [04:19] * Quits: 18WAFR957 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-xkxxqbxbskpddjvd) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [04:20] * Joins: 36DACH050 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-aqphxkvytrjjarep)
# [04:24] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
# [04:25] * Joins: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be)
# [04:30] * Quits: 36DACH050 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-aqphxkvytrjjarep) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [04:30] * Quits: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [04:30] * Joins: 20WAA71NW (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-fikamkrpfhshcdam)
# [04:43] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [04:43] * Quits: cabanier (sid15093@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-orkwvyzcspevohwe) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
# [04:43] * Joins: filR (~textual@202.171.180.162)
# [04:44] * Joins: cabanier (sid15093@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zakgqywgjbbeahdo)
# [04:44] * Quits: kochi1 (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
# [04:45] * Quits: kochi (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
# [04:45] * Joins: kochi (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82)
# [04:46] * Joins: kochi1 (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82)
# [04:47] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [04:47] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [04:52] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [04:56] * Joins: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@199-241-200-45.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net)
# [04:57] * Quits: jernoble (~jernoble@17.202.46.221) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [04:59] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [05:00] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [05:02] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [05:04] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [05:05] * Joins: bzalasky (~bzalasky@c-67-188-211-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [05:06] * Quits: benvie (~bbenvie@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [05:07] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [05:20] * Joins: benvie (~bbenvie@204.28.118.69)
# [05:20] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@75-144-246-6-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [05:24] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [05:24] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [05:28] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@116.sub-70-197-5.myvzw.com)
# [05:29] * Joins: jorgepedret (~jorgepedr@70-36-56-110.dyn.novuscom.net)
# [05:30] * Joins: lmcliste_ (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [05:33] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@116.sub-70-197-5.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
# [05:35] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [05:37] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [05:41] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [05:48] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [05:48] * Quits: Bass10_ (Bass10@c-76-113-194-7.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [05:48] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [05:53] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [05:57] * Quits: bzalasky (~bzalasky@c-67-188-211-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [05:57] * Joins: bootsWitDaFur (~Adium@cpe-172-254-104-101.nyc.res.rr.com)
# [06:00] * Parts: bootsWitDaFur (~Adium@cpe-172-254-104-101.nyc.res.rr.com)
# [06:04] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@173-228-80-252.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [06:18] * Quits: lmcliste_ (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [06:24] * Joins: jernoble (~jernoble@199-188-193-107.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net)
# [06:28] * Joins: ap (~ap@c-24-130-62-30.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [06:31] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [06:35] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [06:36] * Quits: jorgepedret (~jorgepedr@70-36-56-110.dyn.novuscom.net) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [06:36] * Joins: jernoble_ (~jernoble@17.202.46.221)
# [06:37] * Joins: jorgepedret (~jorgepedr@70-36-56-110.dyn.novuscom.net)
# [06:42] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [06:42] * Joins: niloy (~niloy@110.224.141.111)
# [06:43] * Quits: benv (~benv@38.104.194.126) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [06:47] * Quits: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@199-241-200-45.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net) (Quit: jeffreyatw)
# [06:52] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [06:52] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [06:52] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
# [06:53] * Quits: jernoble_ (~jernoble@17.202.46.221) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
# [06:55] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@173-228-80-252.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [06:56] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [06:58] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [06:59] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [07:00] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [07:00] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@host86-163-23-70.range86-163.btcentralplus.com)
# [07:00] * Quits: niloy (~niloy@110.224.141.111) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [07:01] * heycam is now known as heycam|away
# [07:02] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
# [07:02] * Joins: niloy (~niloy@110.224.141.111)
# [07:04] * Quits: filR (~textual@202.171.180.162) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
# [07:04] * Quits: 64MAADNGT (~mven@ip72-193-85-64.lv.lv.cox.net) (Quit: Leaving...)
# [07:04] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [07:05] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@ip72-193-85-64.lv.lv.cox.net)
# [07:05] * Quits: jorgepedret (~jorgepedr@70-36-56-110.dyn.novuscom.net) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [07:05] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [07:08] * Joins: totsinaprops (~totsinapr@gateway/tor-sasl/totsinaprops)
# [07:09] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
# [07:10] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
# [07:10] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Client Quit)
# [07:10] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
# [07:16] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
# [07:21] * Quits: globbot (~logbot@lump.glob.com.au) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [07:22] * Joins: globbot (~logbot@lump.glob.com.au)
# [07:24] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [07:24] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
# [07:25] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [07:30] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [07:33] * Joins: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra)
# [07:33] * Joins: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.144.53)
# [07:37] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [07:39] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [07:41] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@2001:648:2ffc:1225:a800:ff:fe12:113e)
# [07:42] * Joins: jernoble_ (~jernoble@17.202.46.221)
# [07:47] * Joins: sedovsek (~robert@lk.84.20.237.54.dc.cable.static.lj-kabel.net)
# [07:51] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@c-24-4-202-10.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [07:53] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
# [07:53] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [07:54] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [07:56] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [07:57] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@50-193-20-145-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: sicking)
# [08:00] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@host86-163-23-70.range86-163.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [08:04] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [08:05] * Quits: sedovsek (~robert@lk.84.20.237.54.dc.cable.static.lj-kabel.net) (Quit: sedovsek)
# [08:09] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [08:10] * Quits: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra) (Quit: Leaving)
# [08:11] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@c-24-4-202-10.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
# [08:14] * Quits: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [08:15] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [08:17] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [08:18] * Joins: taijeen (~taijeen@p4FF84A95.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
# [08:19] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [08:19] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [08:24] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [08:30] * Quits: diffalot (~diffalot@c-76-107-128-104.hsd1.ms.comcast.net) (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
# [08:33] * Joins: diffalot (~diffalot@c-76-107-128-104.hsd1.ms.comcast.net)
# [08:35] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [08:40] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [08:43] * Joins: sedovsek (~robert@89.143.12.238)
# [08:43] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@26.223-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)
# [08:43] * Quits: jernoble (~jernoble@199-188-193-107.