/irc-logs / freenode / #whatwg / 2015-04-09 / end

Options:

Previous day, Next day

  1. # Session Start: Thu Apr 09 00:00:00 2015
  2. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  3. # [00:00] * Quits: caitp- (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  4. # [00:00] <Domenic> they can set up a small buffer pool and reuse buffers to limit total consumption and GC churn ... it will work beautifully ... /me waves his hands
  5. # [00:01] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Remote host closed the connection)
  6. # [00:01] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  7. # [00:01] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  8. # [00:05] * Joins: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:425:225f:8279:942b:e669:bef6)
  9. # [00:06] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@2607:fb90:538:fe9e:b14f:3c3b:7fa7:b398) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  10. # [00:07] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Quit: Leaving...)
  11. # [00:08] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  12. # [00:12] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  13. # [00:12] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  14. # [00:12] <wanderview> Domenic: sorry... I'm used to the DOM stuff which just enforces types and then says "using X's internal thing, do stuff"
  15. # [00:12] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246)
  16. # [00:14] <Domenic> wanderview: np, just concerned about the layering in the design. Ideally *ByteStream should be additive and opt-in, both for consumers and from an architectural level.
  17. # [00:14] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  18. # [00:17] <wanderview> Domenic: to be honest, things like off-main-thread piping are mostly interesting to me for *ByteStream... for streams with potentially arbitrary js objects for chunks... not sure I can safely move those around off-thread
  19. # [00:17] <wanderview> not sure if that changes anything
  20. # [00:17] <Domenic> wanderview: oh, no, I was never really planning on them being off thread... but i want the model to not change drastically when you move from non-byte to byte streams
  21. # [00:17] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  22. # [00:17] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  23. # [00:18] <Domenic> wanderview: although I guess it could be pretty useful in some cases e.g. if a UA provided stream wants to pass metadata with each chunk like { remotePort, remoteAddress, data } or something instead of just data
  24. # [00:19] <wanderview> Domenic: I built a bunch of node stream libs to do that kind of thing before... not sure anyone really liked it much
  25. # [00:19] <wanderview> https://blog.wanderview.com/blog/2013/03/01/composable-object-streams/
  26. # [00:20] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90)
  27. # [00:20] <Domenic> wanderview: do you have a summary of where we are on https://github.com/yutakahirano/fetch-with-streams/issues/30 ? when i went to bed last night i think we were convering on new Request({ body: readableStream }) + fetch(request, wsRevealer) + cache.add(request, wsRevealer) or similar. But then it changed overnight and now I am confused.
  28. # [00:21] <wanderview> Domenic: I think DOM APIs would prefer to return a structured webidl object with a stream property (like Response)
  29. # [00:21] <Domenic> ?
  30. # [00:21] <wanderview> Domenic: I objected to putting wsRevealer on the consumer... because Request is no longer representative of the network request
  31. # [00:21] <Domenic> (I like the UDP object streams BTW!)
  32. # [00:22] <Domenic> Hmm was it ever?
  33. # [00:22] <Domenic> Isn't Request more like RequestMetadata?
  34. # [00:22] <wanderview> Domenic: no... before streams came into it, it contained all info to perform a network request
  35. # [00:22] <wanderview> including the body
  36. # [00:23] <Domenic> right, info to perform a network request, but not a network request itself....
  37. # [00:23] <Domenic> which is why you can store it in a cache; you can't store a network request in a cache...
  38. # [00:24] <wanderview> Domenic: correct... it is a representation of a possible network request... it is not an actual in progress network request... but if you move the body ws-revealer to fetch() then Request no longer fully describes the possible network request
  39. # [00:24] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  40. # [00:24] <Domenic> hmmm
  41. # [00:24] <Domenic> i guess that's true
  42. # [00:24] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@guest-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
  43. # [00:24] <Domenic> and ws-revealer is really "a sequence of instructions for how to create a body" so it still goes in the category of "representation of a possible network request"
  44. # [00:24] <wanderview> Domenic: look at my last proposal... it combines your WritableStream wrapper without the hard coded type switch
  45. # [00:25] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:2d19:d044:d21e:612e)
  46. # [00:25] <Domenic> Although I doubt you'll store the ws-revealer in the cache...
  47. # [00:25] <Domenic> Yeah, I liked that, although unsure how it fits with the rest of the discussion up until that point
  48. # [00:25] <wanderview> Domenic: well, right now Cache only supports GET... so can't put a body in... but if you could, Cache would trigger ws-revealer to get the body data
  49. # [00:26] <wanderview> I still have all the code in gecko to store Request bodies
  50. # [00:26] <Domenic> hmm i see
  51. # [00:26] <Domenic> yeah i guess that makes sense
  52. # [00:26] <Domenic> you reify the body whenever the request gets "committed" somewhere
  53. # [00:27] <wanderview> those are fancy words, but I will nod my head
  54. # [00:27] <Domenic> :P
  55. # [00:27] <wanderview> does reify just mean normalize?
  56. # [00:27] <Domenic> nah ... i'm thinking of it as, make a real set of bytes out of a function that represents a way to get bytes
  57. # [00:28] <wanderview> ah, ok... serialize then
  58. # [00:28] <Domenic> ws-revealer is a "potential body" that gets reified into a real body when you fetch/cache-add
  59. # [00:28] <Domenic> yeah that i guess
  60. # [00:28] <wanderview> I should look up that term I guess
  61. # [00:28] <wanderview> I have more of an EE background so I tend to get lost in the CS theory world
  62. # [00:29] <Domenic> might be a mathematician thing, I dunno. Or just a pretentious thing :P
  63. # [00:29] <Domenic> so the current proposal is req.{setWriter/pipeTo} plus ... body(ws) { ... } which gets triggered after setWriter/pipeTo plus ... do we allow body: readableStream?
  64. # [00:30] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: tantek)
  65. # [00:30] <wanderview> Domenic: I still want body: readableStream, yes
  66. # [00:30] <Domenic> poor overloaded body: option
  67. # [00:31] <wanderview> Domenic: didn't you hear? fetch is mostly about sugar :-)
  68. # [00:32] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  69. # [00:32] <wanderview> Domenic: and to be clear... I only think we need this ws-revealer thing because of the desire to have progress notification that a pipe would obfuscate
  70. # [00:33] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  71. # [00:34] <wanderview> Domenic: btw... resolving the .write() promises when written to the kernel is going to be somewhat challenging... in gecko we get notification from the network code about progress in a different path from where we write... so we have to match that progress back up to the promises to resolve, etc
  72. # [00:34] <wanderview> maybe not challenging... but annoying
  73. # [00:36] <Domenic> :-S
  74. # [00:36] <wanderview> much easier to integrate that with a progress event (which is what it was designed for, of course)
  75. # [00:36] <Domenic> Well, there's https://github.com/whatwg/streams/issues/316 ...
  76. # [00:36] <trevnorris> wanderview: doubt this'll have any affect on the spec here, but in previous implementations I've had calls like .write() return a request object so you can trace the status at any point in the future.
  77. # [00:37] <trevnorris> e.g. .progress() to see how much has been written.
  78. # [00:37] <trevnorris> I use that in conjunction with timeouts to cancel writes that are taking too long.
  79. # [00:37] <wanderview> Domenic: for example, I think gecko network code throttles progress notifications to once every 50ms or something... so you will see batches of .write() promises resolves at the same time, etc.
  80. # [00:38] <wanderview> trevnorris: sounds like you want cancellable promises :-)
  81. # [00:38] * wanderview trolls
  82. # [00:38] <Domenic> wanderview: lol, because the spec says 50 ms, good times :P
  83. # [00:38] <trevnorris> hehe. ;)
  84. # [00:39] * Joins: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172)
  85. # [00:42] <trevnorris> wanderview: is it possible to do something like: var req = ws.write(data); setTimeout(function(req) { if (req.status() != 'complete') req.abort(); }, 1000); ?
  86. # [00:44] <wanderview> trevnorris: I think you would have to call ws.abort() instead of req.abort()
  87. # [00:44] <trevnorris> wanderview: what if you did ws.write(data1) ws.write(data2) and I only wanted to abort writing data1?
