/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2014-05-17 / end

Options:

  1. # Session Start: Sat May 17 00:00:00 2014
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  3. # [00:06] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134) (Quit: sys.exit(0) # computer went to sleep)
  4. # [00:08] * Joins: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134)
  5. # [00:08] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134) (Client Quit)
  6. # [00:09] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  7. # [00:19] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  8. # [00:20] * Hixie pokes at the style sheet some more
  9. # [00:20] <Hixie> tried to add more White Space.
  10. # [00:22] * Joins: lilmonkey` (~colin@pdpc/supporter/professional/riven)
  11. # [00:23] * Quits: lilmonkey (~colin@pdpc/supporter/professional/riven) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  12. # [00:24] * yoav_ is now known as yoav
  13. # [00:25] * Quits: Maurice (copyman@5ED57922.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  14. # [00:32] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  15. # [00:32] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  16. # [00:33] * Quits: abinader (sid21713@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gtaadosmowwvvrhb)
  17. # [00:34] <benjamingr> Is there any standard regarding getting the amount of memory JS consumes in a web page? I'm using memory.performance in Chrome and I was wondering if there is anything I should look at in terms of standards
  18. # [00:35] * Quits: benjamingr (uid23465@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fqmlugmjmmpdzoax) (*.net *.split)
  19. # [00:35] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (*.net *.split)
  20. # [00:35] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:dcd1:d5d9:53e7:8249) (*.net *.split)
  21. # [00:35] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (*.net *.split)
  22. # [00:35] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (*.net *.split)
  23. # [00:35] * Quits: rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me) (*.net *.split)
  24. # [00:35] * Quits: kochi1 (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82) (*.net *.split)
  25. # [00:35] * Quits: kochi (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82) (*.net *.split)
  26. # [00:35] * Quits: dshwang (~dshwang@134.134.137.75) (*.net *.split)
  27. # [00:35] * Quits: ivan`` (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001) (*.net *.split)
  28. # [00:35] * Quits: molsson_ (~molsson@83.218.67.123) (*.net *.split)
  29. # [00:35] * Quits: mvujovic (sid13458@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ioveozutujucgrha) (*.net *.split)
  30. # [00:35] * Quits: miketaylr (~miketaylr@192.241.222.35) (*.net *.split)
  31. # [00:35] * Quits: dwim (~dwim@210.94.41.89) (*.net *.split)
  32. # [00:35] * Quits: jcgregorio (jcgregorio@nat/google/x-ipxvsgwpdulsddzp) (*.net *.split)
  33. # [00:35] * Quits: Martijnc (~Martijn@is-aweso.me) (*.net *.split)
  34. # [00:35] * Quits: nickstenn (~nickstenn@pdpc/supporter/student/borior) (*.net *.split)
  35. # [00:35] * Quits: wirepair_ (fbi@random.supermario.org) (*.net *.split)
  36. # [00:35] * Quits: beowulf (~sstewart@host86-153-243-191.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) (*.net *.split)
  37. # [00:35] * Quits: bentruyman (~bentruyma@23.252.119.254) (*.net *.split)
  38. # [00:35] * Quits: foolip (~philip@37.139.17.34) (*.net *.split)
  39. # [00:35] * Quits: hendry (~hendry@sg.webconverger.com) (*.net *.split)
  40. # [00:35] * Quits: ahf (ahf@irssi/staff/ahf) (*.net *.split)
  41. # [00:35] * Quits: tbsaunde (~tbsaunde@people1.scl3.mozilla.com) (*.net *.split)
  42. # [00:35] * Quits: gavin (~gavin@firefox/developer/gavin) (*.net *.split)
  43. # [00:35] * Quits: yoshiki (~yoshiki@miku.s.su.la) (*.net *.split)
  44. # [00:35] * Joins: benjamingr (uid23465@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fqmlugmjmmpdzoax)
  45. # [00:35] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  46. # [00:35] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:dcd1:d5d9:53e7:8249)
  47. # [00:35] * Joins: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon)
  48. # [00:35] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203)
  49. # [00:35] * Joins: rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me)
  50. # [00:35] * Joins: kochi1 (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82)
  51. # [00:35] * Joins: kochi (~kochi@2401:fa00:4:1000:26be:5ff:fe03:db82)
  52. # [00:35] * Joins: dshwang (~dshwang@134.134.137.75)