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [08:43] * jernoble_ is now known as jernoble
# [08:44] * Joins: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201)
# [08:47] * Quits: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201) (Client Quit)
# [08:48] * Joins: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201)
# [08:49] * Quits: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201) (Client Quit)
# [08:50] * Joins: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201)
# [09:00] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [09:00] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
# [09:04] * Joins: beowulf (~sstewart@host109-158-229-141.range109-158.btcentralplus.com)
# [09:05] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [09:06] * Joins: TuRnaD0 (~Thunderbi@x1-6-e0-46-9a-1e-fe-ca.cpe.webspeed.dk)
# [09:12] * Quits: sedovsek (~robert@89.143.12.238) (Quit: sedovsek)
# [09:13] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [09:15] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [09:17] * Quits: ap (~ap@c-24-130-62-30.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: ap)
# [09:17] * Joins: stevefaulkner_ (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [09:18] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [09:18] * stevefaulkner_ is now known as stevefaulkner
# [09:20] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [09:21] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-106.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [09:22] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [09:23] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [09:27] * Quits: jdaggett (~jdaggett@61-121-216-2.bitcat.net) (Quit: jdaggett)
# [09:28] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [09:29] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@176.12.107.140)
# [09:31] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [09:32] * Joins: zdobersek (~zan@179.43.133.34)
# [09:33] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: stevefaulkner)
# [09:34] * Quits: globbot (~logbot@lump.glob.com.au) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [09:35] * Joins: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be)
# [09:35] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@176.12.107.140) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [09:38] * Joins: globbot (~logbot@lump.glob.com.au)
# [09:40] * Joins: sedovsek (~robert@89.143.12.238)
# [09:40] * Quits: sedovsek (~robert@89.143.12.238) (Client Quit)
# [09:41] * Joins: sedovsek (~robert@89.143.12.238)
# [09:42] * Joins: WolfieZero (~WolfieZer@neils-wireless.manor.fubra.net)
# [09:44] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@81.143.60.194)
# [09:45] * WolfieZero is now known as WolfieZero|Away
# [09:45] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [09:45] * Quits: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.144.53) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [09:48] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [09:50] * Joins: iancrowther (~iancrowth@host109-155-20-174.range109-155.btcentralplus.com)
# [09:50] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [09:53] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [09:54] * WolfieZero|Away is now known as WolfieZero
# [09:54] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [09:57] * Joins: Bass10 (~Bass10@c-76-113-194-7.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
# [09:58] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [09:59] * Joins: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
# [10:02] * Joins: charl (~charl@2001:610:1908:2000:fd95:7bd0:8f5:14b8)
# [10:04] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.43.222) (Quit: rniwa)
# [10:05] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [10:06] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [10:10] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [10:18] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [10:19] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [10:19] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [10:20] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [10:20] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [10:21] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
# [10:24] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [10:24] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [10:25] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
# [10:33] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [10:45] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [10:46] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [10:47] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
# [10:47] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
# [10:50] * Joins: shaunbaker (~shaunbake@brick-lane.lbi.co.uk)
# [10:52] * Quits: iancrowther (~iancrowth@host109-155-20-174.range109-155.btcentralplus.com)
# [10:52] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [10:59] * Joins: barnabywalters (~barnabywa@46-239-239-203.tal.is)
# [11:01] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [11:06] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [11:12] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [11:14] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [11:15] <mathiasbynens> what is the expected behavior here? data:text/html,<img%20name=anchors><img%20name=anchors><script>document.write(document.anchors.length)</script>
# [11:15] <mathiasbynens> i’d expect 1 based on http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/dom.html#dom-tree-accessors
# [11:19] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [11:20] <mathiasbynens> which spec says <img name=foo> → `document.foo`? and does that spec explicitly override DOM tree accessors or not?
# [11:23] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [11:32] * Quits: WolfieZero (~WolfieZer@neils-wireless.manor.fubra.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [11:32] * Joins: WolfieZero (~WolfieZer@neils-wireless.manor.fubra.net)
# [11:35] <mathiasbynens> via https://twitter.com/RobbertAtWork/status/434273199648284672 and http://robbertbroersma.nl/demo/kill-document/
# [11:36] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [11:42] * Joins: josemanuel (~josemanue@93.Red-79-151-209.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net)
# [11:47] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [11:49] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [11:53] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [11:58] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [11:58] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [11:59] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [11:59] * Quits: totsinaprops (~totsinapr@gateway/tor-sasl/totsinaprops) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [12:00] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [12:00] * Joins: totsinaprops (~totsinapr@gateway/tor-sasl/totsinaprops)
# [12:01] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [12:04] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [12:08] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [12:13] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [12:13] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [12:14] * WolfieZero is now known as WolfieZero|Away
# [12:14] * Joins: felipeduardo (~felipedua@189.103.152.191)
# [12:15] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [12:15] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [12:22] * WolfieZero|Away is now known as WolfieZero
# [12:23] * Quits: 20WAA71NW (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-fikamkrpfhshcdam) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [12:24] * Joins: 92AAAFBPF (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-jzswhnfnfgixymrq)
# [12:27] <annevk> mathiasbynens: seems you missed "getter object (DOMString name)" on Document
# [12:28] <annevk> mathiasbynens: http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#dom-document-nameditem
# [12:28] <annevk> mathiasbynens: also exists on Window but works a bit differently
# [12:36] <mathiasbynens> ah, so DOM tree accessors don’t magically take precedence
# [12:36] <mathiasbynens> thanks
# [12:41] <annevk> mathiasbynens: because of the [OverrideBuiltins] annotation
# [12:42] * Joins: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra)
# [12:48] * Quits: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra) (Quit: Leaving)
# [12:49] * MikeSmith wonders if tyoshino__ made it home before the blizzard arrived
# [12:50] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [12:51] <annevk> TabAtkins: I don't get why you'd <dfn> an argument either, fwiw
# [12:51] <annevk> TabAtkins: the definition is for the method, including its parameters
# [12:51] <annevk> TabAtkins: you're not defining the parameters independently from the method
# [12:51] <annevk> TabAtkins: (and if you are, that's old-style DOM stuff and wrong)
# [12:55] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [12:55] <yoav> TabAtkins & SimonSapin: I'm having some trouble implementing http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css-syntax/#consume-a-number
# [13:02] <MikeSmith> annevk: dunno if you're following the recent Streams discussions but do you know is it correct that the plan is to eventually have the ecmascript spec define a Streams abstraction
# [13:02] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [13:03] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [13:03] <annevk> MikeSmith: Domenic_ certainly envisions it that way
# [13:03] <MikeSmith> ok
# [13:04] <annevk> MikeSmith: I get the impression ECMAScript wants to define all the things that make sense across embedding environments, which would also include URLs, encodings, etc.
