/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2014-07-03 / end

Options:

  1. # Session Start: Thu Jul 03 00:00:00 2014
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  3. # [00:00] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  4. # [00:02] <mounir_> it seems that you guys are the only persons who really care, it would be great if you could find some agreement...
  5. # [00:03] <abarth> mounir_: why don't we continue with the implementation
  6. # [00:04] <mounir_> eh... that's the problem
  7. # [00:05] <abarth> why is that a problem?
  8. # [00:05] <mounir_> if I land a patch going one way, let's be honest, I'm not going to write a spec going the other way
  9. # [00:05] <abarth> great
  10. # [00:05] <abarth> problem solved
  11. # [00:07] <mounir_> I wouldn't say that
  12. # [00:07] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.19) (Quit: othermaciej)
  13. # [00:07] <abarth> what I'd probably do in your place is open an issue in the working groups tracker and move forward
  14. # [00:08] <abarth> eventually you'll need to resolve the issues in the tracker before advancing the spec to CR
  15. # [00:08] <Ms2ger> Meh, w3process
  16. # [00:08] <abarth> if you wait for everyone to agree before writing each line of code, you'll wait for a long time
  17. # [00:09] <Hixie> just ask whoever the spec editor is to make a decision
  18. # [00:09] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2) (Remote host closed the connection)
  19. # [00:09] <Ms2ger> Well, that's mounir_
  20. # [00:09] <Hixie> hawkward
  21. # [00:09] <Hixie> ask another vendor to make a decision, and do whatever they say?
  22. # [00:09] <jgraham> Hixie: &alphabetical_attributes=on
  23. # [00:09] * Joins: marcosc_ (~marcosc@2001:450:1f:224:7048:8c6d:7c8d:bc9b)
  24. # [00:09] <Hixie> sweet
  25. # [00:10] <jgraham> Hixie: Seems past me had a very strange idea about what "defaults" meant
  26. # [00:10] <Hixie> heh
  27. # [00:10] <Hixie> i know that feeling
  28. # [00:10] <jgraham> In this case they seemed to mean "defaults, but only if a parameter value was actually supplied, which for booleans could only be true anyway"
  29. # [00:10] * Quits: paul_irish (~paul_iris@ve.hsh6wjwx.vesrv.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  30. # [00:11] * Quits: rwaldron (rwaldron@gateway/shell/jquery.com/x-ahvifyijhulzmyyt) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  31. # [00:11] * Quits: scott_gonzalez (gonzasi0@gateway/shell/jquery.com/x-vrdpzbzpflftnngt) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  32. # [00:11] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@173-167-114-230-sfba.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: tantek)
  33. # [00:12] * Joins: paul_irish (~paul_iris@ve.hsh6wjwx.vesrv.com)
  34. # [00:13] <jgraham> mounir_: Toss a coin, and if that doesn't help, toss a salad? At least that way you'll have some delicious salad (assuming you put delicious things in your salad. If you mainly put in iceberg lettuce you will have a soggy disappointment go go with your spec woes)
  35. # [00:13] * Quits: shepazu (~shepazu@ip-64-134-46-113.public.wayport.net) (Quit: is sleepy)
  36. # [00:13] <mounir_> abarth: what bothers me is that given that the Blink implementation will be blocked to a specific solution, I can't realisticly spec something different
  37. # [00:14] <mounir_> I would need to be slightly crazy to implement something and spec something else
  38. # [00:14] * Joins: scott_gonzalez (gonzasi0@gateway/shell/jquery.com/x-sjovwfbeulpfmnry)
  39. # [00:14] <Hixie> are there other implementations?
  40. # [00:14] <abarth> mounir_: sure, but you can log an issue and change both the spec and the implementation when the issue is resolved
  41. # [00:14] * Quits: marcosc_ (~marcosc@2001:450:1f:224:7048:8c6d:7c8d:bc9b) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  42. # [00:14] <mounir_> abarth: except that the issue will unlikely be resolved in another way than what you want to be implemented
  43. # [00:15] * Joins: rwaldron (rwaldron@gateway/shell/jquery.com/x-fqgksaayokajnnwb)
  44. # [00:15] <mounir_> abarth: given that Blink will anyway not implement it the other way, right?
  45. # [00:15] * jgraham doesn't know what the actual issue is
  46. # [00:15] * Hixie either
  47. # [00:15] <abarth> mounir_: you're just making assumptions
  48. # [00:15] <abarth> mounir_: why do you assume that?
  49. # [00:16] <mounir_> abarth: there are two patches up there, one is blocked, the other one is ready to land
  50. # [00:16] <abarth> right
  51. # [00:16] <abarth> so land the CL that's ready to land
  52. # [00:16] <abarth> that doesn't foreclose changing the implementation later
  53. # [00:16] * Ms2ger isn't sure of that in general
  54. # [00:17] <abarth> Ms2ger: this whole feature is experimental, which means we aren't shipping it
  55. # [00:17] <Ms2ger> Good good
  56. # [00:18] <mounir_> abarth: will do that
  57. # [00:18] <caitp> which feature? // curiousity
  58. # [00:18] <abarth> ScreenOrientation
  59. # [00:18] <mounir_> abarth: but I would be surprise that it doesn't ship for M38
  60. # [00:18] <caitp> ah
  61. # [00:18] <abarth> mounir_: well, they'll be an intent-to-ship email
  62. # [00:18] <abarth> that folks are welcome to raise concerns in
  63. # [00:19] <abarth> presumably you're going to write that email. If you don't think the spec is mature enough, then we're not very likely to ship the feature
  64. # [00:19] <abarth> shipping is the gate that locks things in. implementation behind a flag doesn't
  65. # [00:23] <Hixie> jgraham: fwiw, getting 504s. i'll keep trying, it's probably intermittent.
  66. # [00:25] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  67. # [00:26] <jgraham> Hixie: OK, it worked for me
  68. # [00:26] <Hixie> it worked the third time
  69. # [00:26] <Hixie> looks perfect, attributes in order and everything
  70. # [00:26] <Hixie> thanks!
  71. # [00:28] * Quits: abinader (sid21713@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-livjvrqdqpykwlmy)
  72. # [00:28] * Quits: bnicholson (~bnicholso@cpe-174-107-192-094.sc.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  73. # [00:30] * Joins: newtron_work (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
  74. # [00:34] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  75. # [00:34] * Quits: newtron_work (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  76. # [00:35] <Hixie> jgraham: is there a flag for not omitting end tags, by any chance?
  77. # [00:38] <jgraham> Er, it omits end tags?
  78. # [00:40] <jgraham> Oh right maybe if you are passing omit_optional_tags
  79. # [00:40] <jgraham> So just removing that might help
  80. # [00:41] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.19)
  81. # [00:42] <MikeSmith> Hixie: a while back bz pointed out that the Navigation Timing spec is using the term "current document" and "previous document" but never defines them
  82. # [00:42] <MikeSmith> Hixie: e.g., https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/webperf/raw-file/tip/specs/NavigationTiming/Overview.html#dom-performancetiming-navigationstart
  83. # [00:42] <Hixie> jgraham: ah, excellent
  84. # [00:42] <MikeSmith> Hixie: "This attribute must return the time immediately after the user agent finishes prompting to unload the previous document. If there is no previous document, this attribute must return the time the current document is created."
  85. # [00:42] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  86. # [00:42] <Hixie> MikeSmith: those terms would be easy to define
  87. # [00:42] <Hixie> MikeSmith: given the session history
  88. # [00:42] <MikeSmith> yeah?