  53. # [00:35] * Joins: molsson_ (~molsson@83.218.67.123)
  54. # [00:35] * Joins: mvujovic (sid13458@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ioveozutujucgrha)
  55. # [00:35] * Joins: miketaylr (~miketaylr@192.241.222.35)
  56. # [00:35] * Joins: dwim (~dwim@210.94.41.89)
  57. # [00:35] * Joins: jcgregorio (jcgregorio@nat/google/x-ipxvsgwpdulsddzp)
  58. # [00:35] * Joins: Martijnc (~Martijn@is-aweso.me)
  59. # [00:35] * Joins: nickstenn (~nickstenn@pdpc/supporter/student/borior)
  60. # [00:35] * Joins: wirepair_ (fbi@random.supermario.org)
  61. # [00:36] * Joins: ivan`` (~ivan@192.241.198.49)
  62. # [00:36] * Quits: ivan`` (~ivan@192.241.198.49) (Changing host)
  63. # [00:36] * Joins: ivan`` (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001)
  64. # [00:36] * Joins: beowulf (~sstewart@host86-153-243-191.range86-153.btcentralplus.com)
  65. # [00:36] * Joins: bentruyman (~bentruyma@23.252.119.254)
  66. # [00:36] * Joins: foolip (~philip@37.139.17.34)
  67. # [00:36] * Joins: hendry (~hendry@sg.webconverger.com)
  68. # [00:36] * Joins: ahf (ahf@irssi/staff/ahf)
  69. # [00:36] * Joins: tbsaunde (~tbsaunde@people1.scl3.mozilla.com)
  70. # [00:36] * Joins: gavin (~gavin@firefox/developer/gavin)
  71. # [00:36] * Joins: yoshiki (~yoshiki@miku.s.su.la)
  72. # [00:36] * Quits: ivan`` (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001) (Max SendQ exceeded)
  73. # [00:36] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (Max SendQ exceeded)
  74. # [00:36] * Quits: ahf (ahf@irssi/staff/ahf) (Max SendQ exceeded)
  75. # [00:36] * Joins: ivan`` (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001)
  76. # [00:37] * Quits: lilmonkey` (~colin@pdpc/supporter/professional/riven) (Excess Flood)
  77. # [00:38] * Joins: ahf (~ahf@irssi/staff/ahf)
  78. # [00:38] * Joins: lilmonkey (~colin@5ED090B0.cm-7-1c.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  79. # [00:38] * Quits: lilmonkey (~colin@5ED090B0.cm-7-1c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Changing host)
  80. # [00:38] * Joins: lilmonkey (~colin@pdpc/supporter/professional/riven)
  81. # [00:38] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@37.162.104.151) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  82. # [00:38] * Joins: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon)
  83. # [00:38] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@c-50-148-162-19.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  84. # [00:40] * Joins: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@17.202.45.163)
  85. # [00:44] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (Excess Flood)
  86. # [00:46] * Joins: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon)
  87. # [00:49] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  88. # [00:50] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: tantek)
  89. # [00:51] * Quits: CvP (~CvP@27.147.199.131) (Quit: [ UPP ] > all)
  90. # [00:51] <Hixie> benjamingr: what kind of standards?
  91. # [00:52] <Hixie> benjamingr: (the answer is probably "no")
  92. # [00:52] <Hixie> benjamingr: like, requirements on how much a browser should use for a given page?
  93. # [00:53] * Joins: CvP (~CvP@27.147.199.131)
  94. # [00:53] * sgalineau__ is now known as sgalineau
  95. # [00:58] <benjamingr> Hixie: as in, be able to get the amount of available memory for the page in the browser, or a vague indication of it
  96. # [00:58] <zewt> even the browser probably doesn't know that
  97. # [00:58] <Hixie> oh, i see
  98. # [00:58] <Hixie> maybe in the web perf wg's set of specs?
  99. # [00:59] <benjamingr> In chrome, I can get it via the performance.memory object
  100. # [00:59] <Hixie> i don't know of anything offhand
  101. # [01:02] * Joins: ap_ (~ap@17.114.219.248)
  102. # [01:03] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:dcd1:d5d9:53e7:8249) (Disconnected by services)
  103. # [01:03] * ap_ is now known as ap
  104. # [01:07] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@c-50-148-162-19.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  105. # [01:08] * Quits: barnabywalters (~barnabywa@89.17.128.127) (Quit: barnabywalters)
  106. # [01:10] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.26.30) (Quit: othermaciej)
  107. # [01:12] * Joins: estellevw (~estellevw@173-228-112-232.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  108. # [01:13] <Hixie> whatwg spec editors: if your spec is too big for browsers to do the transitions i just added without making scrolling painful, add class=big to your <html> element.