# [13:04] <MikeSmith> oh
# [13:04] <MikeSmith> that would be ideal
# [13:04] <MikeSmith> as long as they don't mess it all up at least
# [13:05] <MikeSmith> I mean to have it define all in once place for all JS environments, including no-browser onces
# [13:06] <MikeSmith> a problem I see with
# [13:07] <MikeSmith> one problem I see with this plan is that TC39 is not famous for getting things done quickly
# [13:07] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [13:07] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [13:07] <Ms2ger> I certainly don't think the JS spec is the right place to define URLs
# [13:08] <MikeSmith> has Promises already been folded into the ecmascript draft yet?
# [13:08] * Joins: SteveF (~chatzilla@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [13:08] <annevk> MikeSmith: yes
# [13:09] <annevk> Ms2ger: it seems like a good place for the API, certainly
# [13:09] <MikeSmith> Ms2ger: maybe not the URL abstract definition
# [13:09] <MikeSmith> what annevk said
# [13:09] <Ms2ger> Oh, URL api, I guess
# [13:11] <Ms2ger> What do people think about moving the editing spec to github/whatwg, btw?
# [13:11] <SimonSapin> yoav: How so?
# [13:11] <annevk> SimonSapin: oreolunch in 30min, better get to the office
# [13:12] <SimonSapin> oreolunch?
# [13:12] <annevk> Ms2ger: well we can move things around, but is someone going to maintain it?
# [13:12] <Ms2ger> Not it :)
# [13:12] <MikeSmith> annevk: I wish Jason would generate a multipage version of the ES6 draft. I wonder if he's using python to generate it
# [13:12] <MikeSmith> (to generate the single-age one I mean)
# [13:13] <Ms2ger> MikeSmith, the code is on github, I think
# [13:13] <MikeSmith> k
# [13:13] <MikeSmith> Ms2ger: I say yeah I don7t see any good reason not to move the editing spec to github/whatwg
# [13:14] <annevk> Ms2ger: also, you suggesting moving something to GitHub is funny
# [13:14] <Ms2ger> It is
# [13:14] <annevk> MikeSmith: it loads quite quickly for me
# [13:14] <MikeSmith> where would Ms2ger normally prefer to move things?
# [13:14] <annevk> MikeSmith: are you on your phone again? :p
# [13:14] <MikeSmith> hehah
# [13:14] <Ms2ger> hg.whatwg.org ;)
# [13:14] <MikeSmith> ah
# [13:15] * Quits: 92AAAFBPF (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-jzswhnfnfgixymrq) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [13:15] <yoav> SimonSapin: I think that a "reconsume" is missing in http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css-syntax/#consume-a-token in the digit section
# [13:15] <yoav> before the "consume a numeric token"
# [13:15] <MikeSmith> annevk: yeah I was loading it on my phone. which is a valid use case
# [13:15] * Joins: 92AAAFCHO (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-qnnploszobnwkwxd)
# [13:16] <yoav> The way it is specced, the first digit is consumed, and then not added to the number
# [13:16] <yoav> Unless I'm missing something, which is highly possible
# [13:16] <annevk> MikeSmith: yeah fair
# [13:16] <MikeSmith> annevk: but yeah it's hardly a normal case
# [13:18] * Joins: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra)
# [13:18] <MikeSmith> hmm I see python in Jason's repo so I bet Philip` spec splitter could be modified to split it. I guess I should try it
# [13:25] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@26.223-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) (Quit: bbl)