  88. # [00:44] <Domenic> with cancelable promises you could do `var p = ws.write(data); setTimeout(() => p.cancel(), 1000). (Assuming calling p.cancel() does nothing on an already-settled promise)
  89. # [00:45] <trevnorris> already-settled promise?
  90. # [00:45] <wanderview> trevnorris: that seems racy to me... you may end up with data1 and data2 or just data2... also, not all write operations are abortable once they start, etc
  91. # [00:45] <Domenic> already fulfilled or rejected
  92. # [00:46] <Domenic> yeah, how does that work in POSIX?
  93. # [00:46] <trevnorris> wanderview: if you've queued up several chunks of data to be written, and only the first has actually been sent to the kernel it should be possible to remove any specific write req from the queue.
  94. # [00:47] <wanderview> trevnorris: in a multi-threaded environment... it may have been sent to the kernel and you just haven't been notified of it yet
  95. # [00:47] <boogyman> can you elaborate on a scenario where a Promise could be resolved while a "child" Promise has yet to resolve?
  96. # [00:47] <bradleymeck> its important to remember cancellation does not mean abrupt termination
  97. # [00:47] * Joins: svl (~me@200.123.210.20)
  98. # [00:47] <bradleymeck> just that it should cancel at the next point
  99. # [00:47] <Domenic> boogyman: what is a child promise
  100. # [00:47] <trevnorris> wanderview: as soon as the data is handed off to something else I'll consider it unreachable. in the case of Node I know because we make the call to uv_write() directly.
  101. # [00:47] <bradleymeck> if there is not a clearly defines point of cancellation, something should not be cancellable
  102. # [00:48] <bradleymeck> defined*
  103. # [00:48] <boogyman> Domenic: however you define "p.cancel()" on an already resolved p
  104. # [00:48] <Domenic> i don't understand
  105. # [00:48] <Domenic> please phrase your question using code?
  106. # [00:48] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  107. # [00:48] <wanderview> trevnorris: "something else" is another thread? or the kernel? because in multi-process browsers it goes js->c++->IPC->c++->kernel with thread and process switches in there
  108. # [00:48] <bradleymeck> if cancellation is inteded to be similar to abort()/halting a thread it should be rethought
  109. # [00:49] * bradleymeck can't type today
  110. # [00:49] <wanderview> right now ws.write() does not return a cancellable promise...
  111. # [00:49] <wanderview> this is all hand wving
  112. # [00:49] <wanderview> waving
  113. # [00:49] <trevnorris> wanderview: anything that takes control away from us over the lifetime of the data. but if I have an array of data chunks and only the first has been sent to uv_write() then the others should be able to be removed from their position in the queue.
  114. # [00:49] <boogyman> `var p = ws.write(data); setTimeout(() => p.cancel(), 1000). (Assuming calling p.cancel() does nothing on an already-settled promise) <-- Under what circumstance would be have already been resolved if it is dependent upon ws.write(data)
  115. # [00:50] <boogyman> would p.cancel()*
  116. # [00:50] <wanderview> trevnorris: does uv_write() do file writing on a separate IO thread or the main thread?
  117. # [00:50] <Domenic> boogyman: the adjective "resolved" does not apply to the function call p.cancel(), nor to its return value (which is undefined)
  118. # [00:50] <trevnorris> wanderview: main thread.
  119. # [00:50] <bradleymeck> wanderview: but I think at that point the cancellation point would be if the kernel gets it still, once it gets to the kernel it cannot be stopped, so attempts at cancellation would need to propagate to the C++ that flushes to the kernel, and if it has started flushing it is in an uncancellable state
  120. # [00:50] <Domenic> trevnorris: false?
  121. # [00:50] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
  122. # [00:51] <trevnorris> wanderview: though I agree that if the data chunks were immediately sent to another thread to be written then we would have "lost control". thus cancel would only be a notification that we no longer need to be notified of its completion.
  123. # [00:51] <trevnorris> Domenic: eh?
  124. # [00:51] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90) (Quit: othermaciej)
  125. # [00:51] <Domenic> trevnorris: fs writes in io are done in a threadpool?
  126. # [00:51] <wanderview> trevnorris: ok, then you don't have to deal with the races I do... trying to pick out a single buffer to cancel is going to be hit or miss in browsers or other multi-threaded environments
  127. # [00:51] <bradleymeck> they are queued on the main thread though
  128. # [00:51] <trevnorris> Domenic: they're a special case. uv_wirte() and uv_try_write() is always done on the main thread.
  129. # [00:52] <trevnorris> *uv_write()
  130. # [00:52] <bradleymeck> ?
  131. # [00:52] <Domenic> trevnorris: ah, I thought we were talking about file I/O since wanderview asked "does uv_write() do file writing". I guess uv_write is for sockets?
  132. # [00:52] <trevnorris> yes. sorry I missed that. uv_write() is only for sockets.
  133. # [00:53] <trevnorris> filesystem I/O is a pain thanks to kernel incompatibilities.
  134. # [00:53] <Domenic> gotcha
  135. # [00:53] * Joins: roc (~chatzilla@121-99-129-223.bng1.tvc.orcon.net.nz)
  136. # [00:53] <wanderview> Domenic: what I am getting is they treat the "write is complete" state when it leaves main thread... which might not quite be to kernel
  137. # [00:53] <Domenic> yeah
  138. # [00:53] <wanderview> Domenic: which is different from your goal of "bytes written to kernel"
  139. # [00:53] <wanderview> I'm not sure to-kernel is all that much better than an app internal checkpoint
  140. # [00:53] <Domenic> if you are sure that writes respect backpressure, maybe "accepted and queued" is a good enough proxy for upload progress...
  141. # [00:53] <wanderview> but willing to try to support it
  142. # [00:54] <trevnorris> it's possible to share memory on the req across threads so read-only fields can be used to check its status.
  143. # [00:54] <wanderview> trevnorris: you have an atomic check-and-set for cancellation across threads?
  144. # [00:54] <bradleymeck> wanderview: I think at either point cancellation is a suggestion to w/e you handed it off to
  145. # [00:55] <bradleymeck> it needs to be able to continue the work if it has started side effects already
  146. # [00:55] <bradleymeck> no real need for locking to my knowledge
  147. # [00:55] <wanderview> bradleymeck: exactly... I guess I was just getting at I find it hard to reason about the need to cancel buffer1 and let buffer2 through... when you cannot know if you got to buffer1 in time
  148. # [00:55] <trevnorris> wanderview: right now only have it so if I've queued up many small buffers to be written I can check how many of them have actually been sent to the kernel.
  149. # [00:55] <bradleymeck> i don't think you should be allowed to know at the time of cancellation
  150. # [00:56] <trevnorris> wanderview: streaming video for example. say you're buffering data to be written. it's better that frames are lost and the data stays current then making sure all the data goes through.
  151. # [00:57] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90)
  152. # [00:57] <bradleymeck> wanderview: to rephrase, I cannot think of a good reason you should be allowed to know that buffer1 was cancelled before it calls .finally
  153. # [00:57] <wanderview> Domenic: I think we are still not on the same page here: https://github.com/yutakahirano/fetch-with-streams/issues/30#issuecomment-91057900
  154. # [00:58] <bradleymeck> which to me resolves the problem of reasoning
  155. # [00:58] <wanderview> I guess I'm happy we don't yet allow canceling individual .write() calls... and if we did, I think it would very much have to be a "best effort"
  156. # [00:59] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  157. # [00:59] <wanderview> bradleymeck: sure... I think I understand better that its a best effort cancel, for example the video streaming case mentioned
  158. # [00:59] <bradleymeck> which is good, I want "best effort" and not guaranteed
  159. # [00:59] * Quits: thinkxl (~thinkxl@74-95-237-22-Houston.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Quit: Lost terminal)
  160. # [01:00] <bradleymeck> cause once side effects start / external systems are involved you need to let them resolve back to valid states (say if you have not finished writing)
  161. # [01:00] <bradleymeck> guaranteed cancel would require external systems to stay in valid and buffered states which is a no-no
  162. # [01:00] <wanderview> Domenic: I'll respond in bug... but I think very much "setWriter()" should function like a pipeTo()... we could call it drainToWriter() or something if you want
  163. # [01:02] * Quits: ehsan_ (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:d4de:dec7:880f:bcc7) (Remote host closed the connection)
  164. # [01:02] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  165. # [01:03] <trevnorris> wanderview: doing an atomic field set so the writing thread can check if the queue from another thread is still needed is very much possible.