  89. # [00:43] <Hixie> yeah
  90. # [00:43] <Hixie> current document is just "active document"
  91. # [00:43] <MikeSmith> can't they just use terminology that's all ready in the HTML spec? just reference terms
  92. # [00:43] <MikeSmith> ah
  93. # [00:43] <MikeSmith> yeah
  94. # [00:43] <Hixie> and "previous document" is something like "document for the entry before the first entry of the active document" or something
  95. # [00:43] <MikeSmith> OK that's what I thought for current document
  96. # [00:43] <MikeSmith> ok
  97. # [00:44] <Hixie> though exactly what they want depends on how they want to handle things like bfcache, bfcache eviction, fragmetn navigations, pushState, etc.
  98. # [00:44] <Hixie> not to mention history traversal
  99. # [00:44] <MikeSmith> well
  100. # [00:45] <MikeSmith> I think the spec doesn't go into details in those areas that maybe it should
  101. # [00:45] <MikeSmith> but I dunno I haven't looked too deeply and kinda don't want to
  102. # [00:45] <MikeSmith> I'm glad at least that bz has been taking the time
  103. # [00:46] * Joins: othermaciej_ (~mjs@17.114.217.16)
  104. # [00:46] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.19) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  105. # [00:46] * othermaciej_ is now known as othermaciej
  106. # [00:47] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  107. # [01:01] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  108. # [01:02] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  109. # [01:04] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  110. # [01:04] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  111. # [01:09] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  112. # [01:09] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@10.212-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) (Quit: nn)
  113. # [01:20] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.217.16) (Quit: othermaciej)
  114. # [01:28] * Quits: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  115. # [01:28] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  116. # [01:28] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  117. # [01:33] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.217.16)
  118. # [01:33] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  119. # [01:34] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.217.16) (Client Quit)
  120. # [01:36] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  121. # [01:38] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102) (Remote host closed the connection)
  122. # [01:40] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  123. # [01:40] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  124. # [01:47] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  125. # [01:48] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Client Quit)
  126. # [01:49] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  127. # [01:53] * Quits: mpaarating (~mpaaratin@rrcs-97-78-217-146.se.biz.rr.com) (Quit: mpaarating)
  128. # [01:59] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.226)
  129. # [02:02] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  130. # [02:02] * Joins: mven_ (~textual@ip68-104-38-84.lv.lv.cox.net)
  131. # [02:02] * Quits: jsbell (jsbell@nat/google/x-qidjtjrrewdxgccv) (Quit: There's no place like home...)
  132. # [02:05] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  133. # [02:05] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  134. # [02:06] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.226) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  135. # [02:07] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.226)
  136. # [02:08] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@172.56.38.226) (Client Quit)
  137. # [02:10] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  138. # [02:15] * Quits: mven (~textual@169.241.49.57) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  139. # [02:24] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@84-231-76-254.elisa-mobile.fi) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  140. # [02:26] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.114.217.224) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  141. # [02:27] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  142. # [02:27] * Joins: benschwarz (uid2121@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vijuaqvijahxbeho)
  143. # [02:30] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  144. # [02:30] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:503f:cd45:3803:8e08) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  145. # [02:31] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:503f:cd45:3803:8e08)
  146. # [02:33] * Quits: ambv_ (~ambv@173.252.71.129) (Quit: sys.exit(0) # app closed)
  147. # [02:34] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  148. # [02:38] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  149. # [02:42] * Quits: espadrine_ (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-49-173.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  150. # [02:44] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  151. # [02:49] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  152. # [02:51] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87-8.1450hg.fc20 [XULRunner 29.0/20140428110119])
  153. # [02:53] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  154. # [02:55] * Joins: espadrine_ (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-26-218.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr)
  155. # [02:59] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.43.222) (Quit: rniwa)
  156. # [03:03] * Joins: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@174.107.192.94)
  157. # [03:05] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  158. # [03:06] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  159. # [03:06] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Client Quit)
  160. # [03:12] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  161. # [03:14] * Joins: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon)
  162. # [03:16] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@c-50-157-151-94.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
  163. # [03:16] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:503f:cd45:3803:8e08) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  164. # [03:20] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  165. # [03:24] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  166. # [03:26] * Joins: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat)
  167. # [03:29] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  168. # [03:31] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  169. # [03:31] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  170. # [03:36] * Joins: jdaggett (~jdaggett@61-121-216-2.bitcat.net)
  171. # [03:44] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2)
  172. # [03:47] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  173. # [03:47] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  174. # [03:49] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@17.114.219.114)
  175. # [03:50] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  176. # [03:57] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  177. # [03:57] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@c-50-157-151-94.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  178. # [03:59] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  179. # [04:03] * Quits: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@174.107.192.94) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  180. # [04:06] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@50-0-128-161.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  181. # [04:09] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@17.114.219.114) (Quit: weinig)
  182. # [04:11] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.25.53)
  183. # [04:11] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.25.53) (Client Quit)
  184. # [04:16] * Joins: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  185. # [04:17] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.25.53)
  186. # [04:18] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  187. # [04:18] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.25.53) (Client Quit)
  188. # [04:20] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  189. # [04:23] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  190. # [04:30] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.36)
  191. # [04:36] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-535807.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Excess Flood)
  192. # [04:36] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-535807.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
  193. # [04:43] * Joins: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@cpe-174-107-192-094.sc.res.rr.com)
  194. # [04:43] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  195. # [04:49] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  196. # [04:51] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  197. # [04:56] * Quits: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@cpe-174-107-192-094.sc.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  198. # [04:58] * Joins: plutoniix (~plutoniix@ppp-124-122-133-211.revip2.asianet.co.th)
  199. # [05:04] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  200. # [05:06] * Quits: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  201. # [05:06] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  202. # [05:09] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  203. # [05:16] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.36) (Quit: othermaciej)
  204. # [05:19] * Quits: ivan\ (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001) (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs))
  205. # [05:25] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  206. # [05:28] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: tantek)
  207. # [05:55] * Joins: dddh (~Zumu@pdpc/supporter/active/dddh)
  208. # [06:05] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  209. # [06:07] <Domenic> Mounir_: Honestly I would rather have .screenAngle and .screenType at this point if abarth is going to block on introducing a record.