# [13:25] <mathiasbynens> MikeSmith, Ms2ger: https://github.com/jorendorff/es-spec-html/issues/5
# [13:29] <annevk> MikeSmith: make http://es.github.io/ as ES living standard :-)
# [13:31] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt)
# [13:33] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
# [13:34] <SimonSapin> yoav: there may be a spec bug. Could you write to www-style with the details?
# [13:35] <yoav> SimonSapin: Sure
# [13:35] <yoav> Is the spec on GitHub by any chance?
# [13:35] <yoav> if so, I can open an issue there
# [13:36] <SimonSapin> there is a github mirror of the repo
# [13:36] <SimonSapin> but we don’t use github for issue tracking
# [13:36] <yoav> OK
# [13:36] <SimonSapin> https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts
# [13:37] <SimonSapin> The "main" repo is https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/csswg
# [13:37] <SimonSapin> yoav: or if you’d rather not subscribe on www-style, email me
# [13:38] <yoav> I'm subscribed to www-style, just have a hard time spamming everyone with this bug :)
# [13:38] <yoav> But I'll get over it
# [13:38] <SimonSapin> don’t worry about that
# [13:39] <SimonSapin> it’s what the list is for
# [13:39] <Domenic_> Hah! Worries about mail volume on www-style! Now I've heard everything.
# [13:40] <yoav> Domenic_: That's exactly why I'd rather avoid mailing it to the list :)
# [13:41] <annevk> CSS has Bugzilla as well...
# [13:41] <annevk> I usually use that as email tends to get lost and forgotten
# [13:42] <yoav> annevk: Is it open for non members?
# [13:42] <annevk> yoav: yeah is
# [13:43] <yoav> OK, will try that
# [13:43] <yoav> Thanks!
# [13:43] <annevk> yoav: https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/enter_bug.cgi?product=CSS
# [13:45] * Joins: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
# [13:50] * Quits: charl (~charl@2001:610:1908:2000:fd95:7bd0:8f5:14b8) (Quit: leaving)
# [13:51] * Quits: rego (~rego@99.192.27.77.dynamic.mundo-r.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [13:51] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [13:52] <yoav> SimonSapin: https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=24661
# [13:53] <SimonSapin> yoav: why did you go there?
# [13:54] <SimonSapin> CSSWG has too many fucking ways to track issues
# [13:54] <yoav> annevk suggested to open a bug there
# [13:54] <SimonSapin> I need an issue tracker tracker
# [13:54] * Joins: newtron_ (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com)
# [13:54] <yoav> Sorry
# [13:55] <yoav> I can send it to the list if you prefer
# [13:55] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
# [13:55] * Joins: rego (~rego@99.192.27.77.dynamic.mundo-r.com)
# [13:56] <SimonSapin> annevk: Buzilla bugs can get lost and forgotten just as easily. I recently discovered that the specs *I’m* editing had bugs on Bugzilla
# [13:56] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [13:57] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [13:58] <SimonSapin> Everything is broken and nobody cares
# [13:58] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@206-248-128-25.dsl.teksavvy.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [14:01] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [14:06] * Quits: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra) (Quit: Leaving)
# [14:13] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [14:13] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Client Quit)
# [14:19] <MikeSmith> mathiasbynens: ah thanks I remember that now. I should get around to trying it and just implement a PR
# [14:20] <MikeSmith> annevk: yeah I could just make http://es.github.io/ redirect to Jason's HTML
# [14:22] <MikeSmith> oh if I owned "es"
# [14:22] * Quits: nunnun (~hiro@sculptor.local.hiro.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [14:22] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@b255h017.ugent.be)
# [14:22] * Quits: niloy (~niloy@110.224.141.111) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [14:23] * Joins: nunnun (~hiro@sculptor.local.hiro.ne.jp)
# [14:23] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [14:23] <MikeSmith> hey I do own http://ecmascript.github.io/ though
# [14:33] * Joins: pinpin404 (~pinage404@LPoitiers-156-84-28-38.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr)
# [14:40] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
# [14:40] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [14:40] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203)
# [14:40] <MikeSmith> http://ecmascript.github.io/ now redirects to the latest, and will http://es-spec.github.io/ soon hopefully too
# [14:41] * Quits: josemanuel (~josemanue@93.Red-79-151-209.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) (Quit: Saliendo)
# [14:42] * Quits: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [14:45] * Joins: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be)
# [14:45] <MikeSmith> and http://es6.github.io/ for now
# [14:45] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [14:48] * Joins: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra)
# [14:49] * Quits: barnabywalters (~barnabywa@46-239-239-203.tal.is) (Quit: barnabywalters)
# [14:49] * Joins: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.181)
# [14:57] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [15:03] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [15:08] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [15:11] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt)
# [15:13] * Quits: numerical (numerical@s-e-c-u-r-e-d.info) (Excess Flood)
# [15:14] * Joins: numerical (numerical@s-e-c-u-r-e-d.info)
# [15:14] * Quits: facundor (~facundor@190.194.154.204) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [15:18] * Quits: tobie (sid5692@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ddkostzfcleqatpw)
# [15:18] * Joins: tobie (sid5692@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xoqzcsdgrjkmxqnp)
# [15:20] * Quits: deniak (~denis@35.133.122.109.rev.sfr.net) (Quit: Bye)
# [15:21] * WolfieZero is now known as WolfieZero|Away
# [15:25] * Joins: Johnny- (~null@unaffiliated/johnny-)
# [15:31] * WolfieZero|Away is now known as WolfieZero
# [15:31] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [15:33] * Joins: facundor (~facundor@190.194.154.204)
# [15:38] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [15:40] * Joins: myakura (~myakura@FL1-119-240-194-107.tky.mesh.ad.jp)
# [15:41] * Joins: shi (~decotii@hq.croscon.com)
# [15:48] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@b255h017.ugent.be) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [15:51] * Joins: kuatsure (~kuatsure@74.83.252.220)
# [16:01] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@b237h252.ugent.be)
# [16:02] * Joins: encryptd_fractal (~mfrawley@66-188-99-174.static.ftbg.wi.charter.com)
# [16:09] * Quits: taijeen (~taijeen@p4FF84A95.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [16:14] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
# [16:15] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [16:16] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [16:21] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [16:24] * Joins: taijeen (~taijeen@p4FF84A95.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
# [16:24] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [16:25] * Quits: myakura (~myakura@FL1-119-240-194-107.tky.mesh.ad.jp) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [16:28] * Joins: myakura (~myakura@FL1-119-240-194-107.tky.mesh.ad.jp)
# [16:36] <JakeA> annevk: Looking at serviceWorker.ready()… any idea what the use-cases are for it?
# [16:36] * Joins: espadrine (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-50-185.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr)
# [16:38] <annevk> JakeA: no
# [16:38] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@24.130.60.35)
# [16:39] <JakeA> annevk: Ok, not just me then
# [16:40] <annevk> JakeA: yeah, I asked in the bug; it seems like you need to use register() anyway
# [16:40] <JakeA> annevk: I'm not even sure what "ready" means
# [16:40] <gsnedders> Ms2ger: Can we try removing the lxml dependency from Anolis? It should be way quicker in PyPy, because basically all the cost is overhead.