  166. # [01:04] * Quits: asmodai (asmodai@freebsd/developer/asmodai) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  167. # [01:04] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  168. # [01:05] * Quits: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-plqsjkpysnzhgwvh) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  169. # [01:09] * Quits: svl (~me@200.123.210.20) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  170. # [01:12] * Quits: roc (~chatzilla@121-99-129-223.bng1.tvc.orcon.net.nz) (Remote host closed the connection)
  171. # [01:12] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  172. # [01:15] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Remote host closed the connection)
  173. # [01:17] * Quits: jsx (uid48919@fsf/intern/jsx) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  174. # [01:25] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@62-78-246-79.bb.dnainternet.fi)
  175. # [01:28] * Joins: ehsan_ (~ehsan@67.213.81.142)
  176. # [01:36] * Quits: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com) (Quit: bradleymeck)
  177. # [01:39] * Quits: diffalot (~diffalot@unaffiliated/papyromancer) (Remote host closed the connection)
  178. # [01:40] * Joins: diffalot (~diffalot@unaffiliated/papyromancer)
  179. # [01:41] * Quits: alrra (uid62345@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ncoqwrllfdpdgzzg) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  180. # [01:45] * Joins: eric_carlson (~ericc@c-24-6-239-9.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  181. # [01:45] * Joins: asmodai (asmodai@h159072.upc-h.chello.nl)
  182. # [01:46] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~KevinMark@199.87.84.238)
  183. # [01:47] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87-8.1450hg.fc20 [XULRunner 32.0/20140902134853])
  184. # [01:49] * Joins: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3)
  185. # [01:49] * Quits: bnicholson (~bnicholso@2620:101:80fb:224:f422:186:fa95:1a4c) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  186. # [01:50] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  187. # [01:51] * Quits: boogyman (~boogyman@pdpc/supporter/professional/boogyman) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  188. # [01:51] * Joins: roc (~chatzilla@2001:cb0:b202:224:2677:3ff:fece:dc64)
  189. # [01:53] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  190. # [01:55] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  191. # [01:56] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Remote host closed the connection)
  192. # [01:57] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  193. # [01:59] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  194. # [01:59] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90) (Quit: othermaciej)
  195. # [02:00] * Quits: hswolff (~hswolff@cpe-74-72-23-108.nyc.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  196. # [02:01] * Joins: hswolff (~hswolff@cpe-74-72-23-108.nyc.res.rr.com)
  197. # [02:02] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246)
  198. # [02:03] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  199. # [02:04] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90)
  200. # [02:05] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.160.90) (Client Quit)
  201. # [02:07] * Quits: mikenovikov (~mikenovik@ip-95-220-98-138.bb.netbynet.ru) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  202. # [02:07] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  203. # [02:07] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Remote host closed the connection)
  204. # [02:10] * Quits: zama (~zama@unaffiliated/stryx/x-3871776) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  205. # [02:11] * Joins: zama (~zama@unaffiliated/stryx/x-3871776)
  206. # [02:17] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  207. # [02:21] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  208. # [02:21] * Joins: bnicholson (~bnicholso@223.sub-70-197-20.myvzw.com)
  209. # [02:22] <wanderview> Domenic: ok... I have data that shows multiple read() calls with a promise each is much slower than being able to read buffered chunks synchronously
  210. # [02:22] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  211. # [02:24] * Joins: jdaggett_ (~jdaggett@61-121-216-2.bitcat.net)
  212. # Session Close: Thu Apr 09 02:24:47 2015
  213. #
  214. # Session Start: Thu Apr 09 02:24:47 2015
  215. # Session Ident: #whatwg
  216. # [02:24] * Disconnected
  217. # [02:25] * Attempting to rejoin channel #whatwg
  218. # [02:26] * Rejoined channel #whatwg
  219. # [02:26] * Topic is 'https://whatwg.org/ — logs: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/ & http://logbot.glob.com.au/ — stats: http://gavinsharp.com/irc/whatwg.html — Please leave your sense of logic at the door, thanks!'
  220. # [02:26] * Set by MikeSmith!~mike@sideshowbarker.net on Wed Dec 10 17:23:43
  221. # [02:27] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~KevinMark@199.87.84.238)
  222. # [02:27] <wanderview> Domenic: open this and look in your console: https://blog.wanderview.com/streams-promise-read/bluebird.html
  223. # [02:28] * Joins: JosephSilber (~JosephSil@ool-43513ca2.dyn.optonline.net)
  224. # [02:28] <wanderview> code is here: https://github.com/wanderview/streams-promise-read
  225. # [02:34] <Domenic> wanderview: needs I/O to be a real test
  226. # [02:34] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.121.12)
  227. # [02:34] <Domenic> All you are testing there is promises vs. loops
  228. # [02:35] * Quits: espadrine (~tyl@dan75-7-88-166-187-54.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  229. # [02:35] <Domenic> Not the impact of promises on streams
  230. # [02:38] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.245.121.12) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  231. # [02:39] <zewt> i wonder what middle-managery person at mozilla thought having a "start a conversation" button in the toolbar was a cool idea
  232. # [02:39] * Quits: bnicholson (~bnicholso@223.sub-70-197-20.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  233. # [02:40] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.49)
  234. # [02:44] * Joins: tripu (~tripu@p7223-ipngn11001marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)
  235. # [02:45] * Joins: bnicholson (~bnicholso@204.sub-70-197-19.myvzw.com)
  236. # [02:49] * Quits: bnicholson (~bnicholso@204.sub-70-197-19.myvzw.com) (Client Quit)
  237. # [02:50] <wanderview> Domenic: its the case I described before... the I/O was done previously and written to a pipe... now a consumer is reading from a pipe to process it (perhaps all in memory)
  238. # [02:50] <wanderview> Domenic: this is the case you said "needs citation" above
  239. # [02:51] * Joins: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-178-200-61-79.hsi07.unitymediagroup.de)
  240. # [02:52] <wanderview> Domenic: from here: http://logs.glob.uno/?c=freenode%23whatwg&s=8+Apr+2015&e=8+Apr+2015&h=citation#c944489
  241. # [02:59] * Joins: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@2607:fb90:2193:30e7:75a4:4623:28eb:38a1)
  242. # [02:59] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@62-78-246-79.bb.dnainternet.fi) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  243. # [03:00] * Quits: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:425:225f:8279:942b:e669:bef6) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  244. # [03:08] <Domenic> wanderview: I must have misinterpreted. That's not streaming at all... Just buffering.
  245. # [03:09] <wanderview> Domenic: so buffering is not supported in this stream model?
  246. # [03:10] <Domenic> wanderview: a 1000-chunk high water Mark is unrealistic
  247. # [03:10] <Domenic> of course it is, but you shouldn't use a stream when you're just buffering all data in memory anyway
  248. # [03:10] <wanderview> Domenic: I'm not saying 1000 is realistic... but 10 chunks is a realistic bugger
  249. # [03:10] <wanderview> buffer
  250. # [03:11] <Domenic> A pipe should terminate in I/O on one side or the other
  251. # [03:11] <wanderview> Domenic: I thought you were gone for the evening so I wrote my thoughts here: https://github.com/whatwg/streams/issues/320#issuecomment-91083647
  252. # [03:12] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~KevinMark@199.87.84.238) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  253. # [03:12] <Domenic> If it takes x time to read from the pipe with promises, 0.04x time with batch, and 1000x time to put data in the pipe in the first place, I'm not too concerned.
  254. # [03:12] <Domenic> I kind of am gone, should probably turn off notifications :p
  255. # [03:13] <wanderview> Domenic: I feel like we've pessimized a common case in order to allow an optimization in obscure case later
  256. # [03:13] <Domenic> I do not think chunks being synchronously generated in a batch is common.