  210. # [06:09] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  211. # [06:09] * Joins: bholley_ (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  212. # [06:10] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  213. # [06:10] * Joins: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  214. # [06:15] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  215. # [06:15] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  216. # [06:19] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  217. # [06:29] * SamB records Domenic's statement in his logfiles
  218. # [06:31] * Quits: bholley_ (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  219. # [06:34] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  220. # [06:34] * Quits: roc (~chatzilla@2001:cb0:b202:232:2677:3ff:fece:dc64) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  221. # [06:35] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  222. # [06:35] * Quits: montecfel (~montecfel@gateway/tor-sasl/montecfel) (Quit: montecfel)
  223. # [06:36] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  224. # [06:40] * Joins: ivan\ (~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001)
  225. # [06:43] * Quits: benschwarz (uid2121@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vijuaqvijahxbeho) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  226. # [06:45] * Joins: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@174.107.192.94)
  227. # [06:49] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  228. # [06:53] * Quits: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@174.107.192.94) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  229. # [06:55] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  230. # [07:00] * Joins: roc (~chatzilla@121-99-92-181.bng1.tvc.orcon.net.nz)
  231. # [07:02] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147)
  232. # [07:03] * Joins: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  233. # [07:05] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147) (Client Quit)
  234. # [07:10] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147)
  235. # [07:16] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  236. # [07:20] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  237. # [07:20] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  238. # [07:23] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  239. # [07:24] * Quits: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  240. # [07:26] * Quits: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat) (Remote host closed the connection)
  241. # [07:37] * Joins: musically_ut (~musically@2a02:120b:c3f4:f9e0:a11:96ff:fefb:db24)
  242. # [07:45] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  243. # [07:48] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@host81-156-26-27.range81-156.btcentralplus.com)
  244. # [07:51] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  245. # [07:53] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@50-0-128-161.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  246. # [07:56] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  247. # [08:12] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  248. # [08:13] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  249. # [08:18] * Joins: Ducki (~Ducki@191.233.66.1)
  250. # [08:24] * Joins: wartdev (~wartdev@109.255.148.96)
  251. # [08:26] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@host81-156-26-27.range81-156.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  252. # [08:28] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  253. # [08:35] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@50-0-128-161.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  254. # [08:37] * Quits: kangil (~kangil@210.94.41.89) (Remote host closed the connection)
  255. # [08:37] * Quits: dwim (~dwim@210.94.41.89) (Remote host closed the connection)
  256. # [08:40] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@50-0-128-161.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  257. # [08:48] * Quits: aretecode (~aretecode@173.192.170.114-static.reverse.softlayer.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  258. # [08:51] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@98.234.191.242)
  259. # [08:52] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  260. # [08:52] * Joins: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201)
  261. # [08:54] * Quits: fredy (~fredy@snf-535807.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) (Excess Flood)
  262. # [08:55] * Joins: fredy (~fredy@snf-535807.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr)
  263. # [08:56] * Joins: zdobersek (~zan@130.185.155.130)
  264. # [08:56] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  265. # [08:57] <ManishCloud> annevk: Oh, so you can only fetch HTTP(s). Alright, thanks. This deviates from the actual implementation in Gecko/Blink a bit, but no problem
  266. # [08:57] <annevk> ManishCloud: no you can't
  267. # [08:57] <ManishCloud> ?
  268. # [08:57] <annevk> ManishCloud: #concept-fetch handles all URL schemes
  269. # [08:57] <annevk> ManishCloud: and defines the security policy for all of them too
  270. # [08:58] <annevk> ManishCloud: however, CORS is an HTTP protocol
  271. # [08:58] <ManishCloud> it handles data and about
  272. # [08:58] <ManishCloud> and http(s)
  273. # [08:58] <annevk> ManishCloud: so only the parts of #concept-fetch that end up in the HTTP pipeline will do CORS
  274. # [08:58] <annevk> ManishCloud: and blob and ftp and file
  275. # [08:58] <annevk> ManishCloud: and soon filesystem
  276. # [08:59] <annevk> ManishCloud: a proper implementation of XMLHttpRequest is built on top a proper implementation of Fetch
  277. # [08:59] <ManishCloud> yep
  278. # [08:59] * Quits: musically_ut (~musically@2a02:120b:c3f4:f9e0:a11:96ff:fefb:db24) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  279. # [09:00] <SamB> annevk: of course, CORS is totally beside the point for data: URLs anyway, yes?
  280. # [09:01] <ManishCloud> I still don't see any rule for ftp. It handles data, then about, then some request modes, then it says that non-http/https should return a network error
  281. # [09:01] <ManishCloud> SamB: strangely enough Blink doesn't seem to allow fetching of data
  282. # [09:01] <annevk> ManishCloud: it depends on the request mode
  283. # [09:02] <annevk> ManishCloud: if you're only considering XMLHttpRequest, then yes, XMLHttpRequest can only Fetch ftp if from an ftp URL (as then they're same-origin)
  284. # [09:02] <ManishCloud> okay
  285. # [09:02] <annevk> ManishCloud: but e.g. <img>'s request mode is "No CORS" by default, and therefore can fetch ftp all the time (although it would end up being a tainted response)
  286. # [09:03] <annevk> SamB: yeah, it's not entirely inconceivable that we add CORS things to non-HTTP schemes, but I kind of doubt it
  287. # [09:04] <ManishCloud> oh, I see
  288. # [09:04] <SamB> annevk: well, with data: the data is all in the URL anyway so it's totally pointless, no?
  289. # [09:04] <SamB> no information leakage is possible, as the information is pre-leaked
  290. # [09:06] <annevk> SamB: yeah
  291. # [09:07] <ManishCloud> annevk: in case of an <img> it's an opaque taint, though. Isn't opaque almost the same as a network error?
  292. # [09:07] <ManishCloud> (how does that work)
  293. # [09:08] <annevk> ManishCloud: the implementation of <img> has special privileges in that it can access the internal response to decode the bytes returned and leak some information through width/height
  294. # [09:08] * Quits: GPHemsley (~GPHemsley@pdpc/supporter/student/GPHemsley) (Remote host closed the connection)
  295. # [09:08] <annevk> ManishCloud: that's a bit of a legacy bug
  296. # [09:08] <SamB> annevk: it doesn't also tell you if the load outright failed?
  297. # [09:08] <annevk> SamB: it does?
  298. # [09:08] <SamB> I don't know
  299. # [09:08] <annevk> I'm not sure what you're asking
  300. # [09:08] <SamB> I guess you could guess pretty well though
  301. # [09:09] <SamB> if the placeholder image has a predictable width/height ...
  302. # [09:09] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Quit: :tiuQ tiuq sah woclrak)
  303. # [09:09] <annevk> SamB: if fetch returns a network error <img> will dispatch an error event
  304. # [09:10] <SamB> that's what I was thinking of, yes
  305. # [09:10] <annevk> With legacy APIs you can definitely distinguish between tainting and network errors, it's a bit of a bug that's been exploited all over
  306. # [09:10] <ManishCloud> annevk: Oh, I see.
  307. # [09:10] <SamB> how hard can you exploit that?
  308. # [09:11] <SamB> doesn't seem as bad as the old :visited problem ...
  309. # [09:12] <SamB> oh, you know what I hate? auth dialogs for <img>s
  310. # [09:12] <ManishCloud> :o
  311. # [09:13] * Joins: Kolombiken (~Adium@gateway.creuna.se)
  312. # [09:13] <SamB> there was this one thing that tried to load favicons from a bunch of domains, I think the idea was to see if your ISP was blocking any of them?
  313. # [09:14] <SamB> but some of them popped up those stupid dialogs :-(
  314. # [09:14] <annevk> Authentication dialogs can be spawn from pretty much any API
  315. # [09:14] <ManishCloud> SamB: imagine what happens when you're behind a misconfigured authenticated HTTP proxy
  316. # [09:14] <annevk> Only the very newest of APIs have that disabled
  317. # [09:15] * Joins: musically_ut (~musically@2a02:120b:c3f4:f9e0:a11:96ff:fefb:db24)
  318. # [09:15] <SamB> might be nice to rate limit them or something ;-)
  319. # [09:15] <ManishCloud> has happened to me. They broke login; usually after a couple of failed logins it returns an html error page. But if there are many images, well, boom.
  320. # [09:15] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@176.12.107.140)
  321. # [09:15] <annevk> SamB: you can figure out whether someone has an account with a certain site (the problem is made worse due to sending cookies along with the request, but it essentially exists because the user resides on a different IP than the server)
  322. # [09:16] <SamB> annevk: hmm
  323. # [09:16] <SamB> so, like, do they have a met-art account or whatever
  324. # [09:17] <SamB> maybe something a bit more embarrassing
  325. # [09:20] * Joins: Smylers1 (~smylers@94.116.83.145)
  326. # [09:20] <annevk> Or if your government is hostile and tries to track which organizations you are affiliated with...
  327. # [09:20] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@176.12.107.140) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  328. # [09:20] <SamB> true
  329. # [09:20] <annevk> ManishCloud: you're implementing this for Servo?