# [16:41] <JakeA> annevk: Does it mean when it becomes the active worker?
# [16:41] <Ms2ger> We can :)
# [16:41] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [16:42] <gsnedders> Ms2ger: Either that or rewrite it in Haskell ;P
# [16:42] <annevk> JakeA: yeah I thought maybe that's it
# [16:42] <annevk> JakeA: that would be somewhat different from register() anyway
# [16:42] <annevk> JakeA: but we also have an event for that
# [16:42] <Ms2ger> Not that :)
# [16:42] <JakeA> annevk: But register() is the only place you can a non-active worker
# [16:43] <JakeA> annevk: Yeah, and we decided that a promise wasn't the right fit, because .active can change without a call to registration
# [16:43] <JakeA> annevk: and it can change multiple times over the life of a page
# [16:43] <annevk> JakeA: I thought the idea was that if you did getAll() you would get all workers, regardless of whether they are active
# [16:43] <Domenic_> NOT USING PROMISES FOR SOMETHING!? IMPOSSIBRU
# [16:44] <JakeA> :D
# [16:44] <Domenic_> I am pretty sure Alex had a use case for serviceWorker.ready()
# [16:44] <JakeA> annevk: ahh ok, yeah, that's possible, I can't remember
# [16:44] <Domenic_> https://gist.github.com/slightlyoff/8927885
# [16:44] <Domenic_> hmm you guys already seem to be talking about relevant things like .active so you are probably way ahead of me on this
# [16:46] <annevk> JakeA: hmm, looking at it now ready() makes sense for code that doesn't want to deal with registration and still needs to get a handle on things
# [16:46] <annevk> JakeA: e.g. a library that does push as per Domenic_'s link
# [16:46] * Quits: npcomp (~eldon@c-24-126-240-124.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [16:46] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [16:46] <JakeA> annevk: Isn't .active already the handle you need?
# [16:48] <jgraham> gsnedders: Rewrite in in rust :p Of course you would need to start by writing a HTML parser and tree library…
# [16:48] * Joins: npcomp (~eldon@c-24-126-240-124.hsd1.ga.comcast.net)
# [16:48] * Quits: JosephSilber (~Joseph@ool-44c3e80a.static.optonline.net) (Quit: Leaving)
# [16:48] <gsnedders> jgraham: :P
# [16:48] <annevk> JakeA: so yeah
# [16:48] <gsnedders> jgraham: Yeah, Haskell's still sounding better.
# [16:49] <annevk> JakeA: except if you want to wait for a possible register() call, but I'm not really sure how that could work so indeed
# [16:49] <gsnedders> I mean, at the end of the day Anolis is just a transformation from one tree to another!
# [16:49] <JakeA> annevk: and the registration call may have come from another tab, so the 'activate' event is better in this case
# [16:50] <annevk> right, given the event this makes little sense
# [16:50] <JakeA> annevk: will add this to the ticket
# [16:50] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [16:51] * Joins: bzalasky (~bzalasky@c-67-188-211-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [16:51] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [16:52] * Quits: myakura (~myakura@FL1-119-240-194-107.tky.mesh.ad.jp) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [16:53] * Joins: myakura (~myakura@FL1-119-240-194-107.tky.mesh.ad.jp)
# [16:57] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102)
# [16:57] * Quits: myakura (~myakura@FL1-119-240-194-107.tky.mesh.ad.jp) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [16:58] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@24.130.60.35) (Quit: weinig)
# [16:59] * jonlee_|afk is now known as jonlee_
# [17:03] * Quits: shaunbaker (~shaunbake@brick-lane.lbi.co.uk) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [17:05] <JakeA> annevk: Tried to make it clearer https://github.com/slightlyoff/ServiceWorker/issues/174#issuecomment-35096632
# [17:05] <annevk> JakeA: ta
# [17:06] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@b237h252.ugent.be) (Quit: Leaving)
# [17:06] * Joins: marcosc (~marcosc@a79-168-197-24.cpe.netcabo.pt)
# [17:08] * Joins: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [17:09] * Quits: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201) (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
# [17:10] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
# [17:13] * Quits: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [17:13] <JakeA> Domenic_: annevk: In https://gist.github.com/slightlyoff/8927885, is the serviceworker the only place you could receive push messages?
# [17:14] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [17:15] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
# [17:16] * Quits: nunnun (~hiro@sculptor.local.hiro.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [17:18] * Joins: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@76.74.153.41)
# [17:20] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
# [17:20] * Quits: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [17:22] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@ip72-193-85-64.lv.lv.cox.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [17:23] * Joins: nunnun (~hiro@sculptor.local.hiro.ne.jp)
# [17:23] <annevk> Domenic_: seems like you commented on the wrong thread in blink-dev
# [17:24] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [17:24] <Domenic_> annevk: I was trying to be funny... or did the threading go off?