  109. # [01:13] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@192.150.10.210)
  110. # [01:14] * Joins: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
  111. # [01:17] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  112. # [01:17] * Quits: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@66-194-1-26.STATIC.twtelecom.net) (Quit: jeffreyatw)
  113. # [01:18] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  114. # [01:22] * Joins: llkats (~llkats@h-64-236-138-1.aoltw.net)
  115. # [01:25] * Joins: seventh (seventh@207-207-24-143.fwd.datafoundry.com)
  116. # [01:26] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101)
  117. # [01:27] * Joins: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@66-194-1-26.STATIC.twtelecom.net)
  118. # [01:30] * Quits: seventh (seventh@207-207-24-143.fwd.datafoundry.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  119. # [01:32] * Quits: llkats (~llkats@h-64-236-138-1.aoltw.net)
  120. # [01:34] * Quits: sankha93 (~sankha93@fsf/emeritus/sankha93) (Remote host closed the connection)
  121. # [01:39] * Quits: coolbot95 (~coolbot95@gateway/tor-sasl/coolbot95) (Quit: coolbot95)
  122. # [01:40] * Joins: aretecode (~aretecode@64.120.6.170)
  123. # [01:44] * Joins: roc (~chatzilla@121-99-87-244.bng1.tvc.orcon.net.nz)
  124. # [01:45] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101) (Quit: tantek)
  125. # [01:56] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  126. # [02:05] * Quits: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@17.202.45.163) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  127. # [02:09] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-44-207.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  128. # [02:12] * Joins: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@76.74.153.49)
  129. # [02:14] * Quits: ap (~ap@17.114.219.248) (Remote host closed the connection)
  130. # [02:14] * Joins: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:8dae:5b07:7fc6:ef84)
  131. # [02:14] * Quits: ap (~ap@2620:149:4:304:8dae:5b07:7fc6:ef84) (Client Quit)
  132. # [02:16] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  133. # [02:16] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@corp.mtv2.mozilla.com) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87-8.1450hg.fc20 [XULRunner 29.0/20140428110119])
  134. # [02:23] * Quits: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@76.74.153.49) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  135. # [02:24] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101)
  136. # [02:27] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@c-50-148-162-19.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  137. # [02:28] * Joins: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@mobile-166-137-177-057.mycingular.net)
  138. # [02:28] * Quits: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@66-194-1-26.STATIC.twtelecom.net) (Quit: jeffreyatw)
  139. # [02:35] * Quits: jernoble|laptop (~jernoble@mobile-166-137-177-057.mycingular.net) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
  140. # [02:39] * Joins: espadrine` (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-52-86.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr)
  141. # [02:43] * Quits: espadrine (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-25-82.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  142. # [02:46] * Joins: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231)
  143. # [02:46] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  144. # [02:58] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231)
  145. # [03:02] * Quits: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231) (Quit: Leaving.)
  146. # [03:02] * Joins: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat)
  147. # [03:04] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  148. # [03:05] * Quits: estellevw (~estellevw@173-228-112-232.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: Snuggling with the puppies)
  149. # [03:10] * Quits: TuRnaD0 (~Thunderbi@x1-6-e0-46-9a-1e-fe-ca.cpe.webspeed.dk) (Quit: TuRnaD0)
  150. # [03:17] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101) (Quit: tantek)
  151. # [03:35] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  152. # [03:53] * Joins: GPHemsley (~GPHemsley@pdpc/supporter/student/GPHemsley)
  153. # [03:56] * Joins: estellevw (~estellevw@173-228-112-232.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  154. # [03:56] * Joins: llkats (~llkats@c-69-181-45-245.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  155. # [04:07] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@c-98-210-154-157.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  156. # [04:13] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  157. # [04:22] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101)
  158. # [04:23] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@c-98-210-154-157.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: sicking)
  159. # [04:28] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101) (Quit: tantek)
  160. # [04:35] * Joins: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon)
  161. # [04:49] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101)
  162. # [04:50] <MikeSmith> Hixie: about "should be easier to check questions such as can a p tag contain a div" no ideas jump to mind
  163. # [04:52] <MikeSmith> but, well, the content model is a hyperlink that says "phrasing content" and if you click on that link you get http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/elements.html#phrasing-content
  164. # [04:52] <MikeSmith> which is a complete list of elements that are allowed as phrasing content
  165. # [04:53] <MikeSmith> so not sure how much easier you can make it than you already have
  166. # [04:54] <Hixie> yeah i dunno either
  167. # [04:55] <MikeSmith> Hixie: I guess instead of that hyperlink, the complete list of those elements could be repeated at each place where you have "content model: hyperlink" now. But I don't think most people would think that'd be in improvement.