  330. # [09:21] <SamB> that's what he said
  331. # [09:21] <ManishCloud> annevk: CORS? sort of
  332. # [09:21] <annevk> ManishCloud: I recommend implementing Fetch
  333. # [09:21] <ManishCloud> annevk: So I'm writing it XHR-specific but I intend to integrate this into Teepee (a full Rust implementation of fetch.s.w.o) later
  334. # [09:21] <annevk> s.w.o?
  335. # [09:22] <ManishCloud> spec.whatwg.org
  336. # [09:22] <annevk> heh
  337. # [09:22] <ManishCloud> Teepee intends to implement the fetch spec (not the browser specific things like Request and fetch() )
  338. # [09:22] <annevk> Pointer to GitHub?
  339. # [09:23] * Quits: musically_ut (~musically@2a02:120b:c3f4:f9e0:a11:96ff:fefb:db24) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  340. # [09:23] <ManishCloud> As far as implementing fetch() in Servo, I'll do that when Teepee is stable; no point implementing it with rust-http when I'll have to do all the plumbing that Teepee plans to do all over again
  341. # [09:23] <ManishCloud> annevk: https://github.com/teepee/teepee
  342. # [09:23] <annevk> Sounds good I guess, as long as you guys have the better picture in mind
  343. # [09:23] <annevk> I don't really care about fetch()
  344. # [09:23] <ManishCloud> annevk: then?
  345. # [09:23] <annevk> I mostly care about Fetch
  346. # [09:24] <ManishCloud> oh, #concept-fetch
  347. # [09:24] <annevk> That <img>, XMLHttpRequest, background-image, etc. all call into the same library to get a bag of bits
  348. # [09:24] <ManishCloud> Teepee ought to solve that problem
  349. # [09:24] <annevk> After that fetch() is relatively straightforward
  350. # [09:24] <ManishCloud> Exactly, that's why I haven't implemented it yet ;p
  351. # [09:25] <annevk> If Teepee is a generic HTTP toolkit, they might not be okay into making it something specific to clients
  352. # [09:26] <ManishCloud> I'm not the maintainer of Teepee, but I believe that it should be easy to just do `let req = Request::new(method, url, header, mode, blah)` and then call `req.fetch()` or something (with channels/hooks for the task queues)
  353. # [09:26] <ManishCloud> annevk: it has both a client and server library. As well as some common stuff (like headers/methods)
  354. # [09:27] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  355. # [09:27] <ManishCloud> It's not for browser specific stuff, but most of the spec isn't browser specific
  356. # [09:27] <annevk> Why would an HTTP library be interested in data URLs?
  357. # [09:27] <annevk> Or service workers?
  358. # [09:27] <ManishCloud> Good point
  359. # [09:27] <annevk> Or CORS?
  360. # [09:27] <ManishCloud> I need to discuss this with Chris as well, but first I'll try to get CORS done. If Chris doesn't want #concept-fetch, I'll write a wrapper for Teepee
  361. # [09:28] <ManishCloud> annevk: he said he does want CORS
  362. # [09:28] <ManishCloud> one sec
  363. # [09:28] <annevk> Oh
  364. # [09:28] <annevk> Fetch is basically a big superset of a client-side HTTP library with some tweaks
  365. # [09:28] <annevk> And these days JavaScript hooks (service workers)
  366. # [09:29] <ManishCloud> annevk: https://botbot.me/mozilla/rust/2014-06-30/?msg=17205109&page=9
  367. # [09:30] <ManishCloud> yep
  368. # [09:30] <annevk> I guess you can guys can sort out the planning, now you know how it works
  369. # [09:33] * Quits: Smylers1 (~smylers@94.116.83.145) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  370. # [09:34] <ManishCloud> yep :P
  371. # [09:34] <ManishCloud> :)
  372. # [09:35] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@98.234.191.242) (Quit: weinig)
  373. # [09:36] * Joins: jungkees (uid24208@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-axpgetdzzgkkqphb)
  374. # [09:37] <ManishCloud> anyway, thanks for the help!
  375. # [09:44] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  376. # [09:44] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  377. # [09:49] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@81.143.60.194)
  378. # [09:53] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  379. # [09:55] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  380. # [09:55] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  381. # [09:57] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  382. # [10:00] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@91.182.24.9)
  383. # [10:04] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  384. # [10:05] * Joins: Jirka (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  385. # [10:07] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  386. # [10:09] * Quits: wartdev (~wartdev@109.255.148.96) (Remote host closed the connection)
  387. # [10:14] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  388. # [10:34] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  389. # [10:34] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  390. # [10:38] * Joins: sankha93 (uid12218@fsf/emeritus/sankha93)
  391. # [10:39] * Joins: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl)
  392. # [10:44] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  393. # [10:48] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  394. # [10:48] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Client Quit)
  395. # [10:49] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  396. # [10:50] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  397. # [10:51] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  398. # [10:54] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  399. # [10:56] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  400. # [10:56] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  401. # [11:03] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  402. # [11:05] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  403. # [11:06] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  404. # [11:06] * Quits: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: estellevw)
  405. # [11:07] * Quits: jdaggett (~jdaggett@61-121-216-2.bitcat.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  406. # [11:08] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Client Quit)
  407. # [11:09] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  408. # [11:09] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  409. # [11:10] * Joins: Lachy_ (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  410. # [11:10] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  411. # [11:14] * Quits: Lachy_ (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Client Quit)
  412. # [11:16] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  413. # [11:17] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  414. # [11:19] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147)
  415. # [11:29] <annevk> tobie: asURL() still seems simplest, the others get tricky; e.g. request has an origin that won't be the origin of the URL
  416. # [11:29] <annevk> tobie: at least not always
  417. # [11:30] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  418. # [11:32] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Client Quit)
  419. # [11:34] * Joins: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:40f:31b9:8897:76a:7642:5da5)
  420. # [11:46] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  421. # [12:01] * Joins: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.121)
  422. # [12:12] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  423. # [12:25] <hsivonen> MikeSmith: I'll need to figure out how to deploy from git first. Not going to happen today. Tomorrow hopefully.
  424. # [12:26] <MikeSmith> hsivonen: no rush then. Tomorrow's a US holiday anyway, so a lot of people would miss any announcement. So it can wait til next week or after.
  425. # [12:29] * Quits: scrollback (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-leynqngkmkorczpk) (Remote host closed the connection)
  426. # [12:31] * Joins: scrollback (scrollback@conference/jsconf/x-vpgkoxseymdbjwxj)
  427. # [12:32] * Joins: darobin (~darobin@78.109.80.74)
  428. # [12:36] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
  429. # [12:45] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com)
  430. # [12:54] * Quits: Ducki (~Ducki@191.233.66.1) (Quit: Leaving)
  431. # [12:56] * Joins: ashemedai (asmodai@freebsd/developer/asmodai)
  432. # [12:57] * Quits: Manishearth (manisheart@wikipedia/Manishearth) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  433. # [12:57] * Quits: odinho (odinho@dalvik.ping.uio.no) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  434. # [12:58] * Quits: asmodai (asmodai@freebsd/developer/asmodai) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  435. # [12:58] * Joins: richt (~richt@192.121.59.29)
  436. # [12:58] * Joins: odinho (odinho@dalvik.ping.uio.no)
  437. # [13:00] * Joins: Manishearth (manisheart@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-hauozszllhltagbm)
  438. # [13:00] * Manishearth is now known as Guest59926
  439. # [13:00] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM602ad06daeed.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  440. # [13:01] * Joins: scor (~scor@c-24-2-162-32.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
  441. # [13:01] * Quits: scor (~scor@c-24-2-162-32.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Changing host)
  442. # [13:01] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  443. # [13:06] * Quits: richt (~richt@192.121.59.29) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  444. # [13:12] * Quits: plutoniix (~plutoniix@ppp-124-122-133-211.revip2.asianet.co.th) (Quit: จรลี จรลา)
  445. # [13:13] <annevk> Ms2ger: should we revive the thing where we use a single entry to reference a bunch of specs?