# [17:24] * Joins: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189)
# [17:25] <annevk> Domenic_: I see, slow day here
# [17:25] <Domenic_> yeah, I guess that could have been clearer, "stop torturing them by messing with the Promise API."
# [17:25] <JakeA> Oh, I didn't realise the promises api wsa changing
# [17:25] <JakeA> was*
# [17:25] <annevk> JakeA: yeah that's the plan
# [17:25] <annevk> JakeA: push notifications only really make sense if the app isn't open
# [17:25] <JakeA> I guess .race is still in there to confuse people
# [17:27] <JakeA> Domenic_: "Keep then, reject chain (NOT DEFER, reject!)" what does that mean?
# [17:27] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
# [17:27] <Domenic_> lol
# [17:27] <Domenic_> *that* sentence was almost certainly designed to confuse people
# [17:28] <Domenic_> it means don't add monadic chain method to promises, neither now, nor in ES7
# [17:28] <JakeA> It is a fruitless collection of words
# [17:28] <JakeA> Ahh, the whole flatMap thing?
# [17:29] <JakeA> I was playing around with the design of a AsyncMap, it gets quite confusing if the AsyncMap stores promises
# [17:29] * jonlee_ is now known as jonlee_|afk
# [17:29] <JakeA> Domenic_: See https://github.com/slightlyoff/ServiceWorker/issues/156
# [17:30] <JakeA> It's one of those weird cases where you want to resolve a promise with a promise without unwrapping
# [17:31] <Domenic_> I don't understand why you want to store promises in AsyncMap.
# [17:31] * Quits: ahf (ahf@irssi/staff/ahf) (Quit: Reconnecting)
# [17:31] * Joins: ahf (ahf@irssi/staff/ahf)
# [17:31] <Domenic_> The most natural semantics (for promises, not monads) is option B
# [17:32] <Domenic_> in terms of what you can implement in JS
# [17:32] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [17:32] <Domenic_> wait no not optionB
# [17:33] <Domenic_> I will write it up
# [17:33] <annevk> JakeA: btw, I'll be in SF April 1-8 for service workers and summit thingy
# [17:34] <JakeA> annevk: What days are you available for serviceworkering?
# [17:35] <annevk> JakeA: 7/8 is still best
# [17:35] <annevk> JakeA: the tentative dates from the email
# [17:35] <JakeA> annevk: Oh yeah, I do have that in my calendar
# [17:35] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [17:35] <JakeA> Cool
# [17:35] <annevk> great
# [17:39] * Quits: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189) (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
# [17:40] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [17:41] * Quits: sedovsek (~robert@89.143.12.238) (Quit: sedovsek)
# [17:42] * Quits: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra) (Quit: Leaving)
# [17:45] * Quits: pinpin404 (~pinage404@LPoitiers-156-84-28-38.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [17:47] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [17:52] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [17:52] * Joins: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134)
# [17:53] * Quits: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@76.74.153.41) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [17:53] * Joins: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@76.74.153.41)
# [17:53] * Joins: ambv_ (~ambv@206.108.217.134)
# [17:56] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@81.143.60.194) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [17:57] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [17:57] * Quits: taijeen (~taijeen@p4FF84A95.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [17:57] * Joins: ebetancourt (~ebetancou@c-66-229-12-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net)
# [17:59] * Joins: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@173.247.197.10)
# [18:00] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-106.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
# [18:01] * Joins: JosephSilber (~Joseph@ool-44c3e80a.static.optonline.net)
# [18:08] <dglazkov> good morning, Whatwg!
# [18:14] * Quits: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.181) (Quit: adactio)
# [18:15] * Quits: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@76.74.153.41) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [18:15] * Quits: zdobersek (~zan@179.43.133.34) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [18:16] * WolfieZero is now known as WolfieZero|Away
# [18:18] * Joins: llkats (~llkats@206.169.83.230)
# [18:20] * Quits: WolfieZero|Away (~WolfieZer@neils-wireless.manor.fubra.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [18:27] * Quits: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125) (Quit: eric_carlson)
# [18:27] * Joins: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189)
# [18:31] <annevk> morning dglazkov
# [18:32] * Joins: izhak (~izhak@92.248.142.152)
# [18:36] * Joins: Maurice (copyman@5ED57922.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
# [18:40] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [18:45] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: stevefaulkner)
# [18:46] * Quits: kuatsure (~kuatsure@74.83.252.220) (Quit: zzz)
# [18:48] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [18:48] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [18:51] * Joins: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125)
# [18:53] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [18:55] * Joins: TallTed (~Thud@63.119.36.39)
# [19:01] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:7851:ff38:96d3:4163)
# [19:02] * Quits: benvie (~bbenvie@204.28.118.69) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [19:04] * Quits: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [19:07] * tbsaunde_ is now known as tbsaunde
# [19:09] * Quits: timeless (sid4015@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tgehtshehikktxll) (Changing host)
# [19:09] * Joins: timeless (sid4015@firefox/developer/timeless)
# [19:09] * Quits: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125) (Quit: eric_carlson)
# [19:09] * Joins: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [19:10] * Joins: benvie (~bbenvie@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
# [19:14] * Joins: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125)
# [19:14] * Quits: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [19:14] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.7.172)
# [19:21] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [19:23] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@c-24-4-202-10.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [19:24] * Joins: WolfieZero (~WolfieZer@neilandkerrie.plus.com)
# [19:24] * Quits: WolfieZero (~WolfieZer@neilandkerrie.plus.com) (Client Quit)
# [19:24] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [19:30] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@c-24-4-202-10.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [19:31] <TabAtkins> Domenic_: I gave examples in the es-discuss thread of why you'd want to store a promise.