  257. # [03:14] <Domenic> Chunks come from somewhere, ultimately, perhaps after several transforms, but ultimately from I/O. This example does not show that.
  258. # [03:16] <Domenic> Just read your comment... 6 ms is a lot... Absolute numbers help.
  259. # [03:18] <Domenic> Except... 625 microseconds is actually 0.6 ms
  260. # [03:18] <Domenic> Oh, it's per chunk
  261. # [03:19] <wanderview> Domenic: yea, sorry... I was trying to make the number easier to compare... so I normalized per chunk
  262. # [03:19] <Domenic> Although I wonder if the code is just not hot enough for the optimizer to kick in for 10 chunks
  263. # [03:20] <Domenic> Maybe do 10 chunks in a loop or something
  264. # [03:20] <wanderview> Domenic: well, the higher number loops suggest the sync loop optimizes much better than the promise loop can be optimized... not surprising
  265. # [03:20] <Domenic> Or ten chunks every requestAnimationFrame, since eating the frame budget is the real concern
  266. # [03:20] <TabAtkins> Domenic: Yo, sorry for the digression, but random help here: it's a bad idea for an attribute to sometimes be updated sync and sometimes async, according to unknowable impl-specific criteria, right?
  267. # [03:21] <Domenic> I'm not concerned about the relative numbers (see my "x" comment above), but about eating 6 ms of frame budget
  268. # [03:21] <Domenic> TabAtkins: sounds bad, although I could imagine cases that fit that description which are probably ok?
  269. # [03:22] <wanderview> Domenic: if we expect this only to happen for modest buffer sizes... I don't see how we can expect the loop to get super hot
  270. # [03:22] <TabAtkins> Well, the case is whether a FontFace.status is set to "unloaded" or "loading". Currently it's always async, but jdaggett/heycam want it to be set syncly when possible (font is a data url, a blob url, a cached font, etc)
  271. # [03:23] <wanderview> Domenic: anyway, I have to go crash and sleep for 12 hours... talk to you tomorrow!
  272. # [03:24] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  273. # [03:24] <Domenic> Cached sounds skeevy.... Others sound somewhat reasonable
  274. # [03:24] <Domenic> wanderview: ok cool, I'll probably fork your thing and experiment
  275. # [03:24] <wanderview> Domenic: please do... just don't judge me by my javascript :-)
  276. # [03:25] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.49) (Quit: othermaciej)
  277. # [03:25] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.49)
  278. # [03:26] <wanderview> Domenic: btw... looking at the results I think the jit kicked in at 100 chunks... there was an across the board improvement there... the sync loop got another boost from some optimization going from 1000 chunks to 10,000 chunks... but the promise loop did not
  279. # [03:26] <wanderview> in spidermonkey of cours.e.. don't know what chrome does
  280. # [03:27] <Domenic> TabAtkins: I think some of the normal zalgo hazards don't apply here because I can't see a way for code to be written that assumes always sync or always async
  281. # [03:27] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  282. # [03:27] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@adsl-108-231-147-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
  283. # [03:28] <Domenic> wanderview: yeah, we need to make sure the code is hot before benchmarking. Kinda pointless to measure non hot code since it doesn't need to be fast.
  284. # [03:28] <TabAtkins> Cached I definitely see - easy for a dev to accidentally work with cached fonts, and write broken code for users.
  285. # [03:29] <TabAtkins> And I can see some browsers considering some types of urls as sync, while others dont'.
  286. # [03:29] <Domenic> TabAtkins: but what kind of code would run into this? I would think conditionals on ff.status would work in either case.
  287. # [03:30] * Quits: ap (~ap@17.202.44.214)
  288. # [03:32] <TabAtkins> Man, I dunno. It just feels super icky to have a line in a spec that says "If you want you can do this part sync, lol i dunno"
  289. # [03:33] <Domenic> Yeah, it would have to be normative which cases are sync
  290. # [03:34] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87-8.1450hg.fc20 [XULRunner 32.0/20140902134853])
  291. # [03:37] * Quits: tripu (~tripu@p7223-ipngn11001marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  292. # [03:37] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@adsl-108-231-147-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
  293. # [03:39] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@adsl-108-231-147-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  294. # [03:45] * Joins: bnicholson (~bnicholso@c-24-130-60-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  295. # [03:47] <wanderview> Domenic: yea, you are right... let me add a call to the tests to prime the jit
  296. # [03:48] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  297. # [03:49] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.49) (Quit: othermaciej)
  298. # [03:52] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  299. # [03:58] <wanderview> Domenic: I think I agree the read() promise is fast enough for browsers... but also agree with trevnorris that its probably inadequate for what node.js needs... not sure we can get something that works perfectly for both
  300. # [04:06] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  301. # [04:10] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  302. # [04:13] * Joins: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wydvlcojcomybfdc)
  303. # [04:15] * Joins: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat)
  304. # [04:16] * heycam is now known as heycam|away
  305. # [04:25] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@17.245.30.85) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  306. # [04:26] * Joins: caitp- (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  307. # [04:30] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  308. # [04:42] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@c-71-198-213-78.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  309. # [04:48] * Joins: xiinotulp (~plutoniix@node-cpt.pool-125-24.dynamic.totbb.net)
  310. # [04:49] * Joins: biniar_ (~biniar@c-68-34-47-33.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)
  311. # [04:51] * Quits: plutoniix (~plutoniix@node-krx.pool-101-108.dynamic.totbb.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  312. # [04:57] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  313. # [05:00] * Quits: biniar_ (~biniar@c-68-34-47-33.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) (Quit: leaving)
  314. # [05:00] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@adsl-108-231-147-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) (Quit: tantek)
  315. # [05:06] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  316. # [05:10] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fb:224:2d19:d044:d21e:612e) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  317. # [05:15] * Joins: tripu (~tripu@2001:200:0:8805:594f:3cbd:ea8a:61d7)
  318. # [05:23] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  319. # [05:23] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121)
  320. # [05:25] * Joins: jwalden (~waldo@c-50-168-55-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  321. # [05:26] * Quits: ttepasse (~ttepasse@ip-178-200-61-79.hsi07.unitymediagroup.de) (Quit: s)
  322. # [05:29] * Quits: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  323. # [05:29] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
  324. # [05:30] * Joins: jyasskin (~jyasskin@173-228-80-34.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  325. # [05:37] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  326. # [05:38] * Quits: caitp- (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  327. # [05:40] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246)
  328. # [05:41] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  329. # [05:44] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  330. # [05:45] * Quits: jyasskin (~jyasskin@173-228-80-34.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Quit: My computer has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  331. # [05:48] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-197.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com)
  332. # [05:55] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  333. # [05:57] * Quits: nunnun (~hiro@2001:200:164:48:20c:29ff:fe02:11d2) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  334. # [05:59] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  335. # [06:01] * Joins: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172)
  336. # [06:03] * heycam is now known as heycam|away
  337. # [06:25] * Quits: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wydvlcojcomybfdc) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  338. # [06:34] * Joins: caitp- (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  339. # [06:38] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
  340. # [06:51] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  341. # [06:53] * Joins: ohaibbq (~ohaibbq@2601:9:a80:a8f:952f:3b47:6ad8:107d)
  342. # [06:55] * Joins: boogyman (~boogyman@pdpc/supporter/professional/boogyman)
  343. # [06:56] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  344. # [06:58] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  345. # [07:09] * Quits: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@2607:fb90:2193:30e7:75a4:4623:28eb:38a1) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  346. # [07:11] * Quits: ^esc (~esc-ape@77.119.129.86.wireless.dyn.drei.com) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  347. # [07:12] * Joins: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:2196:710d:ed5f:b68c:f288:6382)
  348. # [07:12] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  349. # [07:14] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  350. # [07:19] * Quits: igoroliveira (uid20755@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ijppgawzergdqrxb) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  351. # [07:20] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  352. # [07:27] * Quits: hendry (~hendry@ec2-52-74-100-218.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com) (Quit: brb)
  353. # [07:28] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246)
  354. # [07:31] * Quits: caitp- (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Quit: Leaving)
  355. # [07:32] * Joins: hendry (~hendry@ec2-52-74-100-218.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com)
  356. # [07:33] * Quits: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  357. # [07:33] * Joins: Areks (~Areks@rs.gridnine.com)
  358. # [07:40] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  359. # [07:42] * Joins: nunnun (~hiro@2001:200:164:48:20c:29ff:fe02:11d2)
  360. # [07:43] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  361. # [07:45] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  362. # [07:47] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@107-204-232-178.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
  363. # [07:48] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  364. # [07:48] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  365. # [07:49] * Quits: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:2196:710d:ed5f:b68c:f288:6382) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  366. # [07:49] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  367. # [07:51] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  368. # [07:52] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121)
  369. # [07:53] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@50-1-62-185.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com)
