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- # Session Start: Fri May 08 00:00:01 2015
- # Session Ident: #whatwg
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- # [13:04] <annevk> TabAtkins: is there a reason for not marking up definitions of IDL members with <code>?
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- # [14:02] <GPHemsley> annevk_: Is there a term for host + port?
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- # [14:12] <jgraham> http://tantek.com/2011/238/b1/many-ways-slice-url-name-pieces
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- # [14:26] <yhirano_> annevk: ping
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- # [14:46] <yhirano_> annevk_: ping
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- # [15:36] <annevk_> yhirano_: hi
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- # [15:37] <annevk> GPHemsley: not in the spec
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- # [15:47] <annevk> To this day I have trouble spelling Docs, thanks Opera
- # [15:47] <annevk> Or I guess, thanks Stig
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- # [16:10] <TabAtkins> annevk: Since I wrap IDL *links* in <code>, no, it just looks like an oversight on my part. File an issue on me.
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- # [16:30] <annevk> TabAtkins: do you think we should have a way to do it automatically?
- # [16:30] <annevk> TabAtkins: e.g. perhaps <dfn>{{Node/baseURI}}</dfn> should be a thing
- # [16:30] <TabAtkins> Yeah, makes sense to me. I can just check that it's not already in a <code> and wrap it.
- # [16:30] <annevk> TabAtkins: or that could be {{{Node/baseURI}}} :p
- # [16:30] <TabAtkins> Oh, yeah, there's an issue on me to figure that out, too.
- # [16:31] <annevk> I guess I can wait for that
- # [16:31] <TabAtkins> Why wait? Just file the issue. Wrapping a <code> is easier than figuring out what syntax I want for definitions.
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- # [16:35] <annevk> done
- # [16:36] <TabAtkins> Thanks. ^_^
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- # [17:14] <yhirano_> annevk: I'd like to talk a bit about bodyUsed.
- # [17:14] <yhirano_> annevk: let res be a non-empty response.
- # [17:15] <yhirano_> annevk: var stream = res.body; assert_false(res.bodyUsed); is that OK?
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- # [17:18] <yhirano_> oh, anne is away.
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- # [17:26] <Domenic> timezones :(
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- # [17:32] <TabAtkins> circular earth :(
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- # [17:33] <Ms2ger> It's not like it's better on Discworld
- # [17:33] <jgraham> TabAtkins: Feeling flat today?
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- # [17:34] <TabAtkins> I'm just saying, if there sun shined from a skybox at infinite distance, we wouldn't have these problems.
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- # [17:36] <jgraham> I don't know what a skybox is, but a sun at infinite distance would have problems of its own
- # [17:37] <TabAtkins> Nah, you just have light move at infinite speed. Easy.
- # [17:39] <annevk> "Getting DOM to REC: last interop issues" lol
- # [17:39] <TabAtkins> A skybox is a programming technique. Easiest to talk about with raytracing - whenever a ray fails to hit anything and just goes off toward infinity, the skybox defines the color of that point-at-infinity.
- # [17:40] <Ms2ger> Ha
- # [17:41] <annevk> yhirano_: sorry, we've been having some connection issues
- # [17:42] <annevk> yhirano_: wanderview will be back from vacation next week or so I'm told and hopefully he can sort that through
- # [17:42] <annevk> yhirano_: I have to say I'm not super committed to any particular model, as long as it makes sense...
- # [17:42] <Domenic> I too have stopped having strong feelings about bodyUsed
- # [17:43] <yhirano_> ok, thanks.
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- # [17:49] <annevk> yhirano_: I agree with you that if body is null, it would make sense for text() et al to not set it and always succeed
- # [17:50] <annevk> yhirano_: note that body being null is different from it being empty
- # [17:50] <annevk> (I said as much on the issue)
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- # [17:56] <Ms2ger> TabAtkins, we'll be expecting you in #rust :)
- # [18:01] <yhirano_> annevk: interesting. I don't understand the difference between null body and empty body (and I merged them in my draft). can you tell me?
- # [18:01] <TabAtkins> Ms2ger: Get SimonSapin_ to pull the HTML parser + selector engine out of Servo, and we'll talk.
- # [18:01] <jgraham> TabAtkins: Done
- # [18:01] * SimonSapin_ is now known as SimonSapin
- # [18:01] <Ms2ger> TabAtkins, that is done indeed
- # [18:02] <SimonSapin> kind of
- # [18:02] <TabAtkins> WHY DIDN'T SIMON TELL ME
- # [18:02] <TabAtkins> oh ok
- # [18:02] <TabAtkins> phew
- # [18:02] <Ms2ger> Well, they're not integrated
- # [18:02] <SimonSapin> We still need a nice tree API and plugging everything together
- # [18:02] <Ms2ger> But html5ever and rust-selectors exist
- # [18:02] <jgraham> https://github.com/kmcallister/html5ever https://github.com/SimonSapin/cssselect/issues/48
- # [18:02] <jgraham> Er, not issue 48 specifically
- # [18:02] <TabAtkins> Bikeshed is just an HTML parser, a selector engine, and then some other random code.