  168. # [04:56] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.43.222)
  169. # [04:56] <MikeSmith> or maybe the problem is that whoever reported that instead wants to have the list of elements that are _not_ allowed. Maybe they don't understand that by not being listed, that means they're not allowed.
  170. # [04:57] <MikeSmith> But if so I don't think most people have that confusion problem.
  171. # [04:58] <MikeSmith> so anyway "p can't contain div" seems pretty clear from what you have now. About as clear as you can practically make it.
  172. # [04:58] <Hixie> yeah maybe
  173. # [04:58] <Hixie> one thing i'm thinking of doing is having popups appear when you hover over a link, essentially telling you what the link points to
  174. # [04:58] <Hixie> no idea how i'm gonna do that exactly
  175. # [04:58] <Hixie> but that could solve this
  176. # [04:59] <MikeSmith> ah yeah, that would be helpful
  177. # [05:00] <MikeSmith> for the content model links, popups with the list of elements for "phrasing content" and "flow content" would be good
  178. # [05:01] <MikeSmith> and also for whatever the other classes of content are that are referenced in the content model sections
  179. # [05:14] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.43.222) (Quit: rniwa)
  180. # [05:19] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  181. # [05:20] * Joins: xiinotulp (~plutoniix@node-1b0c.pool-101-109.dynamic.totbb.net)
  182. # [05:22] * Quits: plutoniix (~plutoniix@node-69t.pool-125-25.dynamic.totbb.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  183. # [05:29] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101)
  184. # [05:29] * Quits: GPHemsley (~GPHemsley@pdpc/supporter/student/GPHemsley) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  185. # [05:34] * MikeSmith wonders what transitions Hixie is talking about
  186. # [05:37] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.101) (Quit: tantek)
  187. # [05:44] <Hixie> load the multipage version of the spec
  188. # [05:44] <Hixie> or the dom spec
  189. # [05:47] * Joins: mven_ (~textual@ip68-104-38-84.lv.lv.cox.net)
  190. # [05:49] <Hixie> MikeSmith: see them?
  191. # [06:43] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  192. # [06:47] * Quits: llkats (~llkats@c-69-181-45-245.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  193. # [06:48] <MikeSmith> Hixie: stepped out for a bit, looking now
  194. # [06:50] <MikeSmith> Hixie: page transitions?
  195. # [06:50] <MikeSmith> gradients at the end?
  196. # [06:57] <JonathanNeal> Anyone in here have experience with createShadowRoot?
  197. # [06:58] * xiinotulp is now known as plutoniix
  198. # [07:01] * Quits: Areks (~Areks@rs.gridnine.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  199. # [07:51] * Joins: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@199-188-192-248.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net)
  200. # [07:59] * Quits: jeffreyatw (~jeffreyat@199-188-192-248.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net) (Quit: jeffreyatw)
  201. # [08:05] * Joins: Areks (~Areks@rs.gridnine.com)
  202. # [08:05] * Joins: newbie (~Areks@rs.gridnine.com)
  203. # [08:06] * newbie is now known as Guest81586
  204. # [08:06] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  205. # [08:11] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  206. # [08:13] * Joins: zdobersek (~zan@109.201.154.141)
  207. # [08:17] <Hixie> MikeSmith: move your cursor off the page for a bit
  208. # [08:18] <MikeSmith> Hixie: ok, trying now
  209. # [08:18] <MikeSmith> Hixie: ah the link thing?
  210. # [08:19] <Hixie> not just links, but yeah
  211. # [08:19] <MikeSmith> I thought that was a browser bug :)
  212. # [08:19] <MikeSmith> yeah
  213. # [08:19] <MikeSmith> but now that I know what it is I like it
  214. # [08:19] <Hixie> some people seem to want less colour
  215. # [08:19] <Hixie> so...
  216. # [08:19] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@220.225.242.27)
  217. # [08:19] <MikeSmith> ah yeah it's very slow transition
  218. # [08:19] <Hixie> personally i use the colour to figure out what's going on
  219. # [08:19] <MikeSmith> Hixie: bingo
  220. # [08:19] * Quits: roc (~chatzilla@121-99-87-244.bng1.tvc.orcon.net.nz) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  221. # [08:20] <JonathanNeal> These are the 4 “element query” techniques I’ve heard of. Am I missing others? https://gist.github.com/jonathantneal/d4e27ac9a65a426e6870
  222. # [08:20] * Quits: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat) (Remote host closed the connection)
  223. # [08:21] <MikeSmith> Hixie: yeah the color is there for genuine functional purposes. I think the people who don't like are people who don't actually use the spec, or don't need to. And for them it just hurts their purist aesthetic sensibilities about what a good document should look like in general, I guess
  224. # [08:21] <Hixie> yeah
  225. # [08:21] <Hixie> i also added a lot of whitespace, which i think works ok
  226. # [08:22] <MikeSmith> Hixie: yeah I think we can all agree that more whitespace is better
  227. # [08:22] <Hixie> within reason
  228. # [08:23] <MikeSmith> sure yeah
  229. # [08:23] <Hixie> it did add about 50 pages to the pdf version...