  370. # [07:56] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  371. # [08:00] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@50-1-62-185.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com) (Quit: tantek)
  372. # [08:01] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@107-204-232-178.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
  373. # [08:02] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@50-1-62-185.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com)
  374. # [08:02] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@50-1-62-185.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com) (Client Quit)
  375. # [08:06] * Joins: ^esc (~esc-ape@178.165.128.82.wireless.dyn.drei.com)
  376. # [08:11] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  377. # [08:15] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  378. # [08:18] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  379. # [08:19] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  380. # [08:21] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-197.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  381. # [08:21] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  382. # [08:21] * Joins: tommyliu (~tommyliu@58.60.170.109)
  383. # [08:22] * Quits: tommyliu (~tommyliu@58.60.170.109) (Remote host closed the connection)
  384. # [08:22] * Joins: zdobersek (~zan@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/zdobersek)
  385. # [08:24] * Joins: tommyliu (~tommyliu@183.16.190.191)
  386. # [08:24] * Quits: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  387. # [08:26] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  388. # [08:27] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  389. # [08:27] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121)
  390. # [08:27] * Quits: scor (~scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  391. # [08:27] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
  392. # [08:40] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  393. # [08:44] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  394. # [08:45] * Joins: SteveF_ (~chatzilla@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
  395. # [08:45] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@107-204-232-178.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  396. # [08:46] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@107-204-232-178.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
  397. # [08:46] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  398. # [08:48] * Joins: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@2607:fb90:2179:9158:1e22:d01b:5373:37b3)
  399. # [08:48] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@107-204-232-178.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  400. # [08:48] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  401. # [08:49] * Quits: roc (~chatzilla@2001:cb0:b202:224:2677:3ff:fece:dc64) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  402. # [08:50] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@107-204-232-178.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
  403. # [08:53] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  404. # [08:53] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  405. # [08:56] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  406. # [08:57] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  407. # [08:59] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121)
  408. # [09:00] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@67.164.23.121) (Client Quit)
  409. # [09:00] * Joins: markkes (~markkes@62.207.90.201)
  410. # [09:03] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@172.56.31.245)
  411. # [09:06] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  412. # [09:09] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Remote host closed the connection)
  413. # [09:09] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  414. # [09:10] * Quits: ohaibbq (~ohaibbq@2601:9:a80:a8f:952f:3b47:6ad8:107d) (Quit: Leaving...)
  415. # [09:12] * heycam is now known as heycam|away
  416. # [09:13] * Joins: g4 (~g4@unaffiliated/gormer)
  417. # [09:13] * xiinotulp is now known as plutoniix
  418. # [09:15] * Quits: jwalden (~waldo@c-50-168-55-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87-8.1450hg.fc20 [XULRunner 32.0/20140902134853])
  419. # [09:20] * Quits: Goplat (~goplat@reactos/developer/Goplat) (Remote host closed the connection)
  420. # [09:21] * Joins: roc (~chatzilla@121-99-129-223.bng1.tvc.orcon.net.nz)
  421. # [09:25] * Joins: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-arjnxhrgsycvfgpr)
  422. # [09:27] * Joins: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@193.190.253.150)
  423. # [09:29] * Quits: annevk (~annevk@77-57-114-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) (Quit: Leaving...)
  424. # [09:31] * Quits: tommyliu (~tommyliu@183.16.190.191) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  425. # [09:32] * Joins: tommyliu (~tommyliu@58.60.170.109)
  426. # [09:34] * Quits: ehsan_ (~ehsan@67.213.81.142) (Remote host closed the connection)
  427. # [09:34] * Joins: ehsan_ (~ehsan@67.213.81.142)
  428. # [09:34] * Quits: ehsan_ (~ehsan@67.213.81.142) (Remote host closed the connection)
  429. # [09:42] * Joins: annevk (~annevk@77-57-114-240.dclient.hispeed.ch)
  430. # [09:44] * Joins: alrra (uid62345@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cxdcswolmtsmagfr)
  431. # [09:44] * Joins: davve (~user@83.218.67.123)
  432. # [09:47] * Parts: biniar (~biniar@unaffiliated/biniar)
  433. # [09:48] * Quits: CvP (~CvP@203.76.123.238) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  434. # [09:48] * Quits: davve (~user@83.218.67.123) (Remote host closed the connection)
  435. # [09:48] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  436. # [09:49] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Quit: Leaving...)
  437. # [09:50] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  438. # [09:58] * Joins: davve (~davve@83.218.67.123)
  439. # [09:58] * davve is now known as Guest1598
  440. # [09:59] * Quits: mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  441. # [09:59] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Quit: Leaving...)
  442. # [10:02] * Joins: mpt (~mpt@2001:67c:1560:a003:b167:9a92:14de:a297)
  443. # [10:02] * Quits: mpt (~mpt@2001:67c:1560:a003:b167:9a92:14de:a297) (Changing host)
  444. # [10:02] * Joins: mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  445. # [10:07] * Quits: jdaggett_ (~jdaggett@61-121-216-2.bitcat.net) (Quit: jdaggett_)
  446. # [10:08] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  447. # [10:10] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  448. # [10:12] * Quits: Guest1598 (~davve@83.218.67.123) (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
  449. # [10:13] * Joins: davve_ (~davve@83.218.67.123)
  450. # [10:13] * davve_ is now known as davve`
  451. # [10:17] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  452. # [10:19] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Quit: Leaving...)
  453. # [10:20] * Quits: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net) (Quit: The deeper I go / the deeper I go / green mountains - Santoka)
  454. # [10:22] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  455. # [10:22] * davve` is now known as davve
  456. # [10:25] * Quits: davve (~davve@83.218.67.123) (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
  457. # [10:25] * Joins: davve (~davve@83.218.67.123)
  458. # [10:32] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@172.56.31.245) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  459. # [10:33] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  460. # [10:35] * Joins: ehsan_ (~ehsan@67.213.81.142)
  461. # [10:35] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  462. # [10:36] * Joins: calvaris (~calvaris@fanzine.igalia.com)
  463. # [10:37] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  464. # [10:39] * Quits: ehsan_ (~ehsan@67.213.81.142) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  465. # [10:39] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  466. # [10:43] * Quits: tommyliu (~tommyliu@58.60.170.109) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  467. # [10:43] * Joins: tommyliu (~tommyliu@183.16.190.191)
  468. # [10:50] * Quits: sarri (~sari@unaffiliated/sarri) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  469. # [10:50] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  470. # [10:51] * Joins: sarri (~sari@unaffiliated/sarri)
  471. # [10:54] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  472. # [10:55] * Quits: tommyliu (~tommyliu@183.16.190.191) (Remote host closed the connection)
  473. # [11:06] * Joins: CvP (~CvP@203.76.123.238)
  474. # [11:08] * Joins: wilsonpage (~wilsonpag@217.111.161.212)
  475. # [11:11] * Joins: espadrine (~tyl@LMontsouris-656-1-2-84.w80-12.abo.wanadoo.fr)
  476. # [11:18] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  477. # [11:20] * Joins: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  478. # [11:22] * Quits: mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  479. # [11:22] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  480. # [11:32] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  481. # [11:35] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  482. # [11:39] * Quits: MikeSmith (~mike@sideshow.default.msmith.uk0.bigv.io) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  483. # [11:40] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  484. # [11:46] <zcorpan> ok any opinions on naming? document.scrollingElement? document.viewportElement? https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Apr/0108.html
  485. # [11:49] * Joins: wnklb (~winklebee@p4FE152DA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
  486. # [11:50] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  487. # [11:52] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  488. # [11:52] <paul_irish> document.viewportElement sgtm
  489. # [11:53] <zcorpan> thanks paul_irish
  490. # [11:58] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  491. # [12:00] * Parts: Kingdutch (~kingdutch@cookiemonster.alexandervarwijk.com)
  492. # [12:04] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  493. # [12:15] * Quits: tripu (~tripu@2001:200:0:8805:594f:3cbd:ea8a:61d7) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  494. # [12:19] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  495. # [12:20] * Quits: wilsonpage (~wilsonpag@217.111.161.212) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  496. # [12:21] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  497. # [12:24] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  498. # [12:26] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  499. # [12:32] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  500. # [12:43] * Quits: wnklb (~winklebee@p4FE152DA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
  501. # [12:47] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@62-78-246-79.bb.dnainternet.fi)
  502. # [12:47] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  503. # [12:51] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  504. # [12:55] * Quits: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-arjnxhrgsycvfgpr) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  505. # [12:55] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  506. # [13:02] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  507. # [13:07] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  508. # [13:09] <roc> scrollingElement
  509. # [13:09] <roc> viewportElement isn't correct
  510. # [13:12] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  511. # [13:14] <zcorpan> roc: it will be correct when webkit/blink have fixed scrollTop, no?