# [19:31] <TabAtkins> And not have it auto-chain.
# [19:33] <TabAtkins> Domenic_: I suppose that my example is exactly the example in the OP of SW issue 156
# [19:34] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.7.172) (Quit: othermaciej)
# [19:37] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [19:38] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
# [19:39] * Joins: danielwrobert (~Adium@wsip-68-15-24-46.sd.sd.cox.net)
# [19:42] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [19:46] * Joins: jorgepedret (~jorgepedr@64-46-23-103.dyn.novuscom.net)
# [19:46] * Quits: espadrine (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-50-185.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [19:48] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.245.25.248)
# [19:48] * Joins: shaunbaker (~shaunbake@97e69e6b.skybroadband.com)
# [19:48] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.216.108)
# [19:48] * Joins: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra)
# [19:49] * Joins: benv (~benv@38.104.194.126)
# [19:49] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [19:52] * Quits: ebetancourt (~ebetancou@c-66-229-12-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [19:52] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.245.25.248) (Client Quit)
# [19:53] * Joins: ap_ (~ap@17.114.219.4)
# [19:54] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [19:55] * jonlee_|afk is now known as jonlee_
# [19:56] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:7851:ff38:96d3:4163) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [19:56] * Quits: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: stevefaulkner)
# [19:57] * Joins: mmoretti (~mmoretti@2620:149:4:1a01:c18c:a2c4:834c:3efb)
# [19:57] * Quits: mmoretti (~mmoretti@2620:149:4:1a01:c18c:a2c4:834c:3efb) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [19:58] * Quits: ap_ (~ap@17.114.219.4) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [19:58] * Quits: shaunbaker (~shaunbake@97e69e6b.skybroadband.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [20:00] * Quits: TuRnaD0 (~Thunderbi@x1-6-e0-46-9a-1e-fe-ca.cpe.webspeed.dk) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [20:01] * Joins: ap (~ap@17.114.19.52)
# [20:01] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.114.18.247)
# [20:06] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.114.158.10)
# [20:09] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
# [20:11] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.114.158.10) (Client Quit)
# [20:12] * jonlee_ is now known as jonlee_|afk
# [20:12] * Joins: charl (~charl@524A9047.cm-4-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
# [20:14] * Joins: espadrine (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-21-54.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr)
# [20:17] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [20:21] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@host86-163-23-70.range86-163.btcentralplus.com)
# [20:23] <Hixie> so......
# [20:23] <Hixie> if you have an <area> that is used by two image maps
# [20:23] * Quits: SteveF (~chatzilla@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 30.0a1/20140212030201])
# [20:23] <Hixie> one in a <dialog> and one in the page
# [20:23] * Joins: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
# [20:23] <Hixie> and you call .focus() on the <area>
# [20:23] <Hixie> should it focus:
# [20:23] <Hixie> a) the first one in tree order
# [20:24] * Joins: roven (~roven@78-20-24-80.access.telenet.be)
# [20:24] <Hixie> b) the first one in tree order in whatever (dialog/page) is currently focused, if possible, else the first one in tree order
# [20:25] <Hixie> c) the last one that was focused, if any has been focused, or otherwise b)
# [20:25] <Hixie> c) the last one that was focused, if any has been focused, or otherwise a)
# [20:26] <Hixie> e) something else
# [20:26] <Hixie> i'm leading to a.
# [20:26] * Quits: Bass10 (~Bass10@c-76-113-194-7.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Quit: Leaving)
# [20:28] * Quits: izhak (~izhak@92.248.142.152) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [20:30] <Hixie> oh... wait...
# [20:30] <Hixie> i'm silly
# [20:31] <Hixie> well, no, i'm not silly
# [20:31] <Hixie> the above is fine, but i was thinking it was more general than that in my head
# [20:31] <Hixie> but it really is very specific to <area>
# [20:34] * Joins: shaunbaker (~shaunbake@97e69e6b.skybroadband.com)
# [20:36] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.114.18.247) (Quit: weinig)
# [20:37] * Quits: ap (~ap@17.114.19.52) (Quit: ap)
# [20:37] * Joins: karbassi (~karbassi@li62-206.members.linode.com)
# [20:38] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [20:39] * Joins: kuatsure (~kuatsure@cpe-184-59-100-169.cinci.res.rr.com)
# [20:40] * Joins: shannonmoeller (~shannonmo@pool-108-17-8-225.bflony.fios.verizon.net)
# [20:42] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:41d7:d381:a12a:a344)
# [20:42] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [20:43] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
# [20:45] <annevk> how does <dialog> makes this different from just two image maps?
# [20:45] * Quits: 92AAAFCHO (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-qnnploszobnwkwxd) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [20:46] * Joins: 92AAAFKE7 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-siuqinqyccnfpwxo)
# [20:47] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Client Quit)
# [20:50] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [20:52] * Joins: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca)
# [20:52] * Quits: reyre (~reyre@bas1-streetsville52-1279283565.dsl.bell.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [20:52] * Quits: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra) (Write error: Connection reset by peer)
# [20:52] * Quits: annevk (~annevk@207.218.72.65) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [20:53] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
# [20:55] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [20:58] * Quits: shaunbaker (~shaunbake@97e69e6b.skybroadband.com)
# [21:02] * Joins: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra)
# [21:03] * Quits: charl (~charl@524A9047.cm-4-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Quit: leaving)
# [21:07] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
# [21:11] * Joins: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [21:12] * Quits: alrra (~alrra@unaffiliated/alrra) (Quit: Leaving)
# [21:12] <Hixie> annevk-cloud: only difference would be that now there's more than one group of controls, since each dialog has its own group
# [21:14] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@host86-163-23-70.range86-163.btcentralplus.com) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [21:15] * Quits: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
# [21:17] * Quits: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125) (Quit: eric_carlson)
# [21:18] * Joins: pinpin404 (~pinage404@2a01:e35:8b86:e330:260a:64ff:fe63:69ab)
# [21:18] * Quits: pinpin404 (~pinage404@2a01:e35:8b86:e330:260a:64ff:fe63:69ab) (Client Quit)
# [21:20] <jamesr__> TC39 seems confusing
# [21:21] <Hixie> how so?
# [21:22] <jamesr__> i'm trying to follow the threads describing what the status of Promises is
# [21:24] <Hixie> ah, yeah
# [21:24] <Hixie> i assume they just didn't know it had shipped
# [21:24] <Hixie> (they presumably wouldn't have changed it if they knew that)
# [21:24] * Quits: dshwang (~dshwang@192.55.54.40) (Write error: Broken pipe)
# [21:24] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [21:27] <jamesr__> the part in parens is the part i'm not sure about, which is what i find confusing
# [21:28] <Hixie> why would they change it if it had shipped? once it's shipped it almost certainly can't change unless it's really really early on, and even then there's a huge cost
# [21:29] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [21:30] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [21:31] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [21:31] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [21:32] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [21:32] <Hixie> TabAtkins or any other CSS mavens around: does CSS have some equivalent to "tree order"?