  230. # [08:26] <MikeSmith> Hixie: well anybody who's nuts enough to try to print out the whole PDF doesn't have anybody to blame but themselves
  231. # [08:26] <Hixie> hah
  232. # [08:33] <MikeSmith> hmm wchen adding Gecko support for <template> in application/xhtml+xml
  233. # [08:33] <MikeSmith> I wonder if other engines are doing that too
  234. # [08:35] <MikeSmith> I can't remember what the decision about that was... I vaguely recall it being "we don't need to make <template> work for XML" being what everybody agreed to at one point at least
  235. # [08:37] <MikeSmith> Hixie: oh I see you do actually cover it now in the "Parsing XHTML documents" section
  236. # [08:40] <MikeSmith> Hixie: action item: XML Core WG to add <template>-parsing steps to the errata for the stable TR draft of XML 1.0 Fifth Edition
  237. # [08:41] * Hixie glares at MikeSmith
  238. # [08:57] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@134.199-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)
  239. # [09:00] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.44.231) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  240. # [09:41] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  241. # [09:42] * MikeSmith stumbles across https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/Navigator.requestWakeLock
  242. # [09:46] * Quits: nw (nw@kapsi.fi) (Quit: leaving)
  243. # [09:48] * Joins: nw (nw@kapsi.fi)
  244. # [10:00] * Joins: Maurice (copyman@5ED57922.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  245. # [10:04] * Joins: coolbot95 (~coolbot95@gateway/tor-sasl/coolbot95)
  246. # [10:10] * Joins: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231)
  247. # [10:19] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  248. # [10:19] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@220.225.242.27) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  249. # [10:20] * Quits: ivan\ (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  250. # [10:23] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Remote host closed the connection)
  251. # [10:25] * Joins: ivan\ (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001)
  252. # [10:31] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  253. # [10:31] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Client Quit)
  254. # [10:34] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  255. # [10:38] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Client Quit)
  256. # [10:42] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  257. # [10:54] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  258. # [11:05] * Joins: IZh (~chatzilla@0897578511.static.corbina.ru)
  259. # [11:18] <IZh> Hi. It seems that something is changed in CSS file http://www.whatwg.org/style/specification. The prince PDF generator complains: warning: failed to parse all CSS rules.
  260. # [11:19] * Joins: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
  261. # [11:25] * Quits: CvP (~CvP@27.147.199.131) (Disconnected by services)
  262. # [11:25] * Joins: xCG (~CvP@27.147.199.131)
  263. # [11:25] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  264. # [11:26] * xCG is now known as CvP
  265. # [11:29] <IZh> Currently PDF document generation is aborted at any error or warning. I prefer to generate clean documents. ;-) But I can ignore this warning.
  266. # [11:30] <IZh> By the way, what CSS validator you are using? I tried http://www.css-validator.org/, and it complains with lots of warnings and errors.
  267. # [11:34] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@host86-140-155-113.range86-140.btcentralplus.com) (Quit: Leaving.)
  268. # [11:37] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  269. # [11:39] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  270. # [11:41] <MikeSmith> IZh: the CSS validator has some known issues. there are some CSS3 things it doesn't recognize. e.g., content leader
  271. # [11:41] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
  272. # [11:42] <IZh> MikeSmith: Is there any other validators that can parse CSS3 correctly?
  273. # [11:44] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  274. # [11:44] <MikeSmith> IZh: maybe, but none that I know of. Myself I don't usually bother to validate my CSS unless I'm forced to
  275. # [11:48] * Quits: IZh (~chatzilla@0897578511.static.corbina.ru) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  276. # [11:49] * Joins: IZh (~chatzilla@0897578511.static.corbina.ru)
  277. # [12:02] <IZh> Hixie: In css rules for h1, h2, h3, h4, h5, h6 on line 44 "optimiseLegibility" -> "optimizeLegibility".
  278. # [12:04] <IZh> Also the block "DELETE ME" at the end is incorrectly commented because of nested comments that will produce parse errors.