  512. # [13:17] <zcorpan> i guess background/overflow have different rules, but i think things would work as intended if this API is used for those also
  513. # [13:19] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  514. # [13:23] * Joins: tommyliu (~tommyliu@14.153.62.206)
  515. # [13:26] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  516. # [13:27] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  517. # [13:27] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  518. # [13:45] * Quits: rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  519. # [13:46] * Joins: satazor_ (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  520. # [13:47] * Joins: rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me)
  521. # [13:49] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  522. # [13:54] * Joins: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xuwfqakgcuqmbgcd)
  523. # [13:59] * Joins: tripu (~tripu@p7223-ipngn11001marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)
  524. # [14:00] * Joins: hemanth (~hemanth@122.167.67.18)
  525. # [14:01] * Joins: MikeSmith (~mike@sideshow.default.msmith.uk0.bigv.io)
  526. # [14:03] * Joins: scor (scor@nat/acquia/x-plwnabconupsidft)
  527. # [14:03] * Quits: scor (scor@nat/acquia/x-plwnabconupsidft) (Changing host)
  528. # [14:03] * Joins: scor (scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view)
  529. # [14:04] * Quits: smaug____ (~chatzilla@62-78-246-79.bb.dnainternet.fi) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  530. # [14:07] * Joins: wilsonpage (~wilsonpag@217.111.161.212)
  531. # [14:10] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  532. # [14:14] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
  533. # [14:16] * Quits: satazor_ (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt) (Remote host closed the connection)
  534. # [14:20] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  535. # [14:22] * Joins: zenith_ (~zenith@199-7-157-72.eng.wind.ca)
  536. # [14:22] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  537. # [14:23] * Joins: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172)
  538. # [14:26] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  539. # [14:28] * Quits: zenith_ (~zenith@199-7-157-72.eng.wind.ca) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  540. # [14:30] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@67.213.81.142)
  541. # [14:39] * Quits: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Quit: Leaving)
  542. # [14:41] * Quits: wilsonpage (~wilsonpag@217.111.161.212) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  543. # [14:42] * Quits: tripu (~tripu@p7223-ipngn11001marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp) (Quit: Leaving)
  544. # [14:47] * Joins: caitp (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  545. # [14:52] * Quits: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  546. # [14:53] * Joins: jdaggett_ (~jdaggett@ad056175.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp)
  547. # [14:55] * Joins: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172)
  548. # [14:55] * Quits: zecho (~zecho@66-247-17-199.northern.mnscu.edu)
  549. # [14:55] * Joins: caitp- (~caitp@CPE48f8b385c01c-CM84948c4c6f80.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
  550. # [14:57] * Quits: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172) (Client Quit)
  551. # [14:59] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  552. # [14:59] <zcorpan> mathiasbynens: wanna polyfill http://dev.w3.org/csswg/cssom-view/#dom-document-scrollingelement ?
  553. # [15:00] * Joins: igoroliveira (uid20755@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xwfisbedbhwewppw)
  554. # [15:01] <mathiasbynens> zcorpan: sounds like fun! will do
  555. # [15:02] <zcorpan> :-)
  556. # [15:02] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  557. # [15:02] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  558. # [15:10] * Joins: eBureau (~Bruno@181.164.77.172)
  559. # [15:13] * Joins: darobin (~darobin@2a01:e34:ed05:d180:e4e1:8dff:de94:d4f6)
  560. # [15:16] * Joins: zecho (~zecho@66-247-17-199.northern.mnscu.edu)
  561. # [15:18] * Joins: smaug____ (~chatzilla@62-78-246-79.bb.dnainternet.fi)
  562. # [15:21] * Joins: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203)
  563. # [15:23] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  564. # [15:23] * Joins: hgl- (~hgl@unaffiliated/hgl)
  565. # [15:24] * Quits: tav (~tav`@host86-167-17-118.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  566. # [15:27] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  567. # [15:27] * Quits: hgl (~hgl@unaffiliated/hgl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  568. # [15:27] * hgl- is now known as hgl
  569. # [15:27] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  570. # [15:33] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  571. # [15:42] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  572. # [15:43] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  573. # [15:43] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  574. # [15:43] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  575. # [15:45] * Joins: TallTed (~Thud@63.119.36.36)
  576. # [15:46] * Joins: tav (~tav`@host86-167-17-118.range86-167.btcentralplus.com)
  577. # [15:46] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  578. # [15:47] * Joins: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  579. # [15:47] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
  580. # [15:49] * Joins: encryptd_fractl (~encryptd_@23.30.224.246)
  581. # [15:56] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-197.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com)
  582. # [15:58] * Joins: jsx (uid48919@fsf/intern/jsx)
  583. # [15:59] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  584. # [15:59] * Joins: wilsonpage (~wilsonpag@217.111.161.212)
  585. # [16:01] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  586. # [16:01] * Joins: satazor_ (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  587. # [16:03] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  588. # [16:04] * Quits: hemanth (~hemanth@122.167.67.18) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  589. # [16:05] * Quits: satazor (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  590. # [16:13] * Joins: hemanth (~hemanth@122.167.67.18)
  591. # [16:15] * Quits: satazor_ (~satazor@bl6-111-97.dsl.telepac.pt)
  592. # [16:17] * Joins: karlcow (~karl@nerval.la-grange.net)
  593. # [16:20] * Quits: eric_carlson (~ericc@c-24-6-239-9.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: eric_carlson)
  594. # [16:22] * Joins: eric_carlson (~ericc@c-24-6-239-9.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  595. # [16:24] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  596. # [16:28] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  597. # [16:28] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  598. # [16:29] * Quits: jungkees (uid24208@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jgbfnzftxzvvndln) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  599. # [16:41] * Quits: tommyliu (~tommyliu@14.153.62.206) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  600. # [16:41] * Joins: thinkxl (~thinkxl@74-95-237-22-Houston.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
  601. # [16:41] * Quits: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141) (Remote host closed the connection)
  602. # [16:41] * Joins: tommyliu (~tommyliu@li587-82.members.linode.com)
  603. # [16:42] * Joins: hasather (~hasather@80.91.33.141)
  604. # [16:42] * Joins: tommyliu_ (~tommyliu@14.153.62.206)
  605. # [16:43] * Quits: tommyliu_ (~tommyliu@14.153.62.206) (Client Quit)
  606. # [16:44] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  607. # [16:46] * Quits: tommyliu (~tommyliu@li587-82.members.linode.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  608. # [16:53] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  609. # [16:55] * Quits: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@2607:fb90:2179:9158:1e22:d01b:5373:37b3) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  610. # [16:55] * Quits: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xuwfqakgcuqmbgcd) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  611. # [16:56] * Quits: gavinc (~gavin@4df8-a168-e2af-74d7-030d-4002-3420-2062.6rd.ip6.sonic.net) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
  612. # [16:59] * Joins: jyasskin (~jyasskin@173-228-80-34.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  613. # [17:02] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
  614. # [17:24] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  615. # [17:24] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  616. # [17:25] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
  617. # [17:26] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  618. # [17:26] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  619. # [17:27] * Joins: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  620. # [17:28] * Quits: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  621. # [17:29] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  622. # [17:29] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  623. # [17:31] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  624. # [17:31] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  625. # [17:36] * Joins: frivoal_ (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  626. # [17:36] * Quits: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  627. # [17:39] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  628. # [17:40] * Quits: ehsan (~ehsan@67.213.81.142) (Remote host closed the connection)
  629. # [17:41] * Joins: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  630. # [17:44] * Joins: svl (~me@200.123.210.20)
  631. # [17:45] * Joins: zenith_ (~zenith@142.150.23.90)
  632. # [17:48] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  633. # [17:50] * Quits: darobin (~darobin@2a01:e34:ed05:d180:e4e1:8dff:de94:d4f6) (Remote host closed the connection)
  634. # [17:52] <calvaris> Domenic: I am writing more tests
  635. # [17:52] <calvaris> and it seems that I can construct if I pass undefined to the constructor
  636. # [17:52] * Quits: hemanth (~hemanth@122.167.67.18) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
  637. # [17:52] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  638. # [17:52] <calvaris> which should be equivalent to pass no arguments, right?