# [21:32] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [21:33] <Hixie> if an element generates multiple boxes that are scrollable, then it might have multiple scrollable regions, and i'd like to be able to pick the "first one" by some useful definition
# [21:33] <Hixie> but i don't know how to say that
# [21:37] <jamesr__> i can't speak strongly, though. these promises threads are very long
# [21:37] <jamesr__> Hixie: CSS doesn't define a box tree properly anywhere, sadly
# [21:37] <jamesr__> there may be an approximation somewhere though
# [21:39] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-106.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
# [21:40] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [21:40] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt)
# [21:40] * Hixie figures out these regions have to be in the tab order too, and so defers to that for now
# [21:40] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [21:40] <Hixie> (that'll come and bite me in the ass later...)
# [21:40] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [21:43] <Hixie> i wish someone could explain to me the value of all the chatter on some of the w3c lists about whether something is "at risk" or not and whether it should be in or out for CR and when to ship the CR and all the crap
# [21:43] <Hixie> just publish it all. why would you want to _not_ get the patent protection.
# [21:44] <Hixie> and publish it asap. why would you want to wait.
# [21:44] <Hixie> sigh
# [21:44] <Hixie> (hm, actually i guess they might not theoretically all be in the tab order.)
# [21:48] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@host86-163-23-70.range86-163.btcentralplus.com)
# [21:50] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Reconnecting…)
# [21:50] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
# [21:51] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [21:55] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.43.222)
# [21:56] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [21:56] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [21:56] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [21:57] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:41d7:d381:a12a:a344) (Quit: ap)
# [21:59] <TabAtkins> Hixie: Yeah, you can do tree order on the box tree.
# [22:00] <Hixie> oh, cool. what should i reference when doing that?
# [22:00] * Quits: espadrine (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-21-54.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [22:00] <TabAtkins> http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/intro.html#formatting-structure
# [22:01] <TabAtkins> It's not really "defined", per se, but that's the right ref for people to know what you're talkinga bout.
# [22:06] * Joins: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125)
# [22:08] * Joins: ap (~ap@17.114.219.4)
# [22:09] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
# [22:11] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:11] * Quits: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189) (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
# [22:11] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [22:11] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:15] * Quits: llkats (~llkats@206.169.83.230) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [22:16] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Reconnecting…)
# [22:16] <Hixie> TabAtkins: is there any plan for a real definition that i can reference?
# [22:16] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-42-30.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
# [22:16] <TabAtkins> Plan, yes. Timetable, no.
# [22:16] <Hixie> i mean, people will "know what i mean" even without a ref... :-)
# [22:16] <Hixie> k
# [22:23] * Joins: yoshu (~josh@75-151-125-213-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
# [22:30] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
# [22:32] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:32] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:33] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:33] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
# [22:34] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
# [22:34] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:37] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
# [22:38] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Quit: Leaving...)
# [22:42] * Quits: yoshu (~josh@75-151-125-213-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: yoshu)
# [22:44] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:44] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
# [22:44] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:45] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:45] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:46] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:46] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:46] * Joins: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189)
# [22:52] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt)
# [22:52] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
# [22:52] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [22:52] * Joins: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu)
# [22:56] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@80.78.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [22:56] * Joins: seventh (seventh@31.6.45.141)
# [22:56] * Quits: mven_ (~mven@u-131-216-14-39.dhcp.unlv.edu) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [22:57] * Quits: benvie (~bbenvie@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [22:57] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
# [22:57] * Quits: TallTed (~Thud@63.119.36.39) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [23:00] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@sjfw1-b.adobe.com)
# [23:02] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
# [23:07] * Quits: 92AAAFKE7 (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-siuqinqyccnfpwxo) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [23:08] * Joins: 36DACIIKL (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-mkcoqexutpvtomlh)
# [23:09] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
# [23:11] * Quits: ap (~ap@17.114.219.4) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [23:11] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:48a1:e840:58d7:ca47)
# [23:12] * Joins: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
# [23:15] * Joins: yoshu (~josh@75-151-125-213-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
# [23:16] * Quits: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@24-177-124-44.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
# [23:17] * Joins: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [23:23] <Hixie> seriously. running. out. of. words. in. the. english. language.
# [23:23] * Parts: stevefaulkner (~stevefaul@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
# [23:24] * Joins: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@17.202.45.163)
# [23:26] * Quits: jernoble (~jernoble@17.202.46.221) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
# [23:30] * Joins: benvie (~bbenvie@204.28.118.69)
# [23:33] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
# [23:33] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
# [23:38] * Quits: rdebeasi (~rdebeasi@datacenter.ef.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# [23:39] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
# [23:39] * Quits: felipeduardo (~felipedua@189.103.152.191) (Remote host closed the connection)
# [23:40] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
# [23:41] * Quits: kuatsure (~kuatsure@cpe-184-59-100-169.cinci.res.rr.com) (Quit: bye)
# [23:41] * Quits: benv (~benv@38.104.194.126) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
# [23:41] * Quits: encryptd_fractal (~mfrawley@66-188-99-174.static.ftbg.wi.charter.com) (Quit: Leaving.)
# [23:42] * Quits: totsinaprops (~totsinapr@gateway/tor-sasl/totsinaprops) (Quit: totsinaprops)
# [23:46] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@host86-163-23-70.range86-163.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
# [23:51] * Joins: TuRnaD0 (~Thunderbi@x1-6-e0-46-9a-1e-fe-ca.cpe.webspeed.dk)
# [23:52] * Joins: benv (~benv@38.104.194.126)
# [23:53] * Quits: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125) (Quit: eric_carlson)
# [23:53] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no)
# [23:57] * Joins: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125)
# [23:58] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@guest.schibsted.no) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
# Session Close: Sat Feb 15 00:00:00 2014

The end :)