  446. # [13:14] <annevk> Ms2ger: seems somewhat useful for XML, but especially HTTP
  447. # [13:14] <Ms2ger> Mm, perhaps
  448. # [13:14] * Quits: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:40f:31b9:8897:76a:7642:5da5) (Remote host closed the connection)
  449. # [13:16] * Quits: Rastus_Vernon (uid15187@wikimedia/Rastus-Vernon) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  450. # [13:16] * Quits: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.121) (Quit: adactio)
  451. # [13:19] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  452. # [13:25] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  453. # [13:25] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  454. # [13:29] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  455. # [13:29] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  456. # [13:33] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  457. # [13:33] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  458. # [13:35] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  459. # [13:35] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  460. # [13:39] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  461. # [13:41] * Joins: Ducki (~Ducki@191.233.66.1)
  462. # [13:51] * Joins: benjamingr (uid23465@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-umodhkpvcvinbpdt)
  463. # [13:52] * Joins: richt (~richt@192.121.59.29)
  464. # [13:56] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@2601:6:7700:929:bdca:2756:c543:ea9e)
  465. # [14:10] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  466. # [14:17] * Quits: richt (~richt@192.121.59.29) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  467. # [14:18] * Joins: tj_vantoll (~Adium@2601:4:5380:2ec:9e:624b:c356:fc51)
  468. # [14:19] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  469. # [14:20] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  470. # [14:25] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  471. # [14:28] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  472. # [14:28] * Joins: crankharder (~crankhard@c-73-191-6-206.hsd1.va.comcast.net)
  473. # [14:30] <crankharder> so i'm working with this 3rd party / client that is sending us multi-part POST requests that have no Content-Length which has already caused problems where akamai immediately drops the request ( ddos protection etc )
  474. # [14:30] <crankharder> is there any scenario where not specifying the content-length is valid or should I be pushing back on these guys about the finer points of the http spec?
  475. # [14:39] * Joins: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.203)
  476. # [14:42] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  477. # [14:43] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  478. # [14:45] * Joins: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  479. # [14:46] * Quits: tj_vantoll (~Adium@2601:4:5380:2ec:9e:624b:c356:fc51) (Remote host closed the connection)
  480. # [14:47] * Joins: tj_vantoll (~Adium@2601:4:5380:2ec:9e:624b:c356:fc51)
  481. # [14:47] * Quits: ricea (~ricea@2401:fa00:4:1000:a941:5ab7:805e:3f26) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  482. # [14:48] <annevk> crankharder: https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7230#section-3.3.2
  483. # [14:48] <Domenic> crankharder: I believe if you specify Transfer-Encoding: chunked and the data gets sent in that fashion, Content-Length is not necessary
  484. # [14:49] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  485. # [14:52] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  486. # [14:53] * Quits: Ducki (~Ducki@191.233.66.1) (Quit: Leaving)
  487. # [14:56] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  488. # [14:57] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  489. # [14:58] * Joins: abinader (sid21713@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jsggsqojjyjsfesn)
  490. # [15:01] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  491. # [15:01] * Joins: ricea (~ricea@2401:fa00:4:1000:4c02:ecd5:371a:83db)
  492. # [15:02] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@24-212-207-29.cable.teksavvy.com)
  493. # [15:04] <crankharder> I just managed to get my hands on the raw request: 'Transfer-Encoding: chunked'
  494. # [15:04] <crankharder> dammit
  495. # [15:05] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147)
  496. # [15:05] <annevk> crankharder: seems like an Akamai problem
  497. # [15:15] <zewt> the whole point of chunked is to not specify a content length, you use it when you don't know the length in advance
  498. # [15:16] <zewt> eg. compression
  499. # [15:22] * Joins: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.121)
  500. # [15:23] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  501. # [15:24] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  502. # [15:25] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@103.249.181.147) (Quit: BigBangUDR)
  503. # [15:25] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  504. # [15:26] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  505. # [15:27] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com)
  506. # [15:28] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  507. # [15:29] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2)
  508. # [15:30] * Joins: TallTed (~Thud@63.119.36.36)
  509. # [15:31] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Remote host closed the connection)
  510. # [15:37] * Joins: dawhite (~dawhite@74.118.22.223)
  511. # [15:39] * Quits: dawhite_ (~dawhite@74.118.22.223) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  512. # [15:42] * Quits: mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Read error: No route to host)
  513. # [15:43] * Joins: mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  514. # [15:57] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  515. # [16:02] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  516. # [16:03] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  517. # [16:06] * Joins: shepazu (~shepazu@108-70-132-46.lightspeed.rlghnc.sbcglobal.net)
  518. # [16:06] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.43.222)
  519. # [16:06] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  520. # [16:09] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  521. # [16:14] * Quits: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.121) (Quit: adactio)
  522. # [16:16] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@2601:6:7700:929:bdca:2756:c543:ea9e) (Remote host closed the connection)
  523. # [16:17] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2)
  524. # [16:26] * Joins: montecfel (~montecfel@gateway/tor-sasl/montecfel)
  525. # [16:28] * Joins: mpaarating (~mpaaratin@rrcs-97-78-217-146.se.biz.rr.com)
  526. # [16:31] * Joins: weinig (~weinig@98.234.191.242)
  527. # [16:38] <tobie> annevk: not sure that bug's comment is the right place to have the URL conversation. :)
  528. # [16:39] <tobie> annevk: happy to take that elsewhere if you want.
  529. # [16:39] * Joins: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.121)
  530. # [16:40] <annevk> tobie: so you want URL.parse to return an immutable object?
  531. # [16:40] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  532. # [16:42] <tobie> annevk: no. I'm just expressing confusion as to why we on one hand facilitate devs building URL objects and on the other, hope they use strings to represent urls as much as possible.
  533. # [16:42] <annevk> If we had value objects sooner URLs would be a value object
  534. # [16:42] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2)
  535. # [16:43] <annevk> However, we don't, so they are strings. Similarly time representation is done through a floating point number.
  536. # [16:43] <tobie> annevk: I need to refresh my memory about those.
  537. # [16:43] <annevk> Meaning can be extracted through objects such as URL and Date
  538. # [16:43] <tobie> annevk: everybody agrees that the Date constructor in JS is terrible.
  539. # [16:44] <tobie> annevk: also mutable dates kind of blow my mind (but that's more subject to debate).
  540. # [16:44] <annevk> tobie: the constructor being terrible does not mean it's not the way to do time
  541. # [16:45] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@2601:6:7700:929:985a:2c47:e49:896)
  542. # [16:46] * Quits: mven_ (~textual@ip68-104-38-84.lv.lv.cox.net) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  543. # [16:46] <annevk> Anyway, the underlying platform model thing is a URL value object of sorts
  544. # [16:47] <annevk> Which is serialized when you do request.url
  545. # [16:48] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@2601:6:7700:929:985a:2c47:e49:896) (Remote host closed the connection)
  546. # [16:49] * Quits: gavinc (~gavin@dd4a-fc73-9c42-8091-030d-4002-3420-2062.6rd.ip6.sonic.net) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
  547. # [16:50] <tobie> annevk: mmm. Well, we're going on in circles, here, but given it's stringifiable(?) why don't we expose this as an immutable URL object then?
  548. # [16:50] <annevk> tobie: that doesn't exist
  549. # [16:50] <annevk> tobie: or do you mean the URLUtilsReadOnly thing?