  639. # [17:54] * Joins: ap (~ap@17.202.44.214)
  640. # [17:55] <Ms2ger> For optional arguments, yes
  641. # [17:55] <Ms2ger> For required arguments, no
  642. # [17:55] * Quits: zenith_ (~zenith@142.150.23.90) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  643. # [17:58] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@70-36-140-197.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  644. # [17:59] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  645. # [18:00] * Joins: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:5c6:8108:b51b:9d30:97c:63ee)
  646. # [18:02] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@c-67-164-14-200.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  647. # [18:05] * Joins: mcnesium (~mcnesium@unaffiliated/mcnesium)
  648. # [18:05] <mcnesium> my new wordpress does have a valid rss feed but safari on iOS and OSX do not show the "reader" sign. any idea what might be wrong? http://mcnesium.com
  649. # [18:07] * Joins: ehsan (~ehsan@2001:450:1f:224:6030:da54:5ea8:49ec)
  650. # [18:16] * Joins: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com)
  651. # [18:16] * Quits: svl (~me@200.123.210.20) (Quit: And back he spurred like a madman, shrieking a curse to the sky.)
  652. # [18:18] * Quits: espadrine (~tyl@LMontsouris-656-1-2-84.w80-12.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  653. # [18:25] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  654. # [18:29] * Quits: jyasskin_w (jyasskin@nat/google/x-rkziyehlwgqgatfh) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  655. # [18:29] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  656. # [18:30] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  657. # [18:30] * Joins: darobin (~darobin@mtl93-18-78-208-93-24.fbx.proxad.net)
  658. # [18:33] <calvaris> in this case, the object can be constructed with no arguments, so we can assume argument is optional
  659. # [18:34] <calvaris> can't we?
  660. # [18:35] <wanderview> Domenic: do you know why the promise cases in the benchmark all take longer to settle than the sync cases?
  661. # [18:35] <wanderview> Domenic: is that just variability from runnables in the event queue?
  662. # [18:35] <calvaris> Ms2ger: ?
  663. # [18:36] <calvaris> I guess it is not
  664. # [18:37] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  665. # [18:37] <calvaris> because in myFunction(myArgument = {}) {} it is different to call myFunction() than myFunction(undefined)
  666. # [18:39] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
  667. # [18:40] * Joins: jyasskin_w (jyasskin@nat/google/x-rrioyywaucjhgytz)
  668. # [18:41] <calvaris> no, it's the same thing
  669. # [18:41] * Quits: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  670. # [18:42] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  671. # [18:51] * Joins: mpt_ (~mpt@canonical/mpt)
  672. # [18:54] * Quits: frivoal_ (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  673. # [18:54] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  674. # [18:54] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  675. # [18:58] * Quits: darobin (~darobin@mtl93-18-78-208-93-24.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  676. # [18:58] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  677. # [19:01] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  678. # [19:05] * Quits: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com) (Quit: bradleymeck)
  679. # [19:06] * Krinkle|detached is now known as Krinkle
  680. # [19:22] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@c-71-198-213-78.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: othermaciej)
  681. # [19:24] * Joins: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com)
  682. # [19:26] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  683. # [19:26] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@70-35-48-188.static.wiline.com)
  684. # [19:29] * Quits: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com) (Client Quit)
  685. # [19:29] * Joins: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@sjspeed.wiline.com)
  686. # [19:29] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.41)
  687. # [19:29] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  688. # [19:30] * Quits: KevinMarks (~yaaic@2607:fb90:5c6:8108:b51b:9d30:97c:63ee) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  689. # [19:30] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  690. # [19:31] * Joins: jsbell (jsbell@nat/google/x-hcbdotivbmzqoxqm)
  691. # [19:31] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@70-35-48-188.static.wiline.com) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  692. # [19:36] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  693. # [19:41] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  694. # [19:42] <wanderview> Domenic: can you explain again why we need async read() always on getReader()... instead of making getReader().read() sync and getByobReader.read() async?
  695. # [19:43] <wanderview> sorry... I know you've explained before
  696. # [19:46] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@sjspeed.wiline.com)
  697. # [19:46] * Quits: jyasskin (~jyasskin@173-228-80-34.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Quit: My computer has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  698. # [19:50] * Joins: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com)
  699. # [19:51] <caitp-> dunno his reasons, but if it's sometimes sync and sometimes async, that's not great for usability
  700. # [19:51] * Quits: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com) (Client Quit)
  701. # [19:57] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com)
  702. # [19:59] * Joins: mikenovikov (~mikenovik@176.195.203.7)
  703. # [20:01] <wanderview> caitp-: no... its only async if you explicitly opt-in to the "bring my own buffer" optimization... and then its always async
  704. # [20:01] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  705. # [20:01] <caitp-> yes, and then if you pass that reader to something that doesn't know you brought your own or not, it may or may not be async
  706. # [20:02] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fc:232:5d9e:fb04:9852:1d1e)
  707. # [20:10] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  708. # [20:11] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@17.245.30.85)
  709. # [20:15] <wanderview> caitp-: that reader has its own type... they are not compatible with each other already
  710. # [20:16] * Joins: woebtz (~woebtz@12.36.17.197)
  711. # [20:18] * Quits: KevinMarks__ (~yaaic@sjspeed.wiline.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  712. # [20:19] * Joins: wartdev (~wartdev@109.255.148.96)
  713. # [20:19] * Joins: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@sjspeed.wiline.com)
  714. # [20:21] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  715. # [20:22] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  716. # [20:22] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Client Quit)
  717. # [20:24] * Joins: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net)
  718. # [20:25] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  719. # [20:28] * Quits: c74d (~c74d3a4eb@2002:4404:712c:0:76de:2bff:fed4:2766) (Remote host closed the connection)
  720. # [20:34] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@76.74.153.41) (Quit: othermaciej)
  721. # [20:34] * Joins: c74d (~c74d3a4eb@2002:4404:712c:0:76de:2bff:fed4:2766)
  722. # [20:36] <caitp-> if they can be used the same way, you can probably expect that they would be
  723. # [20:36] * Quits: calvaris (~calvaris@fanzine.igalia.com) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  724. # [20:36] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  725. # [20:37] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  726. # [20:38] * Quits: KevinMarks_ (~yaaic@sjspeed.wiline.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  727. # [20:39] * Quits: wilsonpage (~wilsonpag@217.111.161.212) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  728. # [20:40] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.39)
  729. # [20:41] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  730. # [20:44] * Quits: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fc:232:5d9e:fb04:9852:1d1e) (Quit: 8403864 bytes have been tenured, next gc will be global.)