  279. # [12:06] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  280. # [12:10] * Joins: josemanuel (~josemanue@80.30.2.189)
  281. # [12:11] * Quits: Areks (~Areks@rs.gridnine.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  282. # [12:11] * Quits: Guest81586 (~Areks@rs.gridnine.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  283. # [12:14] * Quits: coolbot95 (~coolbot95@gateway/tor-sasl/coolbot95) (Quit: coolbot95)
  284. # [12:29] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Excess Flood)
  285. # [12:31] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
  286. # [12:32] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  287. # [12:41] * Quits: night199uk (~night199u@xbmc/staff/night199uk) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  288. # [12:45] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  289. # [12:49] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  290. # [12:55] * Quits: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231) (Quit: Leaving.)
  291. # [12:58] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  292. # [12:59] * Joins: richt_ (~richt@91.216.105.42)
  293. # [13:03] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  294. # [13:03] * Quits: tomaw (tom@freenode/staff/tomaw) (Quit: Quitting)
  295. # [13:06] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  296. # [13:09] * Joins: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron)
  297. # [13:10] * Quits: richt_ (~richt@91.216.105.42) (Remote host closed the connection)
  298. # [13:10] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  299. # [13:15] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  300. # [13:22] * Quits: josemanuel (~josemanue@80.30.2.189) (Quit: Saliendo)
  301. # [13:28] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  302. # [13:33] * Joins: coolbot95 (~coolbot95@gateway/tor-sasl/coolbot95)
  303. # [13:37] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  304. # [13:42] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  305. # [13:45] * Joins: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231)
  306. # [13:46] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  307. # [13:46] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  308. # [13:47] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  309. # [13:51] * Quits: IZh (~chatzilla@0897578511.static.corbina.ru) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [SeaMonkey 2.26/20140428215944])
  310. # [13:53] * Joins: IZh (~Igor_Zhba@0897578511.static.corbina.ru)
  311. # [13:57] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  312. # [13:59] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  313. # [14:03] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  314. # [14:07] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Excess Flood)
  315. # [14:08] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
  316. # [14:09] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Excess Flood)
  317. # [14:10] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
  318. # [14:23] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  319. # [14:24] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  320. # [14:27] * Joins: richt_ (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  321. # [14:28] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  322. # [14:31] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@a213-22-1-7.cpe.netcabo.pt)
  323. # [14:31] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@a213-22-1-7.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  324. # [14:34] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  325. # [14:44] * Quits: richt_ (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  326. # [14:44] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  327. # [14:49] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  328. # [14:58] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  329. # [15:02] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@134.199-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) (Quit: bbl)
  330. # [15:26] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@101.57.123.36)
  331. # [15:27] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@101.57.123.36) (Client Quit)
  332. # [15:30] <MikeSmith> IZh: probably best to file bugs for those
  333. # [15:32] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  334. # [15:34] * Quits: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231) (Quit: Leaving.)
  335. # [15:34] * Joins: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231)
  336. # [15:35] * Quits: nessy (~silviapf@101.164.214.231) (Client Quit)
  337. # [15:37] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  338. # [15:38] <IZh> MikeSmith: I've sent a letter to Hixie. By the way, I have bought one commercial validator, so soon there will be more bug reports. ;-)
  339. # [15:39] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  340. # [15:47] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  341. # [15:51] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@c-5eeaaab1-74736162.cust.telenor.se)
  342. # [15:58] * Joins: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon)
  343. # [16:00] * Joins: seventh (seventh@103.17.199.189)
  344. # [16:04] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  345. # [16:07] <JonathanNeal> Curious, if external SVGs can have media queries, does that mean sticking a lot of SVGs on the page is as taxing on the browser as sticking a lot of iframes on the page?
  346. # [16:07] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  347. # [16:08] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@c-5eeaaab1-74736162.cust.telenor.se) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  348. # [16:11] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@184.175.16.140)
  349. # [16:22] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@94.234.170.177)
  350. # [16:27] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  351. # [16:28] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  352. # [16:31] * Joins: richt_ (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  353. # [16:31] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  354. # [16:36] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@94.234.170.177) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  355. # [16:37] * Quits: richt_ (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  356. # [16:38] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  357. # [16:39] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@101.57.123.36)
  358. # [16:39] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@101.57.123.36) (Client Quit)
  359. # [16:42] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  360. # [16:43] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  361. # [16:46] * Joins: GPHemsley (~GPHemsley@pdpc/supporter/student/GPHemsley)
  362. # [16:46] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@94.234.170.203)
  363. # [16:55] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@host86-140-155-113.range86-140.btcentralplus.com)
  364. # [16:57] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
  365. # [16:57] * Joins: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se)
  366. # [17:03] * Quits: richt (~richt@c83-248-137-176.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  367. # [17:03] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  368. # [17:12] <annevk> JonathanNeal: depends on how you embed them
  369. # [17:12] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@94.234.170.203) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  370. # [17:44] * Quits: zdobersek (~zan@109.201.154.141) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  371. # [17:49] * Joins: zdobersek (~zan@109.201.154.176)
  372. # [17:54] <JonathanNeal> annevk: is there a better way to embed them where they still respond to embedded media queries?