  550. # [16:50] <annevk> tobie: yeah, I wouldn't mind doing that
  551. # [16:51] <annevk> tobie: on reflection, Domenic seemed opposed somewhat
  552. # [16:51] <tobie> annevk: no I mean the stringifier attribute.
  553. # [16:51] * Joins: Ducki (~Ducki@191.233.66.1)
  554. # [16:52] <tobie> annevk: (but I might be misunderstanding what it means.)
  555. # [16:52] <annevk> tobie: you lost me
  556. # [16:53] <tobie> annevk: :( God I hate WebIDL.
  557. # [16:54] * Joins: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@cpe-174-107-192-094.sc.res.rr.com)
  558. # [16:54] <Ms2ger> It's always easy to blame WebIDL
  559. # [16:55] <annevk> tobie: I'm happy with an explanation that does not involve IDL
  560. # [16:58] <tobie> annevk: wondering if all of this doesn't stem from my misunderstanding of what stringifier does.
  561. # [16:58] <tobie> annevk: reading up on it now.
  562. # [16:58] <tobie> Ms2ger: heh.
  563. # [16:58] <annevk> tobie: that's just another word for toString()
  564. # [16:59] <tobie> annevk: right. So the URL object gets turned into url.href when coerced to a string, right?
  565. # [16:59] <annevk> yes
  566. # [17:00] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  567. # [17:04] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  568. # [17:04] * Quits: Ducki (~Ducki@191.233.66.1) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  569. # [17:05] <tobie> annevk: I guess I need to see more examples of SW before pushing for a change here.
  570. # [17:05] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@24-212-207-29.cable.teksavvy.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  571. # [17:06] <tobie> annevk: if it is mostly the case that people use request.url to choose how to respond, then returning an immutable URL object makes sense.
  572. # [17:06] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  573. # [17:07] <tobie> annevk: if on the other hand, there's lots of manipulation of the URL object going on anyway, then we might as well keep the string.
  574. # [17:07] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@2601:6:7700:929:89df:d9ba:4758:d356)
  575. # [17:08] * Joins: Jirka_ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  576. # [17:08] <annevk> tobie: changing this after the fact will be hard
  577. # [17:08] <annevk> tobie: at least in a nice way
  578. # [17:09] * Joins: Jirka__ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  579. # [17:09] * Quits: Jirka_ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  580. # [17:11] <tobie> annevk: vaguely related, but you mentioned the Request object has an origin attribute. Where is it defined? (can't find it)
  581. # [17:11] * Quits: Jirka (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  582. # [17:11] <tobie> annevk: true. I meant I want to look at a bit more examples.
  583. # [17:11] <tobie> Within the next couple of weeks.
  584. # [17:13] <annevk> tobie: oh, it's not exposed
  585. # [17:13] <annevk> tobie: I think it might not be exposed because it would always be same-origin with the service worker
  586. # [17:14] <annevk> tobie: I kept some properties off Request for now until we have a v0 implementation
  587. # [17:14] * Quits: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  588. # [17:14] <annevk> tobie: yeah, I guess we can change this in August still
  589. # [17:16] * Quits: jungkees (uid24208@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-axpgetdzzgkkqphb) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  590. # [17:17] * Quits: espadrine_ (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-26-218.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Leaving)
  591. # [17:18] <tobie> Right, that was my understanding wrt that origin prop.
  592. # [17:18] * Joins: espadrine (~ttyl@AMontsouris-158-1-26-218.w92-128.abo.wanadoo.fr)
  593. # [17:24] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@2601:6:7700:929:89df:d9ba:4758:d356) (Remote host closed the connection)
  594. # [17:27] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  595. # [17:28] * Guest59926 is now known as Manishearth
  596. # [17:28] * Quits: Manishearth (manisheart@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-hauozszllhltagbm) (Changing host)
  597. # [17:28] * Joins: Manishearth (manisheart@wikipedia/Manishearth)
  598. # [17:28] * Joins: plutoniix (~plutoniix@node-1dm4.pool-101-108.dynamic.totbb.net)
  599. # [17:30] * Joins: Jirka_ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  600. # [17:30] * Quits: Jirka__ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  601. # [17:30] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:c4bc:4b11:cd47:cc74)
  602. # [17:30] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  603. # [17:41] <tobie> annevk, JakeA: is the promise returned by cache.add resolved with responseArray or void? Promise<any> seems to imply the former, the algorithm seems to imply the latter.
  604. # [17:42] * Quits: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  605. # [17:44] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@c-24-4-202-10.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  606. # [17:47] <tobie> annevk, JakeA: Trying to build an example which primes the cache after a cache miss: https://gist.github.com/tobie/0689c5dda8f6d49d500d#file-gistfile1-js-L25-L30
  607. # [17:47] * Joins: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189)
  608. # [17:49] * Quits: weinig (~weinig@98.234.191.242) (Quit: weinig)
  609. # [17:50] <annevk> not sure, haven't followed Cache that much
  610. # [17:50] <annevk> waiting for rename, some more stability in the API
  611. # [17:53] <tobie> cache.add which does fetch in the background seems like a terrible name (and weird API)
  612. # [17:53] * Joins: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  613. # [17:53] * Joins: marcosc_ (~marcosc@2001:450:1f:224:853d:93b1:d888:ddab)
  614. # [17:54] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  615. # [17:54] <tobie> annevk: also priming the cache before sending back a response shouldn't be that difficult.
  616. # [17:55] * Quits: marcosc_ (~marcosc@2001:450:1f:224:853d:93b1:d888:ddab) (Client Quit)
  617. # [17:58] <annevk> tobie: work on it with Jake?
  618. # [17:58] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  619. # [17:58] <tobie> annevk: if that's how it works, then sure. :)
  620. # [17:59] <annevk> tobie: I think JakeA is working on that API and making sure it's good
  621. # [17:59] <annevk> If that's not the case I'd like to know, because then someone else should take ownership
  622. # [17:59] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126)
  623. # [18:00] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  624. # [18:01] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126) (Client Quit)
  625. # [18:03] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  626. # [18:05] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  627. # [18:05] <tobie> annevk: reaching out to JakeA by email, cc'ing you.
  628. # [18:06] <tobie> annevk: or should I move that conversation to WHATWG mailing list directly?
  629. # [18:07] <annevk> tobie: public-webapps is the SW spec list, and since cache is there...
  630. # [18:07] <tobie> annevk: ty
  631. # [18:09] <tobie> annevk: what about the waitUntil/respondWith issue?
  632. # [18:10] <annevk> tobie: could email there too, it's hard to attract people that want to change that part of the design
  633. # [18:11] <annevk> tobie: probably need to come up with a replacement design to get that through
  634. # [18:11] <tobie> I have for waitUntil
  635. # [18:12] <tobie> annevk: https://github.com/slightlyoff/ServiceWorker/issues/256#issuecomment-47878042
  636. # [18:17] * Joins: felipedefarias (~felipedef@189-19-85-225.dsl.telesp.net.br)
  637. # [18:19] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  638. # [18:22] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@cs78246079.pp.htv.fi)
  639. # [18:24] * Joins: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron)
  640. # [18:24] * Joins: ambv (~ambv@173.252.71.129)
  641. # [18:26] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88)
  642. # [18:26] * Quits: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: estellevw)
  643. # [18:28] * Quits: Smylers (~smylers@81.143.60.194) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  644. # [18:29] * jarib_ is now known as jarib
  645. # [18:29] * Quits: jarib (~jarib@jaribakken.no) (Changing host)
  646. # [18:29] * Joins: jarib (~jarib@unaffiliated/jarib)
  647. # [18:30] * Joins: Maurice` (copyman@5ED5617C.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  648. # [18:30] * Joins: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  649. # [18:33] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:c4bc:4b11:cd47:cc74) (Remote host closed the connection)
  650. # [18:33] * Quits: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Client Quit)
  651. # [18:35] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:dd4e:396f:5cd2:dcc1)
  652. # [18:36] * Quits: darobin (~darobin@78.109.80.74) (Remote host closed the connection)
  653. # [18:37] * Joins: darobin (~darobin@78.109.80.74)
  654. # [18:38] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@50-0-128-161.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  655. # [18:39] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:dd4e:396f:5cd2:dcc1) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  656. # [18:40] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  657. # [18:41] * Quits: darobin (~darobin@78.109.80.74) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  658. # [18:44] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126)
  659. # [18:44] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126) (Client Quit)
  660. # [18:45] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  661. # [18:48] * Joins: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2)
  662. # [18:50] * Quits: plutoniix (~plutoniix@node-1dm4.pool-101-108.dynamic.totbb.net) (Quit: จรลี จรลา)
  663. # [18:50] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  664. # [18:51] * Joins: IZh (~IZh@83.220.237.110)
  665. # [18:52] * Joins: marcosc_ (~marcosc@135-23-143-163.cpe.pppoe.ca)
  666. # [18:52] <IZh> Hi. Is there API to specify which textarea should or shouldn't be spell checked by browser (if capable)?