  731. # [20:45] * Joins: dbaron (~dbaron@2620:101:80fc:232:5d9e:fb04:9852:1d1e)
  732. # [20:46] <wanderview> caitp-: agree in principal, but not sure if its worth baking a performance penalty into getReader() just to satisfy aesthetic similarity to getByobReader()
  733. # [20:47] <caitp-> i'm sure domenic's reasons are better ones
  734. # [20:47] <caitp-> or at least, he's probably spending more time thinking about it =p
  735. # [20:51] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  736. # [20:55] * Quits: asmodai (asmodai@h159072.upc-h.chello.nl) (Changing host)
  737. # [20:55] * Joins: asmodai (asmodai@freebsd/developer/asmodai)
  738. # [21:08] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  739. # [21:10] * Joins: mrtn_ (~Martin@h-52-179.a157.priv.bahnhof.se)
  740. # [21:12] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.39) (Quit: othermaciej)
  741. # [21:13] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.39)
  742. # [21:15] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  743. # [21:15] * Joins: calvaris (~calvaris@254.126.27.77.dynamic.mundo-r.com)
  744. # [21:16] * Joins: darobin (~darobin@2a01:e34:ed05:d180:d:517f:ab3:180e)
  745. # [21:16] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Remote host closed the connection)
  746. # [21:19] * Krinkle is now known as Krinkle|detached
  747. # [21:20] * Joins: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com)
  748. # [21:21] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  749. # [21:23] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Quit: ZZZzzz…)
  750. # [21:25] * Quits: darobin (~darobin@2a01:e34:ed05:d180:d:517f:ab3:180e) (Quit: Leaving...)
  751. # [21:25] * Quits: Ms2ger (~Ms2ger@193.190.253.150) (Quit: nn)
  752. # [21:27] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  753. # [21:29] * Joins: Maurice` (copyman@unaffiliated/maurice)
  754. # [21:35] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  755. # [21:40] * Joins: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  756. # [21:41] * Joins: tantek (~tantek@50-1-62-185.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com)
  757. # [21:47] * Joins: jyasskin (jyasskin@nat/google/x-swqwxvrucfukuxgp)
  758. # [21:48] * Quits: zdobersek (~zan@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/zdobersek) (Quit: Leaving.)
  759. # [21:50] * Quits: scor (scor@drupal.org/user/52142/view) (Quit: scor)
  760. # [21:52] * Quits: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238) (Remote host closed the connection)
  761. # [21:52] * Quits: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@sjspeed.wiline.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  762. # [21:54] * Joins: jwalden (~waldo@2620:101:80fc:224:7e7a:91ff:fe25:a5a3)
  763. # [21:54] * Joins: benwerd (~benwerd@199.87.84.238)
  764. # [21:59] * Joins: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com)
  765. # [22:00] * Joins: jamesheston (~jameshest@wsip-72-196-170-92.sd.sd.cox.net)
  766. # [22:02] * Quits: zcorpan (~zcorpan@90-230-218-37-no135.tbcn.telia.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  767. # [22:08] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  768. # [22:08] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  769. # [22:09] * Quits: wartdev (~wartdev@109.255.148.96) (Remote host closed the connection)
  770. # [22:12] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  771. # [22:12] * Quits: bradleymeck (~bradleyme@cpe-70-114-246-88.austin.res.rr.com) (Quit: bradleymeck)
  772. # [22:12] * Quits: newtron (~newtron@199.71.174.203) (Quit: Leaving...)
  773. # [22:13] * Quits: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  774. # [22:14] * Quits: calvaris (~calvaris@254.126.27.77.dynamic.mundo-r.com) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  775. # [22:17] * Joins: mven (~textual@32.97.110.57)
  776. # [22:22] * heycam|away is now known as heycam
  777. # [22:28] * Quits: rniwa (~rniwa@17.245.30.85) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
  778. # [22:34] * Joins: kruppel (~kruppel@192.161.158.18)
  779. # [22:37] * Quits: lnr (~lnr@aim.engr.arizona.edu) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  780. # [22:37] * Quits: tantek (~tantek@50-1-62-185.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com) (Quit: tantek)
  781. # [22:42] * Quits: jacobolus (~jacobolus@70-36-196-50.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
  782. # [22:44] * Quits: beowulf (~sstewart@host86-153-9-85.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
  783. # [22:45] * Joins: espadrine (~tyl@dan75-7-88-166-187-54.fbx.proxad.net)
  784. # [22:45] * Joins: beowulf (~sstewart@host86-190-65-30.range86-190.btcentralplus.com)
  785. # [23:01] * Joins: thinkxl_ (~thinkxl@74-95-237-22-Houston.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
  786. # [23:01] * Quits: alrra (uid62345@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cxdcswolmtsmagfr) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
  787. # [23:02] * Quits: thinkxl (~thinkxl@74-95-237-22-Houston.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  788. # [23:03] * Quits: Maurice` (copyman@unaffiliated/maurice)
  789. # [23:05] * Joins: KevinMarks (~KevinMark@sjspeed.wiline.com)
  790. # [23:05] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  791. # [23:08] * Joins: jacobolus (~jacobolus@215.sub-70-197-16.myvzw.com)
  792. # [23:08] * Quits: TallTed (~Thud@63.119.36.36)
  793. # [23:09] * Quits: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.39) (Quit: othermaciej)
  794. # [23:10] * Joins: othermaciej (~mjs@17.244.161.39)
  795. # [23:11] * Quits: bholley (~bholley@c-50-174-198-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
  796. # [23:11] * Quits: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com) (Quit: sicking)
  797. # [23:18] * Joins: xtrm0 (uid12574@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rtcjkddbtltuvfub)
  798. # [23:22] * Joins: sicking (~sicking@corp-nat.p2p.sfo1.mozilla.com)
  799. # [23:27] * thinkxl_ is now known as thinkxl
  800. # [23:27] * Quits: thinkxl (~thinkxl@74-95-237-22-Houston.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Changing host)
  801. # [23:27] * Joins: thinkxl (~thinkxl@unaffiliated/thinkxl)
  802. # [23:33] <wanderview> hmm... does chrome has something like URLSearchParams?
  803. # [23:35] * Quits: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no) (Remote host closed the connection)
  804. # [23:35] * Joins: frivoal (~frivoal@cm-84.208.175.177.getinternet.no)
  805. # [23:36] <caitp> doesn't look like it
  806. # [23:36] <caitp> well, "something like", probably just a JSObject
  807. # [23:38] <caitp> not even a JSObject
  808. # [23:38] <caitp> not exposed on the interface, and no TODO. should file :o
  809. # [23:40] * Joins: rniwa (~rniwa@17.202.47.189)
  810. # [23:40] * heycam is now known as heycam|away
  811. # [23:44] <caitp> i guess it is filed
  812. # [23:44] * Quits: yoav (~yoav@sdo26-1-78-245-148-181.fbx.proxad.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
  813. # [23:45] * Quits: jamesheston (~jameshest@wsip-72-196-170-92.sd.sd.cox.net) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
  814. # [23:48] <wanderview> yea... I guess that part of the URL spec just needs to be implemented
  815. # [23:49] <jgraham> Is there some way to tell if the origin of a page changed at some point (i.e. that document.domain was set)
  816. # [23:53] * Joins: wartdev (~wartdev@109.255.148.96)
  817. # [23:54] * Quits: SteveF_ (~chatzilla@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  818. # [23:55] <caitp> there's no event triggered in the setter algorithm, or anything
  819. # [23:56] * Joins: SteveF_ (~chatzilla@cpc3-nmal20-2-0-cust916.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
  820. # [23:57] * Joins: hasather_ (~hasather@cm-84.210.170.16.getinternet.no)
  821. # [23:58] * Quits: kruppel (~kruppel@192.161.158.18) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
  822. # [23:59] * Quits: plutoniix (~plutoniix@node-cpt.pool-125-24.dynamic.totbb.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  823. # Session Close: Fri Apr 10 00:00:00 2015

Previous day, Next day

Think these logs are useful? Then please donate to show your gratitude (and keep them up, of course). Thanks! — Krijn