  373. # [18:09] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  374. # [18:10] * Quits: IZh (~Igor_Zhba@0897578511.static.corbina.ru) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  375. # [18:18] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  376. # [18:19] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@c-5eeaaacb-74736162.cust.telenor.se)
  377. # [18:21] * Quits: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  378. # [18:22] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
  379. # [18:23] * Joins: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron)
  380. # [18:40] * Quits: diffalot (~diffalot@c-76-107-128-104.hsd1.ms.comcast.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  381. # [18:44] * Joins: diffalot (~diffalot@c-76-107-128-104.hsd1.ms.comcast.net)
  382. # [18:45] * Quits: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  383. # [18:47] * Joins: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron)
  384. # [18:47] * Quits: rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  385. # [18:48] <JonathanNeal> annevk: i was using <object>
  386. # [18:48] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@c-5eeaaacb-74736162.cust.telenor.se) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  387. # [18:52] * Joins: rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me)
  388. # [18:52] <JonathanNeal> Which is the defacto method I think people are using.
  389. # [18:57] * Joins: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat)
  390. # [19:16] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Excess Flood)
  391. # [19:17] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-8914.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
  392. # [19:22] * Joins: barnabywalters (~barnabywa@89.17.128.127)
  393. # [19:26] * Quits: gavinc (~gavin@barad-dur.carothers.name) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
  394. # [19:28] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.afb.bredband2.com)
  395. # [19:29] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-44-207.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
  396. # [19:36] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@101.59.77.28)
  397. # [19:36] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@101.59.77.28) (Client Quit)
  398. # [19:37] * Joins: fredyt (~tobias_@athedsl-4514486.home.otenet.gr)
  399. # [19:47] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-44-207.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 32.0a1/20140513030201])
  400. # [19:49] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-44-207.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
  401. # [20:05] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.202.50.223)
  402. # [20:06] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-44-207.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  403. # [20:09] * Quits: GPHemsley (~GPHemsley@pdpc/supporter/student/GPHemsley) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  404. # [20:10] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  405. # [20:12] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.afb.bredband2.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  406. # [20:18] * Joins: shepazu (~shepazu@108-70-132-46.lightspeed.rlghnc.sbcglobal.net)
  407. # [20:22] * Joins: GPHemsley (~GPHemsley@pdpc/supporter/student/GPHemsley)
  408. # [20:22] * Quits: mven_ (~textual@ip68-104-38-84.lv.lv.cox.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  409. # [20:23] * Joins: mven_ (~textual@ip68-104-38-84.lv.lv.cox.net)
  410. # [20:24] <gsnedders> How is one meant to decide what URL schemes are safe to allow through a sanitizer?
  411. # [20:24] <gsnedders> Because, ergh.
  412. # [20:26] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@123.239.173.221)
  413. # [20:33] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@123.239.173.221) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  414. # [20:34] * Joins: annevk_ (~annevk@77-57-114-66.dclient.hispeed.ch)
  415. # [20:34] * Quits: annevk (~annevk@77-57-114-66.dclient.hispeed.ch) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  416. # [20:35] <gsnedders> Also, I hate the html5lib sanitizer.
  417. # [20:41] * Joins: annevk (~annevk@77-57-114-66.dclient.hispeed.ch)
  418. # [20:41] * Quits: annevk_ (~annevk@77-57-114-66.dclient.hispeed.ch) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  419. # [20:49] * Quits: estellevw (~estellevw@173-228-112-232.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  420. # [21:05] * Joins: lmclister (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  421. # [21:10] * Joins: IZh (~Igor_Zhba@0897578511.static.corbina.ru)
  422. # [21:12] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  423. # [21:16] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@a91-154-44-207.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
  424. # [21:25] <gsnedders> jgraham: html5lib/html5lib-python#151 should be quick/easy to deal with, plz.
  425. # [21:29] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  426. # [21:35] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  427. # [21:40] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  428. # [21:41] <IZh> On main page of whatwg.org "lang" attribute is missing on <html>.