  667. # [18:53] * Quits: marcosc (~marcosc@135-23-143-163.cpe.pppoe.ca) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  668. # [18:53] <IZh> And probably suggest language for checking.
  669. # [18:53] * Joins: plutoniix (~plutoniix@node-1dm4.pool-101-108.dynamic.totbb.net)
  670. # [18:54] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt)
  671. # [18:55] * Quits: sankha93 (uid12218@fsf/emeritus/sankha93)
  672. # [18:55] <IZh> May be for other types of input fields too.
  673. # [18:56] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  674. # [18:57] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@213.166.174.2) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  675. # [18:59] <gsnedders> is the script that generates the index published anywhere?
  676. # [18:59] <gsnedders> IZh: the spellcheck attribute
  677. # [19:00] <IZh> gsnedders: thanks.
  678. # [19:00] <gsnedders> IZh: language I guess is inferred from @lang?
  679. # [19:00] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  680. # [19:00] <gsnedders> but browsers may just always assume the current locale
  681. # [19:02] <IZh> gsnedders: May be. But it will be bad for online translator sites.
  682. # [19:03] * Parts: adactio (~adactio@212.42.170.121)
  683. # [19:07] * Quits: IZh (~IZh@83.220.237.110) (Quit: Bye)
  684. # [19:07] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126)
  685. # [19:09] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126) (Client Quit)
  686. # [19:09] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  687. # [19:10] <Ms2ger> gsnedders, assuming not, given that it's part of Hixie's pipeline
  688. # [19:11] <Hixie> there's no script that generates the index
  689. # [19:11] <Hixie> it's manually managed
  690. # [19:12] <gsnedders> Hixie: oh, okay
  691. # [19:17] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  692. # [19:19] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126)
  693. # [19:19] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@115.184.196.126) (Client Quit)
  694. # [19:22] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-50-136-134-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  695. # [19:24] <jgraham> gsnedders: So you can have access to it, but only if you have a scapel
  696. # [19:28] * Quits: CvP (~CvP@27.147.199.131) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  697. # [19:28] * Joins: CvP (~CvP@27.147.199.131)
  698. # [19:29] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@c-24-4-202-10.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  699. # [19:32] * `nik`_ is now known as `nik`
  700. # [19:33] * Joins: jwalden (~waldo@c-50-168-55-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  701. # [19:33] * Joins: rafaelrinaldi (~textual@B12E835D.dynamic.spo.dsl.tesa.net.br)
  702. # [19:34] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102)
  703. # [19:35] * Joins: webben (~benjamin@hq.benjaminhawkeslewis.com)
  704. # [19:37] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  705. # [19:37] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  706. # [19:39] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl17-128-175.dsl.telepac.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  707. # [19:40] <jgraham> Is there a proper way to select the elements of the first column of a table (:nth-child doesn't seem to work in the face of cells with rowspan > 1)?
  708. # [19:41] * Joins: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel)
  709. # [19:41] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@66.207.208.102) (Remote host closed the connection)
  710. # [19:41] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:dd4e:396f:5cd2:dcc1)
  711. # [19:41] <Ms2ger> No
  712. # [19:42] * jgraham adds a class
  713. # [19:44] <jgraham> Hmm, it will also screw up alternating row background colours because the first column will get a random colour
  714. # [19:47] <Hixie> many people have over the years proposed table-model-aware selectors
  715. # [19:47] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.49.56)
  716. # [19:49] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  717. # [19:51] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: tantek)
  718. # [19:53] * Joins: musically_ut (~musically@2a02:120b:c3f4:f9e0:a11:96ff:fefb:db24)
  719. # [19:56] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  720. # [19:58] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@173.252.71.129) (Quit: sys.exit(0) # computer went to sleep)
  721. # [19:58] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  722. # [19:59] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  723. # [20:02] * Joins: Jirka__ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  724. # [20:04] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  725. # [20:04] * Quits: Jirka__ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  726. # [20:04] * Joins: Jirka (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  727. # [20:05] * Quits: Jirka_ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  728. # [20:06] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  729. # [20:08] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Client Quit)
  730. # [20:08] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  731. # [20:09] * Joins: izhak (~izhak@92.248.142.152)
  732. # [20:09] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  733. # [20:10] * Quits: felipedefarias (~felipedef@189-19-85-225.dsl.telesp.net.br) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  734. # [20:13] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Client Quit)
  735. # [20:13] * Joins: felipedefarias (~felipedef@189-19-85-225.dsl.telesp.net.br)
  736. # [20:14] * Joins: Jirka_ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  737. # [20:14] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  738. # [20:14] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  739. # [20:15] * Joins: Jirka__ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233)
  740. # [20:15] * Quits: Jirka (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  741. # [20:15] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  742. # [20:15] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  743. # [20:17] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com)
  744. # [20:17] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  745. # [20:17] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com)
  746. # [20:17] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Client Quit)
  747. # [20:18] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  748. # [20:18] * Quits: Jirka_ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  749. # [20:22] * Joins: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134)
  750. # [20:23] * Quits: felipedefarias (~felipedef@189-19-85-225.dsl.telesp.net.br) (Remote host closed the connection)
  751. # [20:25] * Joins: mven (~textual@169.241.49.57)
  752. # [20:32] * Joins: Smylers (~smylers@host81-156-26-27.range81-156.btcentralplus.com)
  753. # [20:34] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  754. # [20:35] * Quits: izhak (~izhak@92.248.142.152) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  755. # [20:36] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  756. # [20:38] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@c-50-168-55-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: PT session, back 14:00ish)
  757. # [20:39] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  758. # [20:45] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  759. # [20:45] * Joins: Somatt_wrk (~somattwrk@130.193.24.135)
  760. # [20:47] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Client Quit)
  761. # [20:48] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  762. # [20:50] * Quits: abinader (sid21713@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jsggsqojjyjsfesn)
  763. # [20:51] * Joins: Areks_home (~Areks@95-28-254-201.broadband.corbina.ru)
  764. # [20:52] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Client Quit)
  765. # [20:54] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Quit: othermaciej)
  766. # [20:55] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  767. # [21:01] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  768. # [21:02] * Joins: newtron_work (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
  769. # [21:03] * Joins: nwtn (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
  770. # [21:04] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  771. # [21:04] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  772. # [21:05] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Client Quit)
  773. # [21:06] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  774. # [21:06] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  775. # [21:07] * Quits: newtron_work (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  776. # [21:09] * Quits: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  777. # [21:13] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  778. # [21:14] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  779. # [21:14] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  780. # [21:15] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@70-36-139-254.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  781. # [21:19] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  782. # [21:19] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@50-0-128-161.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  783. # [21:19] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  784. # [21:23] * Quits: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  785. # [21:24] * Joins: ambv (~ambv@206.108.217.134)