- # [18:02] <jgraham> Silly search
- # [18:03] <gsnedders> TabAtkins: it's like why Anolis is so slow — looping over stuff is just too slow, silly Python
- # [18:03] <jgraham> Oh, not that project al all even
- # [18:03] <jgraham> Anyway, it's somewhere
- # [18:04] <SimonSapin> I have some experiments at https://github.com/SimonSapin/kuchiki , but it’d need someone to take the lead and make a proper library and maintain it
- # [18:06] <SimonSapin> TabAtkins: wanna make a tree library in Rust? :)
- # [18:06] <TabAtkins> Probably not!
- # [18:08] <gsnedders> Totally unrelated: is there any serialisation format that can serialise all DOMs? Like, can serialise both <!-- -- --> and stuff with arbitrary namespaces?
- # [18:09] <SimonSapin> Probably, somewhere in the infinity of all possible serialization formats
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- # [18:14] <TabAtkins> Actually, a tree library sounds like an interesting learning project, with all the ownership semantics. Maybe.
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- # [18:15] <jgraham> Certainly you are going to learn all the hard things rather fast if you make a tree with parent references
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- # [18:16] <gsnedders> I tried doing that once. Then decided I was getting in too deep.
- # [18:18] <TabAtkins> Well, I know Bikeshed's tree-library needs, and they include walking up the ancestor list.
- # [18:18] <annevk> yhirano_: the difference is what happens with Content-Length
- # [18:18] <annevk> yhirano_: mostly
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- # [18:18] <annevk> yhirano_: if there's no body, there's no Content-Length
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- # [18:20] <annevk> gsnedders: didn't we develop a format like that once?
- # [18:20] <yhirano_> annevk: thanks. I will fix the draft.
- # [18:20] <annevk> gsnedders: for testing?
- # [18:22] <TabAtkins> annevk: Opinion - if SVG explicitly embraces a looser format for standalone, should we just use HTML (special-case when the first tag is <svg> to make it an SVG document rather than HTML) or use your XML5 or something similar?
- # [18:22] <TabAtkins> We dont' actually give a shit about namespaces.
- # [18:22] <annevk> TabAtkins: my opinion is that if we keep XML in browsers we should make it "XML5"
- # [18:22] <annevk> TabAtkins: and we can make namespaces nice
- # [18:23] <Ms2ger> There's even a rust implementation with tests
- # [18:23] <annevk> TabAtkins: e.g. <svg xmlns=svg> or some such
- # [18:23] <annevk> that autoexpands to the actual namespace
- # [18:23] <TabAtkins> Is XML5 as easy to use as svg-in-html? Similar affordances?
- # [18:23] <gsnedders> annevk: can't quite deal with arbtirary namespaces
- # [18:23] <annevk> TabAtkins: yeah, you can even use </> to close an open tag
- # [18:24] <annevk> gsnedders: XML5 can
- # [18:24] <Ms2ger> What is this, sgml?
- # [18:24] <TabAtkins> Nah, that's just use /
- # [18:24] <annevk> Ms2ger: you're too young to be making that joke :p
- # [18:24] <TabAtkins> s/that'd/
- # [18:24] <Ms2ger> Get off my lawn
- # [18:24] <Ms2ger> And onto that beautiful mountain of yours
- # [18:25] <gsnedders> TabAtkins: SGML allows both depending on configurations for the application; HTML<5 per spec allows both NET (a/bar/) and whatever-it's-called-syntax (<a>foo</>)
- # [18:25] <annevk> I was about to say, get off my mountain
- # [18:25] <gsnedders> Wait, I'm younger than Ms2ger. Shit.
- # [18:25] <TabAtkins> Hahaha, all you babies!
- # [18:25] * TabAtkins studiously hides that he's not 30 yet either.
- # [18:26] <Ms2ger> gsnedders, :D
- # [18:26] * gsnedders hopes he isn't still the youngest guy active in this IRC channel
- # [18:26] <gsnedders> Because, like, I've been here almost a decade.
- # [18:26] <gsnedders> And that just leads to disturbing questions
- # [18:26] <jgraham> Well, if you will kill off all the newbies
- # [18:27] <gsnedders> Hey, I never killed anyone!
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- # [18:55] <caitp-> ...but (and here's the key shock), to ever have a hope of doing that, we need to accept and embrace: we have to break the old broken web. <standing ovation from browser vendors and users who shed happy tears upon hearing this speech>
- # [18:57] <TabAtkins> caitp-: Why would *users* shed happy tears? They're the whole reason we can't break the old web in the first place.
- # [18:57] <TabAtkins> Authors don't care; they've abandoned the pages we want to break.
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- # [18:59] <caitp-> oh, it's sarcasm
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- # [18:59] <TabAtkins> Oh, ok. You quoting that from somewhere?
- # [18:59] <caitp-> kyle simpson
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- # [19:06] <TabAtkins> Ah, getify. Ok.
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- # [19:32] <TabAtkins> I can't tell if this "You update XMLHttpRequest has a bug" thread is spambot, or just a very confused and non-native English speaker.
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- # [20:52] <Ms2ger> TabAtkins, I guessed "confused" :)
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- # [20:59] <caitp-> but it makes his web music lose voice
- # [20:59] <caitp-> that's just terrible
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- # Session Close: Sat May 09 00:00:01 2015
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