  429. # [21:48] <tantek> YAGNI
  430. # [21:49] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  431. # [21:49] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  432. # [21:50] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  433. # [21:51] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  434. # [21:54] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  435. # [21:57] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  436. # [22:01] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Client Quit)
  437. # [22:03] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  438. # [22:07] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Client Quit)
  439. # [22:11] * Quits: fredyt (~tobias_@athedsl-4514486.home.otenet.gr) (Quit: bye to all o/)
  440. # [22:14] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.afb.bredband2.com)
  441. # [22:18] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.afb.bredband2.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  442. # [22:19] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  443. # [22:26] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  444. # [22:32] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@184.175.16.140) (Remote host closed the connection)
  445. # [22:40] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  446. # [22:42] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  447. # [22:45] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  448. # [22:56] <gsnedders> Wait, what? html5lib-tests includes tests for lone surrogates in the tokenizer tests, but not in the tree-construction tests? Um, okay.
  449. # [23:00] * Quits: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat) (Remote host closed the connection)
  450. # [23:00] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  451. # [23:22] * Quits: lmclister (~lmclister@c-98-210-38-110.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  452. # [23:25] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  453. # [23:31] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  454. # [23:40] * Quits: IZh (~Igor_Zhba@0897578511.static.corbina.ru) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [SeaMonkey 2.26/20140428215944])
  455. # [23:42] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
  456. # [23:43] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@184.175.16.140)
  457. # [23:45] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  458. # [23:47] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@host86-140-155-113.range86-140.btcentralplus.com) (Quit: Leaving.)
  459. # [23:47] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@184.175.16.140) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  460. # [23:48] * Quits: Maurice (copyman@5ED57922.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  461. # [23:48] * Quits: zdobersek (~zan@109.201.154.176) (Quit: Leaving.)
  462. # [23:50] <Hixie> JonathanNeal: <object> for svg is in fact exactly equivalent to <iframe> under the hood, iirc
  463. # [23:50] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  464. # [23:51] <JonathanNeal> Hixie: KNEW IT! Thanks a ton.
  465. # [23:51] <JonathanNeal> Okay Hixie, the followup is: is it taxing on a page to have a bunch of SVGs loaded with <object>?
  466. # [23:52] <Hixie> no more so than having a bunch of <iframe>s
  467. # [23:52] <JonathanNeal> And is that taxing?
  468. # [23:52] <Hixie> more so than having inline svg, probably, though
  469. # [23:52] <JonathanNeal> (when I said “KNEW IT” I meant in the sense of “ah good, the data suggested this”)
  470. # [23:52] <Hixie> iframes are as taxing as a new tab, basically. well, not quite as much.
  471. # [23:53] <Hixie> i would treat a Document as expensive, in theory
  472. # [23:53] <Hixie> in practice...
  473. # [23:53] <Hixie> what do i know
  474. # [23:53] <Hixie> the doc i publish is 1000+ pages
  475. # [23:53] <JonathanNeal> A document or a tab is pretty expensive, no? Or are they as expensive as createDocumentFragment?
  476. # [23:54] <Hixie> document fragments are (hopefully) way cheaper than whole documents, which are way cheaper than document+window pairs
  477. # [23:54] * Quits: seventh (seventh@103.17.199.189) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  478. # [23:54] <JonathanNeal> Is <object> cheaper than document+window? Same with <iframe>?
  479. # [23:55] <Hixie> object or iframe = document+window
  480. # [23:55] <JonathanNeal> ouch.
  481. # [23:56] <Hixie> i should say, object when rendered using a nested browsing context = iframe = document+window
  482. # [23:56] <caitp> do any user agents actually have a concept of browsing contexts as they are in the web apps specs
  483. # [23:57] <JonathanNeal> The <object data="path/to/some.svg"> method was recommended for svgs + art direction. I never thought about them being mini iframes scattered throughtout the page.
  484. # [23:57] <Hixie> caitp: the spec is written to match what browsers do, so, in theory, at least, yes... i'm sure there's differences though
  485. # [23:58] <caitp> I saw a bug on gecko that involved a bunch of hacks to implement a subset of it as specified, and as far as I can tell there's no proper analog in blink, so I'm not sure if that's actually the case
  486. # [23:59] <caitp> unless opera/webkit/ie are doing it all
  487. # [23:59] <Hixie> how does what the browsers have differ from the spec? (and could you phrase your answer in the form of a bug report at http://whatwg.org/newbug :-) )
  488. # Session Close: Sun May 18 00:00:00 2014

The end :)