  786. # [21:25] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  787. # [21:25] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@123.239.64.21)
  788. # [21:28] * Joins: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  789. # [21:28] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  790. # [21:29] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@123.239.64.21) (Client Quit)
  791. # [21:30] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  792. # [21:30] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  793. # [21:31] * Joins: darobin (~darobin@2a01:e34:ed05:d180:2977:b004:68e:dcd1)
  794. # [21:31] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Quit: othermaciej)
  795. # [21:37] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  796. # [21:39] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  797. # [21:39] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@26.186.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt)
  798. # [21:39] * Quits: mpaarating (~mpaaratin@rrcs-97-78-217-146.se.biz.rr.com) (Quit: mpaarating)
  799. # [21:48] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Remote host closed the connection)
  800. # [21:49] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  801. # [21:51] * Joins: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  802. # [21:51] * Joins: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@123.239.64.21)
  803. # [21:53] * Quits: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  804. # [21:53] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  805. # [21:54] * Quits: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  806. # [21:54] * Quits: BigBangUDR (~Thunderbi@123.239.64.21) (Client Quit)
  807. # [21:54] * Joins: jonathanmarvens (~jonathanm@107.181.19.54)
  808. # [22:01] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  809. # [22:06] * Quits: nwtn (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Remote host closed the connection)
  810. # [22:06] * Joins: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
  811. # [22:07] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  812. # [22:08] * Joins: newtron_work (~newtron@199.71.174.203)
  813. # [22:10] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  814. # [22:11] <annevk> Imagine if all those people instead worked on the table layout model... Oh wait
  815. # [22:12] * Quits: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  816. # [22:14] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  817. # [22:15] <jgraham> Only dbaron actually understands the table layout model
  818. # [22:15] <jgraham> Although he does try to explain it to everyone he meets
  819. # [22:15] * daleharvey__ is now known as daleharvey
  820. # [22:15] <jgraham> Which does mean that one day a second person might understand it
  821. # [22:16] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:503f:cd45:3803:8e08)
  822. # [22:16] * Quits: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.49.56) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  823. # [22:20] * svl is reminded of http://quotes.burntelectrons.org/183
  824. # [22:21] * Joins: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no)
  825. # [22:23] * Joins: clamstar (~rx-ident@162.243.230.189)
  826. # [22:25] * Joins: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com)
  827. # [22:28] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Quit: othermaciej)
  828. # [22:33] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  829. # [22:34] * Quits: Lachy (~Lachy@cm-84.215.104.248.getinternet.no) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  830. # [22:35] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  831. # [22:37] * Quits: jarib (~jarib@unaffiliated/jarib) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  832. # [22:37] * Joins: jarib (~jarib@unaffiliated/jarib)
  833. # [22:40] * Quits: Streusel (~Anonymous@unaffiliated/streusel) (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
  834. # [22:40] * Quits: cheron (~cheron@unaffiliated/cheron) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  835. # [22:41] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:503f:cd45:3803:8e08) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
  836. # [22:41] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  837. # [22:41] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  838. # [22:45] * Joins: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  839. # [22:45] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  840. # [22:46] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:f52d:8e3f:be66:5327)
  841. # [22:48] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@98.210.101.88) (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  842. # [22:49] * Quits: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  843. # [22:49] * Joins: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  844. # [22:50] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  845. # [22:50] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Client Quit)
  846. # [22:51] <annevk> There's some brilliant quotes there
  847. # [22:53] * Quits: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125) (Quit: eric_carlson)
  848. # [22:53] * Joins: jeremyj (~jeremyj@17.202.49.56)
  849. # [22:55] * Quits: Maurice` (copyman@5ED5617C.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  850. # [22:55] * Joins: eric_carlson (~eric@17.202.43.125)
  851. # [22:56] * Joins: Maurice` (copyman@5ED5617C.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  852. # [22:59] * Quits: bnicholson2 (~bnicholso@cpe-174-107-192-094.sc.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  853. # [23:00] * Quits: Jirka__ (~Jirka@95.85.233.233) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  854. # [23:02] <annevk> I should probably stop reading now
  855. # [23:03] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:f52d:8e3f:be66:5327) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
  856. # [23:03] <svl> ^_^
  857. # [23:06] * Quits: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) (Quit: estellevw)
  858. # [23:07] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  859. # [23:07] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@91.182.24.9) (Quit: nn)
  860. # [23:09] * Joins: estellevw (~estellewy@173-228-112-213.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net)
  861. # [23:09] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:232:3101:b1ff:a327:6b1d)
  862. # [23:13] * Quits: Maurice` (copyman@5ED5617C.cm-7-6b.dynamic.ziggo.nl)
  863. # [23:14] * Joins: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.204)
  864. # [23:16] * Quits: TallTed (~Thud@63.119.36.36)
  865. # [23:16] * Joins: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3)
  866. # [23:17] * Quits: darobin (~darobin@2a01:e34:ed05:d180:2977:b004:68e:dcd1) (Remote host closed the connection)
  867. # [23:17] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3) (Client Quit)
  868. # [23:18] * Quits: newtron_work (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  869. # [23:19] * Quits: newtron_ (~newtron@199.71.174.204) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  870. # [23:21] * Joins: Pookz_ (~justin@rrcs-24-199-57-130.west.biz.rr.com)
  871. # [23:22] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:232:3101:b1ff:a327:6b1d) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  872. # [23:24] * Quits: svl (~me@ip565744a7.direct-adsl.nl) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  873. # [23:24] * Quits: gavin__ (~gavin@76.14.87.162) (Remote host closed the connection)
  874. # [23:24] * Joins: gavin_ (~gavin@76.14.87.162)
  875. # [23:24] * Quits: Pookz (~justin@rrcs-76-79-156-34.west.biz.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  876. # [23:24] * Quits: Pookz_ (~justin@rrcs-24-199-57-130.west.biz.rr.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  877. # [23:25] * Joins: Pookz_ (~justin@rrcs-76-79-156-34.west.biz.rr.com)
  878. # [23:25] * Quits: jensnockert (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  879. # [23:28] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Quit: othermaciej)
  880. # [23:28] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  881. # [23:29] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Client Quit)
  882. # [23:29] * Joins: jensnockert_ (~jensnocke@dynamic.1.7.34dbfd722180.e0f8471ae7fa.cust.bredband2.com)
  883. # [23:30] * Quits: tj_vantoll (~Adium@2601:4:5380:2ec:9e:624b:c356:fc51) (Quit: Leaving.)
  884. # [23:30] * Quits: encrypt__ (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2) (Remote host closed the connection)
  885. # [23:30] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67)
  886. # [23:31] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@209.201.113.2)
  887. # [23:34] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:f52d:8e3f:be66:5327)
  888. # [23:35] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.27.67) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  889. # [23:39] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.114.217.16)
  890. # [23:42] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.sonic.net)
  891. # [23:42] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:dd4e:396f:5cd2:dcc1) (Remote host closed the connection)
  892. # [23:47] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Quit: :tiuQ tiuq sah woclrak)
  893. # [23:48] * Quits: zdobersek (~zan@130.185.155.130) (Quit: Leaving.)
  894. # [23:56] <cabanier> annevk: yeah! It makes my sadness for the depressing state of the geometry interfaces go away
  895. # Session Close: Fri Jul 04 00:00:01 2014

